Slashdot Mirror
Amazon & TuneCore To Cut Out the RIAA Middleman
eldavojohn writes "So you're an aspiring band and you haven't signed with a record label. Maybe you've got a fan base interested in purchasing your stuff but you're not really into accounting? Enter Amazon's partnership with TuneCore, a CD printing and music distribution service. You want to sell a full album on Amazon of you brushing your teeth? $31. And you get about 40% back on sales, so selling nine digital copies of your CD will put you back in the black. There you have it, public availability on one of the largest online commerce sites for $31 — no RIAA involved!" TuneCore's CEO put it this way: "As an artist, you have unlimited physical inventory, made on demand, with no [sic] upfront costs and worldwide distribution to anyone who orders it at Amazon.com."
I for one wait to see the lawsuit the RIAA is drawing up to bring down upon Amazon for squelching their draconian business practices by violating their 'copyright' on 'distribution of artistic works of an audio based nature'
How on earth do you figure it's 31$ pr album? It's 31$ to get listed. Read the article, how would you ever make it out to be 31$ pr. album when 9 sales is all that's required to get back in the black?
I could legitimately see this as being the beginning of the end for the RIAA, and I've never thought that before. It makes sense that it would take a big media vendor with a well-established user community, combining manufacturing with sales.
This would be fantastic if I were a musician. No inventory. No worrying about manufacturnig. And you get a percentage of revenue that you won't see anywhere else. The general Amazon community will make marketing a *lot* easier than it would be otherwise. All in all, it seems to make the RIAA meaningless. I really think indie bands might be able to make this work. I'm looking forward to shopping for music on this and know the RIAA ain't getting a dime.
Similar model.
If you read the article, they mention CDBaby:
For TuneCore, the deal expands its primary business helping indie artists get digital distribution through online outlets such as iTunes, Napster and Amazon MP3. TuneCore will now compete directly with CDBaby, the current leader in low-volume CD manufacturing and distribution. CDBaby charges $278 for 100 discs, although it recently lowered its minimum order to just five copies.
I've been a massive fan of CDBaby ordering discs straight from people like Anni Rossi but it has a minimum order those artists have to meet. I don't like the idea of a band having to buy up 500 or 100 or even 5 copies. Instead a flat fee of $31 for the artist makes me excited that this could really be big for indie artists ... I think CDBaby's success is proof that this even cheaper alternative could be a massive success. Let's hope Amazon allows you a 30 second preview and review ratings to quickly separate the wheat from the chaff.
Get into the iTunes store.
While iTunes would be slightly bigger, Amazon is a big leap for Tunecore and I'm happy to see it even on this level.
My work here is dung.
No, no, no. You, the artist, pay them $31 to get started and have them take you on. Then they sell the albums at a "normal" price. RTFA... Although, I also blame /. for increasingly bad summaries these days.
There are lots of elements used in the "Music Engine." One of those crucial elements is radio play. Another is wide-spread marketing. And still another is hiring girls to scream during performances. (Didn't you know? Get a handful of girls to scream during a performance causes other females to start screaming and they begin to believe they "love" this music and/or the performers. I know this flies in the face of common sense, but it works.)
It was my understanding that the band paid $31 as sort of a "starting fee". After that initial $31, there is nothing more to pay (that is, if I understood what I read correctly). They're not trying to -sell- the discs for $31 a pop.
Earn a % of cash back from Newegg, Tiger Direct, Walmart.com, and more: http://www.mrrebates.com?refid=458505
Tunecore will charge just $31 a year in upfront fees to handle a 10-track CD from pressing to delivery, passing all other costs through to the buyer.
And
If one of Amazonâ(TM)s 80 million customers buys your 10-song CD on Amazon for $8.98, youâ(TM)ll receive $3.59
However,
one obvious drawback to this model is that you canâ(TM)t sell an on-demand CD at shows, where enthusiastic fans are most likely to pick one up.
That being said, if anyone here wants to potentially earn some money. Create a mobile (or iphone) app that will allow you to buy the CD from amazon, as well as download the tracks (DRM free) to your mobile device there and then. Perhaps using the barcode apps. This would be the best of both (plus another) worlds.
They are NOT pressed CD's. they are BURNED CD's.
There is no way in hell that for $31.00 they will crank up a pressing process. I've seen those machines, they blow 100 disks just in testing runs.
Granted I can get CD-R's that 90% out there cant tell is a burned CD. They have a beautiful Silver dye system out there that with a silver thermal printing surface looks like the real deal.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
It's a $31 per year "hosting fee" for the artist.
From the article:
If one of Amazon's 80 million customers buys your 10-song CD on Amazon for $8.98, you'll receive $3.59. After selling just nine discs, you're in the black.
emphasis mine.
"Knowledge is the only instrument of production that is not subject to diminishing returns" -Journal of Political Econom
Japanese amateur (doujin) artists have been self-publishing professional-quality albums for years now. No RIAA, no middlemen: they set up a booth at a convention and sell it. And then, afterwards, they sell extra copies from their website. It seems to work well enough: some single fandoms have produced hundreds if not thousands of albums.
Isn't it amazing what you can do when you prioritize actually making music over trying to get rich?
And don't think that the Japanese have it easier with regard to music copyright enforcement: the problem is actually so great there that file-traders have been forced to use anonymous P2P systems like Share and Winny.
While iTunes would be slightly bigger, Amazon is a big leap for Tunecore and I'm happy to see it even on this level.
According to their website, TuneCore already has a deal with the iTunes store, as well as most all of the other digital music services.
Who's going to feed all of these underprivileged lawyers once they stop being hired to sue students, 10 year old girls and dead grandmothers? Think of the henchmen! Won't somebody pleeeeeeeeeeease think of the henchmen!
Used to be called mp3.com.
Aside from that indies have been around forever.
I've always said that artists who cry about this have options but they're too lazy/too talentless to do it for themselves. Oh well.
Dedicated Cthulhu Cultist since 4523 BC.
Maybe they should hire editors to clean up the summaries, verify links, and check for duplicate stories.
It was my understanding that the band paid $31 as sort of a "starting fee". After that initial $31, there is nothing more to pay (that is, if I understood what I read correctly). They're not trying to -sell- the discs for $31 a pop.
You're close, it's $31 a year. Which is why there's no "upfront costs" as the quote says at the bottom of the summary but instead a $31/year. Which is still really really cheap. Interestingly enough, Wired uses "upfront" costs to describe it, from the article:
Tunecore will charge just $31 a year in upfront fees to handle a 10-track CD from pressing to delivery, passing all other costs through to the buyer. In other words, the service promises to remove nearly all of the risks of short-run CD manufacturing, which can cost musicians hundreds or even thousands of dollars for discs that rarely sell enough to cover expenses.
I think people are missing the big picture where you don't have to go to multiple services for your music. You'll be able to buy big names like U2 and Weezer right next to little high school rock bands and indie artists. You make that possible so that the people don't know whether they're buying RIAA or not and who knows? Maybe the musician will decide the RIAA route is not really worth it?
My work here is dung.
I for one wait to see the lawsuit the RIAA is drawing up to bring down upon Amazon for squelching their draconian business practices by violating their 'copyright' on 'distribution of artistic works of an audio based nature'
You're thinking of the National Music Publishers' Association, which controls the rights to record cover versions and licenses them through its Harry Fox Agency. Your "RIAA" guess was close because a lot of labels in the RIAA are under the same management as publishers in the NMPA.
> Instead a flat fee of $31 for the artist makes me excited that this could really be big for indie artists
Wow, yeah.
So this basically reduces the major labels to their back catalog. No one that knows about this service would sign unless they already have major sales - and that's an even STRONGER argument for using this service. You retain all rights, get 40% of the take, and costs you one lunch bill?
What freaks me out is that the labels, after staring this in the face for decades, still can't figure out how to sell their catalog. They have 10,000,000 songs in the database, but the only thing they can figure out is how to sell the newest 40.
Maury
This is America, my friend. It can't be MY fault that I didn't read the article and misunderstood the summary. The article and summary were poorly written and therefore confused me. The writers should be forced to pay me for the time it took me to reply in error and for the public humiliation of being a victim of their poor writing. ;-)
from pressing to delivery
Maybe they mean pressing the "burn" button in Nero.
Too bad RTFS is retarded.
Dear drinkypoo,
As the author of the summary, I would like to respond to your statement of "Too bad read the read the fucking summary is retarded." I assume that you are referring to the quality of the summary although your sentence is a bit difficult for me to parse. In that case, I appreciate your constructive criticism and would like thank you for making me a better person and Slashdot user.
I hope that someday I might become as gifted at using the word "fuck" as you and perhaps I can beat my apparent bout with down syndrome that you so generously apply to every user of this entire site.
I'm sorry my stories don't pass 'journalistic muster.' I read the entire FAQ and didn't see anything about said muster, could you please expound upon that claim that submissions must pass it?
Also, I believe you are misplacing your disgust with the Firehose and directing it at users. This confuses me, as the users did not implement it. What confuses me even more is that it takes an action by you, drinkypoo, to get to said Firehose in order to 'rate' stories. You curse this UI yet you obviously used it and saw my story in Firehose.
As always, I love you dearly with all my heart and remember to tell drinkyurine that I miss him. Please accept my apologies for such a bad summary and don't let this obstruct our friendship which is sometimes as delicate as a flower covered in dew on a crisp summer morn.
Yours in song and dance,
eldavojohn
My work here is dung.
...as opposed to getting about 50 cents to a dollar on each CD, and that's if you're lucky to be Madonna or someone already famous...
I'd say it's a very good deal.
one obvious drawback to this model is that you canÃ(TM)t sell an on-demand CD at shows, where enthusiastic fans are most likely to pick one up.
I don't think there would be anyone stopping the band from buying the CDs from Amazon for $9 and selling them at the concert for $15, with an autograph and some booklet, or for something like $25-50 with a signed t-shirt and booklet.
They'd only lose about 5$ on each CD, but in the end it may still be better than ordering and paying in advance for a 500-1000 batch of discs at a duplication factory.
From the TuneCore-FAQ:
"What format must my artwork be in, in order to upload to TuneCore?
[...] You may not include: email addresses, URLs, any other contact information or any pricing information."
Is this a common (or acceptable) limitation?
sig? Oh, that sig...
I love to see an artist (eldavojohn) work in his preferred medium (wit). Smartly done.
From the FAQ
.wav files to be the most reliable and therefore recommend them first and foremost. Remember that they must be set at a 44.1 khz sample rate, 16 bit sample size and the channel set to stereo. Not sure how to convert your music? - Check out our tutorial.
.aacs, that were compressed from the output of a ten dollar ADC connected to a microphone taken from a 'Barbie's Kiddie Karaoke' machine" stuff floating around; but it looks like the service itself supports perfectly sensible upload options.
"What format must my music be in, in order to upload to TuneCore?
We have found
What format must my artwork be in, in order to upload to TuneCore?
Artwork can be in one of the following file formats: JPG, GIF or PNG. The image must be a perfect square and at least 1600x1600. All artwork must be in best-quality RGB Color mode (including black and white images) and must have a resolution of at least 72 dpi. You may not include: email addresses, URLs, any other contact information or any pricing information. You must include both the artist name and album title on the artwork and remove any stickers or other items from your artwork in case you are scanning it in from a physical CD."
I'm certain that, because people aren't so bright, there'll be a lot of "CD containing audio derived from mp3s that came from ripping a burned CD that was produced from
Don't bite the hand that feeds you. Goodbye.
The problem with their model is that 35 of those newest 40 are recycled from that 10,000,000.
Put identity in the browser.
No one that knows about this service would sign unless they already have major sales...
Unfortunately this still doesn't provide a good alternative to one important service the major record labels provide: promotion.
Just because you put your independent band up on MySpace and SonicBids and your own website and sell your songs on iTunes and your CD on CDBaby doesn't magically make everyone in the world suddenly know you exist and want to buy your stuff. Somehow they still have to stumble across you in the first place, out of the trillions of other bands who have done the same as you.
This Amazon service is awesome, and it's part of a much larger trend that will ultimately make the major labels obsolete, but there's still more work to be done.
"You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war." -- Albert Einstein
TuneCore don't do the disk printing; that's done via Amazon's Disk on Demand service, which is actually performed by CreateSpace.
The service that TuneCore provides is that it handles submission of your album to a whole bunch of online music download stores, like Amazon, eMusic, iTunes, Napster etc. I think from skimming its faq it also handles receiving your payment all into one account.
Therefore, as they say, all of the money Amazon pay goes into your account.
They've been doing this for a little while, but now with the link with Amazon Disk on Demand, albums submitted to TuneCore can for the first time be bought on physical CDs.
Congratulations on living up to the minimum possible standards. Making slashdot grate ...
I can't tell which part of my daily duties you're referring to here, is it the endless sets of metal sheets that I cut slashes and dots into that are later installed in the streets to prevent debris from entering and clogging my fair city's sewer system? Or are you referring to my ability to cause friction between Slashdot and another object/site by rubbing them together forcefully? I must say, I'm guilty of both!
No, no. The firehose sucks, AND the people using it suck.
Something about this sentence is very peculiar considering that in your prior post you say:
I sometimes use the firehose, but it is WAY too fucking painful these days.
I'm not a logician but if all who use the firehose suck ... and you yourself use it ... Wait, I think I've got it but I'm not sure. I shall construct a predicate calculus of these two rules and get back to you once I can conclude something from them.
My work here is dung.
Generally speaking, you're right, but there's no reason "sic" can't be used in that fashion. Use of "sic" is meant simply to draw the reader's attention to something that the author wrote, and the editor knows is wrong, but doesn't feel justified in correcting. I would think that factual errors are at least as likely to fall into this category as typographical errors, which should just be corrected without comment by the editor, in most cases.
Rule of Slashdot #0: You and people like you are not representative of the larger population. - A.C.
Unfortunately this still doesn't provide a good alternative to one important service the major record labels provide: promotion.
Well, this is the essence of what the future of the Record industry is, isn't it? You have two distinct businesses that are finally getting separated. On the one hand, you have the music sales group which makes money based on sales of the actual music. On the other, you have a marketing/promotion group which makes money off of concerts and the like. The former is a dead business model that'll go away with services like the one mentioned in this story. The latter is something that an agent or a marketing company or a PR firm can do. Really, this is what a record company will eventually evolve to.
Fifteen RIAA execs just died laughing at the idea of giving artists 40% of the gross.
Good work.
I think people are missing the big picture where you don't have to go to multiple services for your music.
Not only does this put indie bands next to U2, but it even opens the doors for a whole new level of artist "below" the indie artist, because you no longer have to drop a couple grand to press a thousand CDs.
Currently, if you want to sell a professionally made CD (ie. not a CD-R), you pretty much have to order at least 1000 of them. But what about bands who know they're not going to sell that many? Sure, CDBaby will take as few as 5 discs into their inventory if that's all you think you're going to sell, but what do you do with the other 995 you had to manufacture in order to be able to manufacture any at all?
With this service, if 5 is all you're going to sell, then 5 is all that will be produced, and the total cost to you is only $31 -- which, to most artists, is worth it even if they don't make that money back in sales.
"You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war." -- Albert Einstein
In law school, a bunch of us formed "The Learned Hands" and laid down some tracks. I had seen an ad for TuneCore somewhere on the web, so we uploaded our album for distribution. Sadly, having graduated school, the band no longer exists, but it's cool to say that our original music has been heard in Germany and the UK (Someone streamed "Ten Point Buck" and "Sleepy Hollow").
My experience with TuneCore was great! The initial costs were very low - I think it's like a dollar per track, and a dollar per online music store. And what do you know, our music is available on iTunes, Napster, Rhapsody, eMusic, all over the world! Depending on the vendor, you get one or two cents every time the song is streamed, and for downloads, it's usually 65% or 70% of the purchase price. Uploaded the tracks in FLAC format too, actually, and everything turned out swell.
This is the type of innovation that is changing the music industry, and I don't think the RIAA knows how to, or even can, keep up.
1. Record your album in your garage/basement
2. Upload your tracks to TuneCore for distribution
3. ???
4. Profit!
The problem for my band has been step three, since we no longer officially exist (Singers are in CO and Philly, bassist in VT, and I'm moving to BFE), but we did sell 3 copies on AmazonMP3 and a few tracks on iTunes, plus about $0.76 worth of streaming on Napster and Rhapsody.
In conclusion, TuneCore allows Joe Sixpack to (sort of) achieve his rockstar dreams, at least in terms of getting the music out there and making it available.
Isn't it interesting how you come to recognize posters based solely on their sigs???
Send CD's to radio stations to get air play.
Most stations won't even open the package. College stations might, but mainstream ones aren't interested.
Get out and PLAY at better venues.
That works locally, but what about the rest of the world?
Get out, play for people, get Cd's in the hands of people that will play it on the air.
I'm not saying that it can't be done, and I certainly don't advocate bands sitting on their asses and expecting to become instant multi-millionaires because they recorded an album. But marketing music is hard, especially in a world that has as many bands as this one has. It takes a lot of effort to stand out and get noticed, and you have to recognize that just because you may be good at writing and playing songs doesn't mean you're magically good at marketing those songs. Most bands need someone with knowledge and experience to handle that for them.
"You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war." -- Albert Einstein
While this looks good for low quantities, a lot of people don't like burned CD-Rs which these will probably be (but I'll hold off judgement on that until the service is launched).
If you are selling 1000CDs, the deal isn't so great. If you go direct to a pressing plant you can get 1000 CDs made for $999. If you match Amazon's $8.98 price, your profit will be $7,899 minus postage costs, which will be zero if you sell at your live gigs, or at most $4,000 if you sell them all through a distributor like CD Baby.
In comparison the Amazon deal would give you just $3590 profit (with postage paid), but you won't have any stock to sell at gigs or mail out for promotion unless you buy it at retail, you're limited to just the packaging they support (no gatefolds, digipacks, free postcards, signed copies, 2CD sets etc.), and unlike mailing them yourselves, you don't get to build up a mailing list of fan's addresses, which can be invaluable later in your carreer.
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
Just because you put your independent band up on MySpace and SonicBids and your own website and sell your songs on iTunes and your CD on CDBaby doesn't magically make everyone in the world suddenly know you exist and want to buy your stuff. Somehow they still have to stumble across you in the first place, out of the trillions of other bands who have done the same as you.
This is where I think the future of the recording labels lie. Amazon and iTunes (as well as other services) have shown that distribution is being taken out of the labels' hands. Now Amazon is working to take manufacturing out of their hands also. Recording has been practically out of their hands for awhile now. (Recording artists can buy what used to be thought of as professional level gear for relatively little money now.) The only thing left is Promotion.
The way I see the future of labels (if you'll even be able to call them that) is this: Band X wants to record some songs and sell them. They buy the equipment to record, sign up with Amazon/Apple/whoever to manufacture/distribute, and then sign up with Label A for promotion. Label A gets a cut of the sales, but doesn't own any rights to the music. If Band X is unhappy with how Label A is promoting them, they can drop the label and move on. Label A gets a final paycheck (for work done up to contract termination) and then the next promotion label gets the sales cut paychecks. Labels will have an incentive to treat their bands well and increase sales because otherwise they (the labels) don't get paid. The current labels will fight this tooth and nail, of course, but I think that it is almost inevitable.
My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
So maybe you aren't an instant star. Big Fucking Deal.
Do you think that the guy behind Portal's Still Alive song was picked for that honor because the Valve devs heard him on the radio?
Do you think the reason someone gets invited to PAX every year is because he's got an agent behind him doling out the payola to Tycho and Gabe?
No, you can't find their CD's browsing Best Buy or Wal-Mart. But I bet you they still make enough on their work that they can afford dinner at the end of the day.
a music video on MTV
Hahahahaha
Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
-deep breath-
Hahahahahahaha
The latter is something that an agent or a marketing company or a PR firm can do. Really, this is what a record company will eventually evolve to.
I agree, your post is spot-on.
The first thing that has to happen though is to get the record companies to not be so damn dangerous. Pull their fangs.
They killed internet radio because of ideas like this, you know. They still have enough power to get insane laws like this one passed (you actually have to pay the RIAA to broadcast your own unlicensed non-RIAA member music if you can imagine that!) And they'll do anything they can to remain relevant.
Free money and piles of it - who wouldn't fight for that?
So good job Amazon (never thought I'd say that) and keep chipping away at these jerks. Eventually they'll go the way of the dodo.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
We do. It's our bread-and-butter. We've been delivering music to iTunes--half a million songs already--for three years now. :)
--Peter
peter@tunecore.com