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Safari 4's Messy Trail

Posted by kdawson on from the if-disk-space-were-infinite-and-free dept.

Signum Ignitum writes "Safari 4 comes with a slew of cool new features, but extensive data generation combined with poor cleanup make for a data trail that's a privacy nightmare. Hidden files with screenshots of your history, files that point back to Web pages you've visited and cleared from your history, and thousands of XML files that track the changes in the pages in your Top Sites can add up to gigabytes of information you didn't know was kept about you." Some of Safari's bloat is kept in quite obscure locations; it takes a fairly knowledgeable user to find it and clean it up. You can avoid some of the worst of it by disabling Top Sites.

140 of 200 comments (clear)

  1. Advert co-incidence by ZERO1ZERO · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Is it only I that see ths advert for 'Clean you Mac' in the panel beside the summary?

    (frosty piss)

    1. Re:Advert co-incidence by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      haha
      I've some "StopZilla anti-spyware" spam, myself
      man, Slashdot looks like shit with Adblock disabled

    2. Re:Advert co-incidence by TheSHAD0W · · Score: 1

      No coincidence, it's keywords.

    3. Re:Advert co-incidence by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 1

      Is it only I that see ths advert for 'Clean you Mac' in the panel beside the summary?

      (frosty piss)

      Advertising wouldn't really work if it went by coincidence. Thanks to the advent of keywords it makes perfect sense for the advert to show up.

      I see an advert for anti spyware which is probably triggered by the talk about privacy.

    4. Re:Advert co-incidence by Silas+is+back · · Score: 4, Funny

      Keywords:
      Did, not, get, joke

      --
      this sig is useless
    5. Re:Advert co-incidence by icannotthinkofaname · · Score: 2, Informative

      The Internet looks like shit with Adblock disabled

      FTFY

      --
      Let q be a radix > 1. I am in ur base-q, killing 10 d00ds.
    6. Re:Advert co-incidence by drizek · · Score: 1

      Yes, because the rest of us are using Firefox with adblock.

    7. Re:Advert co-incidence by BrokenHalo · · Score: 2, Informative

      man, Slashdot looks like shit with Adblock disabled

      Not any more. If you're a good boy, you get to disable ads on /. while you're logged in. I now just get a little box saying "Ads disabled [tick] Thanks again for helping make Slashdot great!".

    8. Re:Advert co-incidence by centuren · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Not any more. If you're a good boy, you get to disable ads on /. while you're logged in. I now just get a little box saying "Ads disabled [tick] Thanks again for helping make Slashdot great!".

      Dear Slashdot policy makers,

      The feature introduced to allow active participants the option of disabling advertisements on the site has to be one of the most awesome things I've seen implemented re: ads on community driven sites.

      Keep the great ideas coming.

  2. Oh that Apple by wampus · · Score: 5, Funny

    I for one like it because it is so innovative and it fits in well with my hip, young lifestyle.

    1. Re:Oh that Apple by Laser_iCE · · Score: 1

      Either you're lying, or your parents thought you might like a low UID, so they reserved wampus for you before you were born.

    2. Re:Oh that Apple by wampus · · Score: 1

      The first one. I don't much care for Apple lately.

    3. Re:Oh that Apple by Filip22012005 · · Score: 1

      Please tell me you're Commander Taco.

      --
      When the policeman of the tie, rule you violate, hello punishment of the kitty?
  3. Safari does clean up after itself. by ozzmosis · · Score: 5, Interesting

    There is a "Empty Cache" button under the "Safari" menu.

    Before "Empty Cache"
    ahze:/private/var/folders/zz/zzzivhrRnAmviuee++31gU+-Ev6/-Caches-/com.apple.Safari ahze$ du -sh
      129M .

    After "Empty Cache"
    ahze:/private/var/folders/zz/zzzivhrRnAmviuee++31gU+-Ev6/-Caches-/com.apple.Safari ahze$ du -sh
      32K .

    1. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yes but that last 32k is the EVIL 32k

    2. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by mallumax · · Score: 4, Informative

      "Empty cache", doesn't delete everything.
      before: 737M -Caches-
      after: 571M -Caches-
      This is seriously fucked up.

      --
      TechSutra
    3. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by mallumax · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Anyway, chrome beta is coming on nicely and hopefully I will be able to ditch safari for good. [Firefox is my main browser but I do need a second browser].
      I have been keeping track of mac chrome and in the last two months it has become quite stable and only thing missing is flash. Some here would even consider that a feature.

      --
      TechSutra
    4. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by moon3 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Safari does clean up after itself

      That is a bit of contradiction there, you say that and in the next sentence you claim you need to press the "Empty Cache" button. That means unless somebody figures out how to flush the stuff Safari is happily recording you.

      I can't see that option in the Windows version (beta), there is a preference to limit the size of the database, but not a clean up link in the menu.

    5. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by Ilgaz · · Score: 4, Informative

      /var/folders is generally folder for storing possibly sensitive data of ANY application. I don't know the exact reason of why some files are cached there and some in ordinary caches folder but I mean it is NOT just Safari cache. There could be caches of anything, any program.

      It could be decided like ''If a program binary is signed and it connects to net'' by core OS itself. Again, it is just a very rough guess.

      Did you really expect 700+ MB of Cache from a browser? It indeed cleaned its Cache and didn't touch other applications files. /var/folders is just randomized (sandboxed in future?) temp dir. Nothing exclusive to Safari or any other program.

    6. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by monktus · · Score: 5, Funny

      32k of evil ought to be good enough for anybody.

      --
      Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals... except the weasel."
    7. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 1

      Uh, dude, RTFS?

      Jeeze, seriously, I didn't even RTFA but I noticed TFS said Safari 4 was generating potentially gigabytes of cached info, which it did -not- delete when you "cleaned" the cache.

      So...

      Did you really expect 700+ MB of Cache from a browser?

      Yes?

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    8. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      I'm sure you had something interesting to say, but it seems you don't know how to coherently convert thoughts into English.

    9. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Seriously messed up. On my machine:

      before: 737M -Caches- after: 815M -Caches-

    10. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by belrick · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yes but that last 32k is the EVIL 32k

      You mean each of the evil bits left over from the 129 MB of data?

    11. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You're not seriously considering Chrome over Safari for privacy reasons?

    12. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by CarpetShark · · Score: 3, Funny

      32k of evil ought to be good enough for anybody.

      Unless you're called Bill, in which case you'll want around 640k of evil.

    13. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by dangitman · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Jeeze, seriously, I didn't even RTFA but I noticed TFS said Safari 4 was generating potentially gigabytes of cached info, which it did -not- delete when you "cleaned" the cache.

      Yeah, slashdot summaries are known for being highly accurate and reliable, and not at all sensationalistic. Of course, anything could potentially generate gigabytes of data. My text editor could do it if I had enough monkeys. But is the average Safari user's cache weighing in at several gigabytes? I don't think so. That was just put there to cause alarm for attention-getting reasons.

      --
      ... and then they built the supercollider.
    14. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by BrokenHalo · · Score: 1

      In any case, it's easily enough taken care of. In a terminal window, just

      $ sudo rm -rf /var/folders/*
      Password: **************

      ...and likewise with the other directories mentioned in the article. No need to depend on Safari to do a thorough job of it.

    15. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by f0dder · · Score: 1

      with kdawson I know it's a quality submission.

    16. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by A12m0v · · Score: 1

      It's Not a Bug, It's a Feature...

      --
      GENERATION 25: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
    17. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by Ilgaz · · Score: 3, Informative

      I would do it in single user mode (Apple key+S on boot). What people (and that blog) doesn't understand is, that structure doesn't only carry Safari caches. There are some system caches, font caches and caches of OTHER users there.

      Also they didn't even bother to check the new method of Safari (and other webkit) cache creation. They now create the file in a reasonable (64MB here) size and fill it with zeros.It is a flat file, I guess one of the reasons is to prevent fragmentation.

      Safari does a good job cleaning it. The reason is ''force quit'' and similar. If it loses track of its own file, it (in fact, OS) re-creates in another random dir and they all add up.

    18. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by aaronbeekay · · Score: 1

      How about the size of the "com.apple.Safari" folder *inside* the -Caches- folder? Other applications may be allowed to keep things there.

    19. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by qengho · · Score: 1

      But is the average Safari user's cache weighing in at several gigabytes? I don't think so. That was just put there to cause alarm for attention-getting reasons.

      Mine was 1.38GB and I'm a fairly average user. And that was with Top Sites disabled.

    20. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by atraintocry · · Score: 1

      That is an excellent pun on the word good, and I just felt it had to be pointed out since the other guys went straight for the MS humor. Philistines!

    21. Re:Safari does clean up after itself. by macron1 · · Score: 1

      http://www.macosxtips.co.uk/index_files/12-tips-for-safari-4-beta.html links to an article called "14 Tips for Safari 4 Beta"

  4. At least it is not windows temp by linzeal · · Score: 5, Funny

    Windows temp (/username/appdata/local/temp) which if not cleaned can hold every single unzipped file/torrent/etc since you installed the operating system. Just cleaned up a computer at a friend's house that was nearing 200 gigs in temp from mostly anime porn avi he downloaded and unzipped. I showed his gf some of the stuff thinking it was funny and was told to leave the house, he was not very happy either. Damn kids, lol.

    --
    An Education is the Font of All Liberty
    1. Re:At least it is not windows temp by EricX2 · · Score: 1

      That sounds like something wrong there. I've downloaded tons of stuff and none of it has ever magically been put into my temp folder. If you unzip something it goes where you unzip it to, and ONLY there... so it sounds more like that's where the guy was 'hiding' it from his GF.

    2. Re:At least it is not windows temp by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      For internet settings (for IE at least), it's Options > delete offline content (exact location varies based on version). You get a warning about cache and cookies, you hit OK and it is gone. Deleted. ALL of the internet temp files.

      To get of -all- temp files, just run disk cleanup. It will empty all standard temp directories. A program uses windows temp, disk cleanup removes it. None of this hiding BS, at least not in XP.

      Dunno about Vista personally.

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    3. Re:At least it is not windows temp by maxume · · Score: 1

      If you open a zip as a folder and then open something in the zip by double-clicking it, a copy is stored in a folder under Local Settings/Temp. Firefox also dumps "Open with..." content there.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    4. Re:At least it is not windows temp by Runaway1956 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Am I the only one who changes the temp directories immediately after installation? C:\tmp for both user and windows temporary folder. I clear it frequently. Sometimes, stuff just doesn't WANT to delete, so I start in safe mode, and delete it anyway. No computer has the right to store data that I consider "sensitive". Anime porn, government subversion, or funding for the most outstanding charity in the world, it is MY business, and no one else's. People should learn what the environment variables are for, and use them intelligently - whether they use Mac, Windows, or *nix

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    5. Re:At least it is not windows temp by wipeMyButt · · Score: 5, Insightful
      And this has what to do with Safari's shockingly poor behavior?

      Why is it that everyone's response to any sort of problem is "Windows is worse"? If someone described a serious flaw in say, a Prius, would your response be, "Yeah, but Honda sucks."

      I'm not trying to excuse crappy design problems in Windows, but when is Apple going to lose this untouchable luster and take it's lumps along with everyone else?

    6. Re:At least it is not windows temp by DMUTPeregrine · · Score: 1

      Except, of course, for the Content.IE5 directory, which is hidden & not cleared. You can navigate to it with the command prompt or address bar, but it won't show up in Explorer.

      --
      Not a sentence!
    7. Re:At least it is not windows temp by CodeBuster · · Score: 1

      Friends don't let friends run Windows without CCleaner.

    8. Re:At least it is not windows temp by ya+really · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Probably one of the best ways I've found to deal with temp stuff (if you have enough ram) is to create a ram drive and throw your web cache, page file, and all temp files on there. At least that way when you reboot, they're all gone.

      This method works great with Opera or Firefox, but as far as I know, Safari does not let you change the location of it's cache. In Opera, just type opera:config and then search for cache, in firefox, just type about:config and then it's a matter of adding a string to the config (google if you would like to know more).

      Aside from keeping pesky temp files from building up, this also helps to cut down on disk fragmentation because many of your most modified files will now be isolated on a ram disk and ram doesn't really have any loss compared to a hard disk for fragmentation.

    9. Re:At least it is not windows temp by thePowerOfGrayskull · · Score: 1

      Assuming you don't take the step of enabling view of hidden files & folders (strongly recommended in the quest to avoid viruses and other evil 2.0 inventions). While you're at it, make sure to turn on viewing of file extensions...

    10. Re:At least it is not windows temp by thePowerOfGrayskull · · Score: 3, Informative

      Why change it? %TEMP% in the address bar will take you there every time, straightaway... doing that ensures you can find all of your temp files (including those from apps that make assumptions about the location of the temp folder, instead of obtaining it properly.)

    11. Re:At least it is not windows temp by JustOK · · Score: 1

      was she hot?

      --
      rewriting history since 2109
    12. Re:At least it is not windows temp by shird · · Score: 1

      That doesn't work too well with multiple users. Using a temp directory per user gives you better privacy.

      --
      I.O.U One Sig.
    13. Re:At least it is not windows temp by icebraining · · Score: 1

      No safe mode needed, just use Unlocker, it allows you to remove the lock from processes using the files, kill those processes and if even then they can't be deleted it allows you to automatically delete them in the next boot, in one click!

      --
      Dilbert RSS feed
    14. Re:At least it is not windows temp by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      True enough. Perhaps I should have specified that I don't share windows machines with other people. ;)

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    15. Re:At least it is not windows temp by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      Good point. I've found that, and other similar utilities in the past. I'm rather set in my ways though, and learned the value of safe mode before such utilities were easily found on the web.

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    16. Re:At least it is not windows temp by Hucko · · Score: 1

      Twitter 5 is alive!

      --
      Semi-automatic amateur armchair Australian philosopher; conjecture ready at any moment...
    17. Re:At least it is not windows temp by atraintocry · · Score: 1

      What is poor about it, other than it doesn't fit in with the computer security theater kool-aid?

      I'm sure it stays within the user account.
      Safari has a privacy mode.
      OS X and Vista will happily encrypt your home folder.

      Browser caching is useful for 99% percent of the population, and that a few people don't like it due to computer-sharing or general paranoia doesn't make it evil, and neither does a car analogy. Especially since what we are talking about is still under the user's control, it's just a question of where the defaults are (and IMO they are sensible).

      Cookies are bad, look how many Norton found! Wait, I need them for session persistence? Nevermind. Oh yeah, and screw Apple! Other people like them and I hate that!

    18. Re:At least it is not windows temp by atraintocry · · Score: 1

      On further inspection, I was wrong about #1. That is poor behavior. Sorry.

  5. Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by ruphus13 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The big value-proposition of the Mac has been that it is easy for the non-geeky user to use. Unfortunately, things like these make those very users vulnerable. Without exposing easy ways to flush potentially sensitive and private information, it is the same users Apple attempts to serve that will be exposed. And, this will probably be the default browser for most new systems, so unless this is patched, expect the problem to proliferate...

    1. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by Ilgaz · · Score: 4, Interesting

      But is there really anything to fix besides the files getting into the /var/folders on secure home dir scenarios?

      Browsers cache/store history since they were invented and that click happy site found there is a treasure there. Well, that is why Apple spits files to the randomized and soon to be more secure caches dir. The breach (!) requires someone sitting on your chair and browsing your Caches. It is the same formula for getting Mac fanatics attention and unfortunately every time, it works.

      What will they do? 128 bit encrypt general public jpegs? Not that it can't be done, just enable filevault or whatever equivalent on Windows.
      time.

    2. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by AnalPerfume · · Score: 2, Insightful

      A basic level of user knowledge must also be to blame too. Browsers cache web sites, there's a limit to how much cache is used, perhaps it's set to a maximum by the application unless you set it otherwise. All browsers do that, it saves bandwidth, time and cycles to download each page every time you visit it.

      We know this but this is one of the basics of "using a PC" that ALL users should be taught; every so often you empty your cache. How often varies on what you do with your PC. There's a difference between power users / admins and normal users as we all know. Normal users shouldn't need to learn lots of geeky stuff just to use their PC daily, but there's a basic skill set that they should be expected to know. This is one of them, along with defragging and anti-malware scans (if you're on Windows) updates etc. It's not much, just regular maintenance.

      Of course, if that were to start happening PC stores would see a drop in frequency of repairs, the amount they could con out of customers for simple work or new PC sales because their 1 yr old PC is slow as hell and they think it's out-dated. Some companies like to charge for basic training too, so I'd guess there'd be plenty of people who would like to see that idea shot down in flames. Nothing like screwing the people for maintaining your ticket on the gravy train huh?

      Seriously though, a PC is a versatile tool, used in most places of work now. This means that most people will have to use PCs as part of their work, so basic PC maintenance should be part of the school curriculum. Note I said "PC" not "Microsoft Windows". We're talking platform agnostic here, giving the kids generic PC knowledge which they can apply to any platform, not indoctrination camps to create the next wave of Microsoft monkeys. In other words EDGI not wanted.

    3. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Right, because clicking "Safari -> Empty Cache..." is amazingly complicated...

      Er, did you RTFA? Or even TFS? Or even a few of the comments?

      That's the PROBLEM! "Safari -> Empty Cache" doesn't empty potentialy hundreds of megs of data that Safari 4 generates. A normal user can handle an "Empty Cache" function, they can't handle digging through the browser's cache locations to manually delete the gigs of data built up because the "Empty Cache" function didn't do what it was supposed to do.

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    4. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 2, Insightful

      erm putting all of a users private into ~ is pretty key, why safari is even allowed to write to files outside ~/ or /tmp/ is beyond me

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
    5. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 1

      We know this but this is one of the basics of "using a PC" that ALL users should be taught; every so often you empty your cache. How often varies on what you do with your PC.

      really? I expect my browser to take care of that for me!

      This is one of them, along with defragging and anti-malware scans (if you're on Windows) updates etc

      I though vista did background defragments so you don't have to (ofc if you use a sane filesystem this isn't an issue).

      I do agree that instead of learning to type a word document kids should learn how their computer works in an OS agnostic way. But the goal of any good OS & program is to provide features like caching without requiring any basic maintenance.

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
    6. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by node+3 · · Score: 3, Informative

      Sorry, the menu item is "Safari -> Reset Safari..." where the option is to "Remove all webpage preview images".

    7. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      There are conflicting design considerations: Cached information in a user folder "unnecessarily" inflates the user folder, which is typically subject to frequent backups, often over the network. That's a lot of overhead for temp files. Shared caches can also improve the cache hit ratio. The obviously conflicting (and IMHO more important) goal is privacy, but it's not a simple "doh, how could they?" situation.

    8. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by kestasjk · · Score: 1

      To be fair a world-writable /tmp is pretty standard on unix

      --
      // MD_Update(&m,buf,j);
    9. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by profplump · · Score: 1

      /var/folders is equivalent to /tmp, at least on OS X. I agree that Safari should clean up this location when you ask it to clear the caches, but let's not pretend that it's some exotic hack that Safari does to circumvent system security either -- it's just another temp folder.

    10. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by Mista2 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What about the porn mode, I mean the private browsing option?

    11. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by Ilgaz · · Score: 2, Informative

      It is not Safari writing the files there, it is the OS which redirects the files. Safari doesn't say ''let me create a weird dir to write my files'', it is OS which says ''Let me put Safari's caches to a weird place so it won't be easy to hack it and steal its caches''

    12. Re:Mac abstraction affects the non-savvy... by atraintocry · · Score: 1

      That's too easy. You want these people to have enough time to go outside?

      I don't. So keep that stuff on the d/l.

  6. beta software by commodoresloat · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Keep in mind this is a beta, folks; if you're using it, you're presumably volunteering to help inform Apple about stuff like this. So in addition to letting everyone else know safari is doing this, it might be a good idea to let Apple know that it is unacceptable in a web browser. Presumably the company released the beta in order to solicit just this kind of information from its users; hopefully enough concern from users will lead them to take these "features" out of the final release candidate.

    1. Re:beta software by Rosyna · · Score: 1

      Betas should not be given a pass solely because they are betas.

    2. Re:beta software by node+3 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Please don't do this. This "unacceptable in a web browser" feature is fantastic, and if you still find it unacceptable, you can turn it off. I, personally, find it a very nice touch.

    3. Re:beta software by falcon5768 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      um yes, they should. Thats the WHOLE POINT of a beta, that you are testing it in a real world, uncontrolled environment with all the risks it entails.

      --

      "Slashdot, where telling the truth is overrated but lying is insightful."

    4. Re:beta software by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 1

      putting screenshots of websites you visit outside your home directory is a fantastic feature? wow i sense the RDF is strong in this one

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
    5. Re:beta software by node+3 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      putting screenshots of websites you visit outside your home directory is a fantastic feature?

      You're referring to an implementation detail, not a feature. The feature is the web page previews. Whether they are stored in /var or in ~/Library has no effect on the feature, but does affect the underlying implementation of it.

      By all means, put the previews in the ~/Library folder. By all means, file a bug report about this detail, but don't request the removal the feature.

      wow i sense the RDF is strong in this one

      Correct, because as we all know, nothing bolsters a straw man like ad hominem.

    6. Re:beta software by alanQuatermain · · Score: 4, Informative

      Would anyone care to look at the permissions on the -Caches- folder in question? I know, it'll make it harder to spout hyperbole about security, but it could be instructional I think:

      MacBook-Pro:1tUM+kJcGEqwqSH2bBdLR++++TI jim$ pwd
      /var/folders/1t/1tUM+kJcGEqwqSH2bBdLR++++TI
      MacBook-Pro:1tUM+kJcGEqwqSH2bBdLR++++TI jim$ ls -l
      total 0
      drwx------ 92 jim staff 3128 12 May 20:53 -Caches-
      drwx------ 13 jim staff 442 23 May 20:12 -Tmp-

      As you can see, the permissions on the -Caches- folder mean it's only readable by the owner, namely the current user. So it has the same protections as something inside the user's home folder. Also, by benefit of being in /var/folders/xxxx/-Caches- the operating system can clean this out more or less upon a whim-- this is, after all, the purpose of temporary folders and caches.

    7. Re:beta software by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 1

      OFC the file permissions are fine, but IMO no user data should go outside of /home if that means having to recreate a shared catch system inside /home then that's the way it should be done (perhaps /home/.-var so you don't mess up existing backup scripts).

      Were not even talking about network data being cached, these are screencaps from the user. So many security approaches rely entirely on user and system data being kept completely separate (encrypting per user homes, marking /home noexec). It also not good for system quotas that data belongs to that user charging it to /var is not the correct thing to do. Programs leaving data outside of a user /home is just a terrible idea! if a user removes safari, then deletes ~/.safari, that should erase all safari only data (having rss elsewhere is good), if an admin removes a user then deletes their /home that should be the end of them.

      Also, by benefit of being in /var/folders/xxxx/-Caches- the operating system can clean this out more or less upon a whim-- this is, after all, the purpose of temporary folders and caches.

      The operating system can clear out /home/*/.safari/cache/ on a whim too. OFC it should never do that as it should be up to the browser running under as that user to keep those files in check.

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
    8. Re:beta software by A12m0v · · Score: 1

      Remember, this is not Google's definition of Beta.

      Apple's betas are really beta.

      --
      GENERATION 25: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
    9. Re:beta software by profplump · · Score: 1

      What do you do with programs that want to write to /tmp or /var/tmp on your POSIX system? Do you insist that they write inside your home folder? What about daemons that don't have a home folder?

      I think Safari should clean up this data when asked to do so, but I don't understand why temp data needs to be inside my home folder, which is potentially remote and almost certainly more expensive than local tmp storage, rather than in whatever temp location(s) are designated by the OS and its administrator.

    10. Re:beta software by icebraining · · Score: 1

      If it is a daemon, why would it have "user" data?

      And even if your $HOME is remote, just run "mount -t tmpfs -o size=1G,nr_inodes=10k,mode=0700 tmpfs $HOME/.safari/cache" in your user login scripts.

      Using /tmp for cache is not nice, as I like to keep my cache even after rebooting.

      --
      Dilbert RSS feed
    11. Re:beta software by jvkjvk · · Score: 1, Troll

      I have a feature where you get $1,00,000. Unfortunately, in the implementation I have to take out a life insurance policy on you and then kill you.

      Hey, the feature is great, what are you complaining about?

  7. Easy to fix by clang_jangle · · Score: 1

    This is really easy to fix. Always the first thing I install when I get a new Mac...

    --
    Caveat Utilitor
    1. Re:Easy to fix by Stevecrox · · Score: 1

      Recently I put the Windows 7 RC on my home machine and thought I would try out Opera since it people keep trying to sell it on speed/etc...

      I have no idea if the latest version of windows causes it some problems but my impressions haven't been good. It's slower than IE 8 to use, doesn't look as pretty and has some bizare page loading bug. A good example is going to www.hotmail.com once you've signed in the page never appears to completely load (this occurs every time and even after I've tried giving it several minutes) and I have to click the stop button before enough icons magically appear for me to get to my inbox menu.

    2. Re:Easy to fix by Ilgaz · · Score: 1

      Easy way to fix any browser is:

      a) Enable filevault or some kind of similar thing in Windows (encyript home folder)

      OR

      b) Disable caching, top sites, web site icons and history

      I use Opera right now, beta testing Opera 10 even on OS X. It does store its files in Caches folder too. Where else should this happen? As ''Top sites'' actually an Opera invention (quick dial, similar), if you dig enough, you will see the screenshots too. Perhaps Opera stores them in a better format than lossy jpeg but they must be still there.

      The real issue on OS X Leopard is that /var/folders thing. Especially if I was a filevault user, I would be really really pissed about it. IMHO as disks became faster, it really makes sense to
      srm -rf /var/folders on logout.

      I mean if it is a laptop or critical info having desktop, you actually need your data secure in case of thievery or loss and you are concerned. For example, I don't really care what is in my Cache and I max them out as far as possible.

    3. Re:Easy to fix by clang_jangle · · Score: 1

      Actually, my experience is that Opera kind of sucks on Debian, too. I use FF for that. Maybe the Mac version of Opera is the only really good one? BTW, I'm not sure I'd expect hotmail (a Microsoft site) to do well in Opera, anyway...

      --
      Caveat Utilitor
    4. Re:Easy to fix by Mystra_x64 · · Score: 1

      To the contrary my experience with Opera on Debian (x86_64) is better described as rock solid. I'm not using hotmail however so I don't know how it's working there.

      --
      Quick way to get 30% Funny 70% Troll: defend Opera browser on /.
    5. Re:Easy to fix by Mystra_x64 · · Score: 1

      Opera's Speed dial is not the same as "top sites". You need to manually choose your sites for it.

      It uses PNGs for those shots btw.

      --
      Quick way to get 30% Funny 70% Troll: defend Opera browser on /.
    6. Re:Easy to fix by darthflo · · Score: 1

      As long as there's no "Don't count pageviews towards top sites as long as this is enabled" porn mode switch, everything else seems rather risky to me.

    7. Re:Easy to fix by gyrogeerloose · · Score: 1

      There is. It's called "Private Browsing" and it's under the "Safari" menu. Select that option and nothing is added to the cache, search parameters aren't saved, no browsing history is kept etc. etc. etc...

      --
      This ain't rocket surgery.
  8. Oh expoitable by johncandale · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The real scary part of this for me is not the government, more on that in a sec, but your girlfriend/boyfriend/housemate. Anyone who feels like he/she wants to do some snooping now has a treasure chest of stuff to take out of context.

    I hope no one here is naive enough to use the "if you have nothing to hide..." line.

    Getting back to the government, most cases are not high profile law&order style procedural deals. I could easily see local lawyers taking porn sites as evidence you killed her, technology sites as evidence you were researching bombs, map sites that you were researching crimes, and I can see local judges allowing it, and local jury's believing it.

    Of course they could get most of this from ISP logs, but that would be just that much harder to get, and wouldn't come with screen shots.

    1. Re:Oh expoitable by larry+bagina · · Score: 1, Troll

      Too bad OS X isn't multi-user. Too bad OS X doesn't let you password protect your account.

      --
      Do you even lift?

      These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.

    2. Re:Oh expoitable by Tubal-Cain · · Score: 1

      The people who make Easylist for Adblock Plus also have a filterset for adult/dating ads.

      Homepage
      Adult/Dating filterset
      MySpace filterset
      RickRoll blacklist
      EasyPrivacy

    3. Re:Oh expoitable by EvilIdler · · Score: 2, Funny

      Wow, that's the most paranoid thing I've read all day, and I've read at least two Slashdot articles!

    4. Re:Oh expoitable by AnAdventurer · · Score: 1

      Live like you will own up (Yes hon, I was surfing porn, no I didn't mean to click on that ONE). OR do like I do, use Google as a spell check, that'll throw 'em.

      --
      6.8SPC TR of 550, l xwind at 6, drift rt at 26" drops 77". AT has 503 ft-lbs at 1403 fps. FT 0.86
    5. Re:Oh expoitable by node+3 · · Score: 4, Informative

      The real scary part of this for me is not the government, more on that in a sec, but your girlfriend/boyfriend/housemate. Anyone who feels like he/she wants to do some snooping now has a treasure chest of stuff to take out of context.

      They've always had this. It's called "History" and "Temporary Internet Files". The only difference here is Safari has added screenshots.

      If you're that worried, you can enter Private Browsing mode, you can selectively clear out parts of your history (and cache and screenshots), entirely clear out all of the above (including cookies), or just turn the feature off in the first place.

    6. Re:Oh expoitable by phantomfive · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The real scary part of this for me is not the government, more on that in a sec, but your girlfriend/boyfriend/housemate. Anyone who feels like he/she wants to do some snooping now has a treasure chest of stuff to take out of context.

      If you are seriously worried about those people snooping around in your computer like that, you have serious problems. You're supposed to be able to trust your girlfriend. If you can't, you may consider getting a new one, because she's going to cheat/breakup before long.

      Can't always do as much for your housemate, but if you are seriously worried about them snooping around in your computer, you ought to password protect your computer. And get a lock for your bedroom.

      Getting back to the government, most cases are not high profile law&order style procedural deals. I could easily see local lawyers taking porn sites as evidence you killed her, technology sites as evidence you were researching bombs, map sites that you were researching crimes, and I can see local judges allowing it, and local jury's believing it.

      What exactly are you planning on doing that you will end up in such a situation? Judges typically don't allow evidence that is not directly related to the case, so if you're worried about being framed for killing your girlfriend with a pipebomb at a popular geocaching site I can see why you're worried, but most people don't have that problem. Oh, maybe this goes back to your weird housemate thing again?

      --
      Qxe4
    7. Re:Oh expoitable by mdwh2 · · Score: 1

      I hope no one here is naive enough to use the "if you have nothing to hide..." line.

      I have something to hide from people I don't trust or people I don't want knowing about my private life. I fail to see how someone I was supposedly in a relationship with could come under this - if your gf has a problem with you browsing porn, and you feel the need to hide it from her, you both have bigger problems in your relationship than a web browser.

      If there's really something you need to keep secret from someone who has access to your computer, that's what encryption is for.

    8. Re:Oh expoitable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      I have nothing to hide. Suicide Girls is art, right?

    9. Re:Oh expoitable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm not sure even Private Browsing works fully. Adobe stores a cache of all flash ads and components that are seen on sites that you visit.

      So if you are browsing porn, (possibly even on Private Browsing mode... I'm not sure), even with resetting and clearing your history and cache, you can still get some idea of the websites visited by looking in the user's Library/Preferences/Macromedia/Flash Player/ folder and looking in the subfolders there (eg. follow through the #SharedObjects folder, and the macromedia.com folder and they have folders naming the sites visited in each).

      Even when most people think they've cleaned up traces of where they've been, it's trivial on a Mac to get a list of sites that they've visited.

    10. Re:Oh expoitable by earlymon · · Score: 1

      The real scary part of this for me is not the government, more on that in a sec, but your girlfriend/boyfriend/housemate. Anyone who feels like he/she wants to do some snooping now has a treasure chest of stuff to take out of context.

      The scary part for me is that you live in a world where screen savers are not secure and you use an operating system that doesn't let an authorized user - s.o. or housemate - log in to their own account only, not yours.

      Despite the /var folder being visible, the contents below that are not - unless you've given admin privileges to your housemates. If it's your housemate's computer (obviously, they'll have privileges) then it's you that's exposed - the only solution for that is the obvious one - get your own computer, disallow access to anyone else.

      Just because someone might sleep with you in no way holds you to giving them any access whatsoever to your computer.

      --
      Pathological kinda promises Path + Logical - but instead, you get stuck with pathetic.
    11. Re:Oh expoitable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      For anyone that doesn't believe this, Michael Peterson was convicted of murder on questionable evidence, after the jury was allowed to hear evidence of gay porn on his computer.

      It should have nothing to do with the case, but many locals believe it's relevant and because no one else does this (to their knowledge) it's evidence of evil.

      What would they find in your cache?

    12. Re:Oh expoitable by gyrogeerloose · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I just checked that out on my Mac. While there certainly is a long list of sites (longer than I'd like to see, for sure) listed there, it includes any site that happened to have a Flash ad on a page that I've loaded so it's not really an accurate record of where I've been.

      Still, I agree that it's a bothersome thing

      --
      This ain't rocket surgery.
    13. Re:Oh expoitable by Smurf · · Score: 1

      Adobe stores a cache of all flash ads and components that are seen on sites that you visit.

      So if you are browsing porn, (possibly even on Private Browsing mode... I'm not sure), even with resetting and clearing your history and cache, you can still get some idea of the websites visited by looking in the user's Library/Preferences/Macromedia/Flash Player/ folder and looking in the subfolders there (eg. follow through the #SharedObjects folder, and the macromedia.com folder and they have folders naming the sites visited in each).

      Even when most people think they've cleaned up traces of where they've been, it's trivial on a Mac to get a list of sites that they've visited.

      Mmmmm... but that is not exclusive to Safari, that's a Macromedia folder... I'm pretty sure that if you visit a page with Flash ads in FireFox or any other browser you will populate the exact same directory.

      In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if there is exactly the same directory somewhere in Windows being populated by Flash regardless of the browser. After all, thats a Macromedia folder, I see no reason why they would design that differently for Safari or for the Mac.

  9. just poke around in ~/.mozilla/* by FudRucker · · Score: 1

    you will find some interesting things in there too...

    --
    Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
    1. Re:just poke around in ~/.mozilla/* by mallumax · · Score: 1

      At least it is in one place. Here it seems files are scattered all over the place and in non obvious locations.

      --
      TechSutra
    2. Re:just poke around in ~/.mozilla/* by Quantumstate · · Score: 1

      I am not so sure what you mean by this. I cleared all of my cache and history from within Firefox and it seemed to get wiped. Are you complaining that Firefox stores data that you want stored according to your settings?

    3. Re:just poke around in ~/.mozilla/* by Ilgaz · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Ever wonder why Apple, who offers one of the best organized file system to users since 1980s decided to put temp files to ''non obvious'' places, scattering them?

      Think a bit. I was a Mozilla user when they made the great choice of randomizing cache/temp folder name, Apple (and some vendors) just extended it to operating system for exact same reasons. Temp folder and caches folder security is one of weak points of operating systems and by putting files to weird, impossible to guess places, they are preventing some targeted attacks in future.

    4. Re:just poke around in ~/.mozilla/* by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 1

      The point is that ~/.mozilla/firefox/ is the only place firefox will put sensitive data into
      nothing from a user should be put anywhere else

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
    5. Re:just poke around in ~/.mozilla/* by blueg3 · · Score: 1

      The -Caches- directory has actually been around since 10.5 and some 3+ version of Safari. It's not exclusive to Safari, though Safari does put cached information there. Your individual -Caches- path does have the proper permissions. The only real problem is that, to my knowledge, if you use FileVault, your Web cache will still be outside your encrypted home directory. (Actually, I think this is why -Caches- is outside of the home directory -- the combination of Time Machine, a FileVault home directory, and an active cache folder cause a lot of Time Machine churn.)

    6. Re:just poke around in ~/.mozilla/* by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      Now - HOW ON EARTH did Mrs. FudRucker get in there? But, WOW, she looks great in that purple mesh...

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
  10. Reset Safari by aftk2 · · Score: 2, Informative

    This is a bit sketchy, I will agree. However, it does appear like you can remove most of this. In the menu bar, click "Safari > Reset Safari." Make sure that reset top sites and "Remove all webpage preview images" is selected.

    --
    concrete5: a cms made for marketing, but strong enough for geeks.
    1. Re:Reset Safari by Snorfalorpagus · · Score: 1
      Equally, turn "Private browsing" on (found in the main Safari menu), when you want to browse privately.

      When private browsing is turned on, webpages are not added to the history, items are automatically removed from the Downloads window, information isn't saved for AutoFill (including names and passwords), and searches are not added to the pop-up menu in the Google search box. Until you close the window, you can still click the Back and Forward buttons to return to webpages you have opened.

  11. Oh well... by PopeRatzo · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...a data trail that's a privacy nightmare...gigabytes of information you didn't know was kept about you.

    Remember those famous Apple "1984" advertisements where they're the young, free person breaking out of the crushing tyranny of Big Brother?

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
  12. Bullshit scaremongering. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Use "Private Browsing" mode and this junk won't get in your history in the first place for you to need to delete it. The end. Meanwhile, fulltext searching of your history is hella convenient.

  13. Re:Why would you use Safari anyway? by UnConeD · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Here's why I use and love Safari 4 on OS X. And yes, I am a huge geek who hacks code for a living.

    • It's bloody fast, in every way. From loading speed, to rendering speed, to JavaScript execution to Canvas rendering. Firefox does not compare, and Chrome still isn't available for Mac.
    • Full-text indexing of your history + thumbnails are a life saver for finding that one blog post or article that you read 3 days ago but can't remember the URL to or find on Google (because the site's SEO sucks). Coverflowing through a set of thumbnails lets you identify specific pages really quickly if you've seen them before. It really is waaay more than just a cool effect.
    • Safari has the best web standards support and includes a bunch of awesome proposed features on top of that. Web fonts, box/text shadows (+ rounded corners), css transforms, border image, etc. It's awesome fun to develop on.
    • It is the most polished browser on OS X, by far. The scrolling is butter-smooth and feels analog (multitouch trackpad++), the form widgets feel like real Aqua, the textareas are resizable, the font rendering is the most consistent.

    For me, Safari provides the best web experience. For you, Firefox 3 is the sweet spot. Why can't you just accept that people have differing priorities and requirements, instead of smugly deriding others for using a "miserable little browser"? If you want to hate on a browser, hate on IE. At least there's demonstrable evidence of how IE has damaged the web. Us Safari users are doing just fine.

  14. That's What Passwords Are For by reallocate · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Fretting about Safari 4 privacy issues seems a bit pointless because if someone can see all that data they can see anything on your Mac.

    If your Mac -- or any other PC -- is available to others, well... that's what a password is for.

    --
    -- Slashdot: When Public Access TV Says "No"
  15. That was enlightening. by atm153 · · Score: 1

    Wow. I just saved 650+ meg on my Macbook nano. Definitely disabled Top Sites on my netbook.

  16. Okay, this is ridiculous. by geekboy642 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Everybody on here needs to grow up. You're whining and crying about your browser keeping a history of your browsing. That's been an accepted feature for over a decade. Only now, you've got a porn mode so it doesn't keep a history. That's new. Why are you wanking fools whining about a browser cache now? Are you seriously crying that a file on your computer might have a screenshot of where you've been on the web? Really? I've got a hint for you: NOBODY CARES ABOUT YOUR DONKEY PORN.

    Don't bother responding, I've already answered your objections:
    "Oh, but Geekboy, I live in a totalitarian regime, and I'm a freedom activist! They monitor everything I do!" Your browser history is the absolute last place the KGB is gonna look for information. They'll talk to your neighbors, your boss, your parents, and probably drag you in for interrogation before they even consider looking in your history.
    "Oh, but Geekboy, I just love looking at little kids! It's not sexual at all, it just makes me happy!" Do like pedophiles have done since the middle ages: become a priest. Get it off the internet, those parents' groups and TV shows are really annoying. Also, same thing as in the KGB. Even if they don't catch you in an actual sting, they'll grab your stacks of CDs and piles of imported manga way before they give a rats ass about your browser.

    Now mod me down, and prove you're all pathologically paranoid morons.

    --
    Just another "DOJ fascist authoritarian totalitarian bootlicker" -- Zeio
    1. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      "You're whining and crying about your browser keeping a history of your browsing. That's been an accepted feature for over a decade."

      Accepted by whom, exactly? The uninformed masses? The government? Microsoft? Certainly NOT by ME. A browser is supposed to show me a page, and to run whatever media that I might wish to run on that page. A browser is NOT supposed to document ANYTHING, ANYWHERE.

      I challenge anyone to sit at my computer, and reconstruct my browsing habits. It will take one very sharp SOB, because I've disabled everything that might have made it easy for him.

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    2. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by geekboy642 · · Score: 1

      Parent is a pathologically paranoid moron. Nobody cares about his pristine collection of 1970's-era hairy man porn. He would rather we all be forced to give up a prime feature of every mainstream browser, just so that he can feel better about himself. It's pathetic, really. This is the condition of the modern-day conservative.

      I have to say, though, your past posts promoting eugenics and applauding military-sponsored rape really do put your paranoia in perspective.

      --
      Just another "DOJ fascist authoritarian totalitarian bootlicker" -- Zeio
    3. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      Moron, huh? And, what is YOUR IQ? The morons are those who don't understand the "features" of their software. The morons are those who supply the police/gestapo with evidence to convict them. The guy in China whose computer preserves his online activity acts surprised when the police present evidence that he has been online, badmouthing the party? The guy in Iran who despises the President? The lady in Syria, who detests Islamic rule? How about the journalist in the UK, doing an expose on his MP? Your beloved features can get people KILLED. Which part of "dead" do you not understand?

      As for your preferred version of porn, please keep it to yourself. Most people are offended by your graphic descriptions of your relations with pot bellied hairy men. Ahhh, there is the problem. The most serious use to which YOU put a computer is viewing middle aged gay porn - therefore, incriminating evidence created by your computer is a frivolous matter.

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    4. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by drizek · · Score: 1

      You look at porn at all day and watch videos of cats doing funny things.

      There, and I didn't even have to sit at your computer.

    5. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by geekboy642 · · Score: 1

      Are you an anti-PRC Chinese guy?
      Are you an Iranian?
      Are you the anti-islamic Syrian dame?
      Are you one of the UK journalists who had to have an American do their job for them in the recent illicit expenses scandal?

      No? Then shut up.
      I'm gonna take a guess: You live in the USA, you have a membership at Stormfront, and you would have voted for Bush twice, except the first time he ran you were too young. Please respond with more angry invective, you're amusing me.

      --
      Just another "DOJ fascist authoritarian totalitarian bootlicker" -- Zeio
    6. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      I live in the USA. Keep guessing on all the rest. And, since I'm an American, I'll be damned if I'll shut up. No one on God's green earth has the authority to shut me up. You and President Ahminutjob can BOTH kiss my ass. If anything I say offends you, you are at liberty to hit the "off" button on your interwebz machinez.

      I'm curious though - do you have anything INTELLIGENT to say? Like, maybe countering something I've said? Or, you just save up your bandwidth to post hateful but meaningless bullshit?

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    7. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      Stormfront? I had to look. I don't qualify for membership. "So in response to the question, "Who's White?" we answer: "Non-Jewish people of wholly European descent. No exceptions.""

      http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=579652

      I'm so grief stricken!!! Well, no, not really. Those white bastards wouldn't sell an acre of land to my grandfather when he was a young man, despite the fact that he was European. As for the REST of my (~great) grandparents - not all of them had European blood in their veins.

      Man, you're reall off target with your assumptions.

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    8. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by geekboy642 · · Score: 1

      I like how you dodge the entire point of, well, pretty much everything I've said and reply with a childish "you're not the boss of me!" You're not offensive, you're amusing. I add offensive people to my foes list. Go ahead and check, it doesn't include you. You may be covered by the 1st Amendment, but that doesn't mean you should exercise that particular right constantly. You have no reason to be a paranoid fool, and the thing you're being paranoid about is the tiniest shred of an iceberg, and like everyone else you have an easy tool to destroy the iceberg.

      So I'll repeat myself, why are you crying? What do you have to hide that your browser history would reveal?

      --
      Just another "DOJ fascist authoritarian totalitarian bootlicker" -- Zeio
    9. Re:Okay, this is ridiculous. by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      Serious questions, rather than assumptions? Alright. I'll bite.

      You missed my age, by a long shot. Look ^ @ my nick for my year of birth. I have been around for a few decades, made freinds on three different continents besides the one I live on. I have a lot of political opinions, some of which differ from what is "government approved". Today's political atmosphere, together with the Department of Homeland Defense makes it rather dangerous to have political views that are unapproved. How dangerous? Hell, I don't know, and neither do you. Am I paranoid? Maybe, maybe not - but my computer won't be used as evidence by some overzealous freak of a prosecuting attorney to convict me. If he needs evidence that badly, he can INVENT HIS OWN.

      Look at the RIAA trials. I don't download very much off of the internet, and at least 80% of what I do download is LEGAL without question. That 20% could get me in trouble, so I erase tracks regularly. If RIAA comes after me, let them WORK TO BUILD A CASE, I refuse to supply them with the evidence.

      Seriously I don't do porn. Gay porn, kiddy porn, animal porn, even more "normal" porn - I don't do it. I do, however, read freenet and I2P. If you've ever checked them out, you will already know that kiddy porn is pervasive. Stay on the darknet very long, your cache WILL fill with potentially incriminating evidence. (and in the meantime, you will probably be shocked at the depravity of these low lifes - one day the US will get around to making use of the darknet illegal)

      Aside from possible government intervention - it's probably safe to say that EVERYONE has a few things that they would rather not be found by a boss, a spouse, a kid, a competitor - SOMEONE. Routinely erasing your tracks prevents more mundane embarrasment. Why not spend the several seconds each session to clean up those caches and crap?

      Paranoid? Me? Not really. But, someone MIGHT BE out to get me.

      Before you point out that encrypting the hard drive(s) might be a better solution, I'll point to the UK, where one MUST supply the keys to an encrypted drive of face prison. The US is going in the same direction. We can play a lot of games with "hidden" encrypted drives - but ultimately, if the govenment has your hard drive, they can and will find the volumes and coerce the keys from you.

      No, I don't think I'm paranoid. But, the absence of paranoia doesn't imply "trust" of anyone.

       

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
  17. It's Beta Software! by skribble · · Score: 2, Informative

    First of all this is a beta product that isn't shipping on anything and while it's trendy to think beta software is fully functional (Thanks Google) with Apple, beta generally means, "really this isn't finished, there's still stuff that's messed up here." (In fact this would apply to most Apple .00 products as well, which is fine since historically .1 or .01 is rolls a few weeks after the initial release.) In other words, stuff like this is to be expected.

    Second, Safari has for the longest time provided this very nifty "Private Browsing" which will eliminate all of these issues.

    Finally, if you dig in the preferences you can turn a bunch of this stuff off if it bothers you so much. Still feed the fire of Mac hate... whatever.

    --
    --- Nothing To See Here ---
  18. Re:Why would you use Safari anyway? by dingen · · Score: 1

    It's not extensible (at least not officially)

    Even so, there a loads of extensions to Safari out there, which integrate with the browser completely naturally. I have two addons running myself and they even appear in the Preferences dialog of Safari, like they are normal features.

    --
    Pretty good is actually pretty bad.
  19. Blogger with no idea! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Guy doesn't know what he is talking about. If you do some small investigation, you'll find that these are the previews for coverflow History. Deleting the history items deletes the previews. Also, using the 'Privacy' function in Safari does not store these previews. Thus snooping relatives won't find the porn you've been browsing all day for.

  20. Re:Why would you use Safari anyway? by alisson · · Score: 1

    I like this outlook. Also, I love Safari's RSS reader; that's what keeps me from Chrome.

  21. let me get this straight by mzs · · Score: 3, Informative

    The whole commotion is that temporary files are stored under per user only readable subdirs of /var instead of under ~/Library? I don't know about you but my home dir is mounted from a server. That seems a whole lot more secure (and efficient) to put that in a place more or less guaranteed to be local and not exported. It seems to me some people just have to learn about another place temporary data can appear. Also where it is makes it really easy to just rm -rf all of it when they want to.

  22. /var by jbolden · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Call me a crotchity old unix head but I'm very happy that Apple is using /var for cache information and not /Users/username/Library/Caches.... in fact i think that whole directory should point to /var.

    I'd love to be able to partition my /var stuff off like I do in Linux. So if Apple is moving in this direction and keeps it up, good.

  23. Re:Why would you use Safari anyway? by Schlaefer · · Score: 1

    There are the first Chromium snapshots available.

    Webkit as we love it. Rough but usable. No Plugins so far, that also means no Flash (I'll count that as a feature 90% of the time). Speed - don't know, sites are just there. But here comes the boomer: it's the first (modern) browser that doesn't eat my frakking RAM like there's no tomorrow and makes the whole machine feel sluggish after two hours of extensive web browsing.

  24. That's Bug#6594811 by Val314 · · Score: 1

    If anyone is interested, i've filed a bug some time ago about this and it has been duplicated to #6594811

  25. Re:Why would you use Safari anyway? by A12m0v · · Score: 1

    Two issues with Safari 4:

    • Hogs too much memory.
    • Lacks multiprocess architecture (a la Chrome), which means it doesn't return the memory back after closing a tab/ending a process.

    Once Chrome is released for Mac it'll be my default browser.

    --
    GENERATION 25: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
  26. Re:Why would you use Safari anyway? by kestasjk · · Score: 1
    Here's why I use and love IE on Windows 7. And yes, I am a huge geek who hacks code for a living.
    • It's bloody secure, in every way. From the sandbox it runs in, to the fine-grained permissions system, to the address space randomization and NX support it enjoys as a Windows application, to the way it's made easy to delete cached information. Safari does not compare.
    • Full-text indexing of your history + web slices are a life saver for finding that one blog post that you read 3 days ago, or getting constant updates from a web page.
    • IE 8 has the best success rate for rendering web-pages, correct or not.
    • It is the most polished browser on Windows, by far. The tabs glow different colors depending on their status, the address-bar feels like proper Aero, different tabs can be previewed from the task-bar, the default font matches the default Windows 7 font.

    For me, IE provides the best web experience. For you, Safari is the sweet spot. Why can't you just accept that people have differing priorities and requirements, instead of smugly deriding others for using a "web-damaging" browser? If you want to hate on a browser, hate on Opera. At least there's demonstrable evidence of how buying Opera is like buying bottled water when your house came with a tap. Us IE users are doing just fine.

    --
    // MD_Update(&m,buf,j);
  27. Re:Shiretoko by wintermute000 · · Score: 1

    THe 'official' builds of firefox for non MS OS-es tend to be molasses compared to the custom compiled ones. I'm not really sure why this is.

    Swiftfox is a good example for linux.
    I used Bonecho which is something like your above example for my macbook and noticeably zippier as well.
    Heck just for laughs I compiled firefox for linux off source and it FLIED compared to the version you get off the official repos

  28. Re:Ads Disabled box? by TaoPhoenix · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Hi.

    Where is this box? I'm fairly active, but I don't have it/can't find it.

    --
    My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
  29. Re:Why would you use Safari anyway? (WTF?) by rel4x · · Score: 1

    Your issue with Chrome is that it isn't available for Mac? I thought this was a privacy concern? Chrome should be a dirty word to any privacy advocate/pornography watcher.

    --

    Before you mod me funny, think, perhaps I was insightfully funny?
  30. Re:Ads Disabled box? by BrokenHalo · · Score: 1

    Where is this box? I'm fairly active, but I don't have it/can't find it.

    I guess it might depend on your karma. It appears on the top-right of the /. homepage, but I guess if you can't see the box you'll just have to use adblock (or /etc/hosts) like I used to before.

  31. Re: OS X is so awesome... by Hucko · · Score: 1

    No, that one has been around longer than /.

    --
    Semi-automatic amateur armchair Australian philosopher; conjecture ready at any moment...