Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft's Bulk Deal With New Zealand Collapses
vik writes "The latest 3-year, pan-government deal that Microsoft has been establishing with the New Zealand government since 2000 has collapsed, opening the doors to the wider use of open source software in government. The NZ State Services Commission (already a prize-winning user of open source) says in a statement that it '...became apparent during discussions that a formal agreement with Microsoft is no longer appropriate.' Having lost their discount, individual government departments will now have to put their IT requirements out to tender individually."
Doors open! Get 'em, boys!
The individual departments should be required to use open formats where open formats exist. It's far past the time governments should be held hostage with proprietary formats.
I'd be happily surprised if a National government was the one to embrace Free software and start the process of eventually seeing it used in schools, which then flows to the work place and homes... But we'll see... I would be very surprised if the government picked open source.
Maybe not a nail:
SSC spokesperson Marian Mortensen says government looks for three things in its negotiations: value for money, fitness for purpose and strategic benefit.
Mortensen says open source will be "part fo [sic] the mix, definitely". However, she adds, such choices will be made by individual agencies.
There's something, anyway, but it might not be much. It's up to the individual agencies.
Put identity in the browser.
Before you all rejoice in hallelujah glory please remember that:
1) MS is a powerful marketing organisation with a single control center. It has millions to spend on lobbying. Instead of one central purchasing order they will go after each state/county and government organisation parallely and independently.
2) To take advantage of this situation the FOSS/Open Source has NO marketing budget or marketing plan except for some backdoor geeks.
3) Lobbyists that MS hires far outmatch the abilities of what FOSS can bring up....
Let's face facts ok?
We have been a good, in fact excellent opening in a battle. The enemy has taken a big kick in its balls and is down for a few moments.
But, we lack the control center and resources of taking advantage of it.
If i were Red Hat or Ubuntu (in a corporate sense), i would be in NZ now talking to the main permanent secretaries and other pukes down there to hammer down an initial PoC for Linux/Open office.
And yes i would offer a central help center staffed by real people who can train the department's IT staff and/or assist them in installing, fixing bugs, training staff, etc all the things Microsoft will do.
And yes, i would sign a one-year contract with them offering them a FREE software with paid support.
But, as FOSS supporter do i have a centralized marketing budget, people, resources to make it happen?
NOOOO.
Its likea Sniper going against an entire armoured division. Yeah it sounds gung-ho, but that does not win a war gentlemen. We need the three C's of marketing. Command, Control and a Corporate willing to take risks and Money.
Once we have that in form of Red Hat or corporate Ubuntu we can talk about a Master Plan on taking down MS...
Until then shut up the vodka bottles. Its too early to celebrate.
"Doing what i can, with what i have." ~ Burt Gummer
So the NZ gov will not make a contract with MS centrally, leaving individual dept's to tender individually. Well, it just means that the central States Service Commission with it's liking of FOSS will no longer have as much influence on software purchases, leaving possibly less open-minded dept CIO's to make contracts. At a higher price due to lower volume? No great loss for Microsoft there. It may even be a winner for them.
sudo mount --milk --sugar
I bet they just want better deal, and think this will help. Who knows, they are probably right about that.
Maybe microsoft should work on making windows more user friendly so you don't have to spend hours in the dos cli configuring irq numbers and io addresses, dealing with constant crashes and manually installing networking support just so they can get a workable graphic interface to check their mail with..
Oh wait, it's not 1993 anymore...
Linux these days is generally much easier to install than windows, and proprietary unix was always much easier than windows (because like macos, it came bundled with hardware designed to run it)
http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
In longitude it is pretty close.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
It's likely a positioning move to get steeper discounts.
What would put another nail in MS's coffin would be them calling the bluff and forcing NZ to take on quite a bit of Open source software. Once past the "OMG it's different then what we have always used" stage, it might be more then enough to the government agencies and lead to more OSS adoption.
This is getting fucking tiresome. At first I gave this argument (user friendliness) some thought, of course Linux is different so it has to be either easier or more difficult, no two OSs are exactly equal. Then after hearing this argument about a thousand times between showing everybody from coworkers to friends to my own mother, whom isn't the youngest hen in the pen to put it gently, how to use Ubuntu I come to realise that most of the times it's because you are so fucking lazy. In my experience most people reject it simply because it's different, and different is scary, it's unknown. When my mother asks me for help I refuse to help her, instead I tell her "let's pretent that you have psychic powers and with that you just 'know' where to look for the answer", while I survey. Most times she, being 60+, finds whatever she's looking for. For example if she would ask me how to change the layout of the document she's working with in OOo I'd tell her, "What would be the 'category' of this action? Would it fit more into e.g. changing views or handling files or editing the contents?". Naturally where I'm going with this is to show her that she doesn't need to be scared, she can, with some common sense and an eager index finger, check for it in the logical places she can imagine.
In my experience it's not so difficult to teach a person with low Windows knowledge to do the same fundamental actions in another OS, Ubuntu being my preferred alternative for these. The tasks these people do are virtually the same. What is difficult is to teach the thick headed thinks-he-knows-his-computer guy, that has learned some semi advanced tweaking and configuring in Windows, to start "all over". To me it's clear, these people push it away not because they can't, but because they thought they could and when they realise that Windows has tought them very little (since little hacking is necessary) about general OS structure and configuration. I'm saying this because the first time I really forced myself to give Linux a chance I started off, on recommendation from friends using Linux, with Slackware. As a thick headed thought-I-knew-my-computer I'd tell you one thing: I was fucking lost. This failed, that failed -- and I can tell you that from a Windows users perspective the word "sound server" was very confusing. But as I moved further and further away from the Windows concept (what I thought was how an OS was built) I began learning how OSs function in reality. Of course the hardware resources of your soundcard may only be accessable by one application, which is why you need a sound server to distribute/gather/tunnel the stream, but Windows never even hinted this very fundamental fact about hardware/software interaction. Also I have to add that this was many years ago and long before Mark Shuttleworth first spoke the word Ubuntu, nowadays the sound server example might be nullified by Ubuntu as well. But it wouldn't matter, my point is that you find it difficult because you find it difficult, not because it is difficult, if you understand what I mean. So you see there are 3 types of users, the one that knows, the one that doesn't know and last and worst the one that thinks he knows, don't be the latter, nobody likes this guy.
I am the lawn!
and proprietary unix was always much easier than windows
Nope. UNIX was/is much easier to maintain when setup half decent. Keeping 10 workstations running was peanuts compared to Windows. To install it you needed to know your stuff. No deceptive comfy pillow was supplied. Ever installed SunOS 4? Ever added a 3rd party SCSI disk?
I hadn't the slightest objection to his spending his time planning massacres for the bourgeoisie... (P.G. Wodehouse)
NZ will still buy all software from MS, just at much more inflated prices. Buying OSS from a zoo of little guys is just too much hassle for IT and the buyers.
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
How does nLite ease the installation of Windows?
The act of using nLite to create your custom unattended install is more complex than just doing an attended install in the first place.
Unless you have someone else create your nLited disk for you, but then, you could have somebody else do the Windows install, too.
So your point is moot....
"City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
I'm sure it is great in the Enterprise market, but in the home and SMB markets? It is a royal can of suck. I'm sorry, but it's true. if you would like proof go to Bestbuy.com, Staples.com, and Walmart.com and buy any of the following WITHOUT doing research. You see home and SMB customers will NEVER do research, or spend hours trawling some forum to find out if device foo works on distro barr. They just walk into one of the above stores and buy based on price and features. Now try buying an all in one printer, a USB TV Tuner, and a Wifi USB stick. Remember-NO RESEARCH. Now go to distro foo and see if device barr you just got at Walmart works. I'll wait-
What is that? It don't work? Welcome to my reality. Pretty much zip you buy at the above stores works for the consumer. It is actually easy to explain. It is because Red Hat and Novell and the other companies writing Linux drivers only care about server and enterprise support. And as much as you'd like to believe it, I'm afraid that unless real money is spent on consumer hardware support those drivers aren't going to be written by some guy in his basement. Real support takes real money that simply isn't being spent on Linux. That is why even Ubuntu, the darling of the Linux community, is seeing a 400% higher return rate than Windows. For an OEM that is a dealbreaker.
So can we please just stop that "Linux is ready for home users" BS already? Unless your average home user consists of someone with a server and a $1000 enterprise network printer the facts just don't support it. There is simply way too much hardware being sold that has no support whatsoever in Linux. And you will never ever get Joe SMB or Sally home user to trawl forums and do research just to go buy a doodad at Walmart. It just isn't going to happen and you are deluding yourself if you believe it ever will. If you want the home and SMB markets you need at least 80% of the doodads that are sold at Walmart, Staples, and Best Buy to "just work".
And please don't say "But but but... they won't support us or open their specs!". Welcome to reality, where life is hard and nobody cares. The SMB and home users certainly doesn't give a shit about "free as in beer or freedom" when nothing they own or pick up at Walmart actually works. And they don't care about your excuses either. To them your "free OS" is "free as in worthless" if they can't print. Sorry, but it is true. On servers, it is a different ballgame. Linux is rock solid stable with excellent support. I would recommend Linux without a doubt for a server setup. But for home users it just sucks. Sorry.
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
Thank you for proving my point. While you are using Windows you have little knowledge of how important driver support is, you take it for granted, just like my sound server example. You don't know that it's important to check for supported hardware because whatever you stick inside your PC has been supported so far.
:)
You're saying that you're about to change PC equipment. Before you decide what you want google around for those pieces of hardware and make sure there are stable Linux drivers that support them. It doesn't necessarily need to be old equipment so don't sweat it just yet. Do this and I promise you that you will have the most painless OS installation you've ever experienced, no exaduration. Your initial thought might be "how annoying", but then again if you had low level knowledge (and wanted Linux) you'd probably end up buying a complete setup from a vendor that supplies Linux support, but you're not. If you were an advanced user you'd find no problem in doing this quick research. If however you're the middle person with, let's call it phantom knowledge, you'd try to do what the advanced guy is doing with the ambitions of the low level guy, getting you absolutely nowhere. The only way of learning this is by doing, so do yourself a favor and set yourself on the path of becoming an advanced user, it really doesn't hurt.
As I said, if you're really up for it the only thing you need to do is check for Linux support for the hardware you're going to buy, the same way as you've been ignoring Mac products due to incompability (or other more obvious issues not mentioned).
Oh and about "laziness". You can disagree with me all you want, and you probably should, but I've seen and helped so many people with similar/related problems and my conclusion is, even they'd disagree as well, that they've simply been lazy. They know google, they know english, they have fingers, and most importantly they have a question. Don't tell me that's not being lazy.
I am the lawn!
Mind you, I have to help out my Windows-using friends as well :(
You didn't hear? The best IT friend excuse was formed, it goes by: "I'm sorry man, I never learned Vista so I can't help you. :(". Seriously though it's the best excuse I've found for bailing out of those people-taking-advantage-of-your-juicy-brain situations.
Back to the topic though. I understand your argument about scattered and misleading information, but this is a self solving problem caused by the small magnitude of Linux. As Linux grows, so will this problem shrink. However there are still many detailed and very helpful resources for your distro, if you're using any major distro. My favourite being gentoo wiki. Apart from you have the regular Ubuntu resources, launchpad, ubuntuforums etc. In addition to this you have great independent resources such as linuxquestions.org
I like to use Ubuntu a lot, as you might notice, in my examples. Not because it's "the master distro", not at all actually. But it's unique in a way where "automagic" is a key word. This is what the common user wants, and we will see more ubuntu-like distros coming as time goes. For now I support Ubuntu as much as I support FOSS simply because it's a milestone in FOSS development that has already made it to history, any person whom doesn't recognize that fact is lying to himself. You don't have to promote it, you don't have to use it, you don't even have to like it, but you should never lie about what it is.
I am the lawn!
And they'll say "Whoa, you're thinking of using what filthy hippy app? ...
The 1990's called, they want their talking points back. Notice that after all these years, the best MSFTers can do to counter RMS is to call him names? Can't handle any of the ideas or technologies, can they?
We've known for decades that FOSS is about making money. Some discussions which might make the point that FOSS concepts dovetail with that:
and so on...
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
Put the Lexmark down and step away from 1998. Your 4 paragraphs detailing one area where Windows is better than Linux (and only due to market considerations, not technical considerations) is amusing but overall pointless. I've personally set up about 50 desktop linux installations for friends and family who want to use me as their "computer guy". You have a (very small) point in that you can't just pick up ANY hardware and have it work in Linux, only about 90% of it works immediately. You're completely wrong about people being too stupid to realize that they have to buy something that works with their computer in order to, ya know, use it with their computer. By your logic Macs wouldn't exist simply due to not being 100% compatible with your pet OS.
You keep on spreading that FUD, but in the meantime I'm going to enjoy the ease of maintenance on my household's 2 linux desktops, 3 linux laptops and my linux server. Hell, I've even completely replaced cable TV with internet video.
A quick re-read of your post basically comes down to this bit of logic: Linux is not ready for the desktop because a few hardware companies have not yet blessed it as ready for the desktop. Linux is inferior to Windows because Lexmark says so, and that's the bottom line, nothing you can do about it but not be good enough.
See how goofy that sounds? As it turns out, it's just as silly in practice, as none of the few vendors that are actually Linux hostile have a monopoly in their market, thus any part you need is available at a reasonable (for the item) cost.
It is a lie. Repeat after me. "A Computer is NOT an appliance".
Some things are not inherently simple. A blender is simple, a toaster is simple. A telecsope is NOT simple. You have to adjust where you are pointing it and the focus, know about lenses.
Things are moving along. Compare an SLR camera from 20 years ago to a push and click digital camera of today. There are still things to learn but the simple "point and click" "appliance" camera of today is a very powerful camera.
Microsoft has done everyone a diservice by saying that a computer IS an appliance. Take any group of hardware and add $200 of Microsoft products and you will have a working system. Easy to use and secure.
Everyeone wants to do word processing, but they don't want to lean how their OS stores files...so they can't find what they saved an hour from now. Everyone wants to send email, but they don't know how to read an error message that tells them why their email could not be delivered.
Short of running a kiosk, we are not anywhere near the "appliance" stage of PC computing. Anyone saying otherwise should be swiftly kicked in the balls. Even if he is a geek with funny haircut and wears glasses.
vi +
I'm in the computer repair business (sole proprietor). I'm looking into starting a company along the same lines with three colleagues, one of which is a big fan of Linux and OpenOffice, and another of which is a fan of Vista and Microsoft Office.
We have had a massive bitch of a time convincing Vista dude why we'd prefer OO for in-house use (main selling point: it's compatible with office dox and its free). We literally had to sit down for a half hour and run him through it.
Ultimately, the end user likes things simple. Plug & Play gave them the idea of "Plug it in and it should work; if it doesn't then something's broke". You can't ask basic users to mess with tar.gz files or hunt down drivers that didn't come with the OS.
For Linux to succeed it has to be idiot proof for the end user, and it's not there yet.
Random Thoughts From A Diseased Mind (Not For Dummies)
Now try buying an all in one printer, a USB TV Tuner, and a Wifi USB stick. Remember-NO RESEARCH. Now go to distro foo and see if device barr you just got at Walmart works.
Having bought an overpriced prebuilt many years ago, I've been through all that and more. I still remember the five hour delay while Windows Update downloaded a 30MB bloated, shitty sound card driver over dialup because the OEM install CD didn't bother to include one. It worked on Knoppix "out of the box". Guess windows just isn't ready for the desktop.
They fly direct!
(For fourteen straight hours)