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Jet Stream Kites Could Power New York City
Damien1972 writes to tell us that researchers from the Carnegie Institution and California State University claim that a fleet of kites could harvest enough energy to run New York and other major cities, especially if they are affected by polar jet streams. "Using 28 years of data from the National Center for Environmental Prediction and the Department of Energy, Ken Caldeira of the Carnegie Institution's Department of Global Ecology and Cristina Archer of California State University, Chico compiled the first global survey of wind energy available at high altitudes in the atmosphere. They found that the regions best suited for harvesting this energy align with population centers in the eastern U.S. and East Asia, although they note that 'fluctuating wind strength still presents a challenge for exploiting this energy source on a large scale.'"
Maybe this will finally rid Florida of the lightning capital of the world title.
:-P
Ben Franklin, eat your heart out.
Great defense against incoming jetliners as the kites get sucked into engines, either from terrorists or major campaign donors out for a spin in Air Force One.
It'll be like the ending of Mary Poppins, only it never ends! Let's go fly a kite, up to the highest height...
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
It's always the time to start innovating from scratch.
With 2K for turbines and wires,
we can build a generating flyer.
With a line to the ground,
it's a turbine in flight!
With a bolt holding tight
to the string of the kite!
Let's go fly a kite
Up to the highest height
Let's go fly a kite
And send it soaring
Up through the atmosphere
Up where the air is clear
Oh, let's go fly a kite!
I am officially gone from
A good point, especially if you take out the need for landing at some point.
Got me thinkin'.
I suppose the "fluctuating flow" problem could be circumvented by using helium bags to get the kites aloft initially, combined with a spooled tether.
When the jet-stream is coming close, the bags are filled and the kite spooled to the proper altitude. Once the jet-stream is sufficient to keep the kite aloft, the bags are deflated and stowed. When the jet-stream is predicted to be moving out of the area, the bags are re-inflated until there is no more reason to keep it aloft, at which time it spooled back in.
Even over the best areas, the wind can be expected to fail about five percent of the time.
The heck with backup power sources -- who covers the liability when 6 miles of power-transmitting cable come crashing to the ground? And how much wind does it take to support the weight of 6 mile long high voltage wire?
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
A kite which can support a 30,000 foot electric line? I'm thinking there are some serious engineering challenges there. Probably involving unobtanium and other exotic materials.
What happens when you pull that much energy out of the jetstream? Does it change global air circulation? Do you get climate changes throughout the world?
Everywhere else we call it navigation. I don't know what you would call it.
Why bother
No, it's fine. We just need to lubricate them sufficiently.
I see comment after comment like "What about teh airplanzes!?!" but such comments come from a severe lack of understanding of controlled airspace.
See, while it's true that the Eastern seaboard is one of the busiest airspaces in the world, it's also one of the most tightly controlled. Airspace is commonly restricted to 18,000 feet, above which *all* airspace is controlled. (It's called "class A(lpha) airspace at/above 18,000 ft) The only effect this would have on air traffic is that ATC would redirect commercial flights around the kites, which isn't particularly hard to do.
As a pilot myself, I've many times been diverted around hazards such as other planes, mountains, and even UAVs. (Un-manned Aeronautical vehicles, being tested by the military)
And obviously, these wouldn't be assembled on the instrument approach path for O'Hare airport. This makes the whole "Teh planezes are fallingz" as exciting a story as "Teh Internetz iz failingz" due to lack of router memory.
In short, it's just not a significant issue.
I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
I am asking because if you had, you would be laughing like I am right now. Powerful winds tear through everything that has even the tiniest bit of slack. At ground level. Tarps rip to pieces, grommets are completely useless. Shelters fly away into the playa, women's clothes break free and take on their own. Oh, well, I am getting distracted.
TFA's description is much more vague than ones I've seen in science fiction.
Several technologies have been proposed to harvest these high altitude winds, including tethered, kite-like turbines that would be floated to the altitude of the jet streams at an altitude of 20,000-50,000 feet and transmit up to 40 megawatts of electricity to the ground via the tether.
Well, I am proposing building flying cities maintained by giant robots. We can use the high altitude, jets streams and clear skies to harvest clear solar and wind energy.
Here's my proof of concept: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_in_the_Sky
No doubt a fleet of electricity generating kites are going to cost a pretty penny.
Why is there "no doubt" about this? Is there some reason why kites have to be very expensive?
Second, why would you invest in a new technology when there are other (probably more-efficient) green technologies.
For the same reason you invested in the other green technologies even when there were older technologies already available then -- because it was a promising idea.
Now isn't the time to start innovating from scratch with the global recession.
Now is exactly the time. A few technological "game changers" could be just what it takes to boost us out of recession.
Lastly, where are going to put them, in the plains of the Midwest?
Sure, why not? Or any other place that has wind at 30,000 feet and isn't in anybody's flight path.
What happens when the kites start interfering with birds and such?
Not many birds fly at 30,000 feet, Einstein.
I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
Why don't we just get a really long extension cord and plug it into the sun?
But first off, where are we going to get the money to start buying kites? No doubt a fleet of electricity generating kites are going to cost a pretty penny. Second, why would you invest in a new technology when there are other (probably more-efficient) green technologies.
Ok, what - exactly what - is greener than a kite? Or a longer established technology? (cries, weeps bitter tears.)
On the gripping hand, you could have miniature wind turbines attached to the kite, perhaps tap the electrostatic potential between kite and ground (lots of moving air to add or remove charge) and you wouldn't really need to worry about lightning if you designed the thing to vapourise on a strike.
And they'd be pretty too. I'd vote for the Man in the Moon pattern myself.
Do not mock my vision of impractical footwear
Only the ones that fly into it.
Next question...
Actually, there are a number of species of geese that have been observed flying long distances at over 30,000 feet. Granted, not many birds are likely to be dumb enough to fly headfirst into a kite....
Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.
Clearly if you had INVESTIGATED the proposal, you would know that it does not involve lifting turbines. The kite is flown in a circular or figure-8 motion. On the ground, a generator extracts energy from the rotating tether. There are already test sites.
http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/saul_griffith_on_kites_as_the_future_of_renewable_energy.html
The power is generated on the ground. The kite simply moves cables in a circular or figure-8 pattern.
FTFA: "Several technologies have been proposed to harvest these high altitude winds, including tethered, kite-like turbines that would be floated to the altitude of the jet streams at an altitude of 20,000-50,000 feet and transmit up to 40 megawatts of electricity to the ground via the tether."
It sounds a little like they are talking about creating "kite-like turbines that would be floated to the altitude of the jet streams" ... and then they would "transmit up to 40 megawatts of electricity to the ground via the tether". I am not sure where you are getting the ground-based power generation from. It isn't mentioned anywhere in the article.
Um, they could have threatened nuclear war for violating the UN charter.
My god, I haven't laughed so hard in days.
Are they going to launch a strike from the secret UN base in a dormant volcano? Or perhaps the huge fleet of UN satellites in orbit armed to the teeth and ready to pounce on the slightest transgression!!
If you recall, the German invasion of Belgium was enough to get the British into World War I
I was not aware the british were the UN.
likewise, the invasion of Poland started World War II in Europe.
Wow, that was started by the U.N. too? I guess the books I read were all wet! Thank god we had you along to tell us the true chronicles of Captian UN, hive-mind savior of humanity with the first strike Fist Of Great Justice!
Ha!
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
i've seen the nat geo show on this, they spent decades trying to get these things to work. one guy built a blowup version, sent 10's of thousands on it only to have it fail. it's great is you just ignore small details like oh say, what happens when one breaks loose. it is after all in the jet stream under pretty extreme conditions.
If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....