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Stuck Knob Causes Serious Window Damage To Atlantis
FTL writes "While in orbit a metal knob floated between a window and the dashboard of Atlantis. Once back on Earth, the shuttle contracted, wedging the knob firmly in place and damaging the window. Initial attempts to free the knob have failed and engineers may need six months to disassemble that section of the orbiter. Given that the shuttle program will probably end next year anyway, such a delay might mean scrapping Atlantis early rather than repairing it. Efforts to remove the knob using less invasive techniques continue."
The article neglects to mention the extreme disappointment of John M. Grunsfeld who spent the majority of Mission STS-125 photographing a strange phenomenon he could witness through his window but could not detect on radar. A large knob-shaped object would move about above the atmosphere with an almost supernatural fluidity and change of speeds relative to the Earth. He neglected to mention it to his crewmates hoping that he had stumbled upon either the first contact with alien life or observed a new phenomenon he dubbed in his journal "Grunsfeld's Effect." Unfortunately the engineers at NASA have immortalized his name by calling the stuck debris "Grunsfeld's Knob" or "Grunsfeld's God." The engineers have also started referring to being duped as "being grunsfelded." Example: "I called up to order some of those damn Video Professor instructional DVDs and ended up with 8 of the stupid things. Man did I get Grunsfelded!"
My work here is dung.
Or is that only an outer protective layer? I know I've seen pictures of the pitting that micrometeors and paint flecks have caused on the Shuttles while in orbit, I just assumed they were made to be easily replaced.
There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
they can borrow mine. I never use it.
Absolute statements are never true
Title suggestion: "Shuttle has a Wedgie"
Table-ized A.I.
Throw a bucket of cold water on it and the knob should slip right out.
I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.
and is underfunded and ending soon anyways, give atlantis the same proper ghetto treatment a contemporary of its time would receive, like 25 year old plymouth horizon: plastic sheeting and duct tape
also knock out a back tail light and finger daub "wash me" in the cosmic dust on its hood
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
it's knobody's fault. Sorry.
why not just put it in a vacuum chamber, warm it up, and slide it on out?
What, you mean like they discussed in the article? They even came up with a better idea: instead of heating up the whole vessel, just freeze the knob with dry ice!
The options relating to the application of dry ice to shrink the knob have already been attempted, and failed. However, the same method, along with a pressurization of the Crew Module, may be enough to free the knob from its lodged position.
The only problem is the amount of pressurization that can be conducted in the OPF is far less than the pressure that played a part in allowing the knob to become embedded in the first place.
Pressurize crew module and dry ice on knob to TBD (To Be Determined) pressure. Pro's: Could allow for uniform structural deflection to increase gap between pressure pane and dashboard; enough to free up the knob non-destructively. Less potential for inducing further damage to the pane.
**UPDATE: The above option was selected on Thursday as the opening process for an attempt to remove the knob. The cabin will be pressurized to 3 psid, before an engineer will apply dry ice to the knob. This option is not deemed to be a likely solution, but more so the opening option that avoids additional damage to the window.**
Although it's lengthy, you should try reading the article next time. The guys at NASA are pretty clever.
My work here is dung.
They need to call one of those chip-and-crack auto glass replacement people that I hear on the radio all the time. They come out to your workplace to do the job, and best of all, you only pay the insurance deductible!
Chelloveck
I give up on debugging. From now on, SIGSEGV is a feature.
I know how they feel: Toyota's quoting me $400 to fix a loose sun visor because they have to take the entire @&%#! side of the car apart to get to it.
Table-ized A.I.
Acid.
The guys at NASA are pretty clever.
Oh come on - it's not like they're rocket scientists or anything! :) :) :)
FAO any other Monday morning quarterbacks, armchair rocket scientists, and other self-appointed experts and "why don't they just" merchants out there who never seem to consider that the people working on the thing might actually have thought about what they are doing, quoth TFA:
"Induced damage of the knob being wedged between the glass and the dashboard closeout panel structure, or from removal of the knob could result in unacceptable damage.
"Consequences of unacceptable damage to the glass pane: Replacing the pressure pane would result in a significant impact to ground schedule (potential 6+ month impact). Requires de-configuring dashboard structure and instrumentation to remove window assembly for refurbishment. Windshield pressure pane removal has never been performed at KSC.
"Knob removal must be performed carefully; exhausting all risk free options first, then attempting more intrusive (higher risk) options, if others fail."
Drill baby drill - on Mars
Not to mention that a structure designed to take that differential in a zero gravity environment might not respond the same way to it under 1 gravity.
Jherico
What can the average user can do to ensure his security? "Nothing, you're screwed"
Knobs do not belong in vacuum cleaners. And once it warms up, there's no pulling it out of anything. There was one bad evening I did get my knob suck it something. Don't mix up lube and super glue.
If this condition lasts for more than 4 hours, call a doctor.
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
I used to do tech support at Honeywell. Had real rocket scientists there. Called them my brilliant idiots.
I drank what? -- Socrates
...you read that as "Stuck Know Causes Serious Windows Damage To Atlantis", and think "How the hell do they know what OS they were using on that sunken island?"
I just know realized, that even my question does not make any sense...
Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
Why any car is made with other than LED lights (perhaps cold-cathode is good enough, or for some reason that I don't know even better) rather than little incandescent bulbs is beyond me. "Here's an important part we know will fail, that's about 18" from the driver. Let's make it very, very difficult to remove, so when the important dashlights fail, he'll need to pay someone with more tools a lot of money to fix the 10-cent lightbulb."
Headlights, the same way, at least the ones on a) a 1998 Subaru Outback and b) a 2003 (?) Mazda Protege5. I have no yet had the courage to well investigate on my current car, but since it's also a Subaru, I bet it will lead to much cursing. Ooh, how I hate those little bendy-pins, straight of our Rube Goldberg, and the awkward angles / hand positioning needed to do a repair that's to be easily expected.
And it's not even a space shuttle!
timothy
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
As someone else earlier suggested, why not dissolve it? There are acids with high enough electronegativity differences to dissolve just about anything. If the acid were brushed on to the a sufficiently narrow part of the knot, and all collected as it dripped down, it would in time etch that part of the metal away enough to break it and hence dislodge the knob. Of course, it would have to be secured first so it doesn't collapse when it shouldn't. But that seems less invasive if more time-consuming. However, it needn't even be so expensive -- the acid can after all simply be re-circulated. No matter how time-consuming, though, it's simple enough that there's not much overhead -- so it could be done in weeks instead of 6 months.
And yes, I don't see this option discussed anywhere in the article. Several other options with immediately visible flaws are discussed and rejected, but this isn't.
Yeah this was my thought too as soon as I read "dry ice". Just freeze it and smack it. I'm sure the reason why not is because the fragments will only cause more damage once in space.
Try this, for educational purposes:
Drop a piece of aluminum or steel into a bucket of liquid nitrogen. Now take it out and drop it on the ground from a height of 6 feet, or hit it with a hammer. Notice it not shattering.
The first time I dropped a 10 pound block of aluminum while taking it out of a nitrogen bucket I expected it to shatter, too. Then I realized I thought that because of hollywood.
"I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
... the engineers working on this ... have thought of just about anything ... Drill/cut? ... Pressurize orbiter? ... Apply cold to the knob to shrink it?
How about tying a string to the knob (so it doesn't get away), reheating the orbiter, and pressurizing it - recreating the situation (except for zero G) that let it float in in the first place?
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
<Slaps Head> Of course! The answer is in the article. Phone NASA and tell them to read it.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
How many rocket scientists does it take to get a stuck knob unstuck?
"There are no facts, only interpretations." --Friedrich Nietzsche.
Yeah, why didn't those rocket scientists think of using a magnet to clean up aluminum dust - what losers!
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
Magnets for aluminum. Sure.
Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
pencils contain graphite. graphite conducts electricity. graphite powder is generated when you rub it up against paper to write stuff. graphite powder gets everywhere in microgravity, including behind control panels, into switches, and sensitive electrical components.
i'm glad you're not in charge of so much of a paperclip at NASA.
This is an urban legend. It's entirely false. The poster knows this and is trolling. PS: I own one of the pens in question.
why can't they put postive pressure inside the orbiter and pop it out?
but a better question perhaps, is why the hell is there junk rolling around inside the space shuttle?
They're using their grammar skills there.
Nope sorry p51d007
Fisher developed the pen at their own expense NASA only had to buy the pens, at the same price the general public could I might add.
You know, just a little research would keep you from looking quite so stupid.
As a personal note you might try not being an ass, just for fun.
re: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Pen
NASA never approached Paul Fisher to develop a pen, nor did Fisher receive any government funding for the pen's development. Fisher invented it independently, and then asked NASA to try it. After the introduction of the AG7 Space Pen, both the American and Soviet (later Russian) space agencies adopted it. Previously both the Russian and American astronauts used grease pencils and plastic slates
Well, since everyone else is throwing in their idea, here's mine.
How about a very low-speed, low pressure diamond wire-saw?
For example: SXJ-2 Precision Endless Wire Saw - 840 mm long, 0.35 mm dia. Diamond Loop Wire (that's a continuous loop - they'd need to cut it, and re-attach it after wrapping it around the knob).
They could feed the flexible saw wire around around the knob and adjust the cutting pressure to keep it as safe as they want to be. If it's just a wire coated in diamond dust or the like, it will cut very slowly and precisely.
Note: If it works, please send me the cut pieces :)
N.
"Nothing strengthens authority so much as silence." - Charles de Gaulle
In my case it was soaking the steel in liquid nitrogen for 15 minutes, then hitting it with a whopping big hammer with a knife edge at the end of a three foot long pendulum that had swung through 120 degrees or so. With most steels a 10mm cross section won't even break all of the way through under such treatment. Those that do are usually rubbish in any sort of cold weather.
The "Hollywood style" liquid nitrogen brittleness is best seen with some plastics and rubbers - there is a glass transition temperature below which the material is very brittle. You can do the rick of smashing a rubber dog toy into fragments with a hammer after soaking it in liquid nitrogen for a few minutes. Polyethylene as in cling wrap doesn't do this (which is dissappointing. Anything with a lot of water (eg. a banana) will of course freeze and smash just like ice. An important safety tip is to wait some time before placing the frozen banana in your mouth or it will burn your tongue (my classmate that did that now works in an explosives factory but is still intact last I heard).
We've used a similar technique in one of our workshops, but there's no need to brush and collect - you use an inert sponge and/or capillary tube to circulate the etchant. Likewise, you don't need to use acids which produce potentially corrosive fumes and aerosols. A solution of copper sulphate and sodium chloride will do the job nicely with less risk.
"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."