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Red Hat Is Now Part of the S&P 500

phantomfive writes "Red Hat has made it onto the S&P 500, an important measure of the stock market. It is replacing CIT, which is expected to go bankrupt after the government refused to bail them out. Red Hat is the first Linux company to make it on to the S&P 500. While this means little directly for the company, it is an indication of the importance Linux is taking on in the world."

34 of 128 comments (clear)

  1. Let Me Be the First To Say... by SilverHatHacker · · Score: 5, Funny

    Congratulations.
    Could this be the Year of the Linux Stock Market?

    --
    Funny may not give karma, but +5 Informative never made anyone snort coffee out their nose.
    1. Re:Let Me Be the First To Say... by oneirophrenos · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yeah, congratulations to Red Hat for replacing a bankrupt company!

    2. Re:Let Me Be the First To Say... by jedidiah · · Score: 4, Insightful

      How else do you expect it to happen? Really?

      Yes. It just KILLS some people that Linux might be doing well or
      Redhat might be doing well. They will go so far as to even try to
      stir up some sort of artificial stock panic.

      Regardless of how some lemming might want to spin it, Redhat was
      slightly less important last week when compared to this week and
      this week they are a part of the S&P 500.

      Perhaps Redhat will be a little less subseptable to FUD now.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    3. Re:Let Me Be the First To Say... by Darkness404 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The thing is though, there are only 2 other major OS makers who are publicly traded, that are in competition to RH Apple and MS. Even if Chrome, Ubuntu or SuSE ends up taking away a lot of RH marketshare, all RH has to do is take the ideas and code from them and add it to their product. On the other hand, MS can't exactly take code from OS X and neither can Apple take code from Windows.

      --
      Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
    4. Re:Let Me Be the First To Say... by rtfa-troll · · Score: 4, Informative
      --
      =~ s,(.*),<sarcasm>$1</sarcasm>,g if any_point_you_wish();
    5. Re:Let Me Be the First To Say... by burnin1965 · · Score: 4, Informative

      there are only 2 other major OS makers who are publicly traded, that are in competition to RH

      HPQ HP-UX
      ORCL Solaris
      IBM AIX
      NOVL SUSE

      Looks like Red Hat has plenty of competition. Red Hat's business performance selling support services for their distribution of linux has been outstanding and their inclusion in the S&P 500 is well deserved.

    6. Re:Let Me Be the First To Say... by MattXBlack · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Don't IBM and HP make operating systems?

  2. Benefit of being in S&P 500 by SpinyNorman · · Score: 5, Informative

    There is a benefit to stockholders since being in the S&P 500 creates instant demand - it means that all the S&P 500 index funds need to buy your stock!

    1. Re:Benefit of being in S&P 500 by bert.cl · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, my theory is a bit rusty, but wouldn't this add some liquidity for the Redhat stock?

      Might as well decrease as well if passively managed funds want to keep on to the shares, but going by gut feeling, I would think it's a good thing regardless. If anything, the share should be more correctly priced in the long run;

      Depending on your definition of correct pricing of course.

    2. Re:Benefit of being in S&P 500 by oldhack · · Score: 5, Funny

      Now the god damn commies are in my portfolio.

      --
      Fuck systemd. Fuck Redhat. Fuck Soylent, too. Wait, scratch the last one.
  3. Index funds by andhar · · Score: 5, Informative

    Inclusion in the S&P 500 could mean some index funds will have to acquire some shares. Inclusion in an index is usually seen as positive, and falling out of an index is seen as negative, when index funds have to sell.

    --
    Vaya con huevos, my darling.
    1. Re:Index funds by larry+bagina · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Owning Red Hat stock doesn't make linux happen. When you (or the index fund) buys RHAT stock, that money goes to the previous shareholder, NOT Red Hat.

      --
      Do you even lift?

      These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.

    2. Re:Index funds by Meshach · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Owning Red Hat stock doesn't make linux happen. When you (or the index fund) buys RHAT stock, that money goes to the previous shareholder, NOT Red Hat.

      Not directly. But as more people buy stock in RHAT it means that Red Hat will be a more viable business and more people will put money into it. So indirectly Red Hat does get money.

      --
      "Maybe this world is another planet's hell"
      Aldous Huxley
    3. Re:Index funds by cetialphav · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Owning Red Hat stock doesn't make linux happen. When you (or the index fund) buys RHAT stock, that money goes to the previous shareholder, NOT Red Hat.

      That is true, but there are tangible benefits to RHAT. One of the ways they can raise capital is to issue additional shares. An increase in the stock price means that they can raise more money when they do this. This also makes the stock options that are offered to employees more valuable without costing the company a cent.
      It also protects the company from a hostile takeover since any buyout becomes more expensive.

    4. Re:Index funds by ceoyoyo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Red Hat issues stock. People buy that stock and the money goes to Red Hat. Since Red Hat hasn't issued any stock lately, if you pick some up you're buying it second had, but so what? You're still responsible for an investment in the company. That is, you gave Red Hat money (probably through many intermediaries) to develop their Linux distribution.

    5. Re:Index funds by tnk1 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yes and no. Directly, no effect on Red Hat.

      Indirectly, Red Hat probably has a stock reserve that it maintains. Improving the price of their stock means that they can actually buy things with that stock, usually this is in the form of acquisitions. Many buyouts are done in the form of stock swaps.

      Additionally, it makes their stock more attractive to give to employees/executives because its not some fly-by-night operation any more. Not that it was before, but some people like their certifications and industry recognitions.

      In the end, it could potentially have a net positive effect on Linux, particularly if they use any advantage in a way that will help Linux, either directly or incidentally via side-effects of their corporate strategy.

      A lot of what-ifs, but in the end, its nice to put a capstone on Linux success in the business world.

    6. Re:Index funds by dfn_deux · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Also, being included in the S&P500 means that the increase in demand created by the associated index fund inclusion will (or should in theory) increase the per share value which has the resultant effect of increasing the over all value of the company as represented as the market capitalization. Larger market caps allow for much more leverage when negotiating financing on large business deals; not only by giving a greater perceived value but also by providing for more favorable rates on direct equity exchange deals.

      P.S. I am not an economist and what I've posted above may be completely wrong... I'm working from very old memories of a 100 level econ course I took a long long long time ago.

      --
      -*The above statement is printed entirely on recycled electrons*-
    7. Re:Index funds by prichardson · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Not directly. But as more people buy stock in RHAT it means that Red Hat will be a more viable business and more people will put money into it. So indirectly Red Hat does get money.

      Having a high stock price does not mean you have a viable business. Please remember the dotbomb bubble. Many businesses had completely ridiculous business plans yet their stock went through the roof. Then they ran out of money and the stock certificates were about as valuable as scratchy toilet paper.

      I'm not saying this is true of RedHat, but PLEASE don't equate a high stock price with a viable business. If anything, a high stock price equates with the mere perception that the business is viable.

      --
      Help I'm a rock.
  4. de-spin by girlintraining · · Score: 5, Informative

    Red Hat has made it onto the S&P 500, an important measure of the stock market.

    First, the S&P members are selected by committee, not by merit alone. Companies are (usually) included because they have a high liquidity and are "representative" of their industry. Not that Red Hat being selected isn't good news, just understand they're not selecting it because of the "runaway success of Linux", but because Red Hat is representative of the overall health of this segment of the industry.

    --
    #fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
    1. Re:de-spin by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 5, Informative

      For Red Hat to be representative of their industry, they need to be a healthy and profitable company. While I agree that this doesn't necessarily point to Linux as a being a "runaway success", it is significant to note that Red Hat's flagship product is a distribution of Linux and the various open source tools from GNU, X.org, Gnome, X.org, etc, and that their other products that help to boost their profitable, like JBoss are also open source tools. So yeah, it's a big win for open source because it shows that you can make it to the S&P 500 by being an open source company. That puts things in proper perspective.

    2. Re:de-spin by Vellmont · · Score: 2, Informative

      It's like graduating from fifth grade and moving on to middle school. It might be a big deal to the kids involved, but to the rest of the world? Not exactly bragging rights.

      Right. Because the vast majority of companies eventually wind up on the S&P 500 list, just like the vast majority of people move from 5th grade to middle school.

      Your attempt to downplay this is ridiculous. This may not be a big deal to "the rest of the world" (exactly how many things are a big deal when put in that context?), but it's quite a big deal for open source.

      Comparing this to all the things it's NOT misses the point. That's a fools errand. What it IS is a recognition that a company based on open source software is a player in the large market. That's all people are trying to say here.

      --
      AccountKiller
    3. Re:de-spin by burnin1965 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Companies are (usually) included because they have a high liquidity and are "representative" of their industry. ... Red Hat is representative of the overall health of this segment of the industry.

      Assuming this 2002 statement concerning the S&P Index Policy is still accurate, Red Hat was selected because they are a leader.

      When it comes to publicly traded linux distributors you have NOVL, ORCL, RHT, and at one time Caldera which is now SCOXQ.PK. The make up of the industry has some extreme variation from Novell and Oracle who have started out and continue to sell proprietary closed source products to Caldera a.k.a. The SCO Group that is currently struggling to avoid Chapter 7 Bankruptcy liquidation. Red Hat is more than representative, they are the leader.

      And in a way this is a sign of the "runaway success of linux". I've read and listened to the ignorant mewling of several "investment advisers" over the years continually predicting the demise of Red Hat, and open source in general, because they "give their product away for free". And yet here we are not only with Red Hat continually growing and profiting but at the same time linux has become a huge part of the server infrastructure that makes up the internet and global business data centers but it has also taken a minor share of the desktop market and a massive share of the embedded market in products from data infrastructure components like routers and firewalls to mass consumer products like televisions, DVD players, HD satellite receivers, etc. It is due to this runaway success that Red Hat has grown, profited and now has been acknowledged as a leader with inclusion in the S&P 500.

  5. Finally! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    2009 - the year of Linux on the stock market

    Next milestone - the desktop!

  6. Re:I wonder... by afabbro · · Score: 2, Informative

    ...does the S&P 500 use Linux?

    "The" S&P 500 is a list of stocks published by Standard & Poor's, a division of McGraw-Hill.

    I seem to recall that NYSE does. Then again, I'm old.

    NYSE, AMEX, or NASDAQ might, but "The S&P 500" can't (except in the sense of "do the companies in the S&P 500 use Linux," in which case the answer is obviously "yes, some do").

    --
    Advice: on VPS providers
  7. Red Hat bully customers ? by viralMeme · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Red Hat .. bully customers just as well as other non-Linux open source companies, so good for them"

    Where, how, please provided verifiable citations.

  8. CIT and moral hazard by benjfowler · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Congrats on Red Hat reaching the big league. I've got a couple of mates who work for Red Hat, and they say business is booming in the downturn, because they're picking up a lot of business from people looking to save money through Red Hat's Open Source-plus-support way of doing things. I wish Red Hat luck.

    Sadly, this doesn't seem to have been the case with CIT, whose criminally incompetent management decided that letting the Government bail them out, was a better business plan than running their business as a going concern.

    Too bad Anglo-American culture is far too tolerant of failure, particularly in the business world. The fat cats need to be taken down a few pegs -- and serious repercussions for failure are needed.

    The big problem with the government bailouts on both sides of the pond, is that the captains of industry are scum, by and large; and will find a way to be "too big to fail", and profit by bludging off people who pay their taxes and do the right thing. Thankfully, the chaps in charge in the US have let CIT fail. After all, private business are full of people who preach the benefits of free markets in the good times. The Obama administration are wise enough to allow them to be destroyed by the remorseless logic of the free market when they are too weak to survive.

    1. Re:CIT and moral hazard by iggymanz · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The Obama administration is the one propping up all manner of failed business models with "bailouts".

      It isn't about Anglo-American culture so much as the culture of the banking cartels, whose dynastic families have a somewhat different ethnic background.....

    2. Re:CIT and moral hazard by jmorris42 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      > Hey, if there's THAT much blubber to cut from the US private healthcare industry, then clearly,
      > that's a massive misallocation of resources that needs to be put to better use, like investing in education.

      You misunderstand. What I'm talking about is the headwind small business is heading into. Break it down. You run a small business, here is your future. Your major source of financing just went out, payroll taxes are about to go up a minimum of 8% (play or pay provision in the health 'reform' bill) on your entry level employees... on top of the recent bump in the minimum wage and the prospect they will soon unionize. Another major hit will be coming to your bottom line when all energy sources jump. And if you manage to keep your door open your income is about to taxed at over 50% when you take this new 5+% surtax into account. And more tax increases are coming, including the return of the dreaded death tax. Meanwhile consumers (your customers) are also losing jobs, pulling back spending and generally hunkering down for a long downturn. So how many new employees will you be hiring in that environment? That is why I'm predicting unemployment will keep going up.

      For unemployment to start dropping somebody has to start hiring beyond replacement. Large business is shedding workers, small business is currently in a holding pattern and will probably start dropping people. The only sector adding jobs is government and every government job is a net drain on the economy. Hate on business all you want pal, but good luck asking a homeless guy to hire you.

      As for education, we can waste twice what we currently spend and gain nothing. Break the union and we can get improvement with current or even lower funding. Break the entire system of government schools and we can be #1 again.

      --
      Democrat delenda est
  9. Actually it is significant by seifried · · Score: 2, Insightful

    A lot of mutual funds/index funds/etc. will now be buying and holding Red Hat stock, as well as other large institutional investors (i.e. large state pension funds/etc.). Same mentality as "no one ever got fired for buying IBM computers", it's not like fund managers are much good at this (witness the melt down in almost every mutual fund/hedge fund), most of them just follow the herd.

  10. Re:Not surprising by iggymanz · · Score: 2, Insightful

    funny, my clients love Red Hat, most of them transitioned from Sun and it wasn't Red Hat who was the bully

  11. Re:Just now? by osu-neko · · Score: 2, Interesting

    How many of the companies you own stock in trade with/do business in red china (or Viet Nam for that matter)? Or put it another way, how many *don't*?

    I believe by "commies" he was referring to actual communists. If there are any actual communists left in China these days, they're probably repressed by the Chinese government for advocating radical philosophies fundamentally opposed to that of the party. :p

    --
    "Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies."
  12. Re:Red Hat Enterprise Linux may be Linux... by Datamonstar · · Score: 2, Funny

    Look, see, It's sorta like this. Say I was to buy you a beer. And that beer would be free. To you. And then you could drink it. And get drunk, I suppose. And then, if I was drinking my beer that I had to pay for then I'd be drunk as well eventually, and then, well...

    I just forgot what I was going on about, but I really could use a beer right now.

    --
    The eternal struggle of good vs. evil begins within one's self.
  13. Lost Opportunity by flipper9 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Back in the early days of RedHat, they used to be located in a non-descript office park in the Raleigh-Durham area. I remember working for an obscure Sales Automation company and our office was located upstairs, where if you turned to the left you'd head into our office and if you turned right you'd enter the small RedHat Software offices. I used to pop my head in occasionally to this company that was making this stuff called "Linux", and even asked for help when I was secretly setting up a Linux server at my company's office to replace our Windows NT 3.51 server.

    If I had only turned right when heading into work instead of turning left when walking up those stairs, I'd today be a millionaire. :(

  14. Re:While this means little directly for the compan by burnin1965 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Conceivably someone bigger whose market Redhat represents a threat to, could seek to buy them in order to just kill their product line, and make sure Linux never has a year of the desktop. That's one of my worst fears in all this.

    Don't sweat it too much. Red Hat's product line is the Red Hat Network, not linux. Microsoft could buy up Red Hat and destroy their support business but they would simply be replaced by another support vendor, either an up start or an existing vendor, i.e. Oracle, Mandriva, Ubuntu, Novell, etc.