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Can We Build a Human Brain Into a Microchip?

destinyland writes "Can we imprint the circuitry of the human brain onto a silicon chip? It requires a computational capacity of 36.8 petaflops — a thousand trillion floating point operations per second — but a team of European scientists has already simulated 200,000 neurons linked up by 50 million synaptic connections. And their brain-chip is scaleable, with plans to create a superchip mimicking 1 billion neurons and 10 trillion synapses. Unfortunately, the human brain has 22 billion neurons and 220 trillion synapses. Just remember Ray Kurzweil's argument: once a machine can achieve a human level of intelligence — it can also exceed it."

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  1. Undue Credit to Kurzweil by eldavojohn · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Just remember Ray Kurzweil's argument: once a machine can achieve a human level of intelligence â" it can also exceed it.

    Ray Kurzweil is a brilliant computer scientist and brought us many improvements -- maybe even the invention of -- the electronic musical keyboard.

    But that is not his argument. I laughed when I read that as the concept was presented to me in sci-fi novels before Kurzweil's time. The earliest I (or Wikipedia) can trace the intelligence explosion theory back to is Irving John Good who, in 1965, said:

    Let an ultraintelligent machine be defined as a machine that can far surpass all the intellectual activities of any man however clever. Since the design of machines is one of these intellectual activities, an ultraintelligent machine could design even better machines; there would then unquestionably be an 'intelligence explosion,' and the intelligence of man would be left far behind. Thus the first ultraintelligent machine is the last invention that man need ever make.

    This was popularized by Vernor Vinge which is where I recalled reading about it. There are many reasons to celebrate Raymond Kurzweil. In my opinion, his is "work" in nutrition and his near-religion called futurology are not in those reasons. He has become a vocal proponent of a dream to become god-like. I do not share that dream and I wish him the best of luck in his endeavors. I just cringe every time I read of the "singularity being near" or the ability to live forever coming about. If it's going to happen, just sit back and let it happen. I feel he has done a great disservice to the field of artificial intelligence by promising unrealistic things in interviews to the lay person. Disappointment is a sure fire way to get yourself branded as a snake oil salesman religious nut.

    Predictions for the future are for sci-fi books and movies, don't get into the habit of being a scientist in an interview with a reputable magazine or web site telling them what is about to happen. Example:

    Kurzweil projects that between now and 2050 technology will become so advanced that medical advances will allow people to radically extend their lifespans while preserving and even improving quality of life as they age. The aging process could at first be slowed, then halted, and then reversed as newer and better medical technologies became available. Kurzweil argues that much of this will be a fruit of advances in medical nanotechnology, which will allow microscopic machines to travel through one's body and repair all types of damage at the cellular level.

    And that's easily criticized:

    Biologist P.Z. Myers has criticized Kurzweil's predictions as being based on "New Age spiritualism" rather than science and says that Kurzweil does not understand basic biology. Myers also claims that Kurzweil picks and chooses events that appear to demonstrate his claim of exponential technological increase leading up to a singularity, and ignores events that do not.

    --
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    1. Re:Undue Credit to Kurzweil by eldavojohn · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I agree 100%. I still don't understand why this charlatan ...

      Well, despite my overly critical initial post I will waste karma with further speculation on Kurzweil. He's actually not a charlatan. He's just stepping outside of his field and extrapolating out some of the things that have been achieved ... and using some unrealistic exponential curve to guide his predictions.

      The man has experience great success -- both in business and academia -- throughout his lifetime. But past 1990 he's made a few inventions to help learning and disabled students. Which is great. Unfortunately he's found that writing books, holding symposiums and giving speeches about fantastic science fiction is what draws attention and resources. So he keeps doing it. It results in a lot press and I'm sure his aging body might drive him to hope and fund a singularity before he dies.

      While this singularity is a romantic idea, it's just not based on science. He's lost sight of what he once did musical hardware that advanced synthetic music far beyond the rate at which it normally would have run. And now his efforts are not designated to realistic goals but instead loftier goals that no one can achieve. What's worse is that it depends on crosses between fields he's simply not an expert in.

      You might be able to argue that he's a charlatan now but in my mind he's Thomas Edison turned Nostradamus. He's pulled out all the stops that relegate normal scientists to the scientific process and has passed optimism onto fantastical dreams. He can write all the books he wants but until he gets back to what made him great -- actually implementing something and leaving a legacy of working examples -- he runs of the risk of tarnishing his reputation.

      --
      My work here is dung.
    2. Re:Undue Credit to Kurzweil by SmurfButcher+Bob · · Score: 4, Funny

      In fact, implementation would be trivial.

      10 PRINT "What?"
      20 PRINT "I don't understand"
      30 PRINT "Where's the tea?"
      40 GOTO 10

      --

      help me i've cloned myself and can't remember which one I am

    3. Re:Undue Credit to Kurzweil by mcgrew · · Score: 4, Insightful

      From TFA: imprint the circuitry of the human brain using transistors on a silicon chip?

      No, not on binary circuits we can't. We might simulate the brain, or even model the brain, but we won't imprint it.

      The brain is a parallel processor.

      Tremendously paralell; and it's a multimode analog design, not a single mode digital design. There are many different kinds of brain cells, with both chemical and electrical components.

      We can model an atomic explosion, but we understand the physics behind an atomic explosion. We have hardly begun to understand how the brain works. We'll have cures for all mental ilnesses before we can accurately model the brain, because if you can't fix a broken machine you don't understand how it works, and even sometimes if you can fix a broken machine you still may not understand that machine completely.

      When you model an atomic explosion, there is no radiation released. A model is not the real thing.

      There is no test for sentience. Without such a test it would be impossible to kow if you have succeeded in accurately modeling it.

  2. Can We Build a Human Brain Into a Microchip? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Can We Build a Human Brain Into a Microchip?"
      No.

  3. Interesting, but... by bennomatic · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Something like this will be possible one day, but my layperson's understanding of how the brain works is fundamentally different from how computers work. The hard-wired CPU/RAM model is just not a perfect parallel, so while we can and will improve on machines that learn, it's going to be different from the wetware that is constantly growing, changing, forming new connections and interacting with internal, external and imagined stimuli.

    --
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    1. Re:Interesting, but... by jonbryce · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why should we try to create an artificial brain in the computing lab when it would be much easier to do it in the genetic engineering lab?

    2. Re:Interesting, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Running the human brain in a virtual machine creates lots of overhead.

    3. Re:Interesting, but... by Whorhay · · Score: 4, Interesting

      We may not be able to build a chip that it's self perfectly mimicks the human brain. But we can very likely build a chip that can process the software necessary to simulate the brain. Think of it as a programming problem where you have object classes for each major type of cell in the brain. You then have to keep track of which ones are connected to which others at any one time. The real difficulty will be in allowing the individual cells to change their behavior over time and depending on the stimulus they have individually recieved. Otherwise the brain simulation would not be capable of learning and growing, but would instead be stuck at whatever development stage it was created at.

    4. Re:Interesting, but... by Hatta · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Something like this will be possible one day, but my layperson's understanding of how the brain works is fundamentally different from how computers work.

      According to Turing, all sufficiently complicated computing devices are equivalent. The architecture may be entirely different, but there's no reason in principle one cannot be simulated on the other.

      At the very least, we know the brain obeys the laws of physics. A computer can simulate the laws of physics. Therefore, a computer can simulate the brain.

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    5. Re:Interesting, but... by sabernet · · Score: 4, Funny

      The former doesn't start smelling funny when you leave it on the lab counter overnight.

    6. Re:Interesting, but... by eldavojohn · · Score: 5, Interesting

      According to Turing, all sufficiently complicated computing devices are equivalent ...

      Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that was said of binary systems? Can you prove to me that the lowest form of information in the brain is the bit? Are neurons only 'on or off'? Is it just discharge or not discharge? I am no neurologist but I believe that small non-binary charges can be held by neurons that may influence thought. Neurons are fairly complex cells that have many complex dendrites -- some being multipolar instead of bipolar.

      At the very least, we know the brain obeys the laws of physics.

      Unfortunately we have a very incomplete set of laws for physics.

      This may shock you but I assure you that there are things going on in the human brain that no physicist, biologist or biophysicist can explain. Hell, we can't even draw a definite line between what is chemical/physical and what is purely neurological function. There may not even be a line to draw. Although we are making advances, we are still in the dark about a lot of basic things in the human mind let alone discovering the detailed inner workings of the thing we call 'consciousness.' Can you tell me why it is that enlarged regions of our brain make us so much more 'intelligent' than mice or whales?

      I hope for a huge breakthrough but it is nothing more than childish hope. My gut feeling is that we are much much farther from the 'intelligence explosion' than the futurologists think.

      --
      My work here is dung.
    7. Re:Interesting, but... by hoggoth · · Score: 4, Informative

      But what if the brain works by exploiting all of the effects of molecules, proteins, ions, electrical charges, even quantum effects at a molecular level? We have seen that evolution is excellent at finding very clever ways of exploiting whatever resources are available. It is possible that the only way to simulate a brain is to simulate every single atom involved within a brain. For obvious reasons a computer made of 'n' atoms cannot simulate a brain made of 'n' atoms as fast as that brain can work.

      I don't know that this is true, but it certainly brings up the possibility that it may be impossible to simulate a brain faster than a brain works, or better than a brain.

      Or on a slightly less pessimistic level, perhaps a "synapse" could be encapsulated in a software object, but the number of variables that make each synapse's position, arrangement, and connections unique are staggering and would require a machine to be thousands of times more powerful than a real brain in order to simulate it. That would move our "singularity" out til we have computers that can process as much as 22,000 billion neurons and 220,000 trillion synapses. I wonder if someone better at math and physics could calculate the bare minimum energy required for the negative-entropy to store 220,000 trillion somewhat complex pieces of information. I recall reading a calculation that the ZFS filesystem has the theoretical (but not practical) limit of enough information that the minimum energy required to actual encode that information would be enough to boil the Earth.

      --
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    8. Re:Interesting, but... by robot_love · · Score: 4, Funny

      Emulating brain on x86 - ?

      Priceless?

      --
      .there is enough of everything for everyone.
    9. Re:Interesting, but... by dalhamir · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I am a neuroscientist and I can tell you for sure that the basic form of the information in a brain is not a linear bit. But it does obey the laws of physics, and everything we know points to it following pretty mundane physics. The whole 'quantum state' theory of consciousness is pretty weak and unable to explain a lot of really basic phenomenon of the brain.

      However, the real trick of human intelligence is not simply the number of neurons http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_animals_by_number_of_neurons but rather the particular pattern of the network which allows us to detect and manipulate extremely complex patterns which a significant amount of noise. I think we will get to the point one day where we can replicate a human level intelligence, but getting 20 billion things into a organized pattern is just that start of that process.

      And, even then, we don't need to worry about an 'intelligence explosion' because a) there are probably some pretty hard laws on the relationship between size and complexity, which is almost certainly non-linear and b) the knowledge needed to create this human level intelligence won't be understandable to any single human. It has already take teams of people working together for combined millions of man hours to get to where we are today. Even if this computer we make was capable of thinking at the level of 2x human, it will take many machines a long time before progressing to the next level of understanding of a complex non-linear phenomenon such as intelligence.

    10. Re:Interesting, but... by mcmonkey · · Score: 4, Funny

      Emulating brain on x86 - ?

      Priceless?

      Profit!

    11. Re:Interesting, but... by Red+Flayer · · Score: 4, Interesting

      For obvious reasons a computer made of 'n' atoms cannot simulate a brain made of 'n' atoms as fast as that brain can work

      First... there is no requirement that the computer cannot be some x*n atoms.

      Second... I'm not sure that this would be the case:

      It is possible that the only way to simulate a brain is to simulate every single atom involved within a brain.

      It's quite possible that, say, only 1% of the atoms in the brain are required for the brain activity we'd like to simulate. Off the top of my head (ha!) some examples would be those atoms involved in nutrient uptake, metabolism, and waste removal. I'm sure there're also atoms like those that give length to axons... those don't need 1:1 representation, a timed loop could represent them. Or all the neurotransmitters, those atoms could be instead represented by a few bits used as a counter.

      Basically, my argument boils down to this: I don't think the goal would be to build a simulacrum of the brain. Just a simulation of the brain. This gives lots of room for making things more efficient (though maintaining accuracy would, of course, be necessary).

      --
      "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
  4. Easy! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    All you have to do is pick the right person and you can greatly reduce the number of neurons you'll need to model.

  5. There. Fixed that for you. by denzacar · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "Can We Build a Human Brain Into a Microchip?"

    Not YET.

    --
    Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
  6. Quality of simulation by Tacvek · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Even if we have a chip capable of simulating the same number of neurons and synapses as the human brain, that will not magically form an artificial life-form. I know little about simulated neural networks, but I do know that they are only a very rough approximation of the workings of the human brain. We still don't understand all the intricacies of the neural and chemical interactions that occur to a sufficient level to properly simulate all of them.

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    1. Re:Quality of simulation by ausekilis · · Score: 4, Interesting

      As one of my professors once said: "How do we go from billions of neural synapses to midget wrestling?" While amusing, it points out one of our great unknowns. Biologists and neuroscientists (some psychologists) understand things at the synapse level, and how the chained firing happens in neurons. Then psychologists understand normal behavior by examining abnormal behavior, but that's at a much higher level. We simply don't know how to map out what's in between.

  7. Sure we can... by thisnamestoolong · · Score: 4, Informative

    ...but why would we? The brain was assembled by natural selection -- a process that can only improve and work with what it already has, which is hardly ideal. The human brain is certainly amazing, but it is not perfect. There are certainly better, faster, and more efficient ways of designing the superhuman AIs of the future. Looking at the brain will give us a good road map, but is not the end-all be-all.

    I see a strange arrogance and egocentricity in trying to design robots to be exactly like us, why not think outside the box? Why are upright, bipedal robots always portrayed as the ultimate? There are most certainly more efficient and better designs than the one we are saddled with, this is just how we happened to evolve, we are simply the current end of one branch of the evolutionary tree.

    --
    To the haters: You can't win. If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine
    1. Re:Sure we can... by ardor · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The way we evolved can be a hint about efficiency. For example, bipedal movement turned out to be pretty efficient on a human scale, while eight legs like a spider are not. Therefore, it is important to know *why* things evolved the way they did. Was it because of energy efficiency? Adaptation to local predators? etc.

      --
      This sig does not contain any SCO code.
  8. It's not just the parallelism by imgod2u · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It's the reconfigurable nature of the human brain that's unique and powerful. If all you did was take one person, listed all of the skills of that person -- all of the things he knew; all of the skills in smell, touch, sight and taste; all of the cognitive reasoning ability -- then you could create a chip to simulate those skills. Algorithms for image recognition, feature extraction, speech recognition, etc. are all available that are very very close to what humans can do.

    But the thing that separates humans is that it didn't take hundreds of years of mathematical development to come up with these algorithms. The human brain develops these algorithms through changes in its structure from birth. At about age 10, speech recognition specialized and tailored to the dialect, language and tones that the person hears has developed on its own.

    That type of structural formation and learning is what would need to happen in silicon to make a truly intelligent machine. Neuron clusters emulated using transistors would need to be able to dynamically form connections to other neuron clusters. There'd have to be some type of distributed learning algorithm encoded in the operation of each individual neuron.

    Speech recognition is easy. Image recognition is easy. Developing a distributed, scalable, self-modifying architecture that can learn all of those and more on its own with nothing more than training samples is the difficult part.

  9. Re:Why? by denzacar · · Score: 4, Insightful

    How many of those can work 24/7/365 on a single subject with 100% concentration?

    Or how about how many of those can you scale down to fit into a shoebox or smaller (while they are till operative) or scale up by linking them in a cluster (preferably of the Beowulf kind)?

    --
    Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
  10. Re:How about the converse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm more interested in whether or not we can build a microchip into a human brain. At least then I might be able to remember my wife's anniversary...

    You could try remembering your anniversary instead. :-)

  11. Re:How about the converse by maxume · · Score: 4, Funny

    If there was only some other way that you could store information in a mechanical system for (perhaps automatic) retrieval and display at a later date.

    --
    Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
  12. Interesting question. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Do you work in management?

  13. already done by blackfrancis75 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Hi, BrainChip here - just logging on to let you know I do exist. Cheers, - BrainChip.

  14. Re:I hope this technology comes to fruition by TooMuchToDo · · Score: 4, Interesting
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus

    The Ship of Theseus, also known as Theseus's paradox, is a paradox that raises the question of whether an object which has had all its component parts replaced remains fundamentally the same object.

  15. Complexity orders of magnitude bigger by microbox · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Biologist P.Z. Myers has criticized Kurzweil's predictions as being based on "New Age spiritualism" rather than science and says that Kurzweil does not understand basic biology.

    Having some personal understanding of both, I heartily agree. Lets separate out wishful thinking and esoteric "knowing" - both are merely ungrounded speculation.

    Myers also claims that Kurzweil picks and chooses events that appear to demonstrate his claim of exponential technological increase leading up to a singularity, and ignores events that do not.

    I once seriously considered a strategy for building and artificial brain with a veteran professor of computer science. Examining the problem I gave up when I realised that the individual cells are "intelligent". I think this is vitally important How does the "mind" of a protozoa work? They can navigate obstacles, identify and assimilate food, run away from danger, and have a 20 minute memory. We can assume that a single neurone may well have all of these capabilities and more. I believe that we may be myopically focused on nodes and connections, without considering just how complex and capable a single node is.

    So the complexity of the problem is probably an order of magnitude beyond 22 billion neurones and 220 trillion connections. Then consider the effect of 1000s of unknown neurotransmitters - and we know little about the "known" ones, such as serotonin and dopamine, except that they have a profound effect. And _then_, consider that the brain has structure, and we know comparatively little about that structure, and only a few hints about the algorithms and data structures that it uses.

    --

    Like all pain, suffering is a signal that something isn't right
  16. Randomness by Burnhard · · Score: 4, Informative

    It requires a computational capacity of 36.8 petaflops -- a thousand trillion floating point operations per second

    It requires far more than that. According to some, the microtubules on the cytoskeletons of the cells themselves can be processing units. Raise the bar a few orders of magnitude in that case.

  17. Not even close by joeyblades · · Score: 4, Interesting

    BTW, current estimates are more like 100 billion neurons and upwards of 300-500 trillion synaptic connections.

    However, numbers aside, the human brain is not merely a complex collection of neurons and interconnected synapses. Complexity is only one very basic factor, another, more critical, factor is organization. We don't even know where to start in the organization of these artificial neural networks to emulate a human brain.

    WARNING! COMPUTER ANALOGY: It's not the number and density of interconnected transistors that make a Xeon, it's the organization.