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The "Copyright Black Hole" Swallowing Our Culture

An anonymous reader writes "James Boyle, professor at Duke Law School, has a piece in the Financial Times in which he argues that a 'copyright black hole is swallowing our culture.' He explains some of the issues surrounding Google Books, and makes the point that these issues wouldn't exist if we had a sane copyright law. Relatedly, in recent statements to the still-skeptical European Commission, Google has defended their book database by saying that it helps to make the Internet democratic. Others have noted that the database could negatively affect some researchers for whom a book's subject matter isn't always why they read it."

21 of 278 comments (clear)

  1. Democratic? by ScrewMaster · · Score: 5, Insightful

    helps to make the internet democratic.

    Lets ask ourselves how many governments around the world don't want the Internet to be more democratic.

    --
    The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    1. Re:Democratic? by linzeal · · Score: 4, Interesting

      All of them? Seriously, in this day and age it is embarrassing we have not leveraged the power of the Internet to empower people to not only vote, and proclaim viewpoints but to be part of the legislative process itself. I would wager most people on this site know more about copyright than the average congress critter.

    2. Re:Democratic? by Shikaku · · Score: 4, Insightful

      We're too lazy

    3. Re:Democratic? by Mascot · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There are valid reasons to think twice before allowing online voting. The most common being that it's impossible to verify that the voter is not being influenced by someone at the time of voting.

    4. Re:Democratic? by Jurily · · Score: 4, Insightful
    5. Re:Democratic? by ScrewMaster · · Score: 5, Insightful

      When the english speaking white man will stop expecting my language to become english by virtue of my shared skin color, we'll talk.

      That actually is incorrect. The reason a particular language becomes a so-called lingua franca has much more to do with economics than politics, racism or anything else. You just have to follow the money.

      The dominant military and/or economic power in any given period in history generally finds its language becoming popular, if nothing else because of all the other countries who wish to do business with it. So yes, I guess you could say that the United States (and the British Empire before it) expect those of other nations to speak English, if they wish to do business with us. Otherwise we don't particularly care.

      Furthermore, in many parts of the world the local dialects are so thoroughly fragmented that people from one village often can't understand the native tongue of those a few miles away. Take Africa for example: widespread knowledge of both English and French have done much to facilitate communication among the various peoples of that continent. Want to do business with a neighboring town? Best learn English (or, as I said, French, since they had a huge influence there as well.) So you may find your ego being bruised by having to learn a language that is not your own but, historically, that's the breaks. And when the American economic empire finally falls (and we're on the way down, now) whoever takes up the reins will force us all to learn their language. Which, oddly enough, will probably be English since China is on the way to becoming the next economic (if not military) superpower, and the Chinese are making a heavy investment in the English language. Last I heard, there were more people learning English there than the entire population of the United States.

      So get used to it. The English language is not going away any time soon.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    6. Re:Democratic? by Keen+Anthony · · Score: 5, Interesting

      No. There's another reason why English in the lingua franca of the Internet. A major feature of the English language is its ability to incorporate foreign words and phrases in a useful way which colors, expands, and even conceptually improves the language. For example, this sentence is perfectly sensible English.

      Hey amigo, konichiwa! That was some serious schadenfreude Bob showed earlier when Kate's car broke down, n'est-ce pas?

      In this sentence, I used words from a total of five languages: English, Japanese, German, French, Spanish. It doesn't matter that two were Romance languages. I could have used "chombatta" instead of "amigo" and gone completely neo-African cyberpunk. Hell, if I spoke Klingon, I could have added some of that in. The German word, "Schadenfreude" adds a new word to English which explains a concept that doesn't exist in the language already. Notice also, that I could use the Saxon genitive to expression possession instead of the less efficient "the car of Kate".

      The result is that English can expand really fast. It's likely the most extensible and expansive language on earth. It is always easily expressible without reliance on numerous accent marks. Japanese requires more effort to express electronically. Japanese also isn't as extensible in written form as English is. Japanese is written using multiple forms: hiragana, katakana, kanji, and romaji. The Japanese pull it off well, but these are hacks - especially romaji. The Chinese have the same problem.

      English can grow to accommodate words from other cultures as they become trendy. If Brazil becomes an amazingly cool place culturally, and people outside Brazil start using Brazilian slang, English will better adapt to include Portuguese words than say German or Russian. If I were to bet on any language surviving another couple thousand years and still being structurally the same while still growing, I think it will be English. Sure, we probably not recognize it cause the first person singular pronoun will be "Wa" instead of "I", but a language like Chinese can only maintain its native structure by resisting multi-cultural extension.

    7. Re:Democratic? by linhares · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Hi! Sorry I'm lost. Is this the thread about the copyright blackhole?

    8. Re:Democratic? by Keen+Anthony · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You're just ethnocentric about your language, and ignorant about other cultures since you don't know...

      Actually, I am a native German speaker. English was my second language. I think you showed more ignorance there than I did. You can attack me for favoring English all you want, but you didn't actually counter anything I wrote did you? No, you didn't. The fact remains, English has a competitive advantage over other languages that will guarantee that English will continue to thrive on the Internet. If you want hedge your bet on the computing world adopting written Cantonese, go for it.

      And no, that's not how all language works. If you studied language, you'd learn this. There are a number of languages that are fairly stagnant. I never said *exclusive*. I said it is a major feature. And I gave an example how said feature works well. Perhaps you required more comparative examples in the other languages I know? I'm sorry, I just didn't have time to meet your exacting demands.

      Modded for informative? Hardly.

    9. Re:Democratic? by raynet · · Score: 4, Funny

      The topic went past the event horizon and isn't part of this universe anymore.

      --
      - Raynet --> .
  2. Boyle's book: 'The Public Domain' by Neil_Brown · · Score: 5, Informative

    As a lawyer working in the area, I highly recommend Boyle's book, 'The Public Domain' - available under a Creative Commons licence, as well as in dead-tree format.

    A fascinating (and easy to read) discussion about the concept of 'the public domain', which is well worth reading for anyone who cares about the future of technological development / societal impact of overbearing IP regulation etc.

  3. Economic benefit vs economic waste by nine-times · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I think we can almost take it for granted that current copyright policy is damaging to our cultural development. How could it not be to have all our creative expression tied up and limited based on whether or not someone created something similar? However, whenever the whole issue gets raised, questions get quashed by talking about "the economy" and economic benefits bestowed on certain groups by copyright.

    Those are certainly issues to think about. By what means would authors and songwriters make money if copyright ceased on exist, or even was much more limited? What happens to all the jobs created by the publishing industry, the music industry, and the movie industry? It's particularly a concern in the US because we don't manufacture very much anymore, and a lot of what we export are our ideas and creative works.

    On the other hand, what almost no one talks about is the economic waste generated by all this. The broken window fallacy doesn't just apply to damage, but it applies to all money that need not be spent. How much money do businesses spend figuring out copyright issues, dealing with lawyers to protect copyrights or to defend against copyright lawsuits? How much more cheaply could Google do this indexing if the restrictions were eased? If movies and music and books were cheaper, then we would have the extra money in our pockets to spend on other things.

    We keep hearing about how much money is "generated" by creative industries, and how big a portion of our economy they represent. The information is always offered as evidence that these industries need to be protected, because of the economic damage caused by loss of jobs and loss of profit. However, there's a flip-side to that coin. All that money they're making is coming from somewhere. I'm not claiming it's a zero-sum game because it's not that simple, but for all the billions of dollars these industries make, there's a question of how that money would be spent and where it would go if the government weren't actively protecting fat profit margins for these business models.

    1. Re:Economic benefit vs economic waste by budgenator · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I think we can almost take it for granted that current copyright policy is damaging to our cultural development
      That's because most right's holders have an intolerable sense of entitlement and really want protection in perpetuity. There is an implied contract with society and the right's holders, we provide you with a legal framework to protect your economic interest in creative works an in return the work passes into the public domain after a defined period of time. By extending the copyright period I feel my future compensation has been seized without being compensated for the loss, I paid my taxes what happened to just compensation?

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
  4. Now try to read the article by Animats · · Score: 5, Funny

    Here's what happens when I tried to read the article:

    To continue reading this article, please register - it's quick, free and without obligation...

    You have viewed your 30 days allowance of 2 free articles.

  5. Bad news.. by PopeRatzo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It's not "swallowing" our culture as much as fencing it off from all sorts of people.

    I'm convinced, though, that the more corporations try to limit the availability of "culture" by trying to create a false scarcity, the level of productivity among local and online artists who refuse to participate will increase, and more people will turn to them for their art, music, literature, journalism, etc.

    The only way to save our culture is to change the dynamic that exists between corporations and individuals. You might be surprised to learn that corporations did not always exist just to enslave the population. And I believe it will not always remain so.
    My fear though is that they will try to close those "loopholes" by making it harder for individuals to distribute their own music without a "license". There could also be technical limitations placed, such as making the popular media players only play "licensed" media. I could definitely see a company like Apple or Sony making their players only play files that come from the big corporate copyright holders. Hell, that's been their plan for a long time, but the homebrew and hacker communities kept defeating them. I don't believe they're ready to give up on the "gated community" view of culture, though.

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
  6. Re:Copyright law IS a black hole...BANG! by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 4, Insightful

    lollll....you'll know when you do it, though; a squad of lawyers will show up on your doorstep with a $1 bill, a quitclaim agreement, and a host of delightful comments upon the hazards of a lifetime spent in courtrooms - particularly when considered in light of your...unfortunate...financial circumstances and how the latter affects your ability to retain good legal representation...

    That would be the perfect opportunity for me to show up at the other side of the door with a shotgun and an attitude.

    Seriously, the more unreasonable the laws become, the greater the self-justification for breaking them, whether by shotgun, or P2P digital file sharing.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
  7. The Problem by KwKSilver · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Nothing short of eternal copyright and unlimited damages has any chance of satisfying the copyright cartel... and even that may not be enough as their desires are limited only by their imaginations. Like two year olds they want the moon, the stars and ... EVERYTHING. They think that they are divine.

    --
    If you want your life to be different, live it differently.
  8. Make it a public task to store our culture by MartinSchou · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I made a really long-winded comment about it previously.

    To store 720p AND 1080p copies of every movie and tv-show listed on IMDB would probably take something like 10 PB. That would likely cover dubbed soundtracks and subtitles as well.

    And at Sun's prices, that'd be about 10 million dollars for a single copy (not including data center costs) stored in 21 racks.

    Add in all the books ever written, music and news papers published, what are we looking at? 50 PB for a full copy? Obviously you'd need redundant storage placed on various continents, and you'd expect to replace the hardware every once in a while, but what is our entire cultural history worth to us as a civilization? A billion dollars a year? Two? Keep in mind, it shouldn't just be the US or the EU funding this, it should be everyone.

    Make it a requirement for companies that if they want copyrights on their works, they have to submit it unencumbered to the storage facility. That way there can be no excuses from the companies, that they don't have $work in production any more, as it'd be easy to sell access to a particular work. And if they can't submit it for whatever reason? Copyright expires on that particular work. That'd certainly get their asses in gear to get their entire back catalogue digitized.

  9. Copyright law vs. Black Holes by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 5, Interesting
    • The more matter that is added to it the larger the gravitational/financial attraction.
    • The laws governing each of them are so complex that nobody quite understands how either works.
    • When an object falls into a Black Hole you never see it cross the event horizon because time slows down the closer it gets to it. When an object falls under copyright you never quite see it leave copyright because as it nears the exit horizon the term gets extended.
    • A Black Hole is the corpse of a star that once shone brightly and warmed any planets that it supported. Copyright Law is the corpse of an idea that once warmed the culture that it created it.

    Wow, copyright law really is a Black Hole!

  10. It's not a black hole by smoker2 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    It's not just copyright swallowing our culture, which is why I find it ironic that this is being discussed by people on an American site, talking about an American company. It's about time the EU started actually standing up for the people it represents instead of wealthy American corporations.

    I mean bitching at MS about IE and WMP is all well and good, but when the basic standard for proving you can operate a computer - the European Computer Driving Licence - is nothing more than a short training course in Word, Excel, and Powerpoint, it makes you wonder whose side they're on. At least call it Office skills or something. Why are we entrenching a foreign corporation on one hand and complaining about it on the other ? It qualifies you to operate a computer in the same way operating a washing machine qualifies you as an electrical engineer. You even get points for putting your name in the right place FFS.

    (The tests in that zip are last years version - the new ones mean you have to use vista and Office 2007. They also dropped the Access section completely. Those files have not touched a Windows computer since I got them from the British Computer Societys web site.)

    Some jokers are charging £500 for that shit (training and test). I'd get into it myself, except I would never ever feel clean again.

  11. Science vs Art by Samy+Merchi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What most people are talking about when they talk about these copyright issues are the copyrighting and/or trademarking of artistic creations.

    What's rarely brought up is the fact that there's a very analogous system in the world, too. For scientific creations, there's such a thing as patents. Patents are basically copyright for scientific inventions, as opposed to artistic inventions.

    Now, if we compare patents to copyright, the vast disparity in protection length becomes obvious. In most countries, patents protect the exclusivity of scientific inventions for 15-25 years.

    Artistic inventions are protected for *95* years. That is to say, 4-5 times longer.

    Why? What makes them worth so much longer a protection than scientific inventions get?

    The purpose of exclusivity expiring eventually (that is, not being forever) is to release the invented concept into the public domain so that the general public can eventually benefit from making use of the invention in whatever way society feels fit.

    However, this right of the general public is by and large being denied at present when it comes to artistic inventions. Copyright terms are being extended and extended by Disney and other megacorporations because they don't want their big brands to become public property.

    Imagine if Alexander Bell would have retained exclusive rights to the telephone for 95 years. The patent was issued in 1876. That means the telephone would have become public domain in 1971! The steam turbine would have become available to the general public in 1979 and barbed wire in 1982. The roller coaster and the diesel engine would have expired in 1993.

    More importantly, what things would still be patented? We'd be waiting for the zipper to expire in 2012. Aerosol cans would become available in 2022, electric shavers in 2023. Radar wouldn't fall out of protection until 2030.

    Imagine how much slower technology would have advanced if things like *zippers* would have to be licensed in order to be used in clothes.

    Excessively long protection times directly harm the public, whether it be in the field of our scientific development or in the field of our artistic development.