Open Source Not Welcome At Palm App Catalog

davidmwilliams writes "It appears Palm is seeking to follow Apple's footsteps in gaining a reputation for inconsistent and spurious rejections and removals of iPhone and iPod Touch applications. In this case, Palm has resisted including a free application because the source code is attainable elsewhere."

Comments

Palm's Zawinski Contradicts Palm SDK License

[eldavojohn]

From the article:

In September Zawinski was called by Joe Hayashi from Palm, formerly Senior Director of Product Management for Yahoo!. Despite the treatment from Palm over this matter Hayashi said "We aren't asking that you remove the binaries or source of your apps from your web site, and we aren't restricting anyone from distributing their source code, open source license or otherwise."

Yet the Palm SDK License (as linked to in the article) states under section 4. Developers' Ownership and Ability to Distribute its Applications:

4.3 Applications Can Only Be Distributed Through the Palm Application Catalog. Developer acknowledges and agrees, that absent a separate written agreement with Palm, Developer may not distribute any Application except as allowed by Palm's formal approved distribution process and channel (the "Application Catalog"). Developer acknowledges and agrees that (a) distribution of Applications will be subject to further terms and conditions, which may include a share of the revenue generated from sale of the Applications to be paid to Palm by Developer, where such terms and conditions shall be presented to Developer upon or before Developer's request for distribution of any Application, (b) because of certain laws, regulations, as well as contractual or other restrictions, Palm may refuse to allow the distribution of certain types of Applications, and (c) distributed Applications may be viewable or inspectable by third parties, and Palm is not obligated to take any steps to obfuscate the code associated with the Applications or take any other steps to prevent third parties from viewing or inspecting Application code.

Now this is assuming Jamie Zawinski used the SDK to produce the Palm Pre programs (I'm not sure what the Pre can run and these programs seem to be merely ports). After searching around for the terms of service for the application store for the Palm Pre, I came up pretty empty handed aside from the Developer SDK License. The fact that it says 'Beta' on the app store may make this forgivable but I'm not seeing a clear distinction on the fine details and legal on what you may or may not do when submitting an application. It appears there may be some internal conflicting views also -- considering what Hayashi said and what Palm did.

Re:Palm's Zawinski Contradicts Palm SDK License

[Kasracer]

This article is dumb. Palm is working hard on getting everything in line and many policies have evolved. They have ALREADY said they're working with the developer and that it's okay that the source is available.
The App Catalog is still in beta so the latest terms, etc are not there. I don't even know why Slashdot accepted this article as it was already debunked and addressed by Palm.

Re:Palm's Zawinski Contradicts Palm SDK License

[SmokeSerpent]

This is not the current developer agreement that you have to accept to submit applications. The developer agreement does include a clause allowing open source distribution as long as you do not distribute Palm's IP or charge a fee for that distribution.

Re:Palm's Zawinski Contradicts Palm SDK License

[oblivionboy]

Ah. The Palm appologist fanboys are already out in force. Jump all over Apple sure, but if its Palm then "Noooes, Palm is just working out kinks", despite strong evidence that internally the whole Pre developer program is riddled (and I mean riddled) with schitzoid internal behaviour from executives and others within Palm. And I haven't seen any sign that its improving.

Re:Palm's Zawinski Contradicts Palm SDK License

[shutdown -p now]

They have ALREADY said they're working with the developer and that it's okay that the source is available.

In private email, they did. And if you TFA (and the blog post), they said that "it's okay" before they released a new version of SDK, the license agreement for which explicitly states that it's not okay (which is the one linked from GP's post). So their position is at best unclear, and at worst - if you consider chronological order - they've rescinded their earlier words.

Actual blog post

[Anonymous Coward]

jwz: My ongoing Kafka-esque nightmare of dealing with Palm and their App Catalog submission process.

Bonus: Ben Galbraith: Thoughts on Palm and Jamie Zawinski (Ben and Dion just moved from Mozilla to Palm).

Re:Actual blog post

[Anonymous Coward]

Good find. And now that I've RTFA, I disagree with the title of the /. post. It should be "jwz Doesn't Want to Follow Any of Palm's steps for Submissions, Equates Opening a Paypal Account with an Existentialist Nightmare, Even His LiveJournal Sycophants Call Him An Ass."

Buzzwords

[whisper_jeff]

Is it possible for people to submit a story without loading it with buzzwords (Apple, iPhone, etc.) just to increase the chances of it being posted despite the fact that the story isn't actually about Apple, the iPhone, or anything of the sort. It's about Palm. Sure, I know that new cool thing is to hate on Apple, the iPhone, iTunes, and the like, but this story isn't about any of that. Want to post a story about Apple, the iPhone, iTunes, and the problems associated with them? Go for it - submit the story. But, if your submitting something about Palm (or Microsoft or whatever), let's keep it focused on the actual subject of the submission.

I know. I know. I must be new here...

Re:Buzzwords

[ElKry]

You must be... oh.

Re:Buzzwords

[pandrijeczko]

Sure, I know that new cool thing is to hate on Apple, the iPhone, iTunes, and the like

I'm a middle-aged, overweight fat computer bloke that moans if he has to spend more than £8 (=$12) on a pair of jeans and listens to Jethro Tull in his spare time - believe me, I gave up on "cool" a long time ago...

I just don't want you getting the impression that most people like or hate things because it's "cool" to do so. In 30+ years of working and playing with computers, I've never found a single reason to own anything or buy anything made by Apple and that isn't going to change any time soon.

Yes, maybe if Apple were less proprietary and locked in than Microsoft, I might consider ditching both Windows and Linux for their products, but the fact is I don't like Apple because they charge far too much for something that looks nice yet doesn't let you do what you want with it... ...and my experience with most (but not all) Apple users is that they pay a premium price in order to join an exclusive little club where they are permitted to sneer at anyone who doesn't use Apple products without having any requirement to give any technical justifications for it. That, in turn, creates the anti-Apple backlash.

Re:Buzzwords

[samkass]

You haven't looked very hard. Most Mac communities are accepting folks who would rather generate content than tinker with their machines, but otherwise don't particularly sneer at anyone or act exclusively that I've seen.

Yes, maybe if Apple were less proprietary and locked in than Microsoft

When's the last time you recompiled your Windows kernel from its open source distribution, like you can with MacOS? Or used a Microsoft browser's nightly builds?

Anyway, I understand if you don't like the Mac or iPhone, but there's no reason to go around insulting those who do.

Open source IS welcome at Palm

[krid]

I've released an open source password management app for webOS (http://www.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/keyring), and a rep from Palm contacted me to offer help in getting my app into the catalog. They have no issues with open source, and no problem with the code being available elsewhere. The problem here is that jwz got his panties in a twist, and he needs to take a few deep breaths.

Slashdot getting weak

[ConfusedVorlon]

C'mon /.
Not only is this a rehash of an article posted before.
It is pretty clear from that article that Palm is doing nothing remotely deserving this title. /. can and should do better.

Overblown story

[El Royo]

Seriously... Palm does get it. They've hired two outstanding people to lead the developer relations (Ben Galbraith and Dion Almaer). They've already reached out to jwz, who just spit in their eye(s). This seems nothing more than an overgrown toddler having a tantrum because he doesn't get his way now. I wrote about this on my blog. I tried to keep it a somewhat balanced article but seriously, his actions since just make him seem petulant. Is Palm without reproach in this? No, they're going through the pains of releasing an app catalog, SDK and an app approval process all at once. Things aren't as smooth as they could be but they're nowhere near 'kafkaesque'. This certainly didn't warrant a slashdot post and certainly doesn't warrant two of them.

To be fair, panties were twisted

[SuperKendall]

The problem here is that jwz got his panties in a twist

Actually if you read his original post, that is most certainly not the root problem. He had very valid reasons to be upset, and only posted a long rant when the whole process had gone beyond absurd.

That said, as others have noted Palm has already stated they are clearing this up for him, and I really think Palm is trying to do the right thing in general - they just slipped up very badly here. But Palm has a history of treating developers well so I would cut them some slack now that they have addressed this problem.