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Best Developer's Laptop?
s31523 writes "I love my current laptop, but unfortunately on my last trip the primary LCD went bonkers. It's an older Gateway (2 GB RAM Intel Pentium M 2.0 GHz, ATI M7). There are a handful of features I love about it: [1] Hot-swappable drive bay, with several components that can go in: CD/DVD R/W, extra battery, floppy drive, extra hard drive, memory card reader, etc. The extra battery option is especially appreciated — I can go 4-5 hours on battery power. [2] Docking station / port replicator: I like having my home setup with keyboard, network, and dual screens (a necessity). [3] It runs Linux. OK, I'm a wus, I actually have GRUB command three different OS's: Windows 98 (I have really old embedded software compilers that only run on 98, and yes I have tried every trick in the book to make them run on Linux), Windows XP Pro, and Ubuntu. I'm trying to find a replacement setup that offers the same flexibility and a little better performance. I am open to change as well. So, I ask Slashdot: What is your pick for best developer's laptop under $1,200, considering the features above?"
Who can be bothered with that.
Any new laptop is probably going to have a bunch of cores and hardware virtualization, so put ubuntu on that, and virtualize XP and 98.
All the Java developers at my work used Apple and I found this odd. When I asked one, they mentioned that it was built on BSD so they could use shell commands that they were used to on other Unix based systems. My wife had one and is a system administrator and found it very easy to VNC, SSH and manage most of her servers from her Macbook Pro.
I gave it a shot and have been able to do Objective C, Mono development, LAMP dev and just about everything without any problems. There effectively is not any language or environment that is left out and Eclipse and Subversion work as great as they do on my Linux box.
This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is mine.
You can easily get one that will fit your budget of $1,200. The ultrabay drive is hot-swappable and you can get a Li-polymer battery to slide in there for extra staying power. Also, Lenovo has kept Thinkpad customer service to essentially the same level of quality that it was under IBM which, in my experience, has been nothing short of fantastic.
Sounds like the Gateway/MPC 450-series laptops to me. The problem is usually the video system of the motherboard. Are you open to simply replacing the motherboard? Look at http://mundocorp.com/ or http://blueraven.com/. Either will sell you the parts or do the whole job for you.
I go to a lot of developer forums. Be it stuff designed in Java, PHP, Ruby, etc, there is one common thread I've noted of all the developers that present. 8 of 10 presents will use a mac. I switched a few years ago and couldn't be happier. I have VM Ware. Many people use VMs to run various windows versions, I like to use it to run Linux VMs that I eventually move off to other machines. Works fantastic. No need to reboot.
Now, if the OP is a .net person, well, Mac may not be for them. But there's something nice about being able to pop a BSD style terminal window.
And it meets none of the poster's requirements. Good jerb!
ThinkPad has the hotswap bays, excellent Linux support, excellent hardware support and turnaround from the factory, and there's always a 20% off coupon floating around. You can get a T series laptop with discrete graphics and well equipped for that $1,200 you're willing to spend, and probably far less. Not only that, but you generally get higher resolution displays than you get with Dell or Gateway laptops.
As for your Windows 98 installs -- why not use VirtualBox?
- oZ
// i am here.
Build quality? Really?
My MBP's keyboard backlight was misbehaving within a couple of months of buying it. The machine regularly overheated playing games. The motherboard fried itself and needed replacement after a couple of years. The DVD drive is now extremely fussy about recognizing an inserted disc.
The last two Dell laptops I've owned each lasted well over 5 years with no problems.
Macs may have their advantages, but IMHO build quality is not one of them. You know, to be brutally honest.
But as most/many people know, a virtualized Windows9x installation often doesn't work particularly well. In VirtualBox, it all but doesn't work at all because of the way "idle" time is handled. (I don't recall having much trouble using VMWare workstation long ago however)
Virtualizing instead of multi-booting is a far better idea for me. I use Windows XP on rare occasion and I definitely don't like taking my Linux down to run another OS.
A well made laptop needs a "port replicator" or "docking station" like a fish needs a bicycle. (Gloria Steinem reference unavoidable.)
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
It's about the 50th comment recommending a Macbook, despite the other 50 comments noting that a Macbook doesn't qualify for any of the OP's needs. It's a shame that buying a Mac comes with an EULA demading you work as a freelance PR agent for Apple. Also, it's a shame that you morons will recommend buying a Mac even when it blatantly isn't fit for the job.
Expressing my personal opinion is not a logical fallacy. Reporting my personal experience is not a logical fallacy. My inferences regarding build quality drawn from that experience, while subject to the usual caveats about inductive reasoning, are no less reasonable than those drawn by the O.P.
So I'm a little mystified as to what on Earth you're complaining about.
I am with Goldberg. MacBook Pro has very good Intel hardware, which means it is inherently a very nice Windows machine. Better hardware than a PC at the same price? When actual comparisons have been done (as several magazines now have), as opposed to FUD, it was found that the price difference was surprisingly little. Macs do tend to be a little more expensive for the same electronics, but at the same time their physical engineering is superior (that is something that is not under much dispute). And Mac hardware is probably more thoroughly tested together as a unit than any brand of PC. The beauty of the Mac, though, is that together with good hardware, you get the best of all worlds when it comes to software. I can (and do) boot up Windows so that it runs natively on my Mac, at full hardware speed, or, if I don't need all the speed, I can start the same instance of Windows up, fully functional including Internet connection and I/O, in a VM under OS X. And as far as OS X itself is concerned, I essentially have a Linux machine, with all common Linux tools available to me, with the additional plus of a superior UI. (Superior to Linux, that is. It is debatable whether the UI is superior to Windows, though some people feel that it is.) So, yeah... a MacBook, or at least a MacBook Pro, is indeed a superior developer's machine. Arguably better than any PC, because it gives you many more options. Want to use Windows for something? Go ahead. Want to use *nix for something? Go ahead. Want to use OS X for something? Go ahead. And they run Windows natively just as fast as a PC with similar hardware. I have Linux-style development tools, and Windows development tools, and OS X development tools, all on my MacBook. And I can even use them at the same time if I want. (Though the Windows tools will run a bit slower in a VM, but that is just the nature of the beast.) That is something that PCs just do not do... or at least definitely do not do well. So, no... unfortunately the "best" development notebooks will cost you more than $1200. If you are stuck with that budget, you are stuck with that budget. But you sure are missing out.
Most of the "benefits" of the extra swappable drive bay are nullified in newer laptops.
Here's his list: CD/DVD R/W, extra battery, floppy drive, extra hard drive, memory card reader, etc
Floppy drives are obsolete
Since this is a developers' machine, a 17" should have 2 drive bays, so who needs to swap out drives? Failing that, use an external USB drive.
Memory card readers are built in nowadays.
If you're going to be lugging an extra battery around, just carry a spare.
So just go with the built-in DVD R/W, built in 4 USB ports, built-in 2nd hard drive, built-in card reader, etc. A grand should get you all this, including 4 gigs of ram and twin 500 gig hard drives.
You insulted his Mac, so he's offended and on the attack.
Heathen.
Watch for Penguins, they eat Apples and throw rocks at Windows.
You are implying that a Macbook or a "PC Laptop" are Compal or Quanta laptops with different badges on them. Which is not the case. It's irrelevant which manufacturer is used - you might as well say that they are all made in China for the difference that makes.
I just bought a new laptop to replace the mobile workstation our school gives us (HP nw8240 for the 2005 class; now you know where I go to school!). While that computer was, even to today's standards, pretty freaking fast, I had no warranty on it and saw that the LCD was going at some points.
Instead of waiting a few months, I decided to bite the bullet and upgrade two weeks ago. I was deliberating between a non-unibody Macbook Pro, a Dell Precision M-series and a Latitude E-series. Since I commute and am moving around a lot, I really wanted a computer that could take a bit of a beating and hold a decent charge, all while still being not being as powerful and svelte as my old machine.
In the end, I landed up getting a Latitude E6500 with the Intel Core 2 Duo CPU (P8600 - 2.4GHz with 3MB L2 Cache), 2GB of RAM (though the eBay ad advertised it as having 3GB...bastards :p), 80GB SATA hard drive, nVIDIA Quadro NVS 160M 256MB discrete graphics (not good for Crysis, but good enough for a non-gamer like myself :D), 15.4" LED WXGA LCD and an integrated webcame (VERY IMPORTANT) for $695 shipped.
This thing is awesome. Scratch that; it's FREAKING awesome. It runs Windows 7 like a Cadillac, looks damn good, has THE perfect keyboard (no, really...it's really, really good) and is pretty light (something like six pounds). It's 6-cell battery usually lasts me 3.5 hours, which is perfect for me. Thus, doing development work on it (right now, I'm working on projects in C, though I mainly do a good amount of scripting and am learning C# in the future) is just fantastic. You might want a bigger LCD; they have a WUXGA LED screen available, which I hear is phenomenal. I personally wanted something with a lower-resolution, as I hardly use 1920x1200 anyway (and most mobile graphics cards can't push that many pixels smoothly anyway when under load).
To add, I can get the fingerprint sensor, Bluetooth module and LED-backlit keyboard from Dell (more like from eBay) when I need it. Oh, and it came with a 3-year limited warranty, which isn't business-class, but it's perfect for me.
In short: Macbooks are still overpriced, and AppleCare still comes separately. My Latitude does EVERYTHING a Macbook would do (yes, it even runs OS X successfully)...while looking just as good and with more AWESOME.
Your singular experience isn't really relevant to a discussion of MBP build quality. To say that they have better build quality is not to say that none of them fail. It is to say that they fail less often than competitor machines. Obviously, with a non-zero failure rate, someone will get the failed machine. So, you pointing out that you have one of the failed machines really has no bearing on whether or not the build quality is better. You tacked on an "IMHO", but it's not a matter of opinion, there exists data to say whether or not they fail at a higher or lower rate.
The only devs that Macs are good for are Mac devs.
You do realize that OS X is a certified Unix? That means that OS X shares an enormous commonality/overlap with the entire *nix software developing world including AIX, HPUX, Solaris, BSD and Linux. In fact OS X ships with a huge amount of OSS software pre-installed along with Apple's own proprietary stuff and optional developer packages that include a lot more OSS stuff. Apple also contributes to the OSS movement. Macs are also quite popular for all kinds of platform independent and web development. Apple deserves criticism like any other soulless megacorp and their computers aren't the best development machines ever conceived by the mind of man but Macs are useful for a lot more than just Mac development.
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
Someone hasn't been keeping up with Apple's products it seems. After the outcry in the beginning of the year with the glossy only displays on the MacBook Pro's, Apple actually listened to their customers and brought the option back. You can get matte on the 15" now as well. The 17" has always had the matte finish option and never lost it even with the switch to the unibody design (unlike the 15" which did become glossy only). The 13" is the only one which does not have a matte option, but I don't see that model as being pertinent for the poster's requirements (aside from cost). For development work, you want that larger screen so you can have multiple files or applications open next to each other for writing code (like the program's design document, or API, or even a test window, etc.)
We were all warned a long time ago that MS products sucked, remember the Magic 8 Ball said, "Outlook not so good"