Slashdot Mirror


Microsoft Applies For Patent On Tufte's Sparklines

jenkin sear writes "Data visualization guru Edward Tufte developed Sparklines, a great way to display condensed data as an inline graphic. Excel's new version has incorporated the design element — and Microsoft has applied for a patent on them — without so much as a by-your-leave from Tufte."

175 comments

  1. Why are you surprised? by stillpixel · · Score: 1, Funny

    It is very obvious that Microsoft has never payed much attention to design concepts, especially user interface design concepts.

    1. Re:Why are you surprised? by MrNaz · · Score: 4, Insightful

      How are Sparklines even patentable? They're just a graph, scaled down. I don't even see an innovation here, either my Microsoft or Tufte.

      --
      I hate printers.
    2. Re:Why are you surprised? by mabhatter654 · · Score: 5, Informative

      They're already published and in use, therefore not patentable.... if only the patent office would follow their own damn rules about such things!

    3. Re:Why are you surprised? by apez1267 · · Score: 0

      its not a mater of inovation in their eyes , its a matter of keeping ppl from sueing them like they did in ms word

    4. Re:Why are you surprised? by burner · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's a little too early to fault the USPTO, since Microsoft as only applied for the patent, it hasn't been granted yet.

      --
      MRSH-Recording device, corned beef sandwich with kraut, seafaring bird, and the foamy top of a beverage.
    5. Re:Why are you surprised? by lahvak · · Score: 1

      They are graphs scaled down so that they fit well wit the surrounding test. It's not actually completely simple. As far as I know, Tufte never claimed to invent them, he just described them in his book, and developed some theory on how sparklines should look like to work well. Possibly he also coined the term sparkline, I am not sure about that.

      --
      AccountKiller
    6. Re:Why are you surprised? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Which is why the concept of sparklines is not addressed by the patent, but a particular implementation. Read the whole of the patent and skip the /. summary. You'll see it's (likely) a defensive patent for their way of creating sparklines.

    7. Re:Why are you surprised? by TamCaP · · Score: 2, Informative

      They are not. In addition to Tufte, they've been used since 70ties (??) in Neuroscience and Physiology to describe currents (i.e. http://jp.physoc.org/content/574/2/415/F7.large.jpg

    8. Re:Why are you surprised? by TamCaP · · Score: 1

      Oh, stupidity....those are voltage traces... anyway, point still stands.

    9. Re:Why are you surprised? by Daengbo · · Score: 3, Informative

      This appears to be a specific implementation of sparklines in an Excel spreadsheet, not sparklines in general. This blog talks about this specific implementation (sparklines in Excel) in 2006. This comment on that blog says that there are three current commercial implementations.

      There's even a Sourceforge project for Sparklines in Excel, but it appears to have first published in early 2009.

    10. Re:Why are you surprised? by smitty777 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You all need to read the patent. Microsoft is not trying to patent the graphics, layout, colors, etc. What they are claiming is the specific implementation (i.e., the computer component) that ties together the graphic with the data set. TF(P) states:

        "A computer-implemented method, comprising: associating a sparkline with a location in a document to provide a visual representation of one or more data values included in the document"

      Yes, Tufte did come up with a nifty name, and yes MS is using that name to sell their stuff (without giving Tufte credit). But, as many have already mentioned on this thread, graphs very similar to these have been around for quite some time.

      --
      "Before God we are all equally wise - and equally foolish"
      Albert Einstein
    11. Re:Why are you surprised? by easyTree · · Score: 1

      They're just a graph, scaled down.

      Be fair; you're trivializing sparklines. They're graphs with *text* next to them!

    12. Re:Why are you surprised? by stillpixel · · Score: 1

      Why off topic? My point was that they never pay attention to such things so they wouldn't have noticed they can't patent Sparklines. In this case I don't point my finger at Microsoft and scream bloody murder, I simply say they are ignorant in the matter.

    13. Re:Why are you surprised? by bth · · Score: 1

      You do not need to patent an invention in order to avoid being sued. It suffices to publish the invention in a broad venue to document it, so it can be cited as prior art.

    14. Re:Why are you surprised? by PatHMV · · Score: 1
      YOU should really read the patent. It claims:

      A computer-implemented method, comprising: associating a sparkline with a location in a document to provide a visual representation of one or more data values included in the document; associating with the sparkline a data source within the document including the one or more data values;

      That's part of Claim 1. Here's Claim 6 in its entirety:

      6. A computer-implemented method, comprising: associating a sparkline with a location in a document to provide a visual representation of one or more data values included in the document; associating with the sparkline a data source within the document including the one or more data values; generating the sparkline by generating the visual representation based on the one or more data values with a matrix of points to be presented at the associated location in the document; presenting the sparkline at the associated location in the document; and configuring the sparkline to be regenerated when one or more of the data values in the data source change.

      Putting a graph in-line with text. What a really novel concept! In fact, sparklines, as described by Prof. Tufte, are primarily for the purpose of being included in a particular location in the document, in-line with other text. There's no novel "method" of doing this presented. The flowchart for the process given in the illustrations provided with the application is the same as any flowchart for dynamically presenting data in graphical form: generate the chart; look to see if the data has been changed; if yes, change the chart and regenerate. Frankly, I don't see what the patent covers that's any different from what MS' charting functions already provide. The examples given with the patent all show data embedded in a cell (which would be a welcome change, and perhaps is novel), but the text of the claims simply says "a location in the document" and surely current Excel charts are placed in some location in their document, though not actually within a cell. If the novelty is the method for embedding graphs generally in a cell, then that would really need to be spelled out more, and of course the "sparklines" label would be inaccurate.

    15. Re:Why are you surprised? by Toonol · · Score: 1

      If that actually worked, MS will be denied the patent, and nobody else can patent it. If it doesn't work, MS will be granted the patent. Either way, it's a smart thing for MS to do.

    16. Re:Why are you surprised? by Lally+Singh · · Score: 1

      Not in the patent, but MS is happy to give Prof. Tufte credit in their blog: http://blogs.msdn.com/excel/archive/2009/07/17/sparklines-in-excel.aspx

      Now, how that helps their patent application in terms of obviously admitting prior art....

      --
      Care about electronic freedom? Consider donating to the EFF!
    17. Re:Why are you surprised? by dave87656 · · Score: 1

      Gotta disagree with you there. MS just got a patent for a GUI version of sudo. They are on a crusade now.

    18. Re:Why are you surprised? by dave87656 · · Score: 1

      "A computer-implemented method, comprising: associating a sparkline with a location in a document to provide a visual representation of one or more data values included in the document"

      You mean like icons in my JTable? Oh crap, I should have patented that.

  2. Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The patent is obviously bad. As the summary states, there is plenty of prior art. If you read the patent, it's also trivial - it's just making graphs smaller.

    Will the USPTO reject it?
    Maybe.

    But even if they do, we also need to ask:
    Will anyone at Microsoft be fined or imprisoned for applying for this bogus patent?
    Unfortunately, not.

    1. Re:Obvious bad patent by timmarhy · · Score: 1, Troll

      you want to imprison people filing a patent which has prior art? fuck you in the neck.

      --
      If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    2. Re:Obvious bad patent by mister_playboy · · Score: 3, Funny

      fuck you in the neck.

      Only works if OP has had his larynx removed.

      --
      Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law ::: Love is the law, love under will
    3. Re:Obvious bad patent by mysidia · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It would certainly help with the epidemic of bogus patents, if those exaggerating or being deceptive on applications (such as claiming to have invented a graphical design while doing so much as acknowledging that someone else invented the design) would lead to some serious justice.

    4. Re:Obvious bad patent by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't imprison them. I'd just fine them 50% of the gross worth. They'd only try to fool the patent office once.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    5. Re:Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not really Microsoft's job to make sure the patent isn't bogus. Remember, it's just an application. It will probably get rejected, reviewed, and sent in again. Microsoft is expecting this. If the system is working, Microsoft will only get the patent once they have a good claim.

      But the system isn't working. Even if this patent isn't granted, the version that is eventually granted will still probably be invalid. Eventually, when someone finally goes to court to invalidate the patent, I suggest that we fine the USPTO reviewers who granted the patent.

    6. Re:Obvious bad patent by Korin43 · · Score: 1

      Sometimes prior art is hard to find. You'd probably want to base the fine on how obvious the prior art should have been (if it was blatantly stolen vs. plausable that they didn't know) and how quickly they fix their mistake (telling the patent office when they find the mistake).

    7. Re:Obvious bad patent by HiThere · · Score: 4, Informative

      Actually, yes, it *is* a legal requirement that MS not claim to invent what they haven't invented. Unfortunately, this is never enforced with the applicable punishment. (Rarely against individuals. I've never heard of it being enforced against a company.)

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    8. Re:Obvious bad patent by Asclepius99 · · Score: 1

      Clearly mister_playboy can demonstrate prior art in the technique of neck fucking.

    9. Re:Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Why not? I've got pictures of your mother doing it last night.

    10. Re:Obvious bad patent by Blue+Stone · · Score: 1

      I have patented the 'placement of an orifice below the chin but above the shoulder for the purposes of sexual gratification'. Please cease and desist you potentially infringing suggestions immediately.

      --
      Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. - Ambrose Bierce
    11. Re:Obvious bad patent by MrMr · · Score: 1

      Given the fact that these patents are prepared by legal professionals and that these professionals themselves already note the prior art and still want to file for the bogus patent, I would say all possible malpractice punishments should be applied.
      And preferably also the somewhat harsh punishment you seem to consider suitable for disagreeing with you.

    12. Re:Obvious bad patent by Znork · · Score: 1

      Then again, if you can't be absolutely one hundred percent certain that you're the first, then maybe you shouldn't apply for or be able to get a monopoly?

      But basically it's one of those issues that is practically irresolvable with an all-or-nothing monopoly system, while it would be easy to resolve in a system constructed as most other wealth redistribution systems. If the patent office simply paid out a certain amount when a patent got used by someone it would be trivial to reduce the amount paid. But how do you repair damage caused to other companies by the use of the falsely obtained monopoly right?

    13. Re:Obvious bad patent by pishfish · · Score: 2, Funny

      I think you will find I have prior art on this with a patent I filed entitled: "The use of the neck as a penis warmer"

    14. Re:Obvious bad patent by realityimpaired · · Score: 1

      Then again, if you can't be absolutely one hundred percent certain that you're the first, then maybe you shouldn't apply for or be able to get a monopoly?

      Do you remember the controversy surrounding the patents on the telephone? Specifically that Elisha Gray filed his patents the same day as Alexander Graham Bell, and that Bell's patents beat out Gray's because he filed them about an hour earlier?

      Sometimes you need to file a patent as soon as you can, because somebody else is working on the same idea. You can't 100% guarantee that the other party hasn't beaten you to the draw, but you at least need to try. Theoretically, the patent office is supposed to reject patents for things that've already been done... but when they screw up, it's the failing of the patent office, not the person filing the patent.

    15. Re:Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Jeesh, read the patent. They patented a specific way to generate the sparkline as an inline app process. They did not patent the sparkline, nor did they patent making graphs smaller. I don't like Microsoft a bit. And this patent is pretty trivial, and should have been thrown out. But it's probably going to be a feature in the next version of office, and they want to make the new feature hard to copy. The OP and the blog writing about the patent obviously didn't read more than the first paragraph of the patent. Others already have alternative ways of generating sparklines.

    16. Re:Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about chemical castration and laser blinding?

    17. Re:Obvious bad patent by RalphSleigh · · Score: 1

      RTFP, its about their implementation of sparklines in excel. NOT the lines themselves. Designed to stop other spreadsheets having sparklines in their cells without fighting a huge legal battle to get the patent overturned that only Microsoft can afford.

      --
      Come as you are, do what you must, be who you will.
    18. Re:Obvious bad patent by jipn4 · · Score: 1

      It's not really Microsoft's job to make sure the patent isn't bogus.

      Oh, yes, it is. You are supposed to know the field you're filing in. And if you knowingly claim to have invented something when you haven't, it's fraud.

      I suggest that we fine the USPTO reviewers who granted the patent.

      What have they ever done to you? I suggest we let people sue companies like Microsoft over invalid patents: you file an invalid patent, you're liable for treble damages, based on what licensing revenues you extracted and what impact you may have had on the market. Giving lawyers a financial incentive to invalidate bad patents would stop this nonsense quickly.

    19. Re:Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it's also trivial - it's just making graphs smaller.

      All of my children started making sparklines as soon as they were able to hold a pencil.

      Hey, that's it! Voila! On behalf of all the children in the world, I hereby patent making sparklines with a pencil, pen, crayon, or any other manually manipulated drawing instrument!

    20. Re:Obvious bad patent by mysidia · · Score: 1

      Well, even sparklines in Excel is not Microsoft's innovation. They're implementing something that has already been implemented by an existing open-source add-in.

      This is the equivalent of Microsoft hearing about "Emacs"

      Developing their own text editor that is extensible using embedded lisp,

      And 6 months later, patenting+claiming the concept of a text-editor extensible using embedded LISP.

      Microsoft has done no invention here, only coding their own implementation of a function Excel users are already utilizing via 3rd-party enhancements.

      This is embrace, extend, extinguish, all over again.

    21. Re:Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Filing a patent claim when *you're aware* of prior art strikes me as fraud. At *best* it wastes everyone's time and money, in quest of a pile of money you palpably have no right to.

      So yes, I think jailing (or at least a fine) might well be appropriate.

    22. Re:Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      s/mother/father/

    23. Re:Obvious bad patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not opposed to a hefty penalty, regardless of who it is.
      If a company has hundreds of billions of dollars and pay hordes of lawyers to continually troll patents, they should have their right to patent anything taken away. They fall into a group of people who should obviously know better.
      Just like people who drive improperly over and over have their driving license taken away.

    24. Re:Obvious bad patent by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      If they KNOWINGLY try to defraud the Patent Office by filing for a patent they know is bogus, and it can be proven in court, YES!

      And you have some kinky sex fantasies, you might want to get counseling.

    25. Re:Obvious bad patent by ddusza · · Score: 0

      What about chemical castration and laser blinding?

      No, sorry, those are both patented by Microsoft.

      --
      Don't fear the penguins
    26. Re:Obvious bad patent by DutchUncle · · Score: 1

      Why should Microsoft implementing Sparklines in Excel have anything to do with other spreadsheets having sparklines? If they had invented the concept, there *might* be some claim; as it is, why should this be different from implementing "addition" and "subtraction" in a spreadsheet?

    27. Re:Obvious bad patent by WNight · · Score: 1

      Sure sure, blame the game not the player. To some degree it's even true.

      But the telephone patent thing just illustrates the crap of patents. Poor guy, invents something independently and doesn't get to use it.

    28. Re:Obvious bad patent by Znork · · Score: 1

      Sometimes you need to file a patent as soon as you can, because somebody else is working on the same idea.

      That's just the thing tho, if somebody else is working on the same idea it's obviously not unique enough to warrant monopoly rights at all and we'd be better off with the competitors fighting it out on the market.

      it's the failing of the patent office, not the person filing the patent.

      In the current system, neither the patent office nor the person filing the patent have much incentive to prevent screwups in the filers favour. Neither of them gets to pay for it; everyone else does.

      But again, that's a problem of patents as an exclusive system; to take the Bell/Gray as an example in a non-exclusive system, they could both get granted the patent and share the associated incentive revenue. In such a system the costs are borne by the players; let too many patents get granted and revenue per patent would shrink, so all parties would have an incentive for the 'right' patents to be granted (one might assume that if the costs of the patent system was actually accounted for it would get a fixed budget rather than the unaccounted for general levy on the economy it is today).

  3. It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 5, Informative

    A comment on the blog post discussing the feature (to which TFS links) says:

    They haven’t tried to patent sparklines, but the use of sparklines in Excel. I.e. the automatic updating of a sparkline embedded in a spreadsheet.

    Cue the posts on how obvious and stupid the patent is regardless of this below. Point is, it's not an attempt on something already claimed by someone.

    1. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Sockatume · · Score: 1

      We're two for two, then.

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    2. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Opportunist · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Ok, so if I have to push a button to update it, it's not covered? If I don't embed it but, say, just have an external application retrieve data from a spreadsheet, it's not covered?

      Yes, I'm hanging on technicalities. But when you look at it closely, the whole software patent BS is about technicalities and not much more. We're talking about (usually) so obvious applications that a 5 year old wouldn't only get the idea but actually say "duh" when you present it to him.

      Maybe that would be a good metric. The patent clerc should tell his 5 year old about the idea. If he says "duh", it's not patentable.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    3. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by schnablebg · · Score: 1

      Ok, so if I have to push a button to update it, it's not covered? If I don't embed it but, say, just have an external application retrieve data from a spreadsheet, it's not covered?

      Probably, to both. Most patents, by the time they are approved, have been whittled down to this level. And although I am not in favor of many software patents, most are not really that bad because they describe very specific implementations.

    4. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by sohp · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Sorry, but taking an existing invention and just taking on "in Excel" or "using a computer" does not make it a new invention. That seems to be the way the USPTO treats those magic words, though.

    5. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by mysidia · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This is just a synthesis of existing technologies.

      Spreadsheet software already automatically updates graphs and charts based on changes in the spreadsheet.

      A sparkline is nothing more than a graph reduced in size and placed in-line within the text.

      It follows that a combination of the existing graph technology, with the reduction in size, automatically leads to a sparkline that automatically updates.

      Nothing new or novel is accomplished by the combination, so the synthesis isn't an invention.

    6. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by ChaosDiscord · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Well, golly, I've got a very small chart in a spreadsheet. And you're suggesting that I could dynamically update that chart? Wow! I would never have thought of that! Truly a breakthrough that must have taken years of research and is totally worth a patent.

    7. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by jipn4 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's not just "stupid and obvious", there is plenty of prior art, and it follows from standard engineering principles.

      Point is, it's not an attempt on something already claimed by someone.

      Yes, it is. If sparklines are public domain and updating graphs dynamically is public domain, then so is the (obvious) combination. The technique belongs to all of us.

      So, Microsoft isn't just stealing from another inventor here, they are stealing from all of us, which is even worse.

    8. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by sheriff_p · · Score: 1

      Did you look at the link? It links to a website that ... provides the technology to embed Sparklines in Excel.

      --
      Score:-1, Funny
    9. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by RightSaidFred99 · · Score: 1

      Of course it is, it's all bullshit. The whole system is fucked. But any company that doesn't try to patent as much bullshit as they can will be sued by some asshole and at best pay a boatload of legal fees. Any idiot can see that these companies must play the game or it will cost them. Bit of a prisoner's dilemma.

    10. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They haven’t tried to patent sparklines, but the use of sparklines in Excel

      Let's say that I patent the way that I walk. That's okay, isn't it? I mean, I only patented how I walk, not how walking is done in general.

      "Hey, you're walking kind of like me. Stop that, or I'll have my team of lawyers sue you!"

      Patents have the potential to kill the small developers (like me).

    11. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by fireylord · · Score: 1

      the obvious target of this attempt at patenting someone else's idea into their spreadsheet app is other peoples' spreadsheet apps (openoffice et all). Just goes to show that with stunts like this Micro$oft still hasnt changed their rattlesnake type business ethics

    12. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by westlake · · Score: 2, Insightful

      We're talking about (usually) so obvious applications that a 5 year old wouldn't only get the idea but actually say "duh" when you present it to him.

      The 5 year may "get" the idea.

      That doesn't mean he can produce the machine or device or program that puts the idea to work in new and interesting ways.

      To the patent examiner, "obvious" has to mean more than "twenty-twenty hindsight."

      If the "sparkline" is so obvious and useful an idea and so easily implemented in your spreadsheet program why isn't it there now?

    13. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by gtall · · Score: 1

      "If the "sparkline" is so obvious and useful an idea and so easily implemented in your spreadsheet program why isn't it there now?"

      Uh...you know, MS has a lock on spreadsheets and they only just thought of it.

    14. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Fred_A · · Score: 1

      Well, golly, I've got a very small chart in a spreadsheet. And you're suggesting that I could dynamically update that chart? Wow! I would never have thought of that! Truly a breakthrough that must have taken years of research and is totally worth a patent.

      It's a real shame that now that it's patented I'll still be stuck with updating my graphs in OpenOffice by adding pixels with the Gimp after figuring them out with my calculator. I could have saved hours with this !

      Damn you Microsoft !

      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    15. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by fbjon · · Score: 1

      Are there automatically updating graphs in spreadsheets? A sparkline is ultimately a graph or other image with a small format. If an automatically updating image isn't obvious, whatever the image may be, I don't know what is.

      --
      True confidence comes not from realising you are as good as your peers, but that your peers are as bad as you are.
    16. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by drinkypoo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That is a load of dingo's kidneys, because nobody had to manually generate sparklines, either. There are already numerous systems which dynamically generate them as needed, for example a drupal module. This is a ridiculous patent, as completely insane as any "business method" patent, except instead of taking a common business model and adding "on the internet", it's taking an already-accepted practice and adding "in excel". By any reasonable standard, this is a bad patent application.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    17. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by vegiVamp · · Score: 1

      I'm not trying to patent NTFS. I'm patenting using NTFS on my computer.

      --
      What a depressingly stupid machine.
    18. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Zordak · · Score: 1

      It's a real shame that now that it's patented

      Except it's not. You can file any old thing you want, and it will get published after 18 months, regardless of whether it has a snowball's chance in Hell of actually getting allowed. At the 18 month mark, few applications have even been taken up for examination.

      --

      Today's Sesame Street was brought to you by the number e.
    19. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by hey! · · Score: 1

      Whether or not the "inventor" is capable of producing a device or program is irrelevant. The question is whether he has invented anything.

      This is not an easy question. Inventions are almost always composed of previous inventions. Back when mechanical timepieces were being developed to improve navigation, inventors were constantly tinkering with ways to improve them. These were arrangements of preexisting machine parts like levers and springs. So does *every* distinct mechanical watch design amount to an "invention" just because it is unique?

      No -- the ability to design (much less build) something is completely unrelated to whether you can invent something.

      It seems to me that an *invention* has to embody an original insight into the problem. Lest I be pushing the semantic ambiguity onto a different word, I'll make a stab at what I think "insight" means in the context of invention:

      Insight is an idea that leads to a reformulation of a problem, rather than restatements of existing solutions to it.

      In mechanical timekeeping, the idea that a *wheel* could act like a pendulum alters the problem. Before that realization the problem would have been how to deal with the mechanical inconvenience of a weighted rod, or how to balance friction and force to get a consistent result without a pendulum.

      In this case we have the idea of a sparkgraph, stated in terms of a common design pattern: the observer pattern. If you *have* a sparkgraph in software, you must update it *somehow*; either by manual intervention by the user or by reaction to changes in data. As soon as you decide to make sparkgraphs available to the user, the process of design *forces* you to make the choice one way or the other. You might have the only software package robustly designed enough to give you the option of automatic update, but the choice itself is a generic one forced on you by preexisting design conceptions. You haven't created any *new* way of conceptualizing the software architecture or user interface.

      This requirement of insight is, by the way, why I think software patents are a bad idea. It's not that we don't invent things, it's the opposite. We invent things *constantly*. As software designers that's our job, to create new conceptualizations of problems. The problem is that we generate and discard so many potentially useful ideas that it is virtually certain with enough of us working on various problems, somebody has come up with a lot of the same things independently. That's not quite the same as saying the ideas are "obvious". It's quite difficult to come up with a good conceptualization of a problem and not many people can do it. That's what makes working in this field interesting.

      So why is software engineering different than other fields of "inventing"? I think it's because the flexibility of computers as a platform for expressing useful creative ideas makes generating many alternative problem conceptualizations worthwhile.

      So we *do* invent things all the time in software design. Despite this, an application of an existing design pattern to a useful feature doesn't quality as an "invention".

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    20. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      A patent should protect the research done. The idea is to encourage people to show their results and in return they get a time limited exclusive right to use, so others can build on top of their research, instead of having to hide their discoveries from the opposition to protect their investment.

      Now please show me what investment, what research, what ROI is to be protected here? It's about monopolizing a trivial idea. It's the exact opposite of what patents are about. Not more research and more development, faster discoveries because others don't have to reinvent the wheel. It's monopolizing a trivial idea and actually forcing others to reinvent the wheel, to find loopholes in the patent that allows them to use that very trivial idea as well.

      The reason why using a sparkline (whatever it may be) in a spreadsheet wasn't implemented earlier is that the sparkline itself is new. If anything, this could be patented because that's what required research and investment of resources. What MS does, just to bother a car analogy, is to patent the use of a new rubber mix in tyres after someone else invented the better rubber.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    21. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Theaetetus · · Score: 1

      Sorry, but taking an existing invention and just taking on "in Excel" or "using a computer" does not make it a new invention. That seems to be the way the USPTO treats those magic words, though.

      [Citation needed]

      And I mean an actual citation, not another Slashdot article with a misleading headline or summary about how "zomg the patent office allowed a patent for doing x... on the internet!" Find me an issued patent that has "on the internet" or "on a computer" as the sole inventive limitation of a claim.

    22. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Hatta · · Score: 1

      If the "sparkline" is so obvious and useful an idea and so easily implemented in your spreadsheet program why isn't it there now?

      It is, it's called a graph. Just don't show the axes and scale it down. Voila. "Sparkline"

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    23. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by OldSoldier · · Score: 1

      The patent clerc should tell his 5 year old about the idea. If he says "duh", it's not patentable.

      I'm for patent reform as much as the next guy, but I'm also old enough to remember when soda cans had pull tabs that were removable. They were like that for YEARS before the current type that opens but stays affixed to the can. Whenever I hear the "duh" argument I wonder if the putative "5 year old" would have said "duh" to the current type of pop top.

      Arguments in favor of that being a "non-duh" patent:

      • it was YEARS before someone came up with something different.
      • undoubtedly took some engineering to make it: 1) sealed well enough to not leak, 2) weak enough to open, 3) strong enough to not break off entirely.

      I haven't read the MS application, but it's not clear the "duh" argument applies here.

    24. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by donatzsky · · Score: 1

      I wish I had mod points, but I don't. So I'll just say that that was quite possibly the most insightful thing I have ever read on software patents.

    25. Re:It's not a patent for Sparklines themselves by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 1

      Right, and OpenOffice? What prevented them, and their developers, from implementing it?

  4. Opposing patents by StreetStealth · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This is one of those issues I'd love to hear a real patent attorney weigh in on: If someone files a patent on something you can prove you demonstrated publicly at an earlier date, what are your options? Can you file an opposition to the patent? How does it work?

    --
    Your mind is clear / The things that you fear / Will fade with how much you / Believe what you hear
    1. Re:Opposing patents by Mr_Plattz · · Score: 1

      Please stop thinking in a FOSS mind frame. In our world, someone asks a question and if we're experienced in that field we don't mind helping out. In the law world, they just lol'd at you (just like every patent attorney who actually read your post) and are currently waiting for you to swipe your credit card details. Now ... Armchair Patent Attorneys ... now that's another matter. I'm sure they're willing to provide an abundance of information.

    2. Re:Opposing patents by Grond · · Score: 5, Informative

      This is one of those issues I'd love to hear a real patent attorney weigh in on: If someone files a patent on something you can prove you demonstrated publicly at an earlier date, what are your options? Can you file an opposition to the patent? How does it work?

      I am not an attorney (I'm an academic) and this is not legal advice. If you ever find yourself in a situation like this you should consult a competent patent attorney in your jurisdiction. To be clear, when I use the word 'you' in this post I mean the generic 'you,' not you personally.

      Here's the basic flowchart. Has the other party filed an application or received a patent? If they've already received a patent, then your primary option is to put the patent into reexamination. To do this requires evidence of a substantial new question of patentability (i.e., something new the examiner or the courts haven't looked at yet) and the payment of a fee. You can either put it into ex parte reexamination, where you submit your evidence and the patent office takes it from there, or you can put it into inter partes reexamination, where the patent office holds a sort of mini trial with you arguing against the patent's validity and the patent owner arguing for it.

      If the patent holder is actually demanding a license, threatening a lawsuit, etc, then you may also have the option of filing what's called a declaratory judgment lawsuit where you ask a court to determine whether the patent is valid or not.

      If things are still at the application stage, your options are much more limited. You can submit prior art to the patent office, or, in the rare circumstance that you also have a pending patent application on the same invention, then the patent office may declare what's called an interference and try to figure out who invented the claimed invention first.

    3. Re:Opposing patents by Grond · · Score: 3, Informative

      Please stop thinking in a FOSS mind frame. In our world, someone asks a question and if we're experienced in that field we don't mind helping out. In the law world, they just lol'd at you (just like every patent attorney who actually read your post) and are currently waiting for you to swipe your credit card details. Now ... Armchair Patent Attorneys ... now that's another matter. I'm sure they're willing to provide an abundance of information.

      I'm taking the patent bar in a month and the state bar in three. I'm currently an academic, so naturally part of my job is teaching people about the law, but I'm not going to stop doing so if I'm admitted to the bar. In fact, the Model Rules of Professional Responsibility state that lawyers should help to educate the public about the law (note: they aren't required to, but they should).

      Furthermore, there are patent attorneys that have made helpful comments on Slashdot over the years, which stands in direct contradiction to your claim.

      Similarly, one of the people I work with is an experienced patent attorney and distinguished law professor. We offered to be the subject of a Slashdot interview about patents, particularly software patents. We felt we'd be a good match since he graduated from MIT and I have bachelor's and master's degrees in computer science. Slashdot didn't take us up on the offer, but at least we tried.

      And finally I'll just point out that there are, of course, far more armchair patent attorneys than patent attorneys on Slashdot, so statistically it's hardly surprising that most comments, helpful or otherwise, come from non-experts. It would actually be pretty incredible if every patent-related post or comment on Slashdot was met by a host of patent attorneys chiming in on the issue.

    4. Re:Opposing patents by Grond · · Score: 1

      Model Rules of Professional Responsibility

      *facepalm* That should be Model Rules of Professional Conduct, of course. The predecessor to the Model Rules was the Model Code of Professional Responsibility. It's late, and I got the names jumbled up.

    5. Re:Opposing patents by Antique+Geekmeister · · Score: 1, Funny

      And, of course, you've provided no less than four paragraphs advertising your expertise, and not one single statement about the actual validity of the patent. You must be _amazing_ at preparing defense witnesses for testimony: answering the question without providing the information someone was really looking for is, in fact, an art form which you've just demonstrated quite well.

    6. Re:Opposing patents by icebraining · · Score: 1

      Well, I thought that too, so he may need some practice.

    7. Re:Opposing patents by quacking+duck · · Score: 1

      Far be it for me to be pedantic over a +4 Funny post, but he did answer the question. At length, and almost an hour before the one you replied to.

    8. Re:Opposing patents by Theaetetus · · Score: 1

      This is one of those issues I'd love to hear a real patent attorney weigh in on: If someone files a patent on something you can prove you demonstrated publicly at an earlier date, what are your options? Can you file an opposition to the patent? How does it work?

      Anyone can cite prior art to the USPTO on a pending application, even anonymously (at your written request). You must provide a written explanation of the pertinency and manner of applying the prior art to at least one claim of the patent. This is completely free. See 35 USC 301.

      This being Slashdot, I should remind readers that filing tons of citations of fake prior art in an attempt to bury the Examiner could result in fines and/or jail time.

      If the patent has issued, you can request a reexamination. Again, it must be in writing and include a description of the pertinency and manner of applying the cited prior art to every claim for which examination is requested, but this time, it must include a payment of the reexamination fee. Currently, the fee is $2520. See 35 USC 302.

      Disclaimer: I'm a registered patent agent, but I'm not your agent and this information contains no warranty and may be entirely, 100% false. Reliance upon it is unwarranted and unjustified.

    9. Re:Opposing patents by Zordak · · Score: 1

      This is one of those issues I'd love to hear a real patent attorney weigh in on: If someone files a patent on something you can prove you demonstrated publicly at an earlier date, what are your options? Can you file an opposition to the patent? How does it work?

      With the preface that this is not legal advice, I don't represent you, and you should not rely on this as a legal opinion for any reason whatsoever, this post is for entertainment purposes only, and anybody who relies on a random post on Slashdot as legal advice deserves whatever they get, you have several options actually. (Also, note that this isn't the case here. Microsoft is claiming an improvement on sparklines. It may or may not be an allowable patent, but it is not Tufte's invention they are claiming).

      The easiest and cheapest thing to do is to send a copy of your prior art to the patent attorney prosecuting the application. That attorney is now aware of the prior art and is obligated to share it with the examiner. Make sure that you get a return receipt on your mail, so that you can prove you sent it. If the attorney fails to submit the art, and it's later determined to be material, the patent is invalid. 9+ out of 10 attorneys will just send it in, since there is rarely a reason not to (there was one time when we had already gotten a notice of allowance and the relevance of the art was extremely questionable where we considered not sending it in, but in the end we did anyway). In the case of this Microsoft application, I would imagine that the attorneys have already submitted articles, patents, or other materials that identify sparklines as prior art. If you're REALLY interested, you could even go look at it in PAIR and check the electronic file wrapper. Look for "Information Disclosure Statements." Then you'll know what Microsoft has shared with the Patent Office.

      Next cheapest option is to file a Protest if you're within the protest period. Chapter 1900 of the MPEP has all the procedures. Feel free to go look it up.

      You could wait for the patent to issue, and then if it still has claims that read on your art, you could file a request ex parte or inter partes reexamination.

      If there's no bar date, you could file an application, naming yourself as inventor, to provoke an interference. In your hypothetical, there probably is a bar date, so no dice.

      Then there are all the options that involve hiring a lawyer and giving him a big pile of money. This is the option I recommend. That lawyer will then tell you what options are available in your specific case.

      --

      Today's Sesame Street was brought to you by the number e.
    10. Re:Opposing patents by radtea · · Score: 1

      It would actually be pretty incredible if every patent-related post or comment on Slashdot was met by a host of patent attorneys chiming in on the issue.

      It would be even more incredible if any patent-related story on /. ever deviated from the rigid kubuki theatre script we inevitably see:

      1) One of the editors posts a story with a false headline and misleading summary saying that X has a patent on Y, when Y never appears anywhere in the claims.

      2) Commenters chime in with minor variants on the following themes, in sequence:

      a) "Product Z has had this feature for years, as did something I wrote in kindergarten! How dare X try to patent it! Are the patent examiners on drugs!!!???"

      b) "The patent is actually on something quite different. The claims actually say..." followed by a clear explanation of how to read a patent, and how the claims as actually written could be considered sufficiently novel to meet the abysmally low standard required for patentability.

      c) "I don't care if the patent is actually on something else! It isn't sufficiently novel to satisfy my intuitive sense of the way the patent system should work! I'm outraged! Software patents are dumb!"

      It's a curious phenomenon, particularly since the /. editors clearly believe that the US patent system is extremely solid and only issues pretty reasonable patents. If they believed otherwise, they wouldn't have to put false headlines and misleading summaries on every single patent story that appears on /.

      After all, when you lie about your enemy to try to make your point, you're clearly stating, "My enemy is actually such a good guy that I have to make stuff up to make them look bad. Telling the truth about them simply won't generate the outrage I want, because there's really nothing very outrageous about what they are doing."

      Since /. editors never tell the truth about software patents in the US, we can only conclude that they are highly supportive of the existing software patent system, as they can't come up with any substantive reality-based critique.

      --
      Blasphemy is a human right. Blasphemophobia kills.
    11. Re:Opposing patents by mcgrew · · Score: 2, Insightful

      There seems to be an anti-lawyer bias among some here at slashdot, but lawyers are like programmers: some are competent, some not. Some are ethical, some not. Here's a true (albeit slightly offtopic) story that illustrates a good lawyer.

      I was drinking with my friend Amy, and as I was too drunk suggested we walk home from the bar. She'd not been there as long as me and offered to drive me. There were two things we didn't know: my tail lights had gone out, and her license had been suspended for non-payment of child support; she had just moved and the letter informing her hadn't reached her.

      We were pulled over, the cop ran her license, saw it was suspended, and put her in handcuffs and drove her away. I called another frined to drive my car the rest of the way home.

      Amy was back at my house an hour later; they'd let her out on OR (whatever that means). She went to court and was fined $300. She couldn't come up with the money, and this past Monday went back to court. The judge gave no one there any extensions and said anybody who didn't pay up by 9:00 am Friday (today) was going to jail. No extensions, no community service. "Hang 'em!" (I hope he's elected rather than appointed so I can vote against him next election). She faced six days in the pokey.

      The night before last she called her ex-husband's attorney, a criminal lawyer (her ex-husbans is a criminal who spent time in prison for brutally beating her).

      He told her not to worry, he'd be there to represent her and she was NOT going to jail.

      Good lawyer, terrible judge. Ray Beckerman (/.'s NYCL) fights the RIAA. I owe a debt of gratitude to the two lawyers who handled my divorce and bankruptcy. I can't figure out why there is such an anti-lawyer bias; they're like medical doctors. When you need one, you NEED one.

    12. Re:Opposing patents by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why bother with a Slashdot interview?

      1. Come up with your own questions
      2. Crowd source additional questions on your own website (making clear that contributors are ceding any rights they may hold in their questions).
      3. Edit the answers into a book
      4. Contact tech publishers who might be interested in the project.
      5. Profit!!!

    13. Re:Opposing patents by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 1

      Amy was back at my house an hour later; they'd let her out on OR (whatever that means).

      "Own recognizance" - essentially, "we take you at your word that you'll appear as required", that you have a recognizance of the consequences if you don't.

      The night before last she called her ex-husband's attorney, a criminal lawyer (her ex-husbans is a criminal who spent time in prison for brutally beating her). He told her not to worry, he'd be there to represent her and she was NOT going to jail.

      Hold up, what? He agreed to represent the ex-wife of a client who served time for assaulting said ex-wife, in a court case regarding her non-payment of child support to said client?!?

      Good lawyer he may be, but he may want to read-up on conflict of interest.

      PS: Love your journals.

    14. Re:Opposing patents by mcgrew · · Score: 2, Interesting

      He doesn't have custody; his parents do and the lawyer's not theirs, he's her ex's criminal attorney. They usually don't award custody of the kids to someone who goes to prison for a violent felony, and he beat Amy so badly she had to get reconstructive surgery. The guy's a real wacko from what I understand, a year or so he was on the front page of the SJ-R for a high speed chase through downtown where he hit a few cars, including police cars, almost ran over some cops, when they finally arrested him he had a loaded gun (felons can't have guns, that's another felony), drugs, and was drunk. IINM he's in prison again for that one. IMO he belongs there.

      She called me after her court date, she has until Monday now. It looks like she's still going to jail, and it looks to me like her boyfriend wants her there. A few days ago he was trying to get her to skip her court date (!!!) and he'd pay the fine today at 4:00 when he got paid. I and others told her that was incredibly stupid, instead of six days she'd be a month or more. So her layer got an extention until Monday, now the BF says that after paying the rent he doesn't have the money.

      I told her to get a job and out of his house.

      PS: Thank you!

    15. Re:Opposing patents by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 1

      Ahhh, that makes a lot more sense now. Got it. :D

  5. Obligatory Plunger Analogy by hoytak · · Score: 2, Funny
    --
    Does having a witty signature really indicate normality?
  6. Specifically... by Sockatume · · Score: 2, Informative

    The most general claim of the patent, claim number 1, is:

    associating a sparkline with a location in a document to provide a visual representation of one or more data values included in the document;associating with the sparkline a data source within the document including the one or more data values; associating the sparkline with one or more presentation options; generating the sparkline according to the one or more data values and the one or more associated presentation options by generating the selected visual representation based on the one or more data values with a matrix of points proportional to the associated location in the document; presenting the sparkline at the associated location in the document; and configuring the sparkline to be updated, such that: the sparkline is regenerated when one or more of the data values in the data source change; and the one or more presentation options are maintained when one or more document attributes are changed.

    --
    No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    1. Re:Specifically... by Tablizer · · Score: 1

      Gee, what update action did they miss on that list? Whaddabout: "update a sparkline when you bend over in the shower to pick up the soap"

    2. Re:Specifically... by lahvak · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That's pretty interesting. If I remember correctly, there is a LaTeX package for creating sparklines, it uses data that can be embedded in the document, it takes additional parameters that influence the look of the sparkline, and if you change the data a re-run latex, the sparkline changes to reflect the new data, while preserving the look given by the additional parameters. Add to it a system that watches your file and rerun latex every time to see a change in order to generate a preview (I believe I have seen at least one such editor), and it seems to me exactly like what they are describing. I don't quite understand what they mean by "matrix of points proportional to the associated location in the document". If that is the only difference, it really seems too little to deserve a patent.

      --
      AccountKiller
    3. Re:Specifically... by RalphSleigh · · Score: 1

      "matrix of points proportional to the associated location in the document"

      I am pretty sure this means that the sparkline resizes to fit its containing cell(s) when you drag the row/column resize handles at the edges, or some other process causes the cell(s) to be resized.

      --
      Come as you are, do what you must, be who you will.
    4. Re:Specifically... by vegiVamp · · Score: 1

      A sparkline (or any graphic) is a matrix of points (pixels), that they in this case make proportional (resize to fit) the associated location (insertion point) in your document.

      Part of what they're trying to patent, is sizing an inline graphic to the same height as your font.

      --
      What a depressingly stupid machine.
    5. Re:Specifically... by Zordak · · Score: 1
      No, it isn't. The patent expressly treats generic sparklines as prior art. From the "Background" section of the patent, where you put things that you admit are prior art:

      [0001]Sparklines are small graphics embedded in a document, such as a text document or a spreadsheet, among the words, numbers, images or other content of the document. Sparklines can be used to graphically represent the content of one or more neighboring cells to provide a visual representation of the data. There are at least two advantages to using sparklines. First, as a "picture paints a thousand words," at a glance, a graph can quickly clearly show values, trends, and similar information. Second, by presenting such a graph in context within the document as opposed to presenting the graph on a separate page or screen, a viewer can more readily appreciate the information represented and/or compare the represented information with that represented by other sparklines.

      [0002]In the case of creating sparkline graphs, conventionally, sparklines are created manually, often by simulating the generation of bars with a set of segment fonts that represent parts of bars, lines, or other graph features. Alternatively, a user could manually could select data and manually generate a chart, then try to scale the chart to fit the desired space.

      Sparklines are also used as elements of the claims. You can't use them as elements if you're claiming sparklines. This application may or may not have allowable claims, but it is clearly not trying to claim sparklines themselves. It's claiming an improvement on sparklines, which is a perfectly legitimate thing to do, including without the permission of the inventor of the underlying technology. In fact, since (as everybody has vociferously pointed out) generic sparklines are clearly in the prior art, Tufte cannot be named as an inventor on this application.

      --

      Today's Sesame Street was brought to you by the number e.
    6. Re:Specifically... by lahvak · · Score: 1

      Part of what they're trying to patent, is sizing an inline graphic to the same height as your font.

      Which, if I understand it correctly, is exactly what the sparkline LaTeX package does. And, the package first appeared in 2004.

      --
      AccountKiller
    7. Re:Specifically... by vegiVamp · · Score: 1

      Oh, don't get me wrong, I'm not defending their patent claim, just responding to your query as to what exactly they meant by that.

      --
      What a depressingly stupid machine.
  7. A Few Points by Grond · · Score: 5, Informative

    First, the actual claims are considerably narrower than just 'any and all uses of sparklines.' The broadest claim is about the use of sparklines in a dynamically updated electronic document. Most of the narrower claims have to do visual effects, the handling of null values in the spreadsheet, etc. This is pretty tame stuff.

    Second, this is a newly filed application. The examiner will almost certainly come back with multiple rejections based on obviousness, and the claims will likely be narrowed in response. Like most negotiations, the parties start off with extreme positions and work towards compromise.

    Third, the patent application already cites Tufte (along with a dozen other pieces of prior art) in the Information Disclosure Statement. In other words: Microsoft gave the patent examiner many important pieces of prior art. The examiner will no doubt find many more. This is all publicly available through the Patent Office's Patent Application Information Retrieval system.

    Fourth, there is no need for Microsoft to acknowledge Tufte as an inventor on the patent application. Inventorship in the patent context is a legal term of art with a specific meaning. The fact that Microsoft said that Tufte invented sparklines is not the damning piece of evidence many are assuming it is (and recall from point three, above, that Microsoft acknowledged Tufte in its IDS). First, Tufte invented sparklines more than a year before the filing date, so any patentable claims must be a non-obvious improvement upon or use of sparklines, not sparklines themselves. Second, Tufte clearly did not work with the Microsoft inventors, so he cannot be a co-inventor of anything claimed in this application.

    Once again non-experts hear hoofbeats and scream 'Zebra Stampede!' The comments on Tufte's site, for example, are a joke, an absolute mess of uninformed speculation. Given the wealth of publicly available information on patents and patent application, the Slashdot editors should do more to fact check these stories before publishing them.

    Finally, I'll just tack on that if sparklines are so great and this is all so obvious, then surely there's an open source version that predates this application. Remember, though, that this application was filed on May 7, 2008, so the open source version would need to predate that, preferably (but not necessarily) by a year or more. That would actually be an important piece of prior art.

    1. Re:A Few Points by chrisb.au · · Score: 1

      "Finally, I'll just tack on that if sparklines are so great and this is all so obvious, then surely there's an open source version that predates this application. Remember, though, that this application was filed on May 7, 2008, so the open source version would need to predate that, preferably (but not necessarily) by a year or more. That would actually be an important piece of prior art." A quick search shows: http://sparkline.org/ which on their sf page have a release dated 2004-11-09

    2. Re:A Few Points by Grond · · Score: 2, Informative

      The examiner will almost certainly come back with multiple rejections based on obviousness

      You have such faith in the Federal Gov't. I wish I were still as naive as you.

      This is not naïveté, this is based on personal experience and empirical research. Virtually no patent applications sail through completely unopposed, especially not applications--like this one--that claim combinations of known prior art elements whose combination behaves in a predictable way.

      Furthermore, obviousness is probably the most common basis for rejection, especially in a case like this, where the broadest claim is basically 'sparklines in a spreadsheet.' Sparklines are prior art, spreadsheets are prior art, so it's at least arguable that the combination is obvious, especially given that sparklines are really just a special type of chart, which are of course a common and well known spreadsheet feature.

    3. Re:A Few Points by Grond · · Score: 2, Interesting

      A quick search shows: http://sparkline.org/ which on their sf page have a release dated 2004-11-09

      It doesn't anticipate any of the claims, but it may help in an obviousness analysis. Specifically, it doesn't automatically update the sparkline if the data changes and it doesn't automatically adjust the horizontal proportion of the sparkline (at least that I could tell the width is set explicitly by the programmer).

      Of course, this is to be expected since it's for the web and not a spreadsheet. I suspect a good obviousness argument could come from it though: This is a static sparkline graphing tool. Other static graphing tools have been incorporated into spreadsheets as dynamically updating charts. It would be obvious to add this one new kind of chart to a spreadsheet, especially given that their use on a computer has already been demonstrated.

      Normal sparklines are vertically proportional to the surrounding text but not horizontally proportional because, apart from the width of the page, free flowing text has no natural notion of width. A spreadsheet, on the other hand, is made up of discrete cells, so it would be obvious to make the sparkline's width proportional to the width of one or more cells.

      I fully expect that those arguments, or something very much like them, will be made by the patent examiner.

    4. Re:A Few Points by Akir · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The examiner will almost certainly come back with multiple rejections based on obviousness [....]

      You're saying this about the patent system that approved the patents on swinging on a swing and using a laser pointer as a cat toy?

    5. Re:A Few Points by barath_s · · Score: 4, Informative
      Re: Predating May 7 2008 :

      http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2006/02/05/in-cell-charting/ https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=7603152763857688635&postID=4147846911463078558&pli=1 Note especially comments by Bob Phillips and jon Peltier, in addition to the post by Fabrice on starting in 2005.

      Plus, I'm not sure why you emphasize open source implementations that predate it. Did you really mean to imply that if I had a closed source implementation that predated it, it would not be prior art ?

    6. Re:A Few Points by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well sparkline.org was registered in late 2004 - and it seems that around 5 years ago (well before the 2008 application date) there was code released on sourceforge - BSD license too.
      Obviously it wont match the precise claims because it predates the application but you would expect the application to avoid any claims that could be made about the functionality of existing published code.

    7. Re:A Few Points by Grond · · Score: 2, Informative

      The examiner will almost certainly come back with multiple rejections based on obviousness [....]

      You're saying this about the patent system that approved the patents on swinging on a swing and using a laser pointer as a cat toy?

      I said rejections would be made, not that Microsoft wouldn't be able to overcome them with arguments or amendments. And a quick check shows that rejections were filed in both cases*. Both patents have since been abandoned for failure to pay the maintenance fees, by the way.

      * Technically, the record shows that one and two office actions were filed, respectively. Each office action contained one or more rejections, and it's common for them to contain several. The patents are old enough that the complete record is not available on PAIR, so all I can say for certain is that there were rejections filed.

    8. Re:A Few Points by Lehk228 · · Score: 1

      updating a graph is not patentable, spreadsheets already do it.

      --
      Snowden and Manning are heroes.
    9. Re:A Few Points by Grond · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, see, there you go. That's the kind of prior art worth submitting to the patent office, assuming the examiner doesn't find it.

      Plus, I'm not sure why you emphasize open source implementations that predate it. Did you really mean to imply that if I had a closed source implementation that predated it, it would not be prior art ?

      No, I didn't mean to imply that at all. I just didn't realize Excel was capable of doing in-cell charting through VB or a plug-in, so I assumed a prior art implementation would most likely come from Open Office, gnumeric, etc.

    10. Re:A Few Points by Grond · · Score: 4, Insightful

      updating a graph is not patentable, spreadsheets already do it.

      It's a legal rule that in an obviousness analysis you have to consider the claims as a whole. You can't dissect the claims into individual, obvious elements. It's the combination of all of the elements that must be found obvious.

      I'm not saying that dynamically updating sparklines in a spreadsheet isn't obvious, just that the argument you made isn't a legally valid one.

    11. Re:A Few Points by dbIII · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Finally, I'll just tack on that if sparklines are so great and this is all so obvious, then surely there's an open source version that predates this application.

      The wikipedia article lists several, but for all I know they may have appeared there after your post.
      As for the patent being of restricted use that is true but ultimately somewhat petty. It is like appending "on a plane" onto a mention of anything.

    12. Re:A Few Points by TapeCutter · · Score: 1

      "You have such faith in the Federal Gov't. I wish I were still as naive as you."

      Speaking of being naive, despite what you think government employees are no where near as lazy as the intellect displayed in your post.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    13. Re:A Few Points by Sabriel · · Score: 1

      Finally, I'll just tack on that if sparklines are so great and this is all so obvious, then surely there's an open source version that predates this application.

      There very likely is one. Of course, since it wouldn't have involved attempts to monetise somebody else's shoulders, it might involve actual work (hah) tracking it down.

      Patents have become a broken window. The system was intended to reward what was once the rare spark of applied creative genius - it does not scale to cope with billions of educated individuals possessing both time and resources to advance the useful arts.

    14. Re:A Few Points by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      There is something very wrong with your argument from a logical perspective. It is not about dissecting the claim as you call it it is about generalizing the claim that speadsheeds are already automaticaly updating graphs that is sernanly true and as sparklines are just graphs the claim holds also for sparklines so there is not much left to patend anyway. To recap it is not looking at just a part of the claim it is looking at a statement that is true for sparklines as it is true for all graphs in a spreadsheed

    15. Re:A Few Points by deblau · · Score: 1

      Second, this is a newly filed application. The examiner will almost certainly come back with multiple rejections based on obviousness, and the claims will likely be narrowed in response. Like most negotiations, the parties start off with extreme positions and work towards compromise.

      And an invention is obvious if it is merely "the predictable use of prior-art elements according to their established functions" to produce an expected result. Thanks, KSR.

      --
      This post expresses my opinion, not that of my employer. And yes, IAAL.
    16. Re:A Few Points by radtea · · Score: 1

      the Slashdot editors should do more to fact check these stories before publishing them.

      They would get fewer page-views from the outraged and ignorant if they did that, which is the only reason I can see for them to persist in posting patent stories with false headlines and misleading summaries.

      --
      Blasphemy is a human right. Blasphemophobia kills.
    17. Re:A Few Points by Tristfardd · · Score: 1

      Finally, I'll just tack on that if sparklines are so great and this is all so obvious, then surely there's an open source version that predates this application. Remember, though, that this application was filed on May 7, 2008, so the open source version would need to predate that, preferably (but not necessarily) by a year or more. That would actually be an important piece of prior art.

      This is nonsense. The idea that everything obvious must have been previously done is a complete rejection of the meaning of the word "obvious". Using this legal-speak nothing has been obvious since the beginning of the world. Nothing is obvious today that isn't in the history books. You can use that thinking for what should be patentable, but it is the type of behavior that makes people despise lawyers. It always forces everything to the most primitive denominator. Does this make decision making easier? Certainly. Is it also so far outside of acceptable human norm that one has to become specialized in an arcane pursuit to understand it? Yes. This is the same approach to thinking that results in finding a woman not suitable for marriage because she is not a virgin. Some people think that way, they also tend to have other problems.

      Instead, most people have developed a better approach regarding women and marriage. Economically, it suits the lawyers to not do so regarding patents. How would they benefit? Anything they can do to pull the law away from reasonableness is to their economic advantage.

    18. Re:A Few Points by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      As for the patent being of restricted use that is true but ultimately somewhat petty. It is like appending "on a plane" onto a mention of anything.

      Can I patent snakes?

    19. Re:A Few Points by gentooligan · · Score: 1

      Finally, I'll just tack on that if sparklines are so great and this is all so obvious, then surely there's an open source version that predates this application.

      Yup. Here's one: http://sourceforge.net/projects/sparklinesforxl/

  8. They give him credit on a MS Blog Page by PhunkySchtuff · · Score: 2, Informative

    Over on the Microsoft Excel Team Blog they even give Edward Tufte credit as the inventor of these sparklines.

    For Excel 2010 we’ve implemented sparklines, “intense, simple, word-sized graphics”, as their inventor Edward Tufte describes them in his book Beautiful Evidence. Sparklines help bring meaning and context to numbers being reported and, unlike a chart, are meant to be embedded into what they are describing:

  9. Why must /. editors insist on twisting the truth by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    By the obvious twisting of what is actualy being patented here, is timothy the new kdawson?

  10. Right initial, wrong patent by gmuslera · · Score: 2, Funny

    They should patent Tourette instead, so maybe the rest of the world stop getting its symptoms every time they make a move.

  11. It's killing me by elysiana · · Score: 1

    Either it's way past my bedtime, or the market is over-saturated with Twilight crap, or both, but...

    I totally read that as "Tufte's Sparkliness".

    1. Re:It's killing me by compro01 · · Score: 1

      You are not the only one.

      --
      upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
  12. Not too impressed. by DerekLyons · · Score: 1, Insightful

    I wouldn't complain about Microsoft's activity when you link to Wikipedia rather than the author's own page on sparklines.

  13. Re:I'm trying to figure out who's more ridiculous. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    But it's not just a miniature graph line. That is a misconception. If you tried miniaturizing graphs with all the axes information etc., they don't become any easier to interpret. They just become smaller.

    A Sparkline has special features, like a dot at the endpoint, and a number representing its value (some also display max and min, which gives you an idea of spread). Looking at a Sparkline immediately gives one a sense of the trends and magnitudes in the graph. You cannot imagine how incredibly useful Sparklines are for visualizing the trend of thousands of dynamic trajectories in engineering. Graphs are good if you need to extract detailed information on a few variables, but when you want to see how a dynamic system with 240 variables is evolving, Sparklines can give you that information in 3-4 printed pages. That's how information dense they are.

  14. Wait A Cotton Picking Second by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Sparklines on PC have existed since the 1990s for financial, memory management, cpu graphing, calculators and medical statistics. They even go back farther in the field statistics and physics itself. Neither Microsoft, nor Tufte have invented anything here.

    1. Re:Wait A Cotton Picking Second by Sockatume · · Score: 1

      Sparklines are specifically line graphs included totally in-line with text, without axes. Obviously line graphs as a whole have existed for much longer.

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    2. Re:Wait A Cotton Picking Second by NoOneInParticular · · Score: 1

      So in essence Tufte invents "graphs without axes, in-line with text", calls them sparklines. Then excel comes along and invents 'sparklines in a spreadheet', which, after proper removal of the redundant items (in-line with text), can be expaned to 'graphs without axes in a spreadsheet'. Bravo Excel: you're patenting the removal of one of your features!

  15. Re:I'm trying to figure out who's more ridiculous. by rtilghman · · Score: 1

    I design sophistcated financial applications for a living, so I know exactly how valuable basic trend indication can be. The point of my post was to highlight that this idea is:

    a) not at all novel or original
    b) like trying to patent writing
    c) did not in any way originate with Tufte

    Great idea, not Tufte's, in no way Microsofts, laughable on it's face.

    -rt

  16. first to apply by dbcowboy · · Score: 1

    I have been hearing about the first to apply rule. If patent reform includes such a rule change these new patent applications to inventions by others will have beat the owners of ideas in the race to patent, plus it allows free grab of anything left unpatented.

  17. Microsoft didn't patent the sparkline itself by Device666 · · Score: 2, Informative

    Microsoft patented the use of sparklines as a visualization for a single cell in a grid. In the US patent system, that's night and day different. They recognise Edward Tufte on their website for his invention of the sparkline: "For Excel 2010 we've implemented sparklines, "intense, simple, word-sized graphics", as their inventor Edward Tufte describes them in his book Beautiful Evidence."

    If they would patent the sparkline they would have no claim because of broadly published prior art, under 35 U.S.C. 301: "Any person at any time may cite to the Office in writing prior art consisting of patents or printed publications which that person believes to have a bearing on the patentability of any claim of a particular patent. If the person explains in writing the pertinency and manner of applying such prior art to at least one claim of the patent, the citation of such prior art and the explanation thereof will become a part of the official file of the patent. At the written request of the person citing the prior art, his or her identity will be excluded from the patent file and kept confidential."

    Speaking from an information visualisation perspective Microsoft badly implemented sparklines in excel.

    1. Re:Microsoft didn't patent the sparkline itself by Lord+Lode · · Score: 3, Insightful

      So they patent putting it in a single cell? How obvious is that? Putting something else than text in a cell? No matter what, it's a graph, it's line art, an image, images and lines have been rendered by computers for decades, no matter if it's in a cell of a spread sheet or in a window or in whatever else, no matter if the image is synchronized with some numbers from somewhere else and what not, I fail to see any innovation at all, it's just plotting of a graph based on numbers.

    2. Re:Microsoft didn't patent the sparkline itself by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Use of sparklines in an Excel cell is available as an Excel add-in from Bissantz.com and has been for several years.
      They have scrolling versions, live tickers etc.

  18. Re:I'm trying to figure out who's more ridiculous. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well, I've just looked at it, and yes, it is just a miniature graph. Make all the claims you like, but it is just a graph sized to fit with the surrounding objects. Wow, it has a dot at the end-point (like of course, every other graph I've seen, although the dot is in the example I saw a different colour, wow!), and some also display a max and min value, funnily enough like most normal graphs. How does looking at a sparkline give you any more of a sense of a trend than any other similar traditional line graph. Answer: it doesn't. What it does do is occupy less space. Those of us who have had to embed graphs in documents, have used very similar techniques, but didn't bother to declare it a wondrous new technology.

    To summarise: it's a small graph with certain characteristics.

  19. Do you know who Tufte is? by Kupfernigk · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Obviously not. If you did you would know he always credits his sources in depth and explains the historical development of his thinking. He often draws out features of graphical presentation of data and gives them simplifying names to provide a framework, but he does not claim originality.

    He is not suing Microsoft, and has done absolutely nothing wrong, And your post is a simple troll.

    --
    From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
  20. A by-your-leave? by YourExperiment · · Score: 0

    without so much as a by-your-leave from Tufte

    The summary seems to be implying that Tufte should have asked Microsoft for their permission before allowing them to rip him off. This seems somewhat harsh on the poor guy.

    1. Re:A by-your-leave? by YourExperiment · · Score: 1

      Sigh. If you don't understand the English language, please refrain from moderating. (Get a job as an editor instead!)

  21. "Non experts" are rightfully scared by Nicolas+MONNET · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    First of all, fuck you and your condescending attitude.

    Patents are unreadable by an expert in the field they apply to. I have 15 years experience in IT, as a developer and sysadmin, plus a formal education in a technical field, and I can't understand patents that apply to the work I do. I can not. I might just be stupid, but I can't help notice that most of my peers can't read patents either.

    Yet I can get sued should I publish Free software that is infringing on something I can't read.

    And here you are, patronising people for not understanding that patent, while the damn things are made unreadable *on fucking purpose* because it's advantageous to the patent holder since it makes it easier to trick east Texan rednecks into awarding them billions for nothing.

  22. Blame the system, not M$ by ath1901 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Sure, the patent application may not go through, most likely because of the non-obvious/inventive step requirement (even if you find something looking like prior art, it may not look like it to a lawyer).

    It doesn't make the (american) patent system any less stupid though:
    Microsoft obviously thought the chances were good enough (> 0%) to spend some money filing a patent. It would (almost) be business malpractice if they didn't. Similar patents have been granted before (progress bars, one click shopping etc) and M$ would get a significant advantage if the patent was allowed (great marketing feature and by preventing interoperability of spreadsheets once again).

    As long as design/software patents are allowed, you have to live with the consequences. Next time, vote on someone who cares.

    1. Re:Blame the system, not M$ by kegon · · Score: 1

      US Patent System messed up, movie at 11.

      Seriously though, think about it: Any big company that does research rewards their staff; some guy thinks he can get a fleetingly novel implementation of a graph accepted by USPTO. Managers ask him (as he is the expert) if he thinks it will fly, he says yes, of course. If it's accepted he gets a few hundred $$$ bonus and a line on his resume.

      USPTO's job is not to knock down bad patents; it's job is to generate money for US.gov by selling monopolies on technology. USPTO *want* to give the patent if they possibly can but they have to put it through a review procedure to cover their asses.

      If the patent is accepted then it will be published and we can all go about looking for a workaround.

  23. Embedding is what they are meant for by metalmonkey · · Score: 1

    Sparklines "are meant to be embedded into what they are describing" quote http://blogs.msdn.com/excel/archive/2009/07/17/sparklines-in-excel.aspx
    How can a patent be granted on embedding them in a grid, when Sparklines were designed to be easily embedded into other contexts. A grid being one such context.

  24. New Moon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Edward... sparkliness... vampires (MS)... I smell another 'Twilight' promo here.

  25. Regardless, Glad To See Sparklines in Excel by davide+marney · · Score: 0

    It's too bad that we're all here talking about the legal issues surrounding Excel's implementation of Sparklines, rather than praising the developers at MS for picking up on this great idea and putting it in the code. Isn't this what is supposed to happen in a free market of ideas?

    It's obvious that MS isn't trying to claim authorship of Sparklines per se, since they mention Dr. Tufte's name right up front. Seems to me they're just being aware of a terrific UI idea, and putting it into code. There's not a thing wrong with that, and frankly, it doesn't happen nearly often enough.

    The fact is, Sparklines look awesome in Excel, and I'd love to see them in Sharepoint, too, where a lot of dashboard-type information gets displayed. Way to go, Microsoft! It's great to see some outside-the-box thinking; you've beat your open source competitor at his own game.

    People who know me know I don't normally take Microsoft's side on IP issues, but if their patent is properly limited in scope and novel in execution then let 'er rip. If the patent claim is trash, well then, OK, throw it out. But we need to make sure we don't discourage this imitation-is-the-sincerest-form-of-flattery style of development. That's how we advance the art.

    --
    "We receive as friendly that which agrees with, we resist with dislike that which opposes us" - Faraday
  26. I've done it... by mok000 · · Score: 5, Informative

    I've used sparklines that were updated "automatically" from the values in a database. The software in question tracked the coffee consumption pr. person in the lab, and displayed it using sparklines on a web page (no longer online). The sparkline code was a PHP snippet I found on the net somewhere. There must be plenty of prior art.

    1. Re:I've done it... by polyp2000 · · Score: 1
      --
      Electronic Music Made Using Linux http://soundcloud.com/polyp
    2. Re:I've done it... by iamhigh · · Score: 1

      I've used sparklines that were updated "automatically" from the values in a database. The software in question tracked the coffee consumption pr. person

      You guys went balls to the wall tracking down that asshole that wouldn't contribute for drinking the office coffee, huh?

      --
      No comprende? Let me type that a little slower for you...
  27. Emperor's New Clothes by backwardMechanic · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Am I really the only person looking at this and thinking 'it's a graph'?

    The rest is all visual design and auto-updating.

    1. Re:Emperor's New Clothes by kegon · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's a graph and it's small. I think Tufte's point is that small graphs can communicate information without the cruft of detailed axes, labels and so on.

      However, this is not a new idea. It has been reinvented by every 7 year old learning how to draw a graph, to be howled at by a teacher for not adding useful detailed axes, labels and so on.

      If you read Tufte's website though you may get the impression that it's a brand new idea.

    2. Re:Emperor's New Clothes by coult · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I've always thought that Tufte isoverblown. I mean, sparklines - duh, its a small graph without axes. The famous "Napeleon's army" chart is really not any more enlightening or informative than just reading a paragraph or two and looking at some tables of numbers.

      --

      All is Number -Pythagoras.

  28. matrix of points by hAckz0r · · Score: 1
    I believe that phrase refers to the mapping of 'point size' of the fonts in the document to the size of the graphic to render to match the height of the current font being used. Basically a table of size mappings, which is an OBVIOUS requirement for any such embeded graphic rendering system. Sure, you can create a formula to calculate the size mapping, but what is the real difference? A table probably is fewer bites of memory than the code required to generate the mapping dynamically.

    Big deal. Obvious. Stupid. So they patented it, because they could. Now that they did, they can now threaten more frivolous patent law suits against their competitors when ever its advantageous. So remind me USPTO, Exactly how does this patent help the general public? Never mind the stupid and obvious criteria, but rather how and why should such a patent even exist under the 'defined purpose' that our founding fathers had envisioned/intended?

  29. If only there was a way by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If only there was a way to show Microsoft's coming Waterloo using just one immediately apparent and arresting graphic.

  30. Tufte's Real Contribution by smitty777 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    So what is the argument really about? If these charts are so prevalent, what is Tufte complaining for? As anyone knows who's been following Tufte for as long as I have knows that his real contribution to the field of graphics is his minimalist approach - his crusade to remove the graphics of the world from "chartjunk". His goal is to present the user with the most amount of information using the least amount of features. So, aside from a nifty name, to what exactly is Tufte laying claim? The same could also be asked of Microsoft - are they claiming a specific layout, color combination, or feature set? Or are they just trying to capitalize on the name "Sparklines". If the former, I don't think anyone has a case. If the latter, that does seem fairly reprehensible.

    --
    "Before God we are all equally wise - and equally foolish"
    Albert Einstein
  31. New Patent! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    New Patent! Sparklines ***on the internet***!

    I'll make BILLIONS!

    Especially since that patent would screw over Office documents like excel with a sparkline being saved as a HTML page...

    For my next patent, "Sparklines ***In Open Office***!!!" I tells ya, the opportunities here are endless!

    1. Re:New Patent! by nagnamer · · Score: 1

      New Patent! Sparklines ***on the internet***!

      Google's already been doing it for quite a while. Check out google analytics summary pages. It's loaded with them. There are more examples here: http://www.edwardtufte.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=0001OR

      --
      Every harsh word you utter has the right address. It only sounds harsh because the one on the envelope is the wrong one.
  32. Patent language by AlpineR · · Score: 1

    As it was explained to me: Patents aren't written so that they're impossible to read. Patents are written so that they're impossible to misread. The enforceable parts must be written very precisely so that a judge knows exactly what they mean without any guesswork. You can think of the judge as a compiler who needs to have each part of the program described in careful language.

    The form of patent applications is generally the same as a century ago. That's necessary since they need to maintain a consistent and interactive structure. That also means that they appear archaic. But that's mostly due to unfamiliarity. Once you learn to read the code, they become straightforward.

    Would you expect to read a template class in C++ without ever studying the C++ language? Would you expect to read a medical research paper and understand it completely without studying medicine?

    The good news is that reading patents is easier than writing them. I myself am feeling more confident about the first but looking for professional help with the second. Patent It Yourself by David Pressman gives an explanation that will be clear to any computer coder with just a little study.

  33. I'm not required by law to by Nicolas+MONNET · · Score: 1

    to be supposed to understand C++ code.

    Yet I can be found to be infringing on a patent I don't understand.

  34. OK so who all actually read the patent? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So... read this:

    http://www.freepatentsonline.com/20090282325.pdf

    It's very clearly patenting the use of sparklines in Excel, with key features being that they autoupdate and can chain sparklines with other sparklines.

    There are those who might consider this infringing, but it's certainly not attempting to patent sparklines themselves.

    I'm guessing this was patented as a defensive move. There's probably someone out there that has created a 3rd part plugin for Excel that they want to knock down.

  35. Redundant comment - WTF ? by OneSmartFellow · · Score: 2, Insightful

    How can anyone patent a graph ?

    I don't care how small it is, or whether it has axis labels, or what, it's a damned graph (or chart, which ever word you prefer)

  36. Re:I'm trying to figure out who's more ridiculous. by VGPowerlord · · Score: 1

    No, there is one novel thing he did: Give it a name.

    I wonder if he trademarked it and can sue MS over that...

    --
    GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
  37. Unclear to me.... by mea37 · · Score: 1

    I'm honestly not sure what exactly MS is patenting.

    This doesn't look like an attemptt to patent sparkilnes, much as the headline wants to paint it that way (and many commenters seem to be playing along). If it were, the claims would describe how to visualize data as a sparkline; instead, right from the very beginning of claim 1, they take the concept of a sparkline as a given.

    So it's not sparklines; its the association of a sparline to data and presentation parametesr in an Excel document that they msut be trying to protect. Is it a bad patent? Maybe; the associations to Excel elements could be obvious. But to assert that every sparkline out there (but not used in an Excel document and integrated with it in the ways the patent describes) is prior art would be incorrect. Since nobody but MS could add this feature to Excel, I doubt there's any prior art. It could be that similar use of sparklines in another spreadsheet package would qualify, unless there's something unique about the way it's done in the Excel format.

    There is nothing inherantly wrong with a patent on an invention that depends on / incorporates an element that itself would not be patentable.

  38. Latex, Python (prior tech/art) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Actually, at least one of the uninformed commentators on Tufte's site mentions Latex as including exactly the functionality in question here.

    You're right, Slashdot should do a better job of policing everything in these discussions and correcting any and all inaccuracies. Of course, there wouldn't be much left if this were done.

  39. Its just Excel by PPH · · Score: 1

    If Microsoft wants to patent their implementation of Sparklines in Excel, that's their business. I've seen plenty of implementations in other applications, including spreadsheets, document editors, etc. Excel is their app and if they want to scare third parties from developing for their platforms with patents, that's fine by me.

    I don't use Excel (or other Microsoft crap) so that will just mean more developers will be working on the stuff I use.

    --
    Have gnu, will travel.
  40. Re:I'm not required by law to by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yet I can be found to be infringing on a patent I don't understand.

    Yes, the patent owner has a time-limited monopoly on the method patented because he/she invented and published it first. Your reinventing it later does not revoke the monopoly status and its associated profits.

  41. Prior art by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  42. Can we please *ban* patent stories from Slashdot? by harlows_monkeys · · Score: 1

    It's been proven time and again that Slashdot cannot get patent stories right.

  43. Prior art from 2005 perhaps earlier. by niftymitch · · Score: 1

    http://www.bissantz.de/sparklines/ Done for Microsoft office Feb. 2005 See also http://www.edwardtufte.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=0001OR&topic_id=1 Also the size of graphics is not implicitly small but can and could have been any size and automated by scripts the way Nicolas Bissantz did in '05

    --
    Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't. Mark Twain.
  44. Re:I'm not required by law to by Nicolas+MONNET · · Score: 1

    And my point is, how am I supposed to know he "invented" (for broad values of "invented") the damn thing if the damn thing is unreadable?