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New Virginia IT Systems Lack Network Backup

1sockchuck writes "Virginia's new state IT system is experiencing downtime in key services because of a mind-boggling oversight: the state apparently neglected to require network backup in a 10-year, $2.3 billion outsourcing deal with Northrop Grumman. The issue is causing serious downtime for state services. This fall the Virginia DMV has suffered 12 system outages spanning a total of more than 100 hours, and downtime hampered the state transportation department when a state of emergency was declared during the Nov. 11 Northeaster."

39 of 211 comments (clear)

  1. Blame Northrop? by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In my experience, it is rare for a customer, even with professional IT staff, to properly specify their needs when it comes to technology. Why did Northrop, which presumably has experience in government systems, not design backups?

    --
    Palm trees and 8
    1. Re:Blame Northrop? by eht · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Likely they were told they should have a backup, quoted a price, and said nah, we will be fine.

    2. Re:Blame Northrop? by skgrey · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And not just backups, it sounds like they had no BCP plan at all. This is a massive oversight, but a fairly common one. I've consulted for a number of years, and it's amazing at how many companies don't have a BCP plan at all, and sometimes it includes simple backups of data.

      The companies where I've seen this basically do a risk assessment and say "well, we are willing to accept the risk of downtime because BCP is too costly". Unfortunately they don't weigh the chance of an outage or disaster appropriately, and then find themselves severely screwed when a tornado, storm system, or fire occurs, and then they are either out of business (in a small company) or take enough of a hit to make a headline on Slashdot and cripple the business.

      Seriously, when are companies going to realize that this is a critical component of IT? I've felt like I've talked till I was blue in the face about this over the years.

    3. Re:Blame Northrop? by mcgrew · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why did Northrop, which presumably has experience in government systems, not design backups?

      Because they didn't have to. It wasn't in the contract, so they're not going to spend the money doing it. They're not in business to keep the state government afloat, their only purpose is to make money.

      If you don't properly specify your needs, that's your fault. Don't rely on corporate good will, because there is no such thing.

    4. Re:Blame Northrop? by Publikwerks · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's the state's fault for not putting that in the contract. I have worked for state contractors who handle IT services, and the state always had a downtime penalty written in to the contract, so it was too expensive to be down not to have a redundant system. This is probably a case of penny pushers not doing their homework, seeing that one system is cheaper than two.

    5. Re:Blame Northrop? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You are correct. There should be SLAs, as well. The problem that most people don’t seem to comprehend. NG’s contract is NOT with the Stateits with VITA (yea a state agency..). NG does have SLA’s with VITA however most state agencies didn’t even SEE those SLA’s until oh I don’t know the last 3 months? VITA on the other hand, whom state agencies are REQUIRED to use by state law, has NO SLA’s..no MOU (memorandum of Understanding) nothing with the other state agencies. We are FORCED to use VITAand they have no staff, and they know that if and when it fails, NG will be blamed.

      NG has failed and will continue to fail not because “agencies want us to fail” but because they came in with no clear understanding and NO desire to understand state governments business or needs. We are NOT a private company, we are NOT driven by profit. We are stymied by laws and procedures to protect the tax payer that in the end cost more money.

      State workers just want to get this thing working. WE KNOW how its suppose to workwe’ve done it. We’ve done it many years without budget money, without staff, without support.

      This VITA/NG “parnership” is a complete fiasco for those of us that live it every day. This is just the tip of the iceburg.

    6. Re:Blame Northrop? by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That'd be my guess. Second guess would be that they agreed to having a backup - as soon as some politician determined where the backup site would be. (Which, of course, hasn't happened yet.)

      --
      'Sensible' is a curse word.
    7. Re:Blame Northrop? by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Welcome to the world of government low-bid contracts. The specification didn't call for backups, so you don't get backups, because that would've made the bid higher.

    8. Re:Blame Northrop? by Eivind · · Score: 3, Insightful

      True enough. But as you say, Northrop is in the business of making money, so it would've made sense for them to do the following:

      * Deliver a offer for the system requested.
      * Get the deal signed
      * Say: We notice you've not specified any backup, do you want that additionally ?

      Gives them a chance to upsell, AND potentially makes the customer happier -- a win-win.

    9. Re:Blame Northrop? by DRBivens · · Score: 5, Informative

      ... as soon as some politician determined where the backup site would be. (Which, of course, hasn't happened yet.)

      Actually, it has happened. The CoVA backup site is located in Lebanon, VA (SW part of the state).

      What THIS article is discussing is the lack of network backup, not data backup.

      This is an important distinction, to say the least.

      --
      You have the right to remain silent. If you don't, anything you say will be misquoted and used against you.
    10. Re:Blame Northrop? by WinterSolstice · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You must not deal with the government much :)

      If you are bidding for a government contract, it's a public bid. They state their requirements very precisely, and every single dollar you spend over is counted against you.

      Basically to do network backup, you'd have to eat it out of the goodness of your heart. There is a potential to upsell later, of course, but it has to go back through the public approvals process.

      --
      An operating system should be like a light switch... simple, effective, easy to use, and designed for everyone.
    11. Re:Blame Northrop? by TheLink · · Score: 3, Insightful

      > they have no trouble waking you up to make you fix it, but if you suggest an HA/failover?
      > Sorry, too expensive. We have weighed the risk, and decided it's an acceptable risk.

      Yes because they can count on waking you up to fix it.

      So seems perhaps the bosses are doing the right thing for the organization. They hired you, you will wake up to fix it, and they don't need to spend on HA/failover.

      Now if they hired someone who can't fix it fast, or sleeps really soundly, then they should spend on HA/failover, or hire you instead ;).

      --
    12. Re:Blame Northrop? by nine-times · · Score: 4, Insightful

      They're not in business to keep the state government afloat, their only purpose is to make money.

      I hate when this is offered as an excuse for shoddy work. "It's not their job to do good work. It's their job to make money." Yeah? So what. It strikes me a little like saying, "Hey, can't blame a con man for stealing your money. That's what con men do!"

      I don't know this particular situation well enough to say who is at fault and to what degree, but it's part of their business to service their customers well. It's part of every company's business to provide service to their customers in an ethical manner.

  2. That's the way of the future... by master_p · · Score: 4, Funny

    Have you ever seen backup systems in Star Trek, for example? you haven't. The future requires no backups.

    1. Re:That's the way of the future... by mikael_j · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Actually, there are plenty of backup systems in Star Trek. Of course, a few of them fail in every episode to avoid having every episode end with a "Yay for Starfleet engineers!" after five minutes.

      In fact, for some systems they apparently have up to four backups which all manage to fail magically at the same time *cough*transporters*cough*.

      /Mikael

      --
      Greylisting is to SMTP as NAT is to IPv4
    2. Re:That's the way of the future... by czmax · · Score: 2, Funny

      In the Star Trek future you can always route auxiliary power to the overloaded/failed device; which is usually sufficient to get to the end of the episode.

  3. Easy by Spad · · Score: 5, Insightful

    During the first six months of the year, state Department of Transportation workers faced 101 significant IT outages totaling 4,677 hours: an average of more than 46 hours per outage. One took 360 hours to fix.

    That's 27 weeks of downtime in the space of 26 weeks, which raises a much more important question than why there's no network redundancy and that question is: What kind of fucking morons have they got running their systems?

  4. outsourcing by Clover_Kicker · · Score: 5, Insightful

    But I thought the magic pixie dust of free enterprise would make outsourcing something to the private sector cheaper, more efficient, and better in every possible way?

    1. Re:outsourcing by idiotnot · · Score: 3, Informative

      Hey, it worked. Mark Warner won two-thirds of the vote in his senate run last year based on his stellar performance as governor. This was one of his big initiatives.

      (He also *fixed* the revenue sources, so that there'd never be a problem like happened with Jim Gilmore. Yet, now, Virginia is in worse shape than when he got there.)

    2. Re:outsourcing by darjen · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The government is clearly involved here. So it's got nothing to do with free enterprise.

  5. They have bigger problems than just this one... by Cornwallis · · Score: 3, Informative

    Remember how Virginia's health records were compromised earlier this year?

    http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/05/05/1232240

    Sounds like systemic ineptitude which is why I'm really looking forward to more government involvement in health care!

    1. Re:They have bigger problems than just this one... by east+coast · · Score: 3, Funny

      That wasn't a compromise of health records. That was transparency!

      --
      Dedicated Cthulhu Cultist since 4523 BC.
    2. Re:They have bigger problems than just this one... by mcgrew · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Bureaucracy is bureaucracy. Government involvement doesn't mean ineptitude, and the free market doesn't gurantee competence. Whether private or public, ineptitude as well as competence abounds.

  6. NG, I call you out! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Most forget that the network provided by the NG crooks is NOT part of the Comprehensive Infrastructure Agreement (CIA). It is a seperate agreement that is a fixed cost agreement under which NG was supposed to replace “like for like”. They were supposed to install an MPLS network. MPLS (Multi Protocol Label Switching) allows for the prioritization of traffic to allow Voice traffic to travel over the same circuit as the data. It also supposed to be intelligent enough to encrypt data to essentially allow a VPN to be created from point-to-point.

    None of the VPN has been done as promised, very few sites have used the VOIP option unless dictated to by VITA as part of new construction and most sites complain about network performance. Some agencies had totally redundant networks but were forced to pay more for less. 65% of VITA staff make over 90,000 a year. Again we pay more for less.

    While I am not a NG fan, interestingly enough, most state managers at Agencies will tell you that working directly with NG allows things to get done, VITA just gets in the way. VITA wants to always be the interface, Waste Fraud and Abuse to pay high salaries for mostly unqualified folks. Throw out VITA and let the agencies be treated like customers by NG.

    The IT Community Frowns Upon Your Shenanigans...

  7. Northrop Grumman outsources part of it's own IT as by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Northrop Grumman outsources part of it's own IT as well and it does not own some of it's systems they rent them or at least they did 1-2 years ago.

  8. Network connections, not system backups... by tomhath · · Score: 5, Informative

    Is seems nobody RTFA (no surprise). The problem they're having is network outages at branch offices. I assume they're using DSL or such, with no way to connect if/when it goes down. Any one office probably has >99% up time, but when you have hundreds of offices and the remnants of a hurricane come through you can expect several of them to go offline, which is what's happening.

  9. Network redundancy not backups by zerofoo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The article does not mention "backups" as in tape drives and off-site storage.

    The article does mention lack of redundancy at the network carrier level.

    My guess is that Northrop Grumman designed a network around single circuits connecting offices to data centers, and did not design the network to tolerate WAN link failures.

    A stupid oversight for sure, but nothing that can't be easily remedied by ordering redundant WAN circuits from your telco of choice. Redundant routing gear would also be smart.

    For all that are blaming government for this - they outsourced the design and implementation to a private company. That company screwed the pooch in design and implementation. Shame on both parties for not recognizing the risk of WAN failure.

    -ted

  10. Epic Fail by halfEvilTech · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If any story deserves this tag it is this. from the article:

    "Virginia declared a state of emergency Nov. 11 in the face of record nor'easter rains and winds.

    But without backup circuits -- which VDOT had before the Northrop Grumman outsourcing -- to take up the load, the transportation agency's Hampton Roads' IT network went out of service 23 times during the event.

    "We called at 5:35 in the morning," said Gary Allen, VDOT's chief of technology, research and innovation.

    "It took VITA four hours to open the help ticket" and begin to solve the problem."

    4 hrs on a critical system seriously just to get started solving it?

  11. Funny math or multiple systems? by Cprossu · · Score: 3, Insightful

    "During the first six months of the year, state Department of Transportation workers faced 101 significant IT outages totaling 4,677 hours: an average of more than 46 hours per outage. One took 360 hours to fix."

    wait, 4,677 hours? how could that be? There were 181 days in the first 6 months of this year, that's only 4,344 hours.. there was more downtime on the system than days in it's operational life! (did someone /0 here?)

    Outsourced, no thanks... I think I'd rather dig up a Univac I to do work on, at least it would be more reliable

    1. Re:Funny math or multiple systems? by halfEvilTech · · Score: 2, Informative

      My guess is that would be multiple systems. They noted in TFA that they provided IT services to 1000 local governments and 85 state agencies in VA.

    2. Re:Funny math or multiple systems? by Tino · · Score: 3, Insightful

      4,677 hours of failure in 4,344 hours of time means that at any given time, an average of 1.07 locations were offline.

      There are 131 DMV offices in Virignia; I don't know how many other Department of Transportation locations are included in the same bucket. If we assume that it's *only* the 131 DMV offices, 1.07 failures at any given time means that the system means that 130.3 locations are working, meaning that this statewide patchwork of network connections is 99.45% reliable.

      If your 'redundant' connections cut the failures in half (which they wouldn't), you'd have 99.59% reliability at more than twice the cost for the network.

      Adding 'redundancy' would more than double the network cost (since presumably currently they're using the lowest bidder), and in most places it wouldn't add any real redundancy anyway. Getting actual network redundancy is *fiendishly* difficult, even when you're spending a lot of money and siting a facility in a place that's well-served for networking. In small-town Virginia, you're almost certainly going to wind up paying for having redundant wires hanging on the same poles.

  12. THIS explains all the closed rest stops in VA... by volxdragon · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I *knew* there had to be some other reason why they closed half the interstate rest stops in VA, this is obviously where the money was (mis)spent...

  13. 15 day outage??? by tinkertim · · Score: 3, Funny

    From TFA:

    During the first six months of the year, state Department of Transportation workers faced 101 significant IT outages totaling 4,677 hours: an average of more than 46 hours per outage. One took 360 hours to fix.

    Suddenly, I don't feel so bad for that 2 1/2 hour glitch last week :)

  14. "the government exists by circletimessquare · · Score: 4, Informative

    and has involved itself in the market in some way in the past

    therefore, any prudent rational criticism of the free market and how it obviously fails can be explained away with creative rationalization that its the government's fault, somehow"

    my favorite is how free market fundamentalists wish to blame the market crash of 2008 on government policies. rather than gee, i dunno, the clinton and bush administration deregulation policies? you know, deregulation: having the government less invovled int he market?

    "what? my free market bubble and pop? nah, impossible! government's fault! pffft"

    please study your banking panics of the 1800s: without regulation, free markets have innate imperfections which always result in catalcysmic failures. all you need is simple human psychology, no government need apply, to cause a market to crash. you either regulate it, leveling the playing field artificially, and therefore making it truly "free", or you leave it alone, letting it bubble and pop like mad, and allow monopolists to take advantage of natural imperfections in the market to leverage unfair behavior

    free market fundamentalism is dead. your ideology is dead. fact: you need government involvement in the market for the market to run efficiently. fact: you need government policing and regulation of the marketplace to keep it "free" and egalitarian and equal for all players

    if you don't understand these simple truths by now, or refuse to believe that despite the obvious proof, you're an idiot

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
  15. central planning is equally idiotic by circletimessquare · · Score: 2, Insightful

    as free market fundamentalists

    it is a hallmark of the triumph of your fear over your intellect that you think that's what i am advocating for

    examples of fear triumphing over intellect:

    "gay marriage should be legal"

    reaction:

    "why do you think pedophiles should be allowed to marry boys and bestiality practioners to marry animals?"

    #2:

    "marijuana should be legal"

    reaction:

    "why do you want to legalize methamphetamine and heroin?"

    #3:

    "the government needs to regulate the market in order for it to be stable"

    reaction:

    "why do you want communist central planning"

    do you see the hysteria at work in these examples?

    in the future, i suggest you react to what i am actually saying, rather than projecting your irrational fears onto what i am saying, and reacting to that in hysteria

    fact: an unregulated marketplace bubbles and pops due to nothing but simple human psychology, and naturally degenerates into a few powerful players dominating everyone else. without regulation, there is no such thing as a "free" market. a stable free market of equals, without regulation by some entity, is something that has never existed in the history of humanity. its a myth cooked up by libertarian fundamentalists, their garden of eden. its a fantasy of blindness in direct contradiction to obvious well-established human behavior:

    1. people will take advantage of others, take advantage of natural imperfections in the market, and establish domination and exploitation of later arrivals to the marketplace

    2. people will react in panic and fear at rumors, and destroy the market on nothing but emotion: calm rational decisions does not dominate the market

    do you care to defy these simple obvious truths?

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
  16. Re:there's a lot of obstinance in your comment by circletimessquare · · Score: 2, Insightful

    1. people will take advantage of others, take advantage of natural imperfections in the market, and establish domination and exploitation of later arrivals to the marketplace

    2. people will react in panic and fear at rumors, and destroy the market on nothing but emotion: calm rational decisions does not dominate the market

    do you deny either simple obvious truth?

    how do you fight #1, and #2 then?

    answer: you need the government to regulate it. duh

    an unregulated marketplace bubbles and pops due to nothing but simple human psychology, and naturally degenerates into a few powerful players dominating everyone else. without regulation, there is no such thing as a "free" market. a stable free market of equals, without regulation by some entity, is something that has never existed in the history of humanity. its a myth cooked up by libertarian fundamentalists, their garden of eden. its a fantasy of blindness in direct contradiction to obvious well-established human behavior

    this has been today's intellectual charity offering for you. do try to take advantage of the offering, and accept the fucking obvious for once in your life about this subject matter

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
  17. you're a free market fundamentalist by circletimessquare · · Score: 2, Informative

    you believe the market left alone takes care of itself, and the government makes it unstable

    this is the opposite of reality: a free market is inherently unstable. government involvement stabilizes it

    i'm sorry i don't have any books by crackpots to cite to prop up the fucking obvious truth for you

    not like you would accept it

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
  18. you cannot have a rational discussion by circletimessquare · · Score: 2, Insightful

    with someone who has seriously embraces an absurd premise: that markets left to their own devices are stable and egalitarian

    markets left to their own devices bubble and pop, and are manipulated and dominated by entrenched insiders

    to not understand this is equivalent to someone refusing to accept that that the sun rises and sets or that the tides go up and down. how can you have a rational discussion with someone who refuses to see and accept obvious factual aspects of the reality they live in?

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
  19. what? by circletimessquare · · Score: 2, Funny

    no supplemental reading material from libertarian crackpots about the virginal holiness of the unregulated market?

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it