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Should You Be Paid For Being On Call?

Posted by ScuttleMonkey on from the then-i-want-hazard-pay dept.

theodp writes "Fortune's Dear Annie takes on the case of poor Dazed and Confused, an independent webmaster who's expected to be on call for his client at all hours of the day and night, but doesn't get paid for being on call, only for the 40 hours a week that he's in the office. Surprisingly, Annie throws cold water on the contractor's dreams of paid OT, citing these pearls of wisdom from an attorney who's apparently never had the 'privilege' of being a techie on call: 'Many companies see the on-call issue as analogous to a fire fighter's job. Most of the time, a fire fighter is off-duty but on call, hanging around the firehouse, cooking, sleeping, or whatever. What that person really gets paid for is the relatively small, but crucial, amount of time he spends walking into a burning building with an ax. A webmaster, likewise, has slow times and busy times.'" What on call policies are you used to working with and how should it work in an ideal world?

20 of 735 comments (clear)

  1. Well, then... by fyngyrz · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Here's the way I see it. Mr. Lawyer, you want to pay for support 40 hours a week? I'll give you a cellphone number I'll answer 40 hours a week.

    It is ridiculous to presume that offering the opportunity to interrupt one's life at any time, any place, with an overriding obligation to deal with your problems, has no value.

    Oh, you want the 168 hour phone number? Well, that's gonna cost ya...

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    1. Re:Well, then... by Deflagro · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Right, I'm sure Mr Lawyer wouldn't mind being on retainer for free either. We'll call you when we need you and pay you on the go.

      Firefighters get benefits though in that they are provided food and shelter at no cost and can practically live at the firehouse, albeit not something everyone would love to do :P

      I think if you expect someone to be at your every beck-and-call, then you need to pay them. At least give them some reason to care.

      --
      Der Tod ist der einzige Weg hier raus!
    2. Re:Well, then... by MrMr · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't understand that. If he's an independent webmaster it will cost him a non-paying customer, the kind you really can do without.
      If he is on the pay-roll he should probably join a union.

    3. Re:Well, then... by Delwin · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Have you ever heard of a webmaster union, or for that matter any IT/programming union?

      I haven't.

    4. Re:Well, then... by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 3, Insightful

      From my experience with unions, yea there are good reasons not to have an IT union.

      Suppress wages, defend the inept, petty crap during "bargaining" years, strong arming members, and take money away for political purposes.

      I was in a couple unions, two for IT in the public sector, I'm not a fan.

    5. Re:Well, then... by natehoy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "Independent Contractor". No such thing as a base salary.

      The trouble ensued when he was about to be laid off and his employer decided (instead of letting him go) to offer him a position as an independent contractor, paid at a rate of 40 hours a week in the office. He didn't realize that the position included being on call 24/7 with no compensation, even though his old salaried position had the same on-call responsibilities, and he signed up to do "the exact same job as before, only paid by the hour instead of on salary, with no benefits."

      The difficulty lies in the difference between an employer and a customer. As an independent contractor, his customer is not bound by the same labor laws as they were when he was an actual employee of theirs.

      His former employer is now his customer. The customer doesn't "have" to pay him jack for anything. They "have" to pay him what the contract between the two of them states. And in the absence of a written contract, if the conversation never came up about overtime or even straight-time pay for being on call or even handling calls, the customer is not liable for anything. They are paying for office time at 40 hours and he's giving them any additional time out of the office as part of the contract.

      His best bet, if he really wants to be paid for on-call, is to go and ask for the terms of his contract to be clarified/changed, at which point his customer will either negotiate with him to find an equitable arrangement, or they can also terminate his contract if they so choose.

      The question is not whether he's entitled to overtime for oncall duties. He's not. Sorry. He's offering a service at a set price and if he wants to change that he needs to work it out with his customer.

      The real question is whether it's worth the risk to him to renegotiate with his only customer in this sucky economy, because his customer might decide he's not the best vendor after all.

      If his skills are truly unique, he can probably work something out. If he's just monitoring a web server and doing things that can be done remotely, his customer might decide that it's cheaper to move the website into a monitored hosting provider.

      --
      "This post contains words, known to the State of California to cause thought. Wash brain thoroughly after reading."
    6. Re:Well, then... by ravenshrike · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You're in SWEDEN. Not the US. Attempting to compare the two systems, which have the same name but under the hood work off of entirely different precepts, is foolhardy.

    7. Re:Well, then... by Bill_the_Engineer · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If he's an independent webmaster it will cost him a non-paying customer, the kind you really can do without.

      Well...

      Having played both sides of this issue, let me throw some thoughts out to the wolves (so to speak):

      1. If he is asking slashdot on how to handle this, I doubt he is in a position to lose any customers.

      2. If the website is so problematic that he needs to be on call, then maybe he should make an effort to improve the reliability.

      3. I've had a few customers who used to call after hours for issues not related to the work I was doing. If the problem was small and can be done over the phone (or remotely) I usually helped them out for free. If the problem looked like it was going to take some time to fix or required me to drive to their location, I charged. If the problem could not wait until regular business hours, I charged accordingly. The trick was that I did enough gratis work for them, that they didn't flinch when I required payment for the particularly difficult problems...

      4. As the economy worsens, the number of competitors for your clients will increase. It's easier to work a little harder to keep a client, then it is to replace one.

      5. Keep in mind, that some advice given here on Slashdot are from those who wouldn't mind taking your client.

      --
      These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
    8. Re:Well, then... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It may in fact be US unions - there are historical ties between the labor movement and organized crime over here which helps explain some of the strong arm and machine politics issues that our unions have. There is also a very strong adversarial relationship with management. It probably also has something to do with our level of income imbalance as well - unions have to be more forceful to get the same results. That level of adversarial behavior colors other relationships, leading to the aforementioned protection of the incompetent rather than have the union work in better member's interests.

    9. Re:Well, then... by JWW · · Score: 4, Insightful

      While the Constitution has its flaws, I cannot fathom how horrible a "new" Constitution developed by our current political "leaders" would be. I believe that it would be too horrible to behold.

      The current political classes in DC need to be run out of town in total before we should even think of changing the constitution...

  2. There seems to be some confusion here... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Obviously, with all else equal, the guy who is 40 hours + on call needs to be paid more than the guy who is 40 hours only, unless we want to go back to the good old days of indentured servitude or something.

    However, it doesn't really much matter exactly how that extra money is delivered. It could be that "The job description of 'Job A' includes being on call, which is why people who do it earn a hefty salary" or it could be "'Job B' is 9 to 5; and time on call is X dollars/hour outside of that". That seems to be the point of confusion.

    1. Re:There seems to be some confusion here... by nine-times · · Score: 4, Insightful

      However, it doesn't really much matter exactly how that extra money is delivered. It could be that "The job description of 'Job A' includes being on call, which is why people who do it earn a hefty salary" or it could be "'Job B' is 9 to 5; and time on call is X dollars/hour outside of that". That seems to be the point of confusion.

      Exactly. The first question here should be, are we talking about a salaried position or an hourly wage? If it's a salaried position, then the salary should just be higher for taking on a job with the increased responsibility of being on call. "Being on call" should be part of the job description, and part of the negotiation for salary at hiring. If it wasn't and they ask you to be on call, then I think it's generally reasonable to say, "That wasn't part of my job description. If you want me to be on call, then I want a pay bump to go along with it."

      If it's an hourly wage, then again it needs to be negotiated. If it were me, I'd probably want a certain rate for working the normal 40 hour week, a different rate for being on call, and a third (relatively high) rate for work done outside of normal hours, while on call. If you want me to make an effort to ensure that I can be reached 24/7, I expect some kind of compensation. If you expect me to actually come in at 2am and work, then I expect to get paid more for that time than I get paid during the normal weekday.

      Of course, negotiating terms of employment can always be tricky. If you really like your job and don't mind being on call for the amount you're paid, then you might not want to push it. If you play hardball, it's possible they'll just let you go.

  3. NOT GONNA DO IT! by iplayfast · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I tried this once, but I hated being on a leash so much that I quickly found another job. It just wasn't worth my sanity.

    1. Re:NOT GONNA DO IT! by scamper_22 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      One the items often missed here is the exempt employees are supposed to be able to exercise judgment. It's a vague concept in many circumstances. However, if you are able to exercise judgment, you MUST be able to use the following word:

      NO.

      Do some companies make it hard to say no? Absolutely. Been there done that. But that is what you must do. If you are a worker bee that just takes instructions from management... you are not a professional and you should be paid overtimes.

      It's amazing to me the number of people who never even TRY to say no. I don't know how I'd act if my manager actually threatened to fire me for saying no. It's never happened. Granted, I am sure it has cost me in terms of promotions, bonuses... Perfectly fair if you ask me. Someone else is willing to work harder than me... they deserve it.

      I'm a pretty reasonable person. I'll put in some extra hours if a deadline is coming up. I'll do a late night call once in a while if there's an emergency. If I start to see a pattern... emergencies happening weekly... then it ain't an emergency and management had better start budgeting for that.

      And yes, we should all be grateful to have a job in this time. But never forget this is not a one way street. No employer is going to value you unless you value yourself.

      You know the code/equipment; you know the domain; you know the processes; you are known to do good work. You're worth something. If you leave, the company has to go find a replacement, train them, deadlines pushed back because a new person is coming in... and there's uncertainty if it works out... Chances are the company is understaffed as is... and losing you would just make things even more unmanageable. In short, value yourself. Don't overvalue yourself... anyone can be replaced :P

  4. A contractor? by Greg_D · · Score: 3, Insightful

    You want the opportunity to use my services at your convenience? Pay me a retainer equal to X hours a month. I work any more than X, you pay me an hourly rate. I work less than X, you still owe me for those hours.

  5. hospital model... by i.r.id10t · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Well, the firefighter mentioned is flawed - he is *at work* waiting for a call to come in. On call is not at work, but available should the shit hit the fan.

    The hospitals I worked in, the staff that were on call (CAT scan techs, nuke med techs, OR nurses, recovery room nurses, dialysis folks) were paid $1 or $2 per hour just for carrying the beeper. Should they get called in, they were guaranteed 2 hours of pay, but they had to stay waiting for something to do for that whole time (a CT tech could come in and scan someone in 10 min - but they then had to hang out and wait for the extra hour and 50 minutes). This pay was at regular pay rates/levels, so night shift differential or holiday differential kicked in, as would over time if their total for the pay week was over 40 hours.

    So... followign this, our poor over worked web master would be paid say $1/hr for totin his beeper or whatever. If he gets called, he comes in and fixes the issue, gets a minimum of 2 hours of work at his hourly rate, and probably gets over time. Sounds good. In reality, he's probably a salaried employee, so over time is out the window, and if he's lucky he may be allowed to leave 15 minutes early on Friday to make up for it.

    --
    Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos
  6. The point is that your time is not your own by Fished · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The problem is that, when you're "on call", your time is not your own. You're expected to be ready and able to drop everything at a moments notice and go to work, immediately. Furthermore, you can be limited as to where you can go, particularly in areas with poor cell phone coverage. Most employers I've worked with have given a day of "comp" time in exchange for a week on-call, although they've sometimes been a bit sketchy on actually doing this and on how you should report it. To me, it should be official, recognized, and fully compensated--but often it just happens at manager's discretion.

    --
    "He who would learn astronomy, and other recondite arts, let him go elsewhere. " -- John Calvin, commenting on Genesis 1
  7. Here is where the lawyer's analogy fails. by wcrowe · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Firefighters aren't just "hanging around the firehouse" when they're not putting out fires. They spend that time maintaining equipment, training, performing building inspections, and a lot of other duties. I'm sure municipal policies vary, but I'm certain that many firefighters work regular shifts, and when an emergency call extends beyond their regular shift they are paid overtime.

    --
    Proverbs 21:19
  8. Re:Paid call by KraftDinner · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I think you'll find many businesses do though.

  9. Re:Is Dazed and Confused really bad at his job? by geminidomino · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It seems you've never dealt with these kinds of people. :)

    Even if his system is rock solid, with "free 24/7 contact" (essentially what we're talking about here), one can expect calls at all hours of the day or night with such wonderful nuggets as these:

    "I know you're not the website-guy/guy who does the copy/whatever, but..."
    [SELECT]
    [OPTION] We'd really like to change the text on our About Us page ...
    [OPTION] The main page is off center on our senior partner's (320x200) screen
    [OPTION] The site is running really slow (9/10 times, some asshole in the office has eDonkey/Bittorrent going full blast)

    "... and ..."

    [SELECT]
    [OPTION] the website-guy is out of town
    [OPTION] the website-guy wants to charge us
    [OPTION] the website-guy isn't taking our calls since we decided not to pay him
    [OPTION] we trust your work more <====== My personal favorite. Get your waders out...