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$26 of Software Defeats American Military

reporter writes "A computer program that can be easily purchased for $25.95 off the Internet can read and store the data transmitted on an unsecured channel by an unmanned drone. Drones are crucial to American military operations, for these aerial vehicles enable Washington to conduct war with a reduced number of soldiers. '... the intercepts could give America's enemies battlefield advantages by removing the element of surprise from certain missions and making it easier for insurgents to determine which roads and buildings are under US surveillance.'"

92 of 534 comments (clear)

  1. IN soviet russia by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...you observe uav

    1. Re:IN soviet russia by lorenlal · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Mods. That comment may be redundant, it may be old and tired, but it is certainly not offtopic. In fact, in the grand scheme of frist psots!, it might be the most on-topic one I've seen in years.

  2. but what are the hardware costs? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Well, demodulating an unencrypted digital signal is not news.

    I am more interested in what kind of RF equipment one would need to capture it off the air.
    It's not like you can do this with your WiFi card. ;)

    1. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by brusk · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No, demodulating a signal is not news. But not encrypting it in the first place ought to be. (And TFA had a red herring in its focus on the software used to record the signal--the software is probably the easy part, once you've captured the signal).

      --
      .sig withheld by request
    2. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by Anpheus · · Score: 5, Funny

      Turns out the drones use bluetooth. Just the other day my laptop asked me to sync to one when I was put a pringles can on the antenna.

      "Windows has found a MQ-9 Reaper, would you like to connect?"

      At this point I was (a.) terrified and (b.) glad that somebody with some clout was going to do something about the increased crime in the area.

    3. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by StatureOfLiberty · · Score: 5, Funny

      Let me guess. GA-ASI (maker of the MQ-9 Reaper drone) makes voting machines too.

    4. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by AlexiaDeath · · Score: 5, Informative

      Reading the information in the article and deducting from the software used, all you need is satellite internet card, satellite dish and the SkyGrabber, a bit of software that records anything video like it finds in satellite data stream. Pretty much off the shelf hardware for a place with limited infrastructure.

    5. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by ArcherB · · Score: 5, Informative

      No, demodulating a signal is not news. But not encrypting it in the first place ought to be.

      (And TFA had a red herring in its focus on the software used to record the signal--the software is probably the easy part, once you've captured the signal).

      We were using SINCGARS in the early 90's. SINCGARS is a frequency hopping, encrypted method of voice communication. We were just starting to use it to network military vehicles and personnel with HQ and each other. If SINCGARS could have been cracked, it would have put a beacon on every vehicle and soldier on and off the battlefield, not to mention eavesdropping. However, the inventor of SINCGARS could not decrypt the signal without the software and hardware keys. The software keys were changed at will. Usually weekly, but could easily be done daily. I am shocked that this signal does not use better encryption and/or frequency hopping. This type of communication is critical to tomorrow's battlefield.

      --
      There is no "I disagree" mod for a reason. Flamebait, Troll, and Overrated are not substitutes.
    6. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by sycodon · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If they can prevent me from watching porn on cable and satellite, they should be able to prevent these guys from hijacking the video feeds from the UAVs.

      --
      When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    7. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by WeeLad · · Score: 5, Funny

      If you squint and have a vivid imagination, they can never stop you.

      --
      Seriously, Don't take anything I say seriously.
    8. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by sycodon · · Score: 2, Informative

      True! So True!

      --
      When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    9. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Simple explanation here.

      Back in the early days of this design, someone designated drone-originated video as unclassified. Otherwise there's no way in hell it would be unencrypted.

      This isn't an oversight - there's guaranteed a loooong paper trail going back to a conscious decision regarding the classification level of the drone video here, and following conscious decisions regarding the design.

      If you use encryption in a military system that is not NSA Type 1 approved, there's a LOT of paperwork required to prove that your encryption is not being used to protect classified information.

      Type 1 approved crypto is a royal pain in the ass. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_1_encryption

      It often proves significantly easier in terms of cost and paperwork to not encrypt than to prove that your encryption isn't being used to protect classified information. Security guys ask, "If it's unclassified, why are you encrypting it?", with "It's good design practice." resulting in massive beancounter agro.

    10. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by dov_0 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The hardware costs are not really so important when the military is concerned - even in otherwise poor nations the military can have some very expensive toys.

      If I could pick up the UAV's broadcast, I'd probably be far more interested in being able to overpower any control frequency long enough to crash the thing and/or stopping the signal getting back to base. I'd say the control signals are far more likely to be encoded than the vid stream, so selective frequency jamming would be the way to go.

      --
      sudo mount --milk --sugar /cup/tea /mouth /etc/init.d/relax start
    11. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by gandhi_2 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      No kidding.

      The SINCGARS is the standard today, though a few versions later.

      I flew RQ-11A Ravens in Iraq, and even THOSE aren't plain text transmitions. WFT?

      I'm sure a small mod will be pushed out now and the other UAV's will be encrypted and freq-hoping like it's no big deal.

    12. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by Xtravar · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Maybe they're purposefully sending incorrect video feeds unencrypted, and this story has been disseminated to lull the enemy into a false sense of security.

      --
      Buckle your ROFL belt, we're in for some LOLs.
    13. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by Grygus · · Score: 5, Funny

      Your comment that GA-ASI does not make voting machines has been recorded. Have a nice day!

    14. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by sycodon · · Score: 5, Funny

      What they SHOULD do is to substitute porn for the regular video feeds.

      They would either stop watching out of their sense of morality or NEVER stop watching.

      Win - Win situation.

      --
      When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    15. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by acklenx · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Just to be clear

      frequency hopping != encryption

      especially if you are the only transmitter in that spectrum nearby.

      --
      Never let a mediocre career stand in the way of a good time
    16. Re:but what are the hardware costs? by hax4bux · · Score: 2, Informative

      That's right. I'm not sure this is even a problem. So you can see the video. BFD. You know, the fun really begins when we start broadcasting bogus video. Much cheaper than launching real platform and just as fun.

      I worked on a UAV system in the mid 80's and we didn't encrypt anything (everybody remain calm:that was then, this is now). I did the entire RF system using off the shelf packet radio systems at 1200 baud. Encryption adds overhead and we were just a POC demo.

  3. Sh..... by jc42 · · Score: 5, Funny

    Don't tell the DoD. They've been paying $7,000 per license for that software.

    --
    Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    1. Re:Sh..... by gplus · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why are the military so goddam stupid? They have been transmitting video unencrypted ever since the Bosnia conflict. And apperantly they're still happily going on making same mistake as Joe Sixpack, setting up his new home wireless router.

      Don't they understand that even the weakest simplest encryption, is 1000 times better than none at all?

    2. Re:Sh..... by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yeah because being a computer engineering in the military is some how infinitely easier than in the private sector which allows the stupid kids to do it after school. They let just anyone fly jets too.

    3. Re:Sh..... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This is just my experience but I met some computer engineers with top secret clearance working at the DoD. They are so incompetent that it's scary. Even worse, they were contractors/consultants. I'm not saying all DoD computer engineers are idiots. The problem is the government is so incompetent that they've given much of the work to large consulting companies whose sole purpose is to fill as many seats as possible for the revenue.

    4. Re:Sh..... by gestalt_n_pepper · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Which is the problem with military outsourcing in general. The goal is "make a profit" instead of "protect the country."

      Halliburton is not in the defense business to defend. They're in the defense business to make money.

      --
      Please do not read this sig. Thank you.
    5. Re:Sh..... by kalirion · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think this has about as much to do with Army IT as IE vulnerabilities have to do with the Microsoft IT department.

    6. Re:Sh..... by blueturffan · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Not to be harsh about it, but think back to high school and college and ask yourself if you would describe the people who were planning military careers as the "best and brightest" of your class.

      I went to school with a guy that was student body president, captain of the basketball team, and valedictorian of his class. He went to the Air Force Academy, and after graduating won a Rhoades Scholarship. He has three master degrees, and graduated first in his class from flight school.

      He was (maybe still is) in command of the 89th Airlift Wing, which is responsible for flying and maintaining the planes that carry the president, vice president and other top U.S. officials. I believe he was recently promoted to Brigadier General.

      Yes -- I'd describe him as "the best and brightest". He also happens to be a very nice guy.

    7. Re:Sh..... by 5KVGhost · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "Halliburton is not in the defense business to defend. They're in the defense business to make money"

      What?! You mean to tell me that Halliburton, Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, and General Electric are not staffed by monks who've taken a vow of poverty?

      People who aren't in business to make money seldom manage to stay in business long enough to do anything at all. And I'd much rather contractors operate at a profit than be perpetual budgetary basket-cases like NASA.

    8. Re:Sh..... by HaZardman27 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I truly hope this is sarcastic, because the ignorance of this statement baffles me. To say the military is comprised only of self-serving individuals who seek some sort of sick pleasure from killing people is offensive to everyone who served or is currently serving. Military members don't get free food, clothes, or housing more than anyone else with a job does. There are allowances for these necessities that are simply an extension to a member's base pay, which for enlisted members would be terribly low otherwise. If you worked a minimum wage job for the same number of hours per week as an average military member, you would probably make more money than their monthly base pay.

      --
      Apparently wizard is not a legitimate career path, so I chose programmer instead.
    9. Re:Sh..... by Culture20 · · Score: 2, Informative

      They let just anyone fly jets too.

      Although it's not a jet, the top drone pilot is a 20 y/o kid whose only experience prior was video games.

    10. Re:Sh..... by Beardo+the+Bearded · · Score: 2, Informative

      I have to take exception to this. I work for a military contractor and I take my job very seriously. I know that there are men and women who are trusting me with their lives to do my job properly. They require me to do my job error-free. On-time, on-budget are nice but are, and always will be, secondary concerns.

      I get paid very well, I get a lot a nice benefits, and the atmosphere is excellent. (Hell, I even get to read /.!) The goal of any company is to make money, yes, but that's a fact of life. I expect to get paid. So does my mortgage company, my cable company, the water department, etc. I like my job and if I didn't have any expenses I'd do it for nothing. If I won the lotto, I'd still come in to work. (Which would be really weird since I don't buy tickets.)

      The company likes loyal employees because we have to be trusted with (get this) military secrets, we have to go through background checks, and we have to be ready, willing, and able to do our best. It's expensive to hire someone -- it takes months and thousands of dollars before you even get to the point when they can sit at a desk. Greedy employees are the ones who wouldn't mind sending certain documents to people who would pay "Top Dorrar". You don't want those kind of people.

      It's not a job that can be done by anyone. Yes, some of the stuff I'm doing can and likely will be used to kill someone. I spend a lot of time making sure that it's the bad guys and not the folks using the stuff. After all, if you've made the kind of choices where the military is shooting at you, it's probably not a big loss if we've got to kick you off the planet. If you've written the Blank Check to the government, then it's a terrible loss if I've fucked up and killed you by accident.

      --

      ---
      ECHELON is a government program to find words like bomb, jihad, plutonium, assassinate, and anarchy.
    11. Re:Sh..... by NiteShaed · · Score: 2, Insightful

      One lie, persistent on all battlefields in the history of humanity is: We're the good guys!

      Silly concentration-camp prisoners during WW2, falling for that lie and thinking the Allied forces were the good guys. Man, what a bunch of rubes, when clearly, according to you, they were no different than the Wehrmacht.
      Or did you really mean some battlefields, or "the occasional battlefield"?

      --
      Some bring out the best in others, some the worst. Some bring out far more.
  4. This is bullshit, guys. by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 5, Informative

    We need an OSS option stat. Nobody should have to give up their software freedom just to make a mockery of America's finest tech toys.

    The only question is, would this make more sense as an added option in wireshark, or GNU Radio?

    1. Re:This is bullshit, guys. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Ethereal is the old name. The lead dev lost access to the Ethereal trademark, and the project moved over to Wireshark.

    2. Re:This is bullshit, guys. by j-pimp · · Score: 5, Funny

      The only question is, would this make more sense as an added option in wireshark, or GNU Radio?

      Well to keep with the unix philisophy of small reusable components the following should be done:

      • libUAVSniff should be created on github
      • libUAVSniff should be developed. It should include a simple command line program for sniffinf UAV traffic and spew to stdout
      • Wireshark will add a module that uses this library
      • GNURadio will add a module that uses this library
      • Someone will fork it on github and write an irc bot that will post UAV locations
      • Someone will fork it on github and write a twitterbot
      • github forks for perl modules, .net/java wrapper, etc
      • A codeproject article explaining how to track UAVs and plot their location using silverlight.
      --
      --- Justin Dearing http://www.justaprogrammer.net/ We're just programmers.
    3. Re:This is bullshit, guys. by Coren22 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Yes, it was approximately the size of a UAV.

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
  5. $26 is a lot by gurps_npc · · Score: 5, Insightful
    How much is a bullet to the brain of the General commanding the war? But you need a trained sniper and an awfully good insertion to get that bullet there.

    Counting the cheapest part of the machine is silly.

    Software is often free. $26 is a lot for software. The radio reception, etc. and knowing where to aim are all much more expensive and require skill.

    --
    excitingthingstodo.blogspot.com
    1. Re:$26 is a lot by donscarletti · · Score: 3, Informative

      You really should attribute Blackadder when you quote it.

      Anyway, it was written for comedic effect rather than accuracy, generally in colonial wars British fought against people with guns, Zulus being a prime example of a group often depicted inaccurately without firearms or military organization, an insult to both sides of that conflict.

      --
      When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
    2. Re:$26 is a lot by c6gunner · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Tend to agree, especially since current strategy is to only pick fights with opponents one step above the stone age, then bomb them right back into it.

      If you're referring to Afghanistan, the US didn't pick that fight. If you're referring to Iraq, they are/were quite a few steps out of the stone age.

    3. Re:$26 is a lot by c6gunner · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yes, it did. Not that the Taliban didn't have it coming, but the USA was still the attacker.

      If your friend shoots one of my family members and then goes and hides in your house, I'm not picking a fight with you when I come to drag him out. If you decide to get in my way, that's your problem.

      The pathetic thing here is that Taliban, Al-Qaida and bin Laden are all still alive and at large, so it could be argued that the US actually lost, failing to meet its goals for the invasion.

      By the same logic, Germany and Japan still exist today so I guess the US lost in WW2, also. Good thinking!

      They do seem to be quite primitive, actually, considering how quickly their defense collapsed, and how few casualties the attacker suffered.

      Frankly, the US could probably roll over the Canadian military tomorrow, just as quickly, while suffering not many more casualties. I guess Canada is primitive too, huh?

      You're confusing American dominance for Iraqi incompetence, and then assessing their entire nation based on your misunderstanding. That's just silly.

    4. Re:$26 is a lot by IgnoramusMaximus · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If your friend shoots one of my family members and then goes and hides in your house, I'm not picking a fight with you when I come to drag him out. If you decide to get in my way, that's your problem.

      Well, its a fine demagoguery you got there, but the actual reality was that the Taliban demanded to see evidence of Bin Laden's responsibility before handing him over (remember that Bin Laden is just a "spiritual leader" - read: "pontificating bore that talks hell of a lot but hasn't actually done much directly" as opposed to other, more hands-on operatives who worked out of Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and, in the case of the 9/11 crew, Germany) and the USA flatly refused. Following which the USA invaded declaring any and all comers as "unlawful combatants" with no rights of any kind.

      So to keep your analogy straight, you have a case of my friend showing up at my house saying that you are gunning for him, following which you show up with a box of explosives and demand that I hand him over or else "because he did me wrong!". And when I say "hold on for a sec, what proof exactly do you have?" you say "I don't have to explain myself to a non-human like you, far beneath my superior Manifest Destiny self! What I say goes or else! You got 10 minutes to comply!" and then set the bomb off 5 minutes later, killing my wife and maiming my kids, following which you get the biker gang down the street to help you rummage through and "govern" the wreckage. And so now you have two mortal enemies instead of one and not exactly what could be called a "moral high ground".

      This is how the Afghanistan mis-adventure is seen by "the other side" and it is of little wonder that the fight will likely go on indefinitely, Taliban having quite a bit (and growing by many accounts) of local support and very able to present itself as the victims of a belligerent, arrogant, foreign, religiously-motivated, supremacist aggressor, victims who will defend their ancestral homeland, their religion and their "way of life" against that aggressor to the bitter end.

      I'd say the odds of "victory" in Afghanistan for the USA are pretty much on the same level as those of all the previous Empires ... not entirely zero but any Vegas slot machine looks like a guaranteed retirement plan by comparison.

    5. Re:$26 is a lot by c6gunner · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Well, its a fine demagoguery you got there, but the actual reality was that the Taliban demanded to see evidence of Bin Laden's responsibility before handing him over ... and the USA flatly refused.

      Your first mistake is assuming that operations against Al Qaeda in Afghanistan started in 2001. The rest of your argument is rendered moot by that mistake. The US has been operating in Afghanistan since the 90's, as a response to earlier Al Qaeda attacks. The 2001 invasion was just the final commitment in a much longer campaign.

      I'd say the odds of "victory" in Afghanistan for the USA are pretty much on the same level as those of all the previous Empires ... not entirely zero but any Vegas slot machine looks like a guaranteed retirement plan by comparison.

      That, of course, hinges on how you define "victory". If all we care about is maintaining majority control over the country and preventing it from being used as a staging area for further attacks against the west, then we've already won. The Taliban is now using Pakistan as a staging area for it's attacks in Afghanistan, and Al Qaeda is broke and mostly useless.

      Under any other reasonable definition we ... we haven't achieved all of the goals we've set for ourselves, but the odds of eventually meeting them are pretty much 100%. The opposite forces have no chance of achieving a military victory - the best that they can hope for is that we get bored and go home. As long as we're willing to stay, we can't lose. Unfortunately, it seems likely that we will decide to leave, largely due to opinions such as yours. I find that truly depressing. Seems like people didn't learn a damn thing from the American mistakes in the 80's.

    6. Re:$26 is a lot by IgnoramusMaximus · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Your first mistake is assuming that operations against Al Qaeda in Afghanistan started in 2001. The rest of your argument is rendered moot by that mistake. The US has been operating in Afghanistan since the 90's, as a response to earlier Al Qaeda attacks. The 2001 invasion was just the final commitment in a much longer campaign.

      Oh I see, so in addition to being the chief sugar-daddy and arms supplier to Al Qaeda throughout 1980s, the USA then proceeded to meddle directly and covertly in Afghanistan as soon as their "allies" won and the USSR withdrew, showing itself utterly duplicitous and untrustworthy to the locals ... and this is improving your case how exactly?

      That, of course, hinges on how you define "victory". If all we care about is maintaining majority control over the country and preventing it from being used as a staging area for further attacks against the west, then we've already won.

      By that token the Nazis "won" WWII in 1942 ... I mean they occupied and held a lot of territory at the time, "preventing it from being used as a staging area by the Allies", no?

      Under any other reasonable definition we ... we haven't achieved all of the goals we've set for ourselves, but the odds of eventually meeting them are pretty much 100%.

      Yes, the time-honoured way of getting your ass handed to you: "fail to declare coherent, logical and testable goals, bloviate endlessly about 'progress' and 'democracy' and whatever other abstract and nebulous feel-good concept you can come up with, declare 'victory' and skedaddle home holding your bruised posterior, having met 'your goals' 110%! - whatever those 'goals' morphed into in the end in order to be met 110%". You did not seriously think you are the first would-be conqueror to come up with this?

      The opposite forces have no chance of achieving a military victory - the best that they can hope for is that we get bored and go home.

      You have an interesting way of defining "boredom", apparently measured in trillions of dollars, thousands of wounded, dead and maimed on your side and many more on theirs...

      And yes, all the defenders have to do is to do what they always have done ... to outlast the latest Empire until it crawls back whence it came from. They have an ample precedent for that, although you are of course the Super-extra-specially-exceptional Empire, the American One, so everything will be oh-so-super-specially-extra-exceptionally different for you, despite no substantial changes in the general conditions of the whole affair. Just because America is oh-so-Speeeecial!

      As long as we're willing to stay, we can't lose

      Which is pretty much a guaranteed loss for the USA as the "will to stay" (translated to real-life measurements of mayhem and treasury) is far, far, lower than "their" will to outlast you - they are after all fighting for their homes, their "way of life" (as they see it) and their religion (and "zealot" is too kind a word to describe most of them) - and all that on top of their vastly disproportionately lower cost of warfare!

      Unfortunately, it seems likely that we will decide to leave, largely due to opinions such as yours.

      No, you will leave because that is the only thing you can do. The alternative is "total war" and utter bankruptcy of the US Empire. None of the previous empires left because of nay-sayers either, they left because staying further meant Imperial Collapse (and some, like the USSR, waited a tad too long). No amount of Rah-Rah cheer leading will change basic realities of Afghanistan and the logistics of foreign conquests.

      I find that truly depressing. Seems like people didn't learn a damn thing from the American mistakes in the 80's.

    7. Re:$26 is a lot by IgnoramusMaximus · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Seeing as how your very first sentence is a complete lie, I see no reason to wade through the rest of your comment. If you're honestly mistaken instead of intentionally deceitful, I suggest you do a bit of research and then come back here and post an apology and a detailed explanation of why you were wrong. Under those circumstances I would be willing to continue our discussion.

      Now this is a classic case of Projection! Accuse your opponent of the very thing you are doing and then try to escape pretending that somehow defending your lies is beneath your oh-so-high-moral-standards!

      Speaking of detailed explanations however... oh but you probably meant this whiny quote form the US government "The United States wanted to be able to deny that the CIA was funding the Afghan war, so its support was funneled through Pakistan's Inter Services Intelligence agency (ISI). ISI in turn made the decisions about which Afghan factions to arm and train, tending to favor the most Islamist and pro-Pakistan. The Afghan Arabs generally fought alongside those factions, which is how the charge arose that they were creatures of the CIA." - oh so everything is now so wonderfully clear! You did not hand the brown envelopes directly to Bin Laden, you had a middle man! Therefore you soooo absolutely absolved of any culpability, yes Siree! After all if one hires a middle-man, one is automatically innocent of anything that middle-man might have done in one's name ... unless of course you are not an American! Then all the rules change, naturally.

    8. Re:$26 is a lot by IgnoramusMaximus · · Score: 3, Interesting

      ... these guys were so great that they even managed to piss off IRAN. Of course they had to slaughter several thousand civilians and a bunch of Iranian diplomats in their own embassy to do it.

      Actually, this is typical US-centric ignorance showing, Taliban and Al Qaeda are both derivatives of Wahhabi Sunni Arabic Islam sect, while Iranians are not only Shiites but also Persian, not Arabs. Their language is Farsi, not Arabic. Taliban and Bin Laden were always at war with Iran, they consider Shiites to be "apostates". It is one of the reasons the US chose Saddam as its cat's-paw to attack Iran, he was (at least nominally) a Sunni and held deep contempt of all things Shiite, Iran in particular. Curiously, Saddam and Bin Laden were also at odds, mainly because Bin Laden saw Saddam's Iraq in the way of re-creating his utopian Caliphate, with the Caliph restored to Baghdad in its centre. Needles to say pretty much secular and socialist Saddam would not be welcome in the epicentre of the zealot paradise and Bin Laden had fatwas issued calling for Saddam's head to roll (which makes Dick Cheney's idiotic claims of Saddam - Al Qaeda cooperation truly comical).

      Also, the U.S. didn't have to provide proof of Osama's connection, and responsibility, for 9/11 attacks as he did that himself. If you can't trust the words from the horse's mouth then you're a hopeless tinfoil hatter. http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2004/10/29/binladen_message041029.html

      As I pointed out in another post, should Bin Laden not take credit, some other wacko (and most likely several of them at once) would. Bin Laden's main claim to fame is that the US chose him to be the "Celebrity Evildoer #1" single-handedly responsible for all evils globally, past, present and future. Needless to say this instantly gave him far greater credibility then all the others combined.

      It was in the interest of every radical loon to claim that he, and only he, was the "mastermind" of the most famous and successful terrorist foreign strike on the US soil. The instant ego expansion possibilities were just endless on this one for the Jihadists.

      I know that it's great when the U.S. is the bad guy,

      Actually, no, it is not great. We do not want you to be the "bad guy". In fact we'd rather that the US came to its senses and started to act like its actions were based on the great principles and traditions it always boasts about being at its core. The world would be a much better place for it than with the US as a hypocritical, back-stabbing, duplicitous, greedy, self-centred, arrogant bully it is acting like now.

  6. It doesn't defeat them by mysidia · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Defeating them would be gaining control of the drones (a really scary proposition)

    This seems to be an information leak.. something that ought to be fixable by using some sort of encryption.

    Or even by making slight changes to the stream format, since SkyGrabber seems to just be off-the-shelf software.

  7. Oh noes by OverlordQ · · Score: 4, Informative

    So they recorded unencrypted OTA video feeds? While yes, they probably should have been encrypted in the first place and . . .

    The U.S. government has known about the flaw since the U.S. campaign in Bosnia in the 1990s, current and former officials said. But the Pentagon assumed local adversaries wouldn't know how to exploit it, the officials said.

    Yea that's kinda bad and lazy of them,

    Senior military and intelligence officials said the U.S. was working to encrypt all of its drone video feeds from Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan, but said it wasn't yet clear if the problem had been completely resolved.

    they're fixing it.

    --
    Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
    1. Re:Oh noes by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm frankly more worried about "But the Pentagon assumed local adversaries wouldn't know how to exploit it, the officials said." than I am about this particular security vulnerability.

      Security vulnerabilities happen, and are unfortunate and need to be fixed, and we really should spend more time and resources on caring about them; but that is all manageable software/systems engineering stuff.

      Making important decisions on the basis of "Eh, our enemies are just ignorant mud farmers anyway, no problem", on the other hand, is colossally arrogant and extremely dangerous. Particularly, since the US currently has the world's highest tech and most expensive military, "Eh, they're just primitives, no problem" is a practically all-purpose dismissal of virtually any problem that you are too lazy to fix. That is a recipe for learning, the hard way, about every new asymmetric warfare trick.

    2. Re:Oh noes by couchslug · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It could be a deliberate ploy to manipulate what the enemy "sees". Why not have a "leak"?
      It's a bit like leaving USB keys around for the unsuspecting to pick up...

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    3. Re:Oh noes by Minwee · · Score: 4, Funny

      I'm frankly more worried about "But the Pentagon assumed local adversaries wouldn't know how to exploit it, the officials said." than I am about this particular security vulnerability.

      I believe that the technical term for that is "Security Through La-la-la-I'm-not-listening!"

      Although it has a long and glorious past filled with successes, it's still not a recommended way to secure anything more important than ordering a pizza.

  8. Time to copyright! by jsnipy · · Score: 5, Funny

    Perhaps the US can put an IP copyright on the data then sue anyone who looks at it without a licesnce! More money!

    --
    -- if you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine
  9. Seems Expensive by Clovis42 · · Score: 2, Funny

    I doubt a "terrorist" is the kind of person who would actually spend money on software. I know perfectly reasonable teenagers who access software for free all the time on this thing called the internet.

    --
    Clovis
    ^ Clovis, look! It's that guy you are!
  10. Anonymous Coward by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Perhaps the smart play would be to quietly encrypt actual data, while continuing to broadcast placebo or manipulated data in the clear.

  11. So instead of leaking this to the news... by a_nonamiss · · Score: 5, Insightful

    why didn't the DoD just start passing a fake feed from the drone? They could have added another encrypted channel for the real feed, which I would assume is trivial given the military's budget. Then pass fake data over the unencrypted channel. Sometimes disinformation to the enemy is far more valuable than real intelligence. I can see a bunch of jihadis sitting around watching a tv screen. "Look at those infidels. They are going to blow up the wrong building! Our secret base is 100 kilometers away! Say, does anyone else hear that noi..." [BOOM]

    --
    -Arthur
    Cave ne ante ullas catapultas ambules
  12. Hubris by mruizcamauer · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "U.S. military personnel in Iraq discovered the problem late last year when they apprehended a Shiite militant whose laptop contained files of intercepted drone video feeds. In July, the U.S. military found pirated drone video feeds on other militant laptops, leading some officials to conclude that militant groups trained and funded by Iran were regularly intercepting feeds." The Germans did not think the Poles could break their codes. The Japanese did not think the US and the Australians would break their codes. The British did not think Argentina would finish assembling the Exocets on their own without the French manuals or use them in a way differently than designed. The Afghan and Iraqi insurgents have the money and the brains to break into Western weapon systems, don't underestimate them (or the probable help from Iran, Syria, Korea, etc...) The prospect of getting killed is a powerful motivator.

    1. Re:Hubris by querist · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Never underestimate your opponent. Anyone who forgets that rule is doomed to failure. The safe rule is always to assume that your opponent is AT LEAST as well trained and capable as you are. You may be able to make intelligent suppositions regarding supplies and equipment, but never underestimate training, intelligence, and skill.

    2. Re:Hubris by westlake · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The Germans did not think the Poles could break their codes. The Japanese did not think the US and the Australians would break their codes.

      The problem was never breaking the codes.

      The problem was breaking the codes more or less instantaneously.

      You need time to frame and execute an appropriate response - and far too often the correct response will be to do nothing.

      Since to do anything will invite suspicion.

      Eavesdropping on the Rising Sun
        The Code War
      The Edison of Secret Codes

  13. RMS by Ukab+the+Great · · Score: 4, Funny

    Not all religious zealots with huge bushy beards who fight in jihads and live in caves and don't use commercial software are terrorists.

  14. Re:note to self: by AHuxley · · Score: 2, Informative

    The US is known for in the clear intel gathering. They only encrypt the stuff they are interested in after sorting, that way they can sort a lot of info, very fast. If the US had to fill the sky with crypto computers on sats the flow would slow. Best just to push raw packets to a safe area.
    The software CIA honeypot is Microsoft and people who use it networked.
    Just as Enigma was and crypto ag was.
    Skygrabber is a powerful filter system for a satellite dish. Passive and not networked.
    Mb some version of Rivet Joint can spot the satellite dishes?

    --
    Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
  15. Re:More important question by Fieryphoenix · · Score: 4, Insightful

    From what I could make out, it's just the video stream transmitted by the drone that's unencrypted, not communications that control the drone. The obvious reason this might be done is to save on the computational requirements onboard the drone by not making it encrypt the presumably immense data stream of the video. Decrypting the rest of the communication the drone receives is probably an order of magnitude less processing load, or even two.

    If received and understood by the enemy in a timely manner, very useful information. But if it is just the image unencrypted and not GPS coordinates, etc, the enemy would have to have enough people watching the feeds to recognize the terrain that was being photographed... it's easy to see why this might not be considered likely and lead to the poor judgement to leave it unencrypted when the drones were designed, many years ago with less powerful processors available.

  16. Re:Seriously would it have been difficult by Eivind · · Score: 4, Informative

    It should've been encrypted, for sure. Agreed.

    However, it does need to be encryption that works over a noisy channel, with possible gaps in the datastream. Your typical block-cipher using chaining thus doesn't qualify. (If you wonder why, try encrypting a one-megabyte file, then change a few characters randomly in the first half of the file, then decrypt it)

    It's still not a hard problem mind you, just slightly more so than "grab AES, set it to CBC-mode"

  17. Some real kneejerk reactions above by Kupfernigk · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Really this is a huge fuss over nothing, and some of the more wacko conspiracy theories about CIA honeypots and the like (above) are just as silly as the "shoot General Atomics" mob.

    Is there any real security risk in this? I suspect it is very small. The Russians never bothered to encrypt the telemetry on their ICBM tests, because after all even assuming someone was reading it, they had no way of stopping the thing. Even if you know where the drone is, it is going to be very hard to shoot down; RPGs and IEDs really aren't much use. And given that this is a video feed, how do you ray trace back to the actual position of the camera?

    Unfortunately there are plenty of assholes out there who will exaggerate anything in order to claim that they are more security conscious than the next person (and perhaps hope to get a contract for their company). But this is surely small war, no-one dead, move along please.

    --
    From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
    1. Re:Some real kneejerk reactions above by Registered+Coward+v2 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Unfortunately there are plenty of assholes out there who will exaggerate anything in order to claim that they are more security conscious than the next person (and perhaps hope to get a contract for their company). But this is surely small war, no-one dead, move along please.

      And those same people don't know (or remember) the first rule of intelligence:

      Those who know, don't talk. Those who talk, don't know.

      --
      I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
    2. Re:Some real kneejerk reactions above by OzPeter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Is there any real security risk in this? I suspect it is very small.

      The risk to this is not a danger to troops. The risk of this is having a completely un-edited video source available to people who would have a field day if the official US proclamation of what happened was visibly different from the recorded video stream

      --
      I am Slashdot. Are you Slashdot as well?
    3. Re:Some real kneejerk reactions above by Mr+44 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The risk to this is not a danger to troops. The risk of this is having a completely un-edited video source available to people who would have a field day if the official US proclamation of what happened was visibly different from the recorded video strea

      Awesome point! And of course, since they've had access to these feeds for over a year, can we then assume that there hasn't been an incident where showing the footage would have disproved the US version of events?

      Of course, they would be hestitant to tip thier hand that they've got access to the footage, but if they really caught us in a lie, don't you think they'd show it?

  18. you have a good point by circletimessquare · · Score: 4, Insightful

    furthermore, there's nothing to say they still can't do that, or aren't actually doing that already. in fact, a big story in the international press about how dumb the military is on these video feeds is a good cover. one can hope, anyways, that the military is smarter than depicted in this story

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
  19. Re:All your drone are belong to us by HateBreeder · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Sensationalist... i would expect this from a tabloid.

    Title should have been: Unencrypted data broadcasted everywhere ... can be received by anyone!

    The leap from that to "$26 of Software Defeats American Military" is quite a big leap in my opinion.

    --
    Sigs are for the weak.
  20. Can't add encryption? by RealErmine · · Score: 3, Interesting

    From TFA:

    The difficulty, officials said, is that adding encryption to a network that is more than a decade old involves more than placing a new piece of equipment on individual drones. Instead, many components of the network linking the drones to their operators in the U.S., Afghanistan or Pakistan have to be upgraded to handle the changes.

    As an engineer in the defense industry and with experience integrating communication systems, I can't even think of one military data radio system in use that doesn't have encryption ability. Even if they are using off-the-shelf wifi (doubtful) they wouldn't need to change hardware to at least have some encryption. Either this quote is a lie, or someone did something monumentally stupid.

    --
    Dewey, you fool! Your decimal system has played right into my hands!
    1. Re:Can't add encryption? by decsnake · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As an engineer in the defense industry you probably also know how long defense systems live and how hard it can be to get upgrades pushed out into the field. It wouldn't surprise me at all if it wasn't technically feasible to encrypt the video stream at the time this system was first deployed and since then upgrading it has never been a priority for anyone with enough clout to make it happen. Now that its on SecDef's radar how long do you think its gonna take before this gets fixed?

  21. Famous Last Words... by DarthVain · · Score: 5, Funny

    "Hey I can see my house from here! Oh Wai..."

  22. Re:All your drone are belong to us by TheRaven64 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Damn straight. There's Free Software that can do it!

    --
    I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  23. Gung ho by sjbe · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Not to be harsh about it, but think back to high school and college and ask yourself if you would describe the people who were planning military careers as the "best and brightest" of your class.

    Ahh, you are thinking of the one or two guys who were all gung ho but not especially bright and had delusions about being a badass commando. Yeah, my school had some too. See the thing is though that those guys aren't the guys running the military. The guys you are thinking of end up as infantry grunts or something similar and exit the service after a few years. I have a cousin who is one of those guys. Smart but classic ADHD and socially stunted and not someone I'd trust right now to be in charge of anything. But he served two tours in Iraq and now he's in college so I have hope for him.

    The guys in the officer corps (commissioned and higher level NCO) are almost invariably bright and hard working and most of them that I've ever met didn't talk much about their interest in the military. I have a classmate who is a major in the US Navy who never gave the slightest hint he was interested in a military career. He was quiet, very smart, and I would have guessed he'd be an engineer but instead he's become a heck of a good officer. I have a number of friends who were graduates of West Point and Annapolis and I've been impressed as hell by each one of them. Smart, incredibly disciplined, and I'd hire any one of them in a heartbeat.

    The US military is an incredibly complicated and large organization with huge budgets, difficult goals, and a huge workforce. If you think managing all that is easy and doesn't require tremendous skill, you are delusional. Sure they make mistakes just like any other large organization but their mission is also more complicated than most and if they fail, people die.

    1. Re:Gung ho by sxltrex · · Score: 2, Interesting

      To second your post, my best friend is a Major in the Marine Corps (F-18 pilot). He has an engineering degree from Penn and is one of the smartest, most dedicated people I know. His roommate (also a Major and F-18 pilot) has a bachelors and masters degree in electrical engineering from Stanford. Sure, some dumbass people manage to climb up the ladder, but most of the people at that rank and above are pretty darn sharp.

    2. Re:Gung ho by RxScram · · Score: 3, Informative

      Regarding your classmate who is a "Major" in the US Navy... The Navy does not have a rank called Major. So, either your classmate is a Major in one of the other 3 branches of the military (Army, Air Force, or Marine Corps), or he is a Lieutenant Commander in the Navy.

    3. Re:Gung ho by sjbe · · Score: 2, Informative

      The Navy does not have a rank called Major.

      Quite right. Brain fart on my part. He's an O-4 which in the Navy is Lt Cmdr. Most of the military guys I know are in the other branches so I transposed...

  24. Proprietary software by pmontra · · Score: 3, Interesting
    From TFA:

    Predator drones are built by General Atomics Aeronautical Systems Inc. of San Diego. Some of its communications technology is proprietary, so widely used encryption systems aren't readily compatible, said people familiar with the matter.

    No more words needed.

    1. Re:Proprietary software by MrMickS · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Must be good to live in a world where all life's problems can be solved by OSS software. Sadly, life just isn't that simple.

      --
      You may think me a tired, old, cynic. I'd have to disagree about the tired bit.
    2. Re:Proprietary software by TubeSteak · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Must be good to live in a world where all life's problems can be solved by OSS software. Sadly, life just isn't that simple.

      They didn't have to use OSS.
      How about using established standards?
      Then the Army can drop in some off the shelf fix instead of having
      to pay their sole vendor to custom code/design new software/hardware.

      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
  25. Yawn by mea37 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    $26 software defeats American military? OMG, we've been beaten?

    Oh, wait... you're just saying that insurgents have a tactical advantage in some missions because they've exploited a security vulnerability using $26 software. So maybe $26 software used as weapon aganist US military?

    Ah... but the military discovered the problem in the field, and is working to plug the security hole. $26 software annoys American military temporarily.

  26. security through obscurity... by cadience · · Score: 2, Informative

    ...never works. This has been known for nearly two decades (TFA): "The U.S. government has known about the flaw since the U.S. campaign in Bosnia in the 1990s, current and former officials said. But the Pentagon assumed local adversaries wouldn't know how to exploit it, the officials said."

  27. And What If Al-Qida Sees A Beat Cop Overhead? by LifesABeach · · Score: 2, Funny

    Why not use the Drones as a way to help folks? Afghanistan does not need an Aggressor Sniper Team for every flat tire problem. How about applications like Snow Fall Levels? Lake Levels? Traffic? Crop Pests? River and Lake Levels? Civil Engineering Project Completions? Sometimes just walking up to the person and saying, "Would you please stop flipping off the Reapers as they fly by. To Americans it means 'I going to empty my bladder'."

  28. Re:All your drone are belong to us by c6gunner · · Score: 2, Funny

    Obviously they don't think it's a big issue. And they're right. What's the worst case scenario here?

    Last words overheard from an Al Qaeda satellite-intercept house: "Hey, look, I'm on TV!"

  29. Re:Seriously would it have been difficult by mdarksbane · · Score: 3, Insightful

    And of course these drones have been operating for years, and have to withstand conditions well beyond what any off the shelf parts are rated for. Doing good crypto in a small package wasn't quite as easy twenty years ago when these were in development.

  30. Re:Seriously would it have been difficult by QuoteMstr · · Score: 4, Insightful

    series of one-time-pads

    ...

    It can be repeating

    You are a dangerous fool. Never use a one-time pad more than once, even for "light" security. Doing that turns the whole thing into a Vigenère cipher and destroys all security. You might as well just XOR each byte of the message with 0x42.

  31. Re:Seriously would it have been difficult by nobodylocalhost · · Score: 2, Informative

    Private companies were much better, until they started outsourcing to India. It's amazing how economy can work for you and against you at the same time isn't it?

    --
    Where is the "Ignorant" mod tag?
  32. Re:All your drone are belong to us by BlueBoxSW.com · · Score: 2, Informative

    I agree. I expect better from Slashdot, but they seemed to have turned their headline writing over to the DrudeReport.

    What they don't say is that this report going back to January of this year, and that the military has been working on fixing the problem since then. They "hackers" can only pick up the video signal, not other info, and could not control the drones, which is what is implied from the headline.

    I do think it is embarrassing and kind of hard to imagine that you couldn't see this coming, especially with North Korea regularly developing and selling anti-US technologies. This should have been in the design, or at least identified as a risk.

  33. Sounds like a honey-pot to me by Locke2005 · · Score: 2, Funny

    1) Spread rumors that cheap software can defeat Predator drones.
    2) Offer software for sale on the internet.
    3) Include tracking device with every copy of software sold.
    4) Trace every shipment to it's destination.
    5) Send Predator drone to attack destination.

    Yep, sounds like a winning plan to me!

    --
    I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
  34. Re:Seriously would it have been difficult by QuoteMstr · · Score: 3, Informative

    A Vigenère cipher generates ciphertext C(N) by passing plaintext symbol P(N) through the function E(P(N), K[N mod len(K)]), where N is the symbol number of the input, K is the key, K[Q] is the Qth symbol in K, and E is a function such that E(A,B) -> A', and E(A',B) -> A. Decryption simply applies the same function to the ciphertext, yielding the original plaintext.

    This description clearly applies to XOR with a random pad. What makes a one-time pad secure is that the key is always longer than the input, so attacks that depend on correlation don't work. Conversely, Vigenère is insecure because the key repeats. Used with a random "key" as long as the message, Vigenère is equivalent to XOR, and is provably and perfectly secure.

  35. Re:Seriously would it have been difficult by ImprovOmega · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Well, bear in mind that it's probably sending the video signal compressed in the first place, and compression is just as prone to catastrophic errors as encryption is. It's encoded either way. As others in this thread have mentioned, you just do some error correction and carry on. Encapsulate the encrypted payload with some kind of error handling stream.

  36. Okay, so they transmit unencrypted... by Interoperable · · Score: 2, Interesting

    that's quite worrisome. I really hope that they only receive encrypted data or, at the very, very least, need some sort of secure authentication that can't be easily falsified. If you could transmit to the drones with $30 software and have them listen, I would be absolutely terrified.

    --
    So if this is the future...where's my jet pack?
  37. Germans had great confidence in ENIGMA by tjstork · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The Germans had great confidence in ENIGMA as well. But, the Allies could read it and it made us look stupid. Granted, cracking some of the current Allied codes would require a fundamental breakthrough in computing - like a proof that P=NP and the utility to solve these problems, but...

    What if the Chinese had it?

    We would be screwed.

    --
    This is my sig.
  38. Re:Appearantly, not much by Anachragnome · · Score: 3, Informative

    Warning:

    Comment in first link warns not to trust uploader. Possible nasty shit instead of actual App.

    And, no, I am not going to find out...The last thing I want is the feds kicking in my door. Keeping the article in mind, I suspect the Government will be closely watching these torrents now (if they haven't already been doing so. Wouldn't surprise me if the whole story is a government plant to smoke out tourists...erm, terrorists).

    I apologize for the self-response, but felt it was warranted.

  39. Re:Seriously would it have been difficult by meringuoid · · Score: 3, Informative
    Ok, so then how trivially can you decrypt this?

    Telling me the key length is a big hint. But 5,632 bytes is only about 11 repetitions of your key. That means I have 512 separate Caesar ciphers to crack, with a ciphertext of 10 or 11 characters each. Even Sherlock Holmes needed more than that to solve the puzzle of the Dancing Men.

    Feel free to carry on using your not-so-one-time pad, though. The larger the data set relative to the key, the easier it gets. Once you give the attacker enough data to make frequency analysis possible on the 512 separate Caesar ciphers, then your Vigenere cipher is gone.

    --
    Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.