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Jaron Lanier Rants Against the World of Web 2.0

hao3 writes "In his new book, You Are Not A Gadget, former Wired writer Jaron Lanier bemoans what the internet has become. 'It's early in the twenty-first century, and that means that these words will mostly be read by nonpersons,' it begins. The words will be 'minced into anatomized search engine keywords,' then 'copied millions of times by some algorithm somewhere designed to send an advertisement,' and then, in a final insult, 'scanned, rehashed, and misrepresented by crowds of quick and sloppy readers.' Lanier's conclusion: 'Real human eyes will read these words in only a tiny minority of the cases.' He goes on to criticise Google, Wikipedia, Facebook, Twitter, open-source software and what he calls the 'hive mind.'"

16 of 231 comments (clear)

  1. maybe.... by pitje · · Score: 4, Insightful

    it just could be that nobody is interested in what he has to say?

  2. Whining about folk-art webpages... by captainpanic · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In the early days when roads were invented, they were winding romantic sand paths through lush forests, over hills and through valleys, following the path of the creek.

    Now, 6-lane highways cut through mountains - but hey, they can get you from A to B in less than no time.

    If you like to make an original website, this is still possible. You CAN still have your own site, do all the html yourself. Alternatively, you can also spend less than 10 minutes to get your blog online, or less than 15 to have a photo album online.

    Thing is - where the masses previously had no websites, they now have a facebook account... which is equally empty as no website at all. But internet did not lose anything - it just didn't gain anything either.

    1. Re:Whining about folk-art webpages... by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "If you like to make an original website, this is still possible."

      I think his bigger issue is that nobody is doing that anymore, so it is becoming impossible to find such things. Maybe he has weird taste or memory distortion, though, because my memory of personal web pages from the 90s is of horrible marquee text, blink text, animated gifs, and black backgrounds without hundreds of different colors in the text.

      "Thing is - where the masses previously had no websites, they now have a facebook account... which is equally empty as no website at all. But internet did not lose anything - it just didn't gain anything either."

      Actually, it did lose something: openness. Facebook is closed off to anyone without a Facebook account, which is definitely a change from the way things used to be done. Sure, there were places that you had to log in to in order to participate during the 90s, but I have trouble remembering websites that required a login just to see what users had posted.

      --
      Palm trees and 8
    2. Re:Whining about folk-art webpages... by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "That is a feature, not a bug. It is one of the things that make it rather successful. I dont want any random jackass viewing my profile."

      Well, I have to wonder what you are posting that has you so worried about individual people seeing it. Look, I am with you on privacy being important, but why focus on individuals? Facebook does not hide your information from the large organizations that really have the power to invade your privacy.

      "Yeah, yeah, yeah, information wants to be free and I shouldn't put it on the internet if I dont want all to see it."

      Pretty much; why would you post something online, with no encryption whatsoever, if you wanted to keep it between you and your friends? Also, why, if this is personal information between you and your friends, would you need to use the global Internet at all? Do you not see your friends in person? Are you and your friends incapable of using email?

      Really, the whole situation sounds bizarre from where I sit. You have this information that you believe should remain between you and your friends, so you post it on a massive, global network and rely on a massively popular, international website with hundreds of millions of users and a history of failing to respect privacy, to ensure that the data is only accessible by your friends. Yeah, I know Facebook is popular and trendy and whatnot, but I really cannot see why you would post information on Facebook that you did not want to spread beyond a close circle of friends.

      "Well, guess what--I dont want everybody to see it, I only want people I invite to see it. If I can't use the internet for that purpose, what can I use?"

      Well, you could do what I do: show your pictures off to your friends when they are sitting next to your computer, talk to them in person, and engage in non-electronic social interactions. For friends in far away places, there is email, IM, telephone, etc., none of which runs the risk of some "random jackass" stumbling across your conversation (unless the jackass is trying to eavesdrop, but do you really think Facebook is going to protect you from such people?).

      --
      Palm trees and 8
  3. Insulting the people who made him by petes_PoV · · Score: 3, Insightful
    The hypocrisy!

    This guy got his reputation from our technology - now he goes around insulting the people who read his gushings.

    misrepresented by crowds of quick and sloppy readers

    It sounds like he has become altogether too precious about his own opinions and superiority (in his own mind, at least) and forgets that every printed word he's ever made money from has gone through exactly the same process of being edited, distributed and read (and possibly mis-understood - but isn't that HIS failure, not the reader's?) as the electronic texts he is so critical of.

    --
    politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
  4. Re:Isn't It... by gzipped_tar · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Web 1.0 was all about connecting people. It was an interactive space, and I think Web 2.0 is of course a piece of jargon, nobody even knows what it means. If Web 2.0 for you is blogs and wikis, then that is people to people. But that was what the Web was supposed to be all along. -- Tim Berners-Lee

    --
    Colorless green Cthulhu waits dreaming furiously.
  5. Not going to read it by paiute · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I did not RTFA, and I will not RTFA. My spidey sense tells me what is in it (and in the book, which I will also not R) - a needlessly long piece of prose which can be summarized as : Get off my virtual lawn. and Gee, everything was so much better when I was young.

    --
    If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine
  6. Whine by zieroh · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Jaron whines a lot. I think that's his main contribution to technology.

    --
    People who say "sheeple" have about as much sophistication as an AOL user, and in fact are probably actually AOL users.
  7. Re:Worse than DRM by vlm · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "We should effectively keep only one copy of each cultural expression--as with a book or song--and pay the author of that expression a small, affordable amount whenever it's accessed."

    I should pay my plumber every time I flush, forever. And, I should pay some carpenter every time I go up or down "their" stairs. Its not fair that they don't have a perpetual revenue stream from work they did in the past.

    --
    "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
  8. Reminds me of Clifford Stoll by weave · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Clifford Stoll

    Remember him? And his book Silicon Snake Oil from the mid-90s about the evils of the new Internet.

    What does he do now? Makes weird bottles. Wow.

    Yesterday my boss was pissed because his new Mac laptop with Snow Leopard wouldn't work with his old Laserjet 1020. A few minutes on Google and I found the solution.

    I remember what it was like finding tech info in the 80s. A nightmare. For example, I wanted some tech books on CANDE, WFL, and ALGOL that a Burrough's mainframe that my university used and was told by the publisher that they'll only ship if I proved I was an employee of a firm that owned one.

    Keep your romance about the past to yourself. Adapt or die I say.

  9. How many would have read, w/o the web? by Mathinker · · Score: 3, Insightful

    He rants, but one wonders how many human people he would have expected to read his words in a world before the Web, where he wouldn't get free publicity on Slashdot by spouting anti-techno rants.

    Disclaimer: I also didn't read. And unless some other poster here convinces me it's worthwhile, I probably won't.

  10. The New Printing Press by netsavior · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The Printing press made READING accessible to everyone (eventually), "web2.0" or whatever is making WRITING accessible to everyone, it is a giant leap, but unfortunately leads to a lot of crap published, like the article linked in parent.

  11. Re:Worse than DRM by ceoyoyo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Maybe we need to go back to art's roots - a patron system. Except instead of a single rich guy to be your patron, you could have a legion of adoring fans who are all willing to give you $1 to finance your next album. Once it's finished, the music is released into the public domain.

    If you were a decent act I don't think you'd have too much trouble getting fans to donate. And when you lost your touch you'd be retired.

  12. These posts are a good example by beegeegee · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The article is a Slate review of a collection (book) of writings by Lanier. The review concludes in a non-sympathetic view of Lanier's thinking. In other words, if anyone on /. had bothered reading the article, their (by comparison) lame posts would not have been neccessary. Ironically, this is exactly the point Lanier is making. No one is reading the real words, no one is making real friends; it is all an artificial world constructed for advertising/marketing. Way to go slashdotters.

  13. Re:Can someone summarize this? by Tezcat · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I wouldn't call them unique to the internet. Paper journalists bemoaned the TV news as a bite-size summary of real news, and then as a torrent of summary when 24-hour news networks rolled around.

    In fact, weren't there plenty of people complaining about the growth of first the printing press and then mass-production novels and comic strips? Writers of all stripes seem to have a notion of the 'sanctity of information'... or at least the authority of their opinion.

  14. the irony by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The irony here is that this thread is a perfect example of what Lanier's been talking about. A group of people with self-reinforcing attitudes making pronouncements based not on the actual book, but on a review of the book. Actually, I bet most of these "opinions"--since who can be bothered to read an entire review, let alone the book--aren't even informed by reading the review. I'm sure there are lots of valid criticisms to the book, but Lanier has you all dead to rights as far as the intellectual seriousness of this "debate" goes.