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Why the First Cowboy To Draw Always Gets Shot

Posted by timothy on from the more-guns-less-crime dept.

cremeglace writes "Have you ever noticed that the first cowboy to draw his gun in a Hollywood Western is invariably the one to get shot? Nobel-winning physicist Niels Bohr did, once arranging mock duels to test the validity of this cinematic curiosity. Researchers have now confirmed that people indeed move faster if they are reacting, rather than acting first."

28 of 398 comments (clear)

  1. Unforgivable! by mcgrew · · Score: 4, Insightful

    They explained that in Unforgiven

    Wrter: "But what if he draws first?"

    Sheriff: "Then he'll miss. You see, you can only draw, aim, and shoot so fast. Me, this is about as fast as I can draw my gun and hit anything smaller than a barn. The guy that keeps a cool head, he'll come out standing."

    That was from memory and is obviously not word for word, but the gist is there. It makes sense to me.

    --
    Free Martian Whores!
    1. Re:Unforgivable! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      So Han Solo Did shoot 2nd! heh :D

    2. Re:Unforgivable! by ViViDboarder · · Score: 4, Interesting

      This is the opposite of what the article is saying...

      The article says that the first person to draw will be the last one to pull the trigger, but the one reacting (drawing second after seeing the first person draw) will draw and pull the trigger quicker but they are less likely to get a hit.

    3. Re:Unforgivable! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Just my opinion though...my apologies if that is way more stupid than it was in my head.

      No worries. The only thing you might need to apologize for is the use of the cringe-inducing pseudo-word "prolly" in an otherwise coherent, grammatically-correct, and typo-free post.

    4. Re:Unforgivable! by Translation+Error · · Score: 4, Informative

      Actually, in the last paragraph it concluded that the increased reaction speed wasn't great enough to offset starting later. The research team believes that Bohr, the man who conducted the first experiments on the subject and won every time when drawing second, was simply much better than his opponent.

      --
      When someone says, "Any fool can see ..." they're usually exactly right.
    5. Re:Unforgivable! by mcgrew · · Score: 4, Funny

      Seems odd, and just a tad self serving, for Unforgiven to have an explanation for a cheesy writer's ploy

      It's obvious you never saw the movie. There was a damned good reason it got all those Oscars. It was realistic and believable, a VERY well written flick. Few movies at all are as good.

      As a nerdy bonus, Saul Rubenik played the writer; he was on an episode of ST:NG.

      As a double bonus, it has hookers.

      --
      Free Martian Whores!
    6. Re:Unforgivable! by roman_mir · · Score: 5, Funny

      that's not a Troll, that was clever.

      Didn't you see what the parent did to the grand parent? Grand parent drew first, then parent responded with a more precise comment.

      I think grand parent is dead now, Jim, killed by the AC.

      --
      You can't handle the truth.
    7. Re:Unforgivable! by Sechr+Nibw · · Score: 5, Funny

      Jayne: "Don't much see the benefit in getting involved in strangers' troubles without a upfront price negotiated."
      Book: "These people need assistance. The benefit wouldn't necessarily be for you."
      Jayne: "S'what I'm sayin'."
      Zoe: "No one's gonna force you to go, Jayne. As has been stated -- this job's strictly speculative."
      Jayne: "Good. 'cause I don't know these folks. Don't much care to."
      Mal: "They're whores."
      Jayne: "I'm in."

    8. Re:Unforgivable! by mcgrew · · Score: 5, Informative

      Actually, no, not if you've read the history of the old west. There were a LOT of black cowboys, perhaps as many as white ones, although you wouldn't know it from western movies. A cowboy himself was looked down on, it was a vocation you took if it was the only work you could get. And back then, damned near everyone was discriminated against. A laughable but realistic line from Blazing Saddles: "OK, we'll take the niggers and the chinks, but NOT THE IRISH!"

      They would have been far more predjudiced against the black man's wife, who was native American. Nobody was hated more than them, the Chinese came in a distant second, followed by the Irish immigrants.

      Now, had it taken place in the deep south rather than the northwest, you would be correct. In, say, Alabama a black man would indeed have been a "nigger". But in the plains, not so much.

      --
      Free Martian Whores!
    9. Re:Unforgivable! by pcolaman · · Score: 5, Funny

      Apparently Jack Bauer was not factored into the equation. In less than 8 days (seasons) he has killed almost 100 people.

    10. Re:Unforgivable! by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 4, Informative

      All this blabbery is fine, except quick draw artists proved decades ago that there's no way in hell you can, in fact, outdraw someone by reacting to seeing them start first.

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    11. Re:Unforgivable! by Shakrai · · Score: 4, Informative

      "Who wins" falls into another hollywood myth: that people fall down when you shoot them. They don't neccessairily. They may be shot several times and still returning fire.

      People don't fall down when you shoot them unless you destroy the nervous system (headshot for you gamer types) or they fall down because of the shock of being hit.

      Shock is a variable factor and can not be counted on to stop someone. Some people will fall down screaming after being shot in the arm. Others will absorb multiple shots that ultimately prove to be fatal, yet continue to fight until their blood pressure drops low enough that they pass out. The 1986 FBI shootout is a good example of this.

      There are only two surefire ways for a bullet to stop someone. It can destroy/disable the nervous system or it can cause enough blood loss that they physically can't keep functioning. The former is problematic because it's exceedingly difficult to hit such a small target when the adrenaline is pumping and your life is on the line. The latter is problematic because even if you destroy the heart or sever a major blood vessel, they will still have at least 15 seconds of willful activity before they are stopped.

      There's a reason why police officers are trained to shoot center of mass and to keep on shooting until the person goes down. Remember that the next time you see a headline like "Cops shoot man 12 times".

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    12. Re:Unforgivable! by JMandingo · · Score: 4, Interesting

      A bunch of buddies of mine played paintball in the woods, and after months of nagging I bought some cheap used equipment and joined them. My buddies were high school jocks, and one of the guys they played with had been in the army. The army guy sized me up and made a snide comment, and when they picked teams I was picked last and ended up on the team opposite him. That very first game I personally knocked their entire team out.

      In the months that followed I played with them many weekends, and everyone soon acknowledged that I was the deadliest player there. I has shot real guns previously I was as accurate a shot as I could be with my cheap paintball marker. More importantly I have read a lot of WW2 books and I have played a lot of first person shooter games and I had a good layman's understanding about suppressing fire and flanking. Often I would let the rest of my team rush in first to draw fire while I moved around the edge a bit to study the other team's positions. Many of my kills were a single shot from the side or from behind at very close range while the target was otherwise distracted. Even when a match was down to one on one, once I got the opponent to duck behind cover I could approach their position obliquely, keeping him suppressed with bursts of fire, until I had the angle to get in a kill shot.

      Then one weekend came where a bunch of serious "speedball" players joined us. My tactics weren't any good against them, because they could not be suppressed. They would use cover VERY well. They knew to return fire regardless of being under fire, exposing only the nose of their gun and just enough mask to get one eye down the sight. They were vigilant about constantly scanning for movement, so I could not flank them without running through a hail of paint balls first. Their expensive guns had long range were very accurate. That day was humbling.

      --
      Vonnegut was right: Of all the words of mice and men, the saddest are, "It might have been."
  2. BANG! by stillnotelf · · Score: 4, Funny

    Does that mean the first poster gets shot? Wait, why am I bleeding...?

    1. Re:BANG! by Bryan+Gividen · · Score: 5, Funny

      You really shot yourself in the foot with that non-first post, didn't you?

  3. Must be joking by TwiztidK · · Score: 5, Funny

    This must be why people can think up a comeback before I'm finished with the original joke.

    --
    Sent from my iPhone 5
  4. Bad summary by RealErmine · · Score: 5, Informative

    Did the submitter or editors read the story? At the end they plainly state that even though the second "shooter" reacted faster, they could not make up the difference in time.

    --
    Dewey, you fool! Your decimal system has played right into my hands!
    1. Re:Bad summary by mdarksbane · · Score: 5, Informative

      This is pretty important, and follows the police and self-defense literature I've read. It's a real concern for officers who might have a gun pointed at a suspect who draws and fires.

      Previous studies have shown that even though the officer should have an advantage, if they actually process what is being drawn instead of just firing, the suspect who began with a gun at their head wins most of the time. Reading some of those studies provided a whole new perspective on all of the horrible "cop accidentally shoots a kid with a toy gun" moments.

  5. The mythbusters need to test this! by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The mythbusters need to test this!

    1. Re:The mythbusters need to test this! by swillden · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why? Real scientists have already confirmed it.

      Because the Mythbusters would dress up in cowboy costumes and play "high noon" music.

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  6. 1645 called. by bigattichouse · · Score: 4, Informative

    Miyamoto Musashi established this phenomenon quite well in 1645. Book of five rings.

    Feudal Japan called, they want their news back.

    --
    meh
  7. Re:Oblig. by Captain+Splendid · · Score: 5, Funny

    "Hans' hot first"

    AKA "How I Learned To Enjoy Wookiee Lovin'"

    --
    Linux, you magnificent bastard, I read the fucking manual!
  8. In movies, it's a Morality lesson by The+Famous+Druid · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The guy who draws first is the agressor, we can't let the agressor win.

    That's the same reason that the guy on the roof of the saloon, aiming to shoot the someone in the back, always gets shot just as he's taking aim, and falls impressively to the street. Snipers and back-shooters are bad guys.

    --
    Quidquid Latine dictum sit, altum videtur (anything said in Latin sounds important)
  9. Re:Oblig. by hansamurai · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It was always the intent of George Lucas to have Luke Skywalker and Obi-Wan ride on Greedo's ship, The Manka Hunter, but Harrison Ford was cheaper than keeping famous actor Paul Blake around (who demanded more money for sitting in a rubber suit most of the day) so he decided to rewrite the script to have Han kill Greedo instead of the other way around.

    --
    Reviewing just the first hour of video games.
  10. Re:Oblig. by jollyreaper · · Score: 5, Funny

    "Hans' hot first"

    AKA "How I Learned To Enjoy Wookiee Lovin'"

    You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought.

    --
    Kwisatz Haderach
    Sell the spice to CHOAM
    This Mahdi took Shaddam's Throne
  11. Better counter-example - Liberty Valance by tomhath · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance is a better example of the real reason - it's the bad guy who gets shot. Lee Marvin (bad guy of course) baits James Stewart (good guy of course) into a gunfight. As Stewart draws his gun, knowing Marvin would win the gunfight, John Wayne (hero of course) shoots Marvin from across the street

  12. Re:Oblig. by Minwee · · Score: 4, Funny

    You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought.

    Get in there, you big furry oaf! I don't care how it smells. GET IN THERE!

  13. Re:Oblig. by jbezorg · · Score: 4, Funny

    That day, Palpatine was amazed to discover that when Vader was saying "As you wish", what he meant was, "I love you." And even more amazing was the day he realized he truly loved him back.

    ( Just burning off some real karma with this one )

    --
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