Cub Scouts To Offer Merit Pin For Video Gaming

Hugh Pickens writes "Fox News reports that the Boy Scouts of America — a group founded on the principles of building character and improving physical fitness — have introduced merit pins for academic achievement in video gaming, a move that has child health experts atwitter. 'It could be quite visionary and exciting or it could be a complete sellout,' says Dr. Vic Strasburger. 'I don't see anything wrong with that as long as they're not playing first-person shooter games, violent games, games with a lot of sexual or drug content. The question is, who's going to supervise the scouts?' Tiger Cubs, Cub Scouts, and Webelos Scouts can earn their pins by spending an hour a day playing games, teaching others how to play better, and researching the best price for games they'd like to buy."

Comments

Next: pins for first post.

[Alex Belits]

n/t

Why the censure?

[Thanshin]

I don't see anything wrong with that as long as they're not playing first-person shooter games, violent games, games with a lot of sexual or drug content.

Stop the censure! I grew up with duke nukem and it had no bad consequences.

And I'm all out of gum!

Re:Why the censure?

[mjwalshe]

Highly ironic as the Scouts where set up to teach "scouting" a set of skills used in the military as a result of Baden Powel’s experiences in the Boer war. And presumably American scouts have badges related to shooting real guns :-)

Best price

[Bert64]

Do you get extra credit for working out that piracy provides the best price?

Re:Best price

[Darth Sdlavrot]

Nope. Cub Scouts have always shot bows and small rifles.

I've just gone through the whole thing with my son from Cub Scout to Eagle Scout, I'm an Eagle Scout myself, was Scout Master of his troop for three years, took Wood Badge, and went with the troop to summer camp, Double H and Philmont. Clearly I wouldn't know anything about the program.

Cub Scouts do not shoot rifles or shotguns. Webelos get to shoot pump action BB guns.

Boy Scouts get to shoot 22 rifles and shotguns, and older boys (14+) get to shoot black powder rifles. At Philmont they get to shoot 30-06 rifles in addition to shotgun and black powder.

Re:This is like printing money

[Thanshin]

1. Shakedown boys scouts for their video game pin. Mention something about getting the self defense belt loop so this doesn't happen again
2. Put pin up on eBay

1. Get boy scout.
2. Put boy scout on craiglist.

Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[madwheel]

So much for Boy Scouts sticking to what its roots were in the 1900's. What's next? Oh yeah... Sleeping badge. You eat 12 cookies, drink a glass of milk, then sleep for 14 hours a day for a full week! It's the ultimate badge that takes a lot of hard work.

Re:Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[ndogg]

How much lower can it go? They already discriminate (and still get funds from various governments).

Re:Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[drooling-dog]

And still no badge for masturbation. We'd all have made Eagle around here...

Re:Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[Bakkster]

More importantly, the cub scout belt loops and pins have always been about leisure activities. There's one for chess, why not one for video games? Besides, these kids are going to spend far more time playing video games than nearly any other subject, why not teach them to do it responsibly? As a secondary effect, their parents will learn about the ESRB ratings system, since one requirement is for the boys to teach their parents about it.

It's not even like the cubs will gain ranks or advancement from video games. It's just recognition that they've learned something about it. Even if it were a BSA merit badge (which is used for advancement as a boy scout), would a video game merit badge be less useful that indian lore? What about coin collecting? How many scouts do you think earn basket weaving or pottery and go on to use their skills after summer camp is over? As long as they're learning age-appropriate (we're talking 10-year olds) and useful knowledge, I see nothing wrong with it.

For reference, here are the requirements:

Requirements for the Video Games Belt Loop
Complete these three requirements:
Explain why it is important to have a rating system for video games. Check your video games to be sure they are right for your age.
With an adult, create a schedule for you to do things that includes your chores, homework, and video gaming. Do your best to follow this schedule.
Learn to play a new video game that is approved by your parent, guardian, or teacher.

Requirements for the Video Games Pin
Earn the Video Games belt loop, and complete five of the following requirements:
With your parents, create a plan to buy a video game that is right for your age group.
Compare two game systems (for example, Microsoft Xbox, Sony PlayStation, Nintendo Wii, and so on). Explain some of the differences between the two. List good reasons to purchase or use a game system.
Play a video game with family members in a family tournament.
Teach an adult or a friend how to play a video game.
List at least five tips that would help someone who was learning how to play your favorite video game.
Play an appropriate video game with a friend for one hour.
Play a video game that will help you practice your math, spelling, or another skill that helps you in your schoolwork.
Choose a game you might like to purchase. Compare the price for this game at three different stores. Decide which store has the best deal. In your decision, be sure to consider things like the store return policy and manufacturer’s warranty.
With an adult’s supervision, install a gaming system.

Re:Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[99BottlesOfBeerInMyF]

Discriminate?

Yes, they discriminate against people based upon religion and sexual orientation. I have no problem with a private organization doing either, but they should not be eligible for government funding or freebies like they have been getting.

Government funding? I don't think so.

Here is a list of a few dozen instances where they've lost government aid in various court cases. Mostly it was a case of being allowed to use public facilities free of charge. It includes the cities of Philadelphia and Berkley and the states of Illinois and Oregon in the US. There are still many city and state governments providing assistance to the BSA despite it being illegal favoritism. Sadly too many people in the US are in favor of discrimination against gays and non-christians so politicians are unwilling to do anything about it.

Re:Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[Crudely_Indecent]

If they're going to do this, they really need to make the badge more realistic.

Instead of a game controller on the badge, they somehow need to convey how playing video games is a complete waste of time. The badges aren't nearly big enough to show a 40 year old fat virgin on a recliner in his moms basement surrounded by twinkie wrappers and empty pizza boxes.

Be Prepared - for what.....Aliens? Zombies?

I fail to see how this will help them in later life. Unlike outdoor survival skills which can save your life, playing video games only increases your proficiency in playing video games.

As a Boy Scout, I learned knots that I thought were stupid at the time - but I still use them to this day.

Re:Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[mc1138]

This is Cub Scouts, not Boy Scouts, the distinction may be small, but Cub Scouts works with kids in 1st through 5th grade or so. A big big part of Cub Scouts is working with kids on being grounded and responsible. With video games becoming such a large part of our society, having something that helps kids approach them responsibly, which if you read the requirements it has more to do with understanding game ratings (also good for parents) and making sure that you don't play too much than anything else. I say good job to Scouting for keeping up with the times. Also, this isn't the first time badge to deal with this, Boy Scouts already have merit badges dealing with computer's and other more technical activities as well.

Re:Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[Bakkster]

This latest move is stunning in it's lameness, but not really surprising, given their increasingly desperate attempt to remain relevant.

Really? Perhaps you are just ignorant of the requirements. It's teaching personal responsibility, time management, and how to spend money wisely, it just uses video games as a trick to interest the boys. Why? Because they're 11-years old, at the oldest!

And how is disallowing homosexuals (or atheists) based on 'fear and ignorance'? Why not the simpler explanation of 'it doesn't fit with our moral beliefs'? Are you saying they should compromise on their morals, just to be politically correct?

Re:Way to lower the credibility of Boy Scouts...

[99BottlesOfBeerInMyF]

Discrimination exists. There is a reason for it these days.

Umm, okay. I'm not even going to address this.

Also what is wrong with organizations using facilities for free?

It is illegal favoritism. Other organizations are not allowed use of the same facilities for free.

Did they not help pay for it with their taxes?

No, the BSA is a not for profit that does not pay taxes. More importantly though, why should some taxpayers be forced to pay utility costs and upkeep fees for facilities that are incurred by an organization that bans their children from joining? If the BSA allowed anyone to join, then I would have a lot less of a problem letting them use government facilities, but when they exclude some citizens, that nixes it for me.

Are you not being discriminatory yourself?

No because I'm proposing equal access to all people based upon the criteria of nondiscrimination in the constitution. The government is forbidden from providing favoritism based upon certain criteria including religion. That extends to providing extra perks to private organizations that discriminate on that basis. You do remember the constitution don't you?

I think the government exists to help people...

Which it can do by providing free facilities to organizations that follow the guidelines necessary for it to do so legally. The government is not allowed to promote any religion and spending taxpayer dollars subsidizing an organization that does promote specific religions, certainly qualifies.

I can see the difference between a group of kids getting together with their parents and a rock band playing at a public arena.

What about a rock band that does not allow Christians to attend? Are you okay with that? What about a club using the public park for the day, but not letting white people in the park that day because whites cannot join said club?

They did something like that with a local park I used to go to when I grew up.

Sorry, your anecdote does not apply. The government charging fees for thing is one thing. How would you feel if that same park had started charging fees, but only to registered members of the republican party? That's what we're talking about, unequal treatment for groups based upon criteria specifically forbidden by federal law to be used as criteria for unequal treatment by the government. It's entirely the BSA's choice to discriminate based upon those criteria and that is what makes them ineligible for government benefits; the same as the KKK, Neo Nazis, and the Black Panthers.

In other words

[JimboFBX]

I don't see anything wrong with that as long as they're not playing first-person shooter games, violent games, games with a lot of sexual or drug content.

So in other words, as long as they aren't fun games

Oh yeah

[Moraelin]

Oh yeah, because sitting on a chair and moving a mouse around so teaches one how to handle a real assault rifle, and for that matter so prepares one to sprint with 60 pounds of equipment.

Not to mention other valuable lessons. While those dumb Russkies and Chinese go like sheep and run at the enemy with a gun, as ordered, our brave NATO troops will be where it matters: camping an airstrip so they can fly an airplane into a hill ;)

I guess next thing you know they'll progress to other games, and the USA will have the first army who knows how to bunny-hop, grenade jump and spawn-camp. And woe to Osama once they learn where on the map are the BFG and quad damage ;)

Re:Oh yeah

[Mr. Freeman]

"Seriously, assault rifles have point-and-click interfaces. Guns are ridiculously easy to operate." Spoken exactly like someone who has never handled a weapon in their life.

Why don't you go down to the range one day and say that to someone who actually owns a gun. See how many shots you can land with any respectable accuracy.

"Seriously, assault rifles have point-and-click interfaces. Guns are ridiculously easy to operate."
Any dipshit can point and fire a rifle WITHOUT ANY VIDEOGAMES. A crazed man with a gun and videogames is no different from a crazed man with a gun.

Re:Oh yeah

[hairyfeet]

Yeah, as someone who has fired quite a few weapons while I can't say how bad the M16 would be, I pity the poor bastard that tries to fire a combat shotgun if the only experience is FPSs. Those bitches got some kick buddy!

Not to mention if you let gamers with NO training loose on a battlefield I'm sure it would be like an article I read a few years back when a gamer mag took a couple of stoners from the mail room and put them on a tactical shooter (Sorry I can't find a link because I would LOVE to read it again) which went like this...

OBJECTIVE..Rescue hostages from terrorists behind locked door...STRATEGY...Stoner A will blow door open with combat shotgun, Stoner B will throw in flash bang and follow Stoner A in an neutralize terrorists...WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED..Stoner A says "Are you ready" which causes Stoner B to drop a LIVE GRENADE instead of a flash bang, which of course drops at their feet. Stoner A panics and shoots Stoner B in the face, followed by both being blown to fuck. Terrorists stand behind the door and wonder what that noise was.

Yeah, I don't really think the military would be well advised to let "XBox warriors" loose on the battlefield with nothing but their FPS "training" to back them up, not unless the goal is to try to make the enemy die laughing.

Re:Oh yeah

[blennidae]

As a civilian, I had the opportunity several years ago to use some weapons that were modified to use compressed air (simulate recoil, etc.) to shoot at targets on a movie screen. Re-enacting things like hostage situations in an office, traffic stops gone wrong, etc. Let me just say that using an M-16, SAW or Mossberg for any length of time (over 5 minutes) is *definitely* different than pointing and clicking with a mouse and that video games in NO WAY prepare anyone for the reality of using actual weapons. I don't remember the actual name of this one rifle a Marine pulled out of the storage closet and was handling it like a toothpick. He handed it off to me and I just about fell face first just from the weight of it. Nothing like having combat veterans laugh at a "dumb-ass civilian" to start your day out.

Re:Oh yeah

[theshowmecanuck]

It always screws up my suspension of disbelief whenever I see someone fire a rocket launcher (like the M72) or recoilless rifle (like the Carl Gustav) from a helicopter or a window in a building. The backblast of the former will kill anyone within one or two hundred metres to the rear of the weapon, and up to 300 metres for the Carl G. Similar for similar weapons of similar size. They'd blow their own helicopter out of the sky if they did that. They'd incinerate themselves as the backblast blew back on them in the room if fired from a window. I remember standing up a hill about a half mile behind a Carl G being fired and feeling a stiff warm wind blowing my clothes tight to my body. The safety NCO's on ranges (who normally stand 10 or 20 feet to the side) need to rotate through every few firings to ensure they don't suffer damage just from watching due to the huge pressure wave generated when firing. I've seen guys get bleeding noses or their watch crystals pop off after watching half a dozen firings. At least with the Carl G., the gunner who stands directly under the weapon is in a 'quiet' zone and the most you feel is a solid thump on your chest (but it is still a good idea to open your throat so that there is an open pipe from the outside to your lungs so that you minimize the pressure differential if you make your lungs into a closed air sack by holding your breath). If you have a weapon that requires a loader (like the Carl G), he is just out of the quiet zone and gets a good wallop too. People watching movies, the news, or playing video games just don't have any idea of how powerful these things are (and they are the smaller of these weapons now-a-days). Understanding academically doesn't count. You have to experience it.

Re:Oh yeah

[tophermeyer]

Plus, combat is stressful. IANAS (Soldier) but I can say that under extremely stressful conditions people that have not had extreme training to handle those situations tend to lose a great deal of their higher cognitive and memory functions. If you are scrambling to point one of those things at an armored vehicle that is trying to kill you, taking the time to read and understand instructions or to remember a 3 day training you received years ago will be difficult. Having simple little images that show you how to use the thing are majorly helpful. At the very least, they don't hurt anything.

Don't you have more important things to do?

[ndogg]

Really? This? Are you going to have a merit badge for going to the movies?

How about you work on some of those long standing issues like your discrimination against gays, and non-Christians?

Re:Don't you have more important things to do?

[Thiez]

Heterosexual people don't have sexual problems?

Re:Don't you have more important things to do?

[The Hatchet]

Scouts does have problems, but to be fair I am an atheist, and my Eagle board of review new it, and awarded me the rank anyways. When asked about 'Reverence' I simply answered that I possess reverence, for the mighty forces of nature, that when I am 10 miles into the woods on the top of a snow covered hill, I understand that nature can kill you on a whim. They responded positively.

Also, a lot of people call scouts 'gay' even though it tends to discriminate against homosexuals. I just find that amusing. I think we should merge boy and girl scouts to just have 'scouts'. Canada does that and it works fine, but in the US? Hell no, they might see each others parts in the group shower, and that would just be the end of the world. The ground would turn to lava and hell would swallow up all the sinners. At least thats what I am told.

Cub scouts really is a crock, as is Girl scouts. My ex was a girl scout, and their merit badges were like sandwich making, how to keep a kitchen clean, knitting, needlepoint, parenting. Not even kidding.

Re:Don't you have more important things to do?

[snowgirl]

Cub Scouts != Boy Scouts

The Boy Scouts are the ones that hate atheists and gays. Not sure about the Cub Scouts but a quick perusal of the Wikipedia article suggests that they have no such offensive policies.

Straight from the Wikipedia page:

The Cub Scouts are a division of the Boy Scouts of America (BSA).

Way to go

[Opportunist]

It was appearantly not enough to put off every halfway liberal person by their quite questionable membership policies, now they're working hard to alienate their conservative supporters.

Just like I always say, give someone enough rope and he'll somehow manage to hang himself.

Embraces what kids are doing anyway

[stupidflanders]

They're embracing something that kids are doing anyway. The Scouts have been modifying their program in recent years. They now have a leadership position for Troop Webmaster, a Jamboree on the Internet and have wholeheartedly embraced Geocaching. I would have thought this would be marked as one giant leap for nerd-kind. They're saying it's OK to play video games. Where's the "HUZZAH"?

The requirements talk about comparing prices of games & consoles (and store return policies), teaching others how to play games, balancing homework/videogames, and picking games that will help improve school skills. You know, the kinds of things we discuss here all the time?

No first person shooters?

[Mr. Freeman]

No first person shooters? Are the scouts aware that they actually offer a merit badge in SHOOTING.

People are up in arms because these violent video games "train young people how to operate weapons". No, they don't. You know what does train young people to use guns? Learning to shoot in the boy scouts.

JESUS FUCKING CHRIST. No one is bitching about REAL guns with REAL bullets shooting REAL targets, but the second it becomes virtual everyone throws a fucking hissy fit.

Re:No first person shooters?

[ZekoMal]

Yeah, I agree. It's far more dangerous to teach a kid how to virtually fire a weapon at aliens that speak English than it is to teach a kid how to operate a firearm.

Wait, what?

The REAL requirements

[MasterPatricko]

Ignoring Fox's propaganda, the list of tasks a scout has to do to earn this is pretty decent. Considering these kids are gonna be playing anyway, why not teach them to play right ...I see nothing to complain about in the following list.

Belt Loop
Complete these three requirements:
1. Explain why it is important to have a rating system for video games. Check your video games to be sure they are right for your age.
2. With an adult, create a schedule for you to do things that includes your chores, homework, and video gaming. Do your best to follow this schedule.
3. Learn to play a new video game that is approved by your parent, guardian, or teacher.

Academics Pin
Earn the Video Games belt loop and complete five of the following requirements:
1. With your parents, create a plan to buy a video game that is right for your age group.
2. Compare two game systems (for example, Microsoft Xbox, Sony PlayStation, Nintendo Wii, and so on). Explain some of the differences between the two. List good reasons to purchase or use a game system.
3. Play a video game with family members in a family tournament.
4. Teach an adult or a friend how to play a video game.
5. List at least five tips that would help someone who was learning how to play your favorite video game.
6. Play an appropriate video game with a friend for one hour.
7. Play a video game that will help you practice your math, spelling, or another skill that helps you in your schoolwork.
8. Choose a game you might like to purchase. Compare the price for this game at three different stores. Decide which store has the best deal. In your decision, be sure to consider things like the store return policy and manufacturer’s warranty.
9. With an adult’s supervision, install a gaming system.

Commercial vs. Academic focus in the badge

[mattr]

Disclaimer: Cub Scouts was awesome and I remember most the warm feeling when the scouts gathered at a parents house. Video games would fit that atmosphere. The requirements are actually not so bad I think for this badge. Whereas I dropped out of Boy Scouts after some years when the bullying overwhelmed the exciting but life threatening campouts (8 miles into the wilderness in freezing winter, other scouts trying to burn down your tent, etc.) loved the hiking though.

Okay in this video merit badge for cub scouts I am worried about these lines:

Choose a game you might like to purchase. Compare the price for this game at three different stores. Decide which store has the best deal. In your decision, be sure to consider things like the store return policy and manufacturer’s warranty.
With an adult’s supervision, install a gaming system.

It seems to require you to buy games in a store and the purchasing experience is emphasized. Being aware of the return policy is good but there seems to be a requirement to buy something. What if you want to use Free (or free) Software? Likewise "install a gaming system" could mean install a linux system on an old PC, and download some free games for it. So I think it would be better for cubs to emphasize the noncommercial aspect.
Also there is the cost of hardware, whether a console or not. If you can use an existing computer then the "install" could really mean just doing a software install.

I think it would be great if linux distro's sites had a page for Cub Scouts to learn about Free Software and guide them to fulfilling all the requirements for these badges and belt loops using Linux.

Re:(De)Evolving with the times

[topsocket]

THIS IS NOT THE BOY SCOUTS. This is an activity belt loop and pin for the Cub Scouts, aged 7 to 12. And if anyone bothered to read the requirements, you would see that the award is a thinly-veiled attempt to teach the boys about thriftiness, enjoying family time, communication, and responsibility. The 3 main requirements have the boy create a schedule to complete homework and chores BEFORE games, explain the video game rating system and why it needed, and play a game that must be approved by a parent. Also, Pickens claims that the Scout can earn an award by playing games 1 hour a day. Nowhere in the requirements that Pickens links to does it state that a certain amount of time MUST be spent gaming. FUD. The Video Game award is only 1 of 13 awards recently released for Cub Scouts:Disability Awareness, Family Travel, Good Manners, Hiking, Hockey, Horseback Riding, Kickball, Nutrition, Pet Care, Photography, Reading and Writing, Skateboarding. I applaud BSA for updating a program with over 75 years of tradition, making Cub Scouting well rounded and relevant to the modern 7-12 year old boy.

Re:How about the popped cherry badge?

[Bakkster]

In all honesty, kids don't need more encouragement to game. Yes I'm a parent, but I'm young enough to still be a gamer and trust me, I didn't/don't need more encouragement.

Have you read the requirements? It's using video games as a cover to teach useful skills. For example, how to research a purchase, about the ESRB and content ratings, how to schedule leisure time so it doesn't interfere with responsibilities, and how to connect a console to a television. It's teaching them to play responsibly, which is probably more than they had done before, while teaching them a few more life skills.