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National Academy of Science Urges Carbon Tax

Posted by samzenpus on from the let-the-flamewar-begin dept.

eldavojohn writes "Moving for the first time from a cautious message to a message of urgency, the National Academy of Science has advised the United States government to either adopt a carbon tax or cap and trade legislation. This follows a comprehensive study in three parts released today from the National Academies that, for the first time, urges required action from the government to curb climate change."

6 of 875 comments (clear)

  1. First warning. by TapeCutter · · Score: 5, Informative

    This may be the first time the NAS have advised specific policies. However the first time NAS warned the US government of the problem was in 1958. This Bell Labs video summarises the contents of that first warning. The NAS has not suddenly flipped from cautious, the urgency has steadilly increased over the last 50yrs to the current position of virtually screaming at congress to pull their head out of their collective arses.

    --
    And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
  2. Re:externality by lgw · · Score: 5, Informative

    A tax on carbon is a tax on everything. Food prices will rise. The price of everything ordered on Amazon will rise. The price of everyhtng transported by road or rail will rise. The price of running your heater or AC will rise, a lot. And it's a regressive tax, like all consumption taxes.

    The last time America had a serious economic crisis, it was pretty directly caused by energy prices rising. Why are we so determined as a nation to magnify and extend the current economic crisis to match the Carter years?

    --
    Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  3. Re:externality by EllisDees · · Score: 5, Informative

    >because you haven't sufficently proven that CO2 is the cause, thats why. the current 10 year trend is actually cooling.

    Oh, Really?

    "April this year was the hottest on record, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration has announced.

    The combined surface temperatures on land and at sea averaged 14.5 C, some 0.76 C above the 20th century average. Average ocean surface temperature was the warmest on record for April and the global land surface temperature was the third warmest on record for the month.

    NOAA also says that Arctic sea ice was "below normal for the 11th consecutive April" while "based on NOAA satellite observations, snow cover extent was the fourth-lowest on record" since 1967."

    --
    -- Give me ambiguity or give me something else!
  4. Are you serious? by XiaoMing · · Score: 5, Informative

    Remember that post a few hundred lines up that suggest fact checking? I would suggest some sanity-checking.

    So for a simple tweak in software, cars would not only gain performance, save more gas, but also eliminate the need for expensive (cats are one of the world's biggest uses platinum) catalytic converters?
    Man, it makes complete sense now that the car companies of the world, especially those on the verge of bankruptcy in this economy, don't want the public to know that they are totally IGNORING this simple reprogramming of the ECU for the great reason of... ... oh yeah it's completely wrong and stupid.

    Cats are there to change NOx (smog, eventually becomes ground level ozone, the kind you WANT depleted) emissions into more harmless NO2.
    Problem is NOx emissions come from higher ignition temperatures (why Diesels get great fuel economy and power, but have always been seen as a dirty fuel source/powertrain), _which are a result of running lean_.

    As a general point, it's also important to remember that CO2 emissions are different from the "Emissions" that they usually talk about in cars (LEV, ULEV, ZEV). Even the "Zero emission vehicles" (many of which are fuel celled) still emit CO2 and water, it's just that they don't burn anything containing nitrogens, and thus emit "zero" NOX (still a bit arguable since fuel cells run hot, and the atmosphere is 80% diatomic nitrogen).

    Anyway, point of the matter, and man I hope people have read this far, is that CO2 is what is being attributed to global warming (save that debate for another thread), but the "emissions" coming out of tailpipes are what's important for whether your children have chronic asthma by their teenage years.

  5. Re:Who is going by wanerious · · Score: 5, Informative

    Right, but that's 3% over equilibrium, and it's cumulative.

  6. Re:Someone Please Explain by enodo · · Score: 5, Informative
    So do you know how the continents were arranged then, and what effect on climate that had? Any idea how different the solar irradiance was at that time? What the sea levels were? If not, why are you asking this question?

    Do you really think that the members of the National Academy of Sciences haven't thought of these obvious questions?

    If you really want to know the answers, you could start by reading articles on Wikipedia:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faint_young_sun_paradox
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permo%E2%80%93Carboniferous_Glaciation
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleozoic#Climate