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What Microsoft Must Do To Save Its Mobile Business

GMGruman writes "Microsoft has tossed out its mobile management team (without admitting to doing so), but is that enough to make Microsoft matter in mobile? InfoWorld's Galen Gruman argues that a lot more is needed than a management change if Microsoft hopes to have a future in the emerging mobile world. In his blog, he lays out a tough five-point prescription for Microsoft to get back in the game. For starters, Microsoft has to get out of its well-established cultural mindset that it's OK to ship crap that it might fix later on."

41 of 250 comments (clear)

  1. Just give up. by symbolset · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I think maybe the best answer here is to just surrender. "Mobile? It's not our thing. We wanted it to be our thing - we tried. But we're not good at it." While they're at it maybe they should get out of search and online ads too.

    I'm symbolset and the lack of Windows Phone 7 was my idea.

    --
    Help stamp out iliturcy.
    1. Re:Just give up. by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Nope.

      The answer is to find a Phone giant (Nokia) and take the best of both worlds and make an OS that utterly kicks arse.

      Nokia hardware rocks. Nokia's software as of late (S60) is buggy to hell and back. If they both got together they could make it big. Nokia making their superior phone hardware, Microsoft ditching the joke that is their mobile OS and starting over with a REAL os that has potential (and design it so carriers cant cripple it) they could give the other two a real run for their money.

      S60 has potential if it was fixed up with a os company behind it.. WM7-Whatever it is has no chance at all. It's a mess.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    2. Re:Just give up. by ErroneousBee · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Nokia can do that for themselves, they don't need Microsoft. They've probably also seen what happens to companies that try to partner with Redmond.

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    3. Re:Just give up. by Hognoxious · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I have an E71, and to me it looks like MS have already been playing with it. Especially when you consider what a lean and clean OS Symbian's ancestor (EPOC) was by comparison.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    4. Re:Just give up. by areusche · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I'm trying not to sound condescending here, but are you kidding me? Have you ever used a Windows Mobile phone before?

      I've been using Windows Mobile since the 2003se days and it has been light years ahead of whatever competitor was pumping out. Things like multitasking, a somewhat open platform for development, and an interface that makes sense.

      The only downside has been the long time insistance from manufactures to only use 64mb of ram. Nowadays that number is up to 256mb.

      HTC has a number of drool worthy phones that spec wise pound the iphone to dust and anything that Palm can come up with.

      And finally Microsoft leaves its homebrew ROM kitchen development alone. Sites like PPCGeeks.com and xda-developers are two that come to mind.

      It's sad that people disregard Windows Mobile. It is nothing like the desktop crap. And seriously what major software or hardware manufacture doesn't pump out crap and fix it later? At least Windows Mobile works out of the box.

      Disclaimer: My first PDA was a Sony Clie. I loved Palm and used it for many years, but it's time to use a real device and software.

    5. Re:Just give up. by Jawnn · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Nope.

      The answer is to find a Phone giant (Nokia) and take the best of both worlds and make an OS that utterly kicks arse.

      Nokia hardware rocks.

      No argument. That would be a sound approach, but for one thing. Microsoft has no experience in making an OS that utterly kicks ass (as we Yanks spell it), especially from scratch, and certainly not on a schedule that would be required to stay competitive in the mobile business, where "innovation" is real and ongoing. I know this sounds like stock /. MS bashing, but it's not meant to be. Microsoft's culture and business model is a poor fit for the wireless industry.

    6. Re:Just give up. by TheKidWho · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Windows Mobile is alright if you're into pen based computing. The iPhone/Android devices are touch based devices though, different paradigms apply.

      Note: I've been using Windows Mobile since it was called PocketPC back in 2000. Yes, I still have an original iPaq, sleeves and all.

      First smartphone was a Windows Mobile device, next one was an iPhone, currently using a Palm Pre, and next month I'm about to purchase an HTV EVO 4G(Android device).

    7. Re:Just give up. by ZeroExistenZ · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Nokia did a "me-tooo!!" online software store. It couldn't engage developers and it flopped.

      Android started it smart with the summer code-challenges almost a year before the first phones came to the general market and have now the power to offer phonevendors the ease of NOT having to design an OS or upgrade/modify what they have for each phone model they release.

      Microsoft still looked like they buttkicked PalmOS and went into a comfy zone "no competition. We know it sucks balls, but hey, what are your alternatives, management boy? Here, have a free magnetic stylus, so you can sync exchange."

      Android has put Microsoft to shame with their pants on their knees in a "developer developers!" conference, touchscreening it to youtube and twitter while the WM6 guys are, well.. sortof trying to find the right program files folder and waiting a bit to open their browser...

      Microsoft will have to "pull another IE" to get "sortof back in the game". The same way they are now throwing in everything to be ready for HTML5 and are a bit neglecting canvas.

      They thought their honeycomb design on WM6 would be sufficient to give Android surprice buttseks, but they've been surprice-somethingelse'd themselves right now while they thought they had full game

      --
      I think we can keep recursing like this until someone returns 1
    8. Re:Just give up. by randomaxe · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That's funny, because every Windows Mobile phone I've ever used has had me on the verge of throwing it against a wall more times than is acceptable for any gadget that isn't still in beta testing. I've had them mysteriously lose settings, crash repeatedly, and lock up -- sometimes right in the middle of a phone call.

      There may be WinMo phones that "spec wise pound the iphone to dust", but impressive hardware is nothing if the software on top of it drives users into fits of rage. There may be a lot of things that a WinMo phone can do that my iPhone can't, but one of them happens to be "piss me off on a daily basis." And I'm just fine with that.

    9. Re:Just give up. by thedonger · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I dislike "proof by anecdote" at least as much as the next guy, but I do not know one solitary person with a Windows Mobile device. On the other hand, I know at least a dozen with either IPhone OS or Android. Personally, I don't care if MS manages to make it in the consolidated computing (my new term for mobile) market, as long as they ship a browser with CSS3/HTML5 support and then transparently - to the user - keep it up to date.

      I see the future in hardware/OS-transparent computing, in other words, don't ever ask if I want to upgrade to the latest version of the browser - that is too much info. Apple had it right from the beginning - ship a box with a keyboard and don't require the customer to figure out the hardware. And with the current generation of hand held devices one need not think about browser, file systems, etc., to have a rich experience. That is the future where literally everyone operates a hand held computer every day for even the most common tasks, and in that world people need not worry about anything but how to turn it on.

      --
      Help fight poverty: Punch a poor person.
    10. Re:Just give up. by MBGMorden · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That's not really a viewpoint that a company should take. "Microsoft" is a nebulous entity. To say "we" aren't good at anything from a corporate is stupid, and ties a company too tightly to it's current staff.

      If the company's current staff isn't doing well in a market that they wish to be a player in, then you replace them. There's no reason to assume that merely having the Microsoft logo embroidered on their company shirts is going to make a talented group of people perform worse than if Google or Apple's logos were on those shirts.

      I just think that whatever group that goes in, needs to understand - WINDOWS does not translate well to a mobile device. The world doesn't need a Mobile Windows OS. What they need to do is develop a completely new Microsoft mobile OS from the ground up, with mobile in mind.

      And for goodness sakes, get some good UI people on board. Their latest attempts - those damned "Kin" phones, look like the UI people were playing around while designing it and thought: "I wonder just how much we can fuck with this and get away with it?" My 2 year old niece has Leap Frog toys with better UI's than those phones.

      --
      "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
    11. Re:Just give up. by CastrTroy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The reason apple works is because there is exactly 1 phone model. Developers know what to target, and are able to ensure their app will work properly. The reason Windows never worked in the mobile industry is because of such a large variety of phones available. Phones with different screen sizes and resolutions. Phones with differently available keys. Some phones have touch, some have accelerometers. Different processor and memory specs. Every phone is different. As long as there is this much variation in the hardware, it will never take off. Desktop is different, because you can depend on everyone having a monitor with a certain minimal resolution, keyboard with 104 keys, and mouse with 2 buttons. That gives you a good base line platform. They should do the same with phones. Define a screen size the phones must use. Define that all phones can have a keyboard, or use an onscreen one, and ensure that all phones must have a certain processor and memory spec, or they don't get to run new new Windows Phone OS. Make the phones more similar, so that developers have something easier to target, and they will come.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    12. Re:Just give up. by tverbeek · · Score: 2, Informative

      EPOC was wonderful. I bought one used Psion Series3 after another for 10 years as they kept breaking, and/or performed surgery to replace the exhausted batteries, just so I could keep using the software. I looked at Blackberry, PalmOS, and WinMobile devices from time to time, but couldn't stand any of them. I finally retired the Psion last year, replacing it with an iPod Touch.

      --
      http://alternatives.rzero.com/
  2. Bullshit by drinkypoo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    For starters, Microsoft has to get out of its well-established cultural mindset that it's OK to ship crap that it might fix later on."

    That is pure bullshit. It works for literally everyone else, including Apple. Or is all the stuff in iPhone OS 4.0 that Steve said wasn't included because it would make the iPhone suck not sufficient evidence for you? How about all the functionality in Android 2.1 that seems mandatory? This story is (-1, Troll).

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    1. Re:Bullshit by RKThoadan · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think your Apple example is counter to your point. They new it would make it suck, so they didn't ship it. The article is asking for any software that ships to be well-designed and to leave it off otherwise.

    2. Re:Bullshit by Uksi · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Bullshit back on you. False comparison. Lacking features != a crappy product. It just means a product that does less. First iPhone OS version didn't have exchange integration or copy/paste, but what was there worked well and was designed to work well. In fact, until Apple was convinced that it could do copy/paste well, it didn't release that feature. That's just not biting off more than you can chew.

      There's a gulf of difference between shipping something that's limited in functionality to something that is crappy. Have you ever used the PocketPC PDAs back in the day? I've used a Palm OS-based Handspring and a PocketPC Dell Axim, and let me tell you, the Handspring, with its limited feature set and a slow CPU, did the core PDA things (calendar, todo) a lot better than the Axim. The Axim felt slow (despite a several times faster CPU) and it was harder to work with the calendar (more taps to do things, weird options I didn't need). I hated using it and wrote off PocketPC after that (which is why I never bought a Treo with Windows). That's what "shipping crap" means.

    3. Re:Bullshit by drinkypoo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Bullshit back on you. False comparison. Lacking features != a crappy product. It just means a product that does less.

      Not multitasking == crappy, and even Steve knows it. But you can make excuses for hypocritical backpedaling all day if you like. I already know you're an iFanboy.

      First iPhone OS version didn't have exchange integration or copy/paste, but what was there worked well and was designed to work well. In fact, until Apple was convinced that it could do copy/paste well, it didn't release that feature. That's just not biting off more than you can chew.

      Comparing Exchange integration and C&P is extremely disingenuous. Copy & Paste has been with us even longer than the GUI. Not implementing it is stupid, especially when the meaningful competition universally has it.

      Have you ever used the PocketPC PDAs back in the day? I've used a Palm OS-based Handspring and a PocketPC Dell Axim, and let me tell you, the Handspring, with its limited feature set and a slow CPU, did the core PDA things (calendar, todo) a lot better than the Axim.

      Having owned a Palm Pro w/2MB upgrade and a Visor Deluxe, as well as an iPaq H2215 (putting aside my GRiDPad 1910 and 2390) I think you're full of shit. Waiting for the Palm devices was an exercise in frustration. The user interfaces were primitive beyond belief. Even as a supernerd I found it more convenient to just write notes on paper, even while I was carrying my Visor. Both WinCE and PalmOS are lame, to about equal degrees, though in different ways.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    4. Re:Bullshit by intheshelter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If you hate Apple then just have the balls to say it and move on, but your rant is not relevant to the discussion. Apple shipped a very good initial iPhone OS. It may not have had the features you wanted, but it was solid, stable and worked well.

      You're just a hater, and that's alright, but at least be honest about it. You're equating a buggy, shitty product with a product that doesn't have the features you think it should have, and to you use your own phrasing, that is disingenuous.

  3. They need to find a marketplace for themselves. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I can't help but feel Microsoft has been wedged out of the mobile market by competitors that are specialized at doing everything better then they do.

    Wanna be a cool kid with a pretty phone?
    Apple has you covered.

    Need something uber business savvy but easy enough for a monkey in a suit to use?
    Get a blackberry

    Want a phone that doesn't hold you down?
    Get an Android phone

    Want a phone that runs on POS hardware and can barely handle anything?
    Oh crap, umm...no.

    What they do have, however, is excellent proprietary stuff like ActiveSync that's integrated into all these other cell phones. If I was them, I would focus on developing technology like that. Let the mobile market work for you, not the other way around.

    The Kin is an interesting attempt to wrangle the teenybopper market but I think they've already fallen to the iphone.

    1. Re:They need to find a marketplace for themselves. by sunderland56 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Since most businesses run Microsoft servers, and use Exchange for email, it should be easy for a Microsoft phone to rule the business space. A phone with built-in versions of Word/Excel/PowerPoint, and of course Outlook, would be easy to market. Put specialized phone management capabilities in their server-side tools to make the IT department happy (right now, IT usually detests supporting iPhones).

      One huge disadvantage of a Windows phone today - the OS cannot be upgraded. Apple and Android come out with new versions every few months, with shiny new features, and people download and enjoy them. Since Microsoft doesn't sell Windows Mobile to consumers (it sells to phone manufacturers) when Microsoft releases new version of the OS, you are usually out of luck.

    2. Re:They need to find a marketplace for themselves. by jimicus · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Current day Microsoft has been slapped around enough by the EU over antitrust issues that they don't dare pull that sort of shit anymore. Free MS from their anti-trust shackles, however, and they would very quickly move in a dominate the phone market if they cared to.

      I disagree - the iPhone was released long after most of the antitrust issues, and lots of smartphones ran Windows Mobile then.

      Frankly, they weren't very popular outside of businesses. (And inside of businesses, Blackberry devices were generally just as popular if not more so). And with good reason - while I'm aware it's a totally different product, Microsoft somehow managed to take most of the annoyances of Windows and implement them in Windows Mobile. When it works it's fine, when it doesn't - which affects everyone sooner or later - it seems to go out of its way to make fixing the problem difficult. Yet Microsoft continued to sell this supremely mediocre product with little sign of planning to give it the thorough overhaul it needed, and it wasn't until Apple basically appeared out of nowhere and said to the world "Here's our new phone. Do you like it?" that Microsoft sat up and realised that they would have to compete if they wanted to remain in the market.

  4. Oh Oh Oh I know this one! by DarthVain · · Score: 2, Funny

    Invest in Apple?

  5. The word is "office" by goombah99 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The reason microsoft succeeded was because they wrote a great application called Word. In it's time it was truly great compared to the competition (word perfect for example). Other than being comprehensive and less clunky than open office it's not such a remarkable product anymore. But if you are bussiness or Govt you have to have a copy of it. It's the standard and you always get some document that the emulators don't open correctly, so you have to use it no matter what processor you prefer.

    Windows I think rode on the coat-tails of this. Windows mac was a superior product up through version 5 but it was not fully compatible with the Windows version. As a result, windows OS became the preferred operating system for providing compatibility of word documents. This choice was cemented by the fact that windows ran on cheaper computers. But I think it was Word that was pulling the buggy, not the OS.

    Ironically, Word 6 made the Mac and PC versions more interoperable by removing the advanced features from the mac product. But by then the product offered an integrated environment on the PC with outlook and server systems. So it still was better to use the PC than the Mac version for business.

    If you were starting over today, the huge standardization on word probably would not happen.

    This is the boat MS is in now with mobile computing. Word is behind the curve on being a first rate mobile product. If they don't get something better out there people may start to standardize on something else once the reasons become compelling enough.

    I think that microsoft is fully capable of producing a first class mobile computing set of tools. Why they haven't is mysterious to me.

    --
    Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
    1. Re:The word is "office" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Ironically, Word 6 made the Mac and PC versions more interoperable by removing the advanced features from the mac product. But by then the product offered an integrated environment on the PC with outlook and server systems. So it still was better to use the PC than the Mac version for business.

      It was the version that broke away from being a native Mac application and used a Windows cross-development library, resulting in a bloated, under-performing piece of crap derided by users and reviewers alike.

      I'm sure Steve Jobs remembers this very well.

    2. Re:The word is "office" by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You really have no idea about the history of personal computing. MS became the dominant player in Personal Computers because they owned the OS that ran on IBM compatible PCs. Before MS DOS, every computer manufacturer used a different OS (slight oversimplification) and a propietary hardware design. This meant that software vendors had to either pick one to develop for or port their ap to every new player that entered the field. Businesses wanted computers that they could count on. IBM was viewed as being that, so software vendors developed aps for the IBM PC. Since IBM made their PC using an open architecture, off the shelf components and the licensing terms allowed MS to sell other PC manufacturers the same OS as they sold IBM (or near enough as made no difference), this meant that other manufacturers could build "IBM compatible" PCs.
      When MS started selling Word it was a poor imitation of Wordperfect (which was an improved imitation of Wordstar). The other key element of what is now MS Office, Excel was a poor imitation of Lotus 1-2-3. Excel was able to gain market share since every new version of DOS would break some of 1-2-3s functionality. MS failed to make as much progress penetrating Wordperfect's dominance until Windows 3.1 came out.
      Wordperfect was unable to easily develop a GUI based version that maintained backwards compatibility. MS did not have such a problem since they had developed Word for Windows in conjunction with developing Windows 3.1.
      Sorry for such a long response but Word took over because of Windows (and the fact that MS was the only major player who had both an established word processor and an established spreadsheet when Windows came out) not Windows because of Word. When Windows came out MS already owned the PC OS market.

      --
      The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
  6. MS makes money from almost every smartphone sold by alen · · Score: 2, Interesting

    it's called ActiveSync. Apple and Google both license it. Google even licenses it for Google Docs sync over the internet and have extended it. Microsoft doesn't need to pour money into R&D and market a phone since they probably make more money by taking a cut of every iphone, ipod touch, ipod and most Android phones sold.

    as far as shipping crap, Apple and Google do the same thing. Only reason Apple shipped the iPad during the slowest shopping time of the year is to work out the bugs before the next holiday season and get market share before everyone else. my iphone hasn't been completely stable until 3.1.3. there are reports of Droid phones rebooting for no reason. The Nexus One had all kinds of problems. It took HP 2-3 years of firmware and driver updates to make their Proliant G5 servers stop rebooting due to a bug in the iLO firmware. OS X 10.6 hasn't been out a year and it's almost on service pack 4 where all the updates are larger than the OS that shipped last year. everyone ships crap these days.

    the big mistake that Microsoft seems to be making is they have given up the low end of computing. Smartphones and tablets. historically every time a new competitor takes over a market is by getting the low end first and then using that to attack the high end of the market. MS did this with Windows. it was crap compared to other OS's but cleaned house because it was easy to use and deploy. now with Windows Server 2008 R2 Microsoft is finally shipping a server OS with features that UNIX had in the 1990's. SQL Server is the same way. not as good as Oracle of DB2, but good enough at the right price for a lot of customers.

  7. Re:Or maybe not by TheKidWho · · Score: 4, Informative

    They certainly don't use iPhones to bill your credit card for purchases anyway

    Yes, yes they do. When I went there to purchase my iPad, the entire sale was done via an iPhone. They have little printers underneath the tables that print out your receipt too.

  8. Re:Or maybe not by sribe · · Score: 2, Informative

    I'm pretty sure the Apple Shop uses them too. They certainly don't use iPhones to bill your credit card for purchases anyway.

    They started out with Windows CE devices, which were horribly unreliable, requiring rebooting throughout the day. Now they use iPhones. No, really, an iPhone-based app, with an attachment that's like a slightly thick protective case with a card-reader on the back.

    In that regard, Windows Mobile 7 is a step in the wrong direction, because the custom built corporate mobile app isn't compatible with the idea of a centralised app store run by which ever Steve is in charge of the company in question.

    The app store has nothing at all to do with custom-built corporate apps. There's a totally different distribution method for that, under the control of the company doing the deployment. (My understanding is that at this point it needs refinement, that it's too much work for IT, but still, it's possible for a company to develop and deploy whatever apps they want without any involvement in the app store.)

  9. MS as system integrator by fermion · · Score: 3, Interesting
    The traditional MS model is to supply a limited set of software and depend on third parties to integrate and expand the selection to meet customers needs. While this has many advantages when customizing a general purpose computing device to serve a specific purpose, it does not work well when dealing with highly available and reliable embedded devices. We see this when HP abandons MS Windows 7 for tablets and when MS becomes a system integrator to deliver a video game console. MS did not deliver a set of tools to create a console, they create the console.

    What is clear is the mobile phone industry does not support the concept of a closed software base on which hardware is hacked to make it work. Two of the major mobile phone OS, Symbian and WebOS were derived from code that was developed to support an integrated PDA device, and is now open so it can be customized to a device. iPhone OS of course is completely open to Apple who can do as they wish to create an completely integrated product.

    If Google can gain real traction with Android then there might be a little hope for MS. Even though Android has the advantage of being open to manufacturers, it has the same disadvantage of being at least partly controlled by a company that does not count the end user as the primary customer. Both Google and MS are tried to jumpt start the market for it's products by creating a reference device(the nexus one and kin) but it is not clear that either attempt will work. In the Android case it might become so fragmented that Apps are not going to be compatible across the devices. For MS, there is frankly little reason for a manufacturer to use the mobile product. Such a phone would either directly compete with Blackberry or Android, with little differentiation, and, unlike xBox, the manufacturer will have little incentive to sell the phones for a loss.

    --
    "She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
  10. Re:MS makes money from almost every smartphone sol by thijsh · · Score: 2, Informative

    ActiveSync is used to synchronize with the PC, when synchronizing with a server it's called Exchange... and Google has that for the e-mail, agenda and contacts. The best part of it: It has PUSH functionality and it works great with my WinMo phone. It generally just takes 3 to 5 seconds to see a change in Google Calendar appear on my mobile's screen. Since it's widely used in companies the Exchange server model is one of the few Microsoft products that works (fairly) rock solid...

  11. Re:Symbian is not the problem by JanneM · · Score: 3, Informative

    "the next generation Symbian will have Qt as user interface."

    Qt isn't a user interface, it's a UI toolkit. The interface is almost completely orthogonal to this. Almost - you need a toolkit that can easily support the UI you want to build. But Qt, or GTK, or the Windows or OSX toolkits are all made for producing windowing user interfaces. Which is the cause of much of the trouble for Microsofts phone and PDA business, which doomed previous Linux-based mobile devices and which pushed Apple and Google to start from scratch with new systems specifically for mobile devices rather than trying to adapt existing stuff.

    A heavily customized Qt - as in, forget source compatibility with desktop apps - may possibly work for a tablet-sized device. Qt for mobiles is likely dead from the start. If Nokia does make a serious go of it, it will have little but the name in common with the desktop toolkit.

    --
    Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
  12. Re:Or maybe not by Tapewolf · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The app store has nothing at all to do with custom-built corporate apps. There's a totally different distribution method for that, under the control of the company doing the deployment. (My understanding is that at this point it needs refinement, that it's too much work for IT, but still, it's possible for a company to develop and deploy whatever apps they want without any involvement in the app store.)

    If I read correctly, you have to have more than 500 employees before Apple will allow you to do that and it's quite simply not the way the industry works, at least not in my country.
    What actually happens around here is that you have a lot of small shops which actually develop the app with, say, a dozen or so employees. Margins are fairly thin and there's a lot of competition so you'll probably never have a 500-employee mobile data outfit. The core product is then sold on to a number of larger firms and most of the deployments are less than 500 units each.

    Much as I dislike Windows Mobile, it and CE are still the best platform for doing this kind of thing, with full native development and no dicking around with approval unless you need to do kernel-level access. Though the firm I work for is starting to branch out into Android as well. While I'd love to develop for the iPhone, it doesn't look like we're going to be allowed to.

  13. Drop the Windows philosophy by UnknowingFool · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The problem with Windows Mobile is that MS has tried to leverage the Windows philosophy to mobile when it wasn't appropriate. They purposely made the OS be more Windows like even though the codebase has no relation to the Windows NT codebase. Yet at the same time it was sufficiently different from Windows desktop to frustrate users. While touch is available to WM phones, they didn't design the OS to use a different UI instead relying on the desktop UI with a few tweaks. In that aspect they just switched a mouse for a stylus and called it done.

    They got away with it for a while because there wasn't much competition for them because they were really the only game in town for corporate users. Then RIM came along. But they weren't worried. But MS didn't think about for consumers as much.

    Apple didn't bother to compete with MS in the corporate smart phone arena; they were making a consumer smart phone which was an under-served area. Apple when designing a smart phone realized that a consumer has different needs than a corporate user. They designed the UI and OS to be different.

    Also in terms of hardware, MS has followed the same philosophy. They just make the software and other companies use it on their hardware. Problem for MS is some of their hardware partners put out crap. While Windows Mobile isn't the most stable OS out there, some of their partners exacerbate problems with their shoddy hardware. Apple doesn't have this problem because they control the whole stack. I'm not saying that MS should do that but they should do a better job of working with their partners to make sure Windows 7 isn't sabotaged by the hardware.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  14. Five minutes with HTC made me want to murder by jollyreaper · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Slow, unresponsive, shittastic. An utter embarrassment. A wank-stain on the face of technology. Windows Mobile products make the users want to kill themselves as opposed to iPhones which only make the people who build them suicidal; in use the iPhone is actually quite enjoyable.

    --
    Kwisatz Haderach
    Sell the spice to CHOAM
    This Mahdi took Shaddam's Throne
    1. Re:Five minutes with HTC made me want to murder by wfolta · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Sorry, what's "enjoyable" about being forced to buy all your software from *ONE* place and only being *ALLOWED* to download what you are told you can download.

      Ignoring the fact that it works and does what I want, conveniently and well? I admit you got me there.

      As mostly Linux user, I will give Microsoft credit where it's due - you can run a Microsoft OS and throw on pretty much whatever free or commercial apps on it that you like, plus I understand from MS developer friends that they give away a lot of freebies to aid developers on Windows.

      Unlike Steve The Control Freak Jobs...

      Same with MacOS: I have R, Virtualbox (Linux, Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 7), along with the full and free (included on every MacOS DVD) developer tools on my laptop.

      Not the case with my iPad or iPhone, admittedly. Not the case with Windows 7 Mobile, either. Not absolutely the case with Android (if the cellphone manufacturer or cell carrier want to restrict you). And not worth using a Windows-Mobile-pre-7 device/OS to take advantage of it on the Microsoft side of the house.

      I am beginning to suspect that a lot of people in this thread have daddy issues, and Steve Jobs comes triggers that. Don't use an iPad/iPod/iPhone and you'll be alright.

  15. What Miscrosoft Must Do To Save by gearloos · · Score: 3, Funny

    What Microsoft must do to save their mobile buisiness: Simple, in Microsoft Fasion, Download the Android ASOP Standard Source. Recomplie with every reference to Android replaced by Windows 8 Mobile. When anyone complains just wait until they sue. The judgement will be much less than the profit. rinse, Repeat. Ohh wait that was Win 3.x err Win95.. err Sorry Win2k ohh wait no Excel, oh nm must have been defrag.. oh dang I must have meant Internet Explorer... well, you get the idea...

    --
    "Computers are a lot like Air Conditioners" "They both work great until you start opening Windows"
  16. From my exposure as a developer by GodfatherofSoul · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Microsoft lucked up, then fucked up. Palm had the market cornered, but their OS didn't scale as well when people were starting to look to their phones for more functionality (the Treo came out a bit too late to save their dominance). Windows CE was an inefficient behemoth with an interface that was not at all tailored to small mobile screens. But, it had the features people wanted at the time and when hardware caught up with it, Windows CE dominated for a while. The familiarity and comfort of their brand was enough to get people using misplaced UI metaphors like start buttons and microscopic icons. Then, for some screwball reason Microsoft decided to effectively stick their mobile development in the backyard shed. They didn't do anything to address the serious bugginess and quirkiness of their support libraries like ActiveSync and the Windows Mobile Device Center app just complicated the desktop/device synchronization problem. If mobile development was a basketball game, I'd call the FBI in to investigate them for point shaving. But, I have to assume that their leadership simply didn't want to deal with it, just as they didn't want to deal with the Internet back in the late 80s.

    So, just as they had sat idly by as fortune smiled upon them, they sat idly as their flawed platform drove more competitors into the market and customers away from them. Unlike sappy romantic comedies, you can't piss in your cornflakes, then expect a heartfelt speech will make everything alright by the time the credits roll.

    --
    I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
  17. Re:Or maybe not by StuartHankins · · Score: 3, Informative
    My understanding is you can use ad-hoc distribution for internal apps with no minimum number of employees. They also specifically have another level of distribution (the base level) which allows internal distribution to up to 100 devices.

    Ad Hoc Distribution Share your application with up to 100 other iPad, iPhone, or iPod touch users with Ad Hoc distribution. Share your application through email, or by posting it to a web site or server.

    http://developer.apple.com/programs/iphone/distribute.html#compare

  18. Re:They should embrace Android by wfolta · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I never would have thought I'd be in this place. I love linux. I want computers to be open.

    And Apple COMPUTERS are open. Full and free set of developer tools included on every MAC OS DVD. I have a whole host of open software on my laptop, ranging from R to Virtualbox. It depends on what you call a "computer" and what that means in terms of how you use it, how you interface with it, and what it does.

    And now I really want Microsoft to stand up and push back against the closed Apple iPad model. I want them to come out really hard, and push something more open, and I want them to run ads explaining why Apple's way is a bad idea.

    Apple is delivering an incredible and unique experience NOW. Microsoft, Linux, Android, etc, will not deliver a comparable experience this year (though there will be first-attempt slates based on these, just not comparable)... perhaps next year, eh? Meanwhile, I have four different book/research-paper apps, three comms/network apps, a RPN calculator, multiple drawing apps, multiple photo editing apps, a word processor, a spreadsheet, a presentation program (VGA output, too), photos, movies, music, multiple Twitter clients (and multiple other-social-media clients), games, flight tracking, GPS, multiple network sync/disk options, games out the wazoo, email, web browsing, task list managers, calendar, etc, etc. All on my iPad. Now.

    It has a long battery life, incredible build quality and beauty, a wonderful feel, is totally natural to interface with, and I use it all day long. Apple's way is a "bad idea", how exactly?

    Yes, yes, open is good. I just joined the OpenStreetMap site today, for example. But "open" is not necessarily as open as you think: cellphone restrictions on Android devices, for example, or the inability to upgrade an Android device to the latest OS, or apps being removed from the Android store, though people claimed that could never happen. And "closed" is not necessarily too closed for intended applications.

    The whole point is that the iPad is not a computer in the traditional sense of the word. Just as your car is not a computer, even though it has an incredible number of CPUs in it and multiple networks connecting them. Who knows, perhaps iMacs will become iPad-like computers, with full MacOS, including developer tools, on it? But iPads are a different KIND of device and waiting years for open, general-purpose computers to look and feel a lot like an iPad doesn't really make sense. (And to repeat myself in a more metaphorical way, "'Open', you keep using that word, but I don't think it means what you think it means."

  19. Re:Ship now! It's the only way! by wfolta · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Sorry, but shipping crap that may or may not get fixed later on is how the entire industry works.

    Actually, no. And the iPad is a good example. Quite a few no-brainer things were left out because they could not get them right: camera (there's a hole there for it, it's just not there), stock app, weather app, Book/PDF markup, printing, over-the-air sync'ing, etc. What is delivered is elegant and works well.

    Yes, there are bugs. I have had apps crash. (Though interestingly, perhaps because of the lack of multi-tasking at this point, I've not lost any data.) No software is perfect, and certainly there will always be the tension between the suits -- who want to ship -- and the coders -- who often want perfection. But Microsoft did set the bar very high in terms of shipping software that is as close to useless, unusable, and outdated as possible yet still getting customers to buy it. I've gone with x.0 releases on many (non-MS) products over the years and NOT been burned (okay, on the iPad, I waited for the x.0.1, i.e. the 3G). It's not as widespread as you make out.

  20. "Failure is not an option" by symbolset · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I actually agree with you about this in every other case, but Microsoft is a special case. Analysts are already saying that "Failure is not an option." Sigh. I guess we'll have to have one more iteration of this. Here's how it goes:

    Normally I'm not one to praise Microsoft's end results, but I'm not stupid. They hire the brightest minds from the best schools with strong foundations in classical IT art as well as contemporary vision and they work them to death because that hazy zone between exhaustion and physical failure is a special point where human brains integrate at miraculous levels. Microsoft has known this for twenty years and organizes its workers accordingly. These folks driven in this way can make an awesome mobile OS, they did, and I'd love to have a copy of the source for that bad boy. These Microsoft developers made a rock solid performant and genuinely innovative phone OS which is the core of Windows Phone 7. It's tiny, boots fast, suspends and resumes instantly, and pinches ergs like they're made of platinum. It has an intuitive touch-centric interface. It works flawlessly with all the latest technologies - hell, it'd make a great HPC OS if these jerks would think out of the box now and then. This was about two years and three reorgs ago. This is the mockup they'll trot out to the major phone vendors hoping to get them to push the platform - short a few apps but you can see the potential because it's beautiful, intuitive, responsive. They built an app store for it, and shopped the mockup around to app developers under NDA. Some of the AC posters here even have it and they're in awe of its incredible flexibility, its power, its potential - and they should be because this bare OS rocks. They float an early 2009 release date to some of their preferred pundits even though it's not finished yet because that's how you feed a flackalyst.

    It's a killer mobile OS but it's not a Windows yet. For six months they put some finishing touches on the version they intend to ship - integrating Bing search and Windows Live services into everything, building the Mobile Office apps for it, porting Silverlight, .NET for mobile and a bunch of other stuff. This is leveraging the platform so that it pushes all of the other Microsoft platforms because making products that can be extracted from their internicine application and server dependencies is not the One Microsoft Way. The shipping version then ran like a dog, leaked memory like a seive and crashed every few minutes. So eighteen months ago they rebooted the team and tried again. They got the same result, so nine months ago they reorg the group from higher up and try again. The new group can't get the thing to work right in nine months, so yesterday they reorg the entire entertainment and mobile division to be directly under Steve Ballmer and reboot their efforts yet again. This product was supposed to ship in early 2009. It is not even close to ready. It probably never will be because all of these internicine ties never did work well, are a moving target, and have reached an insurmountable level of complexity for a mobile device which must by definition be the ultimate in computer reliability and stability while remaining cutting edge in a dynamic market. It literally can't be done.

    Even today Microsoft executives are shopping around that slick mockup that no end user is ever going to see to their phone partners at the manufacturers and carriers, playing the push/pull game. "You want this. You need this. You're going to want to start planning the marketing around this product right away. This is going to be a slam dunk! And look - it says Microsoft on it everywhere so you know businesses are going to eat it up. [Hushed]It has IE and Outlook." / "Of course, this iPhone killer isn't for everybody - it's exclusive to our special friends. Committed friends l

    --
    Help stamp out iliturcy.