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PA Appeals Court Weighs Punishment For Students' Online Parodies

crimeandpunishment writes "Is it a student's right to free speech or a school's right to discipline? A US Appeals Court in Pennsylvania heard arguments Thursday on a case that could have far-reaching implications. The issue involves the suspension of two students, from two different Pennsylvania school districts, for web postings they made on their home computers. The students posted parody profiles on MySpace that mocked their principals. The American Civil Liberties Union argued on behalf of the students."

11 of 319 comments (clear)

  1. Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by AnonymousClown · · Score: 5, Insightful

    She used her principal's photograph and described him as a pedophile and mentioned a sex act. The girl later apologized, took down the page and was suspended for 10 days.

    OK, it's one thing to parody, it's another to accuse someone of a crime that will ruin them for the rest of their life. I think those kids shouldn't be suspended for parodies but when they are using actual images and making false accusations along with them, that's another matter. That fake profile could have gotten that principle murdered. There are many vigilantes out there who would love to knock off a child molester. Then there's the whole social stigma and ruining his life.

    Those kids went way too far - they went beyond parody.

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    1. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by morari · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Maybe. But even then, the principal should have screamed "libel!" and let the police/courts handle that. Instead the student was suspended, despite nothing ever being done at the school itself. This is really just another case of school system trying to overstep their boundaries. It would happen every single day if people don't keep them in check.

      --
      "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." --Paul Atreides, Dune
    2. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by Troy+Roberts · · Score: 5, Informative

      Sorry, you are wrong. Libel and Slander are not criminal offenses. They are civil offenses and this gives the principle a cause of action. So, he can sue.

    3. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 5, Insightful

      IANAL, but if I remember correctly intentionally misrepresenting someone as something that is patently false is libel or slander depending on how it is done. This is a criminal offense

      No. Defamation, which slander are libel are forms of, is generally not a criminal offense in the United States; it's a tort. There is no criminal defamation at the federal level, although 17 states do have criminal defamation statutes, though they seem to be rarely enforced and are generally considered a misdemeanor.

    4. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by Beyond_GoodandEvil · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Inside or outside of school is irrelevant
      Wrong. Your power as a teacher ends at the school, unless you want to be held liable for all the actions of the children you've ever taught?Because that sword cuts both ways.

      --
      I laughed at the weak who considered themselves good because they lacked claws.
    5. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by dkleinsc · · Score: 5, Interesting

      So are you saying that students have no free speech rights (when applied to teachers and principals, who are public officials) whatsoever?

      It's not quite as clear-cut as you think, that's for sure. I'll put forward a few scenarios, tell me where the line is drawn:
        (a) Student goes up to Mr Smith in school and says "Go fuck yourself."
        (b) Student goes up to Mr Smith in school and says "You suck"
        (c) Student goes up to Mr Smith in school and says "You're incapable of doing your job."
        (d) Student raises his hand in class, is acknowledged, and explains to the class that Mr Smith just did some math on the blackboard that assumed that 2=1.
        (e) A student has just finished shoveling their family's driveway, and Mr Smith (who happens to live next door) blows snow onto the driveway. The student responds on the scene by saying "Screw you" to Mr Smith.
        (f) A student complains to his friends that Mr Smith is incompetent.
        (g) A student complains to his friends that Mr Smith blew snow into his driveway.
        (h) A student thinks Mr Smith has applied school rules improperly and arbitrarily, and writes an editorial in the school newspaper laying out his case.

      I can think of a few more cases, but this seems like a good starting point. Where's the line between acceptable and unacceptable speech in your view?

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    6. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by silentcoder · · Score: 5, Informative

      Actually - it wasn't libel.
      The Jerry Fallwell case against Hustler failed on EXACTLY these grounds. Fundamental to the law is that "if there is no reasonable chance that anybody would take the claims seriously - the jury is REQUIRED to find the publisher INNOCENT."

      It is ONLY possible to be guilty of libel if the people familiar with the target would reasonably BELIEVE the claims. Since the school board themselves have testified that "nobody took the claims seriously" - it is therefore absolutely NOT libel.

      I don't LIKE the nature of this parody, but it IS in fact protected parody under U.S. law and the student acted entirely within her first amendment rights.

      --
      Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
  2. There is a difference... by joel.neely · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...between humor and malicious behavior. We don't excuse a schoolyard bully if he claims, "I was just having fun." Neither should we ignore malicious false statements merely because someone claims, "I was just doing a parody."

    Accusations against teachers and principles of sexual misconduct against their students are typically taken very seriously (with good reason). So how is a student who makes such statements, apparently in retaliation for being disciplined at school, that different from a student who retaliates by pulling a fire alarm?

  3. Let's boil it down the the essentials. by Rogerborg · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The clear intent of both students was to harass the teachers and cause disruption by undermining their authority. The publication was targeted at an audience (their peers), and the effect was felt inside the school.

    At this point, I could be describing: posting on the intartubes; putting up posters near the school with the same content; waving a placard outside the school gates; standing outside the window and yelling.

    In each case, the action was done outside the school, but the effects were felt inside it, and that is the salient point.

    Schools must be able to respond to actions that effect them by disciplining or excluding the student. That's independent of any civil or criminal actions brought against the students by the libelled individuals, and the police and prosecution services.

    Can we seriously countenance that a school can discipline or exclude a student for standing up in a classroom and yelling that Principal Peterson is a kiddie fiddler, but that it can't take action if the student moves three feet and yells the accusation in through the open window?

    If so, then schools might as well hand out copies of Lord of the Flies as their conduct rules.

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  4. Re:Not the school's problem by schon · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ask yourself something - assuming the student is guilty of the act - what's better for the student and their family:

    1. Being suspended for a few days and learning that actions have consequences.

    2. Being taken to court, possibly having criminal charges pressed against you, bankrupting your family due to legal expenses and the judgement against you, and learning that actions have consequences.

    Sounds like the school did what was best for the student, and is now being punished for it.

  5. But did the school have a right to suspend them??? by Bourdain · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Those kids went way too far - they went beyond parody.

    I completely agree with that is clearly beyond parody, but the real question is "Can schools punish students for web posts?" not "Can people be punished for [inflammatory] libel?".

    In a sense, these kids got off easy. They could have had real legal consequences as opposed to a school suspension.