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What Gamers Have In Common With Top Athletes

nk497 writes "It's no surprise that professional gamers aren't quite as fit as elite athletes, but they do have something in common. According to a British academic, top-level players show similar psychological attributes as top athletes, such as the ability to manage anxiety, and have reaction times on par with fighter pilots. Dr. Micklewright said, 'When I first got asked to do [the study], my initial reaction was "don't be ridiculous, gaming is nothing like sport." But the more I thought about it, the more similarities [became clear], and I became more and more convinced that it was close in many ways to sport.' While sitting in front of a screen might not have the same physical demands as running a marathon, neither do playing snooker or darts. Still, while gamers show good reflexes, their health was worse than expected, with one 20-something professional player showing the same aerobic health as a 60-year-old smoker." This story is based on a BBC radio report which you can currently hear, although that link seems to say that it won't last.

201 comments

  1. Take that back! by TheKidWho · · Score: 5, Funny

    I may be a gamer, but my right hand has the stamina of an 18 year old!

    1. Re:Take that back! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      But you're 12!

    2. Re:Take that back! by Locke2005 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yeah, but you have to watch out for those Repetitive Stress Injuries.

      --
      I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    3. Re:Take that back! by Stick32 · · Score: 1

      I may be a gamer, but my right hand has the stamina of an 18 year old!

      uhhh you sure that's solely thanks to videogames?

    4. Re:Take that back! by soppsa · · Score: 1

      It's the game lifestyle more than videogames themselves.

  2. nothing wrong here by scharkalvin · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    AS long as Google still shows OTHER hits for such searches I would say let BP pay Google through their nose to get their links to the top of the list.

    1. Re:nothing wrong here by Monkeedude1212 · · Score: 1

      I've never heard of that game, is it new?

    2. Re:nothing wrong here by devour · · Score: 5, Funny

      Clicked the wrong topic, eh? Don't worry, BP bashing is always relevant on the internet!

    3. Re:nothing wrong here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Clicked the wrong topic, eh? Don't worry, BP bashing is always relevant on the internet!

      Like shooting fish in an oil barrel.

    4. Re:nothing wrong here by glynnman · · Score: 1

      not new ... look up saturday night live +wii games starring Alec Baldwin

  3. How to stay healthy while gaming by Pojut · · Score: 1, Offtopic

    Many of them are obvious suggestions, but here are some tips on how to stay healthy while gaming. I hope it helps some of you folks out.

    Mods, please mod this post offtopic or troll due to website pumping.

    1. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You don't have to ask me twice! :)

    2. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Monkeedude1212 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If you're going to plug yourself, at least set up a webcam.

      *pause for laughter*

      Seriously though, I think there are a lot of physical activities that gamers would enjoy if they just put forth the effort to go and try them. For example, I own just about every Star Wars game there is, and I'm pretty big on medieval settings.

      There was a thing this past weekend at the local military museum, which had preformers of warriors from all era's, ancient Roman Gladiators, Vikings, Crusaders, Imperialistic, civil war, WW2, you name it. For me, it was interesting to watch the Gladiators face off and to watch the knights have duels. As a fun activity, they were giving beginner sword fighting lessons to people willing, in a full suit of chainmail. Complete with all the fixings, leather gloves, a tabard, iron helmet, greaves, pauldrons...

      It was a very intense workout, just running around swinging a sword. I think I may try it again, should I get more time. I think its things like that (not necessarily the only case), that there are physical activities gamers might enjoy but they... well... don't...

    3. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're an AC; you don't have any mod points!

      Yeah, I know, you could be a member posting AC so your mod points stick. But then the joke wouldn't be funny... not that it would anyway...

    4. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Pojut · · Score: 1

      A few of my friends who have far less long-term injuries than I do (vertabrae fusion, wrist/knee/hip problems, and more) are active participants in the local LARP and/or Dagorhir communities. Every one of them is in awesome shape.

    5. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by clone53421 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I know, you could be a member posting AC so your mod points stick.

      Nope, they don’t stick. I’ve tried it.

      It doesn’t even warn you that your moderation will be invalidated if you post anonymously. Verify it by opening the CID link afterward... the moderation is gone.

      --
      Alexander Peter Kristopeit bought his basement from his mommy for one dollar.
    6. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I didn't have any mod points today sadly. I said it because I don't like Pojut much, every second or third post of his is just him fishing for hits to his shitty blog I find.

      And Clone is correct, mod points don't stick if you post, even as AC.

    7. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Pojut · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      didn't have any mod points today sadly. I said it because I don't like Pojut much, every second or third post of his is just him fishing for hits to his shitty blog I find.

      My karma says otherwise. But hey, no biggie...can't please everyone!

    8. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Seriously though, I think there are a lot of physical activities that gamers would enjoy

      This might sound crazy, but I've found that my gaming skills have improved over the years, thank in part to my study of tai chi chuan.

      I used to notice that I'd get all cramped up with painful hands and feet after a half-hour of playing a game (or just sitting at my computer, for that matter). I'm older than the average gamer, and I found that no matter which online game I tried, I'd be one of the worst players in the game.

      My ability to sustain relaxed attentiveness, along with the improved mental processes that come from the study and practice of tai chi have helped me to improve across a wide variety of gaming types. Now I find that I learn the game more quickly and am more able to be competitive. With some games, like Modern Warfare 2 or Borderlands, my ability to focus better and react faster have made me surprisingly good, not just for my age, but for any age. In games like Eve Online, I am more patient and seem to be able to process more information.

      Outside of gaming, the improvements in function and enjoyment have been even greater. If any of you would like to become more fit as well as more relaxed, healthy and balanced, I would highly recommend taking the time to find a good tai chi teacher and give it a chance. It's not very hard at the beginning and the benefits come very quickly. I see all types of athletes in the school in which I study and they all say that tai chi has improved their respective game. There have been some recent studies that show tai chi increases the body's production of HGH and improves cardio-respiratory function. They used to believe that you had to raise your heart rate to improve your cardio fitness and stamina, but it turns out that's not the case.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    9. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      *Lightning bolt" *Lightning bolt* *Lightning bolt" *Lightning bolt* *Lightning bolt" *Lightning bolt*

      Ha, yeah, no thanks.

    10. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      An unimpressive example of the effectiveness of goal-oriented behavior.

    11. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He forgot to mention that the rest of your shitty posts are either offtopic or just plain wrong. Maybe you should go to school and learn about computers, then come back.

    12. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by xaxa · · Score: 1

      To keep your mod points while posting anonymously, use your other browser/internet connection ;-).

    13. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Pojut · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      Maybe you should post under your actual account instead of granting credence to the Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory.

      I mean, come on...if you are going to flame someone, at least have the balls to do it under your username.

    14. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Pojut · · Score: 1

      I don't find that to be crazy at all. My fiancee experienced a similar bump in her gaming ability (and general well being) when she started to really get into yoga. Learning how to focus her breathing and tightening certain muscles while simultaneously relaxing others has provided her with an increase in general concentration, mentally and physically. She's said it has helped her in many aspects of her life, but the most obvious one I've noticed (other than her increased flexibility, rawr) is that she has become a much more skilled gamer.

    15. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why do that when we can just troll you all day as AC? :)

    16. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Pojut · · Score: 0, Troll

      Because it's the pussy way out.

      Then again, people say you are what you eat...so...you must be popular with the ladies! ;-)

    17. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have sigs enabled, so I would argue that every one of those posts has a reference to your site. :)

    18. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by dave562 · · Score: 1

      there are physical activities gamers might enjoy but they... well... don't...

      For a certain subset of gamers, they are playing games as an escape from reality. For a subset of that subset, they are supplanting their inability to achieve in real life with their ability to achieve in the game. Where as one person might find the idea of putting on a full suit of armor and swinging around a heavy weapon to be fun, there are others who would just consider it a burden and find that the experience reenforced their preference to suit up and swing weapons around in an online environment.

      Another poster mentioned tai chi. I found that when I started training martial arts (tai chi, bagua and kung fu), I found that I wanted to spend less time playing games. I felt like I was wasting time playing games, and that the time could be better spent "leveling up" my real life skills.

    19. Re:How to stay healthy while gaming by Pojut · · Score: 1

      BURN!!! Oh wait...

  4. Simple by drumcat · · Score: 0, Troll

    Not much.

  5. Real life sports. by jack2000 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Bah, who needs em. I'm going to have better sports. With blackjack,alcohol and hookers. Infact forget the sports.

    1. Re:Real life sports. by Kjella · · Score: 1

      Just define blackjack to be a sport, it's certainly no worse than poker. One down, two creative rewrites to go.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    2. Re:Real life sports. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In fact, forget the blackjack and the sports....

    3. Re:Real life sports. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Futurama is the shit.

    4. Re:Real life sports. by jack2000 · · Score: 1

      How about some sort of sport where the higher the alcohol count in your blood the higher the bonus to your score is. The thing you are expected to do while seriously drunk should be something that gets harder the drunker you are.
      I'd certainly watch that, considering i don't care much for normal sports.

  6. They meet girls through their hobby by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Athletes meet cheerleaders and gamers meet avatars, and those avatars are probably better looking than the cheerleaders. And don't tell me I'm sexist because there is almost no chance that you are 1) female, 2) heterosexual, 3) a gamer, and 4) reading this post.

    1. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by mightyQuin · · Score: 1

      Yes on all four. Can I call you sexist now?

      --
      Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got some idea balls to remove from a manatee tank.
    2. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Athletes meet cheerleaders and gamers meet avatars, and those avatars are probably better looking than the cheerleaders.

      So, I get to choose between an average-looking cheerleader (read: above average by any usual standard of attractiveness) and an incredibly sexy female avatar (who’s played by a man in real life)...

    3. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by Locke2005 · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Oh, in the case of my daughter who is constantly picking up men online, a 9-year old girl. But then, she actually is an AllStar cheerleader with muscle tone the other cheerleaders' moms envy, just a little young to be legal.

      --
      I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    4. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Are you single? If so, you can call me anything you want!

    5. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by Abstrackt · · Score: 1

      Athletes meet cheerleaders and gamers meet avatars, and those avatars are probably better looking than the cheerleaders. And don't tell me I'm sexist because there is almost no chance that you are 1) female, 2) heterosexual, 3) a gamer, and 4) reading this post.

      This may come as a shock to you, but there have been real women on the Internet for a while now.

      --
      They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance. - Terry Pratchett
    6. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by Locke2005 · · Score: 1

      How is this flamebait? The point is, when you try to pickup Avatars online, you may be engaging in homosexuality or pedophilia and not even realize it.

      --
      I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    7. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Wait a minute... the Governor of Illiinois is a woman? And what are you doing posting at slashdot, you're supposed to be fixing Illinois' economy or something, aren't you?

    8. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by mightyQuin · · Score: 2, Funny

      Wrong quin, I'm not even an American, look a little further north. More on topic, gamers can increase their skill significantly by dressing up as in-game characters.

      --
      Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got some idea balls to remove from a manatee tank.
    9. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by yurtinus · · Score: 1

      Tried that, but the bear suit just made tanking impossible- I can't click with claw-gloves on, and everybody claimed I was too muffled on ventrilo.

      --
      +1 Disagree
    10. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by icebraining · · Score: 1

      I'm not even an American, look a little further north.

      That's impossible, unless you live on a boat.

    11. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by mightyQuin · · Score: 1

      I'm king of the world.

      --
      Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got some idea balls to remove from a manatee tank.
    12. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by endymion.nz · · Score: 1

      Homosexuality and paedophilia are things that people do to people, not things that figurative representations of people do to figurative representations of other people. At best you can call it role playing.

      --
      mediocrity rules, man
    13. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by Locke2005 · · Score: 1

      Go ahead and try asking a 9 year old girl online for her address, then explain when law enforcement comes to pay you a visit that you were just "role playing"! Point is, don't make any assumptions about who it is that you are communicating with online. Myself, I always just assume the typist at the other end is an FBI agent trolling for evidence of criminal activity.

      --
      I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    14. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by Locke2005 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, that "I thought it was an 18 year old woman, not a 10 year old boy" excuse always holds up really well in court... and those news articles about how you were sexting with minors won't embarrass you at all.

      --
      I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    15. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by endymion.nz · · Score: 1

      Well call it what it is then, don't use words that mean different things. :(

      --
      mediocrity rules, man
    16. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your slip is showing, your majesty.

    17. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      there have been real women on the Internet for a while now.

      Not the parts of it that you visit...

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    18. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by mightyQuin · · Score: 1

      To err is human and my slip is divine.

      --
      Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got some idea balls to remove from a manatee tank.
    19. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      I didn't really believe it, I was joking. How does dressing up as in-game characters increase yuor skill level? I don't get it.

    20. Re:They meet girls through their hobby by mightyQuin · · Score: 1

      It's a form of immersion. Similar concept as lowlights and surround sound.

      --
      Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got some idea balls to remove from a manatee tank.
  7. Unpopular answer by DaveV1.0 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They both get overpaid to play a game.

    --
    There is no "-1 offended" or "-1 you don't agree with me" mod options for a reason.
    1. Re:Unpopular answer by Aladrin · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I was going to go for something more along the lines of "both serve no purpose to society other than entertainment", but yours fits, too.

      On the other hand, are they the 'top athletics' and 'top players' because they have the coordination and ability to handle stress, or did becoming the 'top X' cause them to gain these abilities? I suspect it's the former and they served only to train them a bit.

      I'm a diehard gamer, but I'm not foolish enough to think it's anything other than pointless entertainment, just like almost all hobbies.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    2. Re:Unpopular answer by geekoid · · Score: 4, Insightful

      define overpaid.

      They get what they can get. They bring in a lot of money to the owners, why not charge that much?

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    3. Re:Unpopular answer by vlm · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      They both get overpaid to play a childs game.

      Almost no one watches real athletes like mountain climbers, weight lifters, soldiers qualifications courses, or deep sea divers. No one watches real gamers like hard core strategic wargamers. Just big steroid addicts playing kids ball games, and twitchy shooters.

      Another similarity is the media coverage is scripted to an intellectual level that makes a typical Noggin/Nick Jr/PBS Sprout cartoon sound like PHD thesis material. Ever catch some ESPN while working out in the gym? All simple one syllable words, lots of grunting.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    4. Re:Unpopular answer by somersault · · Score: 2, Informative

      I'm a diehard gamer, but I'm not foolish enough to think it's anything other than pointless entertainment, just like life.

      TWGFTFY :P

      --
      which is totally what she said
    5. Re:Unpopular answer by dward90 · · Score: 1

      How much money do professional gamers make? A friend of mine played top-tier MLG games for money for a while, but he barely covered his travel expenses. Assuming 8-hour days, he didn't even make minimum wage. How many gamers make enough money that gaming is their only source of income? Athletes? Hint: there are way more athletes.

      --
      My other sig is clever.
    6. Re:Unpopular answer by CannonballHead · · Score: 5, Funny

      Overpaid: the quality or attribute of someone else being paid more than I am.

    7. Re:Unpopular answer by geekoid · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Seriously? Football players aren't real athletes? Let see you take a hit from a 280 pound person that moves like a gazelle.

      You comments is stupid.

      All simple one syllable words, lots of grunting.

      SO your argument build down to a poorly worded ad hom attack. You might want o rethink criticizing other peoples intellect until you've sharpened your ability to have a discussion.

      You sound like someone who insults mathematicians because you don't understand the subject.

      .

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    8. Re:Unpopular answer by srussia · · Score: 4, Informative

      Almost no one watches real athletes like mountain climbers, weight lifters, soldiers qualifications courses, or deep sea divers.

      Well, no true Scotsman does.

      --
      Set your phasers on "funky"!
    9. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "define overpaid."

      Actually everyone is confused about this issue, the reason people get paid so much has to do with the law of large numbers and NOT because thats "what they can get", it's just an artifact of having a large population and no tax on percentage of high money volume, which is desperately needed but of course which will never happen do to human greed.

    10. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      so we should pay them multiple millions of dollars cause they are too stupid to do anything else with their lives but to make us laugh while they chase a ball like dogs

      fuck football players, even if 99% of them were not juiced up thugs too pussy to do anything real or meaningful

    11. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Child's game" does not mean "game that I don't like". And yes, that IS what you were saying.

    12. Re:Unpopular answer by IANAAC · · Score: 1

      They both get overpaid to play a childs game.

      Almost no one watches real athletes like mountain climbers, weight lifters, soldiers qualifications courses, or deep sea divers. No one watches real gamers like hard core strategic wargamers. Just big steroid addicts playing kids ball games, and twitchy shooters.

      I don't know how old you are, or what kind of shape you believe to be in, but I would counter your argument with "Try to play any of these kids ball games". It actually does take skill. I am, of course, referring to AmFootball, Baseball, Basketball, etc. and my personal favorite - soccer. Played well, any of these are physically demanding and require a fair amount of mental skill as well.

      The fact that we tend to take these sports as entertainment is something altogether different.

      But yes, I think some pro athletes - the same ones we follow in tabloids just as we do any other celebrity - are overpaid. I also think the overpaid ones are no longer in their respective sports for their love of said sport, rather they stay in it for the money/fame.

      Yeah, I'm generalizing.

    13. Re:Unpopular answer by HaZardman27 · · Score: 1

      and twitchy shooters

      Look up some videos of Daigo Umehara playing Street Fighter. Many people underestimate the level of intellect that goes in to playing Street Fighter (playing it well, anyhow), and I guarantee he's smarter than you.

      --
      Apparently wizard is not a legitimate career path, so I chose programmer instead.
    14. Re:Unpopular answer by somersault · · Score: 1

      Almost no one watches real athletes like mountain climbers, weight lifters, soldiers qualifications courses, or deep sea divers.

      A few points:

      Mountain climbers and soldiers, I'll give you ;)

      I lift weights. Weights are easy, it just takes the right pattern of reps at a certain percentage of your maximum, and good nutrition, to see gains (especially when beginning, and by the time you hit plateus you're probably already a monster). They're pretty much equivalent to playing any RPG where all you need is time to gain XP.

      SCUBA diving is another one I've done. There were loads of old guys in the club and they even described it as an "old man's sport". You need basically no strength apart from when you're getting back into the boat. It's all just about controlling your buoyancy and monitoring your air supplies, and not ascending too quickly at the end. The rest of the time you're almost weightless and it requires very little effort. Deep sea diving on different types of gas is a bit more complex, but it's still not going to take an elite athlete to do it, just someone with a cool head and a lot of diving experience.

      No one watches real gamers like hard core strategic wargamers. Just big steroid addicts playing kids ball games, and twitchy shooters.

      I actually think some people probably still do watch Starcraft tournaments and the like but I'm not sure; I've always found those types of game to be boring as hell. I love turn based strategy games like Chess and Risk so it's not that I dislike strategy games per se, but I just find realtime strategy games annoying. I can do okay on them, but I just don't really enjoy the rushing for resources nor having to be a "manager", I prefer to be part of the action. Twitchy FPS games are simply fun, and you do still need to be strategic to do well. Even after I stopped playing CS for a few years, I tried it again one time and was still able to do okay despite my aim being very rusty, simply because I knew the levels and played relatively intelligently.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    15. Re:Unpopular answer by vlm · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Football players aren't real athletes? Let see you take a hit from a 280 pound person that moves like a gazelle.

      So, a little old lady whom takes a hit by a 3K pound car must be approximately ten times more of a "real" athlete than a football player?

      You might want o rethink criticizing other peoples intellect until you've sharpened your ability to have a discussion.

      You sound like someone who insults mathematicians because you don't understand the subject

      I'm referring to the intellectual level of the coverage on ESPN, and to some extent the culture of willful stupidity that surrounds it. Try watching it sometime. Note, I used to be highly interested in football, watch all the Packers games. Its a game of considerable tactical maneuvering, strategic insight, logistical long term planning. That's what I got out of it, anyway. What I see in ESPN and media sports coverage in general is a bunch of "grunt grunt yell look at that hit grunt grunt" on to the next story, probably about the soap opera drama of the players, which actually has nothing to do with the game or sports itself. There's too much junk to filter to bother watching anymore.

      You comments is stupid.

      Well sorry if I hit a little too close to home with you. I'll stick to less controversial topics, like bashing religion and race in the future. Geeze. It's just a kids game, nothing to get worked up about.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    16. Re:Unpopular answer by sammy+baby · · Score: 1

      Nice reference.

      By extension, I posit that the only true sports are the caber toss, the stone put, and golf.

    17. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      so we should pay them multiple millions of dollars cause they are too stupid to do anything else with their lives but to make us laugh while they chase a ball like dogs

      Straw man arguments are lies.

    18. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Seriously? Football players aren't real athletes? Let see you take a hit from a 280 pound person that moves like a gazelle.

      A 280 lb rugby player might move like a gazelle. A 280 lb football player moves like a morbidly obese gazelle.

    19. Re:Unpopular answer by vlm · · Score: 1

      I lift weights.

      The "sportyness" is in the endless practicing and learning how not to damage joints, tendons, ligaments, etc. Eating the right foods, supplements, etc. Balancing lifting with at least some cardio to get the fat percentage low enough. Also there is some real world utility to being strong, its more "serious" or "adult" than moving a ball around by kicking it or tossing it.

      SCUBA diving

      My mistake, I meant the guys whom are paid huge money to weld, repair ships, work on shallow water offshore oil facilities, etc. Those dudes are hard core athletes, the muscular ability required is way beyond watching the tropical fish from underwater. The kind of guy whom relaxes when he gets out of the water, not when hes in the water.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    20. Re:Unpopular answer by StikyPad · · Score: 1

      They're both whiny bitches with overinflated egos?

    21. Re:Unpopular answer by uniquegeek · · Score: 1

      I'd watch hockey if it wasn't boxing. If I wanted to go see boxing, I'd go to a boxing match.

    22. Re:Unpopular answer by Bakkster · · Score: 1

      so we should pay them multiple millions of dollars cause they are too stupid to do anything else with their lives but to make us laugh while they chase a ball like dogs

      Should? Probably not. But people do pay to watch football (either through tickets of ad revenue), so I'd rather the players got their fair share of such a lucrative entertainment industry, rather than it all going towards promoters.

      fuck football players, even if 99% of them were not juiced up thugs too pussy to do anything real or meaningful

      Says the AC posting on Slashdot. How does that compute to let you judge others for being 'pussy' or not making meaningful contributions?

      --
      Write your representatives! Repeal the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics!
    23. Re:Unpopular answer by vlm · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      I would counter your argument with "Try to play any of these kids ball games". It actually does take skill.

      OK, I play kids games. My personal specialty, which happens to be "hide n seek", when compared to:

      AmFootball, Baseball, Basketball, etc. and my personal favorite - soccer.

      demonstrates the sillyness of adults taking a kids game too seriously. Its just a kids game.

      Nothing wrong with playing kids games with the kids, or joining an amateur league to meet people and/or an excuse to drink some beer after the game and/or an excuse for cardiovascular fitness.

      I'm making fun of something entirely different, the pro athletes and fans that take those kids games waaaaaay too seriously, the sports media that (exclusively?) narrowcasts at a room temperature IQ level, the dumb arguments that if it doesn't involve a ball like object flying thru the air its not a "real sport" etc.

      Any time you hear someone live or on TV yelling and screaming about some sports related topic, hey, its just a kids game.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    24. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you mean handegg players?

    25. Re:Unpopular answer by blair1q · · Score: 1

      So, a little old lady whom[sic] takes a hit by a 3K pound car must be approximately ten times more of a "real" athlete than a football player?

      If she actually takes the hit, and stops the car in its tracks, instead of being critically injured by it, then yes, she's ten times Brian Urlacher in my eyes.

    26. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You keep saying "it's a kids game".

      Prove it.

      Things that do NOT constitute proof include "ESPN is dumb" and "Some people take the game too seriously", which thus far have been the sum of your argument.

    27. Re:Unpopular answer by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      In the case of major league sports, I'd say making more money than the President of the United states makes is way overpaid, considering the weight on that man's shoulders.

    28. Re:Unpopular answer by vlm · · Score: 1

      If she actually takes the hit, and stops the car in its tracks, instead of being critically injured by it, then yes, she's ten times Brian Urlacher in my eyes.

      Pro football players are occasionally critically injured while playing, and I think they should get credit for trying. So should granny in this scenario.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    29. Re:Unpopular answer by Romberg · · Score: 1

      And competitive haggis eating contests.

    30. Re:Unpopular answer by neonKow · · Score: 1

      They play hockey at hockey games. The boxing comes free of charge. Think of it as mud wrestling. The mud wrestling comes free of charge too.

    31. Re:Unpopular answer by Arthur+Grumbine · · Score: 1

      So, a little old lady whom takes a hit by a 3K pound car must be approximately ten times more of a "real" athlete than a football player?

      If she can take that hit thirty times in the course of three hours, each time jumping back to her feet and begging the coach for more opportunities, just so she could win a competition - hell yeah she'd be more of a real athlete in my book!

      --
      Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure everything I just said is completely wrong.
    32. Re:Unpopular answer by tophermeyer · · Score: 1

      But you can't just think of the paycheck, you also have to consider the total compensation package. In the case of the President, his salary and responsibilities come with things like free housing, personal aircraft, and having the worlds most powerful military calling him Sir.

    33. Re:Unpopular answer by somersault · · Score: 1

      Also there is some real world utility to being strong, its more "serious" or "adult" than moving a ball around by kicking it or tossing it.

      It's definitely beneficial to be strong, but professional football players are generally more fit than bodybuilders, and probably just as strong as many of them when it comes to their legs at least. There's a lot of overlap among the two, and IMO it's only your own opinion of what is important that decides that a weightlifter has more value than a footballer.

      I happen to think football as a game is overrated, but I do respect the athletic ability of the players. Most bodybuilders, even if they also do a bit of cardio, would have nowhere near the stamina of a footballer for, nor would they have the same level of body awareness and coordination in their legs and therefore would be more likely to hurt themselves after becoming fatigued for whatever reason - say if they went camping with a heavy backpack.

      The type of athlete that I currently respect above any other would probably be rock climbers - they're usually wiry little guys but have incredibly good all-round functional strength, stamina, proprioception, confidence and coordination.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    34. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No one watches real gamers like hard core strategic wargamers.

      people probably still do watch Starcraft ... I love turn based strategy games like Chess and Risk

      I'm not sure why the GP didn't mention this in his reply to you, but it bothers me so I'll say it.

      "Strategy game" != wargame

      Wargames are realistic military simulations, although in the last few centuries, people have also started playing them for fun. (Especially certain very evenly matched historic battles.)

      Abstract games like chess are not wargames, even if they do include military themes.

      An RTS is not a wargame. It may LOOK as if it is realistic, but this is just the graphics deceiving you. (Example: No confusion or delay in delivering orders, even in pre-modern battles. This was not a minor point, it was an essential part of how battles were won or lost.)

      Comparing Starcraft to hard core (read: military) wargaming is like comparing astrology to astronomy: They're kind of related in origin, but that is where the similarity ends.

      (No, I don't play. But I would if I had an opponent to play with.)

    35. Re:Unpopular answer by somersault · · Score: 1

      Oh. In that case, I probably would enjoy the "war games". I did buy some game that was meant to simulate some Napoleonic battles for my Amiga when I was a kid, but I had no idea how the hell it worked.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    36. Re:Unpopular answer by westlake · · Score: 1

      They get what they can get. They bring in a lot of money to the owners, why not charge that much?

      The promoter has always known that the star attraction is his best guarantee of success at the box office. Mark Twain's satirical playbill for the Roman Coliseum didn't stray too far from the truth. The Innocents Abroad
      [1869, Chapter 26]

    37. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What defines a 'real' gamer, or a 'real' athlete. Thinking that your 'hardcore strategic wargames' are somehow more important than a 'kid's ball games' is pretty silly - ultimately, it's still make-believe. As far as athletes go, a mountain climber probably won't be the best marathon runner or football player or whatnot, either. And as far as weight lifters go, way too much of bodybuilding has turned into 'who can take the most hardcore drugs and chemicals that may or may not be legal' game.

    38. Re:Unpopular answer by Dalambertian · · Score: 1

      Overpaid my ass. Esports are not mainstream enough for all but a few to be paid to play. The sponsors haven't quite woken up to reality yet. Take the HDH invitational : every single game had more than 100,000 views, yet the prize pool was a mere $2500, and that was apparently the largest prize pool for a foreign starcraft tournament.

    39. Re:Unpopular answer by bitt3n · · Score: 1

      define overpaid.

      makes as much as or more money than I do

    40. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Drugs? In relation, that's where high FOVs and picmips, and physics exploits (not rocket jump, but exploiting framerate caps for higher jump heights) come in. Sad thing is, they all treat this as the only possible way to play these days, in a flat textured wide eyed brightskins arena... and for the "misremembered" bit, often make a hardware excuse about it to justify their tweaks. Serious "pro" gamers seriously gaming on a FX5200, Intel GMA or on a LAPTOP? Give me a break.

    41. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That would rule out the "pro" gamers, then.

    42. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      MLG (console gaming) is a joke compared to professional PC gaming, and in particular PC gaming in the east. However, there are very few players that can make a career out of gaming. The smartest make enough money to fund an upstart like Thresh did. I guess some have done okay with their endorsements (Fatality, etc.). I am sure that there are eastern gamers that have done something similar.

    43. Re:Unpopular answer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't underestimate the influence of sports on culture.

    44. Re:Unpopular answer by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      You can buy a lot of houses and airplanes with a multiumillion dollar per year salary.

  8. Gaming+exercise=??? by ndogg · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Since it's been shown that aerobic exercise can improve reaction time, I can't help but wonder how much better of gamers they would be if they also exercised a bit as well. They wouldn't need to go to a gym. Just some running, or crunches, or something on a regular basis would help, I would bet.

    --
    // file: mice.h
    #include "frickin_lasers.h"
    1. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      No kidding. Years ago when I played Quake 3 professionally I had regular workouts and they helped a lot. Especially with fatigue and such, really keeps your mind sharp. I think it also helps prevent RSI type problems.

      Similar to how race car drivers or golf players lift weights (although maybe not obvious, race car drivers undergo a great deal of physical stress; another hobby of mine). Strength helps in many ways, including gaming.

    2. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by AthleteMusicianNerd · · Score: 1

      A lot of football players play A LOT of video games. Ray Lewis plays like 8 hours a day.

    3. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Interestingly enough, the Korean pro gaming league apparently makes their members do just that. link

    4. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually many of the professional and semi-professional gamers I know already are well aware of this. I haven't seen that study before but it's been collective knowledge since at least ancient greece that one cannot have a strong mind without a strong body, or a strong body without a strong mind. I used to be semi-professional (local tours, minor sponsors paying costs, no yearly salary though) and lived with a number of other gamers at the time, including a semi-professional RTS player (I'm FPS), and we were all well aware of the importance of fitness.

      Though...we are Canadian - and the obcessity problem in the US is way worse - so I can see how a study would miss gamers like myself and my friends.

    5. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      First off, I resent the "how much better off gamers would be if they also exercised" :) I get lots of exercise thank you, and it's not exactly uncommon.

      I'm a very heavy gamer (as per the recent article, 48 hours a week would be a slow week for me), and used to compete at organized events within driving range. I would generally place either within the top 5, and got 1st a few times. (these were all for FPS games such as quake2, half-life, and much later UT2004, though sometimes super smash bros or street fighter, and at the last one BlazBlue would get fired up "unofficially" at the end, and the results generally mirrored the tournament itself).

      Binding factor between those that rank highly...none are overweight, most either exercise or get exercise from their jobs. (I work outside a lot, and enjoy hiking and camping)

      Just something to think about there, the stereotypical overweight gamers are NOT the best, or even the most common ones, so if you're sick of getting constantly headshotted before you can get a shot off, maybe put down the damned twinkie and take a walk instead of grabbing another bag of potato chips and swearing at the screen. (yes, I've met a few of those as well...)

      Granted this only applies to fast paced games like FPS's, RTS's, and Fighting games, so for other genre YMMV

      Posting anon because logins to slashdot are blocked at my work :/
      -Raptor85

    6. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by AmberBlackCat · · Score: 1

      If only there were a game system that encouraged mild physical activity...

    7. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by assertation · · Score: 1


      Since it's been shown that aerobic exercise can improve reaction time, I can't help but wonder how much better of gamers they would be if they also exercised a bit as well. They wouldn't need to go to a gym. Just some running, or crunches, or something on a regular basis would help, I would bet.

      Or a copy of DDR ( Dance Dance Revolution ).

      I used to read a weight loss success site where some sorry shut in like that got sucked into DDR and lost something like 100 lbs.

    8. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by indiechild · · Score: 1

      I don't think mild physical activity like that promoted in some Wii games helps all that much. It's better than nothing, especially if you're a pensioner, but I don't think it'll increase your reaction times.

    9. Re:Gaming+exercise=??? by John+Saffran · · Score: 1

      That's precisely why the training regime of korean pro-gamers includes fitness and muscle building to improve both stamina and reaction time.

  9. Sports injuries... by PPalmgren · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Sports typically have one or two major common injuries associated with them, like knee damage for cross country skiing. I wonder if this will show on gamers in 20 or 30 years.

    I'm specifically interested if mental problems occur later in life from over-use of the brain. Some gamers typically work a mental job, then come home and engage in 5-6 hours of very mentally intensive activity. Your brain gets hammered pretty heavily over the course of a day.

    Another possibility is eye damage. During intense gaming sessions I notice that I dry my eyes out repeatedly focusing by not blinking during specific events. I wonder if this will effect me in 20 years. On another note, most gamers I've met have the same vision as me and we can wear each other's glasses without issue.

    1. Re:Sports injuries... by Pojut · · Score: 1

      Sports typically have one or two major common injuries associated with them, like knee damage for cross country skiing. I wonder if this will show on gamers in 20 or 30 years.

      Wrist and tendon issues are fairly common amongst older gamers, although these can be prevented to a certain degree by stretching your hands properly and taking breaks.

    2. Re:Sports injuries... by Bicx · · Score: 1

      I've played computer/video games ever since I was a small child, and at age 23, I also work a as a software dev. I can no longer wear contacts due to my poor eye health, even though I've worn them for 7 years. Right now, if I put contacts in my eyes for one day, my eyes will be red all the next day. Continued use will cause extreme redness, blurry vision, and sensitivity to light. I don't have direct proof of the cause, but I suspect my eyes have sustained damage from several years of wearing contacts with dry eyes, and I suspect the dry eyes came from staring at a screen for hours on end. I recently invested in a decent pair of glasses that I'll be switching to indefinitely.

    3. Re:Sports injuries... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sounds very familiar to the same situation I was going through (I'm 26). I had the same sensitivity issues and had to stop wearing contacts, and I got Lasik surgery last week.

    4. Re:Sports injuries... by BJ_Covert_Action · · Score: 1

      You know, I was developing sore wrists from typing at a keyboard all day when I started my first job. I bought a wrist brace to help manage my ergnomics, but that got pretty old fast. You know what I figured out? You can work out your wrist, strengthen it, and this will help nullify some of the wrist/tendon issues from excessive keyboard or gaming work. I started doing pull-ups (knuckles turned outwards, away from the body) which really help to strengthen the forearm and the wrist. I also started using some of those squeeze torsion spring things to increase my grip. Since I started actually building the muscle and using the tendons and ligaments in my forearms and wrists and hands, all of the old pain and wear from over-using a keyboard went away. I'll bet hardcore gamers could benefit from similar exercises...

      Plus you get the added benefit of having forearms like Popeye, and that just looks damn tough.

    5. Re:Sports injuries... by kaoshin · · Score: 1

      When I was younger, I had bad vision and they told me if I continued to stare at the computer screen which at the time was a CRT television, that I would end up requiring glasses. Despite the fact that I have gamed extensively for the last 27 years and now also sit for 8+ hours in front of multiple displays at work, I have 20/20 vision.

      As for your comment about over-use of the brain, it was my understanding that we do not even fully utilize our brain. I think the human body is more resilient than most people give it credit for.

    6. Re:Sports injuries... by Pojut · · Score: 1

      It's a bit too late now, but from a young age I've always kept a poster with some words on it at the opposite end of the room I game in. Every hour or so, I'll look away to the poster and read it three times over before going back to the screen. Focusing on a static image that is far away helps keep your eyes from "locking in" to near-focus mode.

      Still, the number one thing that helps alleviate most gaming-related problems (other than weight) are frequent breaks. I try to walk away for five minutes every hour, two at the most. This makes a bigger difference than you might think.

    7. Re:Sports injuries... by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      Please don't try to tell me that a first person shooter is in any way "overuse of the brain". Even with a game like Starcraft for experrienced gamers many of the details are now muscle memory and rote repetition of patterns.

      Even the very idea of "brain overuse" causing mental problems makes me shudder... what has happened to our society!?

      Besides, a baseball pitcher, football quarterback, hockey goalie, auto racer, etc, require just as much (or more) focus, attention, and often strategy as most video games...

    8. Re:Sports injuries... by jab · · Score: 1

      I've raced for about 20 years in cross country skiing (starting with high school, then at the NCAA level in college, and now in citizen races) and have probably entered well over 100 events. More importantly I've known a lot of racers over the years. I've never, ever heard of knee damage being a common problem for cross country skiers. In fact, cross country skiing is one of the more gentle sports on joints, especially compared to long distance running which has a lot of pounding. There are tons of old people (70+) competing in citizen races, and they are often quite fast. Even the skating technique is not so troublesome, although it is a little more wearing than diagonal stride over very long distances. Are you thinking of something in particular that causes knee damage?

    9. Re:Sports injuries... by mcgrew · · Score: 2, Informative

      Atheletes wear their bodies out, same as construction workers, but but you can't overuse your brain. Your brain has no moving parts to wear out, unlike your body. All the mentally sharp geriatrics I've known actively used their brains a lot, and IINM there have been studies proving this.

      I'm not sure about the eye damage, but the only damage would be to the cornea, and I wouldn't worry about that.[article] What you should worry about is if you're severely nearsighted you're at risk of retinal detachment[journal]

    10. Re:Sports injuries... by bm_luethke · · Score: 1

      Some of those answers are going to depend on what age you are "20 years" isn't that long if you are around 20 - lots of us really old folks around the 40 year old range that gre up playing games (games have been popular and require reflexes and such since way back in 1980 or so)

      I picked mine up with pong, went to an atari 2600, a PC, NES, etc and still do today. I spend massive amounts of time at it, more than pretty much anyone does with another sport. I'm a software engineer so I have one of those "thinking jobs" too.

      I'm 35, started when I was around 8. People my age have beginnings of knee problems (I do with no few sports - but arthritis tends to run in my family, few on both sides made it past 35 without some and I am no exception). I have a bit of RSI in my wrists and fingers, but that is probably more to do with the typing. I can't figure that 5 more years (it is usually someone around 20 who thinks "20 years from now how broken will I be") will be much different so your are probably safe.

      Now, if you are older then it gets to be a harder question. For the most part 20 more years for me (mid 50's) probably isn't going to change much - most people play Tennis, Baseball, and many other sports into their 50's with only needing increased therapy. A little more icing/heat, not quite as aggressive, etc. If non-professional gaming has me extra slowing down in that time frame then it really ought to get a good look from the govt to either ban it or make sure people realize the dangers as it is terribly dangerous. Enough time has elapsed with games being obsessed over to note if it does when someone playes heavy from youth to their 40's. Most people In other sports, except the Olympic/Professional Level competitors, should never see a problem into thier 50's that wasn't simply "aging". In those cases the competitors are well aware of the damage it inflicts on their bodies.

      For me what is it going to be like in 30 years is a better question - your early 60's should be where you really start noticing things like that. Maybe you are in your 40's so 20 years is a good length of time to think about, however with such a high user number and obviously something of a techie I doubt it. The likelyhood of being a high numbered poster in your 40 that has been on the net or decades is quite low (though it can happen - I have a low 5 digit account here that I can't access because the e-mail account I registered under no longer exists - can't get my password and I forgot my old one).

      Worry more about your heart, arteries, lungs, pancreas, and other parts of your body that tend to wear out. You brain tends to degrade from *not* using it much.

      --
      ------- Sorry about the spelling, I suffer from two problems. Dyslexia makes it difficult to spell well, lazy makes it
    11. Re:Sports injuries... by frosty_tsm · · Score: 1

      Please don't try to tell me that a first person shooter is in any way "overuse of the brain". Even with a game like Starcraft for experrienced gamers many of the details are now muscle memory and rote repetition of patterns.

      Even the very idea of "brain overuse" causing mental problems makes me shudder... what has happened to our society!?

      Besides, a baseball pitcher, football quarterback, hockey goalie, auto racer, etc, require just as much (or more) focus, attention, and often strategy as most video games...

      I know that after work, playing Empire Total War for extended sessions was too much. I recently found playing FFXIII to be nice candy for the brain. It's not too thought-intensive, I'm still playing a game and I'm still having fun even if I'm not working all that hard at it.

    12. Re:Sports injuries... by vlm · · Score: 1

      I try to walk away for five minutes every hour, two at the most. This makes a bigger difference than you might think.

      This is also vital for deep vein thrombosis prevention, spinal posture related issues, keeping properly hydrated, the eyestrain issue you already mentioned... Also eliminates or reduces sleepiness and daydreaming.

      Also if you're not just grinding, but actually thinking, a physical perspective change and a pause in the thinking for a couple minutes can often result in higher total overall productivity. If you're mind's blank, staring even harder at the whiteboard doesn't help nearly as much as a short walk. Occasionally surfing slashdot has been scientifically proven to dramatically increase overall productivity.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    13. Re:Sports injuries... by blair1q · · Score: 1

      The first time you strafe a hallway instead of just walking past it you prove to yourself that gaming has done something to your head.

      But neurons are highly malleable and learn not to be affected by such situations as easily as they learned to react to them. Except for the flashbacks, that sort of behavior goes away.

    14. Re:Sports injuries... by dogmatixpsych · · Score: 1

      You cannot overwork a brain. Too much stress is bad but mental exercise is != stress. As long as you get the proper amount of sleep you will never hurt your brain by working it too much. The lack of sleep won't necessarily hurt your brain, you just cannot benefit from sleep if you don't sleep.

    15. Re:Sports injuries... by PPalmgren · · Score: 1

      It was a bad example. I was going to use american football examples, but each position has different issues. I was drawing a mental blank.

      My father used to cross-country ski and was going to the olympic trials for Finland. However, knee problems caused him to drop out. One of his good friends had the same problem, so I extrapolated. Cue the xkcd slide.

    16. Re:Sports injuries... by endymion.nz · · Score: 1

      There is some evidence to suggest that staying awake too long might contribute to degenerative brain diseases like alzheimers...

      --
      mediocrity rules, man
    17. Re:Sports injuries... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You should ask your optometrist about punctal plugs. They insert these plugs in to your tear ducts that drain away the excess tears. In a lot of people it can make quite a difference. They are permanently installed but before they do the permanent version they try a temporary version that will dissolve away in time. As for the contacts have you asked about some of the newer contact types. Oasys have unbelievable oxygen permeability and some contacts can be worn for 30-days straight. Something to ask about. At any rate you will wear contacts in the next 20-30 years barring any magical new technology since you will need bifocals.

    18. Re:Sports injuries... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      PLEASE stop perpetuating that myth. I haven't been able to track down the actual research that claims this but let's do a thought experiment. It has been shown that the size of our head is a major hindrance to the species. Women typically need help to deliver and are lost in higher numbers than in other species (without technological assistance). So if the brain, which constitutes a great portion of the head, weren't necessary evolution would be busy shrinking it down since it is an advantage to have an easier to birth head.

      Also consider for a moment CPU development. Whenever, we were talking about power consumption in VLSI we used a factor to represent the currently switching transistors. This factor was typically on the order of 10%. If your 125W TDP CPU actually managed to switch all transistors at the same time (which would be really bad since the rails would be shorted together) then you can imagine 1250W of heat.

      I firmly believe this myth comes from the fact the percentage of currently active neurons is some lower percentage but that every last one of them is being used in one form or another.

    19. Re:Sports injuries... by pnutjam · · Score: 1

      Have you tried different contact materials? Take Acuvue for instance, there are Acuvue2, Acuvue Oasys, and Acuvue Advance. Each is made of a different material and some people can have a sensitivity to one or the other. My doc switched me from Acuvue 2 to Acuvue Advance a couple years ago and it works fine, but the Oasys seem to irritate my eye a bit.

      Another thing I tell people. Tell you doc to give you contacts that do not correct for astigmatism. Many people can't tell the difference and the astigmatism ones are thicker and cause more eye irritation and dryness. It doesn't hurt anything to try them, but some docs are hesitant so be insistent.

    20. Re:Sports injuries... by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      True, but that's not the same as "using your brain too much".

    21. Re:Sports injuries... by Reapy · · Score: 1

      Yes I love this fear of wearing the brain out by using it too much.

      Sounds like many people subscribe to this philosophy around the world...

  10. Might??? by Itninja · · Score: 2, Funny

    While sitting in front of a screen might not have the same physical demands as running a marathon...

    Might not? Might not?? Hell, making a sandwich has more physical demands than playing the vijimagames.

    --
    I judt got a nre Kinesis keybiartf so please excusr ant egregiou typos.
    1. Re:Might??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I disagree. I never get stressed out when I'm making a sandwich. When I'm playing an intense 1v1 in Starcraft against an opponent who is similarly skilled to myself, my heart starts beating faster, I feel an adrenaline rush, and my nerves go to Code Blue as if I actually need all that physical stimulation that only clouds my ability to think clearly and calmly and win. Games require small, quick, and precise movements, which means they aren't physically straining in that manner, but they can be physically demanding in others.

    2. Re:Might??? by blair1q · · Score: 1

      Okay, getting your heart rate up to 20% of your (MHR-RHR) and losing your cool because you're the n00b in the room is not aerobic exercise.

      I rode my bike 20 miles at 22 mph yesterday and never got mine above 60%. That's known as a "recovery day".

      Allay'all stop dawdling and excusing yourselves, get off your fat, pasty asses, and go play in the fucking sunshine.

    3. Re:Might??? by cycleflight · · Score: 1

      And your functional threshold power is....

      If you averaged 22 mph without ever stopping for anything (assuming no tailwind) and you're an average weight and build for a cyclist, your "recovery day" was either done on aerobars or you're a Cat 3 (men's) time trialist. If there were stops in the ride for traffic, or if your FTP is lower than about 270 watts, you're working too hard.

      As for the sunshine, I fight in the shade.

      --
      "...And who wants to make buttprints in the sands of time?" ~Bob Moawad
    4. Re:Might??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you averaged 22 mph without ever stopping for anything (assuming no tailwind) and you're an average weight and build for a cyclist, your "recovery day" was either done on aerobars or you're a Cat 3 (men's) time trialist. If there were stops in the ride for traffic, or if your FTP is lower than about 270 watts, you're working too hard.

      ...or the more likely scenario: he exaggerated.

    5. Re:Might??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Adrenaline, your doing it wrong.

    6. Re:Might??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, this is a pretty gross anecdote.

      Whenever my fiancee comes into our gaming room she can tell if I'm just chilling in dalaran or have been arenaing.

      It gets my heart rate up, and makes me sweat.

    7. Re:Might??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It gets my heart rate up, and makes me sweat.

      To join the anecdote-fest; I often get this during an even match of TF2.

  11. Cause or Result by icebike · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Is the 20 year old "Professional gamer" with the "aerobic health as a 60-year-old smoker" in that condition due to gaming, or is he gaming because that's all he can do, because of some pre-existing limitation?

    I ask, because it takes longer for a sedentary life style to put you in THAT bad shape than your typical 20 year old would have in the interval between highschool and their 20th birthday.

    Where does one get a job being a "professional gamer" other than working for a game developer?

    --
    Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    1. Re:Cause or Result by Kenoli · · Score: 2, Funny

      South Korea.

    2. Re:Cause or Result by Pojut · · Score: 1

      Where does one get a job being a "professional gamer" other than working for a game developer?

      Korea, if you are awesome at Starcraft.

      There is also the PGL and a host of other "professional" leagues.

    3. Re:Cause or Result by Monkeedude1212 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Where does one get a job being a "professional gamer" other than working for a game developer?

      It's easy in that you don't have to apply to become one, like most jobs, but also tough in that you won't make any money for a little while, like playing in a Band.

      1) Find a popular multiplayer game
      2) Get good at said game
      3) Search for a league online for said game
      4) Join league
      5) Win tournaments
      6) ???
      7) Professional Gamer /Profit

    4. Re:Cause or Result by clone53421 · · Score: 2, Funny

      North Korean gamers, on the other hand, are the portrait of good health!

      --
      Alexander Peter Kristopeit bought his basement from his mommy for one dollar.
    5. Re:Cause or Result by Hatta · · Score: 1

      I'm guessing it's all the pot he smokes.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    6. Re:Cause or Result by AthleteMusicianNerd · · Score: 1

      Working for a game developer is not a professional gamer.

    7. Re:Cause or Result by blair1q · · Score: 1

      The attention given to the ones who get rich at a sport creates a disproportionate view of the probabilities of joining that class of competitors.

      Those who gain little or no money, or even lose relative to another choice of profession, is by far the largest segment of any sport's population.

      Delusional hope among the competing class is, of course, of enormous benefit to the organizer class. This goes for any industry, not just sports.

    8. Re:Cause or Result by dunkelfalke · · Score: 1

      It doesn't take that long. I used to do judo but after a couple of broken relationships I just sat at home (and at work), read books and eat. I've gained almost 50 kg in just 5 years and could barely walk 200 meters. Once you are fat you can get sleep apnoea, and once you have that, it is almost impossible to lose weight without doing something against it.

      Once you can sleep properly it is much easier to lose all that fat and start living again, though. Just walked 4 km and feeling good :-)

      --
      "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
    9. Re:Cause or Result by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      I ask, because it takes longer for a sedentary life style to put you in THAT bad shape than your typical 20 year old would have in the interval between highschool and their 20th birthday.

      I've seen some pretty fat kids. twenty years of doing nothing but sitting in a chair stuffing your face is a long time.

    10. Re:Cause or Result by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      lots of internet poker players earn over 100k a year. this being said, most professional poker players take good care of their health by working out.

    11. Re:Cause or Result by arielCo · · Score: 1

      Just as with music. In all three statements.

      --
      This post contains no rudeness or derision of any kind. All arguments are friendly. Terms and exclusions may apply.
    12. Re:Cause or Result by Glarimore · · Score: 1

      There are a number of routes to become a pro gamer. What route you take depends mostly on the game you're playing and whether or not it is a team game.

      If it is a team game, gathering a team of friends that you know wont up and quit on you and working your way up throught the various leagues is the best way to go (www.esportsea.com). If you are good, you eventually work your way to the higher invite-only leagues and if you do well enough in those, you will become sponsored. Some top Counter-Strike players in Europe are proported to have earnings topping $2,500 a month. Which isn't a lot -- but they are playing video games and get to keep all of their tournament winnings, and very often live together and have free housing.

      In non-team games the best route is to practice your head off and either join a league as described above, or fly to South Korea and get your professional gaming license, though it isn't easy.

      This is obviously very dumbed-down and simplified explanation and no persons route to "the pros" is the same, but I wanted to provide some insight into pro gaming for those who do not know about it.

    13. Re:Cause or Result by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why is the parent modded Funny and why is the grandparent modded Insightful?

      There are professional computer gamers all over the world.

      WCG is the event where these professional gamers from all over the world get together to compete.

      Ignorant and average comments may seem insightful and funny to likely minded people, but I expected better from slashdot.

  12. Not surprised by mewsenews · · Score: 1

    Online gaming actually helped me understand real-life sports. When I was a kid my dad took me to Hockey and Soccer and other organized sports, and I never really "got it". I didn't have any aggression in my personality and when the parents were saying "it's not important to win, it's important to have fun" I actually took them to heart and didn't care about the game, at all.

    I finally figured out the pleasure of cooperative sport playing Counterstrike in my bedroom. I actually got pretty decent and had moments that parallel great sports stories: one time I single-handedly cleared a team of 6 players, finishing the last one with my knife. It was my full-length touchdown run and there was actual human adrenaline pumping in my veins.

    After my kinda-sorta epiphany, I actually left the house and joined a ball hockey team. I still suck at hockey but I understand the pleasure of the game and that everyone is working together to become better players.

    Anyway, I'm not surprised that the top "cyber athletes" have the same mental processes as top athletes. Competition is competition..

    1. Re:Not surprised by Reapy · · Score: 1

      It seems many people have to first try to exist in a competitive game environment before they can understand the similarities. For anyone who has tried to improve at any type of game play this article's subject is frighteningly obvious.

      In the same way that a football linebacker will not succeed in soccer, a gamer won't succeed at football. You aren't working on the same skills at all. But depending on the game, the mentality, rush of competition, and psychology of the other people you are playing come strongly into play and will be familiar territory.

      Anything you do that requires mechanical input first requires learning muscle memory to the point that the actions you can take in the game are automatic, your body becomes trained to the point that your brain can figure out what is going on with the big picture, and you execute moves without hesitation, one flows into the next.

      This frees you to take a look at everything going on with your entire set of moves at your command, and later, you will learn your own special set of them that you like.

      This is true in a video game and in a sport. When I learned to play volleyball for real, I had to take some time learning how to spike, where to stand, how to pass properly, all of this. Once I learned how to perform most of these actions, it freed me up to see the bigger picture of the game, and playing in an environment where all competitors see this bigger picture, makes it a lot more fun.

      I think with competitive games the bar to reach the skill plateau where the game gets deeper and becomes an exercise in psychology and strategy is much lower than having the physical fitness needed for sports to reach this level, which appeals to more people.

      But at the end of the day, each thing is a game, and all games have a similar elements to them, including the mental processes it takes to operate at the professional level.

  13. Well DUH by mcgrew · · Score: 1

    Other studies show that the sky is black at night with little white speckles, gray when it's raining at noon and blue when it's not.

    What's next, they're going to study where bears shit and what religion the Pope is?

  14. Eye Hand Coordination by Layth · · Score: 1

    In most cases, Eye Hand Coordination is a big factor in sports, and a big factor in gaming .
    Obviously there are exceptions like soccer and checkers, but yeah there is a lot of cross over.

    I would have thought this was immediately obvious as someone who has both played video games and sports competitively.
    The biggest difference from a competitive point of view? Video games put you completely at the mercy of developers, and it sucks.

    Who wants to spend a year refining a particular talent for a video game, and then have a new patch completely change the balance and gameplay dynamics.
    Also if you put 8 years of your life into the game, what happens when it's out of date? Even if it's a game with big tournaments and prizes, they all go out of style.

    Mainstream sports, on the other hand, date back thousands of years and should experience very few changes in our lifetime.

    As an adult, I could never devote myself fully to a game in that manner...
    As a child I guess I had nothing better to do =)

    1. Re:Eye Hand Coordination by shermo · · Score: 1

      It's no different to the IOC dropping sports/disciplines from the Olympic lineup. It happens every time.

      --
      Insanity: voting in the same two parties over and over again and expecting different results
    2. Re:Eye Hand Coordination by Dalambertian · · Score: 1

      Videogames are not that different from traditional sports: there is a rule set that exists to define the sport, but those rules do not determine the quality of the player. In fact, a good player never complains about patches, because she can change her strategy accordingly. The evolution of the starcraft II beta is a good example of this. To me, there are two measurements that determine the quality of every sport, and it helps to motivate why we appreciate some sports more than others: Game-critical decisions per minute and secondly, the skill of execution in carrying out those decisions. The first is easiest to measure (at least with video), but the latter is a little more subtle - I think it's related to the number of degrees of freedom involved those actions (think of how many wrong ways there are to hit a baseball). Basically, every decent sport should rank highly on both of the scales.

  15. Alpha Male Syndrome? by BJ_Covert_Action · · Score: 1

    I wonder if the study focused on whether or not both groups display high levels of testosterone and high levels of competitiveness. I always figured that the constant tea-bagging and shit-talking in Halo and such were just virtual depictions of the same male-centric dominance instinct that athletes display by making fouls, being unnecessarily belligerent, or just being douchebags in general. I know both groups often (though not always) display an attitude of elitism towards those that are not part of the, 'club.' I know that competitive sports are so popular because they, essentially, allow for the enactment of modern alpha-male style dominance displays. I wonder if the same can be said of gamers. I can't count how many times I've heard a Halo player blow his verbal load on Xbox live talking about how good he is and why he is so much better. There has to be a link in those attributes too. I wonder if further studies are going to look into that or not.

    That said, I think football and soccer would be funnier if the scoring team tea-bagged their rivals every time they made a point.

    1. Re:Alpha Male Syndrome? by vlm · · Score: 2, Funny

      That said, I think football and soccer would be funnier if the scoring team tea-bagged their rivals every time they made a point.

      Turnabout is fair play, you really want the halo team to dance, hug each other, and rub each others butts after a kill and then take a shower together after the game, while the elderly newspaper writers watch, er, I mean interview them? I could do without that creepy stuff.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    2. Re:Alpha Male Syndrome? by karlwilson · · Score: 1

      I think that's just called being a guy and has nothing to do with your profession.

    3. Re:Alpha Male Syndrome? by blair1q · · Score: 1

      Think about that again, only this time make it a women's league.

      How has your attitude changed?

    4. Re:Alpha Male Syndrome? by vlm · · Score: 1

      Think about that again, only this time make it a women's league. How has your attitude changed?

      Uh, I'm thinking a career change to "elderly newspaper writer" is in the cards?
      With my luck, they'll assign the noob (that being me) to the womens sumo wrestling team instead of beach volleyball.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    5. Re:Alpha Male Syndrome? by gangien · · Score: 1

      I know that competitive sports are so popular because they, essentially, allow for the enactment of modern alpha-male style dominance displays.

      You know that? That really doesn't explain why so many people root for the underdog. I think your trying to over analyze the fact that people like to compete and have fun, as well as watching said action.

    6. Re:Alpha Male Syndrome? by d34dluk3 · · Score: 1

      Wait, did you really just say "women's Halo league"? Welcome to Earth, we're sorry it's not as awesome as your alternate reality.

    7. Re:Alpha Male Syndrome? by blair1q · · Score: 1

      Dude, you're missing out.

      http://i39.tinypic.com/2hnmfzn.jpg

  16. Just wait for it by RivenAleem · · Score: 2, Funny

    "Whoa man, there's ProGamer69"

    "Yeh, he's uber leet, look at the size of him"

    "He must put in some serious sessions to get a bod like that, just look as them rolls of flab"

    "Yeah, I just wanna grab them and roll about in them"

    "You're working on a pretty nice gut yourself, how do you manage it with this pro-fitness thing everyone is forcing on us?"

    "Oh that" *scoffs* "CoD7 + Mountain Dew all the way bud"

  17. not true for everyone by ILuvRamen · · Score: 2, Funny

    I play video games and I'm quite good. I always rank high in reaction time games like racing and also RTS games too. I was actually the #7 ranked platinum player in the Starcraft II Beta before it reset :) and I guess I break the stereotype because I'm extremely fit and in shape. One reason is I have a gym membership that I actually use and secondly, I play Dance Dance revoltion! The estimates of calories burned per song are between 10 and 35 and they're all under 2 minutes long. I have freakishly strong legs now because of that and pretty good aerobic abilities. I never actually run anywhere but if I suddenly decided to do so, I bet I could get a couple miles. Last time I played someone's Wii I was sweating too so if I had one of those, I'd be so healthy it would be crazy :-P Then there's that glorified eye toy thing that's coming out soon that will force people to move around so I think this all these things will get gamers in shape pretty quickly. But as for right now, some of us are already quite fit FROM gaming.

    --
    Google's Super Secret Search Algorithm: SELECT @search_results FROM internet WHERE @search_results = 'good'
    1. Re:not true for everyone by witch-doktor · · Score: 1

      And, no doubt, all the ramen you eat contributes to it all ;-)

    2. Re:not true for everyone by AthleteMusicianNerd · · Score: 1

      I never actually run anywhere but if I suddenly decided to do so, I bet I could get a couple miles.

      Two miles is really quite sad, and Dance Dance Revolution fitness does not equate to running fitness. In fact, basketball fitness doesn't even equate to running fitness. Rick Fox starting running too much, and actually cut his NBA career short.

    3. Re:not true for everyone by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hey! You can also play with my Wii anytime you like!

    4. Re:not true for everyone by clone53421 · · Score: 1

      ...and you got a Funny mod for all that. I’m still trying to figure out whether you were really trying to be funny, or actually being serious.

      --
      Alexander Peter Kristopeit bought his basement from his mommy for one dollar.
  18. Right.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Youtube Pavel Datsyuk or Ovechkin and tell me that hockey is boxing..

    Yeah, there are fights in hockey, but there normally it isn't like there is a fight a game.

    I played hockey and football growing up, football was so easy it was sickening. Watching a play unfold was simple...

    In hockey you are moving at 25 MPH (easy) and the goalies are stopping pucks moving at 90+MPH...

    Hockey is nothing like boxing, very few players get paid to fight anymore, most are paid for goals or a nice +/-...

  19. Non-surprising result by blair1q · · Score: 1

    So what they found is that video games select for those qualities that result in superior performance. Fast reflexes, increases in focus with pressure, etc.

    Make a game that consists of holding a heavy rock motionless in your hand and you'll find a class of players with different qualities.

    People without those qualities are not likely to progress, and eventually not likely to continue playing, certainly not to be promoted to more-skilled competitions.

    Like, duh.

    1. Re:Non-surprising result by grikdog · · Score: 1

      I forgot I had mod points (so they expired), or I'd bump this guy up a notch! Insightful.

      --
      ``Tension, apprehension & dissension have begun!'' - Duffy Wyg&, in Alfred Bester's _The Demolished Man_
  20. That explains it by Yungoe · · Score: 1

    This explains why I am always winded after a good game of UT.

  21. DUH? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Of course many video games involves hand-eye coordination, managing anxiety, ..

    That's why pilots train with flight simulators (hello video game).

    They should get this guy to study is water really wet, is the sky really blue, and a myriad of other less obvious questions.

  22. they both play games to be better at work by uremog · · Score: 1

    A lot of pro football players play Madden and the like as a simulator. It's especially beneficial to amateur players who don't have the benefit of having their whole career dedicated to football.

  23. One big difference... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When a fighter pilot finishes his work, bad guys are dead.

    When an athlete crosses the finish line, he's got a trophy, and probably a beautiful girl on his arm.

    When a gamer gets his mage to level 80, he's still a fat loser in his mom's basement.

    1. Re:One big difference... by yurtinus · · Score: 1

      Seriously... everybody knows all the cool kids play Druids.

      --
      +1 Disagree
    2. Re:One big difference... by endymion.nz · · Score: 1

      Most of the time when a fighter pilot finishes his work, nobody died, because most of his work is spent training in simulators, or sitting around doing mental arithmatic. Not much actual shooting down planes, especially in these days of assymetric warfare.

      Don't you kids have IRC and instant messaging shit anymore? There are beautiful girls on the internet, by sheer virtue of the number of people on the internet. Sitting around on the internet all day talking on IRC is highly conducive to inviting everyone to your house to sit around and get drunk, and there were always girls wanting to be part of that when it was happening to me (about 10 years ago - when there were far less of them around than now).

      --
      mediocrity rules, man
  24. We get the girls too... by snooz_crash · · Score: 1

    Right?... Bueller?...

    --
    ceci n'est pas un sig
  25. Good thing Boxer joined the Korean Air Force by oamasood · · Score: 1

    It was good for him

  26. "very mentally intensive activity"... by Chess+Piece+Face · · Score: 1

    Apples and oranges. Video games rarely if ever require me to find a creative solution to a problem. Likewise my job never requires me to be in constant twitch mode ready to shoot anything that moves. Two different parts of the brain.

  27. Sport?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you can drink beer while performing the activity, it's a GAME, not a SPORT.

    1. Re:Sport?! by Psaakyrn · · Score: 1

      What activity can't you drink beer while performing, discounting the nagging legal issues?

  28. Wow by assertation · · Score: 1


    Still, while gamers show good reflexes, their health was worse than expected, with one 20-something professional player showing the same aerobic health as a 60-year-old smoker."

    Impressive. If I was into something like that I would make sure to cut my junk food, avoid overeating and substitute 30 min of gaming a day for a walk.

  29. What Gamers Have In Common With Athletes by vampire_baozi · · Score: 1

    Chicks dig us, and so we get laid a lot.

  30. grrr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How to use square brackets

    There are two uses of square brackets (which, confusingly, Americans call simply brackets):

            * to set off an interruption within a direct quotation [Churchill said of the Battle of Britain: "Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few [the Royal Air Force pilots]".]
            * to set off material which is extraneous to the main text, such as the examples of the usage of punctuation in this essay or comments in a draft document which are not intended to be in the final version

  31. Overpaid? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In which way?

    Sportspeople in particular are in a savage market, they are actually "sold" when in reality they are just changing employer (when it comes to some sports outside the US, where the cartels controlling salaries in the guise of sport leagues keep things under tabs).

    They are worth so much money because ovbisouly the entertainment value they provide is worth it.

    The indictment should be on a society willing to pay so much for something of dubious social value, not on the sportspeople themselves.