Slashdot Mirror
Updated Mac Mini Aims For the Living Room
WrongSizeGlass noted that besides the pre-order of the new iPhone appearing on the Apple store today, Apple has revved the Mac Mini and started selling those too. "PC World is reporting on the latest version of Apple's Mac Mini. At only 1.4-inches tall the unibody aluminium enclosure includes an HDMI port, an SD card reader, and more graphics and processing power. Even the power supply is inside now. The base model comes with 2.4-GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB of RAM and a 320GB hard disk — for $699. Graphics power comes from an NVIDIA GeForce 320M GPU (as found in lower-end MacBook and MacBook Pro laptops). Apple appears to be aiming for living rooms by including the HDMI port and eliminating the external power brick."
Thanks Apple. I really needed yet another device to want to buy, especially given that I've just bought myself an iPad and my girlfriend an iPod Touch. This really seems like an Apple TV-on-steroids that I'd love to have. Thanks.
My bank account thanks you too.
Signed, an unabashed Apple Fanboi.
The Mini was always aimed at people who already had a screen and keyboard.
"I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are."
So with the current mini you're looking at doubling the ram like you always have to for a stock machine and it's a proprietary case not meant for user fiddling so you have to pay the mac store to install the ram
They actually designed the case so the RAM is user upgradable, just scroll down http://www.apple.com/macmini/design.html
A Mac Mini sized Dell Zino with HDMI starts at $249.99.
I liked more the external power brick, because it's a component that generates lots of heat and it was passively cooled. If you put it inside the Mac Mini it will inevitably cause more fan noise than a similar solution with external power supply.
There's a hidden treasure in Python 3.x: __prepare__()
I'm glad I waited; I was going to buy the previous version in the server configuration. Say what you will about HDMI ports, no blu-ray, etc., but the mini makes for a great server. I run Jira, Subversion, Postgres, and Tomcat for a dev team on one mini and it hasn't given me a minute of problems. If anything, I forget where it lives because it's so small. That said, I'd like to replace our existing one with a new one for the increased disk space (currently the db is on an external disk) and to possibly use the built-in Jabber server than the one we've got now.
It's one of Apple's magic combined analog/digital 3.5mm jacks. Plug in an optical TOS cable and you've got your digital audio. It's what I do on my iMac.
It's a Unix system - I know this.
Without a BluRay player, even as an option, its a deal breaker. If the only way they expect me to get content onto the device is to go through iTunes, then I'm not buying.
Even something like EyeTV for recording television seems like a half assed solution, when Apple has the opportunity to do it right.
In terms of being an HTPC...
The mini didn't need to be any smaller. It didn't need a more powerful GPU. It also didn't need a price increase.
It already had to deal with competitors 1/3rd it's price.
Allowing for "more" in the mini itself would have been a better idea.
Also, moving the power supply into the main case is a DUMB idea because it
complicates cooling issues. There was really no problem with it being on the
outside. In back of a TV stand, it really won't matter if there's a power
brick back there too.
It's nice that Apple has finally decided to acknowledge HDMI though.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
so you have to pay the mac store to install the ram
It's not easy to replace the RAM as in other cases, but there are a number of guides online how to do it. The only unique tool you will need is a putty knife.
then you have to get the mouse and keyboard which will be wireless and thus more expensive, plus any other accessories you might pick up.
You don't have to get a wireless keyboard and mouse. You can use USB ones. Or if you already have one like from Logitech it will work.
Oh, and let's no forget the mandatory service plan since Apple gives you a flat one month warranty, that's it. My mini's hard drive took a shit at one year plus two months. They told me I was SOL.
The warranty is one year not one month. One year is fairly standard. And no one is forcing you to buy a service plan.
In your case the HD failed, not the MB so I don't see how your are SOL. HDs fail and the HD isn't a part that Apple manufactures so they don't have control over the quality of it. Replace it and you still have a computer. You'll lose all your data if you didn't perform regular backups
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
Unibody (unopenable) case: BOO
You can open it. From the bottom, which makes for very easy access to the RAM, unlike the previous design.
Still Core2 instead of i5/i7: BOO
Same reason the 13" MBP is still Core2Duo. Try to put a discrete graphics chip in that form factor without losing any of the other features.
Blu-Ray is dead, it just doesn't know it yet.
Remember, Apple doesn't plan a couple quarters ahead, it plans years ahead. And it knows that you can already stream an HD movie or TV show faster than you could get up off your couch and go buy or rent it physically.
Also, there's nothing to stop you buying an external BD player. Newegg has 'em under $150.
Linux, you magnificent bastard, I read the fucking manual!
It is worth noting that the cheapest dual-core model of the Zino is $499, still cheaper than the Mini, but it also has the trendy-retro-60s-ugliness-fit-for-goodwill type look which the Mini lacks.
What changed under Obama? Nothing Good
Look at the UK prices. Once you take off VAT at 17.5%, and then convert to US$, it is 17% more expensive.
Also, the Mac Mini first started at £399 when it was introduced, and affordable computer, it now starts at £649, with mediocre hardware.
It's a rip off, for sure!
Agreed. I like apple products - they're pretty slick. But for half the price you could get about the same by buying a Dell laptop and keeping the lid closed. For the extra cash a keyboard, mouse, display, and Blue-Ray drive would cost, why wouldn't you?
I like apple, but GOD DAMN, do they need to look at reality once in awhile. I might buy this if it was $300-$350. That would be a pretty good deal, I think. I could build better for that price, but not in that small a form factor. A little realism in their pricing might be a very good thing for them.
Velociraptor = Distiraptor / Timeraptor
At only 1.4-inches tall the unibody aluminium enclosure includes an HDMI port, an SD card reader, and more graphics and processing power.
The new Mac Mini doesn't pack more processing power, it's actually slower than one of the previous models. The old line up included two models, one with an Intel Core 2 Duo at 2.26 GHz and one at 2.53 GHz, both with the option to upgrade to 2.66 GHz. Now the new line up includes only one model, clocked at 2.4 GHz, also with the option to upgrade to 2.66 GHz.
So all in all, the new model is faster than the entry model of the previous version, but the old line up also included a model faster than what's available now.
Pretty good is actually pretty bad.
you can already stream an HD movie or TV show faster than you could get up off your couch and go buy or rent it physically
Wally-world is 3 minutes from my house. I can be there and back in 15 minutes from when I decide to go. They actually have a decent selection of Blu-Ray movies these days, including a number in the cheap bins. Blu-Ray supports up to 36 megabits per second, which is faster than the Internet access at the vast majority of homes in the US. For example, to get Blu-Ray quality video on my 6 meg DSL, for a 2 hour movie I'd have to wait for up to 10 hours of "buffering" before I could "stream" the video. If you only did half the max quality level of Blu-Ray (18 meg) and your Internet connection was twice as fast (12 meg), you'd still have to wait an hour before starting to watch a 2 hour movie. And that assumes there's a server farm somewhere that can feed a whole bunch of 18-36 meg streams simultaneously.
Also, there's nothing to stop you buying an external BD player. Newegg has 'em under $150.
Does Apple include Blu-Ray player software (complete with all the necessary DRM support so you can actually get 1080p)? A drive is useless without the software, and the software included with the drive will be for Windows, not Mac OS X.
> Oh, and let's no forget the mandatory service plan since Apple gives you a flat one month warranty, that's it.
In what God-forsaken country do you live ? In all of the EU all the Apple products have a two-year national warranty (including a one year international warranty coverage) by default.
Also: no other company would have replaced a component they don't manufacture (the hdd) after the warranty expired.
You're a troll.
1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
Oh, and let's no forget the mandatory service plan since Apple gives you a flat one month warranty, that's it. My mini's hard drive took a shit at one year plus two months. They told me I was SOL.
AFAIK this is totally wrong? I thought all Apple products come with a one year warranty (90 days of phone support).
You could also have bought a 3 year warranty (Which I never do on something this cheap) for like $150 iirc.
Sucks that the drive broke, but surely a slashdotter could open a mac mini and replace the drive easily enough? I've done so on many models of iMac (even back it was hard!)
The thing is, if non techy people have their box die on them, they're not going to switch to a Mac Mini that probably costs more than their original complete system did.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
"A desktop OS will, and never will, be suited for anything other than a Desktop... it will never work on the Living Room."
Based upon what? Right now I run a Windows 7 system via my 50" Samsung in my living room. I use two bluetooth mice and keyboard. The keyboard is rarely used. My system works perfectly.
To get to a movie or TV show you double click My Computer and double click the mapped drives to the movies or shows. Using the scroll wheel you whip through hundreds of movies or subfolders with the shows. You want to instantly get to the end of the list, use the scroll bar. Double click on the one you want.
Media Player Classic opens and you can use the mouse to instantly zip through the movie or show via the seek bar without using the slow "fast" forward or rewind buttons you get with a remote. You don't realize how much fast forward and rewind buttons suck until you start using a mouse to traverse through videos. You want to go half way into the movie, one click and you're half way into the movie. Want to skip to the end, one click and you're at the end. Instantly.
You want to turn up the volume? Scroll up on the mouse. You want to turn it down? Scroll down. You want to pause, click the mouse. Want to unpause, click again.
Tired of watching TV shows or movies on your TV? Double click a short cut to your "rock" play-list on your desktop and the music instantly starts. Want to find a specific song. Double click on the Winamp library, get the song you want, and listen to it.
I have friends who use their PS3s and 360s to access content. That works. You can even buy remotes for them. But I can get to my content much quicker and with more ease than they ever could.
And one more thing, I don't have to wait for some manufacturer to play catch-up. If some new video codec or wrapper is released, I can instantly watch it in my living room. I don't have to wait a few months in hopes that Sony or someone else will play catch-up and include support for it.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
I wonder if Apple are becoming complacent, or are focusing far too much on their mobile products. Their current product line is an illogical, uncompetitive mess (moreso than usual).
Apart from the usual "Mac Tax, no mid-level desktop blah blah blah" argument, the current product line is decidedly unappealing to a veteran mac user. I have a 2005-era Mac Mini (Core Duo 1.6GHz), and a 12" PowerBook (1.5GHz G4). If it weren't already obvious to you, I'd like to replace both, but don't have gobs of cash to do it, and would also like to get a tangible improvement for my money, and 5 years of "evolution."
We're used to paying 20% more for several intangibles (build quality, form factor, aesthetics) as well as several "tangibles" (OSX, generally top-of-the-line hardware). Right now, many macs cost double what their PC counterparts do, and although Dell and HP haven't quite gotten the memo about build quality and form factor, they're closing the gap, and Windows 7 is actually not bad at all.
Up until today, the Mac Mini hadn't seen a major redesign since the addition of a few extra USB ports around 2007. In 2010, I can pay more than my 1.6GHz machine cost in 2006 for a computer with a slightly better processor (about 2x as fast from what Passmark say), and the same (inadequate) amount of RAM. I installed a 7200RPM hard drive last year (for all of $80), which actually makes the new Mini worse in that regard. 802.11n, and the form factor improvements are nice, but the package just isn't compelling.
The 13" MacBook pro is also a baffling oddity. It's a great machine at a decent price point, and really has no peers in the PC world. However, like the Mac Mini, a C2D is inexcusable on a new machine in 2010. There's not even an expensive option for something faster or with more RAM. The 15" and 17" models are better, though, like many others, I cherish portability more than I do screen size. I'd love for Apple to bring back a 12" model, or simply sacrifice the optical drive for a bigger processor.
The iMac's got better entry level specs and pricing (which have inexplicably not trickled down to the Mini). The top-end model also has an i5, which is nice too, also considering that i7 chips too expensive to be economical for most home users. However, there's no way to get an i5 without a behemoth (but gorgeous) 27" display.
Apple's top-of-the-line workstations used to be defensible, considering that Xeon chips are seriously %*$&ing expensive, and the machines were generally rock-solid and lasted forever. Dell and HP's equivalents weren't much cheaper. However, things have changed, and the Mac Pro hasn't gotten any cheaper. Even a small bump down would be appreciated.
The RAM issue is a bit tricky too. Apple upcharges an extortionate amount on RAM upgrades, and has rather low maximums on most of its machines. Laptops are sadly rarely upgradable very far beyond the stock amount, and even the Minis and iMacs have incredibly low maximums. My G4 from 1999 has the same RAM capacity as my Mini from 2006. That's pathetic.
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
People like owning discs and there are reasons to want to. Currently Blu-ray beats any streaming service hands down. Not surprising, as a Blu-ray is often 25mbps or more for the main movie. Nothing streams at that rate yet. Also none of the streaming services I've seen include extras, which people do like. Finally there's just the concept of owning a disc, owning a movie. People want to be able to rewatch as often as they like and not be charged. May seem silly but it is the case. Also there's just simple impulse buying. People go to the store, browse the movies, see one and say "Want." They aren't specifically out to get a movie, they are just seeing what there is and decide to grab one.
Then of course there's the net issue. While we geek types tend to have connections sufficient for easy HD streaming, many people do not. If you want to stream video well you tend to need a connection at least twice as fast as the rate you wish to stream at, to deal with dropouts and so on without an excessive buffer, and you need it to be pretty stable. Many people still have low end Internet, even if it is broadband. Here cheap cable modem service starts at 3mbps. Now it's only like $10/month more to go up to 12mbps, however people still go for the cheap shit. They say "It's all I need."
Of course then you get to the problems with the streaming services themselves. Netflix is great, pay one price and watch whatever you like, whenever you like. However the selection sucks. There are only a few things you can get watch now. I can watch X-Files but not Robot Chicken, I can watch SVU but not normal Law and Order, and movie selection is the worst of all. Vudu and Cinemanow have a much better selection, you can usually find the latest titles. However that is pay per view. $4 to watch a movie from Vudu. Not hugely expensive, but not cheap either.
Finally there's the simple issue that a Blu-ray player does all this. My $150 LG player plays Blu-rays and DVDs, of course, but also streams Netflix, Cinemanow, Vudu, Pandora, MLB.tv, and Youtube. It apparently can be upgraded too since it didn't come with MLB, that appeared after the last update. So a cheap consumer device, that has an excellent interface for TV use and works with a normal remote, streams movies off the net with ease.
I don't see the Mac mini is Apple planning years ahead (also I can give you plenty examples of Apple failing to plan), it is just a fairly expensive low end computer. Yes you can hook it to your TV, big deal. You can hook any computers with a DVI or HDMI output to your TV and they all have them these days.
Blu-ray is here to stay for some time, like it or no. Streaming is cool but people want to go and buy discs and play them.
That was my thought. When the Mac Mini was originally released, I believe the low end was $499. When they moved to Intel chips, the low end moved to $599. Now the low end is up to $699. It's still the cheapest way to get Mac OSX, but it's losing its price advantage.
You can choose a dual-core Athlon for $45 more than the $250 one.
"If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
I'll be blunt: if you can afford a Mini, you can afford either a new USB keyboard or a PS/2-to-USB adapter for your old one. In the list of reasons why you might not want a Mini, this non-issue is so far down as to be nonexistent.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
It's $599 for the dual-core 1.8GHz option that's closest to the Mac Mini.
Bigger hard drive (750GB) and 4GB RAM however.
Weaker graphics, weaker CPU, bigger box.
You can upgrade the graphics to the HD4330 for another $75. You can't upgrade the CPU.
I'd say the prices were comparable, but with the Mac Mini you can update the hard drive space or add it via USB or FW800, and you can increase the memory. You can't increase the CPU on the Dell.
Windows / Mac OS X is personal preference of course, but iLife has to be worth something compared to the add-on software that Dell offers in their personalisation process.
But does it run Flash?
"But this one goes to 11!"
Dell Zino vs Mac mini comparison:
Z & M- Gig Ethernet, 4 USB, SD card reader, 2GB RAM base - up to 8GB
Z- M-Radeon HD 3200, M-Radeon HD 4330 option (nice)
M- NVIDIA GeForce 320M (faster)
Z- max 1.8GHz Athlon dual
M- max 2.6GHz Core2Duo (alot faster)
Z- base 160GB HD, max 1TB (unless you buy your own)
M- base 320GB HD, max 500GB (unless you buy your own)
Z- VGA & HDMI
M- DP & HDMI
Z- eSATA
M- FW800
Z- analog audio I/O, mic, optional better audio upgrades available
M- analog + digital optical audio I/O
Z- external power brick
M- internal PS (new feature - I like it)
Z- flimsy tray load DVD
M- slot load DVD
Z- WiFi - optional
M- 802.11n (a/b/g/n) WiFi standard
Z- Bluetooth ?? (seems to be no option)
M- Bluetooth 2.1 + EDR standard
Z- Windows Vista OS - base (Win7 -> +$150)
M- MacOS X Snow Leopard
Z- 3.4 x 7.8 x 7.8 inch, 4lb, plastic
M- 1.4 x 7.7 x 7.7 inch, 3lb, aluminum
Z- enviro - you can BTO a tree planting - woo hoo
M- enviro responsible/recycleable if that's a big thing to you
Z- Configured to come anywhere close to base Mac mini - $503
M- Base price - $699
If you upgrade the Zino to a 320GB HD, best Athlon CPU, par up the graphics, add WiFi, and add Windows 7 to the Dell Zino, you're within $50 of the Mac mini price, and you still don't have a fast CPU, Firewire, Bluetooth, DisplayPort, digital audio I/O, or a slot load DVD drive. Plus you also don't have the build quality. Methinks the Mac mini wins hands down compared to the Zino, and probably any other SFF PC on the planet.
Including PS/2 connectors would have better met that goal without discouraging any customers with USB-only peripherals.
The subset of people who would want a Mini and who refuse to upgrade past PS/2 keyboards and mice is null. If you want to bitch about an adapter, bitch that it doesn't support VGA or DVI without buying the extra cable. But seriously, you just can't credibly whine that you'll have to shell out another $5 to buy a keyboard and mouse from this decade.
The Dell I'm typing this on doesn't have PS/2 jacks. The (much older) Dell it's sitting on doesn't have PS/2 jacks. My home server doesn't have PS/2 jacks. Neither of my laptops have PS/2 jacks. I suppose you think that Dell, HP, IBM, Gigabyte, and Apple are all being miserly bastards, but the truth is that you have obsolete peripherals that won't work on the majority of new systems. Either buy an adapter (as I said I did so I can keep using my Model M) or go to the Salvation Army and ask if you can have a spare USB keyboard and mouse. They're ubiquitous now.
Other topics off-limits to bitching: the lack of parallel parallel ports, serial mice ports, and ISA slots.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
In the UK at least, the Mac Mini includes iLife.
If you think about what you are getting in such a small package. Now that the PSU is inside and the RAM upgrade is easy (via the removable bottom panel), it becomes quite an attractive package.
Granted that it is quite a jump from the old model but this one is even smaller and with more inside.
I'm looking at an Asus eeeBox eb1502 as I write this. This is physically larger than the Mini. IT has an exteranl PSU as well. The mini has a far more powerful CPU than the Atom in the eebox. Granted that the Mini is twice the price but for me, it is a great package.
Last month, I got my next door neighbour to buy a Mini. IT replaced a Dell Tower (some 5 years old) that was so full of malware (they have two girls who use Facebook etc...) that it was so slow. The HDD was giving up the ghost with lots of errors.
They are really pleased with the mini. iTunes & limewire works. As does FarmVille, Facebook & UTube. They have MSOffice and they are really happy with their new system.
No more AV software crippling the system and demanding reboots. No more under the cover software updates that demand a reboot.
My life is far easier now that they are using the Mini. Yeah, I'm their IT Support. Even the Parental Controls work very well OOTB. That was always hit & miss on the PC.
I am in no doubt that the Apple computing experiece is far more bounded that the Windows one but as the PC market marutes PC are becoming appliances. The best in class appliance IMHO, is the apple one and the Mini is a great lead into it of you already have a Screen, keyboars & mouse.
Just my 2p worth.
I'd rather be riding my '63 Triumph T120.
About the same form factor? Did you even look at what you linked? That Shuttle is about the size of a shoebox, not a couple of stacked CD cases. There's absolutely no comparison, other than that they're both much smaller than a full tower.
If you care about the expandability, or price/performance, then definitely go with the Shuttle. If you want a tiny, low-power-consumption, attractive system that can easily be used as a set-top box, then paying a premium for the Mini is probably a better choice. Not everyone shops only on price - value can be derived from places other than raw computing power.
How are sites slashdotted when nobody reads TFAs?
If you want to bitch about an adapter, bitch that it doesn't support VGA or DVI without buying the extra cable.
It comes with an HDMI to DVI adapter in the box. You are correct about VGA though.