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Why Google's Wi-Fi Payload Collection Was Inadvertent

Reader Lauren Weinstein found a blog post that gives a good, fairly technical explanation of why Google's collection of Wi-Fi payload data was incidental, and why it's easy to collect Wi-Fi payload data accidentally in the course of mapping Wi-Fi access points. "Although some people are suspicious of their explanation, Google is almost certainly telling the truth when it claims it was an accident. The technology for Wi-Fi scanning means it's easy to inadvertently capture too much information, and be unaware of it. ... It's really easy to protect your data: simply turn on WPA. This completely stops Google (or anybody else) from spying on your private data. ... Laws against this won't stop the bad guys (hackers). They will only unfairly punish good guys (like Google) whenever they make a mistake. ... [A]nybody who has experience in Wi-Fi mapping would believe Google. Data packets help Google find more access-points and triangulate them, yet the payload of the packets do nothing useful for Google because they are only fragments."

13 of 267 comments (clear)

  1. Well duh by Pharmboy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Of course it was accidental, after all, their corporate slogan is "Do no evil". Obviously they wouldn't do anything that would be evil.

    --
    Tequila: It's not just for breakfast anymore!
    1. Re:Well duh by Z00L00K · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Just see it this way - it's sometimes easier to log every information available when collecting the data and then filter out the interesting parts later. Especially when it's in the prototype state. And suddenly a prototype goes into production just because it works good enough.

      --
      If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
  2. Inadvertent Or Not ... by WrongSizeGlass · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Inadvertent or not Google broke laws in some countries. Accidentally breaking the law doesn't eliminate responsibility or culpability - even if people shouldn't have left their WiFi unsecured.

    If I accidentally run over someone with my car because I wasn't paying attention to what I was doing, it doesn't absolve me of the liability - even if that old lady had it coming, er, was jaywalking.

    1. Re:Inadvertent Or Not ... by slimjim8094 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      They may have broken the letter of the law, but almost positively not the spirit. In any case, the law is seriously flawed if it prevents Google's activity. And here's why:

      People were going to great lengths to literally broadcast the information into the car. How the hell can Google be held responsible for hearing it? If you put 50kW of The Office into my house from a hundred miles away, how is it illegal for me to watch it? And I know it's not illegal for me to record it.

      You don't *need* any analogies for this situation - IT'S A BROADCAST. They're all radio waves. Everybody understands FM, AM, TV broadcasts and would think it absolutely ridiculous for a broadcaster to get all up in arms about somebody receiving it. That's what WiFi is, but with somewhat less power, so it comes up less often.

      Can everybody PLEASE stop using analogies? They only serve to cloud the issue, and everybody already understands radio. It's a matter of making it clear to everybody that WiFi is radio.

      --
      I have developed a truly marvelous proof of this comment, which this signature is too narrow to contain.
    2. Re:Inadvertent Or Not ... by WrongSizeGlass · · Score: 4, Funny

      You don't *need* any analogies for this situation - IT'S A BROADCAST. They're all radio waves. Everybody understands FM, AM, TV broadcasts and would think it absolutely ridiculous for a broadcaster to get all up in arms about somebody receiving it. That's what WiFi is, but with somewhat less power, so it comes up less often.

      Can everybody PLEASE stop using analogies? They only serve to cloud the issue, and everybody already understands radio. It's a matter of making it clear to everybody that WiFi is radio.

      So you're saying I should have used a radio controlled car analogy? OK, but I've never used one of those to run over an old lady before.

    3. Re:Inadvertent Or Not ... by c6gunner · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It may well be that one day I paid with my c/c and you noted first two digits. Indeed nothing you can do with them. Next day I again paid with my c/c and you noted next two digits. Now it makes four. Next day ... [repeat until the logical end.] This is how you can get my entire c/c record. Any single observation is useless; but when combined they are very much useful.

      Yep, which would require a concerted effort to gather the required data, not just a single drive-by capture of a small portion of your CC number. If I came back enough times, then yes, I could get the info, but why would I bother? If I were interested in your CC, I'd just copy down the whole damn thing the first time.

      Anyway, if google wanted access to the data you were sending back-and-forth between your computer and router, it'd be pretty pointless for them to go grab a few dozen packets every couple weeks since the data is unlikely to be related. It would be like me coming over to your house every few weeks, writing down 2 numbers from a random document that you have lying around, and hoping to eventually construct a CC number from the jumble I've gathered. The CC analogy is a fun one, but doesn't really reflect the situation.

      The society instead decided to prohibit all intercepts since they have hardly any social advantages to begin with.

      If that were true, I could go to jail every time windows picks up a new access point.

      Besides, there is an easy way to have an unlisted phone number.

      There is an easy way to encrypt your packets.

  3. No privacy laws is somehow better?? by Migala77 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Laws won't stop the bad guys, but if you have laws you can at least punish them if you catch them. Claiming Google are the good guys (based on what? their motto?) and saying therefore there should not be laws is just ridiculous.

  4. Bogus argument by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    The argument is that capturing data packets is useful to find the SSID of access points which send beacon frames with blank SSID field or where only a client is within range but not the access point itself. That argument is bogus. The mobile devices which will later use the mapped SSIDs and BSSIDs to calculate their own position do not see anything but the beacon frames. It is therefore entirely sufficient to capture just the beacon frames.

    There is a legitimate argument that Google was just lazy (or "scientific") by capturing everything they can get in the field and analyzing later. There is however no technical reason for this and we should not make one up to defend Google.

  5. Re:So? by agrif · · Score: 4, Informative

    Despite what everyone thinks (and how it seems to the uninformed) it very likely was accidental. If I was tasked to correlate Access Points to their locations, the simplest way would be to dump raw wireless traffic to one file, and raw GPS data to another. Later, you can zip them both up and run some analysis, and get the data you want out.

    It'd be real easy to forget to filter the packets you dump to only anonymous, non-data-carrying packets. More than likely the people who designed it just forgot to, or figured it would be no big deal if they just never used that info. Sloppy engineering maybe, but certainly not malicious.

  6. Re:I honestly don't understand the fuss by FuckingNickName · · Score: 5, Insightful

    There's a very sensitive infrared camera and microphone outside your house right now, and we're disturbed by your interactions with your plushie. In the spirit of blind justice, I'm going to upload to /b/ and let the People decide.

    If you broadcast your movements via radio (and air movements), why on earth would you expect anyone to consider it private?

    A thick Faraday cage. If you need it, use it.

  7. Re:The good guys? by mellon · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Whether or not they are the good guys, laws that attempt to contravene physics are a bad idea. If the packets had been encrypted, it wouldn't have mattered that Google captured them--without the key, they're just noise. You could pass a law saying that capturing packets broadcast without encryption is illegal, or you could pass a law saying that if you want your packets to be private, you should encrypt them, and if you don't encrypt them, you have no expectation of privacy. Which of these two laws do you honestly think makes the most sense?

    Normally wiretapping involves a deliberate act of bypassing some kind of lock, if only the lock on the box that contains the wires. Here there was no lock, and the packets were hitting the antenna without any special effort on Google's part, and Google did have a legitimate purpose in putting up the antenna and listening for packets. Yes, they got more packets than their legitimate purpose required. Maybe they did so deliberately, although I can't see any reason why that would have been useful to them. But making it illegal is a really expensive way to solve the problem, and it doesn't solve the fundamental problem, which is that people are sending their personal information over the network in the clear.

  8. Re:So? by spinkham · · Score: 5, Informative

    Yes, they should have only saved the SSID, location, and signal strength. Instead, they used off the shelf software which saved more data. There is no reason to believe this was intentional.

    That's fine and legal to do in the USA, as you have no expectation of privacy using unencrypted broadcast:
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00002511----000-.html

    TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 119 > 2511
    (g) It shall not be unlawful under this chapter or chapter 121 of this title for any person—
            (i) to intercept or access an electronic communication made through an electronic communication system that is configured so that such electronic communication is readily accessible to the general public;

            (v) for other users of the same frequency to intercept any radio communication made through a system that utilizes frequencies monitored by individuals engaged in the provision or the use of such system, if such communication is not scrambled or encrypted.

    In the US, if you transmit in the clear on unlicensed spectrum, they can legally pick it up due to two different, non-overlapping legal clauses. ( Note, I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice, this is but one of possibly relevant laws, etc.)

    The problem is they didn't need to do so, and it creeps people in the US out. So even here where it is legal, they probably shouldn't have from a PR point of view.

    In some other countries it is not legal to collect that data, and doing so intentionally might lower your penalties, but still does not make it legal.

    --
    Blessed are the pessimists, for they have made backups.
  9. Re:FR0$T P&$$ by Antidamage · · Score: 4, Interesting

    You make an excellent point.

    For my part, I'd like to point out that if Google wanted to read your email, they wouldn't bother collecting wifi data. They'd just read yer fucking email.