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Apple Patent Points To iMac Touch Running OS X and iOS
siliconbits noted an interesting little tale of a recently surfaced Apple Patent covering an iMac Touch with a flex base that switches from iOS to OS X based on orientation. There's some interesting food for thought in there ... I can't decide if I like the idea or not.
This is what it has looked like for a long time. iOS is on their every other line of devices and the walled garden apps economy is a significant money maker for Apple. Combine that with the recent patent of remotely detecting and disabling jailbroken iPhones and I think Apple really wants to control the whole area, and obviously wants more and more money. Say goodbye to hobbyists or hackers, and just imagine if Microsoft did the same.
Apple trying to dumb down the computer and to vertically integrate the entire experience to lock everyone in will probably fail. Right about at the peak of Microsoft's power is when the company saw they had to support other technologies. IBM's peak in the mainframe age vanished when PC's came along and freed people from the tyranny of the mainframe.
i like my iphone and think it's the right experience for a mobile device, but not the computer.
By the time a patent becomes public the inventor has sent it in about three or more years prior. If we haven't already seen this, it isn't likely to happen soon. go to appleinsider and checkout all the "apple patent points to" things you've never seen. Obviously, they don't report on the patents that you have seen (who would read, "Apple patent points to phone with touch screen and accelerometer.") so it is a little hard to know the time to market versus time to patent delay, but I've never seen anything an "Apple patent points to".
Can we please call the iPhone OS something different? Cisco sold the original IOS years before Apple. Capitalization doesn't create a strong enough distinction. It just looks wrong.
------ Take away the right to say fuck and you take away the right to say fuck the government.
So if you're straight, it runs one OS, and if you're gay, it runs the other.
Does this mean Apple is trying to patent device-based gaydar?
Jobs #&@%ing told you. He told you that iOS was the way his computers were going to shift, but you said "not on the desktop, that's what Mac OS X is for". In five years time, he'll be running iOS on xserves and calling it a revolution in server security "never run untested code! Turn daemons on and off with the flick of a finger on your dedicated iPad (dedication license fees per iPad/xserve connection apply).
While touch-based input is well suited to many applications, conventional styles of input, such as a mouse/keyboard input may be preferred in other applications. Therefore it may be desirable for some devices to provide for touch-based input as well as mouse/keyboard input. However, a UI being displayed by the display device during a touch-based input mode might not be suited for use during a mouse/keyboard input mode, and vice versa.
I certainly hope you have to hit the escape key to switch modes. It would be vi/emacs all over again.
Steve said...
Yep, freedom from programs that steal your private data. Freedom from programs that trash your battery. Freedom from porn. Yep, freedom. The times they are a changin’, and some traditional PC folks feel like their world is slipping away. It is.
If Steve thinks the desktop metaphor is too difficult for most users, he'll take it away from everyone. If he thinks only signed applications should be allowed to run on your computer, he'll make it so. Of course, Microsoft could do the same thing, but Apple is certainly more likely to make those decisions. I can only hope they will keep the "mouse option" for pro creative users, but with Apple randomly removing FireWire, ExpressCard slots, and still failing to provide professional level graphics cards, most people see the writing on the wall: average joe consumers along with iPods and iPads are the future. Steve is a smart guy, but I wouldn't put it past his ego to declare the end of computers as we know them.
OS X developers think the same thing.
Last week, we also hosted a live chat featuring several developers whose apps were picked for our Ars Design Awards for Mac OS X. We asked them what they thought about the future of Mac OS X and Apple's development platform during the chat, and then followed up on their thoughts about languages and APIs. While current Mac developers aren't nearly as concerned as our own John Siracusa about the Objective-C language in particular, they do see new and improved APIs coming down the pike. Developers are seeing iOS influencing Mac OS X instead of the other way around.
The developers on our panel unanimously agreed that Mac OS X will eventually be subsumed by iOS, but that the Mac has plenty of life left. "Mac is the awesome old grandma, whose kids (iPhone & iPad) have left home," Atebits' Loren Brichter said. "Not dead; not really dying. But it's our job to keep her comfortable until she's gone."
Otherwise I would hate it with a firey hate.
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Prisencolinensinainciusol. Ol Rait!
Why would you want iOS on an iMac? I could see going in the other direction, and putting OSX on an iPad, This doesn't make sense to me unless iOS kicks in when it's taken off its base and used as a tablet.
Apple and Andorid are reinventing the way we look at software, "Apps" to be specific. Who knows where it will really take us - sure desktop software is a different ballgame than mobile, but what are people using more of? Our main "Software" of use has been the web browser as of late (For a majority of people) as well as word processors. Beyond those, what percentage of people use 2-3 other desktop applications?
How many mobile apps do they use?
As someone that writes mobile apps, the process is frustrating. We are seeing a mass dumbing down of the already dumb consumer. Everyone now expects all software to cost $0.99 - be feature packed, and work flawlessly. As anyone that develops software knows, "pick two of those."
I wouldn't mind being able to run Angry Birds HD on my home computer. For 99c, my kids get a great experience kinda thing? Not bad at all.
I'm a long-time linux user (since pre-1.0 Slackware), but have presentation needs that I personally prefer some software support for. Thus I use a presentation package --- PowerPoint typically. For a long time I would run linux on my laptop and dual-boot windows when I needed to do presentations. The nature of my work and personal preference requires the use of a Unix-based OS to get anything meaningful done.
I first migrated to the Mac when I noticed times had changed and they had built something I had always thought they should do every since they bought the NeXT properties --- tart it up to look sufficiently as they want it to, but leave the Unix underpinnings for the developer/power user crowd (NeXT was great for that --- all the Humanities people I knew that used it had no idea there was a terminal on the machine and loved it...the fact there was a terminal meant I loved it too =). With office available on the Mac, giddy-up - I get the machine I want without dual-booting. Great!
I've always had a worry in the back of my head that my happiness with Macs would be transient --- that as the platform regained traction they would start screwing with it in ways that are unfriendly to the unix crowd. So far, so good, but ever since the iPad I have been concerned they would push toward that being their OS rather than the full-blown OSX we have currently. I do understand the points people make about how developers need a development environment so the desktop OS won't be going anywhere, but that clearly isn't necessarily the case: no reason they can't build a suitable development environment for the more restricted OS, or simply leave it to developers to cross-compile. Bottom line is my utopian "main-stream unix-based OS that is friendly to the non-power user" may well be at risk.
So fine - it's their company, they'll do what they want and probably make oodles of money doing it. But it will ultimately push me back onto linux full-time, and I'll probably just suck it up and learn to live with PDF presentations or OpenOffice as I have no interest in going back to a dual-boot solution...I'm getting too old I guess :).
It will sadden me a little though as in spite of some of the vendor lock-in that Apple tries to encourage, I have been happy using their products and have built up a bit of an ecosystem I enjoy using. I realize I (we?) are not really the market they are concerned with dominating, but it's a shame they jettison the "win-win" product I feel they had in keeping both the unwashed masses and the developer/power user happy with what is available.
Maybe good for Linux longer-term though. We are light years from where we were a decade ago in terms of user-friendliness of the system. Maybe this can be a tipping point and we'll end up with a "win-win" free OS which would be very liberating for everyone involved =).
--
~AC
Sounds like Apple is sticking its toe in the water. I've loved Mac from the beginning. Lately, I've been moving away from it. I just hate the way they seem to be focusing on selling songs and movies. Apple computers are just going to be disposable gizmos to log into your .mac account to buy songs and movies. Designed to be thrown away in a few years. How green is that?
Seems like I'm working more and more in Linux and Windows XP. Just built my first PC. It was fun. It felt like the Apple IIE days.
From now on, I am keeping better track of my important files and data, and am trying to remember that platform is not important. Data is.
I've also been using Boot Camp and Visual Studio, and put the Objective C and Cocoa Books away.
Did you know that there is a Windows version of Filemaker?
Firefox runs great!
OpenOffice works fine.
Microsoft Word and Excel are Okay - not GOOD - but just Okay.
Sent from my Imac (Currently running XP)
My best guess is that Apple is trying to create a nice "walled-garden" for content providers. Apple has been trying for years to get all the big content providers from TV, Film, etc on the Mac, but these guys saw what happened to the music industry so they have been slow to move. When the iPhone came out you finally had a operating system that the normal user (i.e. not people who are JailBreaking there stuff) couldn't access.
Now they have the iPod, iPad, and the soon to be released iTV (rumor). If they want to get the content, they have to prove to these guys that they have a "safe" environment. It makes sense that Apple is going to try and spread this to the desktop.
I don't like it, but I understand why they are doing it.
The real Sig captains the Northwestern. This one captains
Patents are crap, but UI patents are totally crap. It is like being able to patent language. Now that would be useful.
app store lock in will kill macs and the law may even force apple to open ios to any store / app.
Not only will apple hardware cost more then pc with way less choice. The app choice will just as bad and lot's of free software will go away as well for the mac.
$99 /year just to have free apps in the store and if you want to sell apps pay 30% of the sales as well?
or makeing windows software where it's free for free apps with no Nazi like censorship and if you want to sell stuff you don't have to pay M$ 30% of the sale.
Getting all their apps rewritten by hand, to run on low-memory, low-power devices. Getting all their distribution and supply controlled by keys. Don't make money on the app store, just keep it as the portal everyone must access, let developers and customers get totally addicted to it, and just keep it controlled, with good quality, PR, prices, statistics, tracking, everything under control. Institute many penalties and disadvantages for breaking the walled garden. Fixes piracy, security, badware apps, hacker apps, poor-quality-ware, lots of problems. Further integrates computer and cellphone. Control the supply of software and hardware for music, apps, movies, cellphones, computers. The only part I don't care for is the total-one-corporation-control who I trust just as any corporation, to make money above all and comply with government demands and pressures. Too bad such integration and cooperation is so hard to get, by nature, for uber-rebellious open source hackers. We could build great things. To me, the discussion should center around standards, which after implemented generally everyone accepts, and how to encourage and integrate the activity of everyone, developers, users more, something like these apps-store, music-store, movie-store, forums, etc.
Build your own energy sources from scratch. http://otherpower.com/
I've never seen any of the sockpuppets you mention post, but I see your retard drivel here every day. I think you're the troll.
Apple just has to free the emulator from the SDK.
they might try a tactic of only supporting Mac OS X on their most expensive workstations, and shipping lower end computers with only iOS.
True, Apple could make Mac OS X exclusive to Mac Pro hardware. Then Apple might move to a Nintendo-style model where you have to have a dedicated office and published applications for someone else's platform in order to qualify for the iOS SDK.
I definitely thought Apple was going to make a combination touch screen iMac and Cisco router.
I wouldn't put a touch screen router beyond Apple, seeing as how Apple did popularize 802.11b with AirPort. Imagine a Time Capsule with a built-in iPad.
Funny how you compare $99/year to "free" on Windows. Nothing is free my friend.
Plenty of people spends hundreds of dollars a year on Visual Studio just to program for Windows. $99/year for all the toolsets and support you need for OS X (actually the software is free) and the ability to publish apps in a captive market with an easy to buy interface rich with impulse buying opportunities isn't such a bad thing.
the 30% cut covers a lot of services Apple provides. Good luck delivering your app to millions of potential customers at less than 30% cost to you. Hell, for a $0.99 app webhosting/bandwidth will probably cost you more than 30%. Plus you still need to find a way to drive customers to your site.
Apple also tracks all your sales and gives you nice reports to look at (useful for businessy types) and will handle all your tax paperwork.
90+ comments and no one has mentioned that the 'touch' part could mean they're making the iMac like Wacom's Cintiq? http://www.wacom.com/cintiq/cintiq-12wx.php?gclid=CL7b1ebB0qMCFVjW5wod8DD0ug
Care killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back.
Apple trying to dumb down the computer and to vertically integrate the entire experience to lock everyone in will probably fail ... i like my iphone and think it's the right experience for a mobile device, but not the computer.
I believe it is far more plausible that iOS will supplement Mac OS X, not replace it, and be used for specialized applications where a Mac is used in a kiosk or some other embedded environment where an extremely simplified and touch based interface is desirable.
Isn't IOS based on OS X? Maybe it's not an either/or thing. Maybe it's simply re-enabling a few more features in IOS that had to be axed to fit it on a phone with limited battery life. True Full multi-tasking comes to mind. Better support for peripherals & ports, and other such stuff.
A beginners' guide to Portland, OR?
or makeing windows software where it's free for free apps with no Nazi like censorship and if you want to sell stuff you don't have to pay M$ 30% of the sale.
Nazi like censorship? So who did Apple murder recently? Any names? If they survive, it's not "Nazi-like".
And you are welcome to sell your software on a market stall, but you will have to pay significant money for the stall. Maybe a door-to-door sale then. Knock on everyone's door, up and down the street. That is about the only way you can keep 100% of your sales, and you will likely have more cost in replacing worn out shoes than you make from your software.
I heard that sopssa is the same person as our old favourite Trip Master Monkey. Is this true?
Try as I might, I can't imagine why anyone would want something like this. For one thing, it's a given that your router is going to have to be physically plugged into something like a cable modem (or equivalent), so it's not like you can walk around with it. So why would anyone want to spend the money for a touch-screen interface when you could access & control the thing remotely via the web (or AirPort application)?
Now I know you can't be serious. 802.11b was popular way, way before Apple came out with the Airport. Apple never even captured that big a share of the wireless router market - I think they're currently ranked like fifth, behind Netgear, Linksys, Belkin, and D-link... and they've never really dominated the market.
Seriously, if this is supposed to be a joke or a troll or something, I'm just not getting it.
Of course they won't kill OS X, but it would certainly make some sense to put iOS on the cheaper machines and restrict OS X to the MBP's and Mac Pros. Mac Pros become a lot more appealing (despite their high price) if you need to buy one to have a legit Mac desktop machine for development. Think about it, iOS on Mac Mini, Macbook, OS X on MBP and Mac Pro. Justifies the high price they want to keep on MBP and Mac Pros, and also lets them go lower on the pricing of the mini, the iPad and the Macbook. I don't think this is farfetched at all.
Usefulness to the user has nothing to do with this. This is about Apple gaining control over its users and their computers, and deciding what can or cannot be installed. It is plenty useful for Apple to do this.
Palm trees and 8
So why would anyone want to spend the money for a touch-screen interface [on a router] when you could access & control the thing remotely via the web (or AirPort application)?
Because you can run iPad apps on it while someone else is using your other iPad. Likewise, people pay for a Time Capsule instead of a generic home wireless router because of features it offers. Think of it as like the difference between an iPod nano and an iPod touch.
802.11b was popular way, way before Apple came out with the Airport.
In that case, I don't understand why I had never heard of WLANs prior to July 21, 1999, when Apple announced AirPort.
Yeah, but neither did anybody else, nor any other army in the world, it just so happens that an army led by Napoleon did.
HP, IBM, Fujitsu, Gateway et al didn't take the tablet market by storm in the 8 years they've been selling tablets, but Apple did on their first try, with Steve Jobs at the helm.
Say Apple charged 30% of the price for distributing OS X applications (not apps).
For a lot of software companies, that would make life easy. They would not have to worry about an infrastructure to keep people notified about updates, nor worry about buying bandwidth for app update downloads, nor worry about having have a download site (or physical boxes.) Advertisement is easy -- just tell people to go look at FooApplication in the App Store, and be done with it. You have a single source to write demos and limited versions.
Of course, essentially we are talking about Steam here, so the exact issues with Steam would apply, such as what would happen to purchased software if Valve goes out of business or shuts their servers down?
http://www.redmondpie.com/os-x-10.7-wont-feature-app-store-9140689/
Right. The OS is the same Mach Microkernel with BSD on top. Just the user interface is different and the BSD toolchain a "little" scaled down.
Maybe it's because I'm not browsing low enough, but the feel of the threads on this story seems to be along the lines of "OS X will go by the wayside, and we will be forced to program iOS apps on iOS, a platform developed for phones and tablets, or else the iOS SDK will be prohibitively expensive." I have two responses to that.
First, what happens when Apple stops selling Macs with traditional OS X in favor of the desktop progeny of iOS? Those who would not be developing for iOS anyway (shot in the dark: most Apple consumers) may or may not applaud the decision and will probably not be majorly impacted by the decision. Those who would develop or consider developing for the platform (shot in the dark: most people with negative feelings in the comment threads here) are likely faced with serious barriers to entry for development on the platform.
Has Apple traditionally been known for making it difficult to develop for their platforms? I don't know. Would they seriously consider the impact on developers for their unified desktop/phone/tablet platform before they make a decision like this? Absolutely. If developers are going to have a comparatively hard time developing for iOS, they will both do it less and do it worse.
Second, if Apple does finally stick with pushing only a desktop version of iOS and you don't like it, then there is no better time (in my book) to move away from Apple (or not move to Apple) and support a Linux distribution whose interface more closely resembles OS X. In the technology's current state, I struggle to find fault in Mac OS X proper, and iOS works pretty well on my iPod Touch. To take iOS and put it onto every new Apple desktop/laptop computer, even with serious usability tweaks to be at least something like what I would want in a desktop/laptop computer, would be a big "fuck you!" to everybody I know that does a lot of serious work on a Mac that wouldn't translate well at all into an iOS environment.
("everybody I know that does a lot of serious work on a Mac" uses their Mac because of OS X's convenient and consistent interfaces and would be using a Linux distribution otherwise.)
If you don't want iOS, and that's all that Apple is selling, then you know better than to buy it, I hope.
If you say "troll", you get modded troll. Wait a sec . . . nooooooo . . . D:
Anywho, back on topic, I'll be damned if I let iOS touch my pretty computers. I like Mac computers (not computer wannabees. I'm looking at you, iPad), and I like OS X. Call me a fan boy all you want, though I personally don't give a damn for Apple itself or their fashion shiny-of-the-year devices.
I read TFA and all I got was this lousy cookie
There are PLENTY of other tools other than visual studio that can be used to develop for windows. Free. In many different languages too!
A bit off topic, but Microsoft actually offers Visual Studio and many other tools for free to students via DreamSpark. Not old and outdated either, newest versions and such. I have always been anti-MS but this actually seems like a sensible move to encourage develpment.
i thought they might do something like this when i heard about the ipad.
reckon it would be great if the touch screen interface worked with proper applications like photoshop, illustrator, flash (tee hee!).
Still not getting it. My router (as I'm sure is the case with most people) is tucked in a somewhat out of the way place because it needs to be connected to the cable modem, which needs to be connected to the wall. The only way I could use a touch screen on it is if I were standing next to my desk. I'm certainly not going to be able to sit down in the easy chair and use it because of the must-be-connected-to-the-wall thing.
And it wasn't a big seller then, it's not a big seller now, and it's never been a big seller at any point in between, at least compared to the market leaders. So no matter when it was introduced, it's still quite a stretch to say that Apple "popularized" 802.11*.
Look, don't get me wrong, I own a Time Capsule and like it. But I really can't understand why I'd want one that was also an iPad (given that you can't walk around with it) and it's kind of silly to pretend that Apple was the driving force behind wireless networking, because it simply wasn't.
that will never be used
Like anyone can even know that
"Dashboard" (F12 if you are on a Mac) would be an obvious integration point for iOS.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dashboard_(software)
It even has the iOS sized icons and the existing dashboard options cannot be monetized by the Apple machine.
http://www.apple.com/downloads/dashboard/
Dashboard is currently a microcosm of utilities and distractions, just like my iPhone.
How can you guys say that can't you see how revolutionary apple is. Multiple operating systems on the one computer is ingenious. I simply don't know how these people come up with these ideas. They should come up with a name that really shows there creative power like I-dual-boot. How do other company’s keep up when apple keeps inventing things that have never been done before?
Okay, that was fuckin' funny!
Sounds like the HTC shift which runs Windows CE in one mode and Windows XP in the other