Gene Simmons Threatens Anonymous Again and Gets DDoS'd

BussyB writes "Rather than shutting him up, the 'Operation Payback' DDoS attack on his websites only made Simmons more angry and outspoken. None of those threats seemed to bother Anonymous, however, and the group promptly launched another DDoS attack on both of Simmons' websites and rendered them inaccessible once again."

Comments

Something I find interesting

[Pojut]

It always seems like it's the largest and most sucessful musicians that slam piracy and filesharing.

Weird. Don't they make most of their money by performing dozens of times a year, anyway? I thought income from record sales was minimal, compared to touring and merchandise...

Re:Something I find interesting

[shadowrat]

or is it the shrewdest businessmen who become the largest and most successful musicians? Kiss was a business. It was about marketing and maximizing profits. Of course the people at the head of that machine are concerned about every angle they could pursue and every dime they could possibly get.

Re:Something I find interesting

[John Pfeiffer]

All the more ironic given that this is probably because of his son's blatant plagiarism of popular Japanese comics.

But while you're on the subject, I've always found Metallica's opposition of filesharing to be most amusing, since it's widely understood that they gained initial popularity from the circulation of bootlegs of their live performances. (In fact, if I remember the documentary I saw correctly, this bit of information may have come directly from their own mouths.)

Re:Something I find interesting

[Monkeedude1212]

It's in their best interest to keep the labels happy though. Sometimes the private jet, the pool, the mercedes, aren't actually owned by the musicians (though they'll say that they are on MTV Cribs) but are actually loaned out by the labels so that the band can live the high life while they're on their streak of popularity. You make the label money, they take care of their top money bags to keep them with the label. You fall off the charts? Want to switch labels? Well they're going to repo that car and give it to the next big shot in town.

So when the largest and most successful musicians seem to be slaming their FANS because they want to enjoy the music, it's because the record sales are keeping them in the Hollywood lifestyle. Perhaps you might be unaware of this, but sometimes when you sign up with a label, you can't actually go on tour without the labels permission. Then they've got you by the balls where you can't make money unless they let you.

Re:Something I find interesting

[Darth]

Metallica encouraged tape trading of their shows and their demo tapes. Between songs during their sets, they told audiences to share their music. That is exactly how they got their record deal. They really didn't start giving a crap about people sharing their music until the whole napster thing. Even then, I think it's just Lars. I'm not convinced the rest care.

Lars was always kind of an ass. He's a crafty business man, though.

Re:Something I find interesting

[formfeed]

I don't buy Kiss merchandise because I'm concerned he's so far over the edge he'll use the money to try and get draconian revenge,

Following that argument it would be really unethical to buy a Kiss CD. Good thing you never liked Kiss to begin with. Otherwise, if you really wanted to listen to Kiss, you would have very few options:

1. Surpress your passion for music and suffer. -But you know it's for a good cause.
   Great, the suffering will be a sign that you're doing the right thing. (As long as you're Catholic or Jewish.)
2. Copy the music illegally.
   Great, you break the law for a reason, fight the system. (And also save some money while doing it.)
3. Buy only used CDs on yard sales and flea markets.
   Great, you beat the system, you crafty anti-capitalist. (And support pop-culture addicted teens so they can buy more stuff)

Re:Something I find interesting

[BJ_Covert_Action]

Today? No one even cooks. Everyone orders Domino's or goes to Micky D's. Support what is left of culture

That's nonsense, or, at least, anecdotal. Here on the central coast of California, if it's a nice evening out, you can jog through my community and, depending on which part of town you are in, you can smell the rednecks BBQing hamburgers, the Mexicans BBQing carne asada, or all of the suburbanites cooking their latest Stoffer's stir fry packet. Plenty of people cook. There is plenty of culture left in America. I don't know why the area you grew up in is changing, but out here on the West Coast, in the smaller towns and cities, that is very much not the case.

Re:Something I find interesting

[bws111]

All consumer goods, whether it be art, cars, electronics, furniture, clothing, or anything else, is produced on spec. On spec means that the costs of producing it (including design, facilities, equipment, overhead, materials, etc) is recouped on every single 'copy' of the thing sold. Every car sold has earned some money towards the design of the car. As long as that car is sold, the design of the car is earning profits. Same with every shirt sold. Same with every CD sold. Now, in many cases (cars for instance) the cost of actually producing the physical item far outweighs the portion of money that goes to paying for the design, but the design cost is there nevertheless.

Now, you say you are designing stuff and getting paid. All that means is that your employer has effectively taken a loan against his future profits and paid you with that money. HE is still going to get paid for every copy of the thing that you designed that is sold, which will be used to pay back the loan he used to pay you, and hopefully also earn some profits. You are lucky, you get all your money now rather than having to wait a potentially long time to get paid. If you work for a good company, and the value of your work exceeds projections, you may be paid even more money as part of a bonus or profit-sharing incentive. Regardless of whether or not you earn more in the future, ALL of the money you earned comes from sales, either actual or expected.

As far comparisons to the Statue of Liberty, etc, that is just stupid. The people who designed and built the Statue of Liberty were hired to do that. The money to pay them came from the government. The Statue of Liberty was never intended to earn money. Same with your other examples. However, there are bridges that were built with private money. And guess what? The owners still expect to be paid every time someone uses the bridge, even if it was build 100 years ago.

Re:Something I find interesting

[cayenne8]

"That's pretty much the case with me as well. There are a TON of "bedroom" and "local studio" musicians out there, putting out original and interesting music. I see no reason to line the pockets of rich fatcats who throw crumbs at the people that earn them money."

So, where do you find these new musicians? Where do you find the TIME to find them?

:)

I mean...hell, I live in New Orleans...places play music down here, but during the week, I don't have the time to go out. I work a real job and try to hit the gym. Music in places here starts at 11pm at the EARLIEST it seems, I'm getting old and am usually in bed at 9pm or so (get up a bit after 5am to hit the gym).

I've often heard "well, its on the internet...stream music...etc". Well, everywhere I work at...networks are secured, no streaming on work computers.

I am trying, though to do a little in my iPhone...and starting to try to listen to Pandora a bit. I'm still a bit lost on how to find things I really like, modern bluesy guitar driven rock. I know you can punch in a led zeppelin, but that's what it plays, and I own all their stuff.

Any suggestions on channels to look for? Anything else out there free besides Pandora on the iPhone?

I do want to listen to new music, find the good artists...and do prefer good live music, but whew...when you're over 25yrs (I can only imagine how hard it gets when you have wife and kidlets too)...hard to find it, and hard to see it with it starting so damned late.

Does live music start earlier with ya'll live?

Re:Something I find interesting

[Oqnet]

actually on that note you brought up something I had completely forgot about. He does have 2 kids... this is what his son Nick did recently.. http://www.squidoo.com/nick-simmons-art-thief http://www.penciljack.com/forum/showthread.php?101682-Nick-Simmons-Incarnate-swipes-Tite-Kubo-s-Bleach&highlight=simmons thought someone here might find that interesting....

Re:Something I find interesting

[darthdavid]

Exactly. 90% of the negative consequences of drugs come about because of their illegality and the remaining 10% mostly just effect the person doing the drugs (and thus it should be their choice). As something of a musician myself I'd be thrilled if someone was pirating my work (in fact, I've put it all up online for free). After all, if they're downloading it it means that they like it.

Be careful about what you say

[srussia]

FTFA:“Be litigious. Sue everybody. Take their homes, their cars. Don’t let anybody cross that line,” Simmons encouraged his peers.

He should have listened to his mother and watched that tongue.

You're missing something here Gene...

[tekiegreg]

The group "anonymous" is everyone and it is no-one...it is what was once your devoted fan-base likely. But now that you've threatened them with jail and a pack of angry lawyers they have become defensive and your worst enemy. They are the embodiment of the hearts you are trying to win towards your music and the mass that is disappointed in your reality.

No I'm not doing this, I honestly didn't hear about these attempts until right now...and have never been a big fan of KISS's music from the get go...

Kiss goooood...pirates baaaad

[grapeape]

Sadly Gene is about 5 years behind Metallica in learning that biting the hand that feeds you hurts you more in the end. I've got a friend that would buy every piece of Kiss crap that hit the shelves from CD's to action figures. He got sick of Gene's crap last year over this kind of thing and has been slowly selling his entire collection on ebay. It doesn't help that the album prices for digital downloads are nearly 50% higher than buying the CD. Take Kiss Alive II for example, at Wal-Mart and Best Buy its $9.99 while on Amazon and Itunes its $13.99, who in their right mind would buy the digital version when they can buy the disk and just rip it? I dont use a cd player anymore, but still buy CD's for this specific purpose....but according to Gene im a pirate for it. I realize your an old man Gene but you pretend to be hip and relevant try and at least understand the technology and why people do what they do, maybe then you could be part of the solution rather than a contributor to the problem. I dont think Gene realizes that the same people he is wanting to sue are the same people willing to buy Kiss caskets and trinkets, with his known level of greed you would think he would be more concerned with the revenue stream than someone downloading a copy of a song they have likely already purchased on Vinyl, Cassette and CD.

Re:Internet Terrorism

[BobMcD]

Anonymous doesn't care. They are doing it for the lulz. To assume they have any agenda besides lulz gives them too much credit. Honestly, have you ever visited 4chan? Does that user base strike you as political or activist?

The issue, though, is that 'Anonymous' is a myth. These are real people committing actual crimes, and since they're being so brazen about the conflict, there's an excellent chance that someone WILL take the fall for all of it. It would be one thing to launch an attack at a site unannounced, but to repeatedly use the same methods at the same target, that's just stupid. A scapegoat will be produced if this continues, I promise you that.

So agenda or not, Parent is right. This is not the way to prove Gene wrong. Not today, not in this manner.

All I can think is, 'poor, stupid, kid'.

Re:Didn't he do a lot of drugs?

[BobMcD]

What's going on here. He's over 60, and a musician, didn't he do a lot of drugs in his youth? Why isn't he dead yet?

I was kind of hoping darwin would have taken care of these old pro-RIAA musicians already with a gentle dose of death.

Did you ever consider that the ENTIRE thing was a front? Not just the costumes, but the drug lifestyle and the whole thing? Real junkies-turned-rockstars OD early. As do rockstars-turned-junkies. But there's really only a certain personality type or two that would genuinely flush everything down the toilet like that. It isn't as common as you've been led to believe, and it selects contrary to the traits that make someone a rock legend.

Re:He'll have to learn the hard way...

[Anonymous Coward]

On the other hand, though, if you let them get away with this sort of behavior, you're just reinforcing it, too, by telling them (in essence) "this is how far you'll have to go to win".

It's rather like dealing with stalkers (who're pretty much on the same rung of the ladder as far as lowlifes are concerned); even if a stalker calls you a hundred times a day, you still don't pick up the phone, as all that accomplishes is teaching them that a hundred calls is what it takes to get through to you.

Not acknowledging trolls at all is probably the best option, but it's not always a feasible option.

In any case, for Simmons, it's likely all a matter of money, anyway. How much money does he lose when his websites are inaccessible? How much money does he have to spend on securing them against this? If it's less than what he gains from tougher legislation which will get passed because he can point to these trolls as a justification for why it's needed, then the whole thing will have worked out in his favor, and the trolls will have been nothing but useful idiots who played their role in his game without even realizing.

Re:Didn't he do a lot of drugs?

[gstoddart]

What's going on here. He's over 60, and a musician, didn't he do a lot of drugs in his youth? Why isn't he dead yet?

Doesn't drink. Doesn't smoke. Doesn't do drugs. Says he never did, nobody has ever contradicted him on that.

Also claims to have humped everything that ever came along, which you can take with a grain of salt. I'm sure his own count is inflated, but I'm sure he's never wanted for willing females.

Gene Simmons is a nice Jewish boy who has always been about making money and selling his brand. He's not your typical aging rocker -- having watched a couple episodes of his TV show, he's an out of date old fool of a narcissist who is obsessed with his own image and making money in the worst possible way.

In short, he's absolutely part of the problem with the RIAA mindset. As has been pointed out in this thread, advocating prison rape for file sharers (or Anonymous, or whomever he was referring to) goes to demonstrate he's a bit of a loon, and has way crossed the line.

I thought he was irrelevant before his TV series. Now he's irrelevant, pathetic, and a lot more lame than I ever thought he was. At least his son seems to treat him like the old troll that he is.

Re:Gene, you may want to stay quiet

[magus_melchior]

It's the guy who told one of the best interviewers in the country that she should welcome him with "open legs". I don't think intelligence and good sense are part of his skill set.

Re:Didn't he do a lot of drugs?

[gstoddart]

Real junkies-turned-rockstars OD early. As do rockstars-turned-junkies. But there's really only a certain personality type or two that would genuinely flush everything down the toilet like that. It isn't as common as you've been led to believe, and it selects contrary to the traits that make someone a rock legend.

Not without some precedent though.

Eric Clapton, George Harrison, The Stones, Aerosmith, Motley Crue, Guns and Roses, Kurt Cobain, CCR ... probably countless I can't even think of off the top of my head ... the whole notion of rock legends being users of some pretty hardcore drugs is exceedingly well documented, and not what you'd call a front. The ones that survive it and keep going are some of the biggest legends there are.

Many of them turned around and stopped using. But, in a huge amount of cases, I don't believe that the whole drug thing was a "front". It's more like documented fact.

Now, in the case of Simmons at least, he absolutely wasn't using them, and I don't think ever claimed he did.