Slashdot Mirror


Batteries Smaller Than a Grain of Salt

An anonymous reader writes "Lithium-ion batteries have become ubiquitous in today's consumer electronics — powering our laptops, phones, and iPods. Research funded by DARPA is pushing the limits of this technology and trying to create some of the tiniest batteries on Earth, the largest of which would be no bigger than a grain of sand. These tiny energy storage devices could one day be used to power the electronics and mechanical components of tiny micro- to nano-scale devices."

22 of 68 comments (clear)

  1. You know.... by Reilaos · · Score: 3, Funny

    As exciting as this is, I would take this news... ... with a grain of salt.

    1. Re:You know.... by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 5, Funny

      As exciting as this is, I would take this news... ... with a grain of salt.

      Ugh. If you ever said that to me in person I'd likely be charged with a salt and battery.

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    2. Re:You know.... by LoudMusic · · Score: 3, Funny

      I'd probably just punch you both in the face.

      What?

      --
      No sig for you. YOU GET NO SIG!
    3. Re:You know.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      YEAHHH!!

  2. non removable? by pablo_max · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Apple would still make it un-replaceable ;)

    Seriously though, would it not be even more interesting if something useful existed that could make use of these batteries?

    1. Re:non removable? by mcgrew · · Score: 2, Insightful

      would it not be even more interesting if something useful existed that could make use of these batteries?

      Light bulbs were pretty useless until there were generators. You can't have something useful that depends on something that doesn't exist.

  3. Sand or salt? by smooth+wombat · · Score: 4, Funny

    The title says smaller than a grain of salt but the article says smaller than a grain of sand.

    And what kind of salt are you talking about? Table salt, sea salt, pickling salt? Same goes for sand. Waikiki sand, Provincetown sand, Bali sand?

    What would be nice is if there were some system of measurement that could be easily understood by the masses when talking about such sizes. For example, how many fractions of a Library of Congress would that be? Or maybe elephants. Elephants are always good. I once listened to a story on NPR about how much water is in the average cloud. The scientist (hydrologist?) involved used elephants to let the listener know how many elephants worth of water was being suspended above our heads when clouds are about.

    Personally I prefer metric buttloads. Use that term and everyone knows what you're talking about.

    --
    We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
    1. Re:Sand or salt? by Klinky · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The proper measurement is actually metric asstons...

    2. Re:Sand or salt? by The_mad_linguist · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Except people in the US, since nobody can remember the conversion factor between Metric Buttloads (mB) and Imperial Fucktons.

  4. Re:Why not use in batteries for gadgets? by GlyphedArchitect · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Would that not just be a regular battery?

  5. Re:Why not use in batteries for gadgets? by natehoy · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Because the most efficient batteries are the ones that aren't a bunch of teeny batteries all wired together into a larger one. You have all that wasted space, weight, and resistance loss due to all of the connectors. If this scaled, it would be best used in larger batteries.

    And, from TFA, they are trying to match current densities, not improve on them. Take your 1Ah battery and replace it with 1,000 1mAh batteries that take up the same space, and now you have to connect 1,000 batteries together to come up with the same 1Ah battery. It's larger, heavier, more complex to build, and doesn't last any longer. It's about as logical as trying to get enough rechargeable button batteries to start your car. Sure, you could do it, but it's gonna be a lot bigger, heavier, expensive, and more prone to failure than your current battery.

    The sole purpose of something like this is to power very tiny devices where there's no room for a full-sized battery. It's not improving energy density or efficiency.

    --
    "This post contains words, known to the State of California to cause thought. Wash brain thoroughly after reading."
  6. Maybe they should get the big ones right first by iONiUM · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I don't know about everyone else, but I've had no less than 4 devices in the last year have faulty Li-Ion batteries (they didn't hold a charge, or ran out much faster than they should have). Each time I had to exchange the device for a new one, at which point it worked as expected.

    Is this really how batteries are now? It's pathetic.

    1. Re:Maybe they should get the big ones right first by natehoy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      A couple of months ago, my ThinkPad reported my battery as "unusable" after a year of service. Odd thing was, the battery didn't slowly lose service life. I was getting 3 hours at first, and it was down to about 2 hours 30 minutes, then one day I plugged it in to recharge and the ThinkPad flat out refused to charge the battery. It was under warranty, so Lenovo issued my company a new one free of charge and even overnighted it, but...

      I'm wondering if this is a sign that manufacturers are finally taking the scary explosive dangerousness that is highly unstable Li-Ion seriously, and programming their chargers to be overcautious about any and all perceived faults in the battery?

      --
      "This post contains words, known to the State of California to cause thought. Wash brain thoroughly after reading."
    2. Re:Maybe they should get the big ones right first by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I'd be more interested in knowing why every time the energy density of batteries increase, my consumer grade hardware simply gets thinner with a smaller battery to compensate and make sure my autonomy remains horribly short despite the technology being available to drastically improve things?
      I mean, I know that packing too much energy density around is dangerous but the cell configurations of the larger laptops could easily fit into a smaller one and provide the uncorded hours that those rated numbers boast if the designers weren't so bent on pursuing the look of the macbook air...

  7. Re:Why not use in batteries for gadgets? by Dakman · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The batteries in TFA are more dense, and have a higher capacity for storage in smaller amounts.

  8. Re:Great.... by Dakman · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The connector is larger than the battery! Actually, considering the small size of these, let's pair it up with some wireless power action. Then we'd be in business.

  9. Ok... by i_b_don · · Score: 3, Insightful

    They've got this already... they're called capacitors. Ok, they're not smaller than a grain of salt, but an 0201 package is really fricken small.

    Do you really need the greater power density you get from a chemical reaction rather than a capacitor at those sizes? A capacitor is so much easier to fabricate and charge that I can't imagine why you would go for a battery. I mean, in order to charge a battery, you'd need a chip that is MUCH larger than a grain of salt... although even for a cap you'd want a voltage regulator of some sort.

    Maybe I'm missing something here. What is this for? Nano-machines? Nano listening devices? Nano-trackers? Now that seems like the really interesting question....

    d

    --
    all language nazi's will burne in heil!
    1. Re:Ok... by Dancindan84 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Maybe I'm missing something here. What is this for? Nano-machines? Nano listening devices? Nano-trackers? Now that seems like the really interesting question....

      That's the thing. These are the proverbial horse that's going to pull the cart. We're not sure what these are going to power, but the power source has to be available before those things can be developed. Sure you can design devices without a known power source, but you can't hook a prototype nano-medical bot up to a 12V with jumper cables for proof of concept purposes.

      --
      "Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." - Oscar Wilde
  10. SALT GRAIN BATTERIES USED FOR SURVEILLANCE! by hoggoth · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Slashdot could have gotten more readers with this headline:

    SALT GRAIN BATTERIES USED FOR SURVEILLANCE!

    --
    - For the complete works of Shakespeare: cat /dev/random (may take some time)
  11. So what! by Herkum01 · · Score: 3, Funny

    It is already a pain to change AAA batteries, imagine what it is going to be like trying to change one of these things. Good forbid you drop the thing, or put it in the wrong way. Think, how many sides does a grain of salt have! That is going to the number of ways that someone is going to install it wrong!

    Also, lets say you want to test it to see if it still has a charge. You put it on your tongue and it dissolves! Now your are stuck shelling out another 5 bucks to Energizer!

  12. Power density by ermintru · · Score: 3, Interesting

    So we current have current laptop batteries that store X power in Y space and when then go wrong they over heat or even burst into flames so the new batteries that store the X power in "grain of rice" space then the power density stored must be a minimum of a 1000 times higher what happens when one of those goes wrong?

    1. Re:Power density by jeffb+(2.718) · · Score: 2, Interesting

      FTFA:

      "We're trying to achieve the same power densities, the same energy densities as traditional lithium ion batteries, but we need to make the footprint much smaller," says Chang.

      If these batteries are using a chemical process, they're limited to chemical energy densities, which can't get a whole lot higher than what we see today.

      A white-hot iron rod will make your clothing burst into flames at a touch. A white-hot spark from your Dremel tool grinding that same rod will bounce right off your clothes, or your skin, without any effect or sensation. So, yeah, it would probably be sort of like that.