Slashdot Mirror

← Back to Stories (view on slashdot.org)

Best-Selling Author Refuses $500k; Self-Publishes Instead

Posted by Soulskill on from the six-of-one,-five-hundred-thousand-of-the-other dept.

Last week we discussed an IT book author's adventures in trying to self-publish. Now, an anonymous reader points out an article examining another perspective: "Barry Eisler, a NY Times best-selling author of various thriller novels, has just turned down a $500,000 book contract in order to self-publish his latest work. In a conversation with self-publishing aficionado Joe Konrath, Eisler talks about why this makes sense and how the publishing industry is responding in all the wrong ways to the rise of ebooks. He also explains the math by which it makes a lot more sense to retain 70% of your earnings on ebooks priced cheaply, rather than 14.9% on expensive books put out by publishers."

35 of 290 comments (clear)

  1. big diff: editors are actually important by decora · · Score: 5, Insightful

    editors, working for publishers, are behind a lot of the great literary works of the united states.

    philip k dick's "a scanner darkly" comes to mind. there are many others.

    publishers also deal with libel and defamation lawsuits for you.

    they also set up junkets so you can market your book.

    im not saying theres no point to self publish, but there are many differences between music industry and book industry.

    1. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by MoonBuggy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Absolutely, and for someone new to writing and/or short of capital, the only reasonable way to afford editing, marketing, and so forth is to go with a publisher; thing is, the author is then beholden to the publisher - it's a very old fashioned, paternalistic relationship. Not to mention the fact (brought in to evidence here) that they take a bloody substantial cut of the sales.

      If the author has some cash behind them already, and an established 'brand', then paying for an editor and a PR firm up front may well be far easier, more pleasant, and more profitable in the long run, than signing their creation away to someone else. The publisher is just a middle man, working between the retailers, the editors, the printers & distributors, and the author - not to say that a middle man with knowledge and experience doesn't provide value, but they need to learn that they are employed by the author to provide a service, and not a patron to which the author is beholden. Of course, the fact that publishers traditionally act as initial 'investors' in the process muddies the waters a bit, but as I said, that only applies in the case that the author needs that investment, and even if that is so, there's no reason it needs to come from the publisher, nor are the upfront expenses quite so onerous now that the need to predict the market, print, and ship large amounts of physical inventory is diminishing.

    2. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by larry+bagina · · Score: 5, Funny

      slashdot has a problem hiring decent ones.

      --
      Do you even lift?

      These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.

    3. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Publishers also give advances, which lets authors concentrate on writing their book rather than working at a different job while they try to finish the book in their spare time.

      The whole conversation/interview/article seems to entirely ignore the new author perspective and focus solely on the perspective of authors that have an existing fan base, connections to one or more editors they're comfortable with and enough of a bank account to focus on writing full-time.

      But the similarities to the music industry are there. For quite some time, the largest music acts have setup record labels of their own to publish their music and that of performers they discover. Labels like Maverick Records, No Limit Records and Bad Boy Records were all started by artists that were big enough to use their own releases to establish a successful label.

      There's some differences, but in both cases, enough success through the traditional system enables you to have the freedom to go around the existing players.

    4. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by Nursie · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Lies Incorporated springs to mind. Another PKD novel.

      First few chapters are relatively sane. As are the last few chapters. In the middle is pure PKD weirdness, only even more directionless and bizarre than usual (IMHO). Then I noticed that the weirdness and the last few sane chapters start with the same paragraph.

      So then I finally read the introduction, that says the book was originally published after a brutal pruning by the editor. Later, when PKD got a bit more famous, he managed to get the middle stuffed back in for future print runs.

      The editor was definitely right that time.

    5. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by GrpA · · Score: 5, Informative

      Because editors cost money, even when you're friends with a few. ( And I'd never ask a friend to edit my work for free as anything other than a mutual crit. )

      I self-published an E-book. Admittedly, it could be better edited and I really wish I had the cash to do it. However because I couldn't afford an external editor, I went through 10 editing passes myself ( it's not easy spotting your own mistakes ) and through more than a dozen critics who tore every sentence to pieces.

      The result? It's presently ranking 4.5 stars on Barnes and Noble and has a sales ranking up with the professional. The biggest criticism I get ? Making it free ( Voluntary shareware actually ).

      So while I'd still say a GOOD editor is a valuable thing in the publishing process, I'd also say that you don't need to have a paid editor to do everything you need to make a great story.

      Anyway, you're welcome to judge it for yourself if you like - And feel free to criticize me. I always welcome genuine criticism.

      Title: Turing Evolved ( Science Fiction ) - Currently distributed for free.
      Smashwords Link: http://www.smashwords.com/books/view/34627

      GrpA

      --
      Enjoy science fiction? "Turing Evolved" - AI, Mecha, Androids and rail-gun battles. What more could you want?
    6. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by Patch86 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Because editors cost money, even when you're friends with a few. ( And I'd never ask a friend to edit my work for free as anything other than a mutual crit. )

      You could always offer them a cut. If it takes you 3 months to write, and it takes them 1 week to edit, offer them about a 12th of the overall profit (which means you're about equal in terms of reward-per-hour). If thee book's a runaway success you can make them rich, if not then they get a trickle of pocket money for their trouble.

    7. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by inflex · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Gharr... stupid AC login (or lack thereof).

      We're an independent publishing/writing team here, everything still goes through multiple edits, proofings and all the same stuff, it's essential to edit (doing your own editing is like testing your own software - it does not work!).

      It costs anything between $1000 and $5000 to get a started after you've paid for editing/coverart/PoD-setup but it's a small upfront cost to pay compared to what you lose when a publisher just sits on your work.

      The tide has begun to swing around - with no shortage support and cooperative marketing groups/forums on the net now the publishers really are going to have to fight to get a hold of the next group of big writers. The thing is, if the publisher is already trying to make you a sweet deal, then it's a deal you don't actually need.

      Paul - http://elitadaniels.com/

    8. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by Cyberllama · · Score: 2

      With regards to marketing junkets, this blog does cover that. Both authors state that they are convinced that the #1 best thing you can do market your books is to write another one. Each one catches a few new eyes and prompts new readers to go back and see what else you've written. The time spent in Book stores signing the occasional copy is time that could be much better spent writing. Not only is it more productive with regards to output, but with regards to marketing as well -- or so they believe.

      Sounds good to me.

      As for Libel/Defamation lawsuits, these are fiction writers we're talking about.

    9. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by Cyberllama · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Crowdsource it. I'm a huge fan of podiobooks.com -- alot of the books presented there (for free mind you) often end up to proper book deals and the final version is often changed significantly as a result of feedback from the listener community.

      My understanding is that the Nathan Lowell's and Scott Siglers of the world are doing fairly well for themselves by giving it away for free. It's not unlike the Freemium business model that companies like Evernote use: Free gets as many ears and eyeballs as possible and easy marketing. A certain percentage will recommend it to friends, since it was free and, hopefully, good. That gets you even more ears/eyeballs. A certain percentage of the overall will be such big fans they'll want to buy proper print copies or kindle versions or whatever and, even though you're giving it away for free, you end up selling more copies than you might have otherwise.

    10. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by benwiggy · · Score: 2

      Not to mention the fact (brought in to evidence here) that they take a bloody substantial cut of the sales.

      50% of the retail price goes to the bookseller.
      If you want your book in the window or on the table in a large chain store, then the publisher pays extra for that.

      The publisher must take all his costs, including the author's royalty out of the remainder. That includes production costs, warehousing, distribution; as well as all your staff who do the editing, marketing, and sales. Most publishers have a team of salesmen who schlep around book stores/chain asking if sellers will take their books.

      A book is only worthwhile for a publisher if they can be fairly certain that it will sell many 10s of 1000s of copies in its lifetime. A book that only sells 5000 across 10 years will not make them any money, even at the "academic" prices that you find abhorrent.

      I'm actually all in favour of self-publishing, but it is not a magic bullet. If you think you can market and sell 1000s of copies, then off you go. But for the vast majority, they'll be sitting in the attic for years to come.

      And let's not pretend that publishers are evil money-grabbers. There's an old joke in publishing: "If we wanted to make money, we would be paper merchants."

      The internet is actually helping publishers to sell their books directly, thus cutting out the booksellers. As for ebooks, they have their place and their use, but there will still be a market a physical book for many years to come.

    11. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by vlm · · Score: 3, Interesting

      If you're an author, have you considered bartering?

      Let's put it this way. Say you have three author friends. Pass your book to each of them to proofread, and in turn proofread each of theirs. It's win-win, it costs nobody money, and you get the value of a different perspective. I often am in the situation where I am too blinded by my own bias and can use the outside perspective on something I've created.

      Not a new idea. I know this is not an exhaustive list by any means:

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Writing_circle

      I'm surprised that none of the ebook publisher sites have automated this process, or that I've never heard of them automating it.

      The other side is I really like Nathan Lowell's work, and I would even pay a modest fee to proofread / edit his work before its released. The way he ended "owners share" was pretty much a big WTF and probably could have benefited from some review. Which brings up the topic that beyond simple grammatical correction, I'm not sure crowdsourcing will give useful results unless you're going for super formulaic pulp. I'd probably have to sign a NDA, ok whatever. For anything other than your Very First Book if you can't find one or two fans on the entire freaking internet, including friends, relatives, fellow authors, and coworkers, then, yes indeed, you have very big problems. BTW slightly on topic, Nathan Lowell had a cool interview on the linux link tech show podcast a couple months ago, I don't recall exactly but I think similar issues were discussed.

      Arguing that paid editors exist therefore lone wolf authors absolutely must pay them, is probably going to work about as well as arguing paid software testers exist, therefore lone wolf programmers absolutely must find a way to pay them.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    12. Re:big diff: editors are actually important by WankersRevenge · · Score: 2

      I'll give you a little insight into the publishing industry ... the editor/author relationship is becoming a thing in the past. Publishers these days tend to want to publish "the best" instead of growing a writer. I'm not saying these types of relationships no longer exist, rather they are no longer the norm. These days, publishers are looking for books ready to print.

      That said, marketing dollars for a non published writer is pretty much non-existent. Marketing dollars are generally reserved for the Stephen Kings of the industry while the new writer gets next nothing. And here's the lovely catch-22. Since publishers have access to sales numbers, a first book is do or die for a writer. If your first book sells horribly, you'll be less likely to publish again. A new writer has a better shot at getting published than a failed published one. So as a new writer, you really have the cards stacked against you.

      The big problem with self publishing is that writers tend to publish way too early, but it is certainly losing it's stigma it used to have. I knew a guy who self published a zombie book. It was terrible. I couldn't make it through it but he kept revising it (after he already self published) and he got a book deal out of it. Hell, two years ago, if you self published a manuscript, no house in the world would touch it. These are exciting times for a writer.

  2. Re:Never heard of him. by Shikaku · · Score: 2

    But I'll tell you why I am not inclined towards E-books. I like to read in the tub.

    Derp. Also there are more out there. Pick one, or print it yourself.

  3. Publisher's attitude is for you to bend over..... by blanchae · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Back in 2000, I contacted several publishers about publishing my 500 page book "Introduction to Data Communications", pretty much all declined stating that it was not specific enough. I wrote it specifically because at the time there wasn't an introductary level book. One major publisher had the following conditions that I would have to do in order for them to publish it:

    1. Add another 200 pages
    2. Create an online website
    3. Create an online test bank
    4. They would forward $5,000 of my expected earnings in order to perform the years worth of work.
    5. Hand over complete copyright to them
    6. If they decided that any changes were required, I would have to pay for the changes regardless if I agreed with them or not.

    I told the VP what I thought in the most appropriate terms and stated that I would give the book away rather than have anything to do their company. So since 2000, the book Introduction to Data Communications has been free online to anyone who wishes to use it. I used to make pocket change from the Google adds and for the last couple of years, instead of Google adds, I advertise the programs that I teach for at the post-secondary institute.

  4. Was wondering when this would happen by argStyopa · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I should have figured it'd be a tech-savvy writer.

    When I realized that Neil Gaiman was getting perhaps $2 out of that $20 new book, I thought, 'hell, I wish I could just buy any book he writes directly from him - I'd pay him $6, he gets triple times as much and I get it for 1/3 price'.

    Kudos to him, I hope he's successful against the publisher blacklisting he's going to suffer....

    --
    -Styopa
    1. Re:Was wondering when this would happen by nprz · · Score: 2

      Ditto. Especially saying that I remove the cover as soon as I get it so I don't tear it while thrashing (reading) the book.
      And judging by all the mistakes I see in the current books, they must be pieces of trash before the editing, or the editors are living in some alternate universe where wrong is right.

      DISCLAIMER: This comment was not edited by an editor. Read at your discretion.

  5. Re:Publisher's attitude is for you to bend over... by SpottedKuh · · Score: 5, Informative

    You, sir, have the finest licensing agreement that I have ever seen in the introduction of your book. I was genuinely moved.

  6. Re:Never heard of him. by hawguy · · Score: 5, Informative

    But I'll tell you why I am not inclined towards E-books. I like to read in the tub.

    But e-book readers are even better than paper books for reading in the tub.

    I found that my kindle fits perfectly into a quart sized freezer baggy (which are a bit thicker than sandwich baggies), and I can still operate all of the controls. Perfect for reading in the tub, and unlike a paper book, there's no worries about the book getting soggy if you dip it into the water - you can dunk the entire baggy protected Kindle into the water and pick it up and continue reading.

    The baggy also works well when you want to take it to the beach and protect it from sand... or when you're eating doritos and don't want it to get all cheesy.

    And since I already had these baggies in the kitchen, total cost for this protection was a few cents.

  7. Re:So...back to paper? by Shikaku · · Score: 2

    No, my point was, you can order an ebook to buy a paper edition. There are book printers online that give you a paperback/hardcover book.

  8. Publishing houses aren't Record labels by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Editors are a necessary part of any form of writing that isn't purely artistic (poetry, etc). Creating a piece of writing is a two-step process: first, you come up with the idea that you want to convey, but then you need to convey it in a manner in which people can understand. Even the best writers can be great at the former, but less so on the latter. It's the editor's job to think of the reader, and to put himself in the shoes of the public. Ironically, the same eccentricities that some great writers have that allow them their original viewpoints on their subject matter can be what prevents them from being able to relate to the "normal" reader.

    Yes, there are some geniuses out there. Most of Twain's work is unchanged and Hunter S. Thompson's famous for his ramblings; but really, that's not the yardstick you should be going by.

  9. Re:just like tucker max by Nursie · · Score: 2

    Dean Koontz.... literary genius....

    ROFL.

  10. Fun Interview, If a Bit Long by SpectreHiro · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Hmmmm... Slashdot appears to have eaten my original comment. I hope my comment was yummy and filling, Slashdot.

    Anyway... I read the interview earlier today and it's a pretty good read, if a bit long at somewhere over 13,000 words. Konrath is preaching his usual gospel, but it was nice to get Eisler's perspectives on the publishing industry and its inner workings. He drops a few entertaining links as well; one chronicles his struggles with a French publisher who bought the rights to one of his books. They went to the hassle of translating the book, only to put a cover on it that depicted a chartreuse garage door with a security camera. I have no idea what sort of through process led to that decision, but I'd kind of like to know.

    I'm actually pleased as punch to see Barry Eisler doing so well, and doubly pleased that he's shifting to self-publishing and being so vocal about it. I met him back in 2003 shortly after his first book, Rain Fall, came out. I was working at a bookstore a few miles from his house, and he'd drop through to sign copies and urge us to sell more. I got the impression he was just a genuinely nice guy, and he even humored me when I asked for advice in getting an agent.

    That said, I'm more than a bit jealous, too. He released a short story on Kindle this year, and it's apparently on track to make $30,000, while I'm struggling to sell a dozen copies of my sci-fi novel a month. He's a really good guy, though, and I wish him the absolute best as he dives head first into the self-publishing world.

    --
    You can't win, Darth. If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
  11. Re:Publisher's attitude is for you to bend over... by geminidomino · · Score: 2

    All looks good except for #2.

    Damn, and I was interested, too. :P

  12. Re:Publisher's attitude is for you to bend over... by blanchae · · Score: 4, Funny

    Readings free, copying it - I take your soul...

  13. Re:Publisher's attitude is for you to bend over... by blanchae · · Score: 2

    I don't know if that was a compliment or not...

  14. Re:Never heard of him. by Aeternitas827 · · Score: 2

    Nonsense! Forklifts and flatbed trucks with 'Oversized Load' banners exist for a reason!

    --
    I don't post AC. I like my -1, Flamebaits. Trump/Sheen 2012 on the Batshit Insane ticket!
  15. Re:Publisher's attitude is for you to bend over... by Patch86 · · Score: 2

    I use to have a pdf of the book but the BW charges from people downloading started to cost me money every monthjust to give it away.

    You could pop a torrent up to take the strain off your host. It's always nice to have one more legitimate, non-pirated torrent out in the wild.

  16. FYI by martin-boundary · · Score: 2

    French --> English
    librairie,libraire --> bookshop, bookseller
    bibliotheque --> library

  17. ebook pricing too high by Deb-fanboy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Barry: This is a critical point. There’s a huge data set proving that digital books are a price-sensitive market, and that maximum revenues are achieved at a price point between $.99 and $4.99. So the question is: why aren’t publishers pricing digital books to maximize digital profits? Joe: Because they're protecting their paper sales. Barry: Exactly. Joe: It's awfully dangerous for an industry to ignore (or even blatantly antagonize) their customers in order to protect self-interest.

    This is one thing that puts me off buying ebooks. At the moment they are overpriced.

    Another problem is that they come with DRM, and running a free operating system I cannot read them and have to resort to other methods to obtain a free copy. I would much rather purchase a reasonably priced ebook with no DRM so that some money goes to the author.

    We are left with the same untenable situation with ebooks as there was with the music industry, that is that you get a better ebook for free which is flexible and can be read on any ereader than you get by purchasing for £12 from an official ebook retailer.

  18. Re:Never heard of him. by Ihmhi · · Score: 2

    Heh, I remember visiting a friend who had a pool... we'd take his Gameboy (The old school ones the size of a VHS tape), wrap it in 2 or 3 zip-lock bags, and take turns playing it underwater. Because frankly, why the hell not?

    --
    Random Thoughts From A Diseased Mind (Not For Dummies)
  19. Re:Never heard of him. by Fallingwater · · Score: 2

    But I'll tell you why I am not inclined towards E-books. I like to read in the tub.

    Put the reader in a ziploc bag and use your preferred method for sealing it. Won't be completely waterproof unless you seal the bag with an electric bag sealer (and then you have to rip it open to get the reader back; on the other hand, sealing it with air inside will make sure it floats), but it'll stand casual splashing and probably even short immersion, at least for the time necessary for you to go "OH FUCK" and fish it out. :P

  20. Re:Publisher's attitude is for you to bend over... by anUnhandledException · · Score: 2

    Yup. Perfect legitimate use of bittorrent.

    Hell I would keep it seeded in perpetuity.

  21. Re:Publisher's attitude is for you to bend over... by Jiro · · Score: 2

    Because we all love it when we are prohibited from copying a book because we don't like illegal immigration.

    Not to mention that copyright violation is something handled in a court. When you say that I can copy it if I try to be a better person (etc.), what you are really saying is that if I am in a court accused of copyright violation, and I prove to the judge and jury that I have tried to be a better person (etc.) I am free. Can you see why I might not want to have to prove such a thing in a court, under penalty of paying $100000 if the jury thinks I am not a good person? Because that's what you're requiring, whether you're aware of it or not.

    There's also the problem that this license only affects people with a conscience. Someone who is really evil is going to copy the book, but someone who is basically good but can't meet your requirement will feel themselves restricted. You are stopping exactly the people you don't want to stop.

    I am aware that this is not an open source license anyway, but there's a reason that open source licenses have "no discrimination against fields of endeavor" in them.

  22. Re:Reminds me of the Careware Licence by Jiro · · Score: 2

    Again: saying "you have a license to use this if you stop whining about your life", what this really means is "if you are sued in court, you may be forced to pay huge amounts of damages if you cannot prove to a judge and jury that you have stopped whining about your life". This is an utterly stupid thing to want decided by a judge and jury, but by putting it in the license, that's exactly what you're saying.

    It's also seriously intrusive. Do we really want to have to pass a stream of personality tests in order to use our computers?