Slashdot Mirror


Android Phones More Prone To Hardware Problems

adeelarshad82 writes "A nearly year-long study conducted by WDS on 600,000 support calls has found that Android phones are more susceptible to hardware faults than other types of devices. '14 percent of all technical support calls for Android devices could be traced to a hardware fault, versus 3.7 percent for RIM BlackBerry, 8 percent for iPhones and 9 percent for Windows Phone 7 devices.' WDS attributed the gap in hardware faults to the disparity in OEMs that manufacture Android devices."

220 comments

  1. moving parts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    what's the ratio of those that have slide out or fold open keyboards?

    1. Re:moving parts by Shitfucker · · Score: 2

      Not exactly. It's more like saying Windows PCs are more prone to hardware problems than Macs. With the iPhone and Blackberries, you have devices from one manufacturer with a relatively high standard of quality control. Windows Phone isn't so rigid, but still, the companies currently manufacturing Windows Phone devices are on the relatively high-end.

      With Android, pretty much any schmuck can sell a cheap tablet with a resistive touch screen running the OS - you only need Google's approval to ship with the market and their proprietary apps preinstalled. I didn't catch in the article whether this study only included Android handset manufacturers like Motorola and Samsung, or if it also included manufacturers like, say, Augen. It would make more sense to compare Google-approved devices to Windows Phone 7 handsets, or HTC phones to the iPhone, for example.

    2. Re:moving parts by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 1

      In the UK, afaik, there is one. The rest are iphone clones.

    3. Re:moving parts by scot4875 · · Score: 1

      The only way this report would be useful is if it included problem rates broken down by each manufacturer and model. As it is, it's really only useful to people who want to point out how awful Android is.

      --Jeremy

      --
      Jesus was a liberal
    4. Re:moving parts by node+3 · · Score: 0

      "Android is outselling the iPhone! We count every one, because openness is what makes Android great!" ...

      "Android has more support issues? Well, we really shouldn't be including the crap ones..."

    5. Re:moving parts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Comparing Android marketshare to iOS marketshare is different from comparing the build quality of every device that runs Android to a single device that runs iOS. The two comparisons are not equally valid.

    6. Re:moving parts by node+3 · · Score: 1, Interesting

      They most certainly *are* equally valid. What logic is there to claim all units when making claims about Android, then later ignoring a portion of them?

      Or in reverse, if we are only to compare the *quality* Android handsets to iPhones, then how does that compare with the *quality* iPhone handsets? Or if we are to just compare individual handsets or hardware companies, again, how does the iPhone compare?

      Oh, but in those cases, the iPhone tends to stomp all over Android! Well, we can't have that!

      When you want to talk about Android in the aggregate, you gotta take the good with the bad. If you want to claim that Android being more open is a good thing, you can't simply ignore the bad things that being more open brings with it.

    7. Re:moving parts by WillKemp · · Score: 1

      They most certainly *are* equally valid. What logic is there to claim all units when making claims about Android, then later ignoring a portion of them?

      Android is an operating system, not a make of phone hardware. Lots of manufacturers make phones that run Android. Some of them make good hardware some don't, but it's got nothing to do with the operating system.

    8. Re:moving parts by node+3 · · Score: 0

      What OS do you use without hardware? How can one talk about market share without involving hardware?

      It's absurd to talk about an OS without talking about the hardware. We aren't discussing abstract differences, but actual differences. If one of the advantages of Android is supposed to be that anyone can make an Android device, you can't just ignore it when a portion of those devices are shit.

    9. Re:moving parts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What logic is there to claim all units when making claims about Android, then later ignoring a portion of them?

      Who's ignoring what? I'm not about to deny that there are a lot of shitty Android devices handsets there. OS marketshare and build quality are two completely different things. They aren't comparable in the same ways.

    10. Re:moving parts by node+3 · · Score: 1

      Who's ignoring what?

      From the original post I was replying to:

      It would make more sense to compare Google-approved devices to Windows Phone 7 handsets, or HTC phones to the iPhone, for example.

      Sounds a lot like, "we should ignore non-Google-approved devices here". Do you have a different interpretation?

    11. Re:moving parts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you have a different interpretation?

      Yeah - "we should try to draw comparisons that make sense," like comparing devices made by one manufacturer to devices made by another manufacturer, or comparing devices approved by one entity to devices approved by another entity.

    12. Re:moving parts by node+3 · · Score: 1

      comparing devices approved by one entity to devices approved by another entity.

      Uh... in what way does that not involve ignoring a segment of Android phones?

      That's not a "different interpretation", it's just saying the exact same thing, but using different words (specifically, *not* using the word "ignore").

    13. Re:moving parts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Now you're just being semantic. You're always going to be "ignoring" -some- things, unless you're going to compare every tangible object in existence.

    14. Re:moving parts by node+3 · · Score: 0

      Now you're just being semantic. You're always going to be "ignoring" -some- things, unless you're going to compare every tangible object in existence.

      Um... What you've just done is been semantic. I'm not talking about something stupid like "including every object in existence". I'm talking about including every Android device that is included in market share numbers. It sounds quite reasonable.

      And don't forget, *you* brought up the question:

      Who's ignoring what?

      I answered it. You and the OP are trying to ignore crap Android phones. It's rather a bit "have your cake and eat it too", don't you think? If they're good enough to count for one comparison, it's only fair to count them in another. Otherwise you're just cherry picking data to best fit your desired outcome.

    15. Re:moving parts by SnowZero · · Score: 1

      "Android is outselling the iPhone! We count every one, because openness is what makes Android great!" ...

      Market share is important simply to make a viable platform to ensure app development. It's not really important beyond that. Interestingly, Apple was the one originally crowing about the size of their market and app count. I've noticed they don't bother to bring up app count anymore. The news is that Apple's chosen metrics of the past aren't so much in their favor anymore.

      Of course from a practical standpoint it is meaningless. Having 45 Twitter apps or 10 doesn't make much of a difference to anyone, except some marginal quality improvement from being able to choose from more options (making the big assumption that ratings are accurate).

      "Android has more support issues? Well, we really shouldn't be including the crap ones..."

      No we should include them all, but report the average by what folks actually buy, which is individual models or at least at the individual manufacturer level. The mistake is not that they are included in the study, but that they are included in the same average.

      Should we predict the reliability of Apple phones by averaging across all "proprietary OS" phones and reporting that number. When determining the historical reliability of Mac desktop machines, should we include cheap clones in the same average as Apple hardware?

  2. Of course - its by design! by GooberToo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Android runs on the full gambit of available phone devices. That means on the low end, crappy hardware is there by design. Crappy hardware, by design, driven by cost considerations, are going to have less reliable hardware and less QA.

    Basically the story says, "Shit happens. Sometimes free market economics create products which are far from ideal." Is anyone really surprised. Next story. I mean, that's really all that needs to be said. Duh.

    1. Re:Of course - its by design! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Android runs on the full gambit of available phone devices. That means on the low end, crappy hardware is there by design. Crappy hardware, by design, driven by cost considerations, are going to have less reliable hardware and less QA.

      Basically the story says, "Shit happens. Sometimes free market economics create products which are far from ideal." Is anyone really surprised. Next story. I mean, that's really all that needs to be said. Duh.

      It's quite obvious that's the case. Why is it a story, then? Because iPhone 5 rumors have probably dropped off sales of the iPhone 4, and they don't want the impatient to even consider Android and not wind up perpetuating the cultists.

    2. Re:Of course - its by design! by Joce640k · · Score: 0

      Was this study paid for by Apple...??

      --
      No sig today...
    3. Re:Of course - its by design! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Android runs on the full gambit of available phone devices.

      I hate to do this, but please, use the phrase correctly. The word in bold should be "gamut", as in "the full gamut".

      Examples

      (What is a partial gambit? You offer your bishop but your opponent hasn't captured it yet?)

    4. Re:Of course - its by design! by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I suspect that it may be slightly more than low end, crappy hardware:

      Some(by no means all, sadly) of the cheap dumbphones are both cheap and nigh-immortal, because nobody gives a damn what CPU they are using or how many UberMarks they get on some benchmarking suit that wouldn't fit in the onboard storage anyway. This means that, while they certainly don't use fancy parts, they are polished and solid designs.

      The Android low end is extra unfortunate because it suffers from cheapskate-itis and much of the hardware gets churned and replaced by a different design all the time.

    5. Re:Of course - its by design! by CapuchinSeven · · Score: 1

      Why, whenever something less than favourable is mentioned about Android here, do we always get cries of "nothing to see, move on!" and "omg Apple r paid for this!".

    6. Re:Of course - its by design! by dzfoo · · Score: 1

      The "full gambit"? I guess Android does require a sacrifice in order to gain an advantage.

              -dZ.

      --
      Carol vs. Ghost
      ...Can you save Christmas?
    7. Re:Of course - its by design! by dswskinner · · Score: 2

      A study paid for by Apple that puts RIM in a much better light? that must be Apple innovating again.

    8. Re:Of course - its by design! by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      Perhaps in this instance because who is WDF and of course how do you blame software for "keypad/button failures and microphone and battery issues". In this case "Windows Phone 7, meanwhile, will benefit". So in all, a silly little story based on a silly little study, all paid for by some silly little M$ marketing executive.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    9. Re:Of course - its by design! by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      Are you really that insecure about your "own" platform that you think anything that that is less than glowing praise is perceived as a paid-for trashing by shills working for "the man"? In this case, Apple (and again, on slashdot, nothing they ever do is plain and simple, it's all part of some grand illuminati-style plot to steal your freedoms and enslave the masses while simultaneously destroying open source).

      The paranoid conspiracy stuff is just tiresome. It's quite obvious, and stated in the summary even, that this sort of issue is purely a result of the way the Android ecosystem is deigned - it runs on all manner of commodity hardware from high end awesome stuff right down to crappy 'EZ Break' models.

    10. Re:Of course - its by design! by Wovel · · Score: 1

      So you agree that Android's platform Marketshare is meaningless.

    11. Re:Of course - its by design! by Calos · · Score: 1

      Umm... why? Why is Android being available on a range of pricepoints and hardware a mitigating factor in its marketshare? It seems like you're trying to say that only phone of a certain price/quality should qualify for marketshare. Which is nonsense.

      I think what you're trying to say is that marketshare isn't by itself a fair representation of the market - that other makes (Apple) don't try to compete for the low-end, so the low-end inflates Android numbers? It's fine to say that, but marketshare is marketshare. And even if competitors do fair well against that segment of Android phones they compete against, the Android marketshare is still an advantage to the whole Android ecosystem.

      --
      I vote based on politicians' actions, unless contrary to my preconceptions. Often wrong, never uncertain. #iamthe99%
    12. Re:Of course - its by design! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For a majority of the population, closed platforms are simply better and more genuine to them as a consumer. Whenever I complain about the bugs and issues and the BS that is android, I get the standard Windows PC kinds of questions in return. What phone do you have, what version of this do you have, what is your carrier, where do you live, what is your weather like there, how much did you pay for it, how much is your data plan, did your dog eat your phone, why would you want a working phone, aren't you a fucking idiot for doing X in reply to question Y, my custom ROM doesn't have those issues, sucks to be you?

      Compare that to a blackberry or iPhone or even a WP7 phone on nokia, and the questions are like what model phone do you have? Oh, thats a known issue or here's a workaround or that will be updated in the next release.

      I would assume that in another 3 years or so the android platform will almost be on par with the others with the extra complexity of what it is, but when compared to other computer devices like my computers, my cable box, my wireless router, etc. These are mature products that are on mostly a closed platform (yes, even my linksys linux router). Android phones are still the wild west.

    13. Re:Of course - its by design! by JasterBobaMereel · · Score: 1

      HTC - Makes Android and WinPhones on basically the same hardware ... I suspect that the failure rate is comparable

      iPhone is one manufacturer - Apple - they do not differentiate between hardware and software errors

      Blackberry - again one manufacturer who does not differentiate

      Who exactly are they getting these figures?

      --
      Puteulanus fenestra mortis
    14. Re:Of course - its by design! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Android runs on the full gambit of available phone devices. That means on the low end, crappy hardware is there by design. Crappy hardware, by design, driven by cost considerations, are going to have less reliable hardware and less QA.

      Basically the story says, "Shit happens. Sometimes free market economics create products which are far from ideal." Is anyone really surprised. Next story. I mean, that's really all that needs to be said. Duh.

      Yes, and it was already said in the summary and the article. Your point?

    15. Re:Of course - its by design! by peppepz · · Score: 1

      The point is that the article has no point at all.

    16. Re:Of course - its by design! by GooberToo · · Score: 1

      Not all hardware is used across all OSs. Many hardware packages are only available, for example, on Windows or Android, exclusively. Furthermore, look at some of the low end devices from Motorola. Some of them have been real stinkers. IIRC, HTC made a odd here and there too. And, there are lots of other players. In Asia, there are players you've likely never heard of. Quality is typically absolutely shitty and I wouldn't be surprised if those numbers were tossed in to dramatically bulk up shits rates for Android.

      This really smells like either fanboy marketing posing as journalism or an Apple smear campaign getting primed for their latest iPhone entry. Either way, the fact there is more than a couple of posts to this article submission is pretty pathetic.

    17. Re:Of course - its by design! by mldi · · Score: 1

      HTC - Makes Android and WinPhones on basically the same hardware ... I suspect that the failure rate is comparable

      iPhone is one manufacturer - Apple - they do not differentiate between hardware and software errors

      Blackberry - again one manufacturer who does not differentiate

      Who exactly are they getting these figures?

      Yep, and those numbers are fine and dandy and all, but completely meaningless unless you're reporting on each manufacturer, not the OS that runs on them. It's like saying Milk is less healthy than Soda because more people out there are lactose intolerant.

      --
      If you aren't suspicious of your government's actions, you aren't doing your job as a responsible citizen.
    18. Re:Of course - its by design! by node+3 · · Score: 1

      Just to be clear, because you tried to hide it in a lot of hand-waving:

      Android phones are more prone to failure than other phones like iPhones and BlackBerries.

      I especially like how you tried to make this out to be a good (or at least, deliberate) thing! And you blame this on the "free market". Yes, the exact same "free market" that brings you iPhones and BlackBerries, which fared better.

      I mean, really! Apple and RIM are both free to make shitty hardware, but they choose not to. That's "by design" too, and it seems like a better thing to design for.

    19. Re:Of course - its by design! by node+3 · · Score: 1

      Umm... why?

      Umm... so, market share only counts when it's in Android's favor, got it.

      FYI: iOS has outsold Android approximately 2:1. And it would seem that Android has a greater proportion of crappy hardware. Android saw declining market share last quarter.

      Android doesn't have to "win" to be a good system. It's a *very* good nerd OS, and is also a nice alternative to iOS for consumers. Why are nerds so insecure about their computing choices (while simultaneously being so arrogant about them)? iOS is much better suited for the average consumer. Android is much better suited for the tinker-nerd. That's why, for example, the iPad (and iPod touch) totally dominate Android in their respective areas.

      Not many people actually want *Android* itself. But for those that do, it's good that it exists.

    20. Re:Of course - its by design! by tyrione · · Score: 1

      I always prefer the use of spectrum even over the use of gamut. Less confusion.

    21. Re:Of course - its by design! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Even more important: The article says:

      14 percent of all Android support calls!

      This is not a absolute number, and so says absolutely nothing about the amount of hardware problems!
      All is says, is how the ratio is.

      So it could just as well mean, that Android is a more stable OS, and hence has less support problems, relative to the number of hardware problems.

      Conclusion: Whoever wrote this is either so retarded, he thinks 11 is "one more", or it's a marketing (aka. bullshit) thing. Which wouldn't be surprising, considering the fact that Android overruns everything right now, and that "everything" (aka. Apple, MSNokia, RIM) shits its pants over it. ;)

    22. Re:Of course - its by design! by CheerfulMacFanboy · · Score: 1

      Because iPhone 5 rumors have probably dropped off sales of the iPhone 4, and they don't want the impatient to even consider Android and not wind up perpetuating the cultists.

      Ohh, didn't read the news yet? Verizon iPhone Caused Android Market Share Drop and Roughly One in 10 Smartphones on T-Mobile USA Is an iPhone (~1 million)

      --
      Fandroids hate facts.
    23. Re:Of course - its by design! by macs4all · · Score: 1

      Was this study paid for by Apple...??

      Considering that it showed that Windows Mobile and iPhone are essentially tied, and that BlackBerry has a failure rate that is less than half of the iPhone, I'd venture a guess and say "Are you fucking nuts?"

    24. Re:Of course - its by design! by macs4all · · Score: 1

      This really smells like either fanboy marketing posing as journalism or an Apple smear campaign getting primed for their latest iPhone entry. Either way, the fact there is more than a couple of posts to this article submission is pretty pathetic.

      Of course this is fanboy marketing and/or an Apple smear campaign. That's why it shows Apple and Windows neck and neck, and BlackBerry with a failure rate less than HALF of the iPhone's.

      Reading is FUNdamental. Try it some time.

    25. Re:Of course - its by design! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      iOS has outsold Android approximately 2:1.

      FWIW that stat includes all devices ever sold, including the original iPod Touch. How relevant do you think that is now? It's funny that you complain about bad stats and then use that is quite absurd.

      Of course, cumulative sold was the new one that Jobs brought up in his latest presentation No more talking about relative number of sold each year, or app count -- no *now* it's about cumulative sold! Why not the number of devices that download an update in a given year?-- funny they wouldn't give this more accurate stat, which they clearly can measure.

      But, Steve said cumulative-ever-sold was ok so that's the stat you use and defend.

      In reality, all that matters is that the market for a device is big enough to support continued investment. But you get truly offended when some Android fanboy quotes market numbers, but that's only because you are a fanboy yourself.

  3. Commodity phones by vawwyakr · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Android is used on the cheapest smart phones so they use the cheapest parts....to you know...make them cheap.

    1. Re:Commodity phones by x6060 · · Score: 1

      Android is used on the whole spectrum of cheap to very nice phones. All this says is that Android runs on good and crappy phones alike.

    2. Re:Commodity phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And that crappy phones break, as if that was something new.

    3. Re:Commodity phones by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      ...it's a shame that this information is not broken down in a more detailed fashion as to actually be useful to those of us that might buy a device.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    4. Re:Commodity phones by fermion · · Score: 1
      There are some android phones that are going to be designed to meet a price point rather than maximum quality. Like MS computers by mass market manufacturers like Dell, customers are going to tolerate a lack of high quality due to the low price. This is also a winning deal for the manufacturers as tech support is no longer hugely expensive.

      What is going to be interesting to see is if the MS Windows Mobile phones continue to be more reliable than Android phones if and when the MS Windows phones begin to sell and quantity and expand to bottom line mass market manufactures.

      --
      "She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
    5. Re:Commodity phones by lennier1 · · Score: 1

      Just seems like they didn't even include Archos devices or the numbers would've turned out a lot worse.

    6. Re:Commodity phones by dswskinner · · Score: 1

      Broken down by manufacturer would have been better.

    7. Re:Commodity phones by Americano · · Score: 0

      There are some android phones that are going to be designed to meet a price point rather than maximum quality.

      By which you mean "ALL PHONES are designed to meet a price point rather than maximum quality," right?

      The *maximum* price point is a carrier-subsidized $199/299 or $649/749 unlocked in the US. No phone that costs significantly more than the iPhone is going to sell in any numbers, especially now that AT&T and Verizon both sell the iPhone.

      Reliability certainly enters into the purchasing decisions, though. A phone is something you carry around with you all day, every day, and at least for me, I need the thing to work, not randomly crap out on me when I'm in a conference call with clients. If I'm a corporate purchaser evaluating iPhone and some Android model, and find that I'm looking at a possible Android issue rate that's nearly 2x the issue rate of an iPhone, and the phones cost the same... guess which phone I'll add to my "corporate-approved device list?"

    8. Re:Commodity phones by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      Well, if you can lump all the android devices together to claim dominance over iPhone marketshare, as is commonly done on here, that includes all the crappy Android handsets as well as the really good ones, then it seems fair to lump them all together when looking at bulk failure rate. You have to take the rough with the smooth.

      How about we break down the handsets that are comparable to the iPhone and look at just their marketshare and just their failure rates? I suspect it would be broadly similar on hardware failure (9% ish, just like the iPhone), but no idea on marketshare. I know there are several out there - I've used a couple of them before.

    9. Re:Commodity phones by tycoex · · Score: 1

      I'm sure if they just did a comparison with equally priced phones the failure rates would be nearly identical.

      The answer to your question? That depends on if you look at a study like this and make incorrect inferences from it or not, which says more about you than the phones.

    10. Re:Commodity phones by Americano · · Score: 1

      An entirely substantiated conclusion from this data is that "Android phones vary pretty widely in quality and reliability, and there's no way of knowing whether a model is good or bad until after you've bought it." Corporate purchasers are not widely known for their risk-taking behaviors.

      Why do you think Google has been slowly ratcheting up the controls and requirements for Android device makers? Because they realized that allowing a crapflood of cheap & shitty devices would tarnish the Android brand, and give it a reputation for unpredictable, uneven experiences - which will cause people to migrate away from Android as they get tired of never knowing what to expect. My parents still refuse to even consider purchasing a vehicle made by Ford, due to a bad experience with a Ford (and the dealership they bought it from) they owned in the mid-80's. Rational? No. But humans so rarely are.

      It doesn't matter if Samsung makes really great Android phones, if every other device maker is out there giving Android a bad name by making shit devices. You know that saying, "You only get one chance to make a first impression?" Yeah. That.

    11. Re:Commodity phones by Calos · · Score: 1

      No. There's no logic in your statement

      >>Well, if you can lump all the android devices together to claim dominance over iPhone marketshare, as is commonly done on here, that includes all the crappy Android handsets as well as the really good ones, then it seems fair to lump them all together when looking at bulk failure rate. You have to take the rough with the smooth.

      If we're talking about the smartphone market, marketshare is marketshare. Others (e.g. Apple) may not compete for the low-end, but that doesn't matter - for marketshare. I think it should be blindingly obvious to everyone why the marketshare is as it is, and you can draw your own conclusion from that. However, Android does benefit from its larger installed userbase.

      On the other hand, applying these statistics to all Android phones is misleading and an abuse of statistics and probability. You can't take an aggregate statistic of a heterogeneous sample and apply it to a single datapoint. Saying a given, specific Android phone is more likely to fail than an Apple phone is an unfounded conclusion, based on the numbers we have here. It's applying an aggregate statistic to a specific embodiment. It's like saying that because 70% of school children fail a specific test on average, if you select a single child at random, that child's chances of failing are 70%. That's not true; what is true, is that you have a 70% chance of selecting a child who will fail. Each child, however, based on their own merits, have there own probabilities of failing.

      Applying it to the topic of interest - this principle just gives us back what we already knew. There's a large population of cheap Android phones which are more likely to fail. If pooled, and you selected one at random, odds are it would be a phone that is more likely to fail early than a competitor - because it's more likely to be a low-end phone. But we don't select phones at random. You get to *choose* your phone. And an informed buyer (or just a buyer who has the common sense that a sub-$100 smartphone probably isn't as high quality as a $300 phone) can easily have much better odds at failure.

      What are those odds? We don't know, due to this absurd study. But we can make a reasonable assumption that the odds are better than what are stated here, because the low-end phones - which there are a lot of, skewing the results - have higher failure rates. Knowing that, it's not unreasonable to assume that failure rates of quality Android phones are comparable to other smartphone makers (making phones at similar price points/quality).

      I'm sorry that you feel this is a personal fight, and that you get to make up silly rules to try to make things seem fair. You should try letting reason and logic guide you, not misplaced trust and personal identity in your consumer electronics.

      --
      I vote based on politicians' actions, unless contrary to my preconceptions. Often wrong, never uncertain. #iamthe99%
    12. Re:Commodity phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Comparing Android marketshare to iOS marketshare is different from comparing the build quality of every device that runs Android to a single device that runs iOS. Both comparisons are not equally valid.

    13. Re:Commodity phones by tycoex · · Score: 1

      It's pretty easy to know if a model is good or bad before you buy it. There are hundreds of reviews you can look at to tell you that. And even if this hypothetical CEO is so busy that he can't google for a single review, price is a pretty good indicator of whether a phone is good or not. 90+ percent of the time, a phone that costs $200+ is going to be good hardware quality.

      I understand that not everyone is knowledgeable about technology, but can you really blame Android if an ignorant person can't tell the difference between an operating system and the hardware it's running on? Sure some people will blame Windows when their HP laptop shipped with faulty RAM, but that doesn't seem like it has really hurt Microsoft much.

      And besides that, I thought this was a "news for nerds site." Not "news for business majors."

    14. Re:Commodity phones by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      No, its not, it illustrates a point, and provides you information that you should be able to recognize.

      Buyer beware when buying android based devices because some of them are most certainly in the race to those bottom of the barrel.

      You're probably safer (probably) when buying a RIM, Apple or Win7Mo device as on average they seem to work better.

      What you are seeing is Android becoming like the previous major phone OSes. Its like buying a phone with Symbian on it ... sure its got Symbian, but that doesn't mean jack shit because a full spectrum of hardware runs Symbian, and its all been customized and tweaked in such ways that calling it compatible is a lie. So I have an old nokia dumb phone that runs symbian ... can't run anything else on it than what it came with, but by god its a Symbian phone! Replace all occurrence of Symbian with Android and you'll have the same thing, except it costs less to get your hands on SOME of the source to your phone, in most cases you won't be able to get all of it with either OS.

      Saying 'it runs android' means nothing, as that doesn't specify anything else about what it allows or disallows, what kind of hardware it is, or what you can expect from it.

      On the otherhand, I know what I'm going to get from a RIM or Apple device, and I can make some safe assumptions about Win7Mo due to its resource requirements at baseline (which is still a shitty device, don't get me wrong). You simply can't make assumptions when someone says Android.

      You'll be happy to claim android is more popular than other device OSes because you group all android devices together to show marketshare ... but you don't want to do that when it comes to the shitty parts eh? Fanboy much?

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    15. Re:Commodity phones by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      I'm not "making up silly rules", I'm simply using the same metric that Android users use when talking out how "their" (for those making it personal) mobile OS is winning, and when you point out exactly what you just stated above, you are dismissed as a trolling Apple fanboi who is butthurt that his "toy" smartphone is being outsold by Android. I'm not the one who makes these rules, I just got fed up of fending off Android evangelists who rush out in force at any perceived criticism of the platform and believe everything is some secret conspiracy by Apple to crush open source and enslave everyone - it only took until about post 2 thins time before someone assumed Apple paid for this study.

      If Android gets to be a heterogeneous population when it makes it look "good" - ie, to prove it is 'superior ' to Apple's iPhone (when it's erroneous for exactly the reasons you state - not all of the Android handsets are the good ones that are true iPhone competitors), then they have to reap what they sow when the negative is brought up.

      Aside from all that, the study itself is flawed, since they don't know the total number of support calls or numbers of handsets shipped to be able to draw effective percentages, so they are pretty meaningless across the board.

    16. Re:Commodity phones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The difference is that comparing the marketshare of one OS to another is a cut-and-dry, apples-to-apples comparison. This is more like lumping together a bunch of different fruits that were picked from trees in different areas during different months and comparing that to a single, fresh apple. It isn't inconsistency - one comparison makes sense, the other doesn't.

    17. Re:Commodity phones by macs4all · · Score: 1

      On the other hand, applying these statistics to all Android phones is misleading and an abuse of statistics and probability. You can't take an aggregate statistic of a heterogeneous sample and apply it to a single datapoint.

      Here is why it is a fair comparison:

      When Android fanbois want to crow about how the sale of Android devices outpaces the sale of say, iOS devices, no allowance is made for the "EZ-Break" cheap-ass Android phones that were sold, but now lie broken in someone's drawer or in a landfill, and then were replaced with another Android phone (further artificially inflating the "marketshare"-thru-sales-numbers statistics). Do iPhones fail? Sure; but obviously not at the same rate as the Android phones. And it doesn't take much of a difference in original failure rate to create a seemingly significant "bump" in sales figures.

      So, that is why it is fair to lump all the Android sales together. Because all of those sales are considered by the Android fanbois to be currently active units, and this high failure rate adjusts that total downward in a statistically correct manner.

  4. So what? by Dyinobal · · Score: 0

    So what? Android is a software platform installed on tons of different kinds of hardware. So it's got more hardware issues? well how odd it's installed on more and more widely varied forms of hardware than any other mobile OS.

    1. Re:So what? by toriver · · Score: 1

      Bad experiences with crappy hardware running Android will tarnish the Android name in the consumer's mind.

      That what.

    2. Re:So what? by dzfoo · · Score: 1

      What "Android name in the consumer's mind"?

      People see TV commercials, posters, and other material promoting marks and models of handsets, such as Droid, EVO, Galaxy, etc., not Android.

      The same is true for the competition: consumers purchase iPhones and iPods, not "iOS devices."

                -dZ.

      --
      Carol vs. Ghost
      ...Can you save Christmas?
    3. Re:So what? by _Sprocket_ · · Score: 1

      Bad experiences with crappy hardware running Android will tarnish the Android name in the consumer's mind.

      Only if consumers are buying an Android phone. The advertising I see usually pushes the carrier or the manufacturer. Android is a bullet statement. For example, driving in to work I heard an Ad for Cricket offering the Ascend phone "powered by Android" (manufactured by Chinese company Huawei - I suspect this is right in line with the subject at hand). Which leads me to wonder what name will come to mind if the consumer looks at their device and decides it's a crappy phone. Will they blame Cricket, Huawei (which doesn't even get air time - maybe consumers will identify it simply as the Ascend), or Android?

    4. Re:So what? by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

      Yes but in those same commercials there is always a tagline like "powered by Android" or "runs on Android". Even if the consumer has no real idea what Android is, they may associate it with the phone.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  5. The other way to read this... by tdyer · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Is that 96.4% of all rim support calls are for the terrible software.

    1. Re:The other way to read this... by tdyer · · Score: 1

      In fact are these numbers normalized at all? How do we even know that we aren't comparing apples and bolts? I know a guy who got a new blackberry (model) every year, because Telus in Canada had a unpublished policy that if a phone dies for you 3 times they waive the etf/upgrade fee for the fourth phone. Like clockwork he would go through one every 3 months.

    2. Re:The other way to read this... by 228e2 · · Score: 1

      That alone would make me switch from a BB phone. I have a Tour, which has worked fine for me over the past 13 months, but if a phone needs to be replaced every 90 days, then that phone/(model?) is crap.

      --
      Since when does being a Socialist mean 'someone who has a different opinion than me'?
    3. Re:The other way to read this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It wouldn't actually break (at least on its own) every 90 days. The OP's friend was gaming the system to get a free phone upgrade every year.

    4. Re:The other way to read this... by geminidomino · · Score: 1

      That's actually what I was thinking, too. Of course, I'm pretty much programmed to look at any presented statistics as cynically as possible.

      "So what you're saying could be that Android phones have better software, requiring fewer support calls so that legitimate hardware problems make up a larger percentage?"

      NB: Not an Android fanboy. Not even really an Android fan with all the scumware-friendliness and recent CM's submission to it re: private data spoofing.

    5. Re:The other way to read this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, the spin on this article is so blatant it might be a good candidate article to trace the machinations of media payola PR operations, for those interested in such stuff.

    6. Re:The other way to read this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is that 96.4% of all rim support calls are for the terrible software.

      Are you sure you have mastered logic?

    7. Re:The other way to read this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Exactly.

      Study: Android Phones Less Prone to Software Problems

      The study, conducted by WDS, found that 86 percent of all technical support calls for Android devices could be traced to a software fault, versus 96.3 percent for RIM BlackBerry, 92 percent for iPhones and 91 percent for Windows Phone 7 devices.

      Without overall call numbers, and call numbers normalized by the numbers of active phones in each category, this is meaningless.

    8. Re:The other way to read this... by Lumbre · · Score: 1

      What I haven't seen someone point out is that the average Android user is more technologically advanced than the average iPhone or Windows Phone user. Therefore, percentagewise, as given in the article, there will be less people calling for simple software/computer illiterate tech support and more people calling for true failures/critical errors.

      Remember back in your tech support days where you got calls asking how to open up Office or how to get to the Internet or why your laptop won't turn on... oh wait that happens to me anyway just because I've got a job in 'computers'.

    9. Re:The other way to read this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      *like*

  6. Garbage headline by cabraverde · · Score: 5, Insightful

    WDS did not disclose how many support calls in general technicians fielded for each platform

    So without saying that android phones are more or less reliable in general, what they are really saying is:

    Android phones less prone to software problems.

    1. Re:Garbage headline by Woy · · Score: 1

      Precisely.

      --
      "If God created us in his own image we have more than reciprocated." - Voltaire
    2. Re:Garbage headline by nezcarotte · · Score: 1

      Android phones less prone to software problems.

      exactly, this is a good example were the real message is completely reverted by the title, what a shame

    3. Re:Garbage headline by Kamiza+Ikioi · · Score: 1

      Mod up Parent! If that's not insightful, hell if I know what is!

      --
      I8-D
    4. Re:Garbage headline by hey! · · Score: 3, Funny

      Mod up Parent! If that's not insightful, hell if I know what is!

      Not to disagree about GP post's insightfulness, but I am concerned about your difficulty in being able identifying insightful ideas without its aid. Let me toss a few out:

      • the laws of thermodyamics
      • the biggest homophobes are the people most insecure about their own sexuality
      • the origin of various species by the operation of natural selection upon random genetic variations
      • George Lucas should have quit making Star Wars movies after "Return of the Jedi". Maybe before.
      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    5. Re:Garbage headline by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wait, that's not true at all. If you read the press release, it's specifically talking about things that were related to hardware issues and has nothing to do with software issue statistics at all. It's not "if one, not the other."

      Your statement is like "I crashed my car. My car has a faulty tire. Therefore the crash must be caused by the tire, not the fact I was drunk." There are serious problems with your outlook on causality, correlation, and relation.

      All this study said is that 14% of calls were related to hardware problems; that does not mean that software was not also an issue.

    6. Re:Garbage headline by green1 · · Score: 1

      If one platform gets 1000 calls, 100 of which are hardware, this article would say 10% hardware calls, another platform gets 10000 calls 200 of which are hardware and it would say 2% hardware calls.
      while they are technically right, the later one would, assuming equal number of users, actually have worse hardware.

      Now I'm not saying that any one platform is better or worse than the other, or even that their conclusion is wrong, only that the article lacks enough information to actually back up what they are claiming. More useful information would be number of support calls equalized for user base, percentage hardware, percentage software, percentage instructional.. with those 4 numbers you could actually start to draw some reasonable conclusions about ease of use, and the quality of both the hardware and software.

    7. Re:Garbage headline by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      If by real message you mean, message spun like a politician was talking, than sure.

      Nobody takes incomplete or factually incorrect data and spins it into a good thing like a politician, so therefore I must assume that you and the GP post are also politicians since there is no logical way you would have come to such a conclusion without making things up along the way.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    8. Re:Garbage headline by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The article contains no useful information at all. I did a few Google searches and I couldn't even figure out who this "WDS" is. At least give me the full name of the company spouting this BS, so I know who to blame.

  7. Antenna by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Did they include antenna problems in their survey?

    1. Re:Antenna by intheshelter · · Score: 1

      They probably did and since the faux issue you are referring to was actually a NON issue it didn't make any impact in this data.

    2. Re:Antenna by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're right, it's a non-issue that the phone drops calls if you hold it normally.

    3. Re:Antenna by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Except that it doesn't.

    4. Re:Antenna by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      No, its an issue of course.

      The problem is ... that even if you held it incorrectly, it was STILL in the top 3 of reception quality and ability to not drop calls.

      Meaning that yes, it drops calls more often if you hold it like you normally would ... however ... it STILL DOES BETTER THAN THE COMPETITION on its baad days.

      So from a practical perspective ... if on the iPhone 4's shittiest of days, it STILL does better than most of the other phones in its class, which means its a non-issue from a practical perspective. So even if people report the bad reception quality when holding an iPhone 4 normally ... they STILL made less reports than pretty much everyone else.

      So ... if you want to talk issues, lets talk about all the phones that drop calls regardless of how you hold them ... go ahead, get some stats for whichever device you're fanboying it up that shows it doing better under any condition than the iPhone4 does under the worst conditions (i.e. holding the antenna in a way that shorts it).

      Don't worry, I'm not going to wait, I've seen the stats.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
  8. In other news by Chrisq · · Score: 4, Insightful

    14 percent of all technical support calls for Android devices could be traced to a hardware fault, versus 3.7 percent for RIM BlackBerry, 8 percent for iPhones and 9 percent for Windows Phone 7 devices.'

    In other news: '86% of all technical support calls for Android devices could be traced to a software issue, versus 96.3 percent for RIM BlackBerry, 92 percent for iPhones and 91 percent for Windows Phone 7 devices.'

    Shows how bad Android is doesn't it....

    1. Re:In other news by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 2

      Could it mean there were more "real" problems with Android vs. more "I'm a dumbass and can't RTFM" problems with other platforms?

    2. Re:In other news by rbrausse · · Score: 3, Informative

      the author explains his study a little bit in TFAcomments.

      the focus of the study was something like "how many support calls will end in an (expansive) hardware replacement".

    3. Re:In other news by Chrisq · · Score: 1

      True, and actually I wouldn't be surprised if a system that is run on budget hardware (as well as some quality phones) does have more hardware issues than the iPhone for example

    4. Re:In other news by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      the focus of the study was something like "how many support calls will end in an (expansive) hardware replacement".

      But it deliberately avoids telling you how many, it only tells you what percentage of support calls. If it was what percentage of sold units would be returned then that would be useful but what percentage of support calls (and I won't tell you how many support calls there are) relate to hardware is no use for anything.

    5. Re:In other news by rbrausse · · Score: 1

      sure, you're right - and imo the article shouldn't be posted on /. (stuff that matters, my ass)

      the thing on pcmag looks like a ripped-off press release - I never heard of WDS but I'm quite sure one can buy the complete study for whatever absurd piles of dollars. In a way this is nice metatrolling: the author auf the pcmag-piece *knows* that such an incomplete information base will lead to huge amounts of flaming - and he won, even slashdot is part of the crowd :)

    6. Re:In other news by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How many iPhone people call or go to their local Genius bar?

    7. Re:In other news by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      14 percent of all technical support calls for Android devices could be traced to a hardware fault, versus 3.7 percent for RIM BlackBerry, 8 percent for iPhones and 9 percent for Windows Phone 7 devices.'

      In other news: '86% of all technical support calls for Android devices could be traced to a software issue, versus 96.3 percent for RIM BlackBerry, 92 percent for iPhones and 91 percent for Windows Phone 7 devices.'

      Shows how bad Android is doesn't it....

      No, it shows that your math is nearly as bad as your logic.

    8. Re:In other news by ArsonSmith · · Score: 2

      I take it to mean that Android manufactures are more willing to replace a faulty phone than iPhone or rim. They are just better at convincing you that your phone is fine and working as expected, "just hold it different to get better reception"

      --
      Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
    9. Re:In other news by owlstead · · Score: 1

      Sheesh, I wouldn't put any Slashdot team in a spelling contest. Or are you suggesting that broken phones will be replaced by 12" pads?

  9. stats need another dimension by alta · · Score: 1

    Ok, look I'm an iphone user. Love it. Have the original and waiting to get the next one. But I'm not putting too much into this little survey.

    I need to see the manufacturer listed here before I believe this is any more than propoganda. If it turns out that each manuf. has about the same average fault rate, then ok, there's a problem. But if it turns out that HTC comes out to 2% and Moto is at 25% then I'd say that it's not the OS, but the manuf. that's the problem.

    And then going further, how does a manufacturer's android parts compare to their non android part. What if LG has a average fail of 15% on android smartphones but only 5% on dumbphones.

    Then what about those who make win7 and android phones? How does THAT compare? Samsung? HTC? LG?

    --
    Do not meddle in the affairs of sysadmins, for they are subtle, and quick to anger.
    1. Re:stats need another dimension by jmpeax · · Score: 2

      But if it turns out that HTC comes out to 2% and Moto is at 25% then I'd say that it's not the OS, but the manuf. that's the problem.

      How could it be the OS? This is about hardware faults, and in fact has nothing to do with Android.

    2. Re:stats need another dimension by alta · · Score: 1

      It wouldn't be the OS causing hardware failures. The article is implying that in all cases android phones have more hardware failures. WE know they are not caused by the OS, but the unwashed masses don't.

      --
      Do not meddle in the affairs of sysadmins, for they are subtle, and quick to anger.
    3. Re:stats need another dimension by Wovel · · Score: 1

      All Android stories should be done by model since the compatibility matrix is so complex. The problem is, then Android is not "winning". Considering Android as a single thing is almost always absurd, this story is not really any more absurd then lumping all these same varied devices with 3 different versions of the OS into one pile and calling it Market share.

    4. Re:stats need another dimension by nabsltd · · Score: 1

      How could it be the OS? This is about hardware faults, and in fact has nothing to do with Android.

      Because a "hardware fault" might be caused by the drivers in the OS.

      In other words, if one of the radios in the phone stops working, how can the tech know for sure if the hardware failed or the software is having problems talking to the hardware because the driver has a fault?

    5. Re:stats need another dimension by ArsonSmith · · Score: 1

      just more hardware failures per support call, no word on who has more support calls.

      --
      Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
    6. Re:stats need another dimension by biglig2 · · Score: 1

      I'm a rabid Apple fanboi and a temporary Android user - because I needed a cheap non-subsidised smartphone to buy me time between my 3GS dying and the 4s/5 coming out.

      Now, if you want a *cheap* first hand smartphone, then it's a straight choice, Symbian or Android, and Android wins, I'm afraid. (I've owned and loved many symbian smartphones but not any that Nokia made!)

      So, a quick trip to Argos and I have a ZTE Blade - the things are dirt cheap and effortless to root and install stock android on and the hardware is excellent.

      Let me emphasise that - the hardware is *excellent*. Not as fast as a high-end android device, or as fast as my 4S/5 will be, but way faster than I have any right to demand considering what it cost, and more than good enough. (Interestingly I spent some time with a Galaxy S a while back and I prefer the Blade to it - although that is probably because I put stock Android on the Blade. I do miss the Samsung's big bright screen, but not much else about it.)

      So it's not even as simple as there being cheap Android devices pulling te overall quality down - because you can make solid android phones at a low price - there are some sucky manufacturers out there.

      --
      ~~~~~ BigLig2? You mean there's another one of me?
  10. Misleading by jonescb · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Keep in mind that this is 14% of _support calls_. Using the same logic as the summary, you could say that Android phones have fewer software issues than other phones because only 86% of calls are related to software. That is assuming there isn't a third option in support calls.

    The article even states this, they don't have shipment numbers for devices so they don't have data for the phones that don't require support. Their sample is only phones that people are having problems with in the first place.

    1. Re:Misleading by vawwyakr · · Score: 1

      Excellent point, without a better metric including installed base, number of calls and then break down of call types then the numbers are ultimately meaningless.

    2. Re:Misleading by Inda · · Score: 1

      The missus had a problem with her HTC Wildfire. One of the apps was 'broken'. She made a support call, which was a complete waste of time because they fixed nothing.

      I googled the problem and found it was a network issue that solved itself (in our eyes) the following morning.

      Hardware? Software? Network?

      --
      This post contains benzene, nitrosamines, formaldehyde and hydrogen cyanide.
    3. Re:Misleading by jjetson · · Score: 1

      Except for the fact that support calls aren't just Hardware issues and Software issues.

    4. Re:Misleading by tyrione · · Score: 1

      Missus? Quick glance had me adding an e on the end for misuse instead of the actual `Misses' you were trying to convey, or more commonly convey as the Mrs.

  11. Hmm... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

    I would be curious to know if the numbers break down along any other useful lines:

    For instance, are all the phones(regardless of OS and smart/dumb status) manufactured by a given OEM comparable in reliability? How about all phones by company that designed them? or Smart vs. dumb devices? Are 'flagship' devices more or less reliable than random carrier-branded contract fodder?

    Unless android has some magical hardware-killing powers, it seems very unlikely that the OS itself has anything to do with it; but it is probably the case that Android will be the choice of any manufacturer playing the race-to-the-bottom price-sensitive-market volume sales game, and that is also where you would expect the most corners cut in terms of hardware. It would be interesting to try to break down, though, what factors exactly cut the hardware reliability.

    Do they go with the second-tier OEMs to save money, and suffer manufacturing issues? Does the culture of tech-specs one-upmanship lead to excessively short design cycles, and inadequate engineering on the designing company's part? Is unreliably spread fairly evenly, or does it disproportionately fall on devices attempting mechanically tricky stuff like slide-out keyboards and ignore the more conservative featureless-slab or embedded-keypad designs regardless of OS?

  12. wtf ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    windows phone 7 has been out for a year? huh?

    1. Re:wtf ? by SpaceGhost · · Score: 1

      Exactly. Compare to Win6/6.5 and you'd get lots of mediocre phones. I've had about equally poor results with 2 Win6 phones and my G1, oddly enough all made by HTC. So who funded this study?

  13. Nearly year long ? by Pop69 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I thought WP7 devices had only been available for about 6 months ?

    1. Re:Nearly year long ? by Missing.Matter · · Score: 1

      8 months now.

    2. Re:Nearly year long ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But the three people who actually bought one won't put much of a dent in this study.

  14. Blackberry is not hardware reliable. by Bearded+Frog · · Score: 1

    Really? I've had to replace my Blackberry Storm2 about 7 times now in the last year or so. And everyone I know who has a storm or a storm 2 has had about the same exact situation. The only durable blackberries seem to be the older curves. I would think the storm and the storm2 alone would make their number much higher.

    1. Re:Blackberry is not hardware reliable. by linuxwolf69 · · Score: 1

      My storm worked fine... Until I dropped it in the parking lot and it skidded across a puddle of water.... A little cleaning shouldn't have hurt it right???

      But seriously, I was generally happy with my storm, but it pales in comparison to my android phone.

    2. Re:Blackberry is not hardware reliable. by nabsltd · · Score: 1

      I'll see your anecdote and raise you a personal observation:

      My wife has had a Storm since the month they were released and has had no issues at all.

    3. Re:Blackberry is not hardware reliable. by Voyager529 · · Score: 1

      The Storm units sucked (everyone I know who bought one either hated it or has it stashed in a drawer with the rest of their defunct tech), but you could play tennis with a Curve 8330, walk away from the match, and continue making calls on it without thinking twice.

  15. Translation by Tx · · Score: 1

    "A nearly year-long study conducted by WDS on 600,000 support calls has found that some phones are more susceptible to hardware faults than other phones."

    FTFY. If you take the flamebait out of it, that's all it's saying. Android phones are manufactured by a large number of manufacturers, and some of them are a bit cheap and nasty.

    --
    Oh no... it's the future.
    1. Re:Translation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "A nearly year-long study conducted by WDS on 600,000 support calls has found that some phones are more susceptible to hardware faults than other phones."

      FTFY. If you take the flamebait out of it, that's all it's saying. Android phones are manufactured by a large number of manufacturers, and some of them are a bit cheap and nasty.

      yo mama is cheap and nasty. i fucked her. in the mouth. with my dick. because i was afraid of her beat up cooch. it was cheap and nasty. yo mama's a slut. huh huh.

  16. Windows Phone 7 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It stikes me that the real headline should relate to WP7
    If the 9% of total problems relate to WP7 which has very limited market penetration and has only been available for approx 6 months
    then there is indeed a quite serious problem with the WP7 software/hardware combo.

    MS should be worried. Very worried.

  17. Did someone fail statistics? by andymadigan · · Score: 5, Insightful

    TFA deson't make any sense. The ratio of technical support that ends up being hardware tells us nothing about the hardware fault rate. It could simply be that people are less likely to have other problems with the phone, or that the users are more technical on average and more likely to be able to solve a non-hardware problem on their own.

    For instance, let's say:

    Device A: 2 million sold, 1 million support calls, 100K hardware calls

    Device B: 4 million sold, 1 million support calls, 150K hardware calls

    Device A: "10%"
    Device B: "15%"

    But really, the failure rate for A would be 5% whereas the rate for B would be 3.75%.

    In short, the article's author is an idiot.

    --
    The right to protest the State is more sacred than the State.
    1. Re:Did someone fail statistics? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It could also be one or two devices bumping the average. You have one disaster device that sold good and it could really change things. Or even the other way around...

      Lies, damn lies, and statistics....

      But smooshing them all together makes for good headlines. And tables of failure rates is boring to look at.

      Take the xbox 360 had a failure rate of 30% that was one device. But put it in with wii's and ps3's and the total failure rate would be very different.

    2. Re:Did someone fail statistics? by tokul · · Score: 1

      In short, the article's author is an idiot.

      Lies, damn lies and statistics.

      Then you don't have to prove that author is idiot.

    3. Re:Did someone fail statistics? by nabsltd · · Score: 1

      But really, the failure rate for A would be 5% whereas the rate for B would be 3.75%. In short, the article's author is an idiot.

      Then, too, there's the people who just walk into the store with the broken hardware because they know it is broken ("it doesn't turn on"), so that also would skew the results. But, the biggest skew of all is the fact that only support calls were part of the survey.

      Having run a help desk, I can definitely say that the brighter people don't contact support until it is the last resort, while other people might call for every little thing that is different from their normal experience, except that they won't remember that their phone got a software update a few days before they called.

    4. Re:Did someone fail statistics? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This.

      Also, wouldn't hardware failures logically be more of a function of some combination the hardware manufacturer and cost of the hardware. Trying to correlate hardware failure with the operating system seems rather idiotic unless you're trying to imply that the operating system somehow *induces* hardware failures.

      IF there is an abnormally high hardware failure rate on phones that run the Android operating system (which is FAR from proven by this article for the reasons mentioned throughout) then would that be more of a problem for Motorola, HTC, Samsung, LG, etc. than for Android/Google?

      As a consumer, I'd be far more interested to see things like "X% of brand Y smartphones sold have a hardware issue in the first Z period of time". Preferably even broken down by model. THAT would be useful information if I were shopping for a phone.

  18. What is missing by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

    WDS did not disclose how many support calls in general technicians fielded for each platform.

    And let us read down a little more before I comment...

    "In this study we have not been able to measure PTC for two reasons," Deluca-Smith said via email. "We would require shipment volumes from all of the carriers/OEMs that were part of the 600,000 calls sampled. Many do not share this information with us. [Second,] We sample only calls we take at our contact centers (principally based in the U.S. and Europe); end-users may have visited their carrier's Web care to resolve an issue. In which case, there was still a problem â" but we didn't get to see it."

    Yes, but a) your numbers are already suspect because the customer could have gone to the carrier for any kind of problem, and b) you could have reported on what percentage of the devices under your direct control were of each type, and thus we would have at least some indication, but you neglected to share that information with us, suggesting at least to me (not implying, just suggesting) that perhaps the results would suggest that another platform had higher failure rates overall in spite of higher hardware failure rates for Android. Aside from wanting to damage Android directly, another reason to neglect such results would simply be to knowingly attempt to make the study look more conclusive than it actually is for financial gain, which seems to me to be a form of fraud.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  19. Interesting by Gideon+Wells · · Score: 1

    RIM relative low number impresses me at first glance.

    The iPhone and WP7 has me wondering if 7-9% is the standard, and I'll likely look to see if this is comparable for all cellphones.

    Android's relative high number reminds me why I ditched my android phone for an iPhone. It was an early one, Eris. Wasn't a bad phone for the time, but six months after I bought the thing it was having trouble keeping up at Android 2.1 for the stuff I wanted to do with my phone. I liked the OS, but found my initial choice of hardware... lacking. Rooting it and removing HTC Sense made 2.1 fun, but with 2.2... *sighs*

    I think it is also worth noting the two highest are more software on other people's hardware. RIM is hardware/software as is the iPhone.

    --
    by Anonymous Coward: I, for one, welcome the shift from car analogies to pizza analogies. um.. overlords?
    1. Re:Interesting by AJH16 · · Score: 1

      RIM I'm sure has a lot of software related support questions, that would probably be the reason for their low % of hardware based support calls.

      --
      AJ Henderson
    2. Re:Interesting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think it is also worth noting the two highest are more software on other people's hardware. RIM is hardware/software as is the iPhone.

      Are you suggesting that running software on a single platform is likely to mean a greater proportion of software support calls hence the result for RIM and iPhone? That sounds... unexpected.

  20. Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    So, if I produce a phone that has only 1 support call related to hardware and 1 related to software my hardware must be crappy, because I have 50% support calls due to hardware issues.

    Something I missed?

    1. Re:Amazing by Stewie241 · · Score: 1

      This.

      These stats do not say anything about how many handsets had hardware issues. The stats given relate to how many support calls there are.

  21. Hmmm vague by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We sample only calls we take at our contact centers...end-users may have visited their carrier's Web care to resolve an issue. In which case, there was still a problem – but we didn't get to see it

    So, alternatively, Android webcare/community help could resolve a greater number of software issues than with other devices, leaving hardware issues to make a higher proportion of the contact center cases. May not have been the case, but may have been, which clouds this claim a bit. Especially as they "did not disclose how many support calls in general technicians fielded for each platform".

    So even if Android phones do have a higher proportion of hardware issues in support calls, the overall number could be a fraction of that seen with other devices.

  22. Android bad.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Android bad. iPhone good.
    Repeat wiht me: Android bad. iPhone good. Android bad. iPhone good.....

    How come the world does not get it and the Android market share keeps rising and rising??

  23. SSDD by Dunega · · Score: 1

    Hey look, Slashdot is shitting on Android again. What a freaking surprise.

    1. Re:SSDD by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      Slashdot shits on everything. If it's not Apple's turn, as it usually is, it seems to be Android.

  24. Bitcoins? by plsenjy · · Score: 1

    What about Bitcoins? We haven't heard about Bitcoins in over 24 hours and it worries me.

    --
    Glad I could help.
  25. Android Phones Less Prone To Software Problems. by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 1

    From TFA:

    The study, conducted by WDS, found that 14 percent of all technical support calls for Android devices could be traced to a hardware fault, versus 3.7 percent for RIM BlackBerry, 8 percent for iPhones and 9 percent for Windows Phone 7 devices.

    WDS did not disclose how many support calls in g
    eneral technicians fielded for each platform.

    And there you have it. If the platforms had, say, the same amount of hardware trouble calls as non-Android platforms but a far lower number of software trouble calls you'd get the same result.

    Without additional data we can't tell if my headline or the one from PC magazine is more accurate.

    I don't know of any reason the Android-platform hardware produced by several big-name companies using modern parts and fabs should be almost four times as flakey as the non-Android-platform hardware produced by several big-name companies using modern parts and fabs. Maybe a little from this being earlier in the product life cycle. But a factor of 3.8? So I'm betting at least some of the result is from Android SOFTware being less failure prone and the article's slant being anti-Android FUD.

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
  26. Ruggedized phones ? by Sam+Nitzberg · · Score: 1

    My Casio Commando is a ruggedized (water,shock,vibration,salt spray) resistant Android phone...

    I wouldn't expect a hw fault with it. It's hw failure rate should be pretty low.......
    Other companies also produce ruggedized android phones.

    Did the other phones they discuss have ruggedized versions available?

    -- Sam

  27. mod parent all the way up. by doug141 · · Score: 1

    right on.

  28. Re:Android FUD being ramped up... by fbarajas · · Score: 1

    Coordinated? By Apple and Microsoft?

  29. Trolled again! by MogNuts · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Hey Slashdotters, looks like we've been trolled again! After that story that just was released about Android having supposedly crappier apps a couple days ago. This is just garbage. And for the past few months, I can't seem to mod these stories down.

    I think the Apple schills/PR machine is turning on their control of the tech media even more (releasing thinly veiled "news stories"), because they can't realize they can win on features/openness/technical merit. I mean geez, they knock android, but don't even mention that the iPhone 4 can't even make *simple calls* properly* (read: antennagate)?

    I think my days of "Chips and Dip" are over. I'm thinking it's time to retire the old UID.

    1. Re:Trolled again! by Old+Sparky · · Score: 0

      Indoobifuckintoobly!

      Anyone notice the sudden increase in Micro$crot/Apple FUD since the (so-called) US Justice Department dropped the antitrust investigation against Microscrot? And now they're starting in on google?

      How much did THAT cost Ballmer?!?

    2. Re:Trolled again! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...but don't even mention that the iPhone 4 can't even make *simple calls* properly* (read: antennagate)?

      Or use Wi-Fi when other people are using it next to you.
      Link

    3. Re:Trolled again! by Wovel · · Score: 2

      This story is bizarre and flawed. The app story was pretty good and highlights a real problem for Android...

    4. Re:Trolled again! by MogNuts · · Score: 1

      That's really scary. Holy moly.

    5. Re:Trolled again! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You accuse others of trolling and then post rubbish like:

      > but don't even mention that the iPhone 4 can't even make *simple calls* properly* (read: antennagate)?

      Please do "retire the old UID".

    6. Re:Trolled again! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Good riddance to bad rubbish. See ya!

    7. Re:Trolled again! by Old+Sparky · · Score: 1

      Microsoft shills have PLENTY of negative mod points.

      Keep on proving my point.

  30. Slanted by whisper_jeff · · Score: 2

    I'm an Apple fanboy but even I can see through my Apple coloured glasses and recognize that this is entirely slanted. Comparing phones made by Apple (one manufacturer) and RIM (one manufacturer) to Android phones (how many manufacturers?...) is entirely unfair. I'd like to see how HTC does. How about Samsung. Compare manufacturers to manufacturers. Apples to apples, if you pardon the pun. The might as well compare Apple's and RIM's phones to American automobiles for all the value the information provides...

    1. Re:Slanted by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      Well, like I mentioned earlier (although the study is statistically flawed), Android users love to flaunt their dominant marketshare by lumping all Android handsets together to make the number large, so they can't really complain when that same set of phones is taken as the data set for "so what's the failure rate?".

    2. Re:Slanted by toriver · · Score: 1

      Why? When Android fans push their collective market share compared to Apple and RIM, they scoff when it is pointed out there is not one Android phone but a multitude. (As in: Each of those manufacturers compete with the others, a sale of an Xperia Play does not help Samsung one bit.) So if "Android" is supposed to be treated as one platform THEN, the Android fans should accept that Android is treated as one platform NOW.

    3. Re:Slanted by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      (I don't own a smartphone, and I have no dog in this fight.)

      It's OK to get worked up about your phone, but not over this article. Go back and read it. It's crap. It gives no real information regarding reliability. See if you can answer some basic questions, like:

      14% of what? What percentage of the 600,000 calls is that? What percentage of all Android failures is that? What percentage of all Android phones is that?

  31. Hmmmm.... I can't verify this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I've had two Android phones - a G1 and now a Droid X. Both have had perfect hardware records and have survived falls, getting wet, and having a cat use them for a bed to sleep on occasionally. Of the people I know that have Android phones, not a single one of them has had a hardware failure.... As opposed to people that I know that have iPhones that have all (Except for one) had to return their phones because of battery/screen issues.

  32. Not enough data by Sniper98G · · Score: 1

    Without knowing any of the details of the study (Witch the study maker would not disclose). This is completely meaningless. For all we know, of the 600,000 calls only 7 were for android an only one of those for hardware problems.

    I'm sure that this is not the case but unless we can see some hard data there is no way to determine the real hardware problem rate of these devices.

  33. I call bullshit by AJH16 · · Score: 1

    I have to call bullshit on this article. 14% of technical support calls were related to hardware faults, but it says nothing of the per capita rates of technical service calls. I find it far more likely that either a) android is far more easy to deal with issues yourself or b) used by a more technical user base. Either of these situations would result in less calls related to software issues, which would make the % of support calls that are hardware related go up significantly. Until they release information about the ratio of hardware calls to devices, this is nothing but a bullshit article.

    --
    AJ Henderson
    1. Re:I call bullshit by CraftyJack · · Score: 1

      I have to call bullshit on this article.

      ...and stop right there. There isn't enough information in that article to draw any conclusions.

    2. Re:I call bullshit by Miamicanes · · Score: 1

      It could also be argued that Android owners are more likely to have the technical skills to take matters into their own hands, and won't bother wasting their time with "tech support" for anything short of actual honest-to-god hardware failure.

  34. My experience confirms it by cecom · · Score: 1, Interesting

    I love my Nexus One, but I have to say the statistics are probably true. I have to reboot it a couple of times per week - the touch screen stops working, or the screen just turns black when I am receiving or making a call. Sometimes I have to resort to removing the battery. A co-worker with a Nexus One is having similar problems, so it is not that my specific device is defective.

    As much as I hate Apple, my wife's IPhone 3GS hasn't had any problems whatsoever and she's had it for longer.

    1. Re:My experience confirms it by asnelt · · Score: 1

      Well, I am also using a Nexus One and I don't have any of the problems you mentioned (running CyanogenMod). So you probably have a software problem...

    2. Re:My experience confirms it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I love my Nexus One, but I have to say the statistics are probably true. I have to reboot it a couple of times per week - the touch screen stops working, or the screen just turns black when I am receiving or making a call.

      What does that have to do with the statistics given in the article? Are you saying that more of the support calls you make are about hardware than about software?

    3. Re:My experience confirms it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My mother just got an iPhone 4. She was having it prepare a video for upload the other day when the screen went completely blank. No signs of life, even when she connected it to a charger. She thought to try and pull the battery for a bit, but was unable to figure out how to remove it! Turns out you can push both buttons on it and it will come back to life. The Verizon technician said he doesn't know why they do that, but sometimes they just do. Don't ask me why they didn't warn her after they sold it to her to save her the fuel and time bringing it back after it 'breaks'!

    4. Re:My experience confirms it by vawwyakr · · Score: 1

      Oh yeah well my wife's iPhone bricked itself for no apparent reason so now we are statistically even again.

    5. Re:My experience confirms it by Urza9814 · · Score: 1

      Meh. I switched from Apple products to Android after every single Apple product I had recently (iPod touch, 2 iPod nanos, iPod classic) all stopped working in about a year. My iPod nanos would also tend to reboot without warning and for no reason a couple times a week. My Archos 5 with Android hasn't had a single problem since the day I bought it, other than ones I've caused (leaving it in the pocket of the hoodie I used as a pillow and cracking the touch screen -- but even that was a $20 fix)

    6. Re:My experience confirms it by ruthless+reader · · Score: 1

      This used to happen on some devices with 2.3.3, but the issue has been fixed with 2.3.4

    7. Re:My experience confirms it by nabsltd · · Score: 1

      the screen just turns black when I am receiving or making a call

      I believe it's supposed to do that, but only when you hold it up to your head. So, you could be doing something that confuses the sensors. I know that if I put too much of my hand over the screen while on a call, the screen will go black on my HTC Thunderbolt. Hitting "Home" solves that for me, as once the phone app doesn't have the focus, it won't black the screen.

    8. Re:My experience confirms it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've had my Droid X for almost a year now, and it only locked up once and that was because an app crashed. After uninstalling the app I haven't had a crash since. It's really the most reliable phone I've owned to date, and I have had quite a few...

    9. Re:My experience confirms it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You cannot for sure, say its a software bug. Many hardware bugs are patched thru software, so that could be a hardware problem that is fixed by a software patch as well.

    10. Re:My experience confirms it by Duradin · · Score: 1

      Is that bricked bricked or just "bricked"?

    11. Re:My experience confirms it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have a (stock -- no root nor custom firmware) Nexus One as well, and I don't have the same problems you have. It DOES become unstable if you go down to about 5-10MB application memory and will reboot itself once in a while (i.e. if you get the low space warning, FREE SPACE).

      Considering how many scratches are on my touchscreen (apparently your pocket isn't a good place for your phone if you're riding a rollercoster =P), it still works. You may want to back up and factory-reset: one of the firmware updates may have installed a little wonky and cause your issues.

      It may have very well been a slightly defective batch that went into your area or perhaps rough handling from whatever courier service you both used that caused the issues damage. I would have RMA'd that failing those two solutions

    12. Re:My experience confirms it by cecom · · Score: 1

      It isn't that, I think. The phone is ringing, but the screen remains black so there is no way to answer. Often I have another problem - it can't hang up; just locks up there and only removing the battery fixes it.

      In a strange way it is by far the best phone I have ever had, and by far the most unreliable one :-)

  35. In other news. . . by shadowfaxcrx · · Score: 1

    When you include Yugos, Trabants, and Ladas, foreign cars have much worse reliability than Ford.

    I really hate it when the media writes dumbassed articles like this. "Let's compare phones made by 30 different companies with a phone made by 1 company and see if there are quality variations." Abject stupidity.

    --
    "I disagree with you" does not equal "flamebait."
    1. Re:In other news. . . by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why not bundle them together for android. Thats what you all do when talking about market share. Its always... Android versus iphone then. Oh never mind answering... i've heard it all before.

    2. Re:In other news. . . by Wovel · · Score: 1

      But it is ok to compare sales on those terms, even though 18 months of Android "winning" has still not brought even 1/20th of the iOS revenue to Android developers? The gap is still growing, not narrowing.

        I agree it is not fair or relevant to compare devices from 30 manufactures on a wide variety of OS versions to one or two devices from one manufacture. It is always a meaningless comparison.

    3. Re:In other news. . . by shadowfaxcrx · · Score: 1

      In a comparison of operating systems, it's fair to compare sales of one operating system to another. In a comparison of phone design and build quality, it's stupid to compare phones using one operating system to phones using another. Compare phones by brand, not by type (unless you're willing to admit that Toyota is crap because Yugo made hatchbacks too). The operating system has absolutely nothing to do with the design and build quality of the physical hardware.

      --
      "I disagree with you" does not equal "flamebait."
  36. Re:Android FUD being ramped up... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is it me, or is the FUD campaigns on Android on a dramatic increase? It seems coordinated.

    I can't prove a negative, but there are natural mechanisms that explain this, just as natural mechanisms explain how birds flock without some bird-master pulling their strings.

    Having followed politics for 15 years, there's very little active coordination in the media. It is, however, a relatively insular culture of people who have a much narrower set of opinions than the larger culture and often aren't cognizant of this. And there are media leaders, such as the NY Times, that other smaller operations look to when judging the newsworthiness of a subject. This causes the most problematic kind of bias, that of important stories that don't get reported.

    The tech news is mostly the same, though they are far more susceptible to sponsors in industry withdrawing ad dollars. And, again, the problematic bias is usually of important stories that don't get reported out of fear of offending sponsors.

    If there are a few reports published that are critical of Android, it becomes newsworthy simply by being in the news. That's the simple explanation of why you see a few reports and then a flood, and this increase is how the progression of any big story happens.

    Now, PR people do understand this, and they do sometimes drop hit pieces. But the natural defense mechanism is that there are people who actively follow this stuff and look for those kinds of shenanigans. For example, here's a story that accuses the Obama administration of feeding a story to the WaPo. When PR people try to stir up a story, it's very easy to be caught out, so that naturally limits them to dropping a few hints.

    So, yes, there could be a PR firm quietly spreading FUD stories. This doesn't match that profile; usually they use anonymous sources, since you can't affect the news cycle very quickly with a year-long study. But they can't force papers to run with their press releases and anonymous leaks: they can influence, but not coordinate.

  37. Must be new math by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The original article and the slashdot story show a very questionable grasp of math.

    It is as if I asserted 0% of elephants are naturally orange and Mark Hachman published an article asserting 100% of elepants are pink. One does not follow from the other.

    It's probably a safer to assume that the hardware of all three phones is equivalent, but RIM and iOS get more support calls due to difficulties using the software. But I wouldn't publish that article either without some actual number to back up the assumption of equal hardware. Plus it doesn't really tell you much, are iOS and RIM phones that much harder to use, or do they attract an audience of users that need more assistance with using a phone, or something else?

    Just anecdotally it seems that businesses hand out RIM phones and lately iPhones to their employees while people buy Android phones with their own money. That alone can describe a higher rate of support calls for RIM and iPhones, a user is probably more likely to call the support line for some device that was foisted on them vs. one they chose.

  38. Garbage comment by hellfire · · Score: 1

    Errrrnttt. Nice try. You are correct that the article is committing a statistical error, but so are you. Technical support calls range the gamut from questions, software problems, hardware problems, user errors, help on setup and installation, etc. And you can't lump all the nonhardware issues into "problems strictly with the software" per se because a question could be as simple as "how do I install this" but could be more intricate like asking value added questions about how to best set up wifi or what settings are best to get maximize battery life. And some of those calls might fall outside the realm of the phone like "sorry the problem is not in your phone but your router/printer/computer/etc."

    You also have to factor in user fatigue. If your first problem is a hardware problem where the phone doesn't even work, you're less likely to keep calling back about other problems because you just get tired of dealing with it.

    Also the only scrap of information we have here from the article is that they separated out hardware calls from everything else. We have absolutely NO idea what those other issues are. They state "problems" but problems aren't the only reason to call technical support and by their own paramaters of the study they didn't appear to really look at those other calls to state they were actual problems.

    Given the data in the article, the statement that 14% of Android phone calls are on hardware issues is meaningless. The statement that percentage wise, that 92% of iPhone calls are software problems is also meaningless. So you have an article and a comment, both meaningless. More numbers need to be revealed to make this meaningful.

    --

    "All great wisdom is contained in .signature files"

    1. Re:Garbage comment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well put - I was just about to point out the same statistical issues. I'm sure your explanation is better than mine would have been. As usual, thanks to the people who try to bring fact and objective analysis into FUD/uninformed PR stunts.

      Lies, Damned Lies and Statistics

  39. iOS vs. Android vs. Blackberry – Bakeoff by jschmitz · · Score: 1

    Some of you may be interested in this presentation that was recently given at Velocity - has some good stats about the big three smartphones - http://assets.en.oreilly.com/1/event/60/iOS%20vs_%20Android%20vs_%20Blackberry%20%E2%80%93%20Bakeoff%20Presentation.pdf

  40. BS. by afex · · Score: 1

    man, what a bunch of bullshit. Android is the software, and has NOTHING to do with the hardware problems they may have.

    This is like saying "windows machines have more hardware problems than linux machines."

    I am an iphone user, had a galaxy S previously, and I understand what they are saying - but don't throw mud on HTC's hardware when you're really talking about some shitty kyocera handset that happens to run android 1.1!

  41. Re:Android FUD being ramped up... by Americano · · Score: 1

    Well sure, them too. But mostly the Illuminati.

  42. Re:Android FUD being ramped up... by _Sprocket_ · · Score: 1

    Now, PR people do understand this, and they do sometimes drop hit pieces. But the natural defense mechanism is that there are people who actively follow this stuff and look for those kinds of shenanigans. For example, here's a story that accuses the Obama administration of feeding a story to the WaPo. When PR people try to stir up a story, it's very easy to be caught out, so that naturally limits them to dropping a few hints.

    The article is over five years old, but I think it still is quite applicable today: The Submarine. The trick seems to be having awareness of this manipulation, looking for it, and being able to communicate those findings. Politics breeds that kind of watchdog (especially in the current environment). But I don't think you'll find it in every arena on every issue.

    That's not to say your view lacks insight. I suspect there is a lot of news that is news because it was in the news - especially within tech. But I also suspect that simply leaves tech news wide open to manipulation either by priming the pump or providing information to feed the cycle beneficial to your message. And unlike the political arena, tech watchdogs rarely become the news which greatly reduces the effectiveness of uncovering manipulation.

  43. Is this surprising? by DrXym · · Score: 1

    More manufacturers, more handset models, more components = more faults.

  44. Time distortion by Khyber · · Score: 1

    Windows phone 7?? A year?

    Try since November 8, 2010, for the USA.

    7 months or so. Not even close to 'nearly a year.'

    --
    Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
  45. Correlation!=causation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Android is an operating system not a hardware platform, therefore this is correlation and clearly not causation. The conclusion drawn is similar to saying "Windows machines experience more hardware failures than..." or "red cars are less reliable than...".

  46. A carrier feature, not a problem by Old97 · · Score: 1

    Android's API includes a number of functions for causing various hardware malfunctions. They are designed for use by the carriers. The carriers occasionally invoke them in order to increase their sales. Apple & RIM lock their phones down. The carriers can't mess with them, so they don't accrue these benefits. Sound good?

    --
    Very often, people confuse simple with simplistic. The nuance is lost on most. - Clement Mok
  47. Competition and the race to cheap by HikingStick · · Score: 1

    While not directly related to Android, the findings should have been expected. Everyone wanted to compete with iDevices. Android seemed to offer the flexibility that would been needed in the kernel and the OS, so it was a no-brainer: Android to emulate or even surpass the features of various iDevices. Going to the makers, however, they needed to produce devices that could compete roughly toe-to-toe on price, or, even better, offer a better value than iAnything. Thus, the race to cheap began.

    Only time and retrospect will tell us whether it was rushed engineering, poor component quality, or a combination of factors, but device makers wanted to get to market fast and they wanted to get to market cheap. Overall, that's one area where Apple has held a steady keel--they've resisted pressure to drop their prices, and doing so has let them execute greater control over the quality. They're not problem free, by any means, but they simply have a tighter grip on the hardware side which makes things on the software side so much smoother.

    In some ways, it reminds me of the early days of the PC clone market. You could get components everywhere, but often the quality was a mixed bag, and it even continued as newer technologies emerged. I'm sure many here remember dealing with sound cards, optical drives, and other componnents that claimed to be (then) cutting-edge technologies, but which were severly hampered by lousy chipsets and other signposts from the race to cheap. The good news is that the markets will shake out the makers (device and componnent level) who can't produce quality devices. Hopefully, however, that shakeout won't take too long, or take down too many formerly key players in the process.

    --
    I use irony whenever I can, but my shirts are still wrinkled...
  48. Well duh. by Windows+Breaker+G4 · · Score: 1

    Motorolla makes a bunch of the phones. I am personally on my 3rd moto droid in under 2 years, and know 2 other people with the same issue.

    --
    brickspeed.net for your old Volvo performance addiction
  49. Support?? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nobody I know has ever actually rang a support line. What number is tracked for Android anyway or did he look up every Android phone sold?

    Whole thing seems weird.

    I've seen more busted iPhones in my time than Androids. I know more people with Android phones too. iPhone users tend to call Android users when their phone breaks to ask them what to do in my experience and there is a whole secondary market of repairing iPhones that have broken. Two people in the last place I worked did it on the side.

  50. Not surprised.... by Thu+Anon+Coward · · Score: 1

    I got two G1's about 16 months ago for free. When the wife's touch screen died, I called several cell phone repair stores and got a 100% response ratio of "Android phones (all of them, not just the G1's) are too hard to work on". The prices quoted made it cheaper for me to buy a used working cell phone than get it repaired, and the store owners agreed. They couldn't even guarantee that the touchscreen would work if replaced and advised me that it could be a 50-50 chance the repair wouldn't work and I'd still have to pay them.

    Since then, I've been having second thoughts about getting another Android phone when my current contract runs out.

    --



    I'm good with numbers - .45, 7.62, 9.....
    1. Re:Not surprised.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've had my Hero for almost 3 years without a single problem - after droping it, getting it rather wet, and doing a shitload of other things that usually broke my previous phones. And I know a bunch of people who did even worse stuff to it - and it lived! So I guess you were unlucky?

  51. Percentages don't tell the story by wimg · · Score: 1

    Has the author considered that the percentage of support calls for hardware problems is higher because there are simply less calls for software issues ?
    Percentages don't mean a thing if you don't compare the total number of phones sold to the number of calls...

  52. Android at 50% market share by sl4shd0rk · · Score: 1

    Apple camp nervous and running amok. Unable to comprehend 12% vs. 50% market share* and how it relates to service calls.

    [*] - http://www.pcworld.com/article/226339/android_market_share_growth_accelerating_nielsen_finds.html

    --
    Join the Slashcott! Feb 10 thru Feb 17!
    1. Re:Android at 50% market share by RazorSharp · · Score: 1

      I don't see why Apple would be nervous. They never really measure their success by market share. Sure, when they have large market share they boast about it to their stockholders, but Apple isn't a 'market share or bust' type company and their strategies reflect that.

      I think Apple is fine with Android being the market share king. It's not Microsoft. When smart phones get to the point where everyone has one -- and by everyone I mean poor people as well as the well-to-do -- then Apple is bound to have less market share (although they may be selling more phones). They have no interest in selling their products at the razor thin margins necessary to capture that part of the market. They'll keep their technology on the bleeding edge and charge more for it, just as they've always done.

      Concerning this article about Android hardware problems: it's yet another flawed use of statistics on Slashdot. Who would have thought? Of course, as you point out, larger market share will garner more complaints. Personally, even if one could conclude that Android phones are less reliable (I don't think this study does), I would assume that has more to do with the fact that any manufacturer can make an Android phone. If they're going to compare hardware, they shouldn't be identifying the phones by what operating system it runs, the should be identifying it by the hardware manufacturer. Don't some companies make Win7 phones that are made with the exact same components as their Android phones? If you're trying to grade the hardware, the software is probably irrelevant.

      --
      "From the depths of my skeptical and rationalist soul, I ask the Lord to protect me from California touchie-feeliedom."
  53. BAD METRIC by dcollins · · Score: 1

    A fundamentally broken metric: "percent of all technical support calls".
    A completely incorrect interpretation of that metric: "Android Phones More Prone To Hardware Problems".

    If you want to argue that "Android Phones More Prone To Hardware Problems", then you need to know the number phones of each type that have hardware failures, and total phones of each type (or possibly total usage hours of each) -- and neither of those are known or estimated here. Other possible explanations for higher "percent of all technical support calls" could be perhaps that Android users are more knowledgeable about software and fix those problems on their own. But we can't know either way from this report:

    "WDS did not disclose how many support calls in general technicians fielded for each platform. The study covered 600,000 support calls from June 2010 to May 2011 and covered Europe, North America, South Africa and Australia. Tim Deluca-Smith, the vice president of marketing for WDS, said that the overall percentages of support calls by platform were difficult to measure. The company refers to those as the 'propensity to call,' the percentage of devices that would display a problem in any given batch over a 12-month period."

    Frankly, that smells goddamn fishy to me. You know the percentage of calls per-phone that are for hardware issues, but not the percentage of calls per phone? You've got a metric with an established name like "propensity to call" but claim no effective way to measure it? That doesn't make any sense.

    --
    We know where leadership by an anti-intellectual "strongman" who scapegoats minorities and likes boisterous rallies goes
  54. 9 percent for Windows Phone 7 devices by hduff · · Score: 1

    So just 18 Windows Phone 7 devices were affected versus, what, thousands of Android devices? That's pretty good for Microsoft!

    --
    "I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it." : Dogbert
  55. Bad logic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We don't have the numbers on the number of support calls, but I'd be more inclined to assume that more Android support calls are hardware related because there are fewer software (or User Interface) related support calls. Hardware and network issues I'd expect to be the same across all phones.

  56. Go with PHP by l0ungeb0y · · Score: 0

    For the student or casual hobbyist, PHP is more likely to be immediately useful and beneficial. Sure, it's not a language for desktop apps -- but it's great for web apps which is what your student/hobbyist will most likely benefit from being able to create. Plus. PHP is a great gateway language since it gives you many of the programming elements of C or Java without all the overhead and complexity of a typical C or Java project and can be done solely in a text editor without requiring a compiler or IDE and most every web host will have PHP preinstalled. Also, they can get a taste for mobile app development without requiring a developer license by leveraging HTML5 in their UI with JavaScript -- which should be a fairly simple language to learn in tandem with PHP. When they're ready, they can move up to C, Java, Python or Ruby as their needs or interests dictate.

    Let's face it, the days of the desktop app are waning, it's fast becoming all about web and mobile -- PHP, HTML5 and JavaScript are a solid set of languages to have a working knowledge of.

    1. Re:Go with PHP by purpledinoz · · Score: 1

      What the hell does PHP have anything to do with Android hardware faults? Just curious.

  57. well duh by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 1

    Anyone can sell an Android phone so there is a lot of shit out there.

  58. Stupid news title by GPLHost-Thomas · · Score: 1

    I didn't read TFA (because I don't care about phones), but I don't need to do it to tell that the news title in /. is stupid. Having the stats of 14% of problems being due to hardware doesn't tell the global failure rate. So, let's say we have 0.00001% of failure rate with android phones, and 1% with others, with still 14% of problems being due to hardware on the Android platform, that doesn't make Android more susceptible for hardware issue, does it? So, either the linked article is stupid, either the summary's title is.

  59. sorry, but it's the OS version by zhub · · Score: 1

    Android's niche is bleeding edge, so it's bound to be less stable. Android is on a multitude of devices, so it's bound to be less stable. Blaming the hardware is too easy for the average luser and I saw no indication from the article that they distinguished between real hardware problems and purported hardware problems. Do you have any idea how many "defective" phones get "refurbished" by simply being wiped ?
    Personally, I would like to see a stable version of Android that's meant for users who want something with more stability than features. But then I use CentOS on my desktop, so I'm just nutty that way.

  60. Individual Percentages only... by CarboRobo · · Score: 1

    "WDS did not disclose how many support calls in general technicians fielded for each platform. " WTF!!? This makes the data virtually useless for comparing platforms. From the same data we could just as validly say iOS and BB devices are more prone to software failures! This article is stupid.

  61. Number of phones sold vs. support calls? by clafarge · · Score: 1

    This would be more meaningful if we had stats on the number of issues vs. number of phones sold, and comparison numbers for other types of phones. Currently, as suggested above, this could also, easily, be interpreted as "Wow, so few Software issues they ROCK!"

    --
    Tis I: Me.
  62. duh, you get what you pay for by recharged95 · · Score: 1

    One would expect a $30 phone (on contract) would be flaky compared to a $200 phone (on contract). I notice low end android phones follow that rule (as their high end models are definitely better).

    Then again a $300 phone (on contract) that can't make decent phone calls cause of it antenna design....

  63. Re:Android FUD being ramped up... by That+Guy+From+Mrktng · · Score: 1

    tl;dr

    yes, no, maybe, probably, and whatever it is you don't need to know.

  64. fta by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not surprisingly, the Android faults were more common on certain undisclosed brands, WDS found. Common faults included keypad/button failures and microphone and battery issues, the firm said.

    shitter brands = shitter phones

    it's also not saying what constituted a support call or a hardware fault.
    for example "i couldn't run this app" may be traced back to "the device does not enough ram" which is then a hardware fault
    or how about "this compass app isn't working" may be traced back "the device has no orientation sensor" which is then a hardware fault

  65. Alternative by sjames · · Score: 1

    Since they don't show call volume vs number of devices, only percentage of calls that turn out to be for a hardware fault, it could just as easily be that Android software gets screwed up less or confuses the users less (or the users are more expert). That would make for a higher percentage of calls for hardware problems on equally reliable devices.

    It could also be a simple matter of Android helplines being more willing to admit to a hardware problem rather than claiming user error or endlessly demanding a reset to factory until the caller is exhausted enough to just live with the problem.

  66. 5 Easy Steps to Write Android Malware by 4phun · · Score: 1

    pcMag and just about any other decent web site this week now have step by step how to create new malware for Android intstructions so simple that an absolute moron can create new custom malware for Android. That simple step by step knowledge should have never been posted to the web!

    Google needs to act fast and tighten up the free and open part of Android or no one will want to buy Android as the word gets out any idiot can tamper with the apps you may download, even from the Market. . Creating malware for anything but Android requires a fair amount of programing skills but you can be wiped out on drugs or drunk and knock out Android malware now, no skill required.

    Malware scanners need to be immediately made a mandatory part of the default basic Android OS.

    Then you can get down to worrying if you really have crap Android hardware.

  67. In other news by sepelester · · Score: 1

    Study shows Android phones less prone to software problems. Same study. It's all in what you want it to look like.

  68. Another interpretation ... by jon3k · · Score: 1

    What if android software is so much better than iOS/WP7/blackberryOS that a larger percentage of the failures are hardware related?

  69. It's a classic example of misinterpretation of sta by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's a classic example of misinterpretation of statistical data. The following article concludes that "android phones are more prone to hardware problems" which cannot be deduced from this study. The factor is not calculated versus total number of sold devices but rather than versus total number of support call.

    The proper conclusion should be: "Android phone users are more tech savvy and less likely to call support with bogus software/configuration problems. The worse is blackberry where only 3.7% calls were related to real hardware problems."