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Among the Costs of War: $20B In Air Conditioning
TechkNighT_1337 submitted one of the most well spun little news nuggets I've read in awhile: "The amount the U.S. military spends annually on air conditioning in Iraq and Afghanistan: $20.2 billion. That's more than NASA's budget. It's more than BP has paid so far for damage during the Gulf oil spill. It's what the G-8 has pledged to help foster new democracies in Egypt and Tunisia."
Funny how being green and efficient is considered a weakness instead of a strength.
A gallon of fuel you dont need to use, is one you dont need to carry or convoy in.
You don't actually think they spend $20,000.00 on a hammer, $30,000.00 on a toilet seat do you?
I heard that the Cold War was over!
How are these tents built up? Is this just a canvas tent, no insulation whatever?
That would be rather ... stupid. It should be quite simple to construct something portable with at least a modicum of insulation.
---
"The chances of a demonic possession spreading are remote -- relax."
Acknowledged that it is the cost of doing business.
It is too much $$, the United States is not here to spread democracy among those assholes.
Here is my pullout plan:
1. Pack everyone and everything up
2. Leave.
And honestly causes problems.
The enemy is not lounging in AC comfort, they are used to the heat and can operate in it at peak efficiency.. Our troops are not acclimated to the environment and therefore are operating at less than 100% It's a small drawback but in wars even 1% can make a huge difference.
Ac does not make them better at killing the enemy. AC actually makes them less effective at killing the enemy. Anyone that claims they can exit a 80 degree low humidity environment and enter a 110 degree environment and are AS EFFECTIVE as they were in the 80 degree environment is a flat out liar.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
From every photo I've seen of Afghanistan, it looks to me like they have a surplus of sunlight. I understand solar power can't replace fuel for everything, but couldn't it dramatically reduce the cost of cooling troops? What are the roadblocks and/or definciencies of alternative sources of power?
Sorry - your military-grade communication and data equipment can't handle a temperature range inside a tent and has to be specially protected? Then it should have its own built-in ruggedisation and cooling.
Seriously, you think that soldiers should have air-conditioned rooms except possibly in a hospital? Unless the locals all have A/C and unless you're NOT siting your camps properly, I find that tricky to believe.
As a comparison - I'd be interested to know how much, say, a foreign military that's helping the US over there, but originally from a colder country (say the UK) is spending on A/C over there. I'd be seriously disappointed if it was rounded down in millions and came to greater than zero.
Ac does not make them better at killing the enemy. AC actually makes them less effective at killing the enemy. Anyone that claims they can exit a 80 degree low humidity environment and enter a 110 degree environment and are AS EFFECTIVE as they were in the 80 degree environment is a flat out liar.
Or a Masai Warrior
...Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security account for far more spending than the $107 billion the Pentagon says it will spend in Afghanistan next year.
So of the $107 billion we will spend in Afghanistan, $20.2 billion of it is for air conditioning? Seriously, almost 20% of our war cost?
But the devil is in the details. The calculation takes into consideration all sorts of services that are not solely used for air conditioning. Escort, command and control, medevac support...all are resources that support multiple purposes and not just creature comforts for soldiers. That would be like me saying the annual cost of maintaining my vehicle includes the band-aids I keep in the medicine chest because I occasionally scrape my knuckles loosening the drain plug.
In other words, we do not spend $20 billion on air conditioning. Instead, the cost of every resource that has any tangential effect on air conditioning has a combined cost of $20 billion. Wake me up when NPR posts some information that is actually useful.
We spend more in cooling air than exploring outer space ... Well done, humanity ... /ironic
Religion: The greatest weapon of mass destruction of all time
This is not true. I was deployed to Iraq in 2005 - we had 4 ac units for a 10 man tent. All of our battalion had the same. We happened to be grunts and ground pounders. Our tent with E-3 to E-5's had zero additional insulation, and happened to have a series of shrapnel holes from a rocket that detonated 6 feet outside the front door.
The AC units struggled to run as they were constantly filled with fine silt. We power washed them every few weeks to keep them operational. The generators powering the tents ran constantly of course, but I would hope they ran on cheap local fuel.
Without knowing what all research went into creating this $20 B figure, it's hard to know how accurate it might be.
Things are done like they are for a reason.
The tents are air conditioned with diesel-powered ECUs because people get heat related illnesses when they are not. They aren't kept at 68 degrees F - more like 80-85, but it's better than 105-130F outside. The ECUs also act as heaters in mountainous environments - Afghanistan, for one.
A TOC (command post) is a tent complex surrounded by concrete barriers and/or concertina wire. It's powered by generators. The wire and barriers are to stop potshots from firearms and to offer some protection against mortars/grenades/rockets. The wire isn't intended to harm, it mostly sticks to your skin and clothing and prevents you from going inside the post. The generators are used because they fit inside the perimeter.
Reflective blankets aren't used because the reflective blankets stick out like a sore thumb from the air, or the ground.
Insulation is not sprayed on the tents because they, you know, move...
Solar panels - envision putting a solar panel outside the perimeter. Envision carrying around solar panels and setting them up where you operate. Impractical from a logistical standpoint and could not be secured efficiently against attack without extending the perimeter to perhaps double or triple the circumference, with all the associated costs in additional manning for force protection. A nonstarter.
The same arguments apply to LSA - the places soldiers live - but with some modification. Some are fixed and might be amenable to alternative power sources, but the perimeter guard issue rears its head again. You can't beat generators for portability.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
Exactly, the guy does not know anything at all about data or comms gear. Even corporate Cisco switches and routers will operate at 160 degrees for a very very long time. I have a set that MELTED the rj45 jacks and it was still running, the temperatures sensors in the closet during the fire were off the scale (Above 255 degrees) for 6 hours during the fire until they cut the power. Military grade stuff can do this in the direct sun while being shot at and peed on.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
You can live without AC FOREVER..
Sir, I would like to receive your pamphlet. Is there some sort of ritual I will need to perform?
the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
Most of the network gear isn't MILSPEC, it's commercial off the shelf. Usually it isn't the network gear that gets overly flaky when hot...it's the rest of the computing infrastructure.
Im sure if we pull out the current standing regime will raise hell on the civilians "just because."
Some democracy you guys installed there.
In addition, it might give those leaders the balls to try something on our home soil again.
Again? What "again"? Afghanistan was only invaded because they were sheltering bin Laden and al Qaeda, not because they caused 9/11. What actions did Iraq instigate on American soil?
I'll be honest, we're throwing science against the wall to see what sticks. -Cave Johnson
Nowadays Germany turns out passenger cars in volume with both supercharging and turbocharging for light weight and high efficiency, and Japan turns out reliable, efficient hybrid power trains. The US is having to play copy and catch up.
As for your sig, that is nonsense. If you live in a city, how do you get food, water and shelter? You have to pay. If you think that the water companies and landlords don't use coercion, then you probably think the Tea Party is a rational and progressive political movement.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
Learn some history. In WW2, after the initial German successes they came up against the Russian winter, and Russian troops who were superbly equipped with cold weather clothing. The Russians had Diesel tanks whose engines could be safely heated before starting. German tanks used gasoline and tended to catch on fire when warmed up. The Germans never got their cold-weather logistics together, and they were ultimately defeated in the East.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
Our soldiers are over there dick-waving because some guys who live in a desert were able to make us scared of them. I'm yet to be convinced that it's doing anything for our freedoms, other than making more Arabs mad and breeding the next generation of terrorists.
Is 1563649 a prime number?
The Iraq war has really illuminated the incredible level of fraud by contractors. If we can spend millions to Haliburton to deliver "sailboat fuel" around Iraq (really they were driving empty trucks around and charging the taxpayer), then suddenly a $20,000 hammer makes a lot more sense.
Yeah, but don't forget a large part of that money is borrowed.
There was a Chinese economist on NPR recently who pointed out an interesting factoid -- our total expenditures in Iraq and Afghanistan are approximately equal to our total government debt to China.
"And anyway, it's not the war that's broken Washington's piggy bank," he adds, noting that Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security account for far more spending than the $107 billion the Pentagon says it will spend in Afghanistan next year.
It's like saying "all these fancy dinners we going to aren't breaking the piggy bank. Our mortgage payment is twice as much as we spent going to four-star restaurants last month!"