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Court Approves TSA Body Scans, But Calls For Public Comment

OverTheGeicoE writes "The District of Columbia Circuit Court of Appeals has finally issued a ruling (PDF) on EPIC v. DHS, a lawsuit seeking suspension of the use of body scanners for primary screening pending an independent review that would include a public comment period. According to the summary, the court 'grant[s] the petition for review' but 'due to the obvious need for the TSA to continue its airport security operations without interruption, we remand the rule to the TSA but do not vacate it.' In short, the TSA is required to open up their policy for public comment, but they can continue to use the scanners in the meantime and most likely afterward. This doesn't sound like much of a victory for EPIC or the U.S. public."

16 of 292 comments (clear)

  1. we could take back control... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    These unwelcome intrusions continue because we allow them. If we the people as a group, boycotted air travel, tgis DHS BS would go away. There are two waaaay more effective antiterror methods to use than spying on everyone and fondling people against their wills... first, airlplanes should be constructed to make hijacking physically impossible, (not that hard to do) and we should figure out what it is we as a nation are doing that makes people in other countries want to fscking want to kill us, and stop doing it. It shouldnt be that hard... if we were willing to open our eyes as a nation and see.

    1. Re:we could take back control... by melikamp · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You can travel with a cargo ship. It is much slower and somewhat more expensive than air, but it's definitely an option.

    2. Re:we could take back control... by TheTurtlesMoves · · Score: 4, Informative

      I no longer get connecting flights in the US. I know that most of my colleges are the same now too. We only fly to US if we absolutely need to.

      Its a shame really, once past the airports its a nice place to visit (yea pretty much all of it).

      --
      The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
    3. Re:we could take back control... by chimpo13 · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's only theoretically possible. It got a lot harder after 9/11. I've looked into it.

    4. Re:we could take back control... by pla · · Score: 5, Interesting

      These unwelcome intrusions continue because we allow them. If we the people as a group, boycotted air travel, tgis DHS BS would go away.

      Agreed. However, you need to understand that the vast majority of air travel consists of business travelers with close to zero discretion about how to get to their destination, rather than people flying because they choose to do so.

      You want to make the TSA cut this shit out? We have exactly one option that might work: Public shunning.

      Run a business? Refuse to serve them.
      Know any personally? Tell them you can't hang out anymore until they take a respectable job such as prostitution or dealing drugs.
      Encounter one casually on the street? Stop just short of assault in badgering them.
      Have to actually fly? Hand every one of them that speaks to you the business card of a local headhunter.

      Make it impossible for these people to have a life, and no one will take the job at any price. And maybe, just maybe, instead of instituting some sort of "TSA draft", the asshats in DC will get the message.


      They want "public commentary" on their scanners"? How about "fuck off and die, you goose-stepping pieces of shit, We The People hope your pornoscanners give you all a slow and painful cancer"? That work for ya, Janet? Get the idea yet?


      / And for the apologists - You know who else "was just doing their jobs"?

    5. Re:we could take back control... by sjames · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Considering that one of my friends (20 years) is a supervisor, you're plan does not work for me. The regular TSA agents and supervisors are not bad people at all. It is hard enough to find a job in this economy and a TSA agent is worse than a call center or telemarketer in terms of stress and bullshit.

      Just following orders? Where have I heard that before?

      Sorry, but orders or no, if you rape a baby, you're a baby raper.

      Oh, sorry, FONDLE.

  2. The feds love their power by pwizard2 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Of course they voted this way... why would a federal circuit court do anything that reduces the power of the federal government? These days, representative government is a lie.

    --
    "It is a denial of justice not to stretch out a helping hand to the fallen; that is the common right of humanity."
    1. Re:The feds love their power by ATMAvatar · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It became a myth with the rise of political parties.

      Were there not large organizations that spanned multiple branches of government at any given moment, separation of powers would work better, as each branch would be an independent entity protecting their own interests. Instead, you get one party controlling multiple branches, and the members within agree to work towards common goals, dissolving the separation of powers.

      Of course, one could blame a lot of the country's ills on the existence of political parties.

      --
      "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
  3. Summaraized: by Sinthet · · Score: 4, Insightful

    We're not gonna stop doing it, but we'll now allow you to bitch about it.

  4. "obvious need"? by Gaygirlie · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Why is it considered an obvious need that the TSA continue using these devices? They've cost the U.S. tens of millions of dollars and so far I haven't heard of them actually having stopped any real terrorist, in fact they've just made it even easier for people and TSA employees to steal stuff from fellow travelers.

    Have these things stopped any actual terrorism attempt? And if so, was the attempt sophisticated enough that it wouldn't have been noticed otherwise?

    1. Re:"obvious need"? by James+Kilton · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There isn't one shred of data that these devices actually work, or that TSA's security practices have stopped anything. The TSA does not track anything, so there's no way for anyone to know what the hell the truth is. I suspect that the TSA has not stopped anything since 2001, it's been other agencies (FBI, CIA, etc) who have prevented attacks.

      There's also the fact that driving is many times more dangerous than flying, yet flying gets the most "security" (not that I want a TSA pat-down before getting into my car, of course, but it just shows how useless they are).

      By the way, the backscatter devices would NOT have detected Mr Underpants Bomber. Oh, and every policy the TSA has put in place has been after someone got through security (e.g. shoe bomber => take your shoes off). Security theater at it's finest. Now, who are the politicians who've gotten donations from Rapiscan et.al. and how do we make sure they're permanently removed from office?

    2. Re:"obvious need"? by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 5, Informative

      You left out what may be the worst offender among the TLAs: the Drug Enforcement Administration. The scale of attacks on our rights by the DEA exceeds pretty much any other government agency. The TSA attacks the dignity of America travellers; the DEA routinely sends paramilitary units into homes, rifles drawn, and imprisons or kills the residents. The DEA routinely seizes money and property, and uses the proceeds from those seizures to fund its own operations. The DEA can even declare a substances to be illegal without any congressional approval, and then arrest people for possession of that substance (let me reiterate: the DEA can arrest you for violating laws that the DEA can create without any democratic process).

      There is outrage at the TSA's actions by the media, both from left wing and right wing sources, as well as in state legislatures and in congress. Yet we stand by while the DEA is permitted to commit even worse abuses of American rights, and the media is largely silent or even supportive of what the DEA is doing.

      --
      Palm trees and 8
  5. NO we can't by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    These unwelcome intrusions continue because we allow them.

    That's the thing, most people I talk to in the real World actually think that the scanner make them safe - they'd be pissed if they went away or if there were another successful terrorist attack would say, 'SEE! We needed those scanners!!"

    Remember, we're in a society that has many many people who think that chiropractic doctors are real, homeopathy works, Satan exists and that by increasing the Debt Ceiling, Government spending will go up.

  6. Wow - the only safe place in the world to put. . . by JSBiff · · Score: 5, Funny

    If the TSA sets up a website for public comments about this screening policy, it'll be the only safe place in the world to put kiddie porn, messages between terrorists or between organized crime groups, etc.

    Because you can pretty much guarantee that the government will NEVER READ IT.

  7. Re:Frequent Traveler Votes "BFD" by Drathos · · Score: 4, Informative

    I don't know where you've been using backscatter scanners, but at Washington Dulles, they slow things down. In fact, they actually get so far behind that they randomly select people to go through the old way to prevent the lines from getting too long. With the old metal detector, people just walk through with a possible pause for a check with a hand wand or go through again because of change in their pocket or something. With backscatter, every person has to stop in the device for a few moments, then wait for the person in the back room to report to the agent at the scanner. It doesn't help that every person who goes through the nudie-scan also gets groped because every one is reported to have an "anomaly." At least, with every one that has gone through at the same time as I have since they made the backscatter mandatory earlier this year.

    --
    End of line..
  8. I'm... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm more afraid of the TSA than I am of Terrorists.

    I'd rather die a free man than fly as a slave.