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Apple's Chinese Suppliers Accused of Causing Significant Environmental Damage

itwbennett writes "Environmental watchdog groups in China on Wednesday released a report detailing a 5-month investigation on electronic suppliers that they believe are used by Apple. According to the report, accessory manufacturer Kaedar Electronics and printed circuit board maker Unimicron have allegedly been discharging waste water and harmful gas from their plants in the Chinese city of Kunshan. The report claims that over a 10-year period, 'many people have fallen sick, with a sharp increase in the village's cancer rates.' Since 2007, more than nine people have suffered or died from cancer in the village, which has a population of fewer than 60. Apple declined to say if the companies named were in fact its suppliers, but company spokeswoman Carolyn Wu, responding to the report, said, 'Apple is committed to driving the highest standards of social responsibility throughout our supply base.'"

51 of 346 comments (clear)

  1. Low prices or pollution in China. by Kenja · · Score: 5, Insightful

    American consumers have made their choice a long time ago.

    --

    "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
    1. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Low prices or pollution in China

      I think you meant to say "High prices or pollution in China"

    2. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by jgagnon · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Low prices or pollution in China..

      With Apple you get high prices AND pollution in China. :p

      --
      Remember to maintain your supply of /facepalm oil to prevent chafing.
    3. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by nharmon · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Please. More like: Unemployment or pollution in China; Chinese people have made their choice a long time ago.

      China knows what increasing environmental standards will do to them. It is the same thing they did to us: shift manufacturing elsewhere. That is not to say they should not raise their standards; but it is hard to ignore the costs of doing so.

      Placing this on the shoulder of American consumers ignores the fact that if Americans did not demand low prices, much of that manufacturing would have stayed in America.

    4. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by Ryanrule · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Consumers did not make that choice. American businesses made their choice a long time ago.

    5. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Well, the problem is, when it IS cheaper to build somewhere else because you don't have to worry about pesky things like child labor, and environmental issues, then yeah. It is HARD to IMPOSSIBLE to compete when the playing field is not level. THIS is why everyone left for China.

      And you can thank all the people who wanted to normalize relations and "free" trade with China. Both (R) and (D) parties are to blame here, because both don't give a real shit about LIBERTY. Mainly because they don't understand Liberty and are mired in Group Politics and class warfare debates, while liberties are being systematically removed.

      To fix this problem, we have to DEMAND that imported goods are manufactured under the same rules and regulations required by US law, and charge import duties or refuse entry for all products that do not comply with US Law. Fair Trade, not Free Trade. We cannot impose our laws on others, we can only enforce them at our borders.

      And, if YOU are not willing to demand such action, then you cannot complain about the results such as the one mentioned in the article. People are buying from China (and other places) and when people do, they're part of the problem. There is no way a US manufacturer can make a product in the US, and compete against low wage, lax environmental laws and lack of regulation.

      You want to fix the problem fix the two party system that enables it.

      --
      Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
    6. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by Kenja · · Score: 2

      Dont forget that China has around a 40% tarif on goods made outside of their borders while we have around 5%. So if a company wants to sell their product in China, they had best move the jobs there as well.

      --

      "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
    7. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by fafaforza · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The problem is that you can't really buy a computer without many of the same companies being involved. So whatever system you buy instead is likely no better as far as environmental impact.

    8. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by arbulus · · Score: 2

      The problem is that there are entire segments of goods that are not manufactured in the US at all. There are no electronics manufacturers here. So if you want a computer, phone, tablet, television, dvd player, etc., you have zero choice but to buy foreign. You can't just say "buy american" and it solves all our problems. Most of the things we consume simply aren't made here.

    9. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by amiga3D · · Score: 2

      You know, regulation of Foreign trade is one of the few things that the Federal Government is Constitutionally authorized to perform.

    10. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by shentino · · Score: 2

      Consumers are just as selfish as any other entity.

      They benefit from low prices while chinese citizens are the ones that suffer.

    11. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by amiga3D · · Score: 2

      What's not buying Apple got to do with it? How many computers are manufactured in the US? I have a computer that was made in Pennsylvania but that was in the 80's and that company is gone entirely now. If someone still makes computers here I'd love to hear about it.

    12. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by kelemvor4 · · Score: 2

      Last I checked the iPhone was one of the most expensive cell phones money can buy.. specialty jewel encrusted gold phones notwithstanding. I don't think I'd call that low prices. How about "High prices and pollution in China".

    13. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by kelemvor4 · · Score: 2

      Same thing goes for all Apple products. Apple is well known for having extremely high prices.

    14. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by s73v3r · · Score: 2

      Have you bought any electronics product in the past 20 years? Then you are guilty of the exact same thing.

      Don't try to fool yourself into thinking this is just Apple. They only mentioned Apple because they're the biggest, name wise. Every other company does the same thing.

    15. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by kelemvor4 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Same thing goes for all Apple products. Apple is well known for having extremely high prices.

      And, very high customer satisfaction. Coincidence? I think not.

      I very much agree that the two are related. I'm sure I'll get modded down for elaborating, but I think Apple's success is very much like Prada's. Ownership of an Apple product is more about status than it is about what the product does. Prada handbags offer inferior storage and configuration to cheap competing bags, even ones manufactured from the same materials yet people (the ones who can afford to do it) still shell out the cash for a Prada handbag instead of going to another brand and paying a fraction of the price. In fact, the price its-self is part of the allure.

    16. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by gstoddart · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I very much agree that the two are related. I'm sure I'll get modded down for elaborating, but I think Apple's success is very much like Prada's. Ownership of an Apple product is more about status than it is about what the product does.

      *shrug* Your mileage may vary, and perception can be reality. But ...

      I've had iPods for over a decade, because they did what I want then, and continue to do it now ... contrast this with, oh, a Zune or any number of defunct devices.

      And, when I bought my iPad there wasn't really another product on the market -- despite people saying there have been tablets for a long time, in terms of one I could buy at a consumer electronics store and that was widely supported, in my opinion, the iPad was the first product that was readily available to me.

      I won't say that there aren't people for whom Apple is a status symbol ... but as an overweight, non-trendy geek in his 40s who bought these purely on a user satisfaction basis ... maybe it's a status symbol because it works well, not because other people also like them.

      I don't know a single owner of Apple products who bought it on the basis of what other people would think of it. And, I know a lot of people who have Apple products. In fact, almost all of the people I know who own anything by Apple are at least 40, have worked in tech for at least 10-15 years, and typically have at least an undergraduate degree in computer science. The rest, do not want to know anything about how their tech works, and just want it to work without fuss.

      Other than your belief that people only buy Apple because it's trendy, or that maybe anecdotal evidence suggests that superficial high school kids treat it as a status symbol ... do you have anything which supports this assertion? Or is this merely your own perception or something you've just heard from other people? Because, quite frankly, I hear this a lot but without anything to support it.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    17. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by konohitowa · · Score: 2

      Other than your belief that people only buy Apple because it's trendy, or that maybe anecdotal evidence suggests that superficial high school kids treat it as a status symbol ... do you have anything which supports this assertion?

      No, it's just that he's an expert on purses and is trying to put that expertise to good use.

    18. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by JSBiff · · Score: 2

      Seems to me that a governmental policy which disallows pollution *in* America, but allows imports of products from companies which have no such restrictions, played a big roll too.

      I'm not against importing products from other nations, per se, but it seems to me that it would be altogether *reasonable* and *sane* to require imported products manufacturer's to adhere to the same rules as domestic suppliers.

      What has happened was entirely predictable when domestic companies are forced to compete on an asymmetric legal standard with regards to worker safety, labor treatment, and environmental protection laws compared to their foreign competition.

    19. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by Coren22 · · Score: 2

      That was the point...

      the options are:

      Low prices AND Chinese pollution
      OR
      High prices AND environmental responsibility.

      AC was correct, that it is High prices OR pollution.

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    20. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by bws111 · · Score: 2

      Why does anyone have to DEMAND any ACTION? If you don't approve of China's labor, etc, don't buy products made in China. If enough people do that, companies will get the hint. Yes, this may mean that people may actually have to voluntarily give up having some things they otherwise might have. Oh, the horror! On the other hand, if people don't stop buying Chinese products, what makes you think they actually want policies that prevent them from getting Chinese products? The problem is not the two-party system. The problem is that people are unwilling to take the simple actions that can make a difference, because taking those simple actions (which they claim to so strongly believe in) inconveniences them. Blaming politicians and government is just taking the easy way out - placing the blame on someone else instead of where it belongs, firmly on the shoulders of consumers.

    21. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by gstoddart · · Score: 2

      Imagine two people sitting at an airport terminal. One person, with business attire, opens up his laptop. It's a Lenovo. Another person, dressed casually but with taste, opens a Apple MacBook Pro. Which of the two would you expect to be more affluent? The answer to that question decides if you buy Apple for looks or for usability/service, etc.

      Asking that question says more about you than whether Apple products are status symbols. Because I don't think about the relative affluence of total strangers.

      I see the guy in a suit, and I think of how awful it is to have meetings right after a flight. I see screaming children, and I hope they're not on my flight. I see people with those stupid little doggy carry-ons, and I wonder why the hell they let people bring their pets into the cabin of an airplane. Other than that, I just want to be left alone to suffer the indignity of air travel in peace.

      Just because there exists a subset of humanity who are superficial idiots, does not mean that if you see some of those with a given product you can make generalizations about all people who use that product.

      Now, Monster Cable, there's a status symbol. ;-)

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    22. Re:Low prices or pollution in China. by rtb61 · · Score: 2

      Pretty much the same price. Let's be honest those apple products are sold a prices the market will bear. They are produced overseas in the cheapest nasties place to increase profits, not reduce the price to the consumer. Apple is the 'fashion' company of electronics, all marketing, bluff, bluster and a growing more annoying by the day very bad case of histrionics.

      Apples share price is based upon the size of the gap between what their products cost and how much they get away with as the sale price. When it comes to actually caring about how they are produced and how that affects local populations, they is nothing but marketing bullshit. If they actually cared they would produce locally and take the smaller margin in "highly automated' production facilities.

      Truth is, thanks to gross and disgusting exploitation of labour in China, that labour is cheaper than automation and robots. People tied to menial sole destroying repetitious tasks because they are cheaper and more disposable than robots.

      Apple is utterly indifferent beyond marketing and uses a whole host of forum trolls to attack anyone that says different. Why is Apple so forum aggressive because they are a fashion company totally reliant on marketing image, an empty shell (no manufacturing plants, no chip plants etc.) which makes them extremely vulnerable to loss of marketing image (the reality is it happens every time to every fashion image based company, they oversell the lie).

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
  2. How does this compare to the US? by Alcimedes · · Score: 2

    From the article.

    "Apple does this by regularly conducting audits and working with suppliers to correct violations, according to the company's 2011 supplier responsibility progress report. In 2010, the company audited 127 facilities and found that 89% of them had waste water management practices in compliance with Apple's requirements.

    The same audits, however, found that only 69% of the facilities were in compliance with air emission management standards. Only 70% of the facilities were in compliance for environmental permits and reporting. When violations are found, Apple requires the supplier to complete plans to resolve the problem 90 days after the audit."

    Do we have 100% compliance in the states? How does this compare to US rates?

  3. Again Apples business by networkconsultant · · Score: 3, Interesting

    1. Fabricate an Icon 2. Market Said Icon 3. Move all manufacturing of said Icon to the lowest (and therefore dirtiest place) on the planet. We don't manufacture anything in North America anymore because we have environmental regulations that cost billions of dollars to comply with; china has some regulations but it's always cheaper to bribe the party member than pay the bill. I wonder if the Chinese people know they are poising their own back yard? that's why we have said expensive regulations.

  4. Of course they're going to deny it. by idbeholda · · Score: 2

    With a phrase like "Apple is committed to driving the highest standards of social responsibility throughout our supply base," that's basically a free ticket to PR/Plausible Deniability, whether their company is linked to the supplier or not. Of course, none of this really matters, because the parts have to come from somewhere, and China happens to have the largest concentration of rare earths.

  5. They love to beat on Apple, don't they? by King_TJ · · Score: 4, Insightful

    How many computer or electronic device makers have Chinese plants producing their circuit boards for them? Last I checked, Apple was only one of MANY. Yet this article makes it sound like Apple, alone, is at fault here for not making good on their claim that they're committed to driving the highest standards of social responsibility throughout their supply base.

    Let's face the facts. Only *China* can take care of pollution in China. If their government doesn't consider it important for businesses operating there not to dump hazardous waste into their ground-water, that's the decision they've made on behalf of their citizens.

    When you do business with China, you accept many pros and cons. For example, as Apple is finding out, China also has little regard for intellectual property and copyright -- so plenty of jobs are being created by way of counterfeiting Apple's products and tarnishing their reputation/good name. Again, as much as Apple may be committed to ensuring their intellectual property is protected, they can only do what the Chinese government is WILLING to do for them in those regards, in their nation.

    1. Re:They love to beat on Apple, don't they? by Kenja · · Score: 3, Interesting

      "Let's face the facts. Only *China* can take care of pollution in China."

      Yes, wer'e all powerless to be informed consumers. All we can do is give companies money for shiny things and leave the consequences up to others. Its clearly unpossible for tech companies to move manufacturing to countries with regulations or to just not act like asses when they set up their foreign subsidiaries.

      --

      "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
    2. Re:They love to beat on Apple, don't they? by jandrese · · Score: 2

      Companies go after Apple because in the past Apple has actually taken steps to fix the problems. They put pressure on Foxconn after the negative publicity a couple of years ago. It's the same reason people go after Starbucks about Fair Trade Coffee, because those companies have an image and a consumer who actually care about those issues. They're not going to try to raise a big stink about Acer for instance, because it's not going to get much traction.

      --

      I read the internet for the articles.
    3. Re:They love to beat on Apple, don't they? by timholman · · Score: 2

      How many computer or electronic device makers have Chinese plants producing their circuit boards for them? Last I checked, Apple was only one of MANY. Yet this article makes it sound like Apple, alone, is at fault here for not making good on their claim that they're committed to driving the highest standards of social responsibility throughout their supply base.

      The reason that they are focusing on Apple is because Apple will not pay protection money to organizations like Greenpeace. When other computer companies are criticized by an environmental organization, they make large "donations" to that organization, and the press releases stop.

      Apple refuses to pay the Danegeld, and in fact actually tries to do something about cleaning up their supply chain. Any way you cut it, China is an environmental nightmare, and everyone is contributing to the problem, but Apple is the main target because they won't "cooperate" with Greenpeace and their ilk.

  6. china is the USA circa 50 years ago by alen · · Score: 2

    almost a century ago the europeans dumped their cheap manufacturing to the USA and by the 1960's parts of the USA were environmental nightmares. we fixed it with the EPA and a few laws, but a few morons actually want to bring this back to the USA.

      I live in NYC and parts of the city are still uninhabitable due to pollution years ago, the original polluters are long gone and anyone who builds will have to pay for the clean up. Jetblue paid tens of millions to clean up parts of JFK airport to build a new terminal.

    at some point the chinese will wise up and stop allowing us to pollute their country

  7. Re:Apple cares only about profit by Tsingi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Apple doesn't care about the planet or slave labor so long as they can make a profit. That has been the goal of Apple since Steve took over, and that's part of the reason I don't buy Apple.

    A good and proper reason to boycott a corporation. The problem is ALL corporations are like that, you have to get your hardware somehow, so bending your principles with Apple or some other equally guilty company is six of one...

  8. Ungrateful peasants. by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 3, Funny

    They should be ashamed of rejecting Apple's gifts. iCancer is a truly aspirational lifestyle disease. The revolutionary unibody tumor construction, with the most advanced custom-vascularization in the industry(PC detractors might argue that these are just made of your own commodity cells these days; but it's the unique integration and superb resistance to apoptosis that really makes them special), and Apple's trademark 'It Just Hurts' UX design truly make this the disease to have.

    1. Re:Ungrateful peasants. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      "also found to have polluted a lake in the Chinese city of Wuhan with copper and nickel"

      Seriously dude, you wonder if those peasants even know how much value has been added to their water.

  9. In other news... by rogueippacket · · Score: 2

    In an effort to maintain their lowest-bid status with one of the world's most profitable technology companies, multiple Chinese manufacturers decide to reduce costs by cutting corners on safety. News at 11.

  10. Name dropping for hits. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Another example of "apple name dropping" for hits and sensationalism. Unimicron's clients include HTC, Motorola, Sony, Gigabyte, etc.
    Everything is made in China, and everyone of us -- Apple customer or otherwise -- is a party to whatever hells happen over there.

  11. Re:How does this compare to the US? by Altus · · Score: 2

    In the US its more than just apple doing the audit. I don't know how Apple's standards compare to the EPA standards, but much of this would be illegal in this country and it wouldn't really be up to Apple to police it.

    It's good to hear about an active environmental group in China though. With time, hopefully there will be change. It will mean more expensive hardware, but that is inevitable.

    --

    "In America, first you get the sugar, then you get the power, then you get the women..." -H. Simpson

  12. Bit vague by Harold+Halloway · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ' Since 2007, more than nine people have suffered or died from cancer in the village...'

    'More than nine'? So 10? 11? It seems like it wouldn't be difficult to include the precise number.

  13. Bullshit article by mveloso · · Score: 4, Insightful

    From the summary: "suppliers that they believe are used by Apple"

    Trolling by using Apple's name is a time-honored tradition in environmental groups. Yeah, they may be used by Apple...but they may not be. Maybe they're used by Dell? HP? Lenovo? GM? Ford? Chrysler? Qualcomm? Panda Express?

    1. Re:Bullshit article by OldeTimeGeek · · Score: 2

      Panda Express sells its toxic waste in malls throughout America...

  14. Re:Apple cares only about profit by DurendalMac · · Score: 2

    Corporations don't care about the planet or slave labor so long as they can make a profit.

    FTFY. This is not unique to Apple in the slightest, and I somehow doubt that these suppliers make goods strictly for Apple and no one else. It's like people bashing Apple over Foxconn and completely ignoring that the entire damned computer industry gets their goods from either Foxconn or other cheap Chinese labor.

  15. You can't blame Apple...yet by gubers33 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Apple bought products from these companies, they don't run the companies. That would be like me blaming you for buying a shirt made by slave children. It is Apple's job to monitor its suppliers business practices. I'm not an Apple fan at all and I have written posts where I think Apple is off base suing Samsung and HTC because they both make tablets, but I can be realistic. Apple deserves no blame in here and probably doesn't need to be in the article, but obviously it will sell more and grab more attention if it is in the article. Now that being said if they are Apple's suppliers it would probably be best for Apple to drop them and distance themselves from the story. If they continue to use these suppliers, now that they know of their shady bushiness actions, then maybe you can blame them.

    --
    Just because you are wrong and I called you out on it doesn't mean I am a Troll.
  16. That's retarded. by Brannon · · Score: 2

    Does that make any sense to you at all?

    There are cars made in the US which cost less than $14,000. Do you believe everything you read on the internet?

  17. Name a single computer manufacturer by Brannon · · Score: 2

    who "puts environmental and social rsponsibilities" first.

    No? Then shut up.

  18. Re:Likely some are suppliers? by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2

    One of the traits of Apple is they don't talk to the press unless they are launching a product immediately. Apple is notoriously secret about many things; it wasn't a priority for them to disclose future plans of anything. Now bear in mind, Greenpeace cited Apple not for that they were doing or not doing in terms of environmental concerns. It's that Apple didn't publicly announce what they were going to do in the future concerning the environment.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  19. Hypocrisy by Caerdwyn · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So I can then conclude that all you Apple-haters have personally investigated the source of your motherboards, memory, GPUs, cases, and power supplies of the environmentally-perfect PCs you are using to bash Apple upon? Got a component made by Asus? Foxconn? Any other Chinese company? Yeah, they only engage in environmentally-destructive practices when they're building for Apple.

    By your logic, YOU are just as responsible for any pollution and exploitation from YOUR computer components as Apple. You don't get a free ride just because you don't have a black turtleneck.

    --
    Everybody gets what the majority deserves.
  20. The problem is Chinese business culture by name_already_taken · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I don't know how Apple's standards compare to the EPA standards, but much of this would be illegal in this country and it wouldn't really be up to Apple to police it.

    It's illegal in China too!

    The cause of this problem is nothing to do with Apple, Western consumers, or anything else outside of China.

    In China, pretty much everything is illegal. They have laws against everything you can think of, including adulterating milk with melamine to produce false test results. The problem is that you can't do anything in China without getting permission from the government. Businesses that actually comply with all the Chinese regulations go out of business very quickly because their competition is willing to gain an advantage by cheating - i.e. bribing officials, whatever.

    The culture that has developed under this situation is such that nobody complies with regulations in China. It is simpler, faster and cheaper to pay bribes and to lie about compliance.

    Once in a while, they'll do something that results in people getting hurt or killed, like the melamine in the milk. The government will round up the head of the milk company and execute him, but nothing really changes that will make their food supply more trustworthy or safe.

    I have seen photographs of raw materials processing plants in China spewing huge clouds of colorful smoke into the air. It looked like a movie special effect. The same type of plant in a modern country like Brazil, for example, is three times the size of the Chinese plant - 2/3 of the Brazilian plant's volume is dedicated to equipment that captures the harmful byproducts given off by the process and prevents them from getting out into the environment. This is why the Chinese shut down a fair portion of their raw materials and manufacturing industry just prior to the Beijing Olympics - to allow the pollutants to dissipate and raise the air quality for the games.

    I know of at least one manufacturing plant in California that can demonstrate that they are actually discharging air that is cleaner than the intake air. They are required to meet environmental standards, and they do it. In China a similar plant would just pay off the inspector.

    Short of customers such as Apple stationing full-time inspection crews all the way down the supply chain (pretty much impossible), there's not much they can do. I have also seen pictures of expensive Italian quality control equipment in Chinese plants - everything in the plant looked dirty and worn, but the quality control equipment looked brand new. It was in place so they could pass their quality certification audit but it wasn't in normal day-to-day use, and nobody at the plant actually knew how to use any of it!

    Frankly we're lucky Chinese products aren't falling apart or killing people all the time. Go on Youtube and look for Chinese car crash tests if you want a real eye-opener.

    Almost any product made in China carries the risk of poor quality, false components, or pollution at some point in the supply chain. It's not an Apple problem. It's a China problem.

    --
    Putting moderation advice in your .sig lowers your karma!
  21. Re:Apple cares only about profit by Tsingi · · Score: 2

    Sorry but no, not all corporations are like that. In fact, there are many corporations that put environmental and social responsibilities first. And also no to your second argument, voting with your wallet actually does work. I don't know if you're an Apple consumer or just naive, but these are facts.

    I have a Macbook Pro, but it belongs to the office so I had no vote. In general I am not an Apple consumer.

    I vote with my wallet whenever I can. I'd be interested to hear what responsible manufacturers you recommend that I buy my hardware from.

    I rarely buy COTS computer systems, so the field is wide open for me. I'm sure others would like to hear who the "many" are and how responsible they are.

    Please, do help us become less naive.

  22. Re:Apple cares only about profit by s73v3r · · Score: 2

    Yes, all of them are like that. At least all of them that make electronics. The only way to "vote with your wallet" would be to have no electronics at all.

  23. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  24. Damned if you do by retroworks · · Score: 2

    Having worked with China environmental industries for over a decade, I skimmed TFA and one thing jumps out immediately... These "violations" the report is built on are actual FINES and ENFORCEMENT of Chinese Environmetal Law. China EPA was NOT enforcing these laws ten years ago. This is actually what progress looks like. If you look up environmental fines and enforcements in the USA, you could write the same report. In the past, you could not have written this report about China.

    --
    Gently reply