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Lawsuit Claims Windows Phone 7 Spies On Users
jfruhlinger writes "Microsoft wants to emulate the success of the iPhone, but they probably didn't want to follow in Apple's footsteps this way: a class action lawsuit claims that Windows Phone 7 is collecting location data on users, even when they request that it stop. But a look at the internals shows that Microsoft might not be acting as Big Brother-ish as it appears."
Both of them?
Help stamp out iliturcy.
It's much more secure and it's not Microsoft.
This reveals a lot about Microsoft. Already, people who have a Windows Phone 7 are neither iPhone nor Android users. They're already suffering enough and Microsoft has to pile on the indignity of stealing their measly data. Microsoft must know everything there is to know about the 536 people--worldwide--who bought the Windows Phone 7.
Bet the same people invested heavily in Silverlight...
If you don't like it, don't use 'em.
Enlightenment is a pipe dream. So where's the pipe?
either the government or the fatcat corporate types in this modern-day fascist Corporatocracy
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
And they're telling everyone! Everywhere! Just now, I checked in with them, you're in the bathroom slashdotting! They told me so, and G+ says you're low on toilet paper! OH NOES!!! on a lighter note, only a silly person thinks they're getting location data for free from a service which isn't also recording that location data. How do you think they fund the service?
He concluded that "the Windows Mobile operating system is clearly sending information that can lead to accurate location information of the mobile device regardless of whether the user allowed the Camera application to share location information or not."
Is he testing Windows Mobile or Windows Phone 7? I RTFA and the linked articles and can't seem to find the testing methodology or any documentation.
And wouldn't you want that accurate location information to be sent if you were using the Find My Phone thing (just like you would with Apple's Find My iPhone):
Microsoft's "Find My Phone," meanwhile, only keeps the device's most recent location, the company said.
Of course you have to trust that the company is only keeping the most recent location but that's the case with all providers.
The former part about cell-tower tracking... Yes. it sort of has to to properly hand over control to the next tower when you're moving.
The latter? I doubt it. Otherwise, opening a maps app would instantly have your correct location(versus having to wait and get a gps lock), and that doesn't seem to happen, at least on Android.
"Follow in Apple's footsteps"? If you want to compare them to someone, pick Google, the biggest privacy violator in this market. Even after Apple stopped crowdsourcing location information, Google is still using it to track Android users. There is a reason they spend millions of dollars to develop Android, and it's not benevolent.
I guess I shouldn't expect more from the /. crowd. You guys still believe the "Don't Be Evil" line from 10 years ago.
...that the "7" in Windows Phone 7 referred to the number of users?
There's no -1 for "I don't get it."
Cell tower tracking can get you your correct location-- you dont need GPS for that, and Google maps (at least on blackberry-- which has gps) uses cell tower triangulation.
I've had a Windows Phone 7 device since day one, and it asks at every turn before doing something that would collect location (or any other) data. If it's true and not just a misconfigured device or data being poorly interpreted, I'd be surprised if it was intentional.
But, I know I know. Always assume the worst yada yada. Microsoft is evil, right?
I doubt it relies only on cell tower triangulation. Most likely it uses the cell tower triangulation to get a rough estimate of your location, and as you get a GPS lock it refines that location.... thats how it seems to work on the google maps app on iPhone anyway, and why my maps app doesnt work nearly as well in Japan as it does in Germany, Softbanks shittier than shit service means there are very few towers to triangulate so you have to rely entirely on GPS(which has accuracy issues in large cities).
Fuck Softbank, I cannot wait to get rid of that piece of shit company, even if it means getting rid of my iPhone. I have lived in the US, Germany, and Japan and I have NEVER had any issues with either Verizon in the US or Vodafone in Germany. I got faster internet speeds in cow town Bavaria than I do in Tokyo....and in the town I live in, only 60 km outside of Tokyo, I am out of service more than I am in service...sorry went on an off-topic rant there. But anyway, your maps app uses both GPS and cell tower triangulation and fuck Softbank.
Monstar L
(htc, google, and amazon iirc)
For now, I've set the offending dirs to read-only so no files are written, and all's well, but I don't think reading the fine print buried in settings>about>legal is akin to "explicitly asking for permission".
(And I don't think having to root your phone to chmod dirs read-only is a user-friendly way to decline these "features")
IIRC a Googler said it was used [maybe legitimately] for 'debugging', but the number of files found (in each directory) logging every event was offensive if only for the amount of phone storage it eats up (and I won't even go there re: syncing those files to clouds and bad data plans—I suppose a few MBs/day isn't a huge deal).
(Of course, my biggest concern is privacy :)
Kiss my ass WP7 is great. So what if it they log your location, every other freaking device is subject to the same shit. I for one am sick of this bash Microsoft all the time around here on slashdot almost makes it not worth reading the cruf posted on this site anymore.
It asks you if its ok to send the data, then it sends the data anyway with a flag saying not to use it.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-20057329-281.html
"Windows Phone 7, supported by manufacturers including Dell, HTC, LG, Nokia, and Samsung, transmits to Microsoft a miniature data dump including a unique device ID, details about nearby Wi-Fi networks, and the phone's GPS-derived exact latitude and longitude."
"Microsoft says that in the case of Windows Phone 7, location information is transmitted to its servers only if Wi-Fi and location services are turned on. It also points out it offers a global switch to turn off all location-based services"
So if you have WiFi on and GPS on, then it's sending your location details to Microsoft HQ with or without your permission.
Yes. It's called A-GPS
I still cannot find the droids I am looking for...
Well, they claimed that the tracking was "for emergency use", but the few times I've had to call 911 from my cell phone, the 911 call center had no idea where I was.
Apple wasn't collecting users' actual location; they were collecting the cell towers they were near. Beyond that, it was a bug that, when reported, was fixed within days. Heaven forbid someone just tell Apple (or whatever company) that they have a bug, so not scare people over nothing.
Ummm... it's what?!?!?!? Do you seriously have enough experience with both platforms to make such a judgement?
What part of this article was about security? What kind of security are you talking about?
Blackberry is a Java based phone. If you find ANY opening in it that would allow you to alter the class loader code, it's all tits to the wind after that. You could insert viruses all over that. Oh and given the crap quality of the app store, it seems like it's probably REALLY easy to get an app on the device with malicious intent.
Windows Phone 7 and BlackBerry are EQUALLY shitty with regards to security and quite spouting off worthless trash like this. Show me a secure smart phone operating system and I'll sell you this bridge I own in Brooklyn.
All because you picked your carrier based on the phone. Dude. It's a phone. Use au or docomo if you want service. You can use your iphone on docomo, just switch the sim card, or, get an android from au and have coverage everywhere, even in the middle of nowhere.
"Freedom in the USA is not the ability to do what you want. It is the ability to stop others from doing what THEY want"
But without a complete set of facts one must make an assumption.
No, without a complete set of facts, you go looking for a complete set of facts. Making assumptions is what everybody expects you to do, and it leads to people only feeding you partial information in an attempt to guide you towards a specific assumption.
I'm Rocco. I'm the +5 Funny man.
The towers track you by necessity, the phone itself doesn't need to do anything special and even old dumb phones can be tracked in this way.
http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
When you get a cell phone, you're gonna be tracked. It could be iPhone, Android, W7, or even a "dumbphone". They will track you. We accept this when we get cell phones.
All the world's a CPU, and all the men and women merely AI agents
I'm not - the ipod touch (no gps, no cell) had/has the same tracking issues. If the phone didn't cache 'what is local', it would have to reload its info every time, which is slow and would yield a bunch of weenies whining "my iphone is killing my data plan". Unfortunately, part of caching is tracking - from reversing the age of the cached locations, I can effectively track you.
The appearance problem is maintaining the tracking explicitly. If I delete the explicit track, I can infer most of the information by inverting the 'what is local' cache.
Alternatively, when I arrive at a location, I can send a "whats near me" to a server somewhere, which causes weenie whining about privacy.
in short; your privacy or your data plan is the choice; the weenies will whine either way.
Unfortunately unless you work as a programmer for Microsoft's WP7's customer data stealing department you can never truly get a complete set of facts. There are assumptions and trusting others involved in every step of the way.
Sure with more facts the assumptions are lower, but don't pretend you don't make one, even if the only assumption you make is that the person who has all the facts is telling you the truth.
Plus I have better things to do then investigative journalism for every Microsoft is Evil (tm) case I hear about. Making certain assumptions is the sensible thing to do.
My experiences have generally been as an onlooker as well. Not once has 911 known my location. How many times does one need to call 911 and not have them know where you are for one to recognize that they do not use cellular tracking for that purpose?
Unfortunately unless you work as a programmer for Microsoft's WP7's customer data stealing department you can never truly get a complete set of facts. There are assumptions and trusting others involved in every step of the way.
Nice. That way, there is no way of ever proving you wrong, is there?
Plus I have better things to do then investigative journalism for every Microsoft is Evil (tm) case I hear about. Making certain assumptions is the sensible thing to do.
It's not the sensible thing to do. It just happens to be what furthers your agenda.
I'm Rocco. I'm the +5 Funny man.