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Ask Slashdot: Best Copyright Terms For a Thesis?

plopez gets in his first Slashdot submission with this question, writing: "I am wrapping up an MS. In the past I have had problems getting copies of others' work, due to lack of copyright notices on their thesis or dissertation. I don't want that happen to me. I know the joke is 'No one will ever read your thesis,' but in the slim chance it is useful to others I don't want them to be required to hunt me down for a release. Basically I want to say: 'Copyright is released as long as this work or excerpts is properly attributed. Also, any published excerpts cannot be copyrighted by other parties, nor can the original work in its entirety.' Is this good enough? I don't want to encumber legitimate uses of the work but I also don't want some pirate coming along and stealing it out of public domain. Is public domain good enough? Or does it allow the work to be restricted by commercial interests? I know of copyleft, but copyleft is a family of copyright notices and I am unsure which one is right for my intent. Please help."

211 comments

  1. Creative commons! by NalosLayor · · Score: 5, Informative

    Creative commons has a tool to help, and human readable licenses. I'd guess you can find what you need there. http://creativecommons.org/

    1. Re:Creative commons! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      danah boyd did this:
      http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2009/02/18/licensing_your.html

    2. Re:Creative commons! by paulschreiber · · Score: 2, Informative
    3. Re:Creative commons! by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 5, Informative

      And what he's probably looking for is CC BY-ND. "This license allows for redistribution, commercial and non-commercial, as long as it is passed along unchanged and in whole, with credit to you."

      --
      Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
    4. Re:Creative commons! by BenFranske · · Score: 1

      I did this for my PhD (in 2009) too and my school (University of Minnesota) didn't blink over the copyright being CC at all. I also agree with Danah that you should try to make it as available as possible. Even with a CC license it's important that people be able to find it so they can use it. Luckily in my field there is a clearinghouse (ERIC) which will host theses, papers, and articles and distribute them indefinitely. I also allowed the University Archives to post it online. Interestingly, ProQuest later submitted the copy I sent to them to the same database (of course they didn't submit the full text, just a reference link to there site where you can buy it).

      Your institution and department don't have any claim to your work (unless they are directly paying for it, but even so giving up the rights to it would be rather unusual) and should not be telling you how you can and cannot copyright it. Worst case you just re-release it after the fact with whatever license you want. Academia is the last place that closed licenses belong!

      If you're interested you can see what I did at: http://eric.ed.gov/ERICWebPortal/detail?accno=ED505597

    5. Re:Creative commons! by tepples · · Score: 1

      Your institution and department don't have any claim to your work (unless they are directly paying for it, but even so giving up the rights to it would be rather unusual)

      The institution might argue that it is paying for its students' work not with dollars but with course credit. No copyright assignment, and it's graded incomplete.

    6. Re:Creative commons! by BenFranske · · Score: 1

      That would not fly in the US. I do believe that in some countries universities may have copyright claim on student work but this is simply not the case in the US unless there is a contract and funding making it a work for hire or copyright assignment. I am not aware of any US schools which have such requirements and I study and practice in the field of education.

    7. Re:Creative commons! by hedwards · · Score: 1

      They might argue that, but if you're paying tuition, then they can't make that claim. They're giving the credits in exchange for payment provided the work is completed satisfactorily. There might be a plausible claim if the college is picking up the tab and providing the credits for free.

    8. Re:Creative commons! by digitig · · Score: 1

      The university I studied at in the UK did not claim copyright on my dissertation, but it would be a breach of university regulations if I were to publish it, which could, in the extreme, lead to my degree being revoked. I could, of course, publish a rewritten version containing the same information.

      --
      Quidnam Latine loqui modo coepi?
    9. Re:Creative commons! by melikamp · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Darn, my mod points just expired :) This is pretty much exactly what the OP asked for. Although, OP said "I also don't want some pirate coming along and stealing it out of public domain", so may be CC BY-SA is more up to the task. It all depends on whether derivative works that go beyond verbatim quotation are desirable.

    10. Re:Creative commons! by Capt.Albatross · · Score: 1

      I would be interested to know on what grounds they justify that regulation. It being in the UK, I would guess it is a publicly-funded institution, right?

    11. Re:Creative commons! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Creative Commons! Absolutely!!

    12. Re:Creative commons! by Oxford_Comma_Lover · · Score: 1

      Ditto. Why would it be a breach? Is it just that they are formally the "publisher" for some arcane reason?

      --
      -- IANAL, this isn't legal advice, and definitely isn't legal advice for you. Also, Squee!
    13. Re:Creative commons! by Surt · · Score: 1

      In most of the world such an institution would be risking their accreditation. Coercive contracts are a no-no.

      --
      "Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
    14. Re:Creative commons! by digitig · · Score: 1

      Yes, it was publicly-funded. I didn't challenge the regulations (because I have no particular reason to publish the thing), so I don't know the justification.

      --
      Quidnam Latine loqui modo coepi?
    15. Re:Creative commons! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Was going to jokingly say slap the GNU-GPL on it and call it good, but this is a good idea too (and probably more effective)

    16. Re:Creative commons! by The+Famous+Brett+Wat · · Score: 2

      CC-BY-ND is what I used for my thesis. Given that the default copyright status of any work such as a thesis is "all rights reserved", I don't see how this can be a bad thing: it's just an explicit waiver of certain rights. Attribution and originality are considered important in a typical "western" academic environment (maybe elsewhere also -- I wouldn't know), and that's all the "BY" and "ND" parts assert. In fact, the "BY" and "ND" parts are intended to preserve the integrity of the work for the sake of clarity in future references: if there's an interesting remark in there that you want to quote, it's important that you have a proper reference for it (BY) and that you can be reasonably sure it's what the author actually said (ND). Just slapping a CC-BY-ND on it doesn't magically make it happen, of course, but it expresses the intended use well.

      In response to the sibling reply "ND? you're on crack", it's already considered fair use to quote other works in context, regardless of copyright licenses, so it's not like the "ND" part can take that away. I just want to grant the additional right to redistribute the work, for any reason, so long as attribution is preserved. I want it to be publicly available.

      --
      proof, n. A demonstration that a conclusion is implied by certain premises and axioms.
    17. Re:Creative commons! by kthreadd · · Score: 1

      That's exactly why private and for profit universities should not be allowed to exist.

    18. Re:Creative commons! by tepples · · Score: 1

      Which I guess is why universities try to get everyone competent on at least some sort of scholarship aid, so that the college can put a finger on "these credits are the free ones; give us your copyright".

    19. Re:Creative commons! by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Your institution and department don't have any claim to your work

      How can you possibly say that without knowing where he is?

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    20. Re:Creative commons! by boristhespider · · Score: 1

      So far as I understand it, British universities could claim copyright on a thesis but typically don't - but they'd certainly be quite pissed off if you published commercially. I do remember signing some copyright form or other when I submitted my PhD, though, so maybe they actually did claim copyright. I must confess by that point I was so tired and sick of the thesis that I'd have signed anything to get it over with. It's not practically *that* important, since the thesis is up for the world to see at the arxiv (and, technically, at the British Library) and it's my copyright declaration inside, which the university didn't protest.

    21. Re:Creative commons! by RDW · · Score: 2

      So far as I understand it, British universities could claim copyright on a thesis but typically don't - but they'd certainly be quite pissed off if you published commercially.

      I don't believe this is normally the case, e.g.:

      "I understand that the rights granted to the UCL Institutional Repository through this agreement are entirely non-exclusive and royalty free and that I am free to publish the Work in its present version or future versions elsewhere."

      or:

      "Rights granted to the University of Warwick and the British Library and the user of the thesis through this
      agreement are non-exclusive. I retain all rights in the thesis in its present version or future versions."

      or:

      "Copyright in the thesis usually rests with the author: this does not change when you deposit your thesis in ORA. No ownership is assumed by the Bodleian Libraries over the work."

      Universities are generally more concerned about any material you include (e.g. a figure) in which the copyright is held by a third party (this might even include your own work if you include, say, a paper where you've signed over copyright to a journal). This sort of material can be included under a copyright exemption for the purposes of examination (if properly attributed!), but can't be further distributed by the institutional repository without permission.

    22. Re:Creative commons! by Smallpond · · Score: 1

      That would not fly in the US. I do believe that in some countries universities may have copyright claim on student work but this is simply not the case in the US unless there is a contract and funding making it a work for hire or copyright assignment. I am not aware of any US schools which have such requirements and I study and practice in the field of education.

      Well, then you aren't paying attention. Here's the rules MIT has - it looks like they get the copyright if they paid for any part of your research or you used their facilities, which means almost everybody.

      http://hst.mit.edu/servlet/ControllerServlet?handler=PublicHandler&action=browse&pageId=457#Intellectual_Property_Copyright_Publication

    23. Re:Creative commons! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you get in trouble with you school: Submit it with all copyright clauses removed. This way you retain all rights. After the thesis has been processed by the school release it again over other channels with any license you like.

      If they insist, you can give any rights they want to the school, just make sure you don't grant them excusivity, e.g. make sure that you retain all rights when giving rights to others.

    24. Re:Creative commons! by boristhespider · · Score: 1

      I'll take your word for it - I honestly don't remember what they put on the copyright form.

    25. Re:Creative commons! by BenFranske · · Score: 1

      They're mostly concerned with you using their facilities extensively, many times that is not the case. Also, you'll see exceptions if you bring any money/resource into the picture with it's own strings attached (NSF funding is specifically called out). For a terminal MS this is probably less common but in the PhD world you almost always bring your own pot of money to the table and thus can make some of your own demands. I suspect that in the end MIT only ends up owning the rights to a very selective number of theses compared to the total number submitted in any given time period.

    26. Re:Creative commons! by metrometro · · Score: 1

      Additional on No-Derivatives license.

      A (mildly) restrictive license such as CC BY/ND does not prevent releasing the work under other more permissive conditions later. ND does not in any way limit the author's right to approve follow up projects. If, for instance, the work includes extensive data tables, merging those into an independent dataset might exceed most definitions of fair use. However, an author's note could explain the author's extreme likelyhood to approve such uses on a case-by-case basis, which would allow for appropriate conditions (ie "you can use my data, but you must republish all of it, not just the section that supports your conclusion").

    27. Re:Creative commons! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Personally, I hand wrote an open publication clause as the sole copyright term, because I really didn't care.

      The 40k of bzip2 compressed code that was associated with it I placed under various forms of GPL (deliberately contaminated with outside GPL code so the University could make no claim later).

    28. Re:Creative commons! by gweihir · · Score: 1

      I put my PhD under a CC license. Earned a few looks about the copy of the license in the back of the PDF, but apart from that no problem. I had to pay the publisher an extra 10EUR though to get his acceptance of a CCed electronic edition.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
  2. You did check with your department first, right? by damn_registrars · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Because no matter what your intentions are, I would highly advise against jeopardizing the progress of your MS just because you want to use copyright terms that your department doesn't agree with. If you haven't already, I would very highly recommend you check with them first to see how they manage the copyright of theses that are written there. Depending on the institution you may even need to go higher than that to find the official policy and find out if it has any flexibility.

    --
    Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
  3. What's the problem? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Do what everybody else does and put the PDF on your website. Anyone who Googles for it will find it and download it. No one will care about anything copyright related because you can't make a derivative work of a thesis anyway. It works for everyone else in academia; I assume it'll work for you.

    1. Re:What's the problem? by SwedishPenguin · · Score: 1

      I'm doing my thesis work, all I did was sign a document saying the institution has the right to publish the thesis online and that the university library can keep a copy (which can be checked out if you so wish). As far as I know, nothing more is required and I don't see why I would need anything more. If I want to I should be able to publish it on my website as well without problems, I've certainly seen others do so.

  4. University Owns It by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most universities own the copyright to anything you produce while attending, including your thesis. I'd check the terms with your university.

    1. Re:University Owns It by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

      Most universities own the copyright to anything you produce while attending, including your thesis. I'd check the terms with your university.

      This. And universities take that very seriously, since it can mean lots of money to them down the road.

      A few years back our department received a 7-figure settlement that, at the base of it, was driven by the department's ownership of a former grad student's thesis research.

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    2. Re:University Owns It by TaoPhoenix · · Score: 1

      We're starting to close in on the Division by Zero.

      Why are you paying them six figures to own your 140 page thesis?

      Just make up a distracting thesis that has "academic" merit, swear by its defense to get your degree, then unleash your real degree in the real world when you graduate.

      Let's bust the EDU bubble.

      --
      My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
    3. Re:University Owns It by BenFranske · · Score: 1

      What country and field is this in? If they are sponsoring the research...maybe. In my experience though it is exactly the opposite. Unless you sign a contract making something a work for hire I am aware of no legislation in the US which would give the university any rights to your work at all (other than fair use of course).

    4. Re:University Owns It by muridae · · Score: 1

      Have you read the forms that are required to be signed, by freshmen, at major universities in the USA? Most of those state that anything you do during a class or using university funds can be used by the university. Some go further (mine did) and made sure that the university was assigned copyright to every piece of code I wrote as an undergraduate. For me, they used that copyright as justification to pool all of the projects I turned in and scan next years work for plagiarism. Something they probably could not have done if I held copyright exclusively and did not give permission for them to do so.

      As for why they would want or could get copyright, who pays for the grants? Sure, in some technology fields, most of the work is done by the masters or doctorate student. I've seen that in computer science. But in something like biology, where the lab, safety procedures, chemicals, and large equipment are provided by the school, where the undergrads are hired by the school to act as research assistants; it's those projects that I figure the school really does have some work invested into the thesis, probably way more than the doctoral student has paid in tuition.

    5. Re:University Owns It by BenFranske · · Score: 1

      All of this applies only to my experience in the US... At the schools where I've taught and the schools where I've been a student there are no such forms which state those things. Even if there were as you say it might be that they can use it but I would really enjoy seeing such a form which actually turns over all of the rights and are not joint ownership, etc.

      Just because there are grants does not mean that ownership is automatically turned over. In fact, most grants explicitly state that ownership resides with the grantee. Sometimes (many times with federal grants) there are requirements to disseminate the research freely but that's the opposite of what's being talked about and that too would never be implied, it would be clearly spelled out in the agreement accepting the grant. As for the use of labs, equipment, etc. the university usually takes a hefty "administrative cost" off the top of money coming in to cover those things and usually any fixtures, equipment, etc. you purchase with the grant become school property.

      Academics vigorously protect that their intellectual property belongs to them and not to anyone else. Most contracts for faculty, for example, go so far as to clearly spell this out...even to the extent that at many schools syllabi are property of the faculty and the school may require a record of it but cannot distribute it without permission. Patentable sponsored research, especially in the areas of biotechnology and plant genomics, are some special cases which may be governed by special agreements about who owns the intellectual property of the research, but even there the rights to the report itself is usually owned by the researcher.

    6. Re:University Owns It by Smurf · · Score: 1

      Well, the first university I checked said this:

      (...) In general, students may retain ownership of thesis copyrights when the only form of support is (a) teaching assistantships (the duties of which do not include research activities) and (b) NSF and NIH traineeships and fellowships (although the trainee or fellow may be required to grant certain publishing rights to NSF or NIH). (...)

    7. Re:University Owns It by Smurf · · Score: 1

      Oh, and the second university I checked said something similar:

      In submitting a thesis or dissertation to Stanford, the Author grants The Trustees of Leland Stanford Junior University (Stanford) the non-exclusive, worldwide, perpetual, irrevocable right to reproduce, distribute, display and transmit Author's thesis or dissertation, including any supplemental materials (the Work), . . . to sub-license others to do the same,and to preserve and protect the Work . . . .

      Now, you are right in that public institutions frequently have rules along these lines:

      The copyright to a thesis belongs to the student, according to the University's General Rules. As a condition of being awarded the degree, however, the student grants the University the non-exclusive right "to retain, use and distribute a limited number of copies of the thesis, together with the right to require its publication for archival use."

      So the copyright is yours but you are required to share some of those rights with the institution.

      In general what I have seen is that if you used any money from them (grants, research assistantship, use of labs/equipment), the universities want the copyrights. If you did it all by yourself, you keep it. So it seems that you can typically only keep the copyright for some social science projects or purely theoretical stuff like that as it is close to impossible to carry out an applied scientific or engineering project without any help from the institution.

    8. Re:University Owns It by BenFranske · · Score: 1

      The trick is to get someone to pay for it, but not the institution. Particularly in high-expense research areas (biomedial, sciences) you can usually find federal funds (NIH, NSF, etc.) which will make it clear that you own the copyright but that you have to provide a copy for free distribution through some clearinghouse. My suggestion (and experience) is to avoid funds coming directly from the institution, there are too many strings attached as you have noted. Finding money for good research is not as tough as it might seem. I would go so far as to suggest that if you're paying your own tuition (definitely for a PhD and probably for a masters) you're probably doing something wrong. Writing grants is a key part of future academic work so you may as well figure out how the system works now...and negotiating so that you retain copyrights is part of that.

  5. All you have to do is say it's copyright... by thepainguy · · Score: 1, Insightful

    ...by you and state the year you wrote it. Also, use the copyright sign and the phrase all rights reserved. Then this, "Copyright is released as long as this work or excerpts is properly attributed. Also, any published excerpts cannot be copyrighted by other parties, nor can the original work in its entirety," is assumed.

    1. Re:All you have to do is say it's copyright... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You don't even have to do that, though the name and year are good for establishing who the author is and when it was created. Since you're putting that down for copyright purposes, you may as well prefix it with "Copyright", but it's not required. You haven't needed to say "All Rights Reserved" since 1886.

    2. Re:All you have to do is say it's copyright... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What he wants is not a "copyright notice" (as he wrongly said, which is what you describe), but a "copyright license", which grants certain of those rights he reserved to anyone else, subject to their compliance with his terms (such as attribution).

      Your suggestion is off-the-wall, since "all rights reserved" (which you don't really need anymore -- it's implied under law practically everywhere, thanks to the Berne Convention) is exactly the opposite of "copyright is released ...". Note "reserved" (to the author) vs. "released" (to others) -- I'm not even sure how you could think they accomplish the same goal. Then again, I'm not sure how this plopez character could confuse "copyright notice" with "copyright license", so this whole damn mess stinks.

    3. Re:All you have to do is say it's copyright... by Larryish · · Score: 1

      What douche modded this Insightful?

      "properly attributed"

      That language is ambiguous and would not last a moment in court.

    4. Re:All you have to do is say it's copyright... by vegetasaiyajin · · Score: 1

      The "douche" said that such language is assumed and thus unnecessary. It just quoted part of the question.

      --

      My heart is pure, but make no mistake, it's pure evil
  6. You don't own it by Dan+B. · · Score: 2

    It doesn't matter what you want to put on your thesis, you university owns the copyrights to it.

    I'd suggest you contact your Uni and put the same question to them, rather than 6 million /. Subscribers.

    --
    Dan. -- So what if it's spelt wrong, nobody's perfect
    1. Re:You don't own it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It doesn't matter what you want to put on your thesis, you university owns the copyrights to it.

      This is not true at all universities. It certainly wasn't true for my thesis.

    2. Re:You don't own it by geekboybt · · Score: 1

      This is not necessarily true. At mine, we simply have to submit a form that grants them permission to keep a copy for their archives. I'm free to do what I will with my work beyond that.

    3. Re:You don't own it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know at CMU that anything a student does or creates (projects, papers, programs, thesis) is the student's IP. So yeah, he could hold the copyright to his thesis, as he should.

    4. Re:You don't own it by PopeRatzo · · Score: 4, Informative

      It doesn't matter what you want to put on your thesis, you university owns the copyrights to it.

      I don't think that's even true for half the universities. I'd be surprised if it was true for 1/3 or 1/4.

      I've seen thesis manuscripts with and without copyright language and none of them has ever been held up or given any trouble from the institution. And I've been on PhD panels for several universities, public and private. Had scores of grad students get their degree without this ever becoming an issue.

      I remember a university head librarian who wanted to make an issue out of this and he was practically laughed out of the meeting. And this at a top-five US school.

      All of this changes with faculty research and other publications, of course. Then it matters, big time.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    5. Re:You don't own it by ironjaw33 · · Score: 1

      It doesn't matter what you want to put on your thesis, you university owns the copyrights to it.

      I'd suggest you contact your Uni and put the same question to them, rather than 6 million /. Subscribers.

      At my university, if your research is not funded by the school, you own the copyright to any works you produce. If you are funded, the school does claim copyright on anything you produce.

    6. Re:You don't own it by izomiac · · Score: 1

      How does that work? I could kinda see it if you use their equipment, but many theses are pure products of the mind. A PhD student pays tuition, so it's not work for hire, and the student is certainly the main author. What claim could a university have over a thesis?

    7. Re:You don't own it by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 1

      Same here. Check with your funding body (if any).

    8. Re:You don't own it by ThunderBird89 · · Score: 1

      This. We had to sign the university copyright notice before submitting the thesis. It had three levels: no library access, access from on-site, free access (although this applied only to the electronic version, the print version was expected not to go into circulation of any kind).

      --
      Hyperbole: I use it liberally!
    9. Re:You don't own it by 517714 · · Score: 1, Troll

      No, you were TOLD you had to sign it. If you chose not to they would have no ability compel you to do so unless they had informed you of this requirement before you entered into their program. Imposing such a requirement after you had invested your time and tuition would constitute a unilateral change to the existing contract between you and the university.

      --
      The US government have made it clear that we have no inalienable rights; any we do not defend vigorously will be taken.
    10. Re:You don't own it by the_think_tank · · Score: 1

      Yeah, Dan B. is correct (for every research-intensive university that I've ever been affiliated with) and unless you publish in an open-access journal, the journal owns the copyrights to your writing.

      --
      God: "An inordinate fondness for beetles." -JBS Haldane-
    11. Re:You don't own it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      go to a better university

    12. Re:You don't own it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      We had to sign over to the university right to publish, but it was clear that the copyright was ours, and the university didn't want be prevented from photocopying it and sending it to others (e.g. inter-library loan) or posting it online at some later date. Totally reasonable in my book.

    13. Re:You don't own it by Xugumad · · Score: 1

      I believe the university will want you to sign over copyright, but it's not a requirement. There will be some usage they insist on, but I couldn't tell you details off hand. Some theses are commercially sensitive (either outright paid for by a company, or the student will be selling the research), and there's definitely exemptions made for those.

      However, the university will be in a much better position to advise on this stuff.

    14. Re:You don't own it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think that the faculty who make up PhD thesis committees very rarely have any clue of the copyright policies of their own universities. (Hell, most faculty are ignorant of the copyright policies of the journals they submit manuscripts to...journal sends you a copyright form; you sign it; and it doesn't matter whether it's a license, assignment or transfer.) All the universities I've been associated with require the student to submit his dissertation to some kind of repository - sometimes commercially managed, sometimes by the university itself - and that always requires some form of copyright assignment. Faculty aren't involved in that process, so they never have any reason to find out. The librarian is not going to review the thesis for a copyright statement, because any such statement is superseded by the contractual copyright assignment. If you laughed the librarian out of the room for trying to explain this to you, you lost a good opportunity to reconcile the disparate beliefs.

    15. Re:You don't own it by guruevi · · Score: 1

      Yes, in practicality it doesn't change very much because thesis hardly ever get read or even taken seriously. If students find something really interesting, they won't put it in their thesis but actually co-write a paper with their professors or wait until they graduate.

      However even though the librarian might get laughed at, he might be right and in the end, it's what the courts think is what matters, not a small group of academia. IF you write something REALLY interesting in your thesis like FTL travel or something that really is going to upend the scientific community (which I wouldn't recommend putting in your thesis as said above, just wait and graduate, re-do the science and write a paper on it) what is the University going to do to either clear or involve their name in it? It's about money (grant or otherwise) and image, not about science in your average University leadership.

      --
      Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
    16. Re:You don't own it by rfc1394 · · Score: 1

      It doesn't matter what you want to put on your thesis, you university owns the copyrights to it.

      I'd suggest you contact your Uni and put the same question to them, rather than 6 million /. Subscribers.

      This is not correct. Unless you are an employee of the university and you are hired to do this sort of work, it is not the university's property. Even if you wrote the paper using university computers and university resources. You're paying the university and therefore you're entitled to use of the facilities. This point is very clear that unless you are doing this as a 'work for hire' you own the work, and for it to be considered a work for hire means you either have to be a contract or salaried employee of the university to be considered creating a 'work for hire' for them to own the work. A student of the university is not an employee of the university and the university has no ownership right whatsoever. This has been a standard rule since the U.S. became a member of the Berne Convention and eliminated copyright notices more than twenty years ago.

      --
      The lessons of history teach us - if they teach us anything - that nobody learns the lessons that history teaches us.
  7. Don't Use Public Domain by monk · · Score: 2

    You lose all control over the material and some ugly things can happen.

    The Creative Commons licenses give you excellent control and they have a helpful tool on the website to pick the license you want. And attribution is required in the license which will handle your citation requirement.

    There are others including the GNU free documentation license is a bit more specialized, but CC should be plenty for your needs and most importantly has a community of users and attorneys backing it up. You can probably get quite a bit of help if you ever need to defend it.

    --
    [-- Trust the Monkey --]
    1. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by maxume · · Score: 1

      Is there even much law around putting things in the public domain?

      I mean, a statement repudiating interest in a work is going to work against any claims of damage, but is it well established that a grant to the public domain actually works?

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    2. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The link doesn't answer his question, fucktard.

      It is controversial, however, whether it is possible for a copyright holder to truly abandon the copyright of their work. Robert A. Baron argues in his essay "Making the Public Domain Public" that "because the public domain is not a legally sanctioned entity," a statement disclaiming a copyright or "granting" a work into the public domain has no legal effect whatsoever, and that the owner still retains all rights to the work not otherwise released. The owner would then have the legal right to prosecute people who use the work under the impression that it was in the public domain. It is certainly true that under some jurisdictions, it is impossible to release moral rights.

    3. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by SteveFoerster · · Score: 1

      Meanwhile, for those of us who aren't into trying to control information, the public domain is where the beautiful things happen.

      --
      Space game using normal deck of cards: http://BattleCards.org
    4. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by diamondmagic · · Score: 1

      but is it well established that a grant to the public domain actually works?

      That's 100% FUD. There's zero reason any court would have any reason to interpret public domain as meaning anything other than "you can't sue for damages."

    5. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes it does answer the question. It basically is saying that even if you proclaim a work that you own to be public domain there is nothing legally binding about it. Jesus, do you know how to fucking read?

    6. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by excelsior_gr · · Score: 1

      You lose all control over the material and some ugly things can happen.

      Either give some example and reference for the above quote, or I call FUD.

    7. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by monk · · Score: 1

      You lose all control over the material and some ugly things can happen.

      Either give some example and reference for the above quote, or I call FUD.

      Just to be clear, I'm not arguing against the value of the Public Domain and I would be perfectly happy with a 15 year copyright after which things naturally fall into the Public Domain. I was only referring to the OPs question about just declaring the thesis Public Domain and calling it good. CC is a way of "dedicating works to the public domain"

      I was mostly referring to the same confusion over rights that the OP was trying to avoid and that was described in the Wikipedia link posted above. There's no clear legal definition of "Public Domain," and there are places where it's actually not possible to legally release all rights (Germany is cited in the Wiki article, but Portugal is also an example, I believe). Those are some of the problems CC was created to solve. On the other hand, CC licenses are very explicit about what they allow and make it easy for someone to reuse the work. Without those assurances someone might reuse a work only to find that they original rights owner (or more likely an heir or assignee) is suing them and there's no recourse because the release into the Public Domain wasn't legally valid. You might still win, but it's murky enough in some cases to cost money defending the case.

      There are other things that could happen without much legal recourse if you do manage to give up all rights, for instance someone could change the author's name only and republish it, which, depending on the work and the effort involved my be disappointing. Remember that the OP wanted to make sure that his work was properly cited. Worse, someone might leave the name on it, change the content to meet some agenda of their own and republish it, so that it appears the original author said things they didn't. If I wanted to release something directly into the public domain, I would be inclined to do it anonymously to avoid that problem.

      Another advantage to using a real license of any sort is that somewhere an attorney was involved. From your comments, you are not an attorney. Neither am I. For good or ill the law doesn't work the way an engineer would design it. Public Domain doesn't work just because you or I may say it should. It works when and if a court will find that works in most cases. For most of my own stuff, CC works great because I don't want to have to reinvent all of this every time I publish something.

      You seem to have a strong opinion about this. Do you have a problem with CC licenses that releasing material directly into the Public Domain seems to fix?

      --
      [-- Trust the Monkey --]
    8. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by Xebikr · · Score: 1

      You lose all control over the material and some ugly things can happen.

      Yeah. Disney might make a movie out of it.

    9. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by excelsior_gr · · Score: 1

      My problem with CC licenses is, exactly what you said, that a lawyer was involved at some point. I could analyze this further, but it will probably only boil down to the fact that I don't like lawyers.

    10. Re:Don't Use Public Domain by Uzuri · · Score: 1

      A movie based on a master's thesis couldn't be much worse than what they've been turning out lately.

      So for the love of all that's good, quit giving them ideas.

      --
      I'm a she-slashdotter... but I make up for it by living with my folks.
  8. put not for use on turnitin on the copyright by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 3

    put not for use on turnitin on the copyright

    1. Re:put not for use on turnitin on the copyright by Xugumad · · Score: 2

      That way when someone copies large parts of it and submits it as their own work, it's harder to tell?

    2. Re:put not for use on turnitin on the copyright by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Assuming that instantaneously has any positive or negative influence on the difficulty to begin with.... ~_~

    3. Re:put not for use on turnitin on the copyright by Xugumad · · Score: 1

      It's a widely used tool that does provide an effective similarity detection service, so... it's better than nothing, certainly.

  9. Have a look though the CC licences? by nzac · · Score: 1

    Some of need are vague and slightly contradictory when i read them.
    Have a look at the Attribution-NonCommercial one that xkcd uses but that might interfere with journal publishing.
    http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/2.5/

    What to do you mean pirates if a pirate can access the file and they don't care about the copyright then it does not matter what license you use.

  10. check with your university by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    At my university (management in Canada so YMMV), theses are published by the library and copyright is owned by the school. But other universities can have access to it through shared databases/works as most of the stuff from journals. Beyond that, well nobody really will ever know about my thesis, if I wanted to, I'd have to publish it in a journal as an article and then they'd have copyright over it.

    So make sure you check with your university first, they most likely have policies regarding this, especially if they publish your work (even if it's just sitting at the school's library)

  11. it's not yours to give! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You can't control the copyright. Your work belongs to the university, it's not fully yours. You need to cover this issue with your institute.

  12. Submit to a conference? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just make a paper or a note out of it and send it to a relevant scientific conference or journal. Anybody wanting to use/cite your work will much appreciate that (much shorter) and peer-reviewed version. Also it would make your supervisor very happy.

  13. wha? by nomadic · · Score: 2

    "In the past I have had problems getting copies of others' work, due to lack of copyright notices on their thesis or dissertation."

    Uhhh...huh? Theses are academic sources. The university library where the thesis was finished will have a copy. Lack of copyright notice does not mean you can't use the work as long as you don't simply reproduce it and sell it. I really don't understand what is being asked here.

    1. Re:wha? by Dunbal · · Score: 1

      But going to the library makes his head hurt! Shit what is it with this younger generation? It's called RESEARCH and it's SUPPOSED to be hard. Not everything is on wikipedia.

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    2. Re:wha? by icebraining · · Score: 1

      Why exactly is it supposed to be hard? Keep the knowledge to those who can afford it?

    3. Re:wha? by Dunbal · · Score: 1

      Discipline, and because things that come easily are seldom retained.

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    4. Re:wha? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      your learning disability isn't any reason why the rest of us shouldn't have easier access to research

    5. Re:wha? by icebraining · · Score: 1

      No one forbids you from handicapping yourself and taking the long way to access them. Some of us have work to do and don't have waste time to jumping through hoops, so the alternative to easy access is no access.

    6. Re:wha? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Uh, because there's no low hanging fruit? If it's not difficult, it's almost certainly worthless.

    7. Re:wha? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well it doesn't *need* to be hard, but with intellectual endeavors it is often safe to assume that the easy stuff has been done before, and therefore doing it would be duplicitous effort.

    8. Re:wha? by Dunbal · · Score: 1

      Too funny. Now re-frame this in a paradigm where I have a doctorate and two lesser degrees (including a master's), and you don't.

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    9. Re:wha? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The university library where the thesis was finished will have a copy.

      So what does that mean? If the work he wants to look at is on the other side of the country he might have travel across the country to look at it? If that is the case even some of the time it does make reading that thesis a pain in the ass.

    10. Re:wha? by icebraining · · Score: 1

      You misunderstand. Dunbal claims it should be hard to access existing thesis/dissertations, not write your own.

    11. Re:wha? by icebraining · · Score: 1

      Dunbal is claiming it should be hard to access _existing_ thesis/dissertations, not writing new ones. Knowledge isn't worth any less because you can access it easily.

  14. Give yourself extra time, OR do post-hoc by cretog8 · · Score: 2

    At my university, I own the copyright by default, but when I tried to either do it public domain OR creative commons, the office which handles such things flipped out. They weren't angry or anything, they just didn't get it. It came down to doing things the usual way OR being late submitting and so not graduating. So, I have a typical copyright on my thesis.

    However, now that I think about it (and you could do the same thing), since it's my copyright, there's nothing to stop me (or you) from re-publishing with a Creative Commons license after-the-fact. Hmmm....

    1. Re:Give yourself extra time, OR do post-hoc by tobiah · · Score: 1

      My understanding is the owner of the work may release it under multiple licenses. This is somewhat encouraged in the book, "Intellectual Property and Open Source" (very useful resource on IP), because it allows others to use the one that is most compatible with the other IP they might combine it with.

      --
      "The ability to delude yourself may be an important survival tool" - Jane Wagner -
  15. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You don't need a resume for that. Idiot. You must work at one of the lesser brands.

  16. Say WHAT? by Sooner+Boomer · · Score: 2

    you can't make a derivative work of a thesis anyway

    Derivatives from published, previous work is one of the foundations of educational research. You shouldn't copy the work, or duplicate it whole and call it your own (although I've seen this...), but almost all research, institutional and commercial, was based on previous work. "The reason I can see so far is because I stand on the shoulders of giants". But...if you're saying that you can't take a "chunk" of someone's thesis, call it your own, and publish it as your own work (thesis), I agree; that's plagorism.

    --
    Chaos maximizes locally around me.
    1. Re:Say WHAT? by pavon · · Score: 1

      That doesn't make any sense to me. Copyright protects the expression of the work, the text of the thesis itself, but not the ideas in it. People will take the ideas in the thesis and build off of them, but no-one should be copying and pasting large chunks of someone else's thesis, even if they are rewording it. Besides, anyone who builds off of his work will only contain a brief summary and citation in their writing, as they will spend the bulk of their writing talking about their improvements, and that length should be considered fair use anyway.

    2. Re:Say WHAT? by kylemonger · · Score: 3, Insightful

      With Google around, plagiarists would have to be idiots to try it at this point.

      What I want to do when I read a paper is learn something I can use to make my code better, or to learn that the problem is way harder than I thought and I need to find a workaround. The problem these days is actually being able to read papers without being affiliated with a university, because so many papers are behind publisher paywalls or trapped on internal-only university servers. Someone having to pay what a textbook costs to read a ten year old paper is probably not what the author had in mind when they wrote it.

      Please whatever copyright you use, post the paper online so bright but indigent students can read it.

    3. Re:Say WHAT? by Repossessed · · Score: 1

      It's fairly common to cut and paste charts and graphs without violating plagiarism standards.

      --
      Liberte, Egalite, Fraternite (TM)
  17. Copyright vs a license by slew · · Score: 2

    IANAL, but I think you are confused a bit between copyright and your license to use the work and patents for the ideas...

    Your thesis is essentially "automagically" copyrighted the date that you write it (at least in the US). You may gain additional protections by asserting your copyright (via a simple notice asserting copyright), or registering the copyright (with the government). At a minimum, usually people incluse a copyright to clarify ownership. Typically, you own the copyright to your thesis (unless for some reason it can considered a work-for-hire say about some work sponsored by some company like if they paid your tuition or gave you money for research).

    If you do own it, you can do whatever you want to license it. You can publish your terms for a license as to what sort of copyrights you are asserting as part of your document, but it isn't actually required (or necessarily binding either athough it can be used as evidence of an implied license). However, if you don't really own it, asserting ownership and including an implied license might get you in trouble (say if the real owner didn't like your giving any rights away with your included license and the infringer simply said that she relied on your statement, you might be on the hook for some damages).

    Normally, it would be just enough to say that you have a copyright on it and be done with it. People can still reference it via fair-use and the actual ideas in your thesis may or may-not be patentable (since the US is now a first-to-file country, you are probably screwed in case someone wanted to steal yur ideas) copyright simply doesn't matter in these cases. As a general rule, you can't release your work to the public domain "with-a-catch". If it's public-domain, it's public-domain. If you care about someone stealing it out of the public domain, you really have to assert a copyright on it and keep it (or donate the copyright to someone you trust to keep it).

    There is, however, a small technicality that you probably need to have answered first. How would someone stumble upon your thesis? Is it *published* somewhere? or is it just on your own personal website (essentially self-published). If it is published somewhere, the publisher may want to assert some copyright on that (unless is is just a university publication which sometimes doesn't care). For example, if you put a paper in an IEEE journal, the IEEE will want copyright assigned to them (so they can sell the journal) as a condition of publishing your paper. If this is the case, you actually don't have much of a choice in the matter.

    1. Re:Copyright vs a license by garcia · · Score: 0

      Your thesis is essentially "automagically" copyrighted the date that you write it (at least in the US). You may gain additional protections by asserting your copyright (via a simple notice asserting copyright), or registering the copyright (with the government). At a minimum, usually people incluse a copyright to clarify ownership. Typically, you own the copyright to your thesis (unless for some reason it can considered a work-for-hire say about some work sponsored by some company like if they paid your tuition or gave you money for research).

      And it's basically meaningless if anyone steals your work, republishes it, and you don't have the money to fight them in court when you want to sue them.

      However, if you register your copyright (which costs money), then you are provided with the ability to be awarded legal fees if you win your case in a court of law.

      IOW, automatic copyright is useless especially in today's world of theft first, apologize later/never.

  18. Science is based on open information sharing by presidenteloco · · Score: 4, Insightful

    (with proper attribution)

    Any restriction on this is a despicable attack on the advancement of science.

    Current journal paywalls ought to be against the law. They ensure that only academia
    at the richest institutions have full access to other scientists' work.

    Academics at poorer institutions, here and around the world, and amateur researchers
    who may be just as intelligent as the established, are shut out. It is an outrageous
    and unjustifiable situation.

    We need a different economic model to pay for the service of editing and coordinating
    peer review. Maybe that cost ought to be covered by a journal submission fee.
    Hardcopy publication is now officially not needed, nor should we be paying hardcopy publishing
    companies just for the right to view the online published information. That's rubbish, and
    it's harmful to the progress of knowledge.

    --

    Where are we going and why are we in a handbasket?
    1. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      When you're ready to provide that different model for academic publishing (and pay for the transition and support for its administration), please let us know. Until then you're just another asshole telling people how they ought to act against their own interests, and against the quite valuable prevailing model of academic publication.
       
      "Amateur researchers" include the worst of the cranks and religionists, who rightly face enormous hurdles to publication in respected journals.
       
      And you think a poll tax is the answer? I'm not calling you a socialist or a loon; I'm calling you a moron.

    2. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by pz · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This is a remarkably naive viewpoint. I am responding only because it has been modded (at this point) to +3.

      Journals who require payment for full text or PDF download do not "ensure that only academia and the richest institutions have full access ..." I work at one of the oldest and most famous institutions in the world. Many of the journals where my peers publish are not on the subscription list, and thus I must pay for each access. So, that assertion is not true.

      Each paper costs perhaps $10 to $20. Please show me someone who is smart and motivated enough to be able to contribute to scientific thought and advancement who cannot afford that on occasion. And yes, I pay for those articles out of my own pocket.

      Before the Internet, we had manuscript request cards where, if you saw a paper referenced, you could send a card to the author, and they would mail you back a hardcopy of the manuscript. Up until a few years ago, I would still get one every now and then from somewhere in the far east or Africa. The cost for those is a stamp and a postcard. Please show me someone -- anyone, even one person -- who is sane enough to be able to contribute to science and cannot afford that.

      Even now, most publishers allow authors to post PDFs of their work on the author's private web site. If you can afford internet access, you can get nearly every paper. If you can't get one immediately, you can still send email to the author and request a copy in the email equivalent of the post cards from yesteryear. Please show me anyone -- even one person -- who can afford internet access who cannot get email access and request PDFs, or printed manuscripts, that way.

      Yes, it is not quite as convenient as being able to immediately download manuscripts from the publisher's web sites as soon as they are published. Boo-hoo. I can't afford to live in the best neighborhood, and that impedes my ability to be a professional scientist because I have a longer commute. Is that also despicable? Should I be allowed to live in the best areas for no cost just because I *want* to?

      Modern science, in most but not all fields, is an expensive proposition. The days of amateur scientists making serious contributions in all but a small number of areas are long gone. Saying that we must make all access free (and thus eliminating the valuable filtering service that the journals provide) is a nice pipe-dream but is not rooted in reality. Furthermore, a smart and sufficiently motivated person can make contributions to science -- I had an intern two summers ago who overcame some serious hurdles, including coming from a third-world country, stayed 1-1/2 months in my lab and did enough work to have two publications come out of it -- and not having immediate and free access to all articles is not a limiting factor.

      --

      Put my fist through my alarm clock with its ding-dong death inside my ear. - The Blackjacks.
    3. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by SteveFoerster · · Score: 1

      We need a different economic model to pay for the service of editing and coordinating peer review. Maybe that cost ought to be covered by a journal submission fee. Hardcopy publication is now officially not needed, nor should we be paying hardcopy publishing companies just for the right to view the online published information. That's rubbish, and it's harmful to the progress of knowledge.

      The different model is that academics do this as part of their commitment to service. What's in it for them is that, since reputation is the coin of the academic realm, by serving on editorial boards their own status as an expert is promoted. There are already plenty of journals that work this way. Hard copy is oldthink, let those few readers who want to kill trees to read a journal use print on demand.

      --
      Space game using normal deck of cards: http://BattleCards.org
    4. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by SteveFoerster · · Score: 1

      When you're ready to provide that different model for academic publishing (and pay for the transition and support for its administration), please let us know. Until then you're just another asshole telling people how they ought to act against their own interests, and against the quite valuable prevailing model of academic publication.

      The prevailing model is valuable only to commercial publishers, and their interests are the only ones who are threatened by open access. Good riddance!

      --
      Space game using normal deck of cards: http://BattleCards.org
    5. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      (posting from my phone)

      In my field I have published over 2,000 articles over the years - over 100 in peer reviewed journals.

      The model needs to change.

      Most of these research papers are funded by public research dollars.

      Those research dollars paid by publication fees to the publishers (yes, we have to PAY THEM to publish our papers).

      Others do the peer review for FREE (I know I have never been paid to do a peer review - and I have done many)

      The publishing houses get the publication fee (which can be substantial), charge for the journal (again, not the cost of popular science), charge for database access (again, fairly good $$ in this alone), and charge more for individual papers (The best part is that they all claim they are poor doing so!)

      For what, exactly?

      The NIH got it right requiring all NIH funded research to be published in pubmed.

      The public should have access to them.

      It's no longer the 1800's or even the 1900's. Its 2011, and its time to open the flood gates of information.

    6. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The editing/distribution costs of running a journal are nowhere near as high as the subscription prices would suggest, but they are non-trivial. What if university libraries took over this job (as well as academics who write and referee and curate for "free" a.k.a. the university funds them to do this in the name of science)? Surely for the cost of half a dozen anual subscriptions every academic library could instead hire several people full time to handle the logistics of "publishing," the quality control would happen via peer review as it does today, and the results could be distributed freely, ending up in lower overal costs to institutions and academics.

    7. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What an incredibly stupid viewpoint!

      "Boo-hoo"?! Wow, dude...

      Instant online access to all academic papers would *obviously* accelerate advances in all fields of research. Any expense or inconvenience simply introduces pointless waste in the process.

      Also, having all papers freely available online would allow automated searches and inferences to be made. For example, consider the story of the former Reddit co-owner -- now only 20 year old -- who was arrested for "excessive JSTOR downloads". With access to all of the documents he downloaded, he was able to derive novel and significant facts. That's the kind of research that is hindered by limited access to documents. As "automated scientists" and other bots rival the inference abilities of humans, access to research data will be even more crucial to rapid technological development.

    8. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by smallfries · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Not every field operates the same way. Perhaps you only need to access other papers "on occasion". In my field I need to check 50-100 papers during the research that goes into every one that I write. Why is it reasonable for me to be charged $500-2000 by publishers to access research that they did not create? Not all publishers allow private copies of papers to be hosted on a researcher's website. I trust that your field is not dominated by the IEEE and ACM?

      Free access does not imply lack of review. Your point about journals providing filtering is flawed - just look at any of the newer open access journals in CS that do provide filtering by reviewing.

      --
      Slashdot: where don knuth is an idiot because he cant grasp the awesome power of php
    9. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yes, modern science is expensive. But that cost does not come out of the journal publishers' pockets. It is funded by taxpayers and private investors. Furthermore, the editors and reviewers of the journals are scientists in the filed. They don't get any monetary compensation for their work. So journals have a crazy sweet business model: they get copyrights to a product that was completely created without any cost to them and then they get to sell it back to the community who created the product.

      Publishers are an ADDITIONAL and UNNECESSARY cost to doing science. The service they provide nowadays is trivial. You could organize and publish a journal on the internet for a fraction of the price (and people do). We are stuck with payed journals because they have good impact factors (resulting from past publications). Individual scientists need to publish in high impact factor journals to progress in their careers. So it's very hard to break the cycle.

      But make no mistake: this is not capitalism. No value is being generated by the journals (at least not close to how much they charge, by any stretch of the imagination). In the XXI century, conventional payed scientific journals are a bug. And we have to debug the system sooner or later.

    10. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Your reasons are completely understandable, but as a hobby programmer I can't afford a pile of papers every evening when I don't even know if the contents has any practical usage or is relevant for what I need (abstracts are very vague on practical implementations). Looking for papers on Google very often dead-ends on a paywall. If your PDF paper is not directly linked form relevant Wikipedia pages, I'm not even going to waste time looking for it.
      This could very well result in me inventing something very similar to your paper. This only wastes my time, not yours, but don't expect me to acknowledge or even attribute your paper.

    11. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      So the open access movement (which the GP tries to summarize) has a "remarably naive viewpoint" and only merits commenting because it got modded up on /.?

      While the demand for a general prohibition of paywalls seems indeed over the top to me, the rest of GPs post is reasonable enough.

      Two points I would like to add are:
      - In many areas, research is primarily government-sponsored. So governments pay the people who write the publications, pay the people who do the reviewing, and then should pay some companies for the access to the publication as well?
      - Whenever research is payed for by the taxpayers, they have a valid interest to see the result, without further costs. OA accomplishes that as well.

      The wikipedia page of OA is a good starting point for further information: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_access

      BTW, your comparison to neighborhoods fails because immaterial goods are fundamentally different from material goods.

    12. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      So the GP was naive? Your argument seems to really miss the point. What does the science get from lining up publisher stockholders with ridiculous profits? Surely with your experience you must also know that all the hard lifting (peer review, sometimes editing) is done pro-bono by researchers and judging by the profit margins of eg. Elsevier the bureaucracy isn't really that expensive.

      Also if you have to pay per-paper, there should be some kind of refunding systems; a lot (most?) of articles nowadays are hastily pushed out crap to meet the quota. And the publishing houses of course have no problem with the quantity-over-quality system.

    13. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Modern science, in most but not all fields, is an expensive proposition. The days of amateur scientists making serious contributions in all but a small number of areas are long gone.

      Yeah, those tiny minuscule areas, like that silly computer stuff. I mean who does it these days? I heard we're going back to real world things once this logical wanking fiasco is over.

    14. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is exactly right. The crucial function of journals nowadays is the filtering service---filtering out what's worth reading and what's not. And this is done by peer review which, as you correct point out, is done for free by other researchers, not by the publisher of the journal. The only real service that the publisher provides is dissemination of the journal. Back when this meant typesetting, printing, and shipping paper copies, this was a real service. But now, when we just pull pdfs off a server (especially when most of the typesetting of said pdfs is done by the authors anyway), the benefit of a publishing house is negligible.

    15. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      let me see if I understand correctly:

      1. you pay to create your thesis.
      2. people pay to access your thesis.
      3. you don't get a dime when people access your thesis.
      4. you work in a research institution and therefore you are underpaid.
      5. when you need to access things written by others, the money comes from your own pocket.
      6. usually science got ahead by people who cultivated themselves their whole life, and only people who had all their life solved (meaning food, housing, clothing and a lot of time in their hand) could do so. usually they were members of nobility, living under the resources of taxes and under a well oiled burocratic machinery. what I'm trying to say is that science has always been expensive, but it is only in the past hundred years that governments have put their fingers in it, making it a feud where only friends and family may get into, and where political tendencies have a lot more to say than brain power. resources may be all time high, but in comparison the amount of real scientific advance is catastrophic, merely because political officials in charge of science are eager to show their great successes in order to get more funding, so they put scientifics in the ridicule scenario where they live like monks devoted to poverty, because "science is so expensive now", yet they have nothing to show for the huge expense they make. lack of brains is all I can see in science now.
      7. having people from third world countries (meaning he is working for you for free, because that's his best option and no one else in their mind would do the same) is not something to be proud of neither.

      I wouldn't be so proud if I was being skinned alive like you mention you are, as to need to take advantage of poorer people.

      This is a remarkably naive viewpoint. I am responding only because it has been modded (at this point) to +3.

      Journals who require payment for full text or PDF download do not "ensure that only academia and the richest institutions have full access ..." I work at one of the oldest and most famous institutions in the world. Many of the journals where my peers publish are not on the subscription list, and thus I must pay for each access. So, that assertion is not true.

      Each paper costs perhaps $10 to $20. Please show me someone who is smart and motivated enough to be able to contribute to scientific thought and advancement who cannot afford that on occasion. And yes, I pay for those articles out of my own pocket.

      Before the Internet, we had manuscript request cards where, if you saw a paper referenced, you could send a card to the author, and they would mail you back a hardcopy of the manuscript. Up until a few years ago, I would still get one every now and then from somewhere in the far east or Africa. The cost for those is a stamp and a postcard. Please show me someone -- anyone, even one person -- who is sane enough to be able to contribute to science and cannot afford that.

      Even now, most publishers allow authors to post PDFs of their work on the author's private web site. If you can afford internet access, you can get nearly every paper. If you can't get one immediately, you can still send email to the author and request a copy in the email equivalent of the post cards from yesteryear. Please show me anyone -- even one person -- who can afford internet access who cannot get email access and request PDFs, or printed manuscripts, that way.

      Yes, it is not quite as convenient as being able to immediately download manuscripts from the publisher's web sites as soon as they are published. Boo-hoo. I can't afford to live in the best neighborhood, and that impedes my ability to be a professional scientist because I have a longer commute. Is that also despicable? Should I be allowed to live in the best areas for no cost just because I *want* to?

      Modern science, in most but not all fields, is an expensive proposition. The days of amateur scientists making serious contributions in all bu

    16. Re:Science is based on open information sharing by presidenteloco · · Score: 1

      I would point out that Albert Einstein (patent clerk),
      Isaac Newton, "Newton's private studies at his home in Woolsthorpe over the subsequent two years saw the development of his theories on calculus, optics and the law of gravitation."
      and Charles Darwin were all amateur researchers at the time they developed their major scientific breakthroughs.

      Also, kudos for insulting me based on a complete misreading of what I said about how to pay for it.

      --

      Where are we going and why are we in a handbasket?
  19. Re:You did check with your department first, right by RyoShin · · Score: 1

    This. When I wrote my thesis (for my bachelor's in CompSci), my Thesis department basically said "this is a work for hire, we own the rights to it, you can share it personally for academic pursuits" or something along those lines.

  20. Re:You did check with your department first, right by camperdave · · Score: 1

    Work for hire? Who pays whom when a thesis is written? I always thought it was the student paying (indirectly through tuition) the professor. How can this be a work for hire?

    --
    When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
  21. one i've used by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Copyright © September 2011 by XXXXXXX. All rights reserved. This
    document is hereby made freely available for the use of any and
    all worldwide. Permission is granted to anyone to make or
    distribute verbatim copies of this document, in any medium,
    provided that, except with written permission, the text remains
    unaltered, and this copyright notice and permission notice are
    preserved. Except with written permission, no charge
    whatsoever for redistribution may be made.

  22. Re:You did check with your department first, right by RyoShin · · Score: 1

    The thesis program at my campus is a joint progress between the campus thesis department and the internship the student undertakes. Every senior's thesis is about a real-world project that they develop and implement at the company they intern with; some theses have saved companies millions of dollars or increased the efficiency in processes by two or three times. Because of this, they are often seen as "works for hire"; the company is given the option up-front to make the thesis "protected" (not their term, but I forget the actual phrase) which means it's not viewable by the public (the college maintains a small library with all past theses).

    "Work for hire" might be the wrong terminology, but there were copyright issues at work when I went through my thesis.

  23. Departmental standard format by MikeUW · · Score: 1

    If your school/department is at least somewhat organized, they will already have guidelines stipulated on the format of the thesis document, and these guidelines would include a pre-defined copyright notice that you must include. That's been my experience at two different Universities, and as far as I am aware, it's not an option to swap in my own copyright notice.

    All it really does is ensure that the University owns full rights to republish the work - but so do I.

  24. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    What school did you go to? I need to make sure to recommend no one ever attend it.

  25. Put it on a preprint server by hweimer · · Score: 1

    Better yet, put it on a preprint server such as the arXiv. That way, you also get a Linus-style backup of your thesis for free.

    --
    OS Reviews: Free and Open Source Software
  26. You should own it by Grampa+John · · Score: 1

    At Minnesota, where I teach, and where I did my Masters and Ph.D. theses, students and faculty own copyright to their original work, including scholarly work (papers, theses, etc.) and original course materials. See http://policy.umn.edu/Policies/Research/COPYRIGHT.html for details. My understanding is that this arrangement is extremely common in the U.S. I am a strong advocate of open source and creative commons, but in this case I would encourage you to simply copyright your thesis. That does not mean others cannot use it, it just means that they must attribute the work to you, and cannot claim it as their own.

  27. post it online; problem solved by bcrowell · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I am wrapping up an MS. In the past I have had problems getting copies of others' work, due to lack of copyright notices on their thesis or dissertation. I don't want that happen to me.

    Post a digital copy online. Problem solved. As long as a digital copy is available for free online, others will have access to it, regardless of its copyright status. If you're in a field like physics, you could post it on arxiv.org. If you're in a field that doesn't have anything like arxiv, just post it on your own site, or on a site such as scribd.

    1. Re:post it online; problem solved by TranceThrust · · Score: 2

      Yep, exactly what parent says. I don't see any problem (what more, I have not encountered problems) with just reserving all rights for yourself (copyright by you, as is (should be) possible with any respectable university), and then distributing it yourself, over the internet. Free and open access, and nobody can legally run off with it or put it on shady websites.

  28. Copyright by yar · · Score: 1

    What country are you in? Copyright law is going to be different in different places, at least a bit.

    What university are you at? Some universities require students' to turn over copyright in their work (although many don't). Some universities also have requirements or restrictions on how you may license the work- the most common one I've seen recently is requiring students to allow the library to provide an electronic version.

    Assuming US law, part of your statement is redundant; someone else can't legally claim copyright in your work, either published excerpts or its entirety.

    Your pirate/steal bit is a bit confusing, even without the normal misuse of the terms to describe infringement. ;) If something is in the public domain, anyone can use it for any purpose, commercial or not. Once you've put it in the public domain, in this situation it probably can't be taken out of the public domain. (It would be nice to say that can never happen for any reason, but there is some precedent for some foreign works that probably doesn't apply here).

    Creative Commons does sound like your best bet- check it out. ^^

  29. Re:If Your Thesis Had Any Value... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Score:-1 Asshole

  30. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Dyinobal · · Score: 3

    So basically your shit got stolen by corporate thugs who held your education for ransom?

  31. What ought to be said by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Your thesis will not be put to commercial use no matter the "license" because it interests no one. It will be bound cheaply with all the others and it will sit in a library and it will be forgotten. It is not important. The world is indifferent to it because it is not important. You are not important because you have jumped through this hoop. You are one of millions and you are not important.

  32. Best copyright notice by phantomfive · · Score: 5, Funny
    Best copyright notice I know of came from Woody Guthrie:

    “This song is Copyrighted in U.S., under Seal of Copyright # 154085, for a period of 28 years, and anybody caught singin it without our permission, will be mighty good friends of ourn, cause we don’t give a dern. Publish it. Write it. Sing it. Swing to it. Yodel it. We wrote it, that’s all we wanted to do.”

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    1. Re:Best copyright notice by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I suggest going the opposite direction and using the "My Precious" copyright.
      It's yours and no one else's, and if someone takes it they've been warned you reserve the right to stalk them.

  33. Really? This is your best effort? by RedLeg · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Warning: --Flammable Objects ahead!--

    You're polishing your thesis, the crown jewel of a Masters of Science degree, and you can't figure this one out on your own?

    Worse, you ask HERE!?!

    Hint: Perhaps you should harness some of the experience in researching that you've piled into the past 5-7 years of academia, along with INSIDER ACCESS to academia to get an answer and recommendation worthy of consideration. Does your university have a law school? Go find a member of the legal faculty with some modern clue in the field of intellectual property.

    On the other hand, you could rely on the 2^n monkeys on the Internet banging random crapola into keyboards to eventually come up with the "right answer".

    Oh, wait......

    ( Sheesh.... )

    Red

  34. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "embargo" is the term of art for withholding the thesis, usually these are set to expire after there is no longer some commercial value to protect (sometimes the thesis will turn into a book, or it will disclose some trade secrets).

    In the large state owned higher education corporation where I work copyright is owned by the student, but patent and trade secret issues could also be involved.

    I would use CC-BY-Attribution in OPs case. I can't imagine why the graduate division or the department would care (unless they are marketing the material in the works as some sort of publication or reports?)

  35. Re:You did check with your department first, right by RyoShin · · Score: 1

    Not quite. The copyright doesn't differ to them entirely, even if it's a protected thesis, but you are also limited in how you can distribute it yourself, even if it's public.

    But for your thesis to be accepted by the college, it has to first be approved by the corporation; there are methods to get around this in case there's a falling out or the company otherwise drops out of the internship program, but I hear they're hard and time-consuming. So, yeah, the corporation can hold your education for ransom if you get a dick boss.

  36. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    He may also want to check stuff he signed when signing up for the program. He may have already assigned the rights to the school.

  37. Check your submission forms by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I recently finished an ME myself, as part of this I had to submit digital copies to my university's library. Reading through those submission forms they automatically put it under one of the CC licenses. Where you are doing yours might as well.

  38. Just put the date on it by pem · · Score: 1
    I don't normally care about the copyright if it's a document on the web, because I can just point people at the original.

    But I do care about when something was written.

    It is mind-boggling how many academic papers out there that don't have a damn date on them.

    C'mon people -- if you want to help out the knowledge of the world, you're not being serious if you can't help us put it in a timeline.

  39. Re:Really? This is your best effort? by johnwbyrd · · Score: 1

    Mod parent up +1 for truth.

  40. Re:You did check with your department first, right by RoFLKOPTr · · Score: 2

    my Thesis department basically said "this is a work for hire, we own the rights to it, you can share it personally for academic pursuits" or something along those lines.

    That's such bullshit. If the institution paid you to write a thesis, then it would be a work for hire, but actually YOU pay the INSTITUTION to LET you write a thesis for them. How the hell can they claim copyright over it?

  41. It's your copyright by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Posting anonymously for obvious reasons...

    First of all, it's your copyright to do what you want when you want. There's nothing preventing you from keeping all rights to yourself, then later republishing it under a creative commons or other license. In fact I suggest you do that, because if whatever you have is valuable someone will claim it.

    So what, you say? I was threatened with a lawsuit by my former advisor. Basically I failed to copyright my code, and he had the university license it to his company. I wanted to use the code, and he said I couldn't because it wasn't mine. He was probably wrong, but I couldn't afford a lawsuit so I had to let it go. Later I learned that his threat wasn't an idle one--he ended up suing a former student.

    Put a copy of your entire codebase as an appendix in your thesis. No one hesitated when I wrote "Copyright me. All rights reserved." I suspect there's a good bit of case law about the work you do for your education belonging to you. Putting your stamp on it makes it a lot easier, I suspect. IANAL though.

    1. Re:It's your copyright by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 1

      All you have to do to copyright something is to publish it. You don't even need to explicitly say "copyright XXXX" in the published code or text, but it is a warning. When someone publishes something, it's automatically copyrighted to them. If you register a copyright with the Library of Congress you're entitled to triple damages if someone infringes the copyright, otherwise it's just 1x damages, but the registration is not the copyright itself - publishing is. However, registering at LoC is another warning to an infringer that you know what you're doing, that you'll act to defend, and that you're serious.

      If you had just published your code on some website that gets archived reliably somewhere with a timestamp, including Google or archive.org, you'd have had all the evidence you need to crush your prof. You'd have gotten an adequate lawyer to defend you without fronting them their fees, since it's open and shut and a good investment for the lawyer.

      If the LoC offered the registration service as a simple Web form that archives and timestamps anything published on which copyright can be claimed, the entire process would be simple. Lawyers would defend such cases without asking for payment up front, since the triple damages would ensure any case the defendant had any value in perpetrating would fairly quickly and solidly pay the lawyer suing them for you.

      --

      --
      make install -not war

  42. ND ? you're on crack. by oneiros27 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Please do not *ever* recommend ND for anything of this nature again.

    Think about it -- research builds upon other research. That's the whole point of publishing research.

    We *want* people to build on the work. ND *specifically* tells people 'you're not allowed to do *anything* with my research'. SA's another messy one, as it sets a restriction on derivatives.

    The best thing authors should do is to make sure that they don't lose their rights to the document, so that they can re-distribute the paper, no matter what stupidity the journal publishers do. And for that, see Creative Common's Scholar's Copyright Project:
            http://sciencecommons.org/projects/publishing/

    --
    Build it, and they will come^Hplain.
  43. Re:You did check with your department first, right by ThorGod · · Score: 0

    Yeah, I agree. Placing an embargo (thanks to the poster below for the term) on someone's thesis is one step too far. Yeah, the thesis demonstrates the student's ability to research and so on - but, it's also some marginal increase in knowledge. Knowledge is supposed to be free flowing in academia. Benefit all humanity and all that...

    --
    PS: I don't reply to ACs.
  44. Distribute it youself. by SETIGuy · · Score: 1

    If you've got a web site and you can download your thesis from there, then it doesn't matter the terms because you haven't transferred exclusive electronic distribution rights to your University or a third party. Then, just to be sure, copy it to a preprint server that doesn't allow revocation of distribution rights. for example arXiv, or the equivalent in your field. At that point you've at least guaranteed distribution rights.

  45. Upload it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Upload it to a porn site.

  46. Public Domain by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 1

    Public domain protects anyone else from copyrighting it, but of course doesn't prevent anyone else from copying it. Claiming it as their own and trying to enforce copyright would be fraud, but someone might possibly try it. Public domain will not prevent anyone from removing attribution to you, or prevent anyone from doing anything else with the content except possibly prevent them from (successfully) claiming it as their own (if you or someone else challenges them).

    A license like a Creative Commons one could do all that the public domain does, but also require attribution to you, and make it easier in court (or in threatening letters) to prevent others from falsely claiming your work or interfering with distribution through a frauduent copyright claim.

    But in any case you'd have to actually do something to prevent someone else from doing something with what you publish.

    --

    --
    make install -not war

    1. Re:Public Domain by chrismcb · · Score: 1

      Just to agree with the parent. You can't "steal" something out of public domain. You can only copyright something that you created. If someone else created and released it to public domain, well it is now in public domain. If someone comes along and copies it, then copyrights it... well anyone else can go to the public domain version and still copy it.

  47. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    And if you don't like that situation, the solution is to not sign up for the internship in the first place.

  48. Do not "release" copyright! by bugnuts · · Score: 1

    Grant "Usage Rights".

    I'd go with the Creative Commons language, posted earlier. It will do what you want and has been examined by lawyers.

  49. we enjoy slashdot editors stirring the pot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This was pretty good, but I prefer "ask slashdot" articles of the form "I have 5 million dollars to create "the computer center of the future" but my boss is an idiot, and what game card do slashdotters think I should use here? Also is it OK to put a comfy chair in the machine room?" When I was a kid, car mags use to run articles like "Porsche or Corvette - which is really better"? You need to keep the reader involved or they'll lose attention.

  50. Re:ND ? you're on crack. by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 1

    can you explain why ND is bad? As far as I can tell, it just means that you can't make a derivative of the work itself. In research, you're not supposed to change someone else's research into your own; you're supposed to build on it: i.e., take the idea in it, then write your own story of that idea. ND allows for it, because it applies to the exact text of the dissertation, not the idea behind it.

    Then again, IANAL, and I would love to get some input from someone with more understanding of these terms.

    --
    Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
  51. The 'right' license... by iajrz · · Score: 1

    CC By SA

  52. Treat it as a preprint by NoSig · · Score: 1

    Do what everyone else does with preprint papers in your field. I don't know what people do with preprints in your field, but a MS thesis isn't peer reviewed in the way papers are, so it fits nicely in the preprint category assuming you've actually done at least a tiny amount of work that qualifies as original research. Ask what researchers do with preprints in your field and then do that. Even better, ask your adviser what you should do with your MS thesis. If you are going to to publish papers with your master's thesis work in it, then you may want to downplay your thesis in favor of those papers.

    1. Re:Treat it as a preprint by infodragon · · Score: 1

      Sorry about this but I can't think of any other way to contact you... I've discovered a bug with slashdot, I'm waiting on a response from them before I post in our other discussion. It's odd I can mod your most recent comment even though I've clearly posted in that story.

      --
      If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.
    2. Re:Treat it as a preprint by NoSig · · Score: 1

      Hi! :) well, I'm fine with you responding here, if Slashdot isn't up to continuing the conversation in the other thread. Might get an off-topic mod at some point, though.

    3. Re:Treat it as a preprint by infodragon · · Score: 1

      Now this is weird, I can mod your comment I'm responding to. I just posted today, this is very weird (aka bug). Respond to this post and I'll mod it up one and we'll see if it sticks.

      --
      If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.
    4. Re:Treat it as a preprint by NoSig · · Score: 1

      Free karma! :)

    5. Re:Treat it as a preprint by infodragon · · Score: 1

      When I tried to mod you +1 I got "You've already posted something in this discussion." I also got an email from slashdot, I think they're working on it. In any case the option to mod shouldn't be coming up. It only happens to the posts after I've posted, so I didn't have the option to mod comments prior to my posts.

      --
      If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.
  53. Re:ND ? you're on crack. by Repossessed · · Score: 2

    'derivative' would include something like grabbing a copy of a chart or a table of figures published in the first paper. I don't write papers, so I'm not sure how much of a pain in the ass it would be to remake them (though I imagine a lot, since raw data usually isn't included), but I see this tactic uses very very frequently in secondary papers.

    --
    Liberte, Egalite, Fraternite (TM)
  54. its another mine for the field by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Under the copyright portion of the code (17 USC s 101):

    A “derivative work” is a work based upon one or more preexisting works, such as a translation, musical arrangement, dramatization, fictionalization, motion picture version, sound recording, art reproduction, abridgment, condensation, or any other form in which a work may be recast, transformed, or adapted. A work consisting of editorial revisions, annotations, elaborations, or other modifications which, as a whole, represent an original work of authorship, is a “derivative work”.

    That definition include EVERYTHING that uses the original in ANY way. If you paraphrase or quote the original (or get too close to the phrasing of the original) you are building off of it (the particular expression, not the idea itself) and it is a derivative work. The real question is whether the use of the derivative is fair (the "fair use" balancing test), with the key being how much you transformed the work. In most cases this is so simple that people don't even think twice (a work took the plot of star-crossed lovers from another but in a completely new type of modern circumstance or that is a properly attributed one sentence quote). But in other cases, it can be much more difficult. The last thing a researcher wants is to have to worry about is whether his use is legally "fair" and instead should be allowed to do it, only bound by the ethics of the field.

    While we are talking about mines, Share-alike is similar. It is a poison. Just look here. Someone uses by-sa and another uses by-sa-nc, you have to pick which you like better because you cannot use both.

    1. Re:its another mine for the field by Goaway · · Score: 1

      That definition include EVERYTHING that uses the original in ANY way.

      Not at all. It is pretty obvious it refers to transformations of the entire work, not just usage of parts of it.

    2. Re:its another mine for the field by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That may be what it looks like to you but the poster put "sometimes [fair use] is so obvious that people don't even think twice." It is a derivative work if you use enough of it that a reasonable person would realize that you are using or building off of another. This is because of the use of the words "transformed" and "modified." (Heck, the license itself, in the effective language that makes it the ND license, says the work can be used "as long as it is passed along unchanged and IN WHOLE." If using parts of it don't make a work "derivative" then why does the license have to specify you have to use the whole thing to prevent derivative use?)

      Both of those are much broader than using, and the law cannot draw, the line at the "entire" work; otherwise, for example, you would have TV shows based off of books get away scott-free because they left out a character and did some minor rewrites of the existing one. Or, a data table in your work wouldn't be protected from copying since they didn't use the whole thing. That is why they use the reasonable person test.

      Now it does not apply to the underlying idea, but the specific expression of it. However, even small parts, especially in a research paper, are such that a reasonable person would knows that you are building off of the particular expression of the idea. Or maybe not, but the key is you are adding another headache for the researcher to consider. Completely different question mentioned here is that maybe you want to have that additional headache.

      Of course, if it is a derivative work, you can still get out of it if the use counts as "fair use" because you don't need a license for that. But that is a completely different type of headache.

    3. Re:its another mine for the field by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The language mentioned in the first paragraph in the parentheses appears here next to BY-ND.

  55. Re:Really? This is your best effort? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I can't think of anything worse to do than seek legal advice from your school regarding your thesis. Sorry.

  56. Re:You did check with your department first, right by RyoShin · · Score: 2

    Because my work place did pay me to write the thesis. Again, it was a joint-venture of sorts; that's mainly where the whole copyright thing comes in.

  57. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    so basically you can't do an actual academic thesis because it has to be for some company? sounds like a real top tier university you have going here...

  58. Two words for the OP: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Thesis advisor.
    (I'm in the Cal State system, ie, possibly the most broke still-functioning institution of higher education in the entire country, and they still provide for us people who'll review your thesis and make sure the technical details are all OK)

  59. Re:Really? This is your best effort? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    flames

    dude, it wasn't a serious question, it was just "look at me!"

  60. Re:You did check with your department first, right by rve · · Score: 1

    You sound bitter... maybe you should consider finding another employer?

    By the way, if you can't stand calculus, that doesn't mean you can't get any degree, just not a science degree. It's not like those are the only ones worth anything.

  61. Re:Really? This is your best effort? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yeah, that makes sense. Spend five minutes submitting this post directed towards a group that includes many people associated with or well-versed in free/libre/open copyright issues; or spend an hour or two tracking down which faculty would have an appropriate legal background -- assuming there are any, which is a HUGE assumption -- making an appointment, hiking over to their office, and taking a meeting with them. Boy, aren't you brilliant?

  62. You are the author, but you are not alone here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You are the author of the thesis and seem to have right to do anything with the paper, but you can not just slap any sort of copyright over that paper either, because your university will want it's share.

  63. Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I am confused by the question. Copyright does not restrict others' right to read only their right to make copies, and in a practical sense distribute those copies. In academia there is always a requirement for proper attribution. The practical problem for you I am guessing is protecting your right to copy which you would lose if the university held the copyright. Also, commercial use may need to go through your university as the university may own all work produced in the course of your study. If you think there is commercial potential, check with the schools licensing office.

    Please clarify your question. I really don't see how a lack of copyright notice could impede your ability to obtain published material.

    This must be some master's

  64. Thesis, article. What's the difference? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't bother, nobody will ever read it.

  65. "Pay" doesn't just mean "to give someone cash" by LrdDimwit · · Score: 1

    This is an odd case that demonstrates why words in legal senses have complex convoluted meanings. To "pay" someone is not necessarily to give them money. To "pay" is to give another entity a thing of value in exchange for services or goods they have rendered you.

    In this case, you pay the school cash money and in exchange they allow you to attend classes and receive credit and so on. But they also are giving you things that are valuable: Course credit. Course credit, and degrees, are essentially the university using their reputation to enhance yours. Anyone can learn the content that is covered by a course; people pay a University so they will run you through a process designed to officially recognize that you have learned the content.

    So you do some work for the University, and in exchange, they give you course credit - a thing of value. Thus they are saying it is a work for hire, that they 'paid' you for your work ... just not in cash.

    1. Re:"Pay" doesn't just mean "to give someone cash" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Seriously? What university accepts any kind of trade or barter other than cash?

  66. Hustling by pRock85 · · Score: 1

    These days, however much you want to put your work out there for any one to use, some one may try find a way to make a dollar off it with out even giving credit.

    1. Re:Hustling by eyenot · · Score: 1

      Entirely true. You can only protect your rights within your own nationality -- it could be airtight and perfect for your needs (whatever protection you come up with) and somebody from China or Turky will still distribute it in some way that earns them American cash or Euros.

      --
      "Stratigraphically the origin of agriculture and thermonuclear destruction will appear essentially simultaneous" -- Lee
  67. Re:Really? This is your best effort? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That was my first thought too.
    Then I realised that this guy apparently does not know how to properly use citations.

    It could be that that is a common problem in some kind of fields. Just haven't seen it in computer science.
    (I'll give you a hint: BibTex has an @masterthesis entry.)

  68. In the UK? your uni might own the copyright by fantomas · · Score: 1

    Not sure where you're writing from but I am pretty sure when I started my PhD in the UK the documents said the university owned the copyright on all the work I produced. Go back to the university's regulations that you signed up to and check what they say.

    As another poster has noted, I don't think they'd chase you if you wrote up journal papers or books out of your thesis, and they are unlikely to mind your work being posted on your website, distributed across academic channels (usual repositories etc). I think their perspective is : we give you a grant / living expenses and access to our facilities and our professors for 4 years, we give you a globally recognised and highly respected qualification if you do what we ask of you, in return we own copyright your produce while working for us in this role.

    My work isn't in a very patentable area so it wasn't a big issue for me as much as some others: I guess it's worth examining the university regulations and before you hand it in decide how to play it.

  69. How to procede. by prefec2 · · Score: 1

    After submission of your work, you can just put it on a web site or even better put in an open access platform either of your university or if it does not have such platform in one of the public OA platforms. However, it depends on the country in their you live if you can do so. I have heard that in the US the publications are property of the university (that might be wrong). In Germany the work is your and so you can do with it what you want.

    So first make sure that you own the work. Then check out Creative Commons web-site to find the right license.

  70. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I've never seen this arrangement, although I have seen somewhat similar situations. While it's true that sometimes things derived out of the thesis might be patentable or held confidential for a period of time, or that a university is granted an automatic license to use anything derived from it, or that parts of the thesis might have copyrights belonging to other companies (e.g., data owned by a company that is allowed to be used), it IS primarily the student's work and in every thesis I've ever seen it is the student that holds the copyright on the majority and the thesis is eventually a publicly-accessible document. What you describe is a little different because there is a direct corporate partnership. It does make sense that in such an arrangement the company might be able to exercise greater control as part of the bargain, such as requesting a time during which the thesis is "protected"/held confidential, but that is supposed to expire eventually. Otherwise it compromises the educational principle that other people should be able to learn from prior work and potentially evaluate its validity for themselves, and the principle that a student can present their work publicly. Neither a student nor their supervisor should agree to the level of control you have described.

    I've had students work with multi-million-dollar confidential, commercial datasets in their thesis work. They had to get permission from the company to use the data, the company had to agree to the way that excerpts of the data were used in the thesis, the instances of the company data in the thesis had to be clearly marked as being under the company's copyright, but the rest of the thesis was the student's. We could have held it "protected" for 5 years, if I recall correctly, but it wasn't necessary because the company had already approved the use of the data that we showed and the way that we showed it. The company understood from the start that the student had to be able to present something publicly, otherwise what's the point of having an evaluation that only a secret few can see, or research that can't be presented in conferences or papers? I would have said "no thank you" from the start if a company had that expectation.

    It's wrong for a student to not be able to present their work. Really wrong. Like, "abdication of responsibly" wrong for a supervisor to agree to it. How are students supposed to go on to subsequent work (say, graduate studies) if they can't show anybody what they did?

  71. Choose on that is compatible with the goal. by drolli · · Score: 1

    Compatible with your Universities requirements at least. Dont publish it before you hand it in.

  72. do you own it? by sam0737 · · Score: 1

    Before proceeding, Please check you are the copyright owner. IANAL and IIRC, by default these papers' copyright goes to the school , not the student.

  73. Re:ND ? you're on crack. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I would not consider research that "builds on" other research to be a derivative work.

    A derivative work would be if I took his paper and rewrote parts of it, or added some things, removed bits, etc.

  74. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because you can sign away your rights for any consideration, such consideration might be the "granting of a degree"?

    You might be the author and hold copyright, but not "own" the distribution rights, because other people contributed in some way to the work (providing lab space, editing assistance, experimental subjects or materials). This is similar to being contracted to develop software for a business. The software may incorporate trade secrets or you might have needed access to the business to do the development.

    This is a very sticky area. What about homework? turnitin.com requires that you grant them a limited license of your copyright for their nefarious purposes.

  75. Re:Really? This is your best effort? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You're right, it makes a lot more sense to ask a question to a bunch of people not involved, and get a wide variety of answers, some of which may be contradictory and none of which comes with any guarantee of being at all applicable to the situation.

    And next we'll ask /.-ers for relationship advice, because spending 5 minutes to ask many people associated with or well-versed in all sorts of relationship issues makes more sense than talking to your S.O.

  76. Why getting copies is difficult by pcgamez · · Score: 1

    The OP mentioned that getting copies of dissertations is difficult. Let me provide some more background on the problem.

    First, the copyright is not the issue so much as the language concerning copying and distribution of the dissertation.University libraries almost always have copies of dissertations (theses are different), but the lack of clear language or law regarding copies makes them extremely reluctant to copy them.

    Even if they will make arrangements for duplication there are often other hurdles. Most universities use ProQuest (UMI) who microfilms and sells copies for ~$50. Unfortunately, these are extremely low quality black and white reproductions that are often unsuitable for research. Often I end up having to order a copy from ProQuest, then go back to the university and ask them to make better copies of all the images and plates.

    Universities that do not use ProQuest have a large range of policies. Some will simply not make copies (Stanford). Others will make copies only after getting permission in writing from the author (University of Michigan). Still others will make copies, but only at a high cost (~$1100 in one case from a certain public university in Colorado).

    Finally, there are some cases where the university will neither copy or lend a dissertation, so your only option is to travel there to read it.

    Feel free to reply if you have any questions about the process as I have learned far more about it than I ever wanted to.

  77. Re:Really? This is your best effort? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's also important to mention that this hypothetical professor which can give legal advice won't care about your problem, will have no time to work on it and will refuse you to give you binding legal advice (i.e., put his ass on the line).

  78. Copyright from dissertation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Some Universities require a specific statement as below, signed on the page after your title page. This is so that your library can give out scans from your thesis if they request it. Otherwise, since you own the copyright, they should in theory ask you. In practice this largely depends on the library's traditions.

    If there is something publishable in your thesis then publish it. If there is something patentable then patent it. Otherwise, post it online.

    Congratulations in wrapping up your MS!

    -Sam, PhD (posted anonymously because I'm too lazy to log in).

    Copyright Statement
    I, ANONYMOUS COWARD, do hereby grant permission to copy this document, in
    whole or in part, for any non-commercial or non-profit purpose. Any other use
    of this document requires the written permission of the author.

    ________________
    Anonymous Coward

  79. what is the issue? by seeker_1us · · Score: 1

    Copyright is released as long as this work or excerpts is properly attributed. Also, any published excerpts cannot be copyrighted by other parties, nor can the original work in its entirety.

    Look, copyright is NOT an all inclusive thing. That's what fair use is about. Excerpts, properly attributed, are FAIR USE. Why are you even worrying about this stuff? Sounds like you are trying to overcomplicate your life.

  80. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Actually at VCU, calculus 1 is a requirement for all degrees aside from art majors.

  81. Chances are, you don't own the rights anyway by EmagGeek · · Score: 1

    Check the application you filled out to get into the school. Chances are it contains an assignment of rights to anything you develop while enrolled as a student (both on and off campus, and on the school's dime or your own).

    If that's the case, the school owns the copyright to your Thesis.

  82. don't publish in the wrong journal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    cause if you do, and use the paper in your thesis, you might loose the copyright to your whole thesis! Happened to me, I can't legally publish my PhD thesis online, because its now owned by the American Chemical Society who explicitly forbids that.

  83. Re:ND ? you're on crack. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Remember copyright only protects presentation. It doesn't protect ideas or facts. There's nothing in copyright law that could stop someone from "building on" the paper.

  84. wtfpl by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I used the WTFPL - Do What The Fuck You Want To Public License for my thesis, as did a friend. It is available here:

    http://sam.zoy.org/wtfpl/

    Highly recommend it.

  85. Authors Rights by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    http://scholar.sun.ac.za/handle/10019.1/16405

  86. Re:You did check with your department first, right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So basically your shit got stolen by corporate thugs who held your education for ransom?

    kudos to this dude who still has his nuts where they belong.

  87. Re:Really? This is your best effort? by alexo · · Score: 1

    Red, you've been on /. for, what, 2.5 years and still haven't figured out that the purpose of the site is to generate discussion?

    For example, while I could not care less about the submitter's thesis, not to mention the copyright terms it is released under, I appreciated reading this comment.

    So lay down your flamethrower and either contribute something valuable to the topic or move on to whatever holds your interest.

  88. Use Creative Commons by rfc1394 · · Score: 1
    If you want attribution you cannot use Public Domain because you cannot impose any conditions at all, it is completely open. You probably want Creative Commons share alike non-commercial, which means people can use or quote your work, but if they want to use it for commercial purposes such as resale then they have to get your permission. Sounds like you probably want this one:

    Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike CC BY-NC-SA

    This license lets others remix, tweak, and build upon your work non-commercially, as long as they credit you and license their new creations under the identical terms.

    --
    The lessons of history teach us - if they teach us anything - that nobody learns the lessons that history teaches us.
  89. You don't even have to do that by rfc1394 · · Score: 1

    You don't even have to state the work is copyrighted; copyright notices became optional in the U.S. in 1988 when we became a member of the Berne Union. The only issue is that if you don't have a notice the person who is sued can claim 'innocent infringement' and reduce damages.

    Also, the term 'all rights reserved' is completely deprecated. This notice gives special protection under the Buenos Aires Convention, a special copyright convention from around 1912. As of about 1990 every member of the Buenos Aires Convention was also a member of the Berne Union, which doesn't require copyright notices at all, therefore the term 'all rights reserved' is now completely superfluous. (There are very limited technical exceptions regarding when a copyright expires which doesn't apply for most people because copyrights last for life plus many years, either 50 or 70 depending on which country has stayed with the old version of the Berne Convention or the newer version.)

    --
    The lessons of history teach us - if they teach us anything - that nobody learns the lessons that history teaches us.