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Apple Faces Temporary iPhone, iPad Ban In Germany
An anonymous reader writes "A regional court has temporarily banned Apple from marketing or supplying iPhones and iPads in Germany, following a suit brought about by Motorola. However, Apple said that the judgement 'does not affect our ability to do business or sell products in Germany at this time.' This may have something to do with the respondent in the case being Apple Inc, the US parent company, and not Apple GmbH, the company's local subsidiary."
Seriously, the fewer of these iProducts we have out there, the more intelligent as a society we will be.
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iBan
There's some saying. It was something about reaping and sowing I think. Or was it some bed you sleep in after making it?
Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
Apple is happily having other companies banned from releasing their smartphones in various companies using patents. One can hardly expect the Android base to not respond in kind.
Citation needed...
No sig today...
These days patents are a means of stifling competition and locking out competitors. Companies have "war chests" of patents, and most everybody in the business infringes on one or another... Apple fired the first salvos in this particular war. We'll see what the landscape is when the dust settles, many years from now...
And at the same time we say violence is bad, we still fight back when attacked. Pacifism may be very admirable in some ways but practically speaking most of us will do what we must to defend ourselves. Otherwise the bully always wins.
Apple is faced with the prospect of "live by the sword, die by the sword".
Stop trolling, you disgusting waste of space.
Google may call for patent reform, but till then they have no choice but to play the game along with the others, whether they like it or not.
They have to be able to do business, and when Apple is getting increasingly aggressive now that their iStuff business is threatened by other corporations using the same technologies as those implemented (but rarely invented) by Apple.
I'm seeing a strong correlation between SCO and Apple these days, and I do hope for Apple that they know when to call it quits.
Goatse is getting old but I still appreciate it.
Thanks for making me smile at work.
When someone kicks you in the balls, you'd like be able to prevent an encore...right?
Apple didn't bother to show up, so they had a summary judgment made against them. They'll likely appeal and argue over the merits of the patents in question during the appeal. In the meantime, it's doubtful that any injunction will actually get enforced.
Ah, the "but mooom, he started it!". I get it.
"Yes Johnny, but you're supposed to come tell us immediately, not hit him"
"Yes Google, but you're supposed to explore all the wonderful alternatives we have to a defunct patent system. Not write legal briefs and submit them to a judge"?
Dude, turnabout is fair play.
Google didn't want this, motorola didn't want this, samsung certainly didn't want this.
It was Apple that went to the courts and tried to sue android oems. Now they have to reap what they've sown.
So please don't call google evil just because it is beating Apple at Apple's own game. (there are plenty of other more valid reasons to call google evil...)
You can never know everything, and part of what you do know will always be wrong. Perhaps even the most important part.
Apple is happily having other companies banned from releasing their smartphones in various companies using patents. One can hardly expect the Android base to not respond in kind.
This is the problem with standing behind strong principles to fight in a flame-war. Sooner or later you perjure yourself.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
What, you expect Google to just sit there and take it!?
I just had my iPhone nuked over the weekend because of a SIM-unlock that went wrong. According to the engineer I talked to (3rd level support) via another phone, this is not uncommon (no, it isn't fixed yet).
He then told me that I'm lucky not to have a 4S as there appear to be massive problems with them like dropping Net connections for no reason. Apparently the combination of iOS5 and iPhone 4S is *not* a happy one..
Insert
Totally sensational headline. The Injunction was against Apple Inc. and Apple Inc. can appeal and introduce new evidence. Apple Germany sells iStuff in Germany, not Apple inc. There has been no ruling against Apple Germany. how about /. deals with some facts instead of troll feeding?
Watch those corners
'sfunny. US summary judgement against a UK company in the USA is held up as the fault of the UK company, not the US court system being fubar. And that UK company execs are in danger of being slammed in Jail if they pass through or over US airspace.
Yet here it's not a problem because it's Apple.
Maybe it's because Apple Gmbh doesn't use the same hardware that is under the Motorola suit? It would be news if this were so...
Google is not the villain... nor the victim. Neither is Apple, or any other of the combatants in the Patent Wars. Unfortunately, patent law doesn't allow someone to stay out of it... which is one of the ways in which it has become Evil.
http://alternatives.rzero.com/
Apple used to be a great company. Now, Apple is just a patent parasite. If iProducts are banned, Apple will only have themselves to blame. You can blame other companies for defending themselves against an aggressive scammer, like Apple.
Nothing like a little patent MAD to spice up our lives.
Or to be more precise, make our lives a hell of a lot more expensive, because we the customers are the ones who end up footing the bill in the end.
Engadget ran this story with what I presume is the same misinformation in it last week. I haven't been able to reach ZD Net UK. They might be slashdotted.
It isn't an injunction, legal term Verfuegung, it is a default judgment of infringement. They will now appeal it.
Nothing to see here. (And the server in the UK seems to have fallen down on the job as well.)
Since when is it “evil’ to defend yourself against scummy patent parasite, like Apple.
These lawsuits are absolutely 100% Apple’s fault.
These lawsuits would have never happened were it not for Apple’s aggressive IP scamming. Apple is worse than Microsoft in this regard.
Payback is a bitch.
Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
How dare you link an apple fanboi site
Google certainly is the victim. Google has had their products banned because of Apple's aggressive patent scamming.
You cannot blame Google for trying to defend itself against a patent extortionist like Apple.
These scam lawsuits are 100% Apple’s fault. Google, HTC, Motorola, never wanted this.
here it comes...
muahahahahaaaaa... patents... HAHAHAHA...
who is next?
Apple shills at at work here?
Apple shills at work?
Google is not the villain... nor the victim. Neither is Apple, or any other of the combatants in the Patent Wars. Unfortunately, patent law doesn't allow someone to stay out of it... which is one of the ways in which it has become Evil.
Probably the most sensible comment I've heard on this whole messy business. Until there is patent reform - if it ever happens, then people are going to try and protect the patents they hold, especially if they feel it is harmful to their business, whatever that business may be. It doesn't just happen in tech.
Watch those corners
Maybe I am gay and not an apple user?
Seriously? You are criticizing Samsung for "dodging" scam patents like rounded corners? Why not criticize Apple for filing lawsuits based on scam patents? The JooJoo/Crunchpad had rounded corners before the iPad. Apple is just a patent parasite. We all know it.
is also sauce for the gander.
> Indeed. We should totally let you make purchasing decisions for other people.
Apple seems to think it is okay to ban competitors products from sale in some countries. Why should Apple products be able to be banned? Apple's argument was that if people could buy Android tablets then there was a danger that they would become "Android people". OMG it's the march of the undead Android People! Quick, duck and cover!
So why is this any less dangerous that the iProducts turning people into iPhanboys?
Steve Wozniac said Steve Jobs had given mankind tools unlike any the world had ever seen. Someone replied: yes and they're called Apple fanboys.
I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
> So much for Google's do no evil. At the same time while
> they're talking how patents are bad,
> they use their proxy companies to attack competitors.
Google is not a party to any of these lawsuits.
Apple sued various companies (Samsung, Motorola, HTC, etc). Since the choice of lawsuits (and venue!) is Apple's alone, and Google is not involved as either plaintiff or defendant, how is Google to blame?
Furthermore, these are all publicly traded companies, which are duty bound to act in the interest of their own shareholders and not Google. Acting in anything but their own shareholders best interest is the quickest way to draw a shareholder lawsuit. So how exactly are these publicly traded companies a proxy of Google? I would love to hear the explanation. It would be as convoluted as saying Apple is a Microsoft proxy. Or something.
I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
> Ah, the "but mooom, he started it!". I get it.
But there is no "but mooom". Apple has subverted the patent system and is using the courts. There is no authority to appeal to except for the "mom". So companies sued by Apple (not Google) are using the same system to fight back with in kind.
Your post might make sense if there were a higher authority to appeal to that could reign in the patent system and court abuse going on at Apple's instigation in various countries.
It's kind of like saying that if a small country attacked the US, and the US fought back that the US is just saying "but moooom, he started it!".
I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
Engadget ran this story with what I presume is the same misinformation in it last week. I haven't been able to reach ZD Net UK. They might be slashdotted.
It isn't an injunction, legal term Verfuegung, it is a default judgment of infringement. They will now appeal it.
Nothing to see here. (And the server in the UK seems to have fallen down on the job as well.)
There is a lot to see here. Because of the default judgment, Motorola can move to have the infringing products banned from sale immediately despite a certain appeal by Apple. This is how it works in Germany. In the United States, the infringing products can still be sold while the appeal is ongoing.
Much of the reporting I have seen stems from a Florian Mueller posting on his blog. Florian received the judgment from someone and nobody knew if it was fake of not. Florian's post was complete speculation on why Apple never showed up to the hearing. Since that original post, a number of German lawyers have contacted him with more information and now Florian has a number of additional posts up confirming that this is indeed a BIG DEAL for Apple.
Now, this exposes a big problem. I don't know where Florian lives. But he seems to not live anywhere near where patents are being fought. He writes as a bystander. I have never seen him write "I was in court today and watched the hearing in the case of XYZ against 123". There were a lot of people in the Mannheim Regional Court on Friday. Everybody there saw what happened. Motorola filed two suits against Apple. There were two hearings scheduled in the Mannheim court - about an hour apart. Apple's lawyers arrived half an hour before the 2nd hearing and looked very confused when they saw two hearings on the docketing board. Motorola's lawyers were already there and Apple's lawyers approached and said that there must be some mistake - there are two cases listed today. Motorola's lawyers said no, there was no mistake. You lost the first case. We got a default judgment because you didn't show up.
Google bought Motorola, so yes, they are party to it.
But otherwise I agree with you.
Because there's a shitload of twofaced when it comes to Apple products. The fanbois brains turn off in the presence of the Next Apple Thing (or is that iThing?). Therefore without the next Apple thing, they will have operating brains for more time.
Increasing the average intelligence of the world.
Well, not much. This is primarily going to hurt German retailers which is why you probably will not see an outright ban on the sale of iPhones and iPods. If you don't think people will be driving to, riding to, flying to, or ordering from other countries to get their Apple gadgets, think again. Apple products draw a lot of water and it's something people are buying regardless of the relatively poor state of the western economy.
Stupider like a fox! - H.S.
Google doesn't own Motorola Mobility yet...
Even so, this is very much a defensive move. Ever heard of a defensive force NOT shooting back? Apple opened a can of worms, and now they are paying the price. They should have left well enough alone.
Goatse. Do not click.
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Yet more goatse. Woo. Hoo.
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Since when is defending yourself against an aggressor set on your doom "evil"?
The way things are, there is no "better way" and certainly no "high road" available for Google to take. Apple will NOT STOP and come back to the table until they are faced with the same crap they are issuing to everyone else. And let's be clear on this -- they are not only defending themselves, they are defending everyone else who is faced with the same problem.
When the fight is for "freedom" we are all beneficiaries. That's definitely "not evil."
Google hasn't bought Motorola. Merely states its intentions to do so, and filed some of the paperwork. Whether or not Google will acquire Motorola is still to be decided by regulatory bodies worldwide.
I vote based on politicians' actions, unless contrary to my preconceptions. Often wrong, never uncertain. #iamthe99%
Goatse. You have been warned.
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I just like to point out that this is exactly why Microsoft has gone to courts regarding patents too. Others have sued them first and MS has used their defenses. But on Slashdot that always gets turned around as MS suing first and "threatening" Linux, especially with the FAT filesystem thing (which war other company first started)
Goatse.
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This link goes to goatse.
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SCO lawsuit was much more questionably than Apple's and they were suing someone completely uninvolved. If Apple were suing General Motors for using engine technology that Apple really owned in Android that would be comparable to SCO.
"I will spend my last dying breath if I need to, and I will spend every penny of Apple's $40 billion in the bank, to right this wrong," Jobs said. "I'm going to destroy Android, because it's a stolen product. I'm willing to go thermonuclear war on this." Steve Jobs
Jobs also called everything Google made "shit," (with the exception of its search engine), and unfavourably compared the web giant to Microsoft.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/10/20/scitech/main20123421.shtml
I was under the impression it had been okay'd now, but after a quick search I can't find anything confirming that so I guess you're probably right.
Son of a...
Google is infringing on patents. Knowingly, even. That hardly makes them victims.
... I reported this and more about 6 hours ago.
just so you know. Apple must, according to the judgement that I read through, has to pay Moto damages dating back to as early as the beginning of 2002.
And, as some have most assuradely already noted, this ruling is against Apple Inc. which many believe doesn't actually sell anything in Germany. The problem is the German Apple sites are owned directly by Apple Inc. and so the Lawyers are still discussing if they may have to be shutdown or whatever. Still waiting to see.
IT Admins Group: Where you decide the content
Don't be so fucking pigheaded. Apple didn't write these idiotic patent laws (the ones you probably don't know jack shit about).
Everyone is infringing on patents. The knowingly part has so far not been proven except for Apple, who admitted to infringe on Samsung's patents but declined liability by accusing Samsung of unFRAND licensing.
"If you can't beat 'em, sue 'em." Thanks for being frivolous, Motorola.
It completely ignores human nature. People get hypocritical and cut breaks for things they like all the time. If it isn't Apple, it will express itself somewhere else.
Besides, my overall point is that you are completely oblivious to you are as bad, if not worse, as any fanboy I've ever encountered. Apple reducing the overall intelligence of humanity... seriously?
Except for ending slavery, the Nazis, communism, & securing American independence, war has never solved anything.
Yes, all the Android handset manufacturers sued Microsoft first and forced them to start collecting license fees from them!
Analogies don't equal equalities, they are merely somewhat analogous.
OMG! What is that man trying to do? Catch a football?!
Yup, I was expecting someone would suggest I'd jailbroken the thing.
Guess what - I didn't. I never even tried, for a number of reasons I don't plan to go into. The phone is standard, kept up to date with a few days delay so I could check an update wouldn't screw up (I guess those years suffering Windows updates were good for something after all), and no apps that try to do something with hardware either.
Translated: the baseband code is as it came with the phone, and I intend it to stay that way. It now had 3 full rebuilds which made zero difference, and tomorrow I'll start round two where I will kick this upstairs properly.
What has happened here was direct consequence of a SIM unlock, and the suspicion is that Apple screwed up. I have no idea how they do an unlock, but this was supposed to be an official process and it went seriously wrong.
Oh, and before anyone else throws other suggestions in: I actually worked on mobile systems. That's one of the lesser reasons I keep the baseband code standard..
So, in summary: nope - it's all of Apple's own making.. It's a shame, I like the phone. I am not that fond of the Android phone I have as replacement, but that's simply personal taste.
Insert
It's quite entertaining which conclusions people jump to on the basis of no information whatsoever.
A few basics.
AFAIK, the baseband code is made by Apple, and *ought* to conform to a number of standards. Which it doesn't always do. That same provider has no issues with all the other phones on their network, which kinda identifies the culprit pretty accurately. The statement was not made by an Apple engineer.
Secondly, you may not notice that your phone drops connection, it may simply appear a bit slower while it is working to reconnect and recover the link time after time. You have no way of knowing this - you're on the wrong side of the link.
Thirdly, I have been with this provider for the last 5 years EXACTLY because they are so good. Not only the service, but also the support. They don't bullshit anyone, and they do their best to chose the right tariff for everyone because, quite simply, that's how they keep their customers.
You might want to accumulate some facts before you comment.
Insert
Ah, the "but mooom, he started it!". I get it.
Apple: "It's not fair! He hit me back!"
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. - Voltaire
And how different it is from Samsung? You think there is no Samsung Germany hence they've banned all Samsung or violating "community design" of rectangular shape with rounded corners is punished harder, than violating Motorola's hardware patents?
Well, MS was not sued over filesystems. Not my Linux distributors. And walking around, and spreading FUD, without giving out specifics (which patents are being violated), well is just FUDish PR.
I guess you would be okay if somebody says "you are a criminal", but does not specify what your crime is? Guess it's easy to defend one if one is not knowing what one is accused of, right?