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Film Studios Seeking Complete Block of Newzbin2 in the UK

superglaze writes "Having got BT, one of the biggest ISPs in the UK, to block the Newzbin2 Usenet site, the Motion Picture Association is now trying to get the same result from all the other major service providers in the country. As this is likely to go through, it won't be long before most people in the UK will be unable to visit file-sharing sites at all, without using a proxy, VPN, or special client."

25 of 231 comments (clear)

  1. They can block all they want by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    At the end of the day, they won't be surprised when the ticket sales for the utter crap that they call movies doesn't go up one bit. People who download movies usually cannot afford to go and see them, or refuse to pay the ridiculous prices to see them. Cinemas in the UK are a joke. 7 quid for a coke and popcorn. 8 quid to get in. Take a family of 4 to a cinema and you are out 60 quid ($90 ish). It's a joke. Just to sit there for 90 minutes and watch utter crap. Make cinema affordable for families again and piracy will go down very quickly.

    1. Re:They can block all they want by Dondoet · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That is assuming that it's families who are pirating films, which I don't really think is the case. Personally, I pirate films every now and then for the sake of ease. Going to the cinema is a large use of time (and money), which I'd prefer to spend on something at least marginally more productive. As you said, the prices at the cinema in the uk are quite ridiculous at the moment. I think a drop in prices would probably bring in more money than at the current state but probably wouldn't reduce piracy.

    2. Re:They can block all they want by agentgonzo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      When I can buy a DVD for the price of a cinema ticket + parking + snacks and when my living room is much nicer than the local cinema, it makes very little incentive to go to the cinema. The price of the DVD alone is less than two tickets excluding everything it means the only time I ever go to the cinema is when I tag along with my friends who want to see something. If I want to watch a film, I'll just wait for the DVD. Pirating it is easier and cheaper than getting the DVD so that has a large appeal apart from the bit where I have to poo in a policeman's helmet

    3. Re:They can block all they want by Bert64 · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's 8 quid if you happen to live outside london, it costs a lot more in london...

      Add to that, the conditions... Of the cinemas i've been to over the years, most are smelly, dirty, poor climate control (either too hot or too cold), uncomfortable seats, seats too close together so you knock elbows etc etc...

      I also never understood why they sell the noisiest possible food (crisps and popcorn) at cinemas, people munching away on this stuff is noisy and detracts from the movie!

      Contrast that to cinemas in some asian countries, where they have to compete against a much higher level of piracy, the prices are not only much cheaper but the experience much better to boot.

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    4. Re:They can block all they want by agentgonzo · · Score: 2

      I also never understood why they sell the noisiest possible food (crisps and popcorn) at cinemas, people munching away on this stuff is noisy and detracts from the movie!

      I also don't understand why they think you'll consume an entire litre of fizzy drink during a single movie. I've never seen anywhere else selling that much beverage at one time outside the Oktoberfest

    5. Re:They can block all they want by TheRaven64 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      And renting the DVD is even cheaper. I pay less for an all-I-can-watch, 2 disks at home at once (becoming 3 next week for the same price) rental subscription as I'd pay for going to the cinema twice a month. I spent about £100 on my 5.1 speakers ten years ago, and about £150 on my projector four years ago. I can watch films on a comfy sofa with whatever food or drink I want and pause it when I want. If I want to watch a film with someone else, it costs the same amount, while going to the cinema will cost twice as much.

      The studios delay the DVD releases because they will cannibalise cinema profits. They don't seem to understand that this means that, given the choice, people would rather watch the DVD than go to the cinema. In any sane business, this would mean that they'd release the DVD first, giving their customers what they want. Instead, they intentionally don't give customers what they want and then blame piracy for their profits being lower than they want.

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    6. Re:They can block all they want by xaxa · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I also don't understand why they think you'll consume an entire litre of fizzy drink during a single movie.

      American influence, I think. I don't remember much from my single trip to the cinema in the USA, many years ago, except that the staff wondered why the British children didn't want any food or drink. We lasted the duration of Finding Nemo with no ill effects, and without consuming 175% of a child's RDA of sugar in a single drink (figure for a supersized "42 oz" (1.25L) coke).

      At McDonalds (figures from the websites):
      - A "large" drink in the UK is 0.5L, a "medium" about 0.4L, a "small" 0.25L (Germany has the same sizes).
      - A "large" drink in the US is 0.95L, a "medium" is 0.62L, a "small" 0.47L, and a "child" 0.35L.

      The US "child" drink, the smallest available, is about the same as a UK/German "medium".

    7. Re:They can block all they want by Ihmhi · · Score: 2

      10: BAN INTERNET SITES

      20: print OUR PROFITS AREN'T GOING UP! WE MUST HAVE MISSED SOMETHING!

      30: GOTO 10

      .

      .

      .

      (Sometimes, the Filters kinda piss me off. Blah blah blah text to counter the yelling filter blah blah.)

    8. Re:They can block all they want by nurb432 · · Score: 2

      When I can buy a DVD for the price of a cinema ticket + parking + snacks and when my living room is much nicer than the local cinema, it makes very little incentive to go to the cinema.

      Expect that to change. Pay per view DVD is in our future. Why else do you think all players are connected to the network? ( 'additional content' my ass )

      --
      ---- Booth was a patriot ----
    9. Re:They can block all they want by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      I'll be honest, I don't want to pay for most movies because the paid versions suck compared to the free ones. I'll wait until I can see them for free on TV or via a high quality download (no cam rubbish). Cinemas are not nice places and there is always some twat commentating a couple of rows behind you. DVDs are okay but a chore to rip and I haven't even bothered with Bluray.

      The real problem as I see it is that there is no easy way to make a simple payment for a movie that doesn't involve some kind of exchange, e.g. buying a DVD. I already have the video file, I just want to give some money to the guys who made it without having the majority taken by the shop/cinema and the studio. How much of that £10 Bluray do you think filters down to past the parasites? I bet if I sent the producers £1 that is more than they would get from be buying the Bluray which works out really well for both of us.

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  2. the article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    having just read that, it seems, there is no need for smaller ISPs that resell the connection of BT to be blocked (which they wont be it seems).

    now, if there is one idea we can steal from patent trolls (if they didn't patent it yet) its making shell companies with no real atributes.

    how about making smaller ISPs that do nothing but resell the connection of BT, if they get sued, you drop them and offer the clients to swap to another shell company with no added costs, under the same terms.

  3. sensationalist by Custard+Horse · · Score: 2

    it won't be long before most people in the UK will be unable to visit file-sharing sites at all, without using a proxy, VPN, or special client.

    That's like saying you soon won't be able to leave your own house - unless you use a door or window. If the Chinese government cannot filter the internet effectively the UK government will have no hope.

    1. Re:sensationalist by MoonBuggy · · Score: 2

      Although you're absolutely right, there are still serious problems with a system that allows certain types of information to be banned (and I'm not talking about the copyrighted files, it's the links to the files that they've gone after here). Pragmatic as it is, "It's not a major issue because they can't enforce it" is just asking for trouble a few years down the line.

    2. Re:sensationalist by Inda · · Score: 2

      "proxy, VPN, or special client"

      Or a 64gb micro-SD card, in a smart phone, acting as a WiFi access point. Who needs the internet when you have your own network?

      The kids are already doing this. It only takes one person to obtain the naughty files.

      Files will become hot-property, school currency, and the kids with the most on offer will become the most popular.

      Well done UK Gov. With this and your Channel Islands Tax Loophole closure, you'll have Hollywood making election winning donations for years to come.

      --
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    3. Re:sensationalist by SuricouRaven · · Score: 2

      "the kids with the most on offer will become the most popular."

      It works. When I was a pupil, it was the height of the pokemon craze. I supplied copies of no$gba and roms on floppy, site rips of the pokedex, episode guides, even whole episodes in realmedia format via spanned ZIP archives. Made me quite popular, so long as the flow of data was kept up. Then the internet came along, and suddenly noone needed my services.

    4. Re:sensationalist by SuricouRaven · · Score: 2

      Think more sneakernet with wireless enhancements. You don't download: You got to Knock-Off Nigel with your phone, and he'll transfer whatever you want from his phone to yours. Such activity brings popularity, so it wouldn't be hard to find a Nigel - every school will have some in the student population, as will any sizeable workplace. The Nigels can trade their files with other Nigels online - as they have the contacts and knowledge to do so even under the strictest enforcement - and they in turn serve as points of contact for the rest of the population.

  4. Re:First file sharing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    shhhh, you're disrupting their world view that the USA is the world. you might hurt they're ability to further broad brush over topics....

  5. I applaud this. by Iamthecheese · · Score: 2

    By forcing the 'net underground they ultimately encourage truly free speech.

    --
    If video games influenced behavior the Pac Man generation would be eating pills and running away from their problems.
  6. Re:Why Newsbin2? by jonbryce · · Score: 2

    Newsbin were originally a UK based site. They were forced offshore, then they went for blocking it.

  7. Re:First file sharing by TheRaven64 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    The problem with child porn laws is that they are always badly defined. Child abuse is fairly easy to define. Pictures of child abuse make you an accessory (or an accessory after the fact) to child abuse, so no extra laws are required. Child porn laws have covered:
    • Drawings of fictitious children in various settings (wanting got look at these may be a bit fucked up, but no children were harmed in the creation of them).
    • A photograph of a naked child in the bath taken by its parents (use your favourite search engine to find this one).
    • Pictures of consensual sex between people above the age of consent, create without the intent to distribute them.
    • Pictures of adults who look like they are under the age of consent
    • Pictures of children playing that someone thought might be arousing to someone else.

    One of the cases the was on Slashdot a few weeks ago was a catholic priest. Some of the pictures he had were just photograph of (clothed) children with their crotches in the centre of the frame. These were counted as child porn (not to defend the individual in question - there was also evidence that he was molesting the children, but focussing on the pictures rather than the molestation seems wrong).

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  8. Re:This is good by N0Man74 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Sorry, my points have all been spent.

    You might want to pick up a newspaper sometime (if they still in print) because the world has changed a little bit in the last several decades.

    There have been some recent developments that you might find interesting, such as the rise of "the internet", "smart phones", "i-things", "unemployment", and "economic uncertainty".

    In reading, you might also learn that most of us don't have infinite incomes. Additionally, at the risk of offending some camps, all businesses can't continue to always increase profits for an infinite amount of time.

    So the average person has less money to spend on entertainment and more places to spend it, then it seems pretty likely that certain "creative industries" can feel the pinch.

    You are in the "creative industry", can't you be more creative than using piracy as a scapegoat?

  9. Re:First file sharing by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 2

    There are many losses of freedom that society simply will not tolerate and, even if society did, there are civil liberties organizations that will step up to the ball and fight those battles.

    We here at the TSA whole-heartedly agree, and can attest to the viciousness of people trying to pass airport checkpoints without having their boobs x-ray-goggled and their scrotums squeezed. It was a humbling experience for us when the ACLU obtained a court order forcing us to cease all operations not shown to improve security, both for specific complaints such as humiliation over naked x-rays and groping and for more general complaints about using non-issues as a platform to force travelers into ridiculous and submissive positions so that we can exert control continuously and ensure that they will follow any instruction no matter how much it strips their civil liberties.

    At the TSA, we now focus on working with intelligence agencies and on aircraft control strategies. Locked cockpit doors and fast response and escort when a pilot behaves in an unexpected and uncontrolled manner have become the gold standard, and we are strict on airlines that do not enforce these standards. Your convenience and safety are both equal priorities, as they should be.

  10. Re:First file sharing by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 2

    And this is why you need some related form of momentum--something to vaguely give that impression as well as something to show that we've accepted such censorship. Those arguments are nutty ... but also not so nutty, really. Abortion is fun because you can make societal arguments like the unintended consequence of ELIMINATING other unintended consequences (i.e. risks) causing a slide of other moral fibers of society, or more real effects like proliferation of STDs. Then again, you could just talk about killing babies. Or both, if you juggle your topics right and get the timing down just so.... Of course, some of that relied on people competently understanding the problem that widespread drug use causes to society--something real, but vague, which people just won't swallow. It's analogous of course to the problem that eliminating the risk of pregnancy causes to society (which is more complex and annoying, and fun to argue about in itself--if the man says abort it, the woman says she wanted to keep it, why the fuck should the man have to pay child support?)

  11. Bring on the darknets by BlueParrot · · Score: 3

    The industry can't see an arms-race when it's staring them in the face.

    This will escalate until file-sharing is done over invite-only darknets. Best
    of luck filtering fully encrypted data streams that make a jump or two
    across national borders. A DNS blacklist is one thing, but forcing ISPs to
    engage in highly costly traffic analysis is something they will fight tooth and nail.

  12. Re:First file sharing by Builder · · Score: 2

    > but I suspect at least 50% of UK citizens couldn't tell you which party he represents.

    That's not because we're stupid. That's just because he's very hard to distinguish from the last terrorist in power.