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Qualcomm's Butterfly Wing Display Gets Nearer

holy_calamity writes "Technology Review has an update on a screen technology from Qualcomm called Mirasol that delivers LCD-like colors and video but sips power like e-ink. Demonstration Android tablets with 5.7 inch Mirasol displays apparently held up well in bright light and were responsive enough for gaming. Qualcomm are in the process of building a $1 billion new factory to make the screens, which should appear in devices from phone and tablet makers next year."

168 comments

  1. Soon by jmorris42 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Between this and a couple of other low power passive displays working their way to market, one of them is going to succeed. And change everything.

    The display is one of the biggest power hogs right now. The radios in cell phones are also pretty hungry but having an always on display will be game changing. Then when you consider the work on various memory techs that eliminate idle current and the lifetime issues with flash, things are going to continue to be very interesting in the tech world.

    --
    Democrat delenda est
    1. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Interesting at the expense of hardware engineers. Why do hardware engineers have to put in all the time, effort, and knowledge, and get paid less than software engineers, while software engineers who make Phone apps and stupid facebook games reap in millions in venture capital ?

      This imbalance will only spur the mass exodus of smart EE's from hardware into software. Look out, software people of this gen and next gen !

    2. Re:Soon by penguinstorm · · Score: 4, Funny

      Shit. I thought we already changed everything. I'm not buying anything else until we stop changing things!

      --
      Skot Nelson music is my saviour / i was maimed by rock and roll
    3. Re:Soon by peragrin · · Score: 1

      i have been waiting for a mirasol or pixi q tablet for 6 years when I first heard of the displays. I am tired of waiting and waiting and waiting. Just put out a decent device with the display and you will sell enough to pay for that building.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    4. Re:Soon by somersault · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Indeed.. 30fps from a colour e-ink display. I can hardly imagine how strange it would be watching a video on one of these things.

      This is the beginning of the end of printed magazines, now that people can't complain about eye strain from backlights. It will also be damn cool to be able to do real "living photos" without a backlit display.

      Modifiable tattoos is another fun use that they're already doing with monochrome e-ink - being able to have them in colour that doesn't fade would be awesome too. The whole reason I haven't got a tattoo so far is that I know I'd probably want to change the design at some point.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    5. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This imbalance will only spur the mass exodus of smart EE's from hardware into software. Look out, software people of this gen and next gen !

      If they produce software of the quality I've seen from hardware folk the software engineers have nothing to worry about.

    6. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Because hardware engineers are too busy enjoying their jobs?

    7. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How do you suppose they put out a decent device to pay for the factory they need to build to mass produce the screens?
      chicken and egg?

    8. Re:Soon by nanoflower · · Score: 5, Insightful

      LOL. Hardware engineers can often make more than software engineers in the same company. What you are talking about is people that go off and make their own products that other people buy. That could be hardware or software. Consider the case of two guys named Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak that built a company started out with a hardware product (and some software to drive it.) It doesn't matter what your background is so long as you can come up with a decent product that people want. Hardware/software/literature/movie/clothing. Come up with a good product at a decent price and figure out how to market it and you too can make millions. T

    9. Re:Soon by DragonWriter · · Score: 1

      I have been waiting for a mirasol or pixi q tablet for 6 years when I first heard of the displays. I am tired of waiting and waiting and waiting. Just put out a decent device with the display and you will sell enough to pay for that building.

      Is there something wrong with the Pixel Qi model of the Notion Ink Adam?

    10. Re:Soon by Eternauta3k · · Score: 2

      It's a different time, back when they were building PCs in their garage it wasn't consumer electronics. Nowadays you can't hope to make a tablet, PC or whatever without getting some serious funding. The alternative is producing more expensive goods so you don't compete with massive factories in China for slim profits.

      --
      Yeah. Would you choose a neurosurgeon who pokes around people's brains in his spare time? I wouldn't.
    11. Re:Soon by LordNimon · · Score: 5, Interesting

      This imbalance will only spur the mass exodus of smart EE's from hardware into software.

      God, I hope not. The worst code I've seen is almost invariably produced by EEs. The last thing the software world needs is more hardware engineers who want to "try out" being a programmer. No thanks.

      --
      And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
      To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
    12. Re:Soon by mark-t · · Score: 1

      The applications are indeed very far reaching... from having things that look like full motion paintings (think "Harry Potter"), to changing the pattern on the wallpaper in your house, to changing the colors of the clothes that you are wearing, all at a push of a button.

    13. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      This imbalance will only spur the mass exodus of smart EE's from hardware into software.

      God, I hope not. The worst code I've seen is almost invariably produced by EEs. The last thing the software world needs is more hardware engineers who want to "try out" being a programmer. No thanks.

      FWIW I've seen some hw architected by software engineers "trying out" being a hardware architect, and believe me that ain't a pretty sight either.

      But then I've seen that there are people who are good at both so as with all generalizations, it depends ;^)

    14. Re:Soon by vakuona · · Score: 1

      Sell to someone big. Like Apple. seriously, if the tech is that good, Apple will want it, and will pay for it. That 80bn cash pile that Apple has built up is good for something.

      Samsung has a competing display tech, so probably won't be interested.

    15. Re:Soon by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 3, Funny

      Other than the fact that somebody attached it to a Notion Ink Adam, not really...

    16. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I'm enjoying my Pixel Qi Samsung - you have to make your own with the screen from Maker Shed. If you get the right netbook, it takes about thirty min to swap out the screen.

    17. Re:Soon by Twinbee · · Score: 1

      Not forgetting those upcoming "Lithium Air" batteries.

      --
      Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
    18. Re:Soon by peragrin · · Score: 1

      except you can't buy it any more, very heavy, oh and it comes with the shittiest software stack since windows me.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    19. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All Hollywood movies are at 24 fps and yet they don't seem strange at all. As long as the fps is constant and above a minimum threshold, it'll be fine.

    20. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hyperbole much? What is this going to change? Oh wow, the fashion accessory/toy that everyone seems to need and not use 99% of its functions will last a bit longer on a charge. What will that change? Will it reduce the work week to 20 hours a week? Will it change our dependence on finite energy resources? Will it feed the hungry, house the poor? Jesus get your head out of your ass. It's a display technology.

    21. Re:Soon by Mystiq · · Score: 1

      OH MY GOD WILL YOU PEOPLE STOP PERPETUATING THE FACT "MOVIES ARE 24 FPS SO THAT'S ALL YOU NEED"

      No but seriously, movies and tv are only at 24 fps because of motion blur. If you play a game on a computer where you can control the frame rate (via video options), get an application like Fraps that will show you the frame rate and try to get the game to run at 24 fps, then at 60 fps. You will see a massive difference because the game is showing individual frames with no motion blur.

      This link is very informative on the topic:
      http://www.100fps.com/how_many_frames_can_humans_see.htm

    22. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've been forcefully assured by the Slashdot geniuses that 3D printing has revolutionized home manufacturing. Why don't people just 3D print fully functional PCBs with billion transistor CPUs directly from the ABS feedstock?

    23. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah great, now we're going to have lifetime issues with the display.

      This display technology seems very physically fragile. It has actual real physically moving parts inside of it. Millions of moving parts in even a small phone display.

      You think LCD bad pixels suck? Wait until your screen starts to wear out like flash memory.

    24. Re:Soon by RobbieThe1st · · Score: 1

      Yes No Maby.
      Thing is, as far as the content goes, it comes in 24 or 30fps rates, so as long as you can do those consistantly without variation, it will look fine.
      Gaming on the other hand, you'll need to add lots of motion blur to make it look acceptable. That being said, even at 120hz(I've got an aw2310 and no 3d glasses for a reason...), motion blur helps.
      But I'd not want to a 30fps screen for much in the way of transitions or scrolling, as it'd definitely be somewhat jerky.

    25. Re:Soon by mug+funky · · Score: 2

      action movies are often shot with extremely fast shutter speeds, essentially removing the motion blur.

      also, you need to swap the word "fact" with "myth".

      Japanese movies are coming out at 30fps progressive, now that digital projection is commonplace.

      Best practice with cinematography is that the camera should not be moved too fast, on account of the 24fps shutter making motion very staccato, and the faster things move, the more obvious the flickering becomes. some slow graceful pans can appear completely smooth in a cinema, but since Dogma and the Bourne movies popularised hand-held, all the best practice cinematography rules have been thrown out the window, in spite of how shitty the result looks.

      btw, 100fps.com is not a good resource. it's simplistic and plain wrong in parts. not a bad place to start, but you'll spend a lot of time being corrected if you do start there.

    26. Re:Soon by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      yes, much hyperbole.

    27. Re:Soon by jimmydevice · · Score: 2

      I didn't think most EE's these days even know which end of a soldering iron to hold. Most of the hardware development is programming. All my EE friends seem to be shifting to the dark side.

    28. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 2

      That 80bn cash pile that Apple has built up is good for something

      Is it? Ever since Jobs got sick, basically since Leopard, which is really pretty decent, Apple's been producing poorer and poorer OSX and IOS releases. IOS5 has many, many problems, and also, apparently intentionally, inflicts a rather wicked planned obsolescence on Leopard users -- wifi sync doesn't work. And then there's the *way* they implemented wifi sync. Previously, you had to connect to your PC/mac, and it would sync via USB. Now (assuming you're not using Leopard), you (a) have to plug the iDevice into power, (b) you have to start iTunes, and then it'll sync. This isn't any more convenient from plugging it into the computer to sync in the first place. What were they thinking? Snow Leopard broke quite a few drivers and applications. Lion dumped the PPC emulator for no particular reason. There is a fairly pervasive rumor they're thinking of dropping the Mac Pro, and there is this "sandboxing" thing they're planning on doing to apps from the Mac app store (goodbye programs that talk to one another.) There's still no midrange tower. The mini lost its optical drive. Then there's this batshit idea of "fullscreen apps" that basically crap all over multiple monitor setups (yeah, you guessed it, I have multiple monitors.)

      Maybe it'll work out -- but right now, to me, at least, it seems like things are changing in a new direction: decisions I can't get behind, one after another.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    29. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      Mechanical parts that are very small tend to be very robust. Look at the moving mirror technology in projectors (it's called DLP); those things seem to last forever, I've not heard about any of them losing pixels -- I've got a 1080p Optoma with about 9000 hours of lamp time, and the display looks as good as it did on day one when you slap a fresh bulb in it (the bulbs dim over time... but that doesn't mean the mirrors are implicated at all in the gradual reduction of quality.)

      Also, the arrays in the tech we're talking about here have basically binary states; on or off. They develop brightness by more or less cells reflecting at once, not by incremental positioning.

      I'm inclined to think it'll work out ok.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    30. Re:Soon by omfgnosis · · Score: 1

      since Leopard, which is really pretty decent, Apple's been producing poorer and poorer OSX and IOS releases

      Really? Granted I didn't upgrade to "Lion" until 10.7.2, but I've never experienced a smoother OS upgrade, and I never upgrade to a 10.x.0 release. Basically my experience was that everything I cared about worked as well or better, with the exception single-app Exposé, which I rarely used anyway.

      And while I won't dismiss reliance on 5+ year old software out of hand, anyone with a workflow where they can't or won't update that software should be researching new OS upgrades beforehand; and if that's your primary complaint about "Lion", it doesn't seem like there's a lot to complain about.

    31. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      You're quite right -- I did research my upgrades, and found that it would have been a very bad idea indeed to move beyond Leopard -- so I didn't. Nor do I plan to. Luckily, Leopard is on optical media, and is very amenable to Hackintoshery, so even if Apple drops the Mac Pro, when the time comes to upgrade my machine, I'm still going to be running Leopard on a heck of a nice machine. It just won't be an Apple. I'll either run Leopard native, or in a VM. Not worried about it at all. Been fixing some of the bugs in Leopard, too, so it's more reliable. Started with the cron/console false error message bug they never fixed.

      Unfortunately, WRT IOS5, they didn't "bother" to announce the 10.6 requirement until quite a while AFTER they released it, trumpeting the wifi sync capability. So I ended up with IOS5 on my iPad, and now many of my most commonly used apps crash, wifi sync doesn't work at all, notifications don't clear, and I have that turd of a "bookshelf" stuck in my previously nicely arranged folder collection, making a useless page all off by itself and messing up my single-page arrangement.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    32. Re:Soon by ShakaUVM · · Score: 1

      >>Indeed.. 30fps from a colour e-ink display. I can hardly imagine how strange it would be watching a video on one of these things.

      Yeah, that's got to be the most revolutionary bit about it.

      I've never bought a Kindle or any other e-ink device (though I tested plenty) because you can read a book in the time it takes to refresh the screen, which sort of defeats the point.

    33. Re:Soon by somersault · · Score: 1

      My comment in relation to it being strange was not about the FPS. It was about the fact that this is an e-ink (reflective) screen, rather than backlit. Even e-ink is novel to most people - we're definitely not used to ink that can animate quickly and in colour.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    34. Re:Soon by TuringTest · · Score: 1

      Is there something wrong with the Pixel Qi model of the Notion Ink Adam?

      I've never seen them IRL. But I've been following them through youtube videos, and the problem with Pixel Qi is that under sunlight it only looks good for laptops, but not for tablets. The touchscreen technology requires a reflective glass layer that negates almost all the benefits of the Qi display.

      --
      Singularity: a belief in the "God" idea with the "demiurge" relation inverted.
    35. Re:Soon by somersault · · Score: 1

      What is the point for you then? The point for me is first not having to have a shelf full of books, and second because I can carry around many books - even massive textbooks - in one small form factor. The page turn times really are fast enough for - probably about three quarters of a second at most on my Kindle keyboard, and maybe 0.1 of a second on my Android phone and tablet.

      It's funny - now whenever I read a real book, I want to touch the words on the screen to do a dictionary check.. then realise that it's just a paper book. D'oh!

      --
      which is totally what she said
    36. Re:Soon by somersault · · Score: 1

      You seem to have things mixed up. Some games these days have motion blur effects, but that's only a special effect, it's not to make things look "acceptable". If you freeze a TV frame in motion, you will see blurring. If you pause a computer game, you will always get a crisp clear image (unless like I said there's a special motion effect going on - like when you drive quickly in GTA IV for example).

      --
      which is totally what she said
    37. Re:Soon by adamchou · · Score: 1

      Can you please provide reference to the other low power passive technologies you mentioned? I'd like to do some research on whats around the corner and it sounds like you already know who the front runners are. Thanks.

    38. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My 1st gen Nook changes pages faster than you could turn the page in a paper book, so I don't know what you're talking about.

    39. Re:Soon by ShakaUVM · · Score: 1

      >>What is the point for you then? The point for me is first not having to have a shelf full of books, and second because I can carry around many books - even massive textbooks - in one small form factor.

      Sure, same selling point for me. But when a device pisses me off with glacial refresh or page turn times, it's just not very useful for me.

      Try flipping on a e-ink Kindle one page at a time through a book, and then try it from inside of a non-eink tablet, and a PC. The difference is pretty damn noticeable.

    40. Re:Soon by mangu · · Score: 2

      The worst code I've seen is almost invariably produced by EEs

      How does that compare with code produced by business or art school majors who want to try out being a programmer?

      All EEs who aren't old enough to have been retired long ago have taken courses on logic design. Things like state machines or indirect addressing come naturally to them. Software is a natural evolution from circuit design.

    41. Re:Soon by somersault · · Score: 1

      Well, I guess I must be too relaxed to care these days. The switch is obviously long enough to be noticeable, but I don't think the time is much different to turning a page - only there's less hassle because you are doing a tiny button click instead of moving a couple of fingers or a whole hand around. Either that or you have an earlier Kindle version than I have (bought mine in January).

      I read my tablet at home, and my Kindle each day on the bus, so I have experience of both.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    42. Re:Soon by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Indeed.. 30fps from a colour e-ink display. I can hardly imagine how strange it would be watching a video on one of these things.

      The only downside is that it's going to take a lot of CPU and thus a lot of battery to do the artistic painting effects we're all going to want to do with our screen refreshes and such.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    43. Re:Soon by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      You seem to have things mixed up. Some games these days have motion blur effects, but that's only a special effect, it's not to make things look "acceptable". If you freeze a TV frame in motion, you will see blurring. If you pause a computer game, you will always get a crisp clear image (unless like I said there's a special motion effect going on - like when you drive quickly in GTA IV for example).

      Actually, the motion blur is there to make the series of images look acceptable when the frame rate drops, so you're both right (or both wrong, if you're the glass-half-empty type.) But they will certainly tell you it's all aesthetic.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    44. Re:Soon by morgauxo · · Score: 1

      Which device manufacturer will buy the contract and get a monopoly?

    45. Re:Soon by Dog-Cow · · Score: 1

      What the bleep are you talking about? Every LCD panel has moving parts. How do you think they work?

    46. Re:Soon by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      It doesn't really take much longer than it takes the eye to change the focus on a word at the bottom of the page to focus at one at the top.

      Saying it takes too long to refresh a page seems kind of odd to me. It's not that bad.

      The only time it would be slow is if you're trying to move 10 pages at a time. I don't typically do this when reading- especially not fiction (or non fiction that is intended to be read sequentially)- which is the only thing I use my kindle for.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    47. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your sig, "democrat delenda est", is not valid classical Latin. However, if we use the usual inferences that allow us to translation medieval dog-latin, it means "the rule of the people must be annihilated".

    48. Re:Soon by omnichad · · Score: 1

      I'm a hackintosh Lion user, myself. I have no idea why you wouldn't want Snow Leopard on a Hackintosh OR a Mac. The performance improvements are dramatic. It's the difference between Vista and 7. What's keeping you on Leopard?

    49. Re:Soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The modifiable tattoo was an April Fools Day prank.

    50. Re:Soon by Luyseyal · · Score: 1

      in a cinema, but since Dogma and the Bourne movies popularised hand-held, all the best practice cinematography rules have been thrown out the window, in spite of how shitty the result looks.

      I blame Saving Private Ryan for that. In combination with the shutter timing, it is a very jarring experience (jarheads, notwithstanding).

      -l

      --
      Help cure AIDS, cancer, and more. Donate your unused computer time to worldcommunitygrid.org. Join Team Slashdot!
    51. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      What's keeping you on Leopard?

      Essentially, the red X's and Yellow triangles in this table.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    52. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      Also, I should mention that I'm not having performance issues. Eight-cores, three GHz, eight GB, three graphics cards, six monitors.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    53. Re:Soon by ShakaUVM · · Score: 1

      >>The only time it would be slow is if you're trying to move 10 pages at a time. I don't typically do this when reading- especially not fiction (or non fiction that is intended to be read sequentially)- which is the only thing I use my kindle for.

      In textbooks, I do this all the time, and it's really, really annoying on a Kindle. Tablets can be slow, too, if they have to think through and re-render each page, but if they're cached it's pretty fast. PCs, obviously, are the fastest at quickly moving through ebooks/PDFs.

      But even the normal page turning for fiction is too slow for me, and I hate the "e-ink flash". It breaks my concentration on the text and makes me focus instead on the device, which is a big UI no-no.

    54. Re:Soon by omnichad · · Score: 1

      Adobe CS3 is a yellow triangle but I only had minor problems with setting up in Snow Leopard or Lion and they work perfectly well once set up. For that matter, I was able to force Rosetta to install on Lion to get Final Cut Studio v1 installed without a lot of difficulty.
       
      Out of curiosity, which X's and triangles bother you?

    55. Re:Soon by omnichad · · Score: 1

      Just a huge power bill, I'm sure.

    56. Re:Soon by c++0xFF · · Score: 1

      Phew! I thought I was the only person who noticed this.

      My undergrad degree is EE, but I'd already been writing code well before. Seeing some of my classmates code was very, very painful. And it's not just a matter of experience, more like a mindset.

      I think the main problem is that EE's live in a world of very strict boundaries. Voltages that are guaranteed to be in a certain range. Logic that must fit within a specific clock cycle. As long as they stay within the specified boundaries in the datasheet, they're all set. And once you get something to work within those parameters, that's that. I exaggerate somewhat, of course.

      Software is different. Here, you interface with users. All communication is asynchronous -- no strict clock cycles. The software equivalent of a datasheet is the API documentation, and I would kill for it to be as clear and precise as what I see for electronics.

      Reading back over that, it makes it seem like software is more difficult than hardware -- that was not my intention. (Actually, I think the reverse is true.) But, I think it shows why EE's generally write poor code -- they have a hard time imagining a world that doesn't work with the same precision they're used to.

      The reverse happens when software people try to make hardware, especially now that software has become so abstracted from the hardware it runs on. Programmers have a hard time fitting within these same tight constraints that hardware requires.

    57. Re:Soon by c++0xFF · · Score: 1

      All EEs who aren't old enough to have been retired long ago have taken courses on logic design. Things like state machines or indirect addressing come naturally to them. Software is a natural evolution from circuit design.

      That used to be the case. But software has evolved a couple times since then, and we've gone further and further away from software that just acts like a state machine. Lots of programmers don't understand indirect addressing anymore.

    58. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      I'm very content to pay my power bill. Electronics improve my quality of life far beyond what I would be able to purchase with the money for that bill if I had no electricity. This is true for everything from the smallest electronic widget in the house to the Mac Pro, but the Mac Pro in particular doesn't just improve my QoL, it also earns its keep.

      We're working on off-the-grid stuff too, but it's a big job because we're profligate power consumers. Eventually, I hope to be independent of the power grid. The main problem is batteries. Short lifetimes and/or high maintainance. I don't have the real estate here for pumped storage, which is actually a fine solution (no pun intended) if you have the room, so I'm waiting on ultracapacitor development. Be a few years yet. In the meantime, the power company gets its well-deserved payment.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    59. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      Can you tell me more about Rosetta under Lion? This is a killer for me. WRT Snow Leopard, running Snowchecker today, looks like most of my apps/drivers that I was concerned about have been upgraded, so that's good. Last check, my scanner, guitar interface and VM were all incompatible, all three are marked "good" now.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    60. Re:Soon by RobbieThe1st · · Score: 1

      I'm thinking of the one game I play regularly - TF2. It definitely reduces eyestrain(even at higher framerates) when Motion Blur is enabled in the settings.

    61. Re:Soon by omnichad · · Score: 1

      I actually just ran the installer for Rosetta from the Snow Leopard disc on Lion. If you don't already have a Snow Leopard disc, those are of course going to be getting harder to find.

    62. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      I do own a Snow Leopard disk. I got it for my laptop, So that's good. So then, PPC apps "just work"?

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    63. Re:Soon by omnichad · · Score: 1

      Yeah. The Final Cut Studio installer is PPC-only, while Final Cut Studio itself was universal. I had no problems installing after that.

    64. Re:Soon by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      Well- fundamentally the need is very different in something like a novel, or a biography on one hand and a technical text book on the other.

      A novel, you read from start to finish- often reading long times in one sitting- flipping around isn't as important- you go in one direction. You want something easy on the eyes, like e-ink- not a glaring LCD screen to be most comfortable. Maybe e-ink isn't ready for you if even the short flash disrupts your concentration... the flash is much shorter in newer models than older ones- and each generation is quicker. I barely notice it.

      For a textbook- absolutely a kindle is poorly designed- for one thing it is probably too small- for another- colour is usefull frequently in a textbook for highlighting and help in understanding.

      As you said- in a textbook you do want to flip around alot.

      All these things make a kindle poor for a textbook- with a textbook you're also not staring at it continuously for 2 or 3 hours... you look at it and then look aside so LCD wouldn't be bad.

      All in all though- I think with a textbook nothing digital beats the real thing. Much prefer my kindle for novels though... for me personally it is rare I touch a text book these days- I use the internet for "Text-book" learning.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    65. Re:Soon by LordNimon · · Score: 1

      Things like state machines or indirect addressing come naturally to them. Software is a natural evolution from circuit design.

      The fact that you believe this makes it clear that you are one of those EE's who thinks he can program.

      --
      And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
      To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
    66. Re:Soon by ResidentSourcerer · · Score: 1

      What is it going to change? Assuming it doesn't cost the earth to make:

      1. A laptop or tablet I can use in full sun. make it waterproof. Finally a decent format for field guides, or for techy field work in general.

      2. Wall screen TV without a ruinous power bill. Interactive wall sized touch screens.

      3. Artist of the month club. Put up a 4 foot square frame, and have a different Monet painting every day, then next month it's Van Gogh.

      4. Live windows. E.g. You have a picture window in your apartment that shows a live very high def picture of an alpine meadow, or the field of view from your favorite satellite.

      5. In high heating/cooling climates, have no real windows. Just a camera and a screen.

      On a more sinister bend:

      6. Make one the size of a license plate, and have it show strange numbers when you are speeding.

      7. The equivalent of Dr Who's Magic paper that turns into whatever ID you want.

      --
      Third Career: Tree Farmer Second Career: Computer Geek First Career: Teacher, Outdoor Instructor, Photographer.
    67. Re:Soon by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      Thanks, appreciate the info.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    68. Re:Soon by Tubal-Cain · · Score: 1

      Interesting at the expense of hardware engineers. Why do hardware engineers have to put in all the time, effort, and knowledge, and get paid less than software engineers, while software engineers who make Phone apps and stupid facebook games reap in millions in venture capital ?

      Simple: it's a lot easier to get one million people to pay you $1 than it is to get one person to pay you $1,000,000; and the VCs know it.

  2. Yay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

    This is great! I keep a Sony Reader, since it accepts SD cards, loaded with survival manuals, medical books, car/motorcycle repair manuals, only problem is most of the files are in PDF format, which the device isn't too great at displaying. Combine this screen in a device with large storage and battery, solar charging option and I'm all set Unless Ron Paul continues his trend, he's in second in Iowa, then I'll have no need for such a thing.

    1. Re:Yay by ColdWetDog · · Score: 4, Funny

      This is great! I keep a Sony Reader, since it accepts SD cards, loaded with survival manuals, medical books, car/motorcycle repair manuals, only problem is most of the files are in PDF format, which the device isn't too great at displaying. Combine this screen in a device with large storage and battery, solar charging option and I'm all set Unless Ron Paul continues his trend, he's in second in Iowa, then I'll have no need for such a thing.

      Oh wow. A techno survivalist nutjob. Here on Slashdot.

      Sorry guy, the Aliens have already contacted the Illuminati. NO digital devices will be allowed to the masses. Not even Ron Paul can save us now.

      We're doomed.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    2. Re:Yay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Bah. Keep in mind that every ounce you waste on your tech gadgets is one less round for your gun. And the guy who didn't skim rounds on his gun will eventually come by and take your Sony Reader from your cold, dead hands.

    3. Re:Yay by omfgnosis · · Score: 1

      At worst, the AC is harmless. More than likely, they are also a handy person to have around in a bind. But keep mocking people for Slashdot funny points, it makes you look so cool.

    4. Re:Yay by omfgnosis · · Score: 1

      I'd be a lot more inclined to take Ron Paul and his advocates seriously if the advocates were a lot more realistic about both his potential and his intentions. In the best case scenario, he would be extremely limited in terms of implementing the positive changes he's proposed, and he would also be forced to clarify vaguely positive-sounding ideas into coherent policy that would be, well, problematical.

      That's putting aside serious inconsistencies and problems in his platform and political approach.

    5. Re:Yay by Toonol · · Score: 1

      Yeah. Anybody paying attention over the last few decades should realize we don't have disasters any more. We've completely eliminated the problem of cars breaking down, and there is no political turmoil of any relevance.

  3. First World by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

    The troubles of first world countries; where changing everything is equivalent to lowering your electricity bill.

    1. Re:First World by nomel · · Score: 1

      Context is appropriate of course. They're talking about displays here, so the "changes everything" probably, just maybe, is more about "changes everything in display technology"...which it will.

  4. Backlight by alendit · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Am I the only one who wants backlight in his tablet? E-Ink is all nice and good, but its stupid to have to turn the lights on to read from an electronic device...

    1. Re:Backlight by Greystripe · · Score: 2

      Actually how hard would it be to have either a backlight that could be turned on/off at whim or a small glow bar that swung out from the face a short distance to provide illumination as needed?

    2. Re:Backlight by idji · · Score: 3, Informative

      Wrong! You will need much less front light than back light to see things. You need back light ALL THE TIME. You only need front light WHEN IT IS DARK. These devices will probably have away to produce some "side light" so you can read in the dark

    3. Re:Backlight by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Page two of the article states:
      "In dark conditions, light is directed onto the panel's modulators from LED lights at the edge of the panel."

    4. Re:Backlight by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      RTFA. They will have LEDs at the edges of the screen, providing backlight in dark conditions. In bright/outdoor conditions, these LEDs can be switched off and power is saved.

    5. Re:Backlight by mark-t · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Is it stupid to have to turn a light on to see at all?

      You'd normally need a light to read a real book anyways, how is needing a light to read something on a different surface any different?

      Maybe you like having tons of photons projected directly into your eyes, when your pupils are mostly dilated to accommodate reflect the total amount of light visible to you (which actually doesn't tend to average to much if the room is otherwise too dark to be able to read anything that isn't actually glowing, so your pupils are generally more dilated than they might need to be), but not everybody likes trying to read while staring into a flashlight.

    6. Re:Backlight by adolf · · Score: 1

      so your pupils are generally more dilated than they might need to be), but not everybody likes trying to read while staring into a flashlight.

      I think this is why the brightness of such displays is generally adjustable.

    7. Re:Backlight by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 4, Informative

      You cannot have a backlight with eInk, because it is not transparent. Not sure about Mirasol.

      A compact retractable LED light is certainly possible, and, indeed, precisely what Amazon did with their Kindle cover.

    8. Re:Backlight by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      I hope it doesn't suck as much as it did in Sony Reader way back - with very uneven light distribution across the screen.

    9. Re:Backlight by mark-t · · Score: 1

      Yes, of course... but to typically get it at a level that is suitable, you end up reducing contrast to below the level it would have otherwise appeared on a normal printed page, and given that the visual center of our brains depends heavily on contrast to identify shapes, one might as well just be trying to read a normal book in low light. While not actually being bad for your eyes directly, it's a pretty fast way to get a migraine.

    10. Re:Backlight by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Except the lowest setting is still too bright.

    11. Re:Backlight by adolf · · Score: 1

      I often prefer reading things with low contrast and low luminosity, particularly at night, and especially when excess ambient light might bother other people around me.

      Furthermore, even in today's civilized world, I don't always have control over the lighting of my immediate surroundings. Sometimes it is simply too dark to read, and I want to read anyway.

      I also don't get migraines, which I believe is a (non-)trait that I share with most other people.

      Please stop assuming that your own personal problems and preferences are universal amongst others. No amount of pseudo-science or personal anecdote is going to persuade me to believe that having a device with an electronic display that can self-illuminate is worse than having one that cannot.

    12. Re:Backlight by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      no.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    13. Re:Backlight by BlueCoder · · Score: 1

      I can imagine combining it with transparent LCD tech where an LCD puts out light in one direction but is transparent when the light shines back. Also such an overlay wouldn't require any resolution.

    14. Re:Backlight by alendit · · Score: 1

      Thanks, overlooked it. If its done right, I may be the optimal solution.

    15. Re:Backlight by alendit · · Score: 1

      Not sure what are you talking about. Maybe your tablet (or mobile) can't adjust the brightness right? On Nokia N800, for example, you can scale the backlight down pretty good and it is perfekt for using it in "absolute" darkness.

      You NEED photons projected directly into your pupils to see, reflected or otherwise doesn't make a big difference (yeah, reflected light is polarised, not that you could see it with a naked eye). It is a matter of light intensity and it is not that hard to adjust.

    16. Re:Backlight by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes he is.

    17. Re:Backlight by amRadioHed · · Score: 2

      Would someone RTFA? The displays have LCDs on the side which provide light for viewing when there is not enough ambient light.

      --
      We hope your rules and wisdom choke you / Now we are one in everlasting peace
    18. Re:Backlight by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      not everybody likes trying to read while staring into a flashlight.

      Colored text on black background. I don't give a damn if it looks too "dark" for someone's delicate sensitivity, I still can't understand why this isn't considered normal.

    19. Re:Backlight by Miamicanes · · Score: 1

      Try OLED. You can almost feel your retina sizzle when you view one in a dark environment ;-)

    20. Re:Backlight by mark-t · · Score: 1
      How often do you hear the notion that self-illuminating displays cause eye-strain? (Actually "eye-strain" is most likely a misinterpretation of what is actually physiologically going on, but it's still descriptive enough to give a general idea of where the problem actually lies.)

      The problem is not unique to myself... not remotely.

    21. Re:Backlight by Toonol · · Score: 1

      Absolutely he is the only one; we outvoted him 3-2.

    22. Re:Backlight by mark-t · · Score: 2

      While all you need is photons going into your eyes to *SEE*, you need actual contrast in order to visually perceive and recognize what it is that you are actually seeing (which is crucial for reading). Emissive displays can easily produce the necessary amount of contrast that makes reading easy to do, but when in room that is otherwise too dark to read in, it effectively amounts to trying to read while, as I said above, staring into a flashlight. While turning down the brightness on the display may help alleviate that particular problem, it creates another - lowering the contrast, which reduces your ability to visually process whatever it is you are looking at, and in a darkenned room, where the display is the only real source of light, any illumination from the display is still going to feel like trying to read while looking directly at a light bulb. Even if it's not actually uncomfortable because it's not bright enough to be, it's also then not going to be presenting enough contrast to your eyes for you to easily read what you are seeing. Admittedly, all of this may just be a technical limitation on current designs of emissive displays, and not an inherent flaw in an emissive concept, but owing to the fact that it is not present at all in passive displays, there's reasonable cause to suspect that emissive displays might just be a dead end in that regard.

      But as things sit right now, with an emissive display, and when in a room that is otherwise too dark to read in, you have to choose between getting a headache from looking at a bright display, or getting a headache from trying to read something that doesn't present enough contrast.

      In the end, the best thing to do is just turn on a light... and if you have another source of light anyways, then the backlight on the display is just so much wasted energy.

    23. Re:Backlight by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      http://lmgtfy.com/?q=bookmark+light

      I believe you will find may cheap solutions to the "it's dark and I want to read something" problem.

    24. Re:Backlight by lucian1900 · · Score: 1

      There are several devices with very good front lighting. Also, clip-on lights or things like the Kindle's cover are comfortable enough anyway.

    25. Re:Backlight by adolf · · Score: 1

      I hear far less about "eye strain" today then I did a dozen years ago when almost everyone still had a CRT on their desk, with a disturbingly-large portion of them flickering at 60Hz...

      But at the end of the day, can you really say that you'd prefer a device with no means of illuminating its own display over a device which has illumination available for use? The Qualcomm device in question here is of the latter type: Allegedly, it has a display which can be plainly seen in normal ambient light, as well as the ability to illuminate itself when deemed useful.

  5. Next year? Yeah right. by artor3 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    They're just now building the factory, and you expect the product to be in devices next year? That would be the smoothest production bring-up in history. Maybe in 2013.

  6. MEMS display by Smallpond · · Score: 2

    The Mirasol display technology is pretty cool.
    http://www.mirasoldisplays.com/mobile-display-imod-technology

    1. Re:MEMS display by Tacvek · · Score: 1

      Based on that video, it appears that the display is a 3 bit display, relying on the miniscule sizes and dithering to create intermediate tones. If the interface treats a hundred or so elements as one logical pixel that may work fine. Otherwise... well lets just say as a developer it suck to have to either predither for display, or to accept that different colors have different minimum widths necessary to display correctly.

      --
      Stylish sheet to fix many problems in Slashdot's D3: https://gist.github.com/801524
    2. Re:MEMS display by fyngyrz · · Score: 3, Informative

      Not dithering -- just cumulative addition. The more reflecting elements there are, the more color you get. So each pixel is a series of imod elements, arrays of R, G and B. Black is all off; dark color is just a few on... medium color is half of 'em on... bright color is all of 'em on.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    3. Re:MEMS display by Tacvek · · Score: 1

      Not dithering -- just cumulative addition. The more reflecting elements there are, the more color you get. So each pixel is a series of imod elements, arrays of R, G and B. Black is all off; dark color is just a few on... medium color is half of 'em on... bright color is all of 'em on.

      That is the very definition of dithering. Imagine a version of the display with only red pixels (for simplicity). That is a display with a 1 bit color pallet. You either have bright red or black. You want something in between so you create a pattern where 50 percent of the pixel are red, and 50 percent are black. That is dithering, no different than the classic example of a checkerboard pattern of red and blue pixels to create the appearance of purple.

      To maximize the advertised PPI of these displays I find it unlikely that they will actually pre-group a bunch of elements into hrdware pixels, which would avoid the need of inter-pixel dithering. Instead they will most likely expose a triad of elements as a hardware pixel, and let the software chose how to handle things. The software could group large arrays as a logical pixel, but at the cost of not appearing as sharp as the display allows, so instead most software will opt to controlling individual elements, which would allow sharper images at the cost of more work.

      --
      Stylish sheet to fix many problems in Slashdot's D3: https://gist.github.com/801524
  7. Disruptive by Sponge+Bath · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Apple is working on a high resolution (2048x1536) tablet display. I would guess they are aware of this technology. The article indicates yields are a problem so a 2048x1536 display is probably a ways away. Which will be more disruptive to the market, the leap in resolution or battery life?

    1. Re:Disruptive by tycoex · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Considering the vast majority of people are perfectly happy with 1920x1080 on a 50" screen, I doubt people will really care much if their 10" screen is any higher than that.

      The BIGGEST complaint/problem with smartphones today is the lower battery life. If I could choose between doubling the resolution on my phone and doubling the battery life, I would choose the battery life in a heartbeat.

    2. Re:Disruptive by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 5, Informative

      The reason why Apple needs 2048x1536, and not, say, 1980x1200, is because with the latter they cannot easily scale up existing apps with a simple 2x factor.

      (flexible layouts? what's that?)

    3. Re:Disruptive by shish · · Score: 2

      Battery life is good for mobile devices; but Apple pushing for retina displays in all circumstances means that we can avoid situations like this on all devices. Combine both of these with thin + flexible display research, and in maybe as little as 5 years time we will have invented something that can compete with paper \o/

      --
      I mod down anyone who says "I will be modded down for this", regardless of the rest of their comment
    4. Re:Disruptive by Sponge+Bath · · Score: 1

      Seriously? Modded down twice for a reasonable, on topic post? The mods tonight are afraid of discussion, or maybe Qualcomm employees.

    5. Re:Disruptive by Sponge+Bath · · Score: 1

      Ah, another victim of mod abuse by people who don't understand the purpose of forums. I feel your pain.

    6. Re:Disruptive by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      xrandr --output LVDS1 --scale 2x2

    7. Re:Disruptive by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      Paper?

      What is this... paper... you speak of?

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    8. Re:Disruptive by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      Not sure what you're trying to say. The point was that iPad currently has a resolution of 1024x768, and apps written for it use that to lay out their UI properly. If some future version of iPad has a different resolution, they'll need to do something to adapt existing apps that are not updated to be aware of it - the easiest is to just upscale them by two, as they did with iPhone: 320x480 -> 960x480. So, for iPad, they'll need 2048x1536. Upscaling by a fractional amount, like 1.5, would distort any bitmaps the app could be using.

    9. Re:Disruptive by MrHanky · · Score: 1

      Habitually claiming whatever Apple is rumoured to do as 'revolutionary' or 'disruptive' in a story about actual technological advances is in fact off topic and spam.

    10. Re:Disruptive by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      he is trying to say that you could render the old apps in the old resolution and just scale that to whatever resolution. it's something that's actually been done on some mobile platforms - as long as resolution jump is high enough and the ratio is roughly the same(to 10-20% variation) then it wouldn't really matter that much.

      but that's actually way too complicated for apple engineers, I suppose.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    11. Re:Disruptive by Miamicanes · · Score: 1

      > The BIGGEST complaint/problem with smartphones today is the lower battery life.

      And it's a problem that could be 100% solved if the damn manufacturers would just make the phones a millimeter or so thicker, and give them 3000mAH+ batteries instead of wimpy 1500-1800mAH batteries.The whole reason Android phones with extended batteries end up with a pregnant hump on the back is because the battery's volume has to fit within the footprint of the OEM battery. If they went back to circuit board designs that fit together like a Chinese puzzle (daughterboards stacked onto mainboards) the way PDA phones USED to get built ~8 years ago, they could shift all the electronics to the top half, and have the entire volume of the lower half for the larger battery. Open up a phone like the HTC Evo, and 1/3 of its interior space is orange plastic mounting bracket that could have been battery if they'd shifted the components around a little more. Maybe compromise between the Apple and Android approach... give the phone a non-replaceable 1000-1500mAH battery that fills all available space and always gets charged first & drained last, and a user-swappable1800mAH battery that gets preferentially used and charged last (so it'll be the one that wears out first).

      But no. They have to worry about stupid shit, like trying to make the phone 7mm thick, even though it's going to end up being more than a centimeter thick anyway after you've put it inside a well-padded Otterbox so it won't shatter into a $250 repair job the first time you drop it (a repair job that ends up being even more expensive because, in their quest to shave another .25mm from the thickness, they laminate the fucking glass onto the display so you can't just buy a $10 replacement glass on eBay... but don't get me started...).

      Disclaimer: I drop things a lot, prefer to keep my phone's CPU governor locked into "Performance" mode because it pisses me off when I turn it on and have the lockscreen widget stutter and be nonresponsive because the CPU is still scaled down to 100MHz, and I'm tormented daily between the desire to use an extended battery and the certainty of the phone shattering into an expensive repair job if I do (because no composite case will fit a Photon with an extended battery).

    12. Re:Disruptive by Toonol · · Score: 1

      Upscaling by a fractional amount, like 1.5, would distort any bitmaps the app could be using.

      True at low resolutions, but as the resolution and DPI increase, the distortions this causes are much less noticeable. This may not be a problem scaling from, say, 1024 to 1536. Individual pixels aren't as noticeable.

    13. Re:Disruptive by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      Resolution doesn't matter in this case, only DPI (i.e. physical size of a single pixel). On iPad, individual pixels are still way too big, and easily spotted. With 1.5x denser DPI, it'll be harder to spot, but still enough people will be able to do so - given how much Apple sweats about the look, I very much doubt they'll go along with it.

      Either way, I would expect them to roll out something with 2048x1536 - but not Mirasol (or other similar tech) - within the next two generations. It's what most users have been asking for, and it'll give them a nice edge in terms of raw numbers over Android 1280x800 tablets. Then again, it's still a good thing, because it means that there will be a mass-produced screen with that resolution, and then some Android manufacturers are also bound to start using it.

    14. Re:Disruptive by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      he is trying to say that you could render the old apps in the old resolution and just scale that to whatever resolution.

      It's not fundamentally different from what I was describing. The only difference is that, the way Apple does it (in iPhone 4 transition) is that they use vector scaling for UI inasmuch as possible, rather than scaling the entire output as a single bitmap. That way, even old iPhone 3 apps have sharp text when launched on iPhone 4; the only things that don't look so well are bitmaps.

      as long as resolution jump is high enough and the ratio is roughly the same(to 10-20% variation) then it wouldn't really matter that much.

      It will matter if you scale by a non-integer factor like 1.5x, because the resulting picture will either be distorted (if you do simple nearest neighbor scaling), or look blurry (if you do interpolation). True, with high enough DPI this won't be noticeable, but you'd need to be in "retina" territory for that to work. 2x scaling, on the other hand, translates to simply making every logical pixel consist of 4 physical pixels - there's no loss of detail or sharpness there, the only annoyance is that individual "pixels" in bitmaps are easier to see.

    15. Re:Disruptive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Paper covers rock.

  8. Simply not enough screen real-estate, I'm afraid. by mark-t · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Make it large enough to handle textbook content presented at a readable size (typically letter-sized pages), and I'd be all over it, as long as it allowed me to upload my own pdf's to it, and, perhaps no less important, as long as it wasn't priced ridiculously high. And yeah, I know there's some e-ink readers oout there with displays nearly that big, but the current state of affairs with eink displays totally blows. Page refreshes are so slow that I'd rather carry 20 lbs worth of textbooks than try to use an eink reader for anything other than the reading of fiction.

    A 14" screen would be ideal... although with a respectable resolution, a 10-11" one might also be able to suffice.

  9. Can't wait! by engun · · Score: 5, Informative

    I can't wait for this tech to get into tablets. Just a few of the advantages I'm expecting (and here's hoping there will be no disappointments)

    1. I stare at an LCD screen all day, and I really detest the backlight. This is what prevents me from reading on a "tablet". Mirasol will fix that.
    2. The Kindle's e-ink display, even though it didn't have colour, was simply amazing. However, the slow refresh rates combined with the lack of colour, made it too special purpose. Mirasol fixes all that, allowing for a general purpose tablet + e-reader and I can't imagine why that wouldn't succeed.
    3. The paper like effect (which I assume Mirasol will have), will be so much easier on the eyes - meaning less eye strain. Given a choice between ruining my eye sight and enduring bad colour, I'll choose bad colour anytime.
    4. We can go back to the look & feel of paper without the associated wastage (trees cut down etc. etc). One "electronic book" to substitute them all.
    5. A battery life comparable in the kindle range instead of the lcd range would be an added bonus, but not a deal breaker.
    6. Resolution however is important. I assume that high res screens will be available.
    7. Some form of built-in illumination in the absence of ambient light.

    1. Re:Can't wait! by macshit · · Score: 3, Informative

      I can't wait for this tech to get into tablets. Just a few of the advantages I'm expecting (and here's hoping there will be no disappointments)
      ...
      3. The paper like effect (which I assume Mirasol will have), will be so much easier on the eyes - meaning less eye strain. Given a choice between ruining my eye sight and enduring bad colour, I'll choose bad colour anytime.
      4. We can go back to the look & feel of paper without the associated wastage (trees cut down etc. etc). One "electronic book" to substitute them all.

      I dunno, it's not so clear it will be "paper-like"...

      e-paper uses a real matte reflective surface, like paper, but this mirasol stuff seems to be based on thin-film mirrors—i.e., not matte. Maybe they can do something with a diffusing layer over that, but who knows how much that will look like a real matte surface; it could look more like a material with significant sub-surface scatting, like wax...

      The other thing of course, is that because mirasol uses separate wave-length-specific sub-pixels for red, green, and blue, the amount of light reflected is going to be cut down accordingly, as each sub-pixel will be absorbing many wavelengths even when in its "reflecting" state. So it may very well be kind of dim. [On an LCD, they can compensate for that by simply cranking up the backlight sufficiently to make up for any losses, but mirasol is supposed to work in ambient light...]

      --
      We live, as we dream -- alone....
    2. Re:Can't wait! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Backlighting doesn't ruin your eyesight, keeping your eyes focused on one point for lengthy periods of time does. It doesn't matter if you're watching TV, using your computer, using your phone or reading a book. If you don't take breaks and refocus your eyes periodically, the effect is the same.

  10. E-ink like power consumption? by tylerni7 · · Score: 2

    What does the article mean by e-ink like power consumption? I can't tell if this technology requires power to remain in a given state, or whether it can be static like e-ink. Although the low power consumption of e-ink displays is largely due to their lack of a backlight, being able to display static content with 0 power consumption is really one of the coolest parts about e-ink tech.

    I read the article but it didn't seem to answer this, do any readers know? If it could display static content for free then that would be incredibly awesome.

    1. Re:E-ink like power consumption? by Jamie+Lokier · · Score: 5, Informative

      This page explains near the end: http://www.mirasoldisplays.com/mobile-display-imod-technology
      It's bistable, so it retains memory of the image without needing power (or only a little power), which is similar to e-ink.
      But it switches much faster than e-ink, so it can do video, presumably consuming power for the regions which change.

    2. Re:E-ink like power consumption? by tylerni7 · · Score: 1

      Awesome, thanks! I just looked a bit on their website and didn't see that page where they say it's bistable. That definitely makes it harder for e-ink to compare with this.

  11. Re:Next year? Yeah right. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Or maybe they will retro-fit a current factory with sup-prime equipment while they build a new factory with the proper equipment for a higher output for future orders?

  12. Too little too late by manekineko2 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    We've been hearing about this technology for years now, and unfortunately it's taken it so long to get to market that I think they've missed their market window.

    Smartphones and tablets, spurred on in large part by Apple, have entered into an arms race of display quality with consumer displays the likes has never been seen before. The sort of displays our mobile devices have make our computer monitors look shameful, with AMOLED pushing the boundaries in terms of true blacks and contrast ratios and viewing angles, and ever-higher resolutions pushing DPIs to the boundaries of human sight. Most LCD IPS displays, which are the cream of the crop for desktop monitors and better than any flat-screen TV, are really just average at best these days in the mobile world.

    The Mirasol displays, at least the ones that have been demoed, have never been the highest quality displays. Their two huge advantages are daylight-readability and low power-consumption. Those are two very positive traits, but at this stage, I don't really foresee anything outside of a niche market giving up ordinary-circumstance display quality for these.

    1. Re:Too little too late by rasmusbr · · Score: 1

      Okay, but smartphones and tablets were niche markets (at best) 10 years ago. Maybe power-efficient passive displays will enable a niche market to grow.

      For example solar-powered (or perhaps indoor light powered) advertisement and signage might become a big thing. Why solar powered? Well, in many places getting grid power to a sign can be difficult or expensive for bureaucratic/regulatory reasons.

    2. Re:Too little too late by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      colour accuracy has never been worse.

      as an apple h8er, i'll concede that their screen is the best in the tablet market, but it's in no way accurate (especially when it's crusted with grease marks).

      domestic LCD/LED/plasmas are all shit in this regard if left at factory settings, but at least when you calibrate them they can actually reproduce the whole gamut. the current crop of netbook and tablet displays can't do full saturation at all, meaning if you tweak a picture to look good on one, i'll look like a bad, over-colourful joke on a proper screen.

      * disclaimer: i worked for years as a telecine colourist

    3. Re:Too little too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      thats silly, the reason apple et al. increase the resolution isn't because people wanted it - that was the only thing they could improve. everyone wants better batteries, and once battery life improves an order of magnitude it will be a major game changer in the way and possible uses for modile tech

    4. Re:Too little too late by initialE · · Score: 1

      On the contrary, I think this is an excellent time to bring out new technology on products that the market already wants. Every iteration of a smartphone or tablet needs to bring out something different, something new, in order for people to ditch perfectly functional gadgets and get their hit of the latest coolness. In the end, it all boils down to how well you do your sales pitch, but underlying it is the assumption that you actually have something new to sell.

      --
      Starbucks, Harbuckle of Breath.
    5. Re:Too little too late by manekineko2 · · Score: 1

      No doubt, these things seem great for niche-markets. Color, motion-capable e-readers seem awesome.

      I do hope that they find their niches, and get the funds to continue to improve the technology. Because if you could get the resolution/angles/contrast of modern mobile displays onto something like a Mirasol display that is low power and daylight-readable and low-eyestrain, obviously that would be the best case scenario.

    6. Re:Too little too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you bought a Droid Razr like me, or I'd assume another other similar size screen - you may happily downgrade the quality of the screen for better battery life.

    7. Re:Too little too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most LCD IPS displays, which are the cream of the crop for desktop monitors and better than any flat-screen TV

      Er, you can buy IPS LCD flat screen TVs. Not that I'd take one over a good plasma.

    8. Re:Too little too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are wrong

  13. Re:Simply not enough screen real-estate, I'm afrai by rjstanford · · Score: 1

    Make it large enough to handle textbook content presented at a readable size (typically letter-sized pages), and I'd be all over it, as long as it allowed me to upload my own pdf's to it, and, perhaps no less important, as long as it wasn't priced ridiculously high. And yeah, I know there's some e-ink readers oout there with displays nearly that big, but the current state of affairs with eink displays totally blows. Page refreshes are so slow that I'd rather carry 20 lbs worth of textbooks than try to use an eink reader for anything other than the reading of fiction.

    Actually, full letter size is generally far too large. Take a standrd hardback book, then pare down the margin space you no longer need (and which is to be replaced by screen bezel, not empty pixels), and you've got a very well established field-tested form factor to work with.

    --
    You're special forces then? That's great! I just love your olympics!
  14. Image quality issues by Michael+Woodhams · · Score: 1

    As described, I'd expect poor image quality for three independent reasons.

    First, the cavities have just two reflecting surfaces. The interference design may work wonders on butterfly wings, but they have many reflective layers, not just two. With just two, the wavelength specificity of the reflected light will be poor: you won't be able to make a bright green spot, merely a greenish spot.

    Second, each subpixel can reflect only a particular colour (presumably they'll go for red, green and blue subpixels.) So if for a pixel all the subpixels are turned on, than means that 1/3 of the red light falling on the pixel will be reflected (i.e. from the red subpixel), 1/3 of the green light, and 1/3 of the blue light. This means that if we try to set the pixel as bright as possible (all subpixels on) we'll still only get a medium grey, not white.

    Third, each subpixel is either on or off, so each pixel can only display 8 colours. To get better colour reproduction will require dithering, which requires very many very small pixels to not visibly affect image quality.

    So, from the description I'm expecting a greyish display with washed out dithered colours. The tiny photo they include in the article shows considerably better quality than I'm expecting. (I really want to see a close up, high quality photo of the display showing a challenging image.) Are there reasons why my objections above are not valid?

    --
    Quattuor res in hoc mundo sanctae sunt: libri, liberi, libertas et liberalitas.
    1. Re:Image quality issues by Brian+Feldman · · Score: 1

      Second, each subpixel can reflect only a particular colour (presumably they'll go for red, green and blue subpixels.) So if for a pixel all the subpixels are turned on, than means that 1/3 of the red light falling on the pixel will be reflected (i.e. from the red subpixel), 1/3 of the green light, and 1/3 of the blue light. This means that if we try to set the pixel as bright as possible (all subpixels on) we'll still only get a medium grey, not white.

      Why would you presume that over CMYK? You seem to generally be giving the impression that you think this is a display that "lights up", rather than occludes.

      --
      Brian Fundakowski Feldman
    2. Re:Image quality issues by Michael+Woodhams · · Score: 1

      You might be right, but I'm not sure. This isn't like ink, where you can put two inks on the same place and have each subtract different colours. However, the point I'm trying to make works equally well if it is a CMY(K) colour scheme. The colour response will not be highly specific, so you won't be able to display pure colours.

      --
      Quattuor res in hoc mundo sanctae sunt: libri, liberi, libertas et liberalitas.
    3. Re:Image quality issues by fyngyrz · · Score: 4, Interesting

      With just two, the wavelength specificity of the reflected light will be poor: you won't be able to make a bright green spot, merely a greenish spot.

      No. The resonance (physical size) of the cavity controls the color; it doesn't depend upon how many layers are in there.

      This means that if we try to set the pixel as bright as possible (all subpixels on) we'll still only get a medium grey, not white.

      Yes and no (mostly no.) Look at your LCD screen. See that bright, burn-your-eyes out white capability? That comes from r,g and b spots. Meaning, each spot is only emitting 1/3 of the light that it takes to be white, or, in your concept, you're only seeing 1/3 as "white" as you could be (well, not exactly, since our eyes are nonlinear between red, green and blue, but anyway...) Still makes for a nice white. Bottom line: You don't have to reflect every photon to make a decent white. And in fact, paper reflects a lot of them at angles that don't hit your eyes, so you're not getting them all there, either. The "brightness" of the white here will depend on how wide the reflected photons spread on the way back out of the cells. Or to look at it another way, if the light reflection angle is 1/3 of the light capture angle, it'll seem perfectly white to you. The RGB nature of them isn't really the limiting factor.

      each subpixel is either on or off, so each pixel can only display 8 colours.

      No. Each pixel holds many elements. So the color of the pixel doesn't depend upon its neighbors.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    4. Re:Image quality issues by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I am disappoint. I thought each modulator would be tunable over the full wavelength range. These are formed by binary modulators for each primary color... like an LCD. If each modulator _could_ be continuously tunable, or at least tunable over a wide range of values, then you could have up to 3X the reflected brightness and better resolution. Maybe next decade...

    5. Re:Image quality issues by jmorris42 · · Score: 1

      > Look at your LCD screen. See that bright, burn-your-eyes out white capability?

      Ever looked at the naked backlight? THAT is burn your eyes out white. More than half is lost to the polarizer, then more than two thirds of what remains gets lost to the color filtering. That is why even a LED backlit LCD display draws so much fracking current if it is very large. Incandescent bulbs are about as power efficient . That is why we so need an alternative if we ever hope to have portable electronics that aren't constantly needing charging.

      > ..if the light reflection angle is 1/3 of the light capture angle, it'll seem perfectly white to you..

      In other words, they can trade viewing angle for brightness. Either way it is going to be an issue. Only so much light is hitting the display. If any one spot can only reflect back one small range of frequencies and absorb the majority, it is going to be dimmer than a sheet of standard office paper placed next to it unless they narrow the viewing angle. If they leave white areas between the pixels it will brighten the display at the cost of black levels and contrast.

      --
      Democrat delenda est
    6. Re:Image quality issues by Michael+Woodhams · · Score: 1

      No. The resonance (physical size) of the cavity controls the color; it doesn't depend upon how many layers are in there.
      The resonance size controls the wavelength which is most strongly reflected. The number of layers controls how sharp that peak is.

      An LCD is a very different situation, as an LCD emits its own light. The interferometric display only reflects incident light. We judge the whiteness of an object by how much it reflects compared to other things (so that we don't get misled by changes in ambient illumination) so if anything truly white is visible near the display, I would still expect the display to appear grey. (Actually, anything which is brighter at any wavelength than your 'white' surface I think will do it.)

      No. Each pixel holds many elements.

      OK, so there are very many very small subpixels - which is (nearly) what I said would be needed to avoid dithering. So they've solved that problem by the brute force approach.

      --
      Quattuor res in hoc mundo sanctae sunt: libri, liberi, libertas et liberalitas.
  15. The diference being by publiclurker · · Score: 2

    that the hardware guy can usually get something, no matter how bad, to appear to work. All of the software guy created hardware I've seen could barely catch fire.

    1. Re:The diference being by TuringTest · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The diference being that the hardware guy can usually get something, no matter how bad, to appear to work.

      That's what makes them far more dangerous.

      --
      Singularity: a belief in the "God" idea with the "demiurge" relation inverted.
  16. Loony Tunes Technology by boristdog · · Score: 4, Funny

    This technology uses "interferometric modulators", which I cannot hear in anything but Marvin the Martian's voice.

    1. Re:Loony Tunes Technology by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

      [moves arms in circle from over head down to sides, with accompanying Ack-ack-aaack-ack-aaack!]

      [Shoots Dove of Peace]

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  17. Re:Next year? Yeah right. by caladine · · Score: 1

    They actually announced the factory back in January. One would assume construction started around then, allowing them to meet a 2012 production deadline.
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-01-03/qualcomm-to-invest-about-1-billion-in-taiwan-display-plant-ministry-says.html

  18. What would it cost us ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Any idea how much would the displays cost us ? GE some time back invented methods to manufacture OLED in a cheaper way http://www.eetimes.com/electronics-news/4214335/Solid-state-lighting-coming-into-focus-semiconductor?pageNumber=2 but we don't see the LED screens costs to be down. Looks like technology advancement and product pricing are not directly proportional ;-)

  19. In other words, Ray Bradbury got it right. by xmark · · Score: 3, Interesting

    About a lot of things, actually.

    1. Re:In other words, Ray Bradbury got it right. by brantondaveperson · · Score: 1

      True, but it remains doubtful that the wallpaper will eat your parents.

  20. Re:Simply not enough screen real-estate, I'm afrai by fyngyrz · · Score: 2

    Better yet, get rid of the screen bezel and build a collapsible handle system into the back, so your hand can be behind it, yet still hold it securely. The bezel on my iPad strikes me as a complete waste of space. I might feel better about it if there had been a camera in my gen 1, but there isn't... the bezel just makes the thing so big I can quite get my hand around it without an uncomfortable stretch. We'll have a Kindle Fire in the house tomorrow, looking forward to reading on something that actually fits in my hand.

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  21. Maybe also sarefice resolution for color depth by BlueCoder · · Score: 2

    It's made of tiny monochromatic mirrors that reflect or black out specific colors. It's relies on the number of mirrors per pixel sub-color to determine color intensity. While I suspect they are grouping the sub-colors per pixel right next to each other if they didn't... if every sub-pixel on this display was more or less a group of RGB each... (not likely since humans are more sensitive to certain colors) then the display would be capable or variable resolution. More resolution the closer you get to the pure RGB colors or black and white. So text on the screen can potentially be at a higher resolution while colors pictures appear at lower resolutions. This is such an advantage I suspect the research is focused on interleaved color manufacturing. While the colors on the screen won't be perfect RGB they will be a balanced matrix of colors. Addressing is the only technical challenge which would mean three different color address buses for three different screen colors. One color, I think blue being a reduced resolution for a smaller palette. That's a lot info to be transmitted but fortunately the display is it's own memory.

    So to sum it up pictures at normal resolution, black/white text at 1000 times the resolution and nominal color text at 100 times the resolution.

    I want one....

    1. Re:Maybe also sarefice resolution for color depth by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Days late to the party here, but I find this so fascinating, I must put in my two bits. Let's do some math on the resolution vs. color depth tradeoff, and pixel size:

      * According to the cited website, these sub-pixels/cavities/mirrors/IMOD cells are microscopic, about 10 to 100 microns on a side. That's about 2500 to 250 elements per inch, linear density, if I have my math right.

      * Presuming color is linearly additive, then to equal 6-bits-per-color depth without dithering or other modulation schemes (and, for this, let's ignore the differing amounts of R+G+B needed to be perceived as white as cited above, and let's ignore addressing line width too), we'd need an area of 3*64 = 192 IMOD R+G+B elements, which in a sqare area, would be sqrt(192) = an area of 13 x 13 smaller-than-visibly-resolvable elements to equal the color depth of one 6-bit-capable 3-LCD color "pixel"

      * For 8 bit color depth: sqrt(3*256) = 16 times the linear pixel density of 8-bit-capable LCD technology

      * Prior presumptions effective, for print-quality of 300 linear dpi at 8 bits color depth, this would seem to require 300*16 = 4800 mirror elements per inch. Seems like they're in the ballpark, at 10 micron/side (2500 cells per inch), for a fine quality color display.

      * The site speaks of switching speed on the tens of microseconds, which opens the possibility using PWM (aka "duty cycle modulation") for color depth modulation per-cell, but at the greatly increased power cost of continuous switching of all pixels not of the 6 fully saturated colors, at a frequency above all motion video requirement rates. This might be practical in small displays comprised of larger cells where power consumption is unimportant.

      * This technology seems suitable for diverse bright ambient light viewable applications, beyond ultra-low power computer, cell phone and TV display applications. Reflective heads-up displays and control panels in all kinds of vehicles comes to mind.

      * As a screen, it may look like "animated paint", a new presentation aesthetic. Makes me think of "The Quibbler" -- but in color! We are getting closer to magic here!

  22. Re:Simply not enough screen real-estate, I'm afrai by Marcika · · Score: 1
    The bezel could shrink - but only if your new screen tech consumes a lot less juice. The iPad's dimensions and weight are determined by the massive battery needed to get a 10 hour run time for the LCD, not mechanical constraints. (This is also why smaller tablets like the Fire only run for 6-8 hours.)

    If bezel width were determined by mechanical reasons, the bezel wouldn't need to be any wider than an iPhone bezel...

  23. What's the point? by Hentes · · Score: 1

    If we use an eink-like display with 30fps frequency would it still use less power?

    1. Re:What's the point? by zevans · · Score: 1

      Yes, because it's still ONLY drawing power when the display changes. Even if that's 30 times a second that's still better than drawing power throughout the entire second.

      --
      "... and more and more now there are all kinds of electronic goodies available" -- Pink Floyd 1972
  24. Re:Simply not enough screen real-estate, I'm afrai by gl4ss · · Score: 1

    they'd need to do a dead zone around the edges for touch control, too.
    but qualcomm will just build the displays, it will be up to device manufacturers to actually put them to use.

    what this will do, is that it will push other display tech to cheaper regions.

    --
    world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
  25. Top 3 ... by knarfling · · Score: 3, Insightful

    What are the 3 scariest things to a SysAdmin?

    1. An Electrical Engineer with a software patch.
    2. A Programmer with a soldering iron.
    3. A user with an idea.

    --
    Great civilizations have lived and died on false theories. Don't mess up mine with a few facts.
  26. Re:Simply not enough screen real-estate, I'm afrai by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Full letter size has never been done, at least in a 'modern' tablet, so I think your supposition that it's 'far too large' lacks data to back it up.

    I know several business folks who would pay much more than current iPad prices for a tablet that would show a full page at 8.5x11 including margins (think contracts with handwritten changes).

    We tried iPads but the screen is too small for old guys with bad eyesight. We've costed out the time and materials that a satisfactorily-sized tablet would replace and found that the cost *just in paper, ink, and time spent by secretaries printing & walking to and from the printer* (i.e. excluding the cost of having secretaries type emails, which we assumed would not change) and came up with $2,300 per year.

    So, yeah, I call bullshit. Tiny screens may be awesome for you when you read Piers Anthony novels, but it's not sufficient for a small but significant part of the potential tablet market.

  27. Your geek card, please. Immediately. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    LCD != LED