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Patent Issue Delays Doom 3 Source Code Release

An anonymous reader writes "id Software is still planning to release the Doom 3 source this year, but it's been delayed by a patent issue that's causing John Carmack to personally rewrite some of the code. The patent issue in Doom 3 concerns the Carmack's Reverse algorithm and has led Carmack to rewrite it in the open-source Doom 3."

13 of 283 comments (clear)

  1. Re:Human civilization fail by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 5, Informative

    If it makes you feel any better, the holder of this patent isn't strictly a patent troll; but Creative, world renowned for having not done a damn thing worth mentioning since the SoundBlaster, and somehow continuing to ship alarmingly priced cards in the face of shit that has the decency to be priced as such, from outfits like realtek, and genuinely decent hardware from companies that actually know something about audio...

  2. Re:Human civilization fail by D'Arque+Bishop · · Score: 5, Informative

    It gets worse when you consider that (if I recall correctly), the patent was held by Creative Labs, and they waited until a month or two before the game was to be released to inform id of the patent. They essentially blackmailed id into putting EAX-specific features to avoid a lawsuit and delay the game's release.

  3. Re:About the software patent-- IBTT by Xest · · Score: 4, Informative

    It escaped litigation because id made a deal with creative to promote creative hardware within Doom 3 in exchange for not getting sued.

    Presumably that deal didn't include releasing the source at some point.

  4. Re:Can a developer explain this? by tibit · · Score: 3, Informative

    For patents, the filing date is what counts in this scenario. The one to file first "wins". There's more to it, IIRC, as you can claim priority on public disclosures and foreign patents. So if you publish something in a scientific journal, say, you have a year to file a patent for it, and your invention is protected retroactively since the publication date in the journal. Someone who knows U.S. patent law better feel free to chime in with corrections, I'm not 100% sure about it. I'll ask a patent lawyer at work to see if he has anything to add to that.

    --
    A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
  5. Re:Can a developer explain this? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    I think it's actually the reverse, at least currently. I believe the US is currently a first to invent system. However, there is legislation that is either going to be passed or may have just been passed recently that changes it to first to file as you described.

    I'm not sure how that would apply retroactively, though, nor am I sure what date such a change would take effect if it has already been passed.

  6. John Carmack on Software Patents by chrb · · Score: 5, Informative

    "The idea that I can be presented with a problem, set out to logically solve it with the tools at hand, and wind up with a program that could not be legally used because someone else followed the same logical steps some years ago and filed for a patent on it is horrifying." - John Carmack

  7. Re:Human civilization fail by Eraesr · · Score: 5, Informative

    They (Creative) already did. id Software and Creative Labs made an agreement that id Software could use the algorithm without paying any fees if they included support for Creative's EAX and branded the game with Creative Labs logos. See http://techreport.com/discussions.x/7113

  8. Re:Human civilization fail by Mad+Merlin · · Score: 4, Informative

    Id at the time agreed to use some Creative sound technology in Doom 3 that they wouldn't have otherwise used in exchange for Creative not patent trolling Id over Carmack's Reverse being used in Doom 3.

  9. Re:Human civilization fail by queequeg1 · · Score: 2, Informative

    No, trademark owners are required to protect their IP rights or risk losing them. The one possible exception in the patent world is submarine patents, but it doesn't sound like that sort of situation was present here.

  10. Re:Human civilization fail by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Creative did this to EVERY development studio if they used stencil shadows on previous generation titles. They certainly did for the developer I worked for. Why else do you think EAX survived longer then a heartbeat?

  11. Re:Human civilization fail by bhcompy · · Score: 4, Informative

    Wait, you actually had to ask if Creative Labs got litigious? Creative Labs is the biggest offender in the goddamned industry. Augh, I'm still pissed about Aureal

  12. Re:Human civilization fail by Bengie · · Score: 5, Informative

    I had an A3D sound card back in the late 90s, that cost $20 at the time and would still kick the crap out of a modern day $80 Creative card.

    Even back then, it had better 3D sound than I've heard in the past decade from any game, and used almost no CPU time, even back on my Celeron 450a.

    What happened to them you ask? Creative kept at them with a frivolous lawsuit that eventually bankrupt Aureal with lawyer fees. Aureal was ran almost entirely by engineers, which meant very cheap high quality and innovative products/research, but they couldn't survive in the USA lawsuit world.

    I have loathed Creative ever since. They are on the same level as RIAA/MPAA for me.

  13. Re:Human civilization fail by Moryath · · Score: 4, Informative

    And this kind of fucking bullshit is why mathematical algorithms should not fucking be patentable. EVER.