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Swedish Pirate Party Member To Be EU's Youngest MP
First time accepted submitter genjix writes "In a few weeks Amelia Andersdotter will be the second Pirate Party member to take a seat at the European Parliament in Brussels. The 24-year-old Swede was voted in more than two years ago, but due to bureaucratic quibbles her official appointment was delayed. TorrentFreak catches up with the soon-to-be youngest MEP to hear about her plans and expectations."
I wouldn't mind raising the jolly rodger up her!
24 years old is very young to be in any parliament... That's how old I am!
I wish her luck. Hopefully the concept can spread around the world, the current copyright situation is quite crazy as it stands.
One thing I know, and that is that I am ignorant...
After six or seven rounds of rubberstamping, the new Directive is put before the actual "Parliament", where MEPs can vote yea or nea, or just not show up in the hope that it will pass and they can plead ignorant neutrality. If they vote nea, it goes through the committee system a few more times so that some of the more deliberately egregious clauses can be elided. Honour satisfied, the Directive is duly passed in the form that the lobbyist really wanted, and Member States can begin the process of (mis)implementing it, or in the case of anyone South or East of Belgium, shrugging their shoulders and simply ignoring it.
And that's how democracy works.
If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
I think this is the first time I've read an article on copyright/patent/trademark law, consisting mostly of the words of a particular politician, and thought to myself: Hey, this person knows more than I do about the subject. Like, a lot more.
Whether the "piracy" issue is irrelevant or not, just sitting by and letting your rights be taken away while you are distracted by a larger issue is NOT going to help us in the future. It's precisely at times like this that you need to be vigilant of things that are going on and not just the big issues.
While you were distracted, what is to stop a far-right corporate drone from passing some legislation that further restricts your rights as a citizen and gives more rights to corporations?
You might as well pretend to be an ostrich and bury your head in the sand...
Ok, two things:
One: When will be a good time? There's ALWAYS something "more important". If the euro crisis is resolved, then the issue will be immigration, if that's resolved it will be something else, etc. So IMO they should go ahead.
Two: From TFA, the Pirate Party has about 7% of the vote, which is hardly "grandstanding" the issue. Whether the issue is significant or not is another debate. I think it is. Perhaps not as urgent as the euro crisis, but important none the less.
The fact that she's young perhaps indicates that she shouldn't take charge, but if everything is done by the old people then once they retire / die / whatever, there'll be a big leadership gap, so it's essential that the younger generation is involved to maintain any sort of stability and continuity in the resolution of these issues.
My 2c.
Unfortunately, most of the available people with the relevant life experience accrued that experience during the long process of driving the Euro zone(among other locations, today's clusterfucks are so very cosmopolitan...) into said black hole...
And I'm sorry, while I may agree with some of what the pirate party stand for , the access or not of content on the internet is irrelevant compared to the ecomonic crisis affecting most of europe. This isn't the time or the place for grandstanding an insignificant issue such as this and while she may be very bright there is no way a 24 year old has enough life experience to deal with the issues that need resolving before europe collapses into an economic black hole.
Yeah... And see what "life experience" brought us now...
Governments in general need the new blood. Even though I agree that the piracy and copyright laws are secondary, the MEP may bring worries and topics to debate that may remain unnatended in a 40+ years-old toad-infested parlament. All for new views of the world, doesn't matter how "immature" they might be.
"Why would the commission need be made up out of elected members when you can get better people that are not necessarily political connected? See the present Italian government."
Monti is a member of the Trilateral Comission and the Bilderberg group, as well as a Goldman Sachs "advisor". You dont get any better politically connected than that.
I think it is much more important, that if she starts with 24 and is good and clever enough could be someone - if she grows up - who has a great impact on the european politic, just like the other young politicians, MEPs, MPs, PP members and so on - which I would really welcome
If that "content on the internet" included, say, detailled information regarding said economic crisis from governmental regulatory bodies and from ministries and other administrative institutions responsible for the governance of, say, the financial industry, would you still agree it is insignificant? Here in Germany we had several state banks nearly or actually go bancrupt because of mismanagement, ridiculously risky business practices and outright malpractice. Had all their operational information been freely available to the public this would very likely have been caught early enough to prevent the losses that now have been passed on to the tax payer. And that is just one example.
In a world where politics (and economics) are largely a matter of back-room deals brokered between good ol' boys public scrutiny may well be one of the best ways to fight this crisis. Remember: We are in this situation not because of a sudden Ferengi invation but because a whole - I generally hate the term, but here it fits quite well - class of people had been left to play real-life Monopoly for decades without any real oversight or regulation. This crisis is not some natural disaster. It was brought over us by people.
Rudolf Hess edited Mein Kampf. He was the very first grammar nazi.
I see Conspiracy Corner is open for business.
"You might as well pretend to be an ostrich and bury your head in the sand."
I'd sooner be an ostrich than some squawking hen who makes a big noise when the fox is outside the coop but is fast asleep when she's strung up on a conveyer belt to have her neck cut and be diced into nuggets.
"40+ years-old"
Wow , 40+, thats so old! If you're a teenager. For most people the 30s and 40s are when you finally mature into someone who can make sensible decisions and less bound over by knee jerk group think.
"All for new views of the world, doesn't matter how "immature" they might be."
Fine, using that logic lets vote pre-schoolers into parliament.
Though the name implies it, a large part of the pirate parties program is citizen rights, including non-censorship and anti-surveillance. What they think of other topics is mostly irreleveant - in germany the stance on surveillance of the politicians of the big parties already changed siginficantly when they noticed that there is indeed a large percentage of people who care about it. The fact that they just behave that way because they are afraid to lose votes isn't really relevant.
Officials working in the Commission have all passed hard selection tests, in which the average number of candidates per post are in the 100s to 1. They are thoroughly checked on professional knowledge, languages spoken, work experience and ethics. Trust me, the lucky few who eventually get a job are very, very bright people worth their salt.
Can you say that much about your average MP? Where I come from, the Parliament is composed of:
a) medical-grade morons (25 - 35 %)
b) thieves and con men (the bulk)
c) knowledgeable people (5 %?)
If you watched Idiocracy, you probably get the idea. Why not put some tests in place for all would-be MPs then? If you need a license for the God-given right to drive a car, I don't see why we don't require the same for people who want to hold a public position of such consequence?
Yes, let's all just deal with the same problem at one time. That way, all of them will be solved that much quicker.
Wow , 40+, thats so old! If you're a teenager. For most people the 30s and 40s are when you finally mature into someone who can make sensible decisions and less bound over by knee jerk group think.
With an attitude like that, no wonder. Especially as you yourself are advocating this "group think" you are talking about.
It is fairly accepted that diversity in a group tends to increase the quality of decision making. I do not see the reason in keeping intelligent people away from parliament just because they are not old or "mature" enough.
Fine, using that logic lets vote pre-schoolers into parliament.
That argument is akin to saying "Fine, using that logic lets only drink water and not eat anything" to somebody who said water is good for you. I hope you can see that argument is fallacious, and well, quite silly.
Yeah... attacking the body of the text without touching the underlying rationale of it... Internet, why you fail to surprise me so...
Your "30s and 40s are when you finally mature" is an argument that reeks of conservationism thought, so I'll keep that in mind.
A Parliament (from the French parlement: discussion) is supposed to represent ALL strata of society. Starting from the moment that you gain the totality of your civil personality (usually 18 years old in Western countries) to the end of your civil personality (death or declared incapacity of exertion of your civil rights by extraordinary causes such as extreme dementia, comatose status or any other similar, highly debilitating issue). therefore, your irony of underage parliament is ridiculous simpy because said "toddlers" would be represented by their legal guardian. And said legal guardians are, supposedly, represented. Think before you type.
That said, the young adult strata of the society is NOT represented in a parliament that estabilishes a minimum age starting of the second half of the thirties or even 40 years old (and that is the reason for me to say 40+). The truth is that the average of age for representatives is way higher, usually in the 50s. Your so cherished "life experience" is not, in any way, an objective requirement and is, usually, used as an excuse for the perpetuation of the status quo, delaying the insertion of fresh thought in governing bodies. Maturity is subjective, using a subjective criteria to support an objective criteria (maturity=age) does not make the objective criteria more valid.
My opinion is: if you are old enough to answer fully for your actions, you are old enough to ask for the trust of society and let you represent them in a governmental body. If said society supports you, great! Of course, that is a problem to lobbyists and corporations. Younger people didnt have the time to be properly introduced to the practices of the "backdoor politics" at least not in the sense that an older person would. Like you said, younger people are more prone to impulse. Thing is, I don't think impulse is a bad thing per se. There is no reason, thus far, that can truly justify a restriction against young adults to be a member of a parliament.
If you still think that maturity dictated by age is still a restriction to be enforced, well, enjoy your "no change" status for a while (no change n no moment was supposed to be a reference to Obama slogans. Saying that already before anyone sas anything about it.
Here you go.
The crisis isn't so unrelated to what the pirate party stands for after all. At the root of the crisis, and the recent Occupy protests, is the fact that political power has been going on auction to corporations. This is also a source of a lot of the pirates' peculiar woes.
xkcd is not in the sudoers file. This incident will be reported.
"I'd sooner be an ostrich than some squawking hen who makes a big noise when the fox is outside the coop but is fast asleep when she's strung up on a conveyer belt to have her neck cut and be diced into nuggets."
A very nice metaphor, but sadly also a straw man. The parent has only suggested that you keep your eyes open during both good and bad times, albeit with some hyperbole thrown in. It is considerably easier to get rights-restricting laws passed during mean times, as seen in the current effort to reduce labour laws in the UK.
If you're in favour of this, fine, but if you're not, you need to keep your eyes open.
"With an attitude like that, no wonder."
I'm a firm believer that if you are good enough, you are old enough. However, it is a fact that people in their 20s have no idea what it is like being 40, while the reverse is only partially true. I can only speak for myself, but I know that I believed myself quite mature when I was 24, and now I know for a fact that I wasn't.
Having said that, there is no particular reason why some exceptional 24-year-olds can't be mature enough. After all, it isn't like all 40-year-olds MPs are good enough.
the real problem is that this "half-state" gives you the worst of both sides...so we should go forward and have more integration and a simpler system with one central parliament... mond
To translate back into the original european, the "bureaucratic quibbles" in the summary are actually the ratification of the Lisbon treaty .
And I'm sorry, while I may agree with some of what the pirate party stand for , the access or not of content on the internet is irrelevant compared to the ecomonic crisis affecting most of europe. This isn't the time or the place for grandstanding an insignificant issue such as this and while she may be very bright there is no way a 24 year old has enough life experience to deal with the issues that need resolving before europe collapses into an economic black hole.
Very few politicians acquire their positions based on their intelligence and ability to understand complex issues such as economic problems. The problem is that most voters cannot distinguish between an honest expert on economic issues and a politician who is a hand puppet for special interests that has learned how to recite a handful of easily digestable talking points on camera. And life experience does not do anything for you when it comes to understanding economics. It requires intelligence and education. I am not saying that she is well equipped to handle this issue, just that she may be no worse equipped in comparison to the most senior member of the most popular party.
Conspiracy Corner? There is a long history of bad legislation on relatively small issues slipping through while The Big Issue has everyone's attention. I thought the ostrich analogy was a bit much, but you're changing my opinion on that...
"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
She's pretty hot, you're far too picky!
"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
I hate how some issues are so polarising.
"Piracy" shouldn't be a platform. Nor should allowing theft of intellectual rights.
That said- current laws are ludicrous and publishers have more rights than they should.
The current system of copyright, patents, etc is completely broken and needs losening up a lot. We should resist swinging the complete opposite direction though.
Like many issues- the best course is somewhere between what we have now and what the extremists on the other side want.
Yes, if I buy something, I should be able to make copies on any device I own- and maybe *loan* to a friend.
No, I shouldn't be able to rip it and sell it (or give it away) to whomever I choose.
Yes, copyright timeframes are too long. No, we shouldn't eliminate them entirely.
Why must every policy have to have an extreme answer?
As for age of the candidate. Whereas most 24 year olds probably are not mature enough to take office- even though at that age you think you know the ropes; some 24 year olds are.
There have been fantastic world leaders much younger than 24. It all depends on the individual.
"That's the way to do it" - Punch
The knee-jerking will probably generally decrease in adult age, not so sure about the groupthink though.
Some of my favourite people are from th US; Vonnegut, Chomsky, Bill Hicks.
Offtopic? Come on, this is a tasteful comment about a (geek) woman's appearance on a site full of mostly straight (geek) dudes. It is very much on-topic.
Male sexuality is not wrong, being a gross douchebag is wrong. They're not the same thing. Everytime you go PC-overkill a racist conservative smiles and chuckles, happy that you're proving him right and hastening the arrival of the day that he can openly express his racism once more!
"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
"Your "30s and 40s are when you finally mature" is an argument that reeks of conservationism thought, so I'll keep that in mind."
You do that, and when you grow up you'll realise that in general I was right.
"Your so cherished "life experience" is not, in any way, an objective requirement "
I gather from that statement that you don't actually have much and therefor think its irrelevant. I really hope you don't vote.
"There is no reason, thus far, that can truly justify a restriction against young adults to be a member of a parliament."
There is no restriction, other than the fact that most people don't vote for them for the reasons I stated.
"supposed to be a reference to Obama slogans"
Was it? I have no idea nor do I care, I'm not american.
"to somebody who said water is good for you. I hope you can see that argument is fallacious, and well, quite silly."
The only thing fallacious is your piss poor analogy. He said it doesn't matter how immature someone is therefor I took his argument to its logical conclusion. It would be like saying it doesn't matter how little nourishment is in some food , it should be considered equal with all other foods.
err, since when was there a right to piracy?
Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
Forgive my ignorance, but what do the abbreviations MP and MEP stand for? The only MP that I know of is military police. Obviously I am not from the European Union.
Is it that outlandish to think that somebody who has lived twice as long, experienced twice as much, met twice the people, seen twice the history, would have slightly more understanding of the world? It certainly isn't always the case, but it would seem to make sense.
All of your arguments are completely incorrect. You'll understand when you're older.
And you'll also understand why the Earth is flat. But only when you're older.
Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
Except that the "you'll understand when you're older" argument completely fails to answer any of your opponents' arguments and makes a number of assumptions that might not even be true (that they don't understand now but simply disagree and that they will agree in the future). I see no point in making such an argument.
Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
Your formal analysis shows the major difficulty anyone has in figuring out exactly who has the real power in the EU. All its legal literature is written in such a verbose, convoluted, impenetrable and obfuscated manner that it is quite impossible for a normal human to understand, yet at the same time very easy for the EU itself to interpret any way it likes, particularly as it has a Supreme Court specifically charged by treaty with 'returning verdicts that further European integration'. There can be little doubt that the intention of the EU is to become a centrally governed federation or unitary state, and the current economic crisis (caused by itself) is giving it all the excuse it needs to abandon any pretence otherwise. And who will run this? Well, in Scotland they say that "He who pays the piper calls the tune" and the fact that the Irish government seems obliged to present its budget proposals to German authorities before showing them to its own elected Parliament should contain a clue as to who really pulls the strings in the EU.
And what can one say about the unceremonious removal of two elected Prime Ministers and their replacement with appointed card-carrying EU lackeys. Who exactly ordered this? Were they elected by the people? I do not think any rational person could place 'democratic' and 'EU' in the same sentence. Even EU sycophants admit to what they euphemistically call a 'democratic deficit'. Everything I have discovered points to the European Parliament having no real power at all, as none of its decisions seem to be binding on the Commission, which concocts all the laws of the EU in secret, then orders the national governments to implement them. This 'parliament' is a cynical, tax-money-slurping front for what is a 'de facto' dictatorship; it has the legitimacy of a Mafia boss's cafe and the power of its waitresses.
I think we can safely say, without having to read any of the gazillions of pages of Euro-bullshit, that whoever really controls the EU it is not the European Parliament. There is absolutely no direct connection whatsoever between the people who live in the EU and those who make their laws, and manipulate their 'governments'. It is a totalitarian state, that subjugates the people with bureaucracy and bullshit instead of bombs and bullets.
Yes. Age is not a cure for stupidity. Some people absorb information like a sponge and are well informed and well read at 20. Some people manage to plug their ears and know nothing at 60.
The only good way of finding out what a person knows is testing their knowledge. Age is irrelevant.
It is considerably easier to get rights-restricting laws passed during mean times, as seen in the current effort to reduce labour laws in the UK.
But most people on slashdot would see these as being evil socialist restrictions of freedom of trade anyway. At some point you have to take sides, if you want a libertarian free-for-all don't be surprised if people see you as being on the side of big business and capitalism.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
However, it is a fact that people in their 20s have no idea what it is like being 40, while the reverse is only partially true.
I think I had at least some idea of what it would be like to be 40 when I was younger, I looked at my mother, father, aunts and uncles and their friends, and read books or watched TV and films about forty year olds.
You might as well say that no forty year old knows what it is like to be sixty.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Is it that outlandish to think that somebody who has lived twice as long, experienced twice as much, met twice the people, seen twice the history, would have slightly more understanding of the world? It certainly isn't always the case, but it would seem to make sense.
Some older people have learned from their experiences and acquired wisdom, most have just made more mistakes than someone younger, and carry on running in the same groove until they die.
The low proportion of wise to stupid people is the same for eighteen and eighty year olds.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
"But most people on slashdot would see these as being evil socialist restrictions of freedom of trade anyway. At some point you have to take sides, if you want a libertarian free-for-all don't be surprised if people see you as being on the side of big business and capitalism."
Absolutely. But then, I'm not personally a libertarian.
"I think I had at least some idea of what it would be like to be 40 when I was younger, I looked at my mother, father, aunts and uncles and their friends, and read books or watched TV and films about forty year olds. "
None of which gives you first hand knowledge. Your mother, father, aunts and uncles will never be fully honest about it and the books/movies will have an angle to make them interesting, which invalidates them as evidence.
"You might as well say that no forty year old knows what it is like to be sixty."
That is exactly what I am saying.
Is it that outlandish to think that somebody who has lived twice as long, experienced twice as much, met twice the people, seen twice the history, would have slightly more understanding of the world? It certainly isn't always the case, but it would seem to make sense.
Society in general is changing and advancing very quickly. Someone may well have experienced twice as much as someone younger, but how useful is that experience if a lot of it is now redundant or irrelevant in the context of the modern day society? They may have a better understanding of the world of when they were younger, but that may well be a very different world to the one now.
You are right that in some cases age could be a somewhat useful measure as a rule of thumb, but should not be the most important measure of someones understanding of the world.
Yeah, it was piss poor. I shouldn't have included it.