Slashdot Mirror
Discouraging Playstation Vita Details
itwbennett writes "Sony's new handheld gaming system, the Playstation Vita, launches in Japan in two weeks, and the latest report from Andriasang has some interesting details, including Sony's decision to go with proprietary memory cards. Sony says this is both for security reasons and to ensure a consistent experience for all users, but that 'doesn't explain why they're charging such enormous sums for these cards,' says blogger Peter Smith. 'The caveat here is that we haven't seen official pricing for the cards, but game retailer Gamestop lists them at $120 (!!) for a 32 GB card, $70 for a 16GB, $45 for 8 GB and $30 for a 4 GB.'"
which is why I don't buy Sony anymore...
So, um, does it take phone calls and run millions of apps? Or is it just some kind of limited gaming platform?
"Security" = trying hard to make sure consumers can't jailbreak their own devices.
Sony loves proprietary formats and the market is awash in cheap storage. This is a way to make memory valuable again, but I won't be surprised if someone is demoing a way to use SD cards on the thing within a year of launch.
Let's hope they'll invest some of that excess money into administrators who won't just leave the default passwords in place.
If anyone is surprised by this, they don't know Sony.
sudo eat my shorts
Because they can.
This just means that someone in China will be making money off selling an adapter for microSD cards.
Apple does exactly the same thing with iPad and iPhone prices, but doesnt let you swap the mysteriously expensive memory "cards". Clearly it's all about the value to the consumer, not the cost of manufacture.
The reason they're doing this is because fuck you.
The above mentioned proprietary memory card is for saving, patches, game data as well as DLC. As far as I'm aware they have not mentioned that said memory card would be used for actual games on the system. If we compare this to the Nintendo 3DS we find that Nintendo uses a regular SD/SDHC card for saves, downloadable content and similar while the retail games themselves comes on a completely different medium.
You mean like the SD card that plugs into the front of the Wii?
:(){
At least Microsoft will actually tell you that they're trying to rip you off. Sony pretends like they're doing you a favor.
Invent cheap microSD to proprietary adapter
Sell adapter bundled with SD cards for half Sony's price
Profit
???
Get sued by Sony
The only difference between the iPhone 4s 32Gb and 64 Gb is 32Gb of memory. The difference in price is $100. Are you all going to vilify Apple the same way for not including the ability to insert SD cards?
Brought to you by: "Al"toids - the curiously weird mint.
Vita will not be recognized as a mass storage device on your computer. You'll need to use a separate utility device.
All for security, and giving dirty pirates no direct access to the device.
This is hardly news. Sony has always gone the proprietary memory format and they have always been much more expensive than the generic equivalent. Is Sony even all that relevant anymore ? I could barely give away my PSP (slim) and don't get me started on the current PS3 with it's ridiculous looking motion controllers is utterly lame next to playing Kinect games on the Xbox. ... and it's a day away from getting even more integrated with my Xbox.
If the Vita also doubled as a decent phone, gps, and camera, I might take a look at it, but who really needs another web enabled device to lug around. My Windows Phone already ties in with my Xbox and has some entertaining away from the PC/Xbox games
http://www.engadget.com/2011/12/05/xbox-companion-app-for-wp7-will-launch-alongside-the-new-dashboa/
- tensions in our lives that are attacking our minds, unite themselves together to make our consciousness blind - op'ivy
This was on Kotaku yesterday: http://kotaku.com/5864910/digital-download-discount-for-vita-may-explain-sonys-memory-stick-plans
The info is unconfirmed, but it says they're charging 40% less for downloads than games at retail and that's why the memory cards are more expensive. In other words, please pay up front so they can hold your money for you, and very probably the developers don't get a cut.
Nintendo has a history of proprietary storage formats for every single one of its game systems, from the NES to the Wii. Sony has used CD, DVD, and Blu-Ray for the Playstation series.
Hell, the Wii won't even let you plug an external flash drive into its USB port.
Nintendo doesn't even allow you to redownload online purchases on a replacement system. I'd hardly compare to Nintendo as some bastion of consumer fairness. They have a long history of proprietary storage formats, while the Playstations have used CDs, DVDs, and Blu-Rays.
It's been known since last June that the Vita would use NGV memory cards due to size, weight, lack of noise, and other factors. The only difference with this story is that Slashdot has posted a summary slanting it in a certain direction, because this site hates Sony.
The point I'm trying to make is that Slashdot loves Nintendo and hates Sony, and this story (which is very old--NGV cards were known about last June) only exists to serve that purpose, yet Nintendo has a long history of using expensive, proprietary storage formats. The company doesn't even let you redownload purchases from their online store if you replace your device. Your purchases are forever tied to the single piece of hardware you bought.
The fact that the Wii U will "apparently" support USB HDs isn't very encouraging given that the Wii already had a USB port and did nothing with it. Further, the N64 and Gamecube used their own proprietary memory cards, as did the PS1 and PS2. There is nothing new in this story at all except that it serves as another opportunity for Slashdotters to bitch about Sony.
Nintendo isn't quite as evil as you think. They're just unprepared. My daughter dropped her out of warranty DSi into the toilet. I called them up and asked them how to transfer the save data to a new 3DS (That I had in the closet waiting for Christmas). They couldn't do anything, so they repaired the DSi for free. Outside of warranty. The problem is that people are afraid to ask and see what they can get.
You know, I really hate this type of comment.
"If you don't like it, don't bother complaining, just don't buy it."
Yeah, that will work. I have a better idea: let the company know why you're not buying it, and let other people know why you believe they shouldn't purchase it. That way the company has feedback on why people are refusing to buy their product, and the "invisible hand of the free market" is properly informed. Because don't forget, a proper free market involves informed customers, and people complaining about things they see as defects helps keep customers informed. (Which means that if someone is spreading lies about a product, sure, go ahead and debunk what they're saying.)
Word of mouth is important. Telling people to shut up about things that they don't like is silly and counterproductive.
Or, to invert your comment, if you don't care about high prices, don't bother complaining about people who do, just buy the expensive memory card. What do you care if other people don't?
You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
And sony also has to following to its name;
Minidisc
UMD
Atrac
SACD
memory stick (incl. MagicGate)
Sony loves proprietary gear, probably more so than any other company, they seem to persist with them a lot, and quite a few of them have been failures, atrac in particular, if they didn't persist with atrac and tried to make a digital music player people actually wanted, i doubt the ipod would have been a success.
Except that the Wii supports starndard micro SD cards. The N64 not supporting standard memory was kind of a given considering how old it is. On the wii I can pop my SD card out and put in in another wii with no problem. I can put it in my computer and backup my saves if i want. /. does not hate sony because its cool to hate sony, its because we have been fucked over so many times and sony is about to fuck us over again. For a divice that is suppost to function as a phone/media/game system not having standard memory support is just plain fucking retarded.
The NES, SNES, N64, Gamecube, Wii, Gameboy, Gameboy Advance, DS, and 3DS all use proprietary storage for games. Sony used CDs, DVDs, and Blu-Rays for the Playstation series.
The Gamecube and Wii use DVDs. They weren't a typical book type, and had protection mechanisms, but they absolutely are DVDs.
And proprietary storage for games isn't an issue for users. Proprietary storage for user data is an issue for users. Nintendo loves SD cards for user data storage.
The point I'm trying to make is that Slashdot loves Nintendo and hates Sony...
You are half right, and it was well earned.
The fact that the Wii U will "apparently" support USB HDs isn't very encouraging given that the Wii already had a USB port and did nothing with it.
They used it for the wifi adapter. Wii Content isn't exactly straining the 512 meg SD card that it comes with. It's not that surprising that USB support for external hard drives wasn't Nintendo's highest priority. Oh, incidentally, the whole thing about using the SD card really kinda sinks your argument.
There is nothing new in this story at all except that it serves as another opportunity for Slashdotters to bitch about Sony.
I'll be the first to admit I love bitching about Sony. You got me to confess, that's great! Only... it didn't make any of the points made about Sony go away. Sony isn't selling you anything better than standard flash memory at double the price. They're not selling something that's physically smaller, or has a bfd faster transfer rate, or SOMETHING that at least attempts to thinly justify the price. They're literally just saying "We want more money from you."
If you're a fan-boy, it just glides right in. If you're somebody without any particular biases, but somebody who buys memory cards because you have a cell phone or mp3 player or camera or whatever, it really is an obvious attempt at nickel-and-diming. Since it isn't something only a fanboy or haterade addict would complain about, it is a valid point.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
They got away with it in the '80s and '90s because they actually made good hardware and the concept of interoperability barely existed.
Not quite, remember Betamax? That was a fairly large case of interoperability- or at least support- being an issue, and Sony *not* getting away with it.
The only time they've had any real success with it was Blu-Ray
AFAIK, that isn't proprietary to the same extent, at least not in the sense that Sony almost unilaterally own and are pushing it. (Though I appreciate that they have one of the largest stakes in that business).
Today the reverse is true - their products tend to be sub-par and we increasingly expect stuff to work across our devices, but they're still stuck in the past.
Sony squandered what could have been a major lead in what became the MP3 audio market, and ended up being left behind.
In theory, MiniDisc could have been something akin to a proto-MP3 player almost a decade before (worthwhile versions of) the latter became commonplace. Some sort of very basic filesystem- just enough to let music files be copied to and from the device- would probably have been doable without increasing the technological complexity of the MiniDisc that much. Given that most people didn't have computers with enough storage to benefit from that back then, perhaps that was an understandable omission.
However, their tying it down beyond what people would have seen was technologically possible and desirable even then- i.e. forcing real-time dubbing, restricting what could be done digitally with copying, etc.- blatantly crippled the potential of the system for their own reasons, making it a slightly improved digital version of the standard cassette, but little more. The Japanese went for it, but its success was limited elsewhere.
Then when MP3 came along, they dragged their feet for ages- maybe because they saw this as a paradigm-shift threat to their existing portable players, not realising that the *real* threat was that the market was going that way anyway, and that they could join it ASAP or lose their lead. Of course, they *did* lose their market-leading position, to Apple. "iPod" was the success story of the first decade of this millennium, not some next-generation solid-state "Walkman".
Even after all this, they joined in in a half-baked cynical manner, trying to play things the old way while looking like they were embracing the new. Remember those stupid pseudo-MP3 players that required you to convert all your files to ATRAC via their crappy software before they'd support them? (No, I don't care whether that version of ATRAC was better than MP3 or not- by that point everyone had settled on MP3, Sony had *already* lost their opportunity to dictate what the market would use, and this move was just a mixture of NIH and arrogance).
So, Sony lost the portable audio market through their own arrogance, short-termist self interest, NIHism and generally blinkered short-sightedness... and they really, *really* have no-one to blame but themselves.
"Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
FYI, the "PS1", or "Playstation" as we called it, did prevent burned games from working.
Vita would use NGV memory cards due to size, weight, lack of noise, and other factors..
I'm fairly certain that few people would find a micro-SD card too heavy or too big. Also, I can't recall what noise my micro-SD card makes... anyone?
Every one of those reasons is spurious. Let's just call it what it is. It's Sony being Sony; and that's ok.
I'll believe in corporations having personhood when Texas executes one... - advocate_one
Allow me to explain what happened behind the scenes:
CSR Smithers: Sir, there's a man on the phone who says his daughter dropped her DSi in the toilet and he wants to know how to transfer the save data to the 3DS he's going to give her for Christmas. But there's no way to do that! What should I do?
Supervisor Burns: Dear God! The child has heard that the iPhone is going to do everything our product does and more for less money, so she threw it in the toilet! But the parent hasn't figured this out yet... we have to keep him from returning his 3DS until Christmas. Find some used DSi and send it to him.
CSR: But sir, it's out of warranty.
Supervisor: Just send it!
Poorly.
The PSX (as we called it) just read the bar code from the inner ring of the disc. If the data therein matched what the machine expected, it happily executed whatever code that might happen to be located on the rest of the disc.
And I haven't actually tried, but I'm willing to bet that a bone-stock PSX (as we called it) will gleefully read burned games with an appropriately-burned bar code.
And if such an ancient machine is capable of focusing ~1mm closer than usual, I'd even be willing to bet that it'd be happy to launch a burned game even if the bar code were printed on sticky tape.
But the rest of us just put a simple mod chip into our PSX (as we called it) to emulate this bar code-reading behavior, after which things generally worked fine for all manner of discs.
Kid-proof tablet..