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WURFL Founders Fire Off DMCA Takedown Against Fork

An anonymous reader writes "ScientiaMobile, the company formed behind the open source library WURFL, an API used to do mobile device detection for web applications, has issued a DMCA takedown notice against the OpenDDR project on Github. ScientiaMobile claims that OpenDDR is 'ripping them off' by forking their database, which used to be licensed under a liberal license. Newer versions of the device database are licensed under restrictive licenses which do not allow any modification or redistribution."

28 of 169 comments (clear)

  1. Again by Squiddie · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Just another example of the blatant abuse that is possible with these laws. SOPA will only make it worse if it passes.

    1. Re:Again by iluvcapra · · Score: 4, Insightful

      SOPA could also be used to take down closed-source uses of GPL'd software-- both instances are legitimate applications. The problem is the copyright claim, not the enforcement.

      A problem here could be in the remedy, according to TFA the court may simply find that the database in question isn't copyrightable, as it's merely facts. That's a win for the fork, but it's a fail if you're release GPL software and commercial software vendors decide they want to copy static resources out of your distribution insofar as they can claim that they're "mere facts."

      --
      Don't blame me, I voted for Baltar.
    2. Re:Again by icebraining · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No, the problem is that the law permits unsupervised takedowns.

    3. Re:Again by DarkOx · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It will be the enforcement though:

      Lets try a little thought experiment.
      What happens under the SOPA when say Me (a nobody) has a little GPL app on their personal domain, that either $BIGMEDIA_GUY (where say Sony or Disney would be compatible types ) thinks infringes on their property or could be used to do so?

      My guess is that my domain is yanked so fast my head spins and I can either drop the matter or spend years fighting in court to get it back.

      Now lets say I think $BIGMEDIA_GUY is using my code and not complying with the GPL and lets assume I have some evidence like hey the device behaves in this out of spec way exactly my code does or something. Now I present this to ICE or FTC or whoever is supposed to be enforcing this thing. Do you think BIGMEDIA_GUY is going to see their domain yanked?

      I don't...

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    4. Re:Again by Hatta · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The problem is the copyright claim, not the enforcement.

      The problem is that enforcement occurs before the validity of the copyright claim is established.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    5. Re:Again by sjames · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The problem is it doesn't make copyright more enforceable. It just strips out due process to make enforcement faster and abuse becomes much easier. It also becomes a lot harder to prevent or reverse abuse.

    6. Re:Again by Dog-Cow · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Here's the problem. You are living in a world of theory. My GP is living in this world. Most GPL software has no money behind it. Trying to use SOPA against Sony or Disney will fail completely if they "borrow" some code off of github. They wouldn't go against IBM or Google, but they will feel no compunction against violating copyright of some dinky little project on github or sourceforge. Remember, laws are not enforced those who bought the laws.

    7. Re:Again by denis-The-menace · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "RE: [SOPA] will have the effect of making the GPL stronger and more defendable."

      Under SOPA, Github and SourceForge will be gone within a month. You cannot defend GPL if you can't get to your source code!

      --
      Obama's legacy: (N)othing (S)ecure (A)nywhere and (T)error (S)imulation (A)dministration
    8. Re:Again by DarkOx · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I would be inclined to agree with you I thought were getting a regime where all would be equal before the law.

      Maybe I am a bit jaded but I just don't see it happening. What I do see happening is the media cartel are being given a draconian tool, an Internet death penalty if you will, to deal with anyone they don't like. Where those anyone's don't get much in the way of due process before the action initial action is taken against them. If domains were being seize after some sort of civial court process found an owner liable or criminal court process found them to be guilty it be different. That is not how it works though.

      I also don't see these actions being used against the cartel members ever. What mid level bureaucrat is going to risk his job pulling the DNS glue records for Sony.com, Disney.com, or even a comparatively little guy like a Tivo.com?

      Current law is not exactly applied equally? Remember Sony's root kit? There were no criminal proceedings against them, at all IIRC, and class action civil case where victims basically had to settle for discount CD.

      Now had I distributed a root kit with some software I wrote, or media I published or whatever, it would have been correctly called a trojan and I am certain I would have been prosecuted as we have seen them do in plenty of Slashdot stories, about highschool kids where were just playing prank.

      What Sony did was illegally convert the property of others for their use, executing code on people's computers without permission, and expose them to potentially serious security vulnerabilities that could have resulted in personal information leaking, which might have allowed them to be further victimized by others and the government did NOTHING.

      So personally I'd rather see IP law, wire/electronic fraud laws weakened as much as possible; because they are not there for you and me.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    9. Re:Again by sjames · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Actually, I am entitled to those rights. They're just not appropriately respected.

    10. Re:Again by iluvcapra · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Oh shut up already

      You jest, but if Slashdot wanted to shut me up they'd be completely in their rights. I have no right to have anything I post appear here, moderation or no.

      I think if people did more standing on soapboxes and spent less energy fighting for the hypothetical rights of someone to reproduce five minutes from The Daily Show on Youtube we'd certainly live in a better world.

      --
      Don't blame me, I voted for Baltar.
    11. Re:Again by Bob9113 · · Score: 3, Informative

      I present this to ICE or FTC or whoever is supposed to be enforcing this thing.

      That's part of the fun of SOPA too -- while the government does have to get involved with enforced takedowns, the bill also removes any liability for voluntary takedowns by ISPs. So if Warner Cable decides to censor any website hosting information on how to rip DVDs, they cannot be held liable despite the fact that they operate a communications service with the benefit of government granted easements (like cable rights of way) and, in many markets, government granted monopolies.

    12. Re:Again by DarkOx · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Well I am not fan of the DMCA either but this is much worse. If I get a DMCA take down requests, I have options.

      I can simply comply, the offending material gets removed, I still have my domain, and control over my other stuff.

      If I don't think the request is valid, I can choose not to comply, then go lawyer up. Again I still have control over my stuff initial and unless a judge issues some kinda of order or injunction, I have control until the process gets resolved.

      With the SOPA, Most likely the first I hear about anything is when I get an alert from my monitoring service that my site is down. That is BIG difference. It may not seem like it but that could mean all kinds of follow on effects in terms of lost customers, reputation, and lost time. I am pretty sure even if things are eventually found in your favor you're getting compensated for none of it! Heck something like this can easily be abused just to disrupt upstarts they don't like.

      Its wrong. Its un-American, its anti-freedom, its anti-free enterprise, it amounts just rent seeking on the part of the cartel's interests.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
  2. Konami needs to issue a takedown notice too by tepples · · Score: 3, Funny

    Konami once sued Roxor Games for infringing Konami's patents on Dance Dance Revolution. Why can't Konami just send a takedown notice to OpenDDR for using a confusingly similar trademark?

  3. Success by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So it's like this,

    When the software is born look look at us, help our community were are open source blah blah blah.

    Suddenly the cow fattens , Oh no this is proprietary code blah blah yes open source , but our work business model etc.

    Seen this movie a lot of times, sadly

    1. Re:Success by galaad2 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      oddly enough their support forum is called "Community Support Forum"... shouldn't that be "Proprietary Support Forum" now?
      http://www.scientiamobile.com/forum/

      Also, Scientiamobile itself is in breach of SourceForge's Terms of use (they use SourceForge for file distribution!) because the Terms state:

      http://geek.net/terms-of-use
      "Except as otherwise expressly permitted by these Terms, any Code submitted to SourceForge.net must be licensed to Geeknet and other licensees under a license that is: compliant with the Open Source Initiative ("OSI")'s Open Source Definition (http://www.opensource.org/docs/osd) or certified as an "OSI-Approved License" (http://opensource.org/licenses)."

      imho, the license that they are using now is in COMPLETE VIOLATION with sourceforge's terms.

      i already submitted an abuse report with sourceforge for this... but i'm not sure if only one abuse report is enough

      --
      root@127.0.0.1
    2. Re:Success by Raenex · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Is sourceforge going to remove open source games as well?

      I don't know, but they should if they aren't really open source.

      They quite often have data (e.g. artwork, textures, sounds etc.) that is licensed differently than the source code. For convenience, the data is provided in the same bundle yet there may be restrictions on how you can use and distribute that data, if you read the license.

      I'm really sick of this dilution of open source. If, "for convenience", you make a "bundle" to distribute a complete game, then unless the whole game is open source, it isn't open source. You can claim the engine is open source, but to say the whole game is, that's lying for marketing purposes.

      Everybody wants to fly under the open source banner to get the warm fuzzies and marketing buzz, but then they want to add in the proprietary parts to get exclusive benefits. You wouldn't accept this behavior from Microsoft.

  4. Time to get the EFF involved by jenningsthecat · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There are far too many disputes in tech these days around formerly-open-source stuff that some bastard decides to co-opt and pretend he owns. This case strikes me as simple, clear-cut, winnable, and potentially precedent-setting. It would be good if the EFF brought its weight to bear on this issue - it could be crucial to the future of FOSS.

    --
    'The Economy' is a giant Ponzi scheme whose most pitiable suckers are the youngest among us and the yet-unborn.
  5. Benefit of the doubt by Baloroth · · Score: 4, Insightful

    To give ScientiaMobile the benefit of the doubt, it is possible they simply don't know how the licensing system works and don't realize that changing the license later on doesn't restrict uses of earlier versions that had been distributed under GPL. This would make them idiots, however. Presuming, of course, that OpenDDR doesn't use the newer version of the database (which I am assuming they don't and seems to be the idea from skimming TFA.)

    The alternative is that they are simply assholes deliberately trying to abuse the system. So they are either idiots or assholes.

    --
    "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
    1. Re:Benefit of the doubt by gman003 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So they are either idiots or assholes.

      Or both.

    2. Re:Benefit of the doubt by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Interesting

      To give ScientiaMobile the benefit of the doubt, it is possible they simply don't know how the licensing system works and don't realize that changing the license later on doesn't restrict uses of earlier versions that had been distributed under GPL

      Well, that makes them ignorant of some basic legal principles, and if they received any legal advice which suggested you could retroactively change something like that, their lawyer is incompetent.

      In many places it's illegal to pass a law that is ex post facto, and licenses are no different.

      There is no 'benefit of the doubt' to believe they simply didn't know this was the case -- this is either gross lack of knowledge about the legal system, or a blatant abuse of it. It's a pity the DMCA doesn't really have redress for abuses like this. Because I fail to see how this can be classified as an honest mistake.

      And, I don't see why they have to be either idiots or assholes -- in my opinion, they can be both, and if they sent a DMCA takedown, they likely are.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    3. Re:Benefit of the doubt by Hatta · · Score: 4, Informative

      Ex post facto is not quite what you're looking for here. They're not passing laws. I think the relevant legal issue is promissary estoppel.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
  6. Not being ripped off at all... by MrWeelson · · Score: 5, Informative

    From http://openddr.org/takedown.html, the original file had terms of use as below
    Seems clear to me - as long as OpenDDR are making public any changes.

    "All the information listed here has been collected by many different people from many different
              countries. You are allowed to use WURFL in any of your applications, free or commercial. The only thing required is to make public any
              modification to this file, following the original spirit and idea of the creators of this project."

  7. Summary by LizardKing · · Score: 4, Informative

    OpenDDR used the last snapshot of WURFL that had very liberal licensing. This snapshot dates from April last year. In July, the wording on the database file became a bit more restrictive, stating it was only for use with the WURFL API, but not in the terms of anything approaching a formal license. The subsequent version was the one that had the legalese restricting modification or redistribution. So the OpenDDR people were actually pretty careful about this.

    The sad thing is that most of the WURFL data came from third party contributions. These were probably submitted with a belief that the data would remain available the same way it had always been. The the WURFL developer (essentially one guy) decided to commercialise it. The moral of this would appear to be:

    • Don't submit to projects with unclear licensing
    • Don't host open source projects on sites that are subject to US jurisdiction
  8. person responsible by lkcl · · Score: 4, Informative

    it looks like this person is responsible for the stupidity: https://twitter.com/#!/luca_passani

    i've advised openddr to contact the SFLC but this is twitter: can i recommend that people also advise openddr on twitter to contact the SFLC, as well as pressurise the moron who doesn't understand what the DMCA is for.

    1. Re:person responsible by leromarinvit · · Score: 4, Insightful

      pressurise the moron who doesn't understand what the DMCA is for.

      I think he understands that very well - harrassing inconvenient competition.

      --
      Proud member of the Ferengi Socialist Party.
  9. The GPL is starting to make more sense. by liquidweaver · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I used to release works that I made under MIT or artistic - thinking the GPL was too extreme for my tastes.
    It is becoming clear to me that businesses _predictably_ try to "proprietize" anything they can - morals are never part of the equation. The only defense you have when writing software for the public (and keep it that way) is the include clear, strong, and pervasive licenses such as the GPL.

    The legal framework we live in, at least here stateside, basically demands we protect our works' right to be free and shared in an active fashion. Corporations only have incentives to try and lock down and monopolize anything they can - it makes sense and history continues to repeat itself. Looks like RMS was right; everything I write is GPL from here on out.

    --
    mov ah, 4ch
    int 21h
  10. Feist v. Rural; Nester's v. Hagstrom by tepples · · Score: 4, Informative

    you can't copyright a database (at least in the US).

    Citation needed.

    Feist Publications, Inc., v. Rural Telephone Service Co., 499 U.S. 340 (1991). Is this citation in the correct format?

    an individual map (and the intentional flaws introduced by the cartographer)

    Flaws like so-called "trap streets"? Nester's Map & Guide Corp. v. Hagstrom Map Co., 796 F.Supp. 729, E.D.N.Y., 1992. "To treat 'false' facts interspersed among actual facts and represented as actual facts as fiction would mean that no one could ever reproduce or copy actual facts without risk of reproducing a false fact and thereby violating a copyright. [...] If such were the law, information could never be reproduced or widely disseminated." (Id. at 733)

    the ability to copyright your interpretation of the facts, your method of storing them, your dataset, is fairly unlimited.

    To what extent does this copyright in the method of storing them survive automated conversion to another method?