Open Ministry Crowdsources Laws In Finland

First time accepted submitter emakinen writes "The new Citizens' Initiative service started today in Finland. On the Open Ministry website, anyone can present an idea for a law or initiative. If the idea wins enough support, the ministry's volunteer workers will work on it and turn it into a presentable bill for the MPs to chew over. If 50,000 citizens of voting age agree on a bill Parliament has to take it up."

Comments

The only drawback

[buchner.johannes]

The only drawback there are only 49,000 citizens.

Re:The only drawback

[buchner.johannes]

Of course, kidding, 50,000 is 1% of the population.

Re:The only drawback

[gl4ss]

there's a long tradition of internet "addresses" (petitions) for bitching about things in Finland.

on an interesting note, there's this one minister for whom there's this one petition with over 50k signatures.. to fire her. http://www.adressit.com/adressi_paivi_rasasen_erottamiseksi_ministerinvirasta

Although nobody is yet able to register support...

[solarissmoke]

There is, however, one obstacle that the Open Ministry and the entire citizens’ initiative law is already facing.

The Ministry of Justice should have a website where people can sign the initiatives. To be legally valid, the signing of an initiative requires a bank identifier code or some other form of accepted online signature to prove the signee is who he or she says he is.

The Ministry of Justice has not even commenced the constructing of such a system. It will not be up and running before the end of the year at the earliest.

Copyright and patent laws reform, here I come

[Gaygirlie]

This thing could very likely be used for the purposes of doing a complete patent and copyright system reform in small steps. I personally do not seek to completely abolish either, but I wish to bring both of them down to a maximum of 10 years so that people who patent stuff will actually have to also start utilizing their patents and not just hoard them, and copyrights won't keep on benefiting the creator for several lifetimes without them having to do any work ever again.

Do we have any Finns around here on /. that agree? I'm just curious.

This has been around for a while

[hammeraxe]

Something similar has been running in Latvia for a while now. People can sign online petitions that are submitted to the parliament if they get enough signatures. The identity verification is done by logging in with your bank details (as there is no official electronic ID as of now). Some of the successful initiatives include tighter tax control for shady offshore companies and stricter control of whether MPs actually obey their vows.

Calculus error

[vikingpower]

The real drawback is that it only takes $250,000 to pay 50,000 citizens $50 each to vote on crazy stuff to put before parliament...

It takes $ 2,500,000 to pay 50,000 citizens 50 each FTFY

Sellout to special interests

[abbamouse]

Sounds like a recipe for special interest groups to dominate politics. The same is true of initiative measures in the United States -- they are largely used by well-funded narrow interest groups to advance their agendas at the expense of the public. Indeed, the whole point of the signature requirements is to keep one person (of modest means) from making a difference. As Olson predicted, these schemes lead to the victory of highly committed, well-organized, resource-rich minority positions over the larger but diffuse interests of the public,

Re:That democracy doesn't work.

[speedwaystar]

you noticed the bit where it said "Parliament has to consider the proposition," not "the proposition automatically becomes law", didn't you?

Re:Although nobody is yet able to register support

[Luckyo]

So I will sign with my banking credentials (pretty much everyone has them here nowadays, they're offered for pretty much any new bank account). You just get a series of links containing "confirm your identity with your bank", click your bank, it takes you to the page of your bank where you enter your banking credentials and confirm that you want to be recognised by that site.

Whole process takes about 30 seconds.

Re:All land between the lines on roads world wide

[Luckyo]

In Finland, the most right wing party advertises itself as a "champion of welfare state". They're not really, but even they have to pay at least lip service.

We understand what we pay our taxes for. We have one of the most politically stable, safe, competitive and equal countries in the world. US-style unequal society is viewed with derision at best.

Re:Although nobody is yet able to register support

[tapanitarvainen]

"You just get a series of links containing "confirm your identity with your bank", click your bank, it takes you to the page of your bank where you enter your banking credentials and confirm that you want to be recognised by that site. Whole process takes about 30 seconds."

Sounds like a wet dream of the phishing industry.

Not really, since the credentials aren't reusable: you have a list of key-value pairs, each used only once, in random order. Moreover, payments require separate confirmation (second key-value match), so even man-in-the-middle attack with identification-only site wouldn't allow stealing your money (well, not that easily anyway).

Re:Switzerland?

[Kjella]

Since you seem to be omitting some details:

*) Deportation of foreigners convicted of serious crimes like murder, rape or other grave sex crime, robbery, human trafficking, drug trade, burglary or abuse of benefits. It not like you get deported for jaywalking or shoplifting.
*) Building minarets is forbidden by law, yes. (in English an interdiction is typically issued by a court, parliaments make law)
*) No statute of limitations for child molesters (no prescription is a bad translation)
*) Life sentence for non-treatable, extremely dangerous rapists. It does not apply to all of them.

I think only 2) would fail under the US constitution, 3) and 4) are mostly already so and 1) would probably be possible.