Nokia Applies For Vibrating Tattoo Patent

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Nokia Applies For Vibrating Tattoo Patent

Posted by Unknown on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @03:39AM from the everything-has-been-invented dept.

New submitter CanHasDIY writes "Tired of waiting for the Pip-Boy or Omni-Tool to be invented? Never fear! Nokia is developing the basic technology needed to make your dreams a reality: haptic-feedback tattoos. According to the patent application, Nokia is proposing 'a material attachable to skin, the material capable of detecting a magnetic field and transferring a perceivable stimulus to the skin, wherein the perceivable stimulus relates to the magnetic field.' Basically, the process is the same as for normal tattooing; the difference is in the ferromagnetic ink. Kind of brings new meaning to the term 'embedded device,' doesn't it?"

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I wonder what a MRI would feel like by FictionPimp · 2012-03-21 03:41 · Score: 5, Insightful

Subject says it all.
1. Re:I wonder what a MRI would feel like by Rakshasa-sensei · 2012-03-21 04:03 · Score: 1
  
  I was like... wow... I want that.
  
  Then I read your comment and realized I'd rather not have my skin ripped off every year.
2. Re:I wonder what a MRI would feel like by DragonTHC · 2012-03-21 04:27 · Score: 1
  
  why do you need an MRI every year?
  
  --
  They're using their grammar skills there.
3. Re:I wonder what a MRI would feel like by Rakshasa-sensei · 2012-03-21 04:53 · Score: 2
  
  Well, more like every second year... When the brain is involved it's better to be on the safe side.
  
  And it is one of the benefits of free universal healthcare; when it is necessary with regular checkups, even if expensive, there's no health insurance company there to complain.
4. Re:I wonder what a MRI would feel like by bughunter · 2012-03-21 04:54 · Score: 1
  
  Lots of reasons. My wife has MS and to detect new lesions and determine the effectiveness of her treatments they submit her to a 3T MRI once or twice a year.
  I can imagine quite a few other neurological or autoimmune disorders, not to mention cancer etc., that would have similar diagnostic requirements.
  
  --
  I can see the fnords!
5. Re:I wonder what a MRI would feel like by ILongForDarkness · 2012-03-21 05:20 · Score: 1
  
  Might work as an effective but expensive tattoo remover think Magneto from the X-men movie with hemoglobin :-)
6. Re:I wonder what a MRI would feel like by nomorecwrd · 2012-03-21 06:08 · Score: 1
  
  Your fingers can tell you if the cable is live now even without the tattoos....
  It may hurt a little bit, but you will end up with a nice curly hair ;-)
7. Re:I wonder what a MRI would feel like by Ungrounded+Lightning · 2012-03-21 07:35 · Score: 1
  
  Also, the tatroos detect magnetic, not electric, fields. So you might be able to tell if the line was VERY heavily loaded. But just being hot won't affect the tattoo.
  
  --
  Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
8. Re:I wonder what a MRI would feel like by elsurexiste · 2012-03-21 07:45 · Score: 1
  
  The part in which the magnet rips your skin apart must be a downer, I guess...
  
  --
  I rarely respond to comments. Also, don't ask for clarifications: a brain and Google are faster, believe me!
It's all nice and fine by Hentes · 2012-03-21 03:41 · Score: 4, Insightful

until you have to take an MRI.
1. Re:It's all nice and fine by Anonymous Coward · 2012-03-21 04:24 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  I've had MRIs (two of them, one after another), and among the checklist items beyond no metal was tattoos. Apparently they can heat up during an MRI, I was informed, when I asked why they had tattoos on the checklist form.
  Now, I don't have any tattoos, but the experience was interesting enough. For those who have not been in an MRI chamber, here is my take on that: I got the head MRI done, so the rest of me was outside the chamber. Still, the main issue was that I felt I was not able to breathe in there after about three minutes. They told me the air flow was at maximum, then gave me supplemental oxygen when I told them it still wasn't enough airflow, and I was good after that. (Otherwise, they told me, I would need to get a sedative from my doctor and then return.)
  Everything else wasn't even a factor, except for me mentioning it for others who have not had an MRI. The bed part isn't too hard, nor is it absolutely pillow soft, and they provide something to elevate the feet. The face shield isn't too bad it's like a football helmet mask. They offered me eye pads, but I said I wanted to be able to open and close my eyes at will, they didn't see any problems if I did open my eyes during the MRI. For me, it wasn't even the enclosed circular chamber with small diameter and no other visibility unless I would have moved my head to look at my feet (and moving the head is not allowed or it will blur the result). It wasn't even loud buzzing and grinding sounds despite having earplugs and earpads. It was just the airflow issue, and the oxygen fixed that.
2. Re:It's all nice and fine by Rakshasa-sensei · 2012-03-21 05:04 · Score: 1
  
  Having had about a dozen or so MRI's, I would say it's not very likely that the airflow was an issue. If your mind starts wandering the wrong way it can cause issues, the 'airflow' is one I can easily imagine coming up.
  
  Similar to the emergency button/pump you receive, as long as you hold it in your hand you're ok. But if it slips out of your hand then many fill freak out cause their state of mind ends up in an irretrievable place.
  
  So to sum it up; yes, it was the restrictive head position, yes, it was the closeness making it hard to focus on anything except for the small mirror, yes, it was the stress of trying to stay so very still while your heart is pumping and you need to swallow, and most definitely, yes, it was the loud clack clack clak drrrr sound that the boring music couldn't keep out.
  
  Just relax, it's not the airflow, you just need to relax and let your mind wander.
3. Re:It's all nice and fine by TheLink · 2012-03-21 06:07 · Score: 1
  
  I'd hate to have a choking/sneezing fit while stuck in there.
  --
  
  Too many replies beneath your current threshold
4. Re:It's all nice and fine by deroby · 2012-03-21 06:57 · Score: 1
  
  Having gone through 'the procedure' too (only once admittedly), I tend to agree that objectively all those annoyances are just that : annoying. But subjectively it's a different story. When you're laying there just waiting for the experience to be over it's hard not to get stressed by the combination of LOUD noise, the inability to change position even a little bit (both by the fact your head is restrained and because you know you don't want to ruin the session by causing blurred 'pictures' and having to do it all over again).
  I'm a (very) laid back type, but I too had to restrain myself from going some thought-paths, the mind indeed tends to wander to strange places when given too much time.
  
  --
  If there is one thing to be learned on slashdot, it has to be sarcasm.
5. Re:It's all nice and fine by guruevi · 2012-03-21 07:03 · Score: 1
  
  The no tattoos is because old tattoos and certain types of tattoos (if you got them in jail) are made with ferromagnetic ink (thus invalidating this patent). They can heat up and cause discomfort, even slight burns because of the currents induced by the magnetic field.
  The breathing problem is simple claustrophobia maybe you also had vertigo (I get vertigo after about 15 minutes in a 3T MRI) causing you to panic. There are no real "airflow" problems in an MRI, usually it's fanned which they can control.
  The "face shield" or as we call it "head coil" is the part that makes it actually work. Depending on the type of scans you do and the local setup there are a wide range of possibilities as far as making you comfortable, everyone has to offer adequate ear protection, most venues will offer at least music, masks etc. Some older people actually fall asleep in them. There are also places that offer video or personalized media and much more.
  
  --
  Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
6. Re:It's all nice and fine by s.petry · 2012-03-21 07:58 · Score: 1
  
  The breathing problem is simple claustrophobia maybe you also had vertigo (I get vertigo after about 15 minutes in a 3T MRI) causing you to panic. There are no real "airflow" problems in an MRI, usually it's fanned which they can control.
  Sorry, but you are not correct. Having been through the process about two dozen times (different issues/times) it really depends on the machine and site. I have been in MRIs that have good airflow, but others where there was little to no airflow. As a certified deep sea diver, I can promise that it's not purely claustrophobia.
  
  --
  -The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.
rule 34 by godrik · 2012-03-21 03:43 · Score: 5, Funny

Am I the only one to immediately think of how to apply rule 34 to it?
1. Re:rule 34 by GameboyRMH · 2012-03-21 03:50 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  I can see some applications in wireless teledildonics. Installation would suck though...
  
  --
  "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
2. Re:rule 34 by g0bshiTe · 2012-03-21 03:53 · Score: 2
  
  Man oh man, I'm going back to school, I want to major in teledildonics installations.
  
  --
  I am Bennett Haselton! I am Bennett Haselton!
3. Re:rule 34 by Anonymous Coward · 2012-03-21 04:07 · Score: 1
  
  Yes. Now please feel ashamed.
4. Re:rule 34 by Ol+Biscuitbarrel · 2012-03-21 04:15 · Score: 1
  
  You should be making productive use of your time and hang out at Slashdong, then.
  Well, actually it's just some blog. Rather unfortunate name, too.
5. Re:rule 34 by Beardo+the+Bearded · 2012-03-21 04:43 · Score: 1
  
  Nope, Terry Pratchett did it in Pyramids.
  
  --
  
  ---
  ECHELON is a government program to find words like bomb, jihad, plutonium, assassinate, and anarchy.
6. Re:rule 34 by FatdogHaiku · 2012-03-21 04:49 · Score: 1
  
  I'm thinking teledildonics lubrication technician would be more juicy...
  
  --
  You have the right to remain sentient. If you give up the right to remain sentient, you will be elected to public office
7. Re:rule 34 by bughunter · 2012-03-21 04:57 · Score: 1
  
  Am I the only one to immediately think of how to apply rule 34 to it?
  No. But don't forget that getting such a tattoo would require the repeated and numerous insertion of a needle into your genitals.
  
  --
  I can see the fnords!
8. Re:rule 34 by tsotha · 2012-03-21 05:54 · Score: 1
  
  It's not like people don't do that already with regular tattoo ink.
  My worry would be getting exposed to random magnetic fields from motors and such, then having to endure the smirks of people around me "Oh, is it Spring already? Hahaha." It would be like going through a second adolescence - "No, I will not go to the board and work out this math problem. I'm staying right here at my desk. Sitting. With my legs crossed."
Magneto by Anonymous Coward · 2012-03-21 03:44 · Score: 1

You would also no longer be admitted to visit Magneto in his glass prison.
Resolution by lorinc · 2012-03-21 03:53 · Score: 1

The real question is what would be the resolution of such device. Can it be so precise that a reasonable area of skin could be used to read message? Or to restore sight to blind people or to make a non visual augmented reality?
If this is more than a binary variable (vibrate or not), then it opens the doors to much more creative applications.

--
Video of some good progressive thrash music
Tactile feedback! by deciduousness · 2012-03-21 03:58 · Score: 1

I assume this could be used for alerting you for various things. Cell phone on vibrate. Or it could be used for feedback in video games. How about invisible fences for humans? Hikers could use this to be warned of dangerous areas or conditions. Could also be quite the distraction when you are driving.
1. Re:Tactile feedback! by PPH · 2012-03-21 04:39 · Score: 1
  
  Hikers could use this to be warned of dangerous areas or conditions.
  You mean the grizzly claw marks on your ass wasn't enough to give you the hint?
  
  --
  Have gnu, will travel.
2. Re:Tactile feedback! by Eponymous+Hero · 2012-03-21 06:42 · Score: 1
  
  you must be from provincetown, ct
  
  --
  insensitive clod overlords obligatory xkcd car analogy russian reversals whoosh pedant fanbois ftfy in 3...2...1..PROFIT
How is this novel? by Nemesisghost · 2012-03-21 03:59 · Score: 1, Insightful

Unless I'm totally off my rocker(which is possible) wouldn't prior art come into play here? It's one of the "techs" of at least Mass Effect. And I don't think the writers from ME made it up out of thin air.
1. Re:How is this novel? by Epimer · 2012-03-21 04:08 · Score: 1
  
  "Prior art" doesn't mean "somebody once came up with this idea in the abstract so you can't have a patent on it".
  For a piece of prior art to be novelty destroying it has to provide enough information for the ordinary skilled person to implement the teachings of the patent in their entirety. Seeing it in a video game doesn't provide you with the technical information to implement a ferromagnetic tattoo which displays different information based off data received from a mobile device.
2. Re:How is this novel? by Dr_Barnowl · 2012-03-21 04:54 · Score: 2
  
  There is plenty of prior art for the tech of implantable magnetics :
  A Sixth Sense for a Wired World
  Haptic feedback is probably a candidate for the Next Big Thing in human interface devices, the other being wearable displays.
other applications by CosaNostra+Pizza+Inc · 2012-03-21 04:06 · Score: 1

Okay, pleasure has already been covered in some posts as a possible application for this. What about intense pain?...Does Nokia have Orwellian aspirations for this patent?
1. Re:other applications by Baloroth · 2012-03-21 04:32 · Score: 1
  
  Once you get to the point where you are installing ferromagnetic ink under a person's skin, there are much, much easier ways to inflict pain. Even if you want a permanent, can trigger remotely system.
  Now hackers, on the other hand, they could have a sadistic field day with this. Really, the embedded ink sound like a really really bad idea from a practical standpoint (MRI machines as others have mentioned, but there are tons of sources of magnetic fields that could be extremely painful, dangerous, or inconvenient). The wearable material, on the other hand, has extreme potential.
  
  --
  "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
2. Re:other applications by Pope · 2012-03-21 05:05 · Score: 1, Funny
  
  What about intense pain?...Does Nokia have Orwellian aspirations for this patent?
  Well, they've already gone to Windows Phone 7...
  
  --
  It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
3. Re:other applications by TheLink · 2012-03-21 06:19 · Score: 1
  
  Once you get to the point where you are installing ferromagnetic ink under a person's skin, there are much, much easier ways to inflict pain
  One should also realize that modern medical technology can keep people alive long after they would rather be dead. At least back in the old days there was a significant chance you would die during torture.
  The mind can shut out pain, but shutting out horror and despair might be harder.
  BTW for a similar reason being one of those "highlander" immortals would be terrible in some scenarios since you cannot die. Imagine if one day you were trapped by a sadist who finds out that you can't die...
  --
  
  Too many replies beneath your current threshold
There's too much iron in your blood.. by Hillview · 2012-03-21 04:07 · Score: 1

Takes on a whole new meaning here.

--
-Troll, Flamebait, and Offtopic are NOT equivalent to disagreement.
Even more TSA hassles by jandrese · 2012-03-21 04:08 · Score: 1

I wonder if you would set of metal detectors too? Normally small amounts of metal are alright, but this has to be acting as an antenna of some sort to get enough energy to vibrate enough to be felt.

--

I read the internet for the articles.
Not all that novel... by grnbrg · 2012-03-21 04:08 · Score: 3, Informative

People have been implanting magnetic stuff for a while...
http://www.wired.com/gadgets/mods/news/2006/06/71087
1. Re:Not all that novel... by Epimer · 2012-03-21 04:19 · Score: 1
  
  Right, but reading on to claim 4 of the patent: "An apparatus... wherein the magnetic field originates from an electronic device and relates to digital content stored in the electronic device."
  That's nowhere near the same thing as a simple subdermal ferromagnetic implant.
  Claim 1 in the published application is probably broad enough that the stuff in the linked article would be novelty-destroying, but published patent applications aren't the same as granted patents, and in fact will have deliberately have been drafted broadly as a starting point for examination. Something with claim 4 incorporated into claim 1 is nowhere near anticipated by subdermal ferromagnetic implants alone.
Prior art by RenHoek · 2012-03-21 04:09 · Score: 1, Informative

Don't tell me this concept has never been used in SciFi before.
I'm pretty tired of companies taking all of the cool ideas people already had and stamping a patent on it. I'M LOOKING AT YOU IPAD!
1. Re:Prior art by Baloroth · 2012-03-21 04:37 · Score: 2
  
  Patents* don't cover ideas. Patents cover inventions. Call me up when having the idea for a warp drive means you know how to build one.
  *Real, valid, how-they-are-meant-to-be-used patents. Software and design patents (such as the iPad/Galaxy Tablet thing) are just stupid.
  
  --
  "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
2. Re:Prior art by AlecC · 2012-03-21 04:54 · Score: 1
  
  No, to stamp a patent on it they have to explain how it is done. Which, it appears, they have done in this case. I cannot patent the idea of a time machine, but if I can explain how how one can be built, I can sure as hell patent that, despite many hundreds of SF stories describing time travel.
  
  --
  Consciousness is an illusion caused by an excess of self consciousness.
3. Re:Prior art by dpilot · 2012-03-21 05:03 · Score: 1
  
  Well of course it has. Which begs the question...
  Can it be weaponized, like the O.C. tattoos in the "Pandora's Star" series of books, by Peter F Hamilton?
  
  --
  The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
4. Re:Prior art by RenHoek · 2012-03-21 07:28 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, but patents aren't 'how-they-are-meant-to-be-used' anymore are they? Sure, you can say that's how it _should_ be, but in the end, that's not how it is. When 99% of all patents nowadays are crap, I think it's safe to go out and generalize.
  Nowadays it's hard to really invent anything anyway. It's all evolutionary (computers are getting small enough to fit in my pocket, omg PocketComputer!) or discovery (Ah so when I run electricity through graphene, that's what happens).
  And you made the point yourself. Apple isn't suing Samsung because Apple had a smart idea for the innards of the iPad, but suing instead because it also looked like a rectangle that somehow was reminiscent of the movie 2001).
Re:Can I get one by JosKarith · 2012-03-21 04:10 · Score: 1

I believe there's a minimum size for it to work properly... ;->

--
'Don't worry' said the trees when they saw the axe coming, 'The handle is one of us.'
No thanks ... by gstoddart · 2012-03-21 04:13 · Score: 1

I like tattoos. I have several of them.
But a vibrating tattoo patented by Nokia? Not so much.
I can kind of see why I'd want this as a wearable patch, but actually doing it as a tattoo? Well, that's right up there with getting a Zune tattoo -- it just sounds stupid. :-P
I'll take my actual tattoos as non-magnetic, non vibrating thanks.

--
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
1. Re:No thanks ... by peragrin · 2012-03-21 04:39 · Score: 1
  
  You missed part of it. The design doesn't matter. You can choose the design, it gets tattoo'd on you, you magentise it, then you use your phone and have sensors in the phone scan the magentic field. To make it vibrate the phone produces amodified magnetic field tbat when it interacts with your tattoo vibrates slightly, and in different patterns.
  You choose design and vibration patterns. Like picking out a tattoo, or ring tone.
  
  --
  i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
2. Re:No thanks ... by gstoddart · 2012-03-21 04:55 · Score: 1
  
  You missed part of it.
  
  No, I got that. They claim it goes in just like normal ink and then you re-magnetize later. Choose your own design and everything.
  It doesn't make me any more interested. I have surprisingly little desire to have my tattoo vibrate because my phone is doing something. I simply don't care to have something like this ... I'm not that attached to my phone.
  If sure someone could make a blue-tooth enabled butt-plug which would do the exact same thing -- I'm not buying one of those either.
  I have no doubt there are some people who will decide they need a vibrating tattoo, but I can't see it becoming really widespread for a lot of years.
  
  --
  Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Re:I can"t Wait! by Ol+Biscuitbarrel · 2012-03-21 04:21 · Score: 1

That's what she said.
perceivable? by DarthVain · 2012-03-21 04:27 · Score: 1

"perceivable stimulus"
As opposed to patenting something that has impreceivable...
Does stimulus that no one can observe really happen?
1. Re:perceivable? by Epimer · 2012-03-21 04:31 · Score: 1
  
  You could have a stimulus which was applied at below the threshold level to be detectable by a person, but is still having an effect on the system in question. That would qualify as an imperceptible stimulus.
2. Re:perceivable? by WillgasM · 2012-03-21 04:58 · Score: 1
  
  If a tree falls in the woods...yada yada yada.
Re:Great idea by PPH · 2012-03-21 04:45 · Score: 1

I'm waiting for the House episode where they put someone with one of these in the MRI machine and antics ensue.

--
Have gnu, will travel.
Why the hell would I want that? by Opportunist · 2012-03-21 04:50 · Score: 1

You've never been prank called? Or called by a stalker? Or by some (may $deity smite them in a not-too-merciful way) telemarkedroids? Preferably while you tried desperately to sleep? Or while trying to have sex? Or while trying to do ANYTHING remotely requiring your cell NOT to interrupt?
If you thought that damn thing ringing would be a nuisance, be prepared for a really new level thereof.
I'm effin' glad if I can hurl that damn thing into some corner of my flat where I don't need to find it until next time I want to make a phone call. Why the hell would I want it to get even more under my skin than it already does?

--
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Spidey Sense by WillgasM · 2012-03-21 04:51 · Score: 2

We're a step closer to making one of the lamer superpowers a reality.
I'm wondering about ... by PPH · 2012-03-21 04:54 · Score: 1

... the possibility of 'reading' a ferromagnetic tattoo with a magnetic or r.f. field. The end effect could be similar to having an RFID chip planted in my body, making me trackable wherever I go.
No thanks. I can leave my cell phone behind when I want to go off the grid.

--
Have gnu, will travel.
Re:I can"t Wait! by bughunter · 2012-03-21 04:58 · Score: 1

That's what she said.
After visiting the free clinic.

--
I can see the fnords!
Does the transducer work both ways? by bughunter · 2012-03-21 05:00 · Score: 1

Can I implant one of these tattoos in my arm and a permanent magnet on my waist and then generate current when I swing my arms?
Interesting possibilities...

--
I can see the fnords!
Re:Great idea by Dr_Barnowl · 2012-03-21 05:01 · Score: 1

Already happened on House, although the tattoo wasn't functional, they did MRI a patient with prison tattoos and cause him lots of pain.
I might of missed it by ILongForDarkness · 2012-03-21 05:27 · Score: 1

But both links talk about a "material attachable to the skin" this seems to be a patch not a tattoo. Think nicotine patches all over your arms, sexy. Why do people come up with complicated solutions to things that already exist? They aren't replacing the phone so you still have to have the phone with you. Why not put the damn vibrate setting on rather than a magnetic field generator AND a patch on your arm, have to figure out how to make it so only your phone can make your patch vibrate etc. ? A really complicated solution to have the same effect (vibration on the skin telling you something is happening).
Exploit Potential by Translation+Error · 2012-03-21 05:45 · Score: 1

"Welcome to Nokia tech support, this is Rick speaking. How may I help you?"
"Thank God I finally reached a person! My tattoo has been buzzing out 'Never Gonna Give You Up' for the past 16 hours and I can't make it stop--please, you've got to help me!"

--
When someone says, "Any fool can see ..." they're usually exactly right.
OK but gosh by rinoid · 2012-03-21 07:01 · Score: 1

I've already got my phone on vibrate for you baby!
This is NOT patentable! by s.petry · 2012-03-21 08:26 · Score: 1

They are attempting to patent this as a process, without a material invented to actually work with the patent. Yet another example of blatant patent abuse that the media is trying to hype as a great thing. /sigh

--
-The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.
No Need. by FilthCatcher · 2012-03-21 18:17 · Score: 1

I've already got an embedded device that vibrates.
Pandora's Star anyone? by alexandre_ganso · 2012-03-22 09:19 · Score: 1

and its OCTatoos?