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OLPC Project Disappoints In Peru

00_NOP writes "The One Laptop Per Child project has disappointed in Peru, reports the Economist, apparently because in general teachers did not make creative use of the technology. As in other cases the computers seem to have been regarded as ends in themselves rather than tools to help change the ways kids are taught. Quite disappointing for those of us looking for Linux-Global-Domination but not really much of a surprise given the experience in richer countries either."

27 of 274 comments (clear)

  1. Ha, here's problem. by sunking2 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In some circles the project seems to be more about pushing Linux-Global-Domination as opposed to helping educate people.

  2. OVdGGPC by paleo2002 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    One Van de Graaff Generator per Child

    What if we made sure that every classroom in the world was supplied with a solar-powered, fully recyclable, free-trade produced Van De Graaff generator? We've seen how such devices can spark the interest of physics students in western classrooms over the years. Surely it will have the same effect in classrooms throughout the world! Just present one to the teacher and . . . science!

  3. Independent learning by Nithron · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This kid seems to have gotten the right idea. Maybe even if the teachers aren't using them properly, giving naturally curious kids access to a whole world of information will help them out anyway.

    Or maybe that guy was just a unique case, I don't know. That video made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside however.

    (If you can't be bothered to watch the video, shame on you! But also, it's about a child in Peru who works cleaning people's shoes on the streets. He has an OLPC laptop, though, and he uses it to educate himself with wikipedia.)

    1. Re:Independent learning by Electricity+Likes+Me · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I feel this is really the type of thing OLPC is aiming for.

      Probably more importantly though, I suspect OLPC was always going to disappoint - after all, it's goal wasn't an integrated software and hardware package that would do everything right (although they have put a decent amount of thought into the software) - the goal was to get the price of the laptops to a point where we could conceivably offer them to every child on the planet.

      It's things like the Kahn Academy which are ultimately going to drive the very important software aspect of this - and in that respect OLPC is good since it will be able to define the minimum hardware standard we should aim for.

  4. Teacher's perspective by coffeechica · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The concept of needing laptops at all for good education is questionable, I think. I'm a teacher in a business college for 15-19-year-olds (Austrian education system has these sorts of schools), and we run some student groups with laptops, while others only use computers for IT classes.

    There is a difference in how you need to teach the students, depending on their equipment. But there's no absolute need for laptops, or technology beyond a calculator. For business concepts or for accounting, it's actually better to run things via pen and paper because the students are less tempted to copy and paste, and because it slows down the pace so they have time to think about what they're doing. There is a time and place for internet research, use of spreadsheets for complex accounting or finance calculations, and for plenty of other areas. Get them computer literate, definitely, because a lot of our students end up working in offices and they need the knowledge to use the tools available. But there's no need to get them addicted/dependent on technology to a point where they can't perform simple calculations without Excel anymore, or use their brains without prompting from Google.

    The OLPC project is worthy, that's for sure. But I can't say that the results surprise me, they mirror the experiences we're making in a completely different environment. You can run lessons without laptops, and depending on the subject, it's often the more effective way of teaching.

    1. Re:Teacher's perspective by Electricity+Likes+Me · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That's all well and good, but the OLPC project was always aimed at trying to short-circuit the endemic problems of many poorer nations. The point has never been "technology enables learning" the point has always been along the lines of "what would happen if we could make sure everyone had access to wikipedia?"

      You're dealing with environments where it may not even be possible to maintain a regular structured classroom environment for all sorts of reasons. But if you can get the price of the technology to the right level, then we can in fact begin to think about good software-based solutions for things - remembering that in many cases the goal is less "gets a business masters" and more "can read and write proficiently".

    2. Re:Teacher's perspective by coffeechica · · Score: 5, Informative

      Giving them access to wikipedia won't solve anything, though. They need to know how to use the information they find, and for that they need to know basic technologies, models and methods to apply this. It's something we struggle with in our laptop-equipped classes - they're amazing at first glance, but once you actually look for comprehension, you discover that they copy-paste and don't question or even understand what they've found.

      It all needs balance. Show them that the information is out there, and give them the means to get to that info. But right now, there are a lot of areas where you simply can't use laptops consistently because it takes more time to get things running than to sit students down and simply run them through the matter the old-fashioned way.

      Also, I'll commit murder if I ever meet the designers of some of the educational software platforms out there. The software aspect is absolutely lacking at the moment when it comes to educational stuff. If the software doesn't exist, then good luck at getting it down to a reasonable price. I'm still stunned that Moodle currently gets promoted as the best solution.

    3. Re:Teacher's perspective by tomhath · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The point has never been "technology enables learning" the point has always been along the lines of "what would happen if we could make sure everyone had access to wikipedia?"

      What you say is true; someone assumed that giving each child their own computer would enable them to do something. But the assumption that the "something" would be educational doesn't appear to be correct. I saw it in the computer lab at my own kids' school; most of the effort by the students was listening to music or trying to find a way around the Net Nanny so they could view porn. They didn't know how to use it as an educational tool, and the teachers had no clue what to do with it.

      The big problem now is that every child learns differently, has different interests, and (what many don't want to acknowledge) many students are just plain dumb. A good teacher can adjust to each student in real time, but how do you write software that will help all of them learn?

    4. Re:Teacher's perspective by axlr8or · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You've kind of missed the bigger picture here. And that is, the intention is FREEDOM. The guy that started this wanted to get an infrastructure out into the world that provided an avenue for truth in information. Before you SHOULD educate you need the truth. This would allow kids and adults alike in these countries access to a form of media not directly manipulated by their government. It was going to be done on the back of Linux not because of price but because no one wants a world addicted to one product (Windows). He had toyed with the idea of using windows at one point because (as the devil often does) they were going to offer a version of windows to him in an attempt to familiiarize all those little kiddies with their products. Yay. Despite good intentions the more worldly of us know that all that was going to happen was these governments would weaponize the systems. And lock them down with network restrictions in their DNS's and backbones only to continue pushing their selfish agendas. This is/was a clear indication that this particular country failed to use these devices in a proper manner. Yes, this is about education but its also about freedom.

    5. Re:Teacher's perspective by DerekLyons · · Score: 3, Insightful

      And right there, is why this project is failing. The kids of the world need education, and you (like the project's leaders) are more interested in subjecting them to political indoctrination.

  5. The problem is the education level of the teachers by Lumpy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Almost ALL teachers from the richest of schools to the poorest of schools have a horrible education level in computer technology operation and use. I have met multiple PHD holding professors that cant operate a projector to save their life. Even ones that have been dumbed down with a control system that have an ON and OFF button that will do everything. IF the ON button did not work they freak out and never use it again.

    WE need to start with all education degrees being REQUIRED to have several computer operation classes. Something a lot more than "how to type letters in word 101" and "internet for idiots 102" They whould be requlred to go through a couple of more advanced classes like "education systems troubleshooting and use 204"

    Once you get the teachers comfortable with the technology, they will start using it. Did the OLPC people give the devices to the teachers a YEAR before the kids? Because the teachers should have been given them AND classes on their use in the classroom.

    I will bet you the OLPC people simply dropped a shipment in the schools and said "we givith! use this wisely" and walked away.

    --
    Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
  6. Love the idea; poor execution by quixote9 · · Score: 4, Informative

    I own one of the first OLPCs. The problem isn't Linux. (I hate to think of Win XP running in 256MB system, 1GB storage.) The problem is the whole philosophy of "it's not a computer, it's an education tool." (Or however they put it.)

    No. A computer is whatever the user wants it to be. If you try to make that difficult, it'll fail sooner or later. The less money behind it, the sooner.

    The educational philosophy they were pushing works for some subjects, some of the time. But they should have made it easy to use the OLPCs any way people wanted much earlier. It was only some time last year that a simple desktop switcher (sugar - gnome) was included with the basic OS. For me, at least, not having an ordinary filesystem available was a showstopper. I'd been dualbooting debian since the beginning, but all the trial and error to accomplish that isn't something a lot of teachers would do. But initially, for the first four years!, there was a lot of resistance to just giving people a familiar interface.

    Then there were the hardware limitations. Even for Linux, at least the Fedora they're using, 256MB is barely enough to breathe. The keyboard takes a lot of getting used to. I'm not sure they ever got the expanded touchpad working.

    So, like I said, nice idea, but they should have put more effort into improving hardware, providing the software people want, better distribution so they had a larger community of enthusiasts to write code for the project and help on (better organized!) forums, and kept their goofy educational philosophy for the people who wanted it.

    1. Re:Love the idea; poor execution by DerekLyons · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I own one of the first OLPCs. The problem isn't Linux. (I hate to think of Win XP running in 256MB system, 1GB storage.) The problem is the whole philosophy of "it's not a computer, it's an education tool." (Or however they put it.)

      That's the surface layer - but the real problem lies deeper. The real problem is that it was designed to be a [computer|education tool|portal to information|flavor of the week] (I.E. somewhat confused goals) that adhered to the (idiosyncratic) design theories of people with little to no actual experience in developing such tools*, and to support the political agenda and social theories of Nicolas Negroponte. And it's last item that's the real killer, because everything else was subordinated to that agenda and those theories.
       
      Not helping much was the decision to set the price to a politically attractive level long before they had sufficient experience with the software and hardware to know whether or not that price was a reasonable goal for their laundry list of features. When it turned out not to be, they slashed performance to target those political goals.
       
      And that's not even touching on the myriad of other things they fouled up on...
       
      * to be fair, nobody really has such experience - everything in the developed world to date has been somewhat ad hoc.

  7. Negroponte and IT fundamentalists are the problem by fantomas · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If your project is led by somebody who believes that the way forward is to drop OLPC laptops out of helicopters into villages and completely bypass locally respected educators, because of the belief that outsiders giving people technology will educate them, what hope have you got?

    If the project doesn't seem to respect local teachers, then claims that the reason the project has failed is because of the teachers, well I am suspicious of the findings, or maybe at least suspect a bias.

    Is the project too technology led rather than built on sound pedagogical frameworks to support children's education?

    Providing teacher training to enable teachers to better employ the technology in their teaching practice (what The Economist article suggests) before dropping all the laptops into classrooms would have been less media friendly but perhaps a more successful strategy.

    It does feel like the old story of rusting high tech white elephants in developing countries: well meaning, lots of money spent, not much time understanding local grassroots needs, working with the local educators on the ground. Stuff just gets dropped in with no support and surprise surprise doesn't get used well or technically maintained.

    The technology is the easy bit. Engaging with local communities to understand their needs is time consuming and more difficult.

  8. OS doesn't matter in failure by xzvf · · Score: 5, Insightful

    First, the project couldn't have even been done financially using any other OS/hardware combination. Second, the real reason technology doesn't improve education is we are treating it like magic and not as a productivity enhancement tool. The first computers used by government and business replaced rooms full of people by calculating stuff faster and with fewer errors. Even today, a smart phone replaces the need to have a map, newspaper and phone booth in a strange city when you want to see a movie (recent experience). In education, you don't have the incentive, or the viewpoint, to use technology to make the teacher more efficient at educating, and/or the student better at learning. For example, in the United States, teachers and other workers in education, but not educating, spend a significant amount of time on non-educational activities. Putting effort into automating and reducing the impact of those activities on the learning day, is a good use of technology. A bad use of technology, is replacing an existing working tool with a complex device that does the same thing, but adds overhead and requires more effort.

  9. You can't teach what you don't know by Hentes · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Before educating the students, they should have taught the teachers how to use the tehnology.

  10. Re:Works 4 MS & kids too by Kjella · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Since once they're out in the working world, they'll find what they're used to already: Windows!

    By the time any of them are out in the working world, Microsoft will have gone through several generations of Ribbons and Metro and whatnot other changes. What kids need is to learn to write and structure documents, not the finer points of style and formatting. They need to be able to use their math in spreadsheets, making formulas and chaining them together, not making pretty management reports. That's not to say it won't be important in the future, but that's it's mostly pointless to learn it now to know how it'll be in Word and Excel 2022.

    --
    Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
  11. The result will always be the same by rudy_wayne · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Somehow we have developed this absurd idea that you simply have to place a computer in front of a child and ~POOF~ they are magically educated, with no thought or work required by a teacher or anyone else. As a result, many billions of dollars have been spent putting computers in every classroom, and it has been a gigantic waste of money, because computers are completely unneccesary in education. Maybe in the last couple of years of highschool it makes sense, but in the early years, a computer serves no useful purpose in school and actually hinders important learning.

    Computers are fantastic, powerful and useful tools. but so is a bulldozer, and we don't insist that young children must learn to operate a bulldozer or else they will not get a proper education.

  12. I taught in schools in Ecuador for a few months... by datorum · · Score: 3, Informative

    ... this doesn't come as a surprise to me. Teaching in Ecuador is mostly "frontal assault", the kids are told all the time what to do. Copy that, etc. One student told me - after I quit - I was a go teacher and he liked me, because I didn't tell them all the time "copy that fast"... Basically my impression was that the schools condition the students to be "recipients of orders" ("Befehlsempfänger").Now on the one hand there is quite an authoritarian rule and on the other they just don't care too much mixed up with some totally unnecessary bureaucracy, e.g. every teacher had to sign that he arrived on that day in school and that he left, also entering the time - makes sense. But you would sign twice at once, also if I was late, it wouldn't matter I should write the time I should have been there... furthermore a teacher was running around and taking these signatures, usually interrupting the lessons by doing it...

    Also I worked a bit in an Internet cafe, what you consider a power (or even normal user) in Western Europe would be an admin there...

    Ecuador and Perú are quite similar. I was in the jungle region, which is probably the least "developed" one.

  13. Re:"Seize the youth/seize the future" FAIL by axlr8or · · Score: 3, Funny

    Now wait though, this guy has provided a perfectly good point. As you can see, there are some instances where a computer is a complete waste on some individuals.

  14. Computers and education by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Part of the problem with the standard approach to computers in education is that they are treated as tools for helping students learn how to use pre-computer techniques for solving problems. There is a tendency to treat computers like a combination flash-card/homework-grading system. We give students prepackaged education "solutions" that are supposed to reinforce traditional book learning, and lock down their computers so that they can only use the software they were given.

    We should instead focus on teaching children how to solve problems by writing programs. We should have a completely different approach to computers in education, because computers are different sorts of tools than what we had previously. Let students hack, and moreover create an environment that is friendly toward programming. We live in a computerized world; programming should be considered a matter of basic literacy at this point.

    --
    Palm trees and 8
  15. Re:The problem is the education level of the teach by ColdWetDog · · Score: 3, Informative

    WE need to start with all education degrees being REQUIRED to have several computer operation classes. Something a lot more than "how to type letters in word 101" and "internet for idiots 102" They whould be requlred to go through a couple of more advanced classes like "education systems troubleshooting and use 204"

    Well, if this is what you're trying to accomplish, just print out this handy graphic and you're done.

    --
    Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
  16. Re:The problem is the education level of the teach by coffeechica · · Score: 3, Insightful

    You need the balance, just like with calculators. Give them calculators. But also make sure they're able to estimate whether the result of their calculation/research/query is correct. If you train them solely by using a specific sort of tool, they become dependent on that. Show them a few alternatives to get to a result, then let them choose.

    It may depend on student age, but the amount of times I run into teenage students who blindly trust their calculators and don't pause to think whether 4% of 200 really can be 500 is startling. I'm not a fan of deprieving them of the technology, but they need to realise that they'd better do a rough mental double-check as well.

  17. Just Returned from Peru Visit of Electronics Shops by retroworks · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Seriously, I just returned six days ago from a week in Lima, where I visited partners who buy used computers (for repair, refurbishing, recycling business). At one of the shops (which had 22 repair employees) they showed me one of the One Laptop Per Child laptops they'd gotten their hands on. They were absolutely ridiculing it compared to the price of used Pentium III laptops they buy in bulk from off-lease. I just wrote about the trip a few days ago. http://preview.tinyurl.com/peruewaste

    The refurbishing business itself is falling off in Lima, however. (No joke, I saw used CHINESE CRT televisions - the Chinese cities are upgrading and selling their own used goods to South America and Africa). But the cheap white box models from China show the most growth in the market.

    In short it's a mature market and the whole charity command-and-control, of "e-waste" and white box laptop sales, is rife with at best piss poor market research, and at worst just making things up out of thin air. Read Harvard Business Review Article, http://tinyurl.com/chinagoodnuff The Battle for China's Good Enough Market (2007, written by Bain & Co consultants), to see how the changing consumer demand is being mis-marketed to. Lima had 9M residents, I had no problem finding wifi, and the geeks of color in the used electronics markets all had smartphones.

    --
    Gently reply
  18. Followed by a CSB by Crash+Culligan · · Score: 3, Insightful

    coffeechica: The concept of needing laptops at all for good education is questionable, I think.

    The concept of needing anything/em> for a good education is questionable. The computer is a tool which is capable of good (through assisting the teaching of subjects), evil (distracting the students or supplanting the teacher), or pointlessness.

    First, the tool has to be assessed, to see if it's suitable to assist in the teaching of a subject. The computer can be mighty flexible, and beside running Excel to actually do the accounting, it can present information, quiz students on topics being learned, and even make corrections based on incorrect answers. (And yes, I include properly done Powerpoint under the heading "present information." LibreOffice's Presentation tool qualifies too.)

    Second, the tool may need to be tweaked to work for a specific purpose. The last two, quizzing and correcting, ride on the assumption that somewhere behind the scenes, someone in the school's employ is using a relatively simple scripting tool (LiveCode comes to mind) to create the lessons, and to further present on correct techniques when wrong answers are given.

    Third, the tool has to be accepted and understood by the teacher. A tool unused is meaningless, but a tool misapplied can do more harm than good.

    And fourth, the tool has to be accepted and used correctly by the students. Same principle as above: if they don't know how to get the information out of it, they won't larn nuffin'. A sweet UI and finely honed educational software stand no chance against a blithering idiot.

    My mother taught learning disabled preschoolers. I watched with some horror as she sent one student after another back for "computer time" unattended, and they kind of puttered around with it. The worst was what I dub a "click-monster"—he might as well have been blindfolded and firing a machine-gun the way he was clicking. It was like recess, but nothing was being exercised except index finger and wrist.

    With a little time, expense, and staff education, the computer can be a fantastic tool for teaching and learning. I can appreciate that without that time and expense, the tool isn't nearly as useful.

    --
    You cannot truly appreciate Dilbert until you read it in the original Klingon.
  19. Like "Bibles for Haiti" by ivoras · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The OLPC project was always one step near the infamous "Bibles for Haiti" project - a condescending view that an "easy answer", one which is easily mass-manufactured will miraculously solve a hard social problem. That the OLPC-ers are technocratic instead of theocratic makes little difference with regards to the efficiency of the approach. What *should* have been sent are *teachers*, but it's much, much harder to send teachers into the wilderness when they are already so lowly regarded in the western world.

    --
    -- Sig down
  20. I live in one of Peru's OLPC communities by Russianspi · · Score: 5, Informative

    I live in a tribal village in Peru, and the kids here have OLPC laptops. The trouble is bigger than teachers who have not been educated to make good use of the laptops (although that is an issue too). There isn't electricity here, much less internet (except my personal VSAT). While a computer loaded with educational resources is useful without an internet connection, it is a nice shiny green and white brick without power. For all of the hoopla about hand-crank or foot pedal chargers, I haven't seen one. When my solar panels are pulling in enough power, I'll charge one up for a kid or even let them on the internet, but my resources are limited in these areas too. So...it will be hard to REALLY evaluate the effectiveness of a machine like the OLPC until we have solved these basic infrastructure issues.