US Air Force Can 'Accidentally' Spy On American Citizens For 90 Days
AstroPhilosopher writes "Researchers at the Federation of American Scientists have discovered documentation (PDF) that allows the military to keep footage from drones for up to 90 days to determine whether further investigation is warranted. Besides using footage from natural disasters and monitoring of domestic military bases, all that's truly required is for an operator to 'accidentally' have the camera running while flying."
Are Americans going to tolerate this? Post 9/11, probably.
They told me this would happen if I voted for John McCain for President. And they were right!
I guess I need to start having (gay) sex on my deck again.
Wasn't that just accidentally hitting the buildings whilst flying?
"Kill 'em all and let Root sort 'em out"
"Spy on American Citizens for 90 days" != "retain footage of American Citizens for 90 days"
They can accidentally spy on you indefinitely, or rather, spontaneously whenever you might fall within the vantage of the camera. They can only keep the video for 90 days.
Don't blame me, I voted for Baltar.
If I'm in a public setting, I can pull out my camera and take a picture, "spying" on anything in its viewfinder. This is 100% legal. I can also "spy" by taking a photo out of an airplane. Police can do this as well. Out west, we have airplanes which monitor traffic to see if you are vastly exceeding the speed limit, being a "spy" to see how fast you are driving. They even post signs that they do this.
It isn't strange that our military also has the authority to take footage. What is strange, and wonderful, is that our military removes this footage after 90 days. I have many pictures of all sorts of places, with images of fellow tourists accidentally being "spied" on in them. I am keeping these photos forever.
(Note: YMMV. Certain conservative State legislatures are trying to make it illegal to record police, so as to allow the police to cover up any of their criminal acts; however I am confidant that these laws are destined to eventually be fully overturned by the courts.)
I fail to see how this is in any way a terrible thing. The outside is a public setting. Always has been.
This not some amazing new discovery. It's called Intel Oversight. All Military intelligence under under these same rules. We are allowed to collect only in accordance with an assigned mission. Said mission cannot be to simply go out and watch of follow or collect on random or even specific citizens. What is allowed is if during authorized collection we come across information about a possible US citizen we are allowed 90 days to review to determine if A: The person is indeed a US Person (legal status and yes US Corporations qualify and did before the famous court ruling that the /. crowd hates so much). And if so B: is there reason to collect and retain the info. This is usually a no but there are certain categories of activities that would allow collection to go forward and the information to be retained in official intelligence reporting.
/. geniuses will let me know how wrong I am, even though they have zero experience with this realm.
Now about applicability. In the US the military is required to assume, lacking other information to the contrary, that anyone we run across is a US Person and thus most likely cannot be collected on. So don't worry, they aren't going to start flying "accidently" across the states filming your backyard activities. We'll leave that to the Jackbooted thugs in the FBI and local PD's. Outside the US the view shifts 180 degrees and we are to assume, again until we get some evidence to the contrary, that any individual we run across is NOT a US Person. But should we collect info on someone and they then turn out to be a US person, we are again given the 90 Window to determine if they are in fact a US Person, and if they are engaged in one of the legally specified activities that allow or even mandate collection and reporting on them. Some examples of these categories would be anyone engaged in espionage for a foreign power, anyone actively involved with a declared terrorist group. (not just someone we think "looks like a terrorist."
And regardless of whether they are involved in collectible activities or not any and all collection on US Persons is reported not just up the military channels but also the DoJ and the CIA. People do lose rank and intelligence positions over violation of the Intel Oversight rules. All military intelligence personnel are briefed on Intel Oversight at least annually.
The poster of this story really has no idea what he's talking about. This is a non-story and it's really nothing new. And once again Wired tries to write about the Intelligence community possibly doing wrong but just proves how little their reporters actually understand things.
But I'm sure the
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
this is trivial and a non-issue. Why "accidently' leave the camera on and go off charter when this occurs
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/12/21/2037251/domestic-surveillance-drones-on-the-rise
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/01/24/0410221/domestic-use-of-aerial-drones-by-law-enforcement
Even in UK.
http://tech.slashdot.org/story/10/01/26/1645232/uk-police-plan-to-use-military-style-spy-drones
Let me know when I can buy one at Toys R Us.
For every benefit you receive a tax is levied. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
The founding fathers would have allowed the citizens to have Abrams tanks, F22 Raptors, or other modern weapons of war fully fueled and armed, parked at their farm or street if such technology had been available. They would have been fine with high yield explosives and any other weapons of war that were likely to be used against them by an enemy. Few could afford them today, but being permitted to have them was their clear intent. That's why they added the second amendment. Since a "militia" might be needed at any time to oppose foreign enemies or their own government (that inconvenient revolutionary war against their British government thing everyone forgets about in this day and age), the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
They'd just fought that wonderful war that led to the creation of our country. Think they would have been successful if they were armed with bow and arrows and shotguns and the British had modern weapons as the hunting weapons only crowd would mandate today? Of course not. They wanted their citizens to be fully armed with modern weapons to keep the government in place and to be able to repel any invasion that might come up.
Our creation of standing military forces wasn't in the plan, but even so, only might protect us against outside forces and not against the government itself. That is if they aren't all off on some foreign military base or doing some peace forcing action in a foreign country when the home turf gets attacked.
...considering that the reason that mitigation and minimization procedures exist in the first place is to address and prevent abuse, or accidental or improper collection, not encourage it.
I would also point out that the US has manned aircraft which fly over the US all the time, many with sophisticated ISR capabilities — and which have similar sets of processes to prevent improper uses.
I would also point out that the military and intelligence agencies like the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency aid law enforcement and civil authorities all the time, e.g., for things like natural disasters and wildfires — this includes planes, space assets, and yes, even drones.
The reason the procedures and processes discussed in this article exist in the first place is precisely to prevent unauthorized or improper use.
The idea isn't to say, hey, everything is an "accident", so we will look at anything, all the time (as some people here will no doubt believe). The idea is that IF data on US Persons is obtained improperly, it should be deleted — unless it involves "persons or organizations reasonably believed to be engaged or about to engage, in international terrorist or international narcotics activities."
In DOD-speak, INTERNATIONAL narcotics and terrorism means something very specific. It doesn't mean the Air Force or anyone else is going to blanket the US with drones, and use provisions designed to PREVENT improper activities as an excuse to "accidentally" spy on Americans.
That people believe this is somehow a secret plot designed to let the Air Force, of all things, spy on Americans for no reason, is a very sad thing to me. This may come as a surprise to you, but many in the US military and the government actually take their obligations to the law, the Constitution, and to the people of the United States seriously.
If your next question is, "If they take it seriously, they wouldn't be letting this happen!!" I would direct you to re-read my post more carefully.
Does it really matter? The amount of effort required to look into ONE person in footage is huge. Stop being so paranoid everyone. If they looked at footage of me they would see a guy walking down the street..WOW. sometimes I think people are concerned over things like this far to much. Just live your life and chill out!
It's (maybe) innocuous now but in the future it will be abused somehow. Slippery slope and all that - just look at the TSA.
And the other thing is this: the military or the rest of the Government should NOT be spying on American citizens - period. WTF, dude!
Here we (as a people) are saying "Oh, it's not THAT bad." whenever our Government tramples on our civil liberites. And then they take a little more. And we say again, "It's not THAT bad." and they take even more.
Add in the Right Wingers who think Civil Liberties are pinko hippy Liberal values and you have this water covered icy slipery slope headed towards an oppresive society.
All you need is one grunt (a guy with a badge and gun) to dislike you for whatever reason and your life is Hell.
And it gets worse higher up. It really disgusts me that the FBI treated Martin Luther King as a goddamn terrorist. They watched him, they kept a dossier on him, they bugged his phones, and god knows what else - all because he was fighting INJUSTICE in our society. Sure he committed some misdemeanors in his protests, but to be treated and monitored that way? I DON'T THINK SO.
That's the mentality of the grunts (people with badges and guns) - you're a criminal if they don't like you.
And you have no problem with this monitoring?
Shame on you.
First, a drone can also capture footage of you in your yard, behind the eight foot high privacy fence that you thought would keep prying eyes out. At least if they were spying on you from an airplane, you'd have a good chance of seeing and/or hearing the airplane as it approached. With a drone...not so much. Second, as far as the average American goes, you are right. They aren't going to follow all 300 million or so of us 24x7 in the hopes of finding something juicy. However, if they have a *reason* to be interested in you -- and keep in mind, that does not necessarily mean "if you are a bad guy"* -- then it might be worth their time and effort to sift through the footage looking for something useful.
*A couple of tin-foil-hat ideas, right off the top of my head:
1) a well-known activist: they follow you and collect information on where you go, who you meet, and then harass the people you have been seen associating with, or perhaps just add them to a list of "suspicious" people for more investigation.
2) a senator or representative who isn't friendly to DoD budget requests: again, they follow you and look for things (prostitution, drugs, etc.) that they can use to blackmail you into voting for a better budget.
MCSE? No, sir...I don't do Windows. Yes, I am an idealist. What's your point?
I really don't see them passing on their incidental footage to anyone else, such as Homeland Security, local law enforcement, etc.
Indeed not. When their face recognition tells them that there's a 90% change that you're Wanted Terrorist #1 they'll just launch a missile at you.
Have you compared the Chinese constitution to the actions of their government?
You should check out http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/constitution/constitution.html - specifically "CHAPTER II. THE FUNDAMENTAL RIGHTS AND DUTIES OF CITIZENS"