RMS Robbed of Passport and Other Belongings In Argentina

New submitter Progman3K writes "Richard Stallman, father of the FSF, had his bag containing his laptop, medicine, money and passport stolen after his talk at the University of Buenos Aires on Friday, June 8." Adds reader jones_supa, excerpting from the same linked story: "As a result of this occurrence, he was forced to cancel his talk in Cordoba, and it's still unknown how this will impact the rest of his speaking engagements throughout the world."

Comments

FIRST POST

[Anonymous Coward]

Passports want to be free.

Re:FIRST POST

[Mister Transistor]

Isn't this one of the old internet scams?

Please Help! I'm on vacation in a strange country and had my wallet stolen, please send $$ to my address: scammer23@aol.com to help me get home!

Sigh.

[gruntled]

Free as in steal it.

Re:Sigh.

[Anonymous Coward]

No, no, no his passport was "open sourced"

Re:Sigh.

[jellomizer]

I wonder if someone took he speeches, did his speech, and collected the pay for that speech, he would be fine with that.

Re:Sigh.

[DemomanDeveloper]

I think the problem is with those robbers ancient business models. Just like MPAA/RIAA, the robbers are unable to change their business model to current day. No one wants to go fetch a physical copy. Offer a copy of that password at reasonable price, over the internet and without DRM and I might buy it. Information wants to be free!

Re:Sigh.

[LurkerXXX]

Yes, but only if they contributed back any ad-lib comments they made.

Donning flameproof underwear in 3...2....1

[maroberts]

Whichever Argentinian stole it is probably claiming that it is theirs as a result of their ancestor looking after the cow that the bag was made from between 1828 and 1832.....

Re:Donning flameproof underwear in 3...2....1

[Xest]

"The malvinas/falklands issue goes waaaaaay back, centuries back."

Hardly. Argentina issued initial disputes up until 1849 and once in 1885, but then accepted British sovereignty. It was only in 1941 that Argentina decided to bring it up again because as it does now, and as it did in '82 it had a weak government that desperately needed to stir nationalist sentiment to try and bolster it's standing and the Falklands is an easy target. It's really no coincidence that the issue only ever comes up again each time Argentina has a government that's managed to completely fuck up the country through political incompetence.

"But anyway, why does england claim a couple of islands on the other fucking side of the world and nobody thinks that's strange?"

Because it's been inhabited by British people since the 1640s with only a couple of breaks hundreds of years ago?

You could similarly ask why Alaska isn't Russian or Canadian when it's geographically closer to those nations than it is the US.

There's a number of ways to determine the nationality of a nation and geographical proximity is only one of these, others include who got there first, what the population wants, who won it militarily and the fact of the matter is that Britain wins out hands down in all of these - it's questionable whether the British or French got there first, but the French support the British claim regardless, the British have clearly won it militarily when Argentina tried that tactic, and the population is British, and has been for hundreds of years.

Fundamentally though, the United Nation's key point in terms of determining sovereignty is the will of the people living there. This is important, because no one should have to be ruled against their will, and whilst it does get abused (i.e. Russia pushing pro-Georgian people out of Georgian breakaway regions whilst making pro-Russian people Russian citizens to claim the will of the people) it is for the most part the most sensible option. It's also not as if Britain annexed it by pushing out an Argentine population, the British population has been there as long as any (including when the Spanish were there), the Spanish left, Argentina tried to settle elsewhere there on the island but with no British interference failed to do so because they were not prepared for the harsh weather and so gave up and left it.

The fact is the people living there are living their legitimately, their ancestors settled their legitimately, and they did not use any kind of force to push anyone else out. Everyone else that settled/tried to settle left of their own accord. So if the population is there legitimately, and the population wants to be British the case is pretty clear cut - Argentina just doesn't have an argument.

Again, Argentina's claim is about absolutely nothing more than bolstering a weak incompetent government with the time tested tactics of winning over the ignorant amongst society by using nationalism and populism.

It's also worth noting that Britain even offered to work with Argentina on oil exploration etc. around the islands in the late 90s to at least try and improve relations which it did not have to do, but the Argentine government at the time, again, having fucked up the economy, decided it needed to ramp up the populist rhetoric and pulled out going on about sovereignty.

Again, Argentina's arguments would have far more merit if it weren't for the fact that any claims continuously coincide with bad governance and decreasing popularity of the party in government at the time. When Argentinian governments have been doing well in the polls, they've not even brought up the issue, and have even sought to improve relationships, but every time an Argentinian government starts to struggle, it brings it up. It's pathetic.

Such a loss...

[Sfing_ter]

What a loss, the only laptop running Gnu Hurd. The individual who stole it will be very sorry though, as he will be forced to use emacs, and as it does everything, it will be the only program on the computer... :D

Re:Such a loss...

[unixisc]

It is a unique laptop - one of the few in the US from Lemote Yeedong, and based on the Loongson CPU. But it's not running Hurd - Stallman has pretty much abandoned that in favor of his favorite GNewSense. But yeah, the user will have to be an Emacs expert to find it of any use.

Re:Uhh, it's a third-world country. Be careful the

[buanzo]

I'm Argentine. I avoid problematic areas. But this happened during a conference. In ALL conferences in EVERY country stuff is robbed cause people are idiots. And security guards are idiots. THAT's common sense. Avoiding an entire country is plan idiocy.

No news – Happens all the time

[saibot834]

This is really not newsworthy. It happens in Buenos Aires all the time. I was there 2009 at Wikimania (where RMS also attended) and I in the few days I was there multiple of my friends had their bags/laptops stolen, while I was in the same room.

The thiefs are really skilled and they make it almost impossible for you to notice the theft. The only way to defend yourself is to have all your stuff at your body all the time, thus being a harder target than everyone else.

Re:No news – Happens all the time

[Progman3K]

in the few days I was there multiple of my friends had their bags/laptops stolen, while I was in the same room

I think we have a suspect

Re:Uhh, it's a third-world country. Be careful the

[moranar]

"Argentine, Argentinian, and Argentinean refer to anything that originates in Argentina".

If you're going to be a smartass, at least do it properly.

Re:this guys sure misses a lot of engagements late

[Anonymous Coward]

> Perhaps he would had been better off if he made a living producing software and selling it.

Maybe he would; but we're surely better off since he chose to benefit mankind over himself.

Don't get me wrong, this is not a religious thing... but IMHO overall tech progress got a powerful impulse with the GPL and things like Linux (or GNU/Linux in his lingo). It's easy to underestimate the role of Free Software in mankind's advancement.

Now it would be nice if someone explained that to the thief. Argentinians have an advanced culture and possibly even a thief might grok why it is important not to take this man's passport.

RMS?

[Anonymous Coward]

I guess we need to look for a bag with no soap or razor in it.

Clarification, as I live here and study there.

[goruka]

University of Buenos Aires is a free, public university recognized as one of the best in the world. Anyone can attend and it's also filled with students from other South American countries that travel to Buenos Aires to study. Courses are usually huge, with ~200 students each, and anyone is free to attend them as a listener, even if you are not a student. Teachers, by tradition, are expected to be professionals that excelled in their respective fields and for them it is an honor to be able to be there, all this in the spirit of having the best public education.
This much freedom has the obvious drawback that, as no one checks your student ID at the entrance, anyone can go in including thieves, which often mix up with other students to steal stuff. I've seen this happening several times myself so you have to watch out for strange people and your belongings all the time.
As pro human rights groups are so strong here (product of opposition to US-Sponsored dictatorships during most of the past century), law is lax and stronger security measures are often seen in a negative light, as the population don't know anymore where to draw the line.

Re:Clarification, as I live here and study there.

[OzPeter]

...as no one checks your student ID at the entrance, anyone can go in including thieves, which often mix up with other students to steal stuff.

You're making the assumption that students are not thieves. I doubt that the entrance requirements for this university include the question:
 
"Are you a thief? yes/no".

Re:Uhh, it's a third-world country. Be careful the

[Anonymous Coward]

Blindly spawning mindless stereotypes like "third world countries are best shunned" is also first-class idiocy.

Who steals from wizards?

[Vyse of Arcadia]

I mean, really, who looks at that beard and thinks, "I'm gonna steal from that wizard. No way his bag has any exploding magical components in it or anything."

Why didn't he know better?

[OzPeter]

While I am sorry for his loss (and that is only a story because of who was robbed - a zillion other tech people get robbed in foreign countries and they don't make /.) RMS has traveled the world for years, and I would have thought he knew better about he risks of theft. His passport and money should not have been left unsecured, and he should have ascribed to a layered packing regime that I learnt about years ago that includes three general zones:

1. Checked luggage - Contains stuff you that you don't care if you never see it again
2. Hand luggage - Contains stuff you can drop and leave behind in an emergency in order to protect your personal well being

3. On your person - Contains stuff that is critical to your well being and ability to travel

Passport and money belongs squarely in that last category. They are replaceable, but their loss has a much greater impact on a trip than losing stuff from the other two categories.
 
Leaving his passport and money in an unsecured location was a stupid and idiotic move on *his* part (although I bet that that is probably somewhat offset by him being distracted for a moment). And yes I know that this sounds like blaming the victim, but there is a point where you have to take responsibility for your own actions.

Re:Uhh, it's a third-world country. Be careful the

[Lumpy]

The USA has it's third world areas..... Detroit, New Jersey, South Central LA, Mississippi......

Re:Uhh, it's a third-world country. Be careful the

[Anonymous Coward]

I was born in Argentina too. The post author above was talking the best he could on his second language (as I am doing here), while I bet most of you can only talk English. Still, you made fun of him, and yes, it was funny, but that does not encourage participation. Now, on the topic: Buenos Aires has become a dangerous place in the last 10 or so years, and if you travel there you need to watch over your belongings and know when/where you can go and when/where you cannot. You can get robbed, scammed, or attacked if you are in the wrong place at the wrong time. I agree with the comment that said that Argentina is more and more resembling an African nation. And the people living there has no reference to compare, and passionately will defend their country's image against all logic. All that said, there is no excuse for this. Like him or not, RMS has been and is a very important influence in the world of software, and without crazies like him we will probably not have free Linux and all the free software that is available around and most of us use. He deserves better. The person who stole from him did not care or did not knew about him. Now, avoiding an entire country because you are afraid it is not as civilised as your own country, or your experience would be unfamiliar, seems extreme.

Re:Uhh, it's a third-world country. Be careful the

[Isaac Remuant]

He was going well until he said:

Better yet, don't even bother visiting. Third-world places are best shunned.

That's an extremely ignorant comment. RMS has been to Argentina (and around Latin America) plenty of times without any problems. Shit happens. And it can happen in your beloved first-world New York too.

Fuck condescending comments about the third world.

Re:Not even the most secure system can prevent tha

[ciscocontractor]

This is actually true. I can attest that, at least until the early to mid 90s, his 'rms' login on the MIT AI servers had no password.

Re:Uhh, it's a third-world country. Be careful the

[Shoten]

And in today's world, avoiding third-world nations "just because" is ridiculous. You're saying that executives from Apple should never have gone to China. You're saying that Venezuela, a member of OPEC, should never have members from other OPEC nations visiting there. And where do you draw the line...I'm not sure I'd consider Argentina a third-world country just because they had an economic breakdown...and there is no way they are more akin to an African country than a Western one. If a financial meltdown with long-term effects qualifies a country for third world status, then why not Japan? They still haven't recovered from the financial collapse that happened in the 90s.

And let's keep something in mind...this was Richard Stallman speaking at a conference in a major city. This was not him going off into a remote area in the countryside to dig a well. There are places in most American states where he'd be statistically more likely to come to harm than he was in that hotel. Petty crime is what happens in such places, and little else.

The reason why the post had been modded down...and why it should still be, even if it is not...is because the whole point of it is ridiculous. For a soccer mom to avoid nations with shaky economies? Fine, if a bit wimpy. But for large-impact entities...be they people or simply influential people at large organizations...to shun safe areas in third-world countries because of petty crime is entirely infeasible, self-defeating, and frankly smacks of the armchair thinking of someone who has never ventured outside middle America. The world is global; that's how it is now.