Slashdot Mirror


Young Listeners Opt For Streaming Over Owning

An anonymous reader writes "CNN reports that younger listeners are increasingly opting to stream music rather than own it. If their music is constantly available anywhere on any device, then 'what's the difference?,' ponders the article. The distinction between streaming music and owning music is starting to blur. From the article: 'But Van Buskirk also suggests another reason for streaming, not acquiring music. It's liberating. "There is a certain relief with not having to own music. It is a lot of work," he said. ... Porter says the way people own music is transforming. He believes the cloud model is where the state of music is heading, and for many people ownership is not essential. "I think ownership is access, you don't have to have music on your local hard drive to own it," he said.' Will the concept of ownership of music and software fade as cloud based services become the way people expect to access media and software?"

33 of 390 comments (clear)

  1. Young listeners? by aztrailerpunk · · Score: 3, Informative

    I wouldn't consider myself young anymore and I certainly prefer streaming over owning.

    --
    Foot placed squarely in mouth since 1983.
    1. Re:Young listeners? by cayenne8 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Well, for the most part...the music being produced today, just isn't worth keeping, and owning to replay over and over again in the coming years.

      That's not just my "get off my lawn" mentality either...I hear it from younger people today. They go through tons of music, but it is quite often disposable, I've heard them say.

      "Oh, yeah, I'll get this, listen to it for a few months, but doubt I'll throw it on again."

      Me? Geez...well, I own most of my music in CD form. I've yet to buy a mp3 off the internet....I'd rather buy in a the best format I can generally get, for home use...and then for lessor listening environments, I rip the music to high quality mp3's....which is plenty good enough for bad listening environments like the gym or the car.

      But pretty much everything I've bought...I listen to OVER and over again...and have for decades.

      I never get tired of hearing Dark Side of the Moon, or The Wall....and I usually play those in their entirety, from beginning to end since to me..they are whole pieces of music...the whole album is.

      I never get tired of Brown Sugar....or the plethora of other Stones songs.

      More recently...well, I do like pretty much the whole Wolfmother first album...great stuff. I've found some good bluesmen of today...Guitar Shorty, and Tinsley Ellis.....but yes, most of my stuff is in the electric blues driven classic rock era.

      But I find I like to OWN my music...because, it WILL and is often listened to quite often. A lot of the stuff coming out today...well, I don't usually find it to be something I'd listen to over and over again...so, I can sympathize with the kids of today.

      I'm trying to figure out...when did music become disposable?

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    2. Re:Young listeners? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So are the kids... only it's our generation's music they're listening to over and over again. Go to any live cover band in a bar full of twentysomethings. They're not covering NStynk and Linkin Pork, they're covering Zeppelin and Skynard and Van Halen and the like.

      I don't know what Linkin Pork and NStynk is, maybe you're a dumb child and meant NSync and Linkin Park. Anyway, people cover those bands too, you're just not going to the right bar. Is it really surprising that the places you visit cover songs you like? Are you really so dense that you don't realize that the same thing will be happening in other bars with songs you dislike?

      Music was always disposable. People recorded over casettes, people listened to songs or bought albums and then shelved them for years. There are some songs out right now that I could see myself listening 30 years from now, even if it's "new stuff". The entire music field isn't just NSync and Lady Gaga. There are also older songs that I'll rock on to. How surprising is this, really?

      Your taste changes, it's like food. You don't eat the same thing every week do you? "New music is shit" is a really stupid statement, it's moronic to deep levels. It just means you liked the old style better. You're not different from a lot of other people who also like older music. You'll also find older people hating old music and preferring the new stuff. I heard a grand mother request System of a Down on radio a few years ago, she didn't seem to mind that it wasn't Led Zeppelin.

      Oh, I get it. Your tastes are better than everyone else's, and the music you don't like is shit. See the thing is, that applies to you too. Your music is shit and my taste is better than yours.

    3. Re:Young listeners? by darjen · · Score: 3, Interesting

      the music being produced today, just isn't worth keeping

      I don't understand this. You have an incredibly narrow taste in music. Not that there's anything wrong with that. For me, there is TONS of music being produced today that is worth listening to. My problem is that there's too much out there and I'll never get around to even half of it. That is why I use a streaming service. I try to listen to at least 2 or 3 new albums a month. My horizon is always expanding in every genre. I gravitate towards Jazz and Classical, but there is tons of other stuff as well, from pop to blues to electronic, etc. I use Amazon.com to keep track of the top new releases in every genre each week. I pick a few that might seem interesting and see if they are on my streaming service. There is always something to keep me busy.

    4. Re:Young listeners? by CastrTroy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Maybe it's all about value for money. I could either spend $10 a month, and have access to all the music ever recorded, or I could spend $10 a month and get one (maybe less) album per month. After 6 years of buying albums, I'd have 72 albums, or about 1000 songs. Why would I bother buying music when I could spend less and get more? Obviously there's no service that has all the music ever recorded but there are some services out there that have quite a large selection of music. Why would I want to spend money on buying CDs when I could have them stolen or broken. Why would I want to spend money on MP3s when a hard drive crash could mean that I have to buy them all over again (has Appled fixed this issue yet with iTunes, I know in the past you couldn't re-download songs you had already purchased).

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    5. Re:Young listeners? by Joce640k · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'm no youngster but I hate Dark Side of the Moon. Really can't stand it. I don't mind if I never hear it again.

      Music taste is mostly formed when you're a teen. Teens listen to whatever they're surrounded by. Everybody thinks their generation had the best music. ...and 90% of anything is bad.

      90% of 60s music was completely awful.
      90% of 70s music was completely awful.
      90% of 80s music was completely awful.
      90% of 90s music was completely awful.
      90% of 00s music was completely awful.

      --
      No sig today...
    6. Re:Young listeners? by dgatwood · · Score: 3, Insightful

      the music being produced today, just isn't worth keeping

      I don't understand this. You have an incredibly narrow taste in music.

      Actually, it's probably the reverse. The people producing music have an incredibly narrow taste, and people tend to burn out quickly when each new song sounds only subtly different from the song that came before it. There are times when it has been so bad that I've sung one song while listening to another just for the entertainment value of poking fun at the awful rehash.

      This is not to say that all new music is crap, just that nearly all new music that actually gets airplay is crap. Of course, this has always been true. What makes a song a "classic" is that it is one of the few songs that wasn't crap, and so still gets airplay today (on the right stations). Time has a way of filtering the wheat from the chaff.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    7. Re:Young listeners? by Eponymous+Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      There is far, far more music being played and recorded today than ever before. If the 90% figure is accurate, then there's far more non-crap music made this year than in 1972, 1982, or 1992. I personally think that's true. People who complain that modern music is throwaway garbage haven't being looking very hard. There's some phenomenal stuff out there and just about any decently sized city has a healthy music scene.

    8. Re:Young listeners? by slew · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Although I'm probably in the "bias" set that likes 70's and 80's music, I think a large part of the phenomena is simply shared experience. Back in those days, you had radio payola, and "records" which tended to make music a much more shared experience. Also the numbers of songs in wide release were pretty limited. I knew people back in those days that could literally name just about every single song on every single album in most people's collection, but that was only because everyone bought the same albums.

      Fast forward to today and music is much more fragmented and less of a shared experience. Artists that become popular today don't have the selective pressure that they used to. The ones we remember from the 70's and 80's are the survivors that became part of the shared experience (got radio-play and were recorded the albums that everyone bought). You don't remember the ones that didn't make it. Musicians today can survive in a much more narrow niche.

      So what songs would concerts gravitate towards? The ones that survived the selective pressure of the shared experience. At least that's my opinion. Of course there's still lots of "live" music, but there were also the precursor to "raves" in the 80's. I don't remember any of those bands, just like I'm sure in 2040 nobody will remember similar contemporary music. On the other hand, I can see Coldplay, being at least as popular as say R.E.M. in the long run...

      Maybe there's no Rolling Stones, Aerosmith, or Beatles bands in the wings, but that's probably because nobody seems to play their own instruments anymore... As for guitar hero, name a few popular artists today that play their own music on a guitar... That's why they have 70's and 80's bands..

  2. Young people don't drive. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I can stream music on my phone, and I often listen in the car. I don't stream music while driving because it cuts out due to cell hopping and things. I'd have to get satellite radio for a better solution.

    It's still much much easier to just use locally stored music - CDs or on my phone SD card or otherwise.

    1. Re:Young people don't drive. by Missing.Matter · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The streaming service I use allows for locally downloaded copies of the tracks, so when I'm in the car I just download an entire album and let it go. When I'm done with the drive, the album gets deleted.

    2. Re:Young people don't drive. by joe_frisch · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The apparently also don't travel in airliners, or to foreign countries where data access is expensive, or to remote locations without any data. If you spend your life in a big modern city, its easy to get the impression that the internet is always accessible.

      If I could really be connected all the time, I wouldn't mind cloud-based / streaming services, but in reality I spend a significant fraction of my time in locations where I do not and can not (for any reasonable price) have internet access.

      Services that let you download and then play while disconnected could work, but that starts to sound suspiciously like "ownership" to me.

      I think there are 3 different issues here. One is whether you pay one-time for the content, or pay each time you use it. One is where the content is stored and whether it will be available when you are not connected. The third is whether you will always have access to the content or if it will be removed at some point.

      For me, I don't care much about the payment model as long as the total cost works out to the same. I do want my content available when I am not connected, and I really don't want content to disappear.

  3. Circles by SJHillman · · Score: 5, Insightful

    We seem to be going in circles with music. Own a phonograph, stream from radio, own an 8 track/cassette/CD, stream from TV (MTV or countless other music channels), own mp3's, stream from the Net

    1. Re:Circles by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Own phonograph.
      Oh, it's too much work to manage my collection.
      Stream from radio.
      Oh, I can't decide what I want to hear.
      Own a tape/casette/CD.
      Oh, it's too much work to manage my collection.
      Stream from TV.
      Oh, I can't decide what I want to hear.
      Own MP3s.
      Oh, it's too much work to manage my collection.
      Stream from the net.
      Oh great, I can decide what to hear and don't have to manage my own collection!
      (Some time in the future)
      Oh wait, there was this song I particularly liked. Where has it gone? Maybe I should have my own collection again.
      Damn, the RIAA no longer allows me to own!

  4. Ownership may fade in the short term by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Without ownership, you're giving someone else the ability to take away your access. Once that happens a couple times, I think people will start moving back to an ownership model.

    I think the cloud is great as long as it works. The problem is these services sometimes go away. I was personally bitten by the Google Video shutdown. They refunded the money I paid at the end, but I lost the shows I bought. Now I don't buy videos unless they're on DVD or Blu-Ray. At least I have the physical media and player in hand.

    1. Re:Ownership may fade in the short term by jedidiah · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Certain people also seem to have an interest in grossly overstating the "burden" of ownership. Wasn't the whole point of iTunes in the early days was that it eliminated this "burden of ownership". Wasn't it supposed to make adding a physical copy of music to your electronic library easy and painless?

      It seems the marketing propaganda changes to suit whatever the current product is.

      Ignore all of those old ads, we have a new gospel for you today.

      I don't "maintain" squat. Something gets ripped when I buy it and just sits around. If a device can accommodate my entire music collection, then there is nothing to "manage".

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
  5. TCO by jeffy210 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I guess it all comes down to how often do you want to pay for it? One time up front, or every single time you want to listen to it. For me it's the former. Also, the biggest fallacy in the article is "If their music is constantly available anywhere on any device, then 'what's the difference?" What happens when the service you're streaming from is no longer available or the RIAA revokes the licenses. What happens then? I guess people will just move on to the next hit and not care.

    --
    ------
    "And may your days be long upon the earth."
  6. "Liberating" by giltwist · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Two thoughts come to mind here.

    1) It's "liberating" in the same sense that being chemically castrated and color-blinded is "liberating" in Lois Lowry's The Giver. You are "liberated" from the onerous chore of responsibility for your own actions.

    2) Oh, you know what, even though you've spent $100 bucks on every album by Blah Artist, he's now a bad influence on society. We, the corporations, will benevolently "liberate" you from such unwholesome thoughts. *287 files deleted*

    1. Re:"Liberating" by jedidiah · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The castration comparison is quite appropriate.

      Some people want the ability to choose for themselves and others seem to want total dependence. The idea of becoming a eunuch for the sake of convenience is not far off the mark really.

      The founding fathers are spinning in their graves over this "ownership is a burden" rhetoric. It was one of the key things they fought for.

      You know... life,liberty, property.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
  7. Bandwidth costs, offline access ... by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Insightful

    For me, streaming is the opposite of what I want. Between ISPs wanting apply bandwidth caps and additional costs, or being able to play music in my car or wherever I want it, I definitely prefer to own.

    Granted, I'm not covered under the definition of "young" here, so it's probably a generational thing.

    I still pretty much exclusively get my music on CD, and transfer it to MP3 so I can play it on whatever device I want to.

    I'm definitely in the "own not rent" camp.

    --
    Lost at C:>. Found at C.
  8. A wise man once said by mccrew · · Score: 3, Insightful

    One of my favorite sayings is, "The more you own, the more you are owned." It's definitely a liberating feeling to not have to own and manage stuff, physical and virtual.

    --
    Hey, Windows users, there is no such thing as "forward" slash, there is only slash and backslash.
  9. Re:Probably just because it's so easy by heypete · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Indeed. Pandora, for example, is free and has less ads than a radio station. One can even up/downvote various songs so that it plays more music that you're interested in.

    Even their paid service is only $36/year, has better quality, and no ads. Why would I bother to buy a small amount music (particularly on physical CD) when I could pay less (either $0 or $36/year) in exchange for essentially unlimited amounts of music any time I want it?

    Then again, I have a 5-minute commute on the train and am in the lab all day working on an internet-connected computer, so my needs may be different from people with longer commutes and spotty internet service.

  10. Anyone concerned about loss of control? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Call me cynical, but I'm concerned about loss of control without an actual copy of the music I want. Just like with radio right now, I could listen to [insert popular song of the day] just about any time I want, but come a year or two down the road, and that might not be the case. Add 10 - 20 yrs to that, and the song may be virtually impossible to find. I know that was the case with a number of some of my all-time favorite CDs - it took a lot of work to track them down. I'd rather not "hope" that someone else is making them available down the road - I can make sure I always have them by keeping my own copy.

  11. Is this a video news release? by vlm · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Is this a video news release from the cell phone providers?

    If their music is constantly available anywhere on any device, then 'what's the difference?,' ponders the article.

    The difference is my bandwidth to my phones SD flash card is free, but my cell provider wants me to pay $50 per gig.

    Hmm so I could rip a DVD that I own to my phone for free, or I could pay $ to download it over wifi, or I could pay $$$ in bandwidth charges to stream.

    Also service sucks everywhere I go, so if I actually want to listen, rather than listen to buffering and pauses, then I need to download first.

    --
    "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
  12. who do you trust? by tuffy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If you own your own fileserver, like files in particular format and tagged in just the right way, owning is the right option. You're trading the work of doing that yourself for the benefit of having your data the way you like it.

    For a lot of people who either aren't capable of managing files or just not interested in doing that work, offloading music to "the cloud" or some streaming service makes sense - trading control for convenience.

    I prefer the former option, but can understand the appeal of the latter.

    --

    Ita erat quando hic adveni.

  13. Even if you win the rat race, you're still a rat by j-stroy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Bandwidth and power used by internet infrastructure is a waste of money and energy compared to playing locally off a low power digital device. Streaming only serves to commodify usage similar to how industries have eked their way into every "payable" crevasse of our existence. Its vampiric how our little time here has been turned into being wage slaves for ideas such as this. Even if you win the rat race, you're still a rat.

  14. Streaming is the new radio by DragonWriter · · Score: 4, Interesting

    As long as I can remember, most people listened to music on the radio -- people who dominantly listened to purchased music have always been the exception.

  15. I was told, once... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 5, Funny

    I once spoke to an elder, with a beard of white and an onion on his belt, who spoke of a certain 'amplitude modulation' by means of which he had 'streamed' music rather than owning it on one of the 78rpm vinyl-platter rotational media of the day....

  16. Digital Collections by nine-times · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I think a lot of people try to explain these things too rationally. I could be wrong, but in my mind it all comes down to the idea of "collecting".

    See, when people used to collect records and VHS tapes and even DVDs, they didn't just want to listen to the music and watch the movies; they were amassing a collection. However you want to explain the psychology of it, it was pleasing to see your collection on a shelf. It was comforting to know that you were happy with your collection. You could say, "I have every Rolling Stones album ever," or whatever, and it was pleasing beyond the sum of the enjoyment you get from listening to each song individually. You even bought that one album you didn't like very much because otherwise, there was a hole in your collection. You'd think, "I have every Rolling Stones album... except that one. Well, I may as well get that one."

    And that was part of where the music industry made its money. There were big hits that made a lot of money, but there were also a bunch of collectors amassing very expensive collections.

    And then the whole thing went digital, and the idea of collecting has lost some of its luster. First of all, it's not something you can display on your shelf, so you don't get the satisfaction of having your collection also be a design choice in your house. At most, you might be satisfied when you go to sit through your computer, or as you scroll through your iPhone.

    Secondly and perhaps just as importantly, the collection has lost its uniqueness. Sure, you may have every Rolling Stones album ever, but you can just copy it and give it to your friend, and now he has all of their albums too. So there's no status in it, and no accomplishment.

    Aside from that, there's nothing personal in it. When you had physical copies, you might look at an old record and remember, "This is the first record I bought for myself when I was 16. I bought it with money from my first job. I listened to this exact physical record over and over until it started to wear out. Now there's a scratch in this one part of the song, and I know exactly when it is from memory, because I know this physical object so well." Now a song is some bits that get transferred from device to device, and are effectively identical to everyone else's collection of bits for that song.

    So when you take away the aesthetic appeal of an actual collection, and you take away the uniqueness and the personal nature of it, there's nothing left but the listening. That's all people want: to listen to the music conveniently and cheaply.

  17. Music from iTunes and Amazon is DRM-free by tepples · · Score: 3, Informative

    In *theory* these media are supposed to be copy protected so you can't transfer them from one format to another.

    Neither iTunes Store nor Amazon MP3 uses digital restrictions management for "the stuff you own" anymore as long as it's music. iTunes Store still uses DRM for movies and video games, but the article isn't about those.

  18. Young Listeners Also Have Access... by eepok · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Young listeners also lso have access to silly amounts of bandwidth almost without regard to their location. If there's not a WiFi hotspot, then the kid (or Mom/Dad) are paying for a large bandwidth cap on the smartphone.

    They don't bother to learn directions anymore or explore because Google Maps or Yelp tell them exactly where to go. They don't wander what their friends are doing, their friends are desperately advertising their locations and activities on Facebook and "young listeners" hear it.

    It's not surprise that Gen Y or Millennials are less likely to have their own copies of music. They understand bandwidth and internet access as ubiquitous. Most of us don't. We grew up with low-speed hardline modems, not always on broadband connections. We see wireless internet access as a luxury. They see it as a given.

  19. Grandpa here. by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Over the long haul ownership is the only thing that guarantees you access to the music of your life.

    Many of the things that I loved when I was a college student are out of print, or just flat out not available except as rare items.

    Streaming? Not available.

    People streaming now will eventually own the music that ties into their memories, or lose it.

  20. Lost mine and didn't go back to buying by Necron69 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I lost my entire hard copy music collection in a house fire back in 2008. I took the insurance money for all the CDs and kept it. Fortunately, my computer hard drive survived the fire, so I still had the ripped MP3s, but in the four years since, I've only bought a handful of new albums/songs. Nonetheless, I actually listen to a much wider variety of music, and more often now too - all via streaming.

    Pandora is easy, free, and available just about anywhere I go. I really can't rationalize paying for what I can get for free.

    Necron69