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RIAA Goes After CNET For Media-Conversion Software

Posted by timothy on from the don't-you-know-this-pen-could-be-used-in-a-crime? dept.

First time accepted submitter moj0joj0 writes "Two days after YouTube-MP3.org, a site that converts songs from music videos into MP3 files, was blocked from accessing YouTube, the RIAA has asked CNET to remove software from Download.com that performs a similar function. The RIAA focused its criticism on software found at Download.com called YouTubeDownloader. The organization also pointed out that there are many other similar applications available at the site, 'which can be used to steal content from CBS, which owns Download.com.' CNET's policy is that Download.com is not in any position to determine whether a piece of software is legal or not or whether it can be used for illegal activity." For a sufficiently broad definition of "steal," you could argue that all kinds of software (from word processors to graphics programs to security analysis tools) could be implicated.

39 of 257 comments (clear)

  1. Stream, Download, what's the difference... by Bigsquid.1776 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Don't these dorks know there is not much difference between streaming and downloading.

    1. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by The+MAZZTer · · Score: 5, Informative

      The browser will, in fact, cache some of these on the disk so the user can pull them out of there if they want to.

    2. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by ThatsMyNick · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Ads

    3. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by MightyYar · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Probably not. I actually have a non-infringing (I think) use for these tools. My old Mac G5 has no Flash updates anymore - it's not supported. Most of the time it doesn't matter, but every once in a while I have to download the video so that I can view it with VLC.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    4. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by cpu6502 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I always download songs because I've seen instances where the record company yanked the song off youtube (example: most of Prince's songs). I learned to backup my favorite 70s/80s-era songs so that, if I can no longer access them via youtube, I can still hear them when I like.

      --
      My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
    5. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I have to download the video so that I can view it with VLC.

      I'm fairly confident that VLC can accept a Youtube URL and stream/play the video without downloading as a separate step.

    6. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by jimmyfrank · · Score: 5, Funny

      You could probably take a shoe box, construction paper, magic markers, and make a mp3 vault. Take some pics, blog about it, and the RIAA would probably think it was real.

    7. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by kelemvor4 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Bingo. They've overstepped their jurisdiction, and need to be placed back in their box.

      The RIAA doesn't have any jurisdiction. They're basically a gang like the bloods or the crips with a different agenda and larger bankroll.

    8. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by FatdogHaiku · · Score: 3, Insightful

      There are FF add-ons to do just that... MANY of them, just open the add-ons manager and search "video".

      --
      You have the right to remain sentient. If you give up the right to remain sentient, you will be elected to public office
    9. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by lightknight · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Nonsense. The RIAA has often stated that it represents the copyright interests of signed artists to its group member; now, many people have pointed out that this is false, but from a quasi-political / legal aspect, we prefer the guillotine's blade to be nice and sharp before offing a tyrant.

      The RIAA has, for a time, had a semi-legitimate case, but has seen to not 'get with the times,' preferring an outdated business model that promotes the very problem it seeks to resolve through legislation. What more, it's continued advances into other, protected sectors is angering a great many people (both at the top, and closer to the middle). Now, the people who have count themselves as friends of the RIAA will remain as such, provided they continue to be furnished with the appropriate bribes; but there will come a time when this will end, as all things must, and the populace will be left with nothing but a devastated legal landscape. At its heart, the RIAA is a paranoid baker, who bids his customers to eat their bread in his kitchen, where he can ensure not a crumb escapes to the outside world; customers are required to sign a lengthy legal document, entreating them not to share their bread with anyone else; special precautions, such as searching his customer's persons to prevent them sneaking off with a loaf, and a search of all nearby bakeries, whose bread is confiscated if it is deemed too similar to his own; finally, for fear of his customers and non-customers alike, enjoying their grainy treats in the quiet of their homes, he proposes to search them on demand as well.

      Cooks have long dealt with issues of recipes (copyright) for centuries.

      --
      I am John Hurt.
    10. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by Warhawke · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Don't these dorks know there is not much difference between streaming and downloading.

      Ads. Data caps. Access restriction. Post-upload revisions. Censorship. If you can equate streaming to downloading, you can equate licensing to ownership.

    11. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by bane2571 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Format shifting is perfectly legal in Australia - Such as copying a TV broadcast to VHS. So these programs are completely legal in every way here. Does the US not have something similar? Are you guys really that backward about copyright?

    12. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by mwvdlee · · Score: 4, Funny

      They don't seem to understand that people will just create new software to keep downloaded data from being deleted.
      They need to ban programming languages.

      --
      Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
    13. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by 91degrees · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The law is more concerned with intent than technical mechanism. This allows the same law to cover deliberately killing someone with a rifle or a car, but remarkably similar actions by accident are covered under different laws.

      The intent of visiting youTube is to stream videos. The intent of this software is to download (and presumably keep a permanent copy of) videos.

      Since the RIAA only has rights to a relatively small number of the videos on youTube, and we have no idea whether all the other millions of users it's hard to make the case that the intent of this software is music piracy. If youTube has explicit terms about downloading rather than streaming, then youTube might be able to argue tortuous interference with contract or something but the RIAA has no standing.

    14. Re:Stream, Download, what's the difference... by stephanruby · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The organization also pointed out that there are many other similar applications available at the site, 'which can be used to steal content from CBS, which owns Download.com.'

      Yeah, CBS is also going to be real happy about this.

      Now even less people will download their adware/malware infected wrappers. That can't be good for Download.com's business model.

      It's one thing for the RIAA to go after little kids for downloading music, it's another thing entirely to go after its own members (but then again, CBS is probably just a member of MPAA, not RIAA, so may be I just answered my own question).

  2. How to scare your neighbors by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Name your wifi network "RIAA Monitor Station"

    1. Re:How to scare your neighbors by SuperTechnoNerd · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I tried to explain it to a friend (a digital neophyte) and he said.. "Well they got to make money too...."



      I explained it to my 84 year old father and he said "Hail Hitler!"

      He got it..

  3. In Other News... by OhSoLaMeow · · Score: 5, Funny

    RIAA has asked Unix vendors to remove the 'cp' command since it can be used to make illegal copies of music software.

    --
    They can take my LifeAlert pendant when they pry it from my cold dead fingers.
    1. Re:In Other News... by jdastrup · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The logical next step for the RIAA is to block the use and sale of speakers.

    2. Re:In Other News... by Nethemas+the+Great · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Well if you switch that to MPAA they have. It's called DisplayPort.

      --
      Two of my imaginary friends reproduced once ... with negative results.
  4. Draw me a line by AmiMoJo · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I'd like to know where the RIAA/MPAA draw the line. Does skipping ads on radio and TV count as theft? How about just channel surfing during the ad-break, or getting up and making some coffee? Or just hitting "mute"?

    Does remembering a song in my head count as ripping them off if I don't also own the CD? If I go to a friend's house is it wrong to listen to or borrow their CDs and DVDs, or watch their cable TV?

    I can buy a portable DVD player and take my discs with me. How is it any different if I rip the discs to watch on my phone or laptop. If I own a DVD but can't be bothered to rip it to my phone is it okay to download a .torrent version? The MPAA's members put all sorts of DRM crap on the disc to make ripping harder, making the download more attractive.

    If I buy a DRM locked song and the seller turns off their DRM servers so I can't play it any more is downloading an MP3 from The Pirate Bay morally acceptable?

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    1. Re:Draw me a line by Eponymous+Hero · · Score: 4, Insightful

      it's a trick question. drawing any kind of line would be a declaration of their limits, and therefore an expression of some kind of ethics. clearly they have none, limits or ethics.

      --
      insensitive clod overlords obligatory xkcd car analogy russian reversals whoosh pedant fanbois ftfy in 3...2...1..PROFIT
    2. Re:Draw me a line by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      They can't and won't draw you a line. Drawing a line would state that, at some point in history, nothing beyond the current technology could do us more or less harm. That is exactly what they don't to have happen. By keeping their position grey, and constantly venting that new tech. is further depriving them profits, they can't be held to any single position of appeasement.

      With this new found argument of 'site scripts' for conversion or 'track grabbing', they might as well say wget and the entire TCP/IP stack should be illegal as well.

      There will never be a withdrawal of attack from the likes of the **AA's and everyone here knows it. If they had their way, you'd have to pay for every time you heard a song, whether intended or not, and every time you saw a movie or movie clip. And likely, if you commented on either online, you'd have to pay them to have it ok'd to be put on the web. That is the absurd length they would go to, to protect their outdated business model, despite hollywood accouting, and artist royalty strong-arming. To add insult to injury, they'd also want an ISP tax in place in so that even if people don't copyright content, they'd still get a cushioned share on the chance that they can't catch you.

      In short, FUCK THE RIAA and MPAA! From now, till forever!

    3. Re:Draw me a line by whargoul · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The problem with boycotting is you have to get a vast majority of consumers to go along with it and most people just don't care enough to go through with it. I do, you do and most of /. prolly does but talk to Joe Plumber or Nacho Roofer about DRM and they'll think you're talking about some sort of VD...nevermind the teenagers (RIAA's ever-so-loyal fanbase) who would look at you like you're stupid and continue to buy anyways.

  5. "can be used for illegal activity" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Holy shit. How much software can NOT be used for illegal activity?

    $ ls /usr/bin /bin /usr/local/bin | wc -l
    2695

    Betting all of that could be "used for illegal activity". Never mind that there are maybe half a dozen media format conversion tools in that list, but check THIS out - there's a tool called g++. With it, I can CREATE tools that could be used for illegal activity, such as media format conversion. It's a meta-illegal tool. Man... posting anonymously, so they don't come after me.

    1. Re:"can be used for illegal activity" by russotto · · Score: 4, Funny

      Holy shit. How much software can NOT be used for illegal activity?

      Not just software. Did you know that all x86 and x86-64 processors contain an instruction called MOV? Despite the innocuous name, this instruction does not in fact MOVE data from one place from another. Rather, it COPIES the data, leaving it in both places -- and that's not the only instruction which does so, just the most common. The ARM processors and even the POWER processors all have similar instructions. The whole industry is involved in a massive conspiracy to violate the copyrights of the xxAAs.

  6. Dear RIAA by Ralph+Spoilsport · · Score: 4, Informative

    Fuck You.

    --
    Shoes for Industry. Shoes for the Dead.
  7. Re:Invalid or valid argument? by bhcompy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    And if you wanted to download the video of some guy making his cat do tricks?

  8. Copyright infringement is not theft by Openstandards.net · · Score: 5, Interesting
    You can argue however you want that it is right or wrong. But, it is not theft. That is, you do not deprive another person of access to their possession.

    I've always hated theft. It is one of the 10 commandments. I grew up learning to hate it because people stole from me. When someone steals your bike, your wallet, or other personal possessions, it hurts. You are now deprived of it, while someone else is selling it for $10 of crack. Stealing hurts innocent people. I continue to hate stealing.

    But, if I paint my bike blue, and my next door neighbor, seeing that, paints his bike blue, he didn't steal my bike. I can call him a "copy cat". But, I still get to ride my bike. I just won't be the only one on the block with a blue bike.

    Yes, we all know the theory of lost sales. But, we all know that copying information does not mean that the person would of purchased that copy of that information if they had not of copied it against the will of someone claiming ownership of that information.

    Thus, I lose respect for anyone who tries to insist that copying information is a violation of the 10 commands along with "though shall not kill" and "though shell not commit adultery". Our laws do not support that claim, and we should do more to discredit those who make it.

    Don't get me wrong. I do not advocate copyright infringement. I am just tired of hearing people try to confuse people into thinking that copying information is hurting people like stealing real physical property does and is a violation of one of the 10 commandments.

    --

    Open Standards Portal
    1. Re:Copyright infringement is not theft by xenobyte · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Copyright infringement DOES hurt people.

      There are two parts to "stealing" and I noticed you only concentrated one half the issue. While you may not deprive someone of their property, you do gain something.

      Really? - Copyright holders are getting HURT because I gain a copy, despite that it in no way deprives them of the original? - How do you figure?

      Oh, and please don't insult everybody's intelligence by stating that the copy represents a value, like a lost sale or similar. That would require an ironclad certainty that the copy is used by someone that with 100% certainty would have paid for it if it wasn't available for free. If the copy is used by a freeloader who would never pay for it, or if a legal sale is unavailable, the argument is null and void. As most illegal filesharing is done by people for exactly these two reasons (it's free or unavailable for purchase), it cannot be called stealing or theft as there's no loss.

      --
      "For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken (1880-1956) --
  9. But I WANT people to download and share my Youtube by vik · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I'm a Youtube content creator. I want people to download and share my Youtube content. Does this mean my right to share stuff should be trumped by a vague notion of piracy?

  10. Re:Invalid or valid argument? by Penguinisto · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Though I guess you could argue said program is no different than a VCR (which the SCOTUS ruled can legally capture video and store it).

    ...which is likely why the RIAA is asking and whining, instead of issuing takedown notices and sending official threats of litigation.

    The absolute last thing they'd ever want is for a case like this to end up making video/audio ripping off a stream the equivalent of using a VCR to tape a show.

    --
    Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
  11. Re:Sound recording? by bmo · · Score: 4, Funny

    >RIAA, would you like to sue Microsoft for having software that ships in Windows that can record audio-out and save it to a wav/mp3 file?

    The RIAA will not be satisfied until they successfully make illegal 3.5mm stereo patch cords that can go from audio-out to audio-in.

    --
    BMO

  12. Hello Pot by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 4, Funny

    Hello Pot, meet Barbra Streisand.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
  13. Simple enough then by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The RIAA members should stop uploading of any content to YouTube which they do not wish to be copied.

  14. Re:But I WANT people to download and share my Yout by vux984 · · Score: 4, Informative

    You probably gave up your rights when you uploaded the content. Doesn't matter what you want (sadly).

    Au contraire...

    http://www.youtube.com/t/creative_commons

  15. Re:If it's just the word "Steal", it'd be easy ... by viperidaenz · · Score: 3, Funny

    where no one can do nothing

    So everyone must do something?

  16. Re:If it's just the word "Steal", it'd be easy ... by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 4, Funny

    I don't get the anger.

    we have the representatives they have selected for us. and there are products they have released for us to consume, plus even given us a few ways to consume them.

    I think we should just trust our corporations since they could not have gotton as far as they have if they didn't know what was best for us.

    --

    --
    "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
  17. Re:If it's just the word "Steal", it'd be easy ... by hairyfeet · · Score: 4, Insightful

    That is why we need to call them what they are, just as they think they can turn copyright infringement into theft we need to label them with a name that denotes their true purpose....Leeches. that is ALL that they are, they are the middle men, bleeding the consumer AND the artist of every Shekel they can, wanting to destroy one of the most powerful free communication systems in world history for their own gain, leeches.

    Jim Sterling at Zero Punctuation has a nice rant and while his is mainly about games the sentiment is the same, its leeches pushing draconian crap like SOPA and PIPA and its all about control, so they can leech.

    --
    ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.