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Japanese Parliament: Fukushima a Man-Made Disaster

Bootsy Collins writes "The predominant narrative of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear disaster has been that the accident was caused by a one-in-a-million tsunami, an event so unlikely that TEPCO could not reasonably have been expected to plan for it. However, a Parliamentary inquiry in Japan has concluded that this description is flawed — that the disaster was preventable through a reasonable and justifiable level of preparation, and that initial responses were horribly bungled. The inquiry report points a finger at collusion between industry executives and regulators in Japan as well as 'the worst conformist conventions of Japanese culture.' It also raises the question of whether the failed units at Fukushimi Daiichi were already damaged by the earthquake before the tsunami even hit, going so far as to say that 'We cannot rule out the possibility that a small-scale LOCA (loss-of-coolant accident) occurred at the reactor No 1 in particular.' This is an explosive question in quake-prone Japan, appearing in the news just as Japan begins to restart reactors that have been shut down nationwide since the disaster."

134 comments

  1. correct. by swschrad · · Score: 1, Flamebait

    stop blaming random "acts of God" for setups man created.

    example: I stack 36 pounds of plutonium blocks in the back yard because I want to send ten atoms to all my friends. I just so happened to use an aluminum pan to hold it, and also tossed in a little polonium and a beryllium copper golf club because that crap was in my way.

    and the town blows up.

    what kind of "act of God" was that?

    same thing for Fukushima.

    --
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    1. Re:correct. by imagined.by · · Score: 1

      It's not "act of God" vs. man-made, but more like evitable vs. inevitable.

      In this case, dismissing the technological aspects and blaming it on human error is intended to let the technology shine as inherently safe, so the japanese power companies can spin up their nuclear reactors again. Nothing to see here, move along please...

    2. Re:correct. by polar+red · · Score: 1

      dismissing the technological aspects and blaming it on human error

      the human factor is inherently linked into technology.

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    3. Re:correct. by symbolset · · Score: 1

      Then we should restrict ourselves to technologies with less severe consequences for error.

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    4. Re:correct. by Will.Woodhull · · Score: 1

      While the intention of putting the blame on human error might be to let the technology shine unblemished, this is just the latest large example that nuclear power generation requires a lot more attention to safely engineering the incredibly failure-prone human component than has ever been done.

      We know people and organizations screw up. And we know that the only safe way to prevent that is to put in place very expensive and very inefficient mechanisms of checks and balances between different groups of humans who have very different value systems. Nuclear power cannot be done safely until coalitions of grandmothers interested in the best thing for their grandkids and tree huggers interested in the best thing for the ecosystems have veto power over engineering and financing proposals... and over decisions about daily maintenance.

      We can probably do this. Some of the various governments in the USA (city, county, State, and Federal) almost work this way. But safe, long term power from fissionables is not going to come about without this kind of oversight.

      --
      Will
    5. Re:correct. by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      interesting take on it. probably more cynicism than even i have.

      considering the pretty comprehensive and scathing indictment of the government regulators as well as TEPCO, i find it hard to draw the same conclusion.

      nobody in a million year half-life would believe that nuclear power is inherently safe, just like they wouldn't believe that driving a car or flying in a plane are inherently safe. seems to be a bit of hyperbole there.

      nuclear reactions are certainly not inherently safe for people, otherwise we wouldn't have to surround them with so much steel and concrete, with so many backups and defence in depth.

      the report pretty much says that TEPCO didn't do the defence in depth right at all, and the regulators were weak as piss in keeping them on the straight and narrow path.

      complacency is always a problem in a field where so little goes wrong but so much could go wrong. i'm all for starting the reactors (i couldn't help but think of Kuato there), so long as regulators can... you know, regulate. effectively.

      perhaps a cruel and unusual punishment for the execs etc at fault is to be front line on the cleanup. fighting alongside the robots.

    6. Re:correct. by mug+funky · · Score: 3, Insightful

      part of the human factor is we're absolutely never going to do this. it's not how we work. we learn by making mistakes, and we learn slowly.

    7. Re:correct. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What has become clear is that running a nuclear reactor safely requires almost as much training as flight crew receive to keep aeroplanes up in the air. But who do we actually have operating nuclear plants? Homer Simpson and his buddies. Now it turns out that when the chips are down, Homer and his buddies can act in brave and selfless ways. But that's no substitute for actually being able to fly the goddamn plane.

    8. Re:correct. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Then we should restrict ourselves to technologies with less severe consequences for error.

      I agree with you completely. We must ban all cars, and ban all coal burning power plants.
      Since nuclear power is the one technology with the least severe consequences, we must increase our nuclear plants by an order of magnitude.

      Then tens of millions of people each year would still be alive instead of dead.

    9. Re:correct. by similar_name · · Score: 2

      In your opinion what is the threshold for acceptable consequences?

    10. Re:correct. by fritsd · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If insurance companies are elbowing each other out of the way to get the contract to insure your factory / power plant;
      because their income depends on accurately assessing the risk/reward factors.

      Actuary is a very well paying profession, I hear.

      Nobody wants to insure nuclear power plants. That's an indicator from an unbiased source that they are a bad idea.

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    11. Re:correct. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In this case, dismissing the technological aspects and blaming it on human error is intended to let the technology shine as inherently safe, so the japanese power companies can spin up their nuclear reactors again. Nothing to see here, move along please...

      Literally you saying man kind should never again fly or ride in a vehicle. You do realize more people have died in vehicles than have died from nuclear, including the use of weapons?

      Get back to us when you want to discuss things reasonably, without the ignorance and well reasoned hyperbole.

    12. Re:correct. by fast+turtle · · Score: 1

      Waking Godzilla

      Rousing Mothara

      Deploying the Gundams

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    13. Re:correct. by RespekMyAthorati · · Score: 1

      Nobody wants to insure nuclear power plants. That's an indicator from an unbiased source that they are a bad idea.

      And nobody wants to invest in them either.
      In an age where ROI is normally measured in years, if not quarters, nuke plants take decades to break even unless the taxpayer picks up at least part of the tab.

    14. Re:correct. by similar_name · · Score: 1

      Nobody wants to insure nuclear power plants.

      Nobody?

      Insurance companies will insure anything, including nuclear power. Like you said they are in the business of assessing risk/reward factors. They don't really care about the type or scale of disaster and they will insure up to a certain amount and set rates and premiums accordingly. So in the Nuclear industry the insurance pool is about $12.6 billion. That's what they'll insure. They'd insure more if rates were higher. So it just becomes a matter of whether insurance makes nuclear economically unfeasible (Most people would say it is economically unfeasible, since Congress picks up the bill after that amount according to the Anderson Nuclear Industries Indemnity Act). Fukushima may be more than $250 billion in damages. Of course the same argument could be applied to say commercial space flight is a bad idea.

      My point really is just that it is up to the actuaries like you say. There is no threshold for acceptable consequences other than a cost/benefit analysis.

    15. Re:correct. by symbolset · · Score: 1

      Then we're going to have to accept the consequences of this choice, like meltdowns.

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      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    16. Re:correct. by fritsd · · Score: 1

      Agreed, I should have said it appears nuclear power industry is not cost-effective unless subsidized heavily by the government.

      And in the 60's and 70's this was the case because those power plants also made plutonium for nukes, perceived necessary for the Cold War.

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      To be, or not to be: isn't that quite logical, Slashdot Beta?
  2. And thats why by geekoid · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I would rather the government built and ran them. I trust government workers to stick to engineering spec and scientific guideline more then a company where a CEO will make a larger bonus by putting off storage costs another year.

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    1. Re:And thats why by Nyder · · Score: 2

      I would rather the government built and ran them. I trust government workers to stick to engineering spec and scientific guideline more then a company where a CEO will make a larger bonus by putting off storage costs another year.

      The government who gives the job to pretty much the cheapest bid?

      --
      Be seeing you...
    2. Re:And thats why by Korin43 · · Score: 1

      The inquiry report points a finger at collusion between industry executives and regulators

      Oh look, government workers aren't magically less corrupt than everyone else..

    3. Re:And thats why by geekoid · · Score: 1

      It's because corporate money snuggled up to the regulating system.

      Corporation work hard to pout their people onto regulatory system, and Japan is especially bad with this type of corruption.
      Remove the largest bonus, removed the profit driven decisions and things are a hell of a lot safer.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:And thats why by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      I assume you mean a well run and open democratic government, rather than say the government of the USSR.

      While I agree it would be better than a for-profit company I think human beings are basically unable to do this sort of thing without any serious mistakes for long periods of time. Look at NASA, a government agency full of scientists and engineers, management made up of mostly ex-sci/eng people, and they still lost two Shuttles. Human nature I'm afraid.

      --
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    5. Re:And thats why by geekoid · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I can't speak for the Japanese government, but in the US money is only ONE component. I have been in bid projects where money was way down on the list, after other factors.

      If you have two bids by companies with the same experience, quality, and other factors, then yeah money comes into play.

      --
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    6. Re:And thats why by polar+red · · Score: 1, Insightful

      indeed, the largest problem in nuclear power: humans, therefore: inherently unsafe.

      --
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    7. Re:And thats why by rahvin112 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Government workers in general are conscientious and careful workers. There are bad apples of course but they are in general good hard workers with good ethics that simply trade pay for job security.

      But, the problem with government isn't the workers, it's the bureaucracy (and political management) forced on them that's goal is to prevent fraud (by putting 5000 pieces of red tape on every action) that causes inefficient government and the requirement that every selection be low bid that handicaps government. For those two reasons alone you'd have to be a friggen idiot to put government in charge of a power plant, even something not dangerous like coal and completely brain dead for something dangerous like a nuclear reactor.

      Unless you are willing to cut the handcuffs, allow non competitive bidding (like the private sector can) and remove the red tape that prevents fraud (and expect fraud as a result) you are going to have the worst built, deficient running reactor in the world if you let government build or run it. I'll temper that statement with one caveat, if you allow the millitary to run it you will probably be fine for construction and operation but they'll probably take the waste and dump it in an open pit on the side of the reactor.

      At least with private companies you can structure regulation to enhance their desire for safety by making unsafe conditions very unprofitable. But you have to give the regulators teeth, and you have to put in place laws that will pierce the corporate veil for serious accidents and you better be prepared to pay a LOT more for power.

    8. Re:And thats why by ackthpt · · Score: 1

      I would rather the government built and ran them. I trust government workers to stick to engineering spec and scientific guideline more then a company where a CEO will make a larger bonus by putting off storage costs another year.

      The government who gives the job to pretty much the cheapest bid?

      There was a time when the Government handed out contracts and amazing things were done and done well.

      It's only recently, in an era where whistleblowers can more easily rat out bad materials, practices or cheating the contract, where companies seem most interested in seeing what they can get away with. Silly, no?

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    9. Re:And thats why by serviscope_minor · · Score: 1

      The government who gives the job to pretty much the cheapest bid?

      Or, actually having the government run it, not contract it out.

      --
      SJW n. One who posts facts.
    10. Re:And thats why by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean like TVA, a government agency that runs nuclear power plants and was cited by the GAO for willfully disregarding federal regulations on cyber security for those same nuclear power plants?

      Or what about the old atomic energy commission that totally disregarded safety in the name of progress and had be broken into two agencies because of inherent conflict of interest?

      Yes, you're right, you can trust the government!

    11. Re:And thats why by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      I would rather the government built and ran them. I trust government workers to stick to engineering spec and scientific guideline more then a company where a CEO will make a larger bonus by putting off storage costs another year.

      That'll be why Challenger and Columbia are in pieces rather than a museum.

    12. Re:And thats why by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I would rather the government built and ran them. I trust government workers to stick to engineering spec and scientific guideline more then a company where a CEO will make a larger bonus by putting off storage costs another year.

      Two words, "Lowest Bid".

    13. Re:And thats why by ngg · · Score: 1

      That'll be why Challenger and Columbia are in pieces rather than a museum.

      Yes, um, about that... I'm sorry, what were you saying?

    14. Re:And thats why by WillDraven · · Score: 1

      if you allow the millitary to run it you will probably be fine for construction and operation but they'll probably take the waste and dump it in an open pit on the side of the reactor.

      I know the US military has been running nuclear reactors in their submarines for over 50 years, and I haven't heard of any improper waste disposal yet. Having the military in charge or at least a strict military discipline like environment seems like a workable solution to the human problem here. I won't say it's foolproof, but I think it might be a better idea than letting private corporations run the fission piles.

      --
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    15. Re:And thats why by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      how about this - share dividends are dependent on passing inspections? it could probably still be gamed of course. now if the full documentation of the inspections were available to the masses...

    16. Re:And thats why by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      One thing the military mindset does fairly well is to approach a routine procedure with some sense of urgency and attention. Anyone qualified can run a nuclear plant well for a year; the challenge is nine years down the road, when nothing has gone wrong and complacency sets in. The military fights this with discipline and (perhaps more importantly) relatively rapid turnover of personnel.

    17. Re:And thats why by Elledan · · Score: 1

      [..] even something not dangerous like coal [..]

      Coal, not dangerous? From acid rain to fine dust particles causing many thousands of deaths among the US population alone each year, fly ash pools spilling into nearby rivers and rendering nearby areas unusable for generations, not to mention the other pollutants and their effect on people and the environment.

      Oh sure, not dangerous at all...

      --
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    18. Re:And thats why by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The government who gives the job to pretty much the cheapest bid?

      The above statement really makes me want to whack you (and everyone who made this same statement before) on the head with a thick book.

      Lowest bidder only applies when you can describe your needs exactly, and thus the only difference between bidders is price. All other cases involve much more factors to consider.

      And yes I do this for a living.

    19. Re:And thats why by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

      This argument has always fascinated me. Why is it so foreign, in US, that the government may own and operate a large public company with a legally enforced monopoly? Why is it that "governmental action" seem to always be understood as "let's pay a private company to do our job"?

      --
      The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
    20. Re:And thats why by khallow · · Score: 1

      Silly, no?

      Observation bias, I'd say. In an era of whistleblowers, it is only now that we see most clearly (not that we couldn't have figured it out easily enough in the past) how things are done.

      There was a time when the Government handed out contracts and amazing things were done and done well.

      You have to have two things for this to happen. First, a leadership that is interested and focused on said "amazing things". Second, a bureaucracy that is controlled effectively by the leadership. Lose either one and well, there goes the amazing things.

    21. Re:And thats why by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They do not have the qualification and nobody who has the qualification would work for them for the pittance they offer...

    22. Re:And thats why by khallow · · Score: 1

      Why is it so foreign, in US, that the government may own and operate a large public company with a legally enforced monopoly?

      It's not foreign at all. We can just look at how things work and don't work for those countries that do implement such systems. My take is that US citizens would like to avoid the obvious conflict of interest from having government own a large public company.

      Why is it that "governmental action" seem to always be understood as "let's pay a private company to do our job"?

      Well, there is comparative advantage. Private companies do most things better than government does. And there's the absence of sovereign immunity. If a private company harms you, then you have access to the courts for the most part. Even in cases where US law attempts to remove liability, the courts may rule that liability exists. Sovereign immunity is a more effective defense in those cases.

    23. Re:And thats why by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

      I don't see any obvious conflict of interest. Here (France) the government decided that nuclear energy generation was a too serious business to let private companies do it with, IMHO, good arguments, and they stepped in. Areva is a very successful and efficient company.

      The goal of the government is not to make money (well, it is not the primary goal) with it. The goal is to achieve energy independence, to control a strategic infrastructure, to finance research in nuclear processes and to prevent nuclear traffic.

      I agree that private companies do some things better than governments, but it is precisely when it is not the case (as in this example : long term planning and prevention of low probability accidents) that the government needs to take the relay.

      And why on earth would be employees of a government-owned company be less liable than a privately-owned one ? Public companies are attacked in courts as well. And corrupt political influence tend to protect (illegally) both public and private companies.

      --
      The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
    24. Re:And thats why by RespekMyAthorati · · Score: 1

      Look at NASA, a government agency full of scientists and engineers, management made up of mostly ex-sci/eng people, and they still lost two Shuttles. Human nature I'm afraid.

      Because Washington-appointed bureaucrats dismissed the concerns of those engineers and scientists.

      Thiokol management initially supported its engineers' recommendation to postpone the launch, but NASA staff opposed a delay.
      During the conference call [project manager]Hardy told Thiokol "I am appalled. I am appalled by your recommendation."
      [project manager]Mulloy said "My God, Thiokol, when do you want me to launch — next April?"

      from Wikipedia

    25. Re:And thats why by operagost · · Score: 1

      Because government programs never have to run a budget, right? So everyone makes as much as they want, right?

      --

      Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
    26. Re:And thats why by operagost · · Score: 1

      The conflict of interest lies in that an enemy of the regime can be denied access to the critical utility and thus be at its mercy. Kinda creates a de facto limitation of human rights.

      --

      Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
    27. Re:And thats why by Rich0 · · Score: 1

      The conflict of interest is that you don't have an independent watchdog any longer - there is no regulation since the organization running the plant also makes the regulations and enforces them.

      The counterargument is that with regulatory capture you don't really have an independent watchdog over private industry either, but you do have a profit motive there which is lacking with government.

      Bad things really happen either way unless the public gets REALLY enraged (like burning stuff in the streets enraged). There are too many powerful interests involved otherwise.

    28. Re:And thats why by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

      In a modern democracy, the executive branch and the legislative branch are supposed to be separate. The regulations are not made by the people who enforces them. This is the basis of "how not to be a dictatoriship 101". It really is so twisted that you think that a profit motive is some kind of control...

      --
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    29. Re:And thats why by Rich0 · · Score: 1

      Well, profit motive IS a control - it tends to drive efficiency. The problem is without adequate oversight it also drives an efficient plundering of consumers.

      I think the bottom line is that unless you give voters a fairly granular level of control and they show some interest in it, you're going to have problems either way.

  3. I think /. is turning Japanese by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    I think /. is turning Japanese, I really think so.

    1. Re:I think /. is turning Japanese by hcs_$reboot · · Score: 1

      dôshite?

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  4. Not one in a million by byteherder · · Score: 1

    Anyone who thought a tsunami hitting Japan was one in a million need to have there head examined.

    Or as least, have their math examined. This was just a issue of bad statistical calculations, along with bad disaster planning.

    1. Re:Not one in a million by Bootsy+Collins · · Score: 4, Informative

      Sigh. I submitted this story in a hurry this morning before I left for work; and I typed "one-in-a-million" when the part of my brain that isn't dead had meant to type "once-in-a-millenium," which is the actual argument TEPCO makes.

      I hate getting old.

    2. Re:Not one in a million by geekoid · · Score: 1

      A tsunami this size. You should bear in mind that:

      plate tectonics was a new science when these where built; no one accounted for Japan dropping a meter in such a rush, and the size of the tsunami.

      It's not 1 in a million that any tsunami would every hit.

      This was such a huge disaster because the corporate board kept putting of proper waste management due to costs.

      --
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    3. Re:Not one in a million by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I reckon it was such a huge disaster thanks to those in charge turning a blind eye to all the potential issues (which later became realised). It was easy to see in the news that experts across the world were concerned, but every update from Japan claimed that the power station was under control, for about a week after the tsunami hit.

    4. Re:Not one in a million by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes. That such a big tsunami might occur within the timeframe that the nuclear plant was running might be a rare event, but tsunamis almost as strong had historically occurred along that coastline. This was not the first Richter M8+ earthquake and associated large tsunami along the Sendai coast. The Sendai Plain has sediment layers going back a few thousand years with previous events that inundated the area to several metres deep at the coastline. The plant protection was not adequate for the *known* events at ~1000-year scale. That's just foolish.

      If TEPCO makes the argument that they shouldn't have to prepare for the possibility of a once-in-a-1000-year event during the operation of a plant running for almost 50 years, then they're crazy.

    5. Re:Not one in a million by Bootsy+Collins · · Score: 1

      No argument.

    6. Re:Not one in a million by sphealey · · Score: 1

      Bit of human error there, eh?

      sPH

    7. Re:Not one in a million by cheesecake23 · · Score: 3, Informative

      Your little brain freeze notwithstanding, that was an exemplary summary of a complex report. The mea culpa is also appreciated.

      For those who want to read a little more, there's a very good article over at Ars Technica, which in turn links to the full English report from the Japanese parliamentary inquiry as well as an IEEE Spectrum account of the immediate aftermath.

    8. Re:Not one in a million by necro81 · · Score: 1

      A tsunami this size. You should bear in mind that:

      plate tectonics was a new science when these where built; no one accounted for Japan dropping a meter in such a rush, and the size of the tsunami

      This cannot be used as an excuse. Risk management and mitigation is not something done once during the design and construction of a facility. Rather, it is a continuous process that needs periodic review and updating in light of new information. There's plenty on record that TEPCO and government regulators didn't take such new information into account - which makes the claim of negligence valid...and prosecutable.

      And even if the geologic mechanisms behind it were not well understood at the time the reactor was designed, constructed, and commissioned, there was still ample evidence from the historical record of large earthquakes and tsunamis up and down the coast.

  5. Really, really bad by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This just confirms two major an so far insurmountable problems that people have been pointing out.

    1. No amount of upgrades will deal with chronic underfunding, poor management and incompetence. New designs don't deal with these problems either because it is next to impossible. There has to be ongoing maintenance and investment, and you have to have a firm date for decomissioning which you don't extend past. All the time for-profit businesses are running the plants this is impossible, even with the existing massive subsidies.

    2. The best reactor designs in the world are only good up to about a 7.9 on the Richter scale. The epicentre of this one was a long way from Fukushima but may still have damanged it. If there is one closer to a nuclear plant the outcome is basically undefined and we are just crossing our fingers.

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    1. Re:Really, really bad by geekoid · · Score: 0

      " and you have to have a firm date for decomissioning which you don't extend past"
      no, you can reasonably extend decommission for several perfectly valid engineering and scientific reasons.
      So it doesn't have to be a hard date. However you need to have a way to force decommissioning if the engineering and sciecne doesn't make sense to do so.

      ". If there is one closer to a nuclear plant the outcome is..."
      Which is why waste needs to be dealt with correctly and then shipped elsewhere and buried. Actually you could make glass cubes and then drop the wasted into the deepest parts of the ocean.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    2. Re:Really, really bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      1. True, but the base 'safety level' of the new designs are at a much higher level than the base levels of previous generation—which need to be upgraded to maintain what the newer designs give you by default. So if you're going to spend $x billion, you might as well go with the new design.

      2. The frequency of 8+ earthquakes are rather small. And it seems that for Fukushima, most of the problems started when the tsunami hit the plant. I'm sure in an alternative timeline the whole thing was a non-event as the diesel generators (which were not facing the ocean) kicked in and provided the necessary cooling. Of course with new designs (cf. above) you get passive cooling so it wouldn't matter if a tsunami would have take out any generators.

    3. Re:Really, really bad by FirstOne · · Score: 1

      "2. The best reactor designs in the world are only good up to about a 7.9 on the Richter scale."

      3. Or the next Upstream Dam failure....

      "NRC report says 35 Nuclear power plants in the US are threatened by potential upstream dam failure"!!!
      How much do you want to bet, that the NRC gives these "at risk" plants 20 year operating license extensions??

    4. Re:Really, really bad by Target+Drone · · Score: 2

      I would add that a futher compounding factor is that nuclear power is too expensive. Originally the promise when it was first being developed was power too cheap to be metered. You would just pay a flat monthly fee. If nuclear had turned out to be significantly cheaper than all other power sources than it would be much easier to regulate additional expensive safety features, inspections, etc.

    5. Re:Really, really bad by WillDraven · · Score: 2

      Actually you could make glass cubes and then drop the wasted into the deepest parts of the ocean.

      Today's waste is tomorrow's fuel. I think we should keep this stuff where we can easily get to it when we want to.

      --
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    6. Re:Really, really bad by mug+funky · · Score: 2

      too cheap to meter was most likely the promise of a Very Big weapons program, and the economy of scale that brings. if the government has a vested interest in lots of nuke power, they get a lot easier to build.

      the MAGNOX plants in the UK are a good example of this. basically a less thermally efficient and less insane answer to the USSR's RBMK plants.

    7. Re:Really, really bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or the next Carrington event

      http://www.naturalnews.com/033564_solar_flares_nuclear_power_plants.html

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859

    8. Re:Really, really bad by khallow · · Score: 2

      No amount of upgrades will deal with chronic underfunding, poor management and incompetence.

      That's not a problem much less an "insurmountable" one. You don't use upgrades to solve that sort of thing any more than you'd use a hammer to polish wine glasses. There are appropriate tools for appropriate jobs and problems. I would suggest here regulation and frequent tests of emergency preparedness as the appropriate tools.

      The best reactor designs in the world are only good up to about a 7.9 on the Richter scale.

      Again this is not an insurmountable problem, because again it isn't a problem. Here, it is a sound engineering choice. Here, it turns out cheaper to avoid building a plant directly on such a fault rather than to engineer a plant capable of sustaining that sort of acceleration.

      The vast majority of places on Earth simply are incapable of generating earthquake accelerations comparable to sitting almost directly on a 7.9 earthquake.

    9. Re:Really, really bad by oiron · · Score: 1

      There is a fairly strong evidence stream that says that the first LOCA happened before the tsunami hit, though...

      The report touches on that too!

    10. Re:Really, really bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      I propose we put it in a pool next to the reactor.

    11. Re:Really, really bad by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      It was the UK government in the 60s that made the "too cheap to meter" claim. MAGNOX has been a bit of a disaster for us really. No commercial company would buy them when the government tried to sell them off, and we haven't actually figured out how to decommission them yet. Current estimates are that it will take about 100 years to do.

      Interestingly the only other countries to have used the designs are Japan, Italy and North Korea.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    12. Re:Really, really bad by ed1park · · Score: 1

      Not true

      1. Align management goals with the public's. Remove the corporate barrier and make management and regulatory agencies personally liable (criminally/financially) for all negligence and damages. And prevent any kind of "insurance" to protect them. This should apply to all businesses "too big to fail". Throw in the death penalty and you will see things change quickly.

      2. "May have or not damaged" can be argued and our knowledge and technology improves. But what is certain is that this disaster was preventable, which is a damn shame.

  6. Major Uh-Oh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Although Parliament elections in August/Sept. are just about certain the replacement for the PM will be no better able to understand the basics [regarding anything] nor capable to change the 'Nuclear Village Culture' because the new PM will be the candidate of the Nuclear Village Culture.

    So it is just a matter of time before the next Government/Industry made disaster, which has already been made and is just waiting for the right moment to occur.

  7. Yeah, turns out shutting down everything = bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Feeling that squeeze now, aren't ya Japan?
    Get the reactors back on you fruitloops. Reactors are safe, the idiots who made Fukushima weren't.

    Or let me rephrase that, most reactor designs are safe.

    1. Re:Yeah, turns out shutting down everything = bad by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's a some-hundreds-of-pages report, so I wouldn't have expected you to have read it; but is it too much to skim the summary that TFA kindly provides?

      The report's punchline is that TEPCO fucked up, and nuclear oversight and response are deeply rotten on both the operator and the regulator sides due to chronic regulatory capture and fecklessness. Honestly, that's a conclusion even more difficult to fix than some sort of design problem. Machines can be repaired. Deep cultural rot is much harder to root out, and makes it very likely that, even where solutions do exist, they will not be reliably enacted.

      It's really about the most damning conclusion that the report could have arrived at...

    2. Re:Yeah, turns out shutting down everything = bad by FishTankX · · Score: 1

      The design for the reactor in question was actually American.

    3. Re:Yeah, turns out shutting down everything = bad by hcs_$reboot · · Score: 2

      Yeah the problem was 100% human. On the contrary, nuclear technology is 100% safe.

      --
      Slashdot, fix the reply notifications... You won't get away with it...
    4. Re:Yeah, turns out shutting down everything = bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Get the reactors back on you fruitloops.

      ITYM "fluitroops"

    5. Re:Yeah, turns out shutting down everything = bad by gweihir · · Score: 1

      Indeed. And there are quite a few of these "well engineered" pieces of crap in the USA.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    6. Re:Yeah, turns out shutting down everything = bad by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 2

      The kicker is that those two are not independent:

      The report's punchline is that, because of human/cultural problems, the technology actually deployed will never be as safe and reliable as the technology theoretically available with today's body of engineering and technology knowledge.

      So, whatever the state of the art is, unless the broken human factor is fixed, the actual nuclear facilities actually fully of zesty isotopes will always be less safe than the state of the art would suggest, even in a fairly high-budget situation like Japan.

      That's the real kicker. Even if technology could save you(I'm not sufficiently knowledgeable of the state of the art to say whether it actually could or not), you won't take it up on that offer, so having broken humans ensures that you will end up dealing with incompetent responses to the breakage of sub-optimal technology...

  8. oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by swschrad · · Score: 4, Insightful

    there are lots of reports out and coming, and lots of boiling down hundreds of pages of complex investigation into 20 column-inches, from which, boiled with a pinch of pepper and lots of HappyTalk, you get a 20 second news story.

    there are already lots of pages of technical shortcomings, outright ignorance, wishful thinking, dotcom business plans, and pinhead idiots in custom suits strutting before and hiding afterwards trying to protect their secret overseas banking accounts in the wild over this.

    Fukushima is pretty much a complete cluster-fuck, a manual of "don't do this" in every direction.

    but the Japanese way is one or two men take the blame, grab the sword, and everybody else moves happy through the streets now that the demons are purged.

    this report points out the 800-pound gorilla in the corner, whistling past the graveyard, hoping to not attract attention.

    --
    if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
    1. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by bakarocket · · Score: 5, Interesting

      While I agree that there is a lot of information being lost in the media grinder, and that the handling of Fukushima should be made into the poster child for clusterfuckitude, I would say that this is an example of (some) Japanese politicians taking some of the more rigid aspects of Japanese culture to task.

      Also, contrary to what the GP is trying to say, this is not about making the technology appear safe and blaming human error. It even says this in the summary, "We cannot rule out the possibility that a small-scale LOCA (loss-of-coolant accident) occurred at the reactor No 1 in particular."

      This reaction is the opposite of what has historically happened in Japan when this sort of issue arises. The ex-TEPCO execs and their government cronies are being lambasted in the press and on the net for being given cushy jobs and TEPCO is being nationalized. Hopefully, harsher measures will be applied (if the furor doesn't die down).

      Hopefully, those responsible for the human errors will be made to pay for their mistakes, and those technological shortfalls will be shored up. If they can't be fixed, we'll have to find a new way of getting power.

    2. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      but the Japanese way is one or two men take the blame, grab the sword, and everybody else moves happy through the streets now that the demons are purged.

      In the US, we do the same thing, except without the two guys taking the blame. Instead, they get a golden parachute, an 8 figure settlement, and in two years they write a book and become a celebrity on Fox Business. Maybe they run for office.

      Hell, they don't even apologize any more. What's with this guy from Barclay who was stealing these unimaginable sums and is allowed to quietly resign and disappear? These are the new god-kings of our society. They appear to have formed a breakaway culture that is no longer bound by any social or legal conventions.

      If somebody asks, "Why isn't somebody in jail?", the answer is always, "It's more important to look forward than backward" and the pundits nod their heads sagely, ignoring the snorts of laughter.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    3. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by Will.Woodhull · · Score: 2

      this report points out the 800-pound gorilla in the corner, whistling past the graveyard, hoping to not attract attention.

      What an incredibly bad mixed metaphor. This is a real Fukushima hash of a sentence. :-)

      --
      Will
    4. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by McFadden · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I agree, wholeheartedly. It's very unusual to hear Japanese, especially politicians, comment on firmly established elements of their own culture in a negative way. While I doubt we're witnessing a sea change, and to be honest, in a lot of ways Japanese culture is also responsible for a lot of positives (e.g. clean streets, low crime etc.), it's good to see a bit of introspection going on here.

    5. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by phantomfive · · Score: 3, Informative

      In the US......What's with this guy from Barclay who was stealing these unimaginable sums and is allowed to quietly resign and disappear?

      Uh, you realize that Barclays is in England, right? And he hasn't been let go quietly, he was brought before parliament, and a criminal investigation is ongoing. That's after a 290million pound fine.

      Dang it, Popie, you should know better than this. Check your facts before posting.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    6. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Uh, you realize that Barclays is in England, right? And he hasn't been let go quietly, he was brought before parliament, and a criminal investigation is ongoing. That's after a 290million pound fine.

      No, the one that is being investigated is the bank director, not the perpetrators. The perpetrators have already been sacked, and Barclays did not file a police report so no criminal investigation has occurred. The one under public scrutiny has resigned with a golden parachute.

    7. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by squizzar · · Score: 1

      290Million pound fine to the company, so effectively paid for by the shareholders, not by those who actually perpetrated the crime (and still demand their bonuses).

    8. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by fritsd · · Score: 3, Interesting

      In other news, I read Oliver North has become a political commentator on Fox "News" (after failing to become a US Senator), so I believe you're spot on :-)

      --
      To be, or not to be: isn't that quite logical, Slashdot Beta?
    9. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by khallow · · Score: 1

      Fukushima is pretty much a complete cluster-fuck, a manual of "don't do this" in every direction.

      Based on what? My take is that if it really was, then things would have turned out a lot worse than they did.

      I think people forget that there was a number of plans for dealing with a meltdown from the initial design of the plant (which did survive a vast earthquake and some number of tsunami) through to the desperate means for cooling the core (such as using pumped sea water) even in the absence of on site power of any sort. And while these didn't work as well as we'd like, they did work.

      As others have noted, now is a time for hunting witches and attaching blame. Hence, the unusually vigorous findings by government bodies more well known for their tendency to sweep such things under the rug.

    10. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      The crime is why there is a criminal investigation.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    11. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by RespekMyAthorati · · Score: 1

      The crime is why there isn't a criminal investigation.

      FIFY

    12. Re:oh, I don't think they're ignoring bad tech by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Not to call you dumb, but did you actually check to see if there was a criminal investigation? There actually is a criminal investigation ongoing.

      You should check this things, because you do, right now, at this very moment, appear like a retard. Check your facts before posting.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  9. Hysterical hyperbole. by A+beautiful+mind · · Score: 1, Insightful

    There has been a tsunami that killed over 10000 people and demolished multiple cities and dozens of chemical plants and factories. If this was a man-made disaster where the fuck was the planning to prevent it? Why are we still talking about the nuclear plant, where at most a couple of dozen people will die in the next hundred years?

    Sure, we could have done more to prevent the damage in Fukushima, like build units from a newer generation (fukushima daichi's sister plant survived the same tsunami, but was slightly younger and thus had much less problems), have better oversight, regulation, emergency response etc. However, that is like asking what could have been done better about shark deaths in Nevada ("noone expected it to happen", "zomg, sharks!"), and totally ignoring deaths by drugs abuse, cancer, transportation accidents and cardiovascular causes in the meantime.

    The point is, reinforcing Fukushima would have been a waste of money and effort, money and effort that would have been better spent on building better flood barriers to protect places where people actually live.

    --
    It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile
    Be yourself no matter what they say
    1. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by 0olong · · Score: 0

      If you're going to call a parliamentary inquiry hyperbole, you better have something to back that bold statement up with. Yet all you come up with is grandiose value judgments containing no facts, no numbers, no sources, and nothing of substance whatsoever. Hold a mirror up in front of you, and maybe --in a hysterical feat of irony-- you will find where the origin of said hyperbole really lies. Pompous windbags like you, "beautiful mind", are why I dislike Slashdot more and more these days. For shame.

    2. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you believe global warming. I don't think the heat will be the end game the doomsayers say but ocean acidification may very well be. Ether way we would probably have been able to prevent thousand to billions of deaths by simply having built more nuclear plants. Even if we'd had 10x the number of meltdowns per plant then we currently have. We'd still be ahead by a vast sum of lives and they would have probably enjoyed a higher standard of living in the coming years. Now, am not going to say solar and wind won't work today but I'm saying had we switch to nuclear in the 50s-70s when it was the only real alternative to coal, oil, gas, etc. We would be way ahead even with some really nasty disasters. Also, we probably would have built nuclear rockets to bring man further into space. This is really one of the greatest losses. If space aliens find us dead from runaway C20 and realize that we had the Tech to build nuclear way before the shit hit the fan they will know we deserved our fate. .

    3. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by xs650 · · Score: 2

      The point is, reinforcing Fukushima would have been a waste of money and effort, money and effort that would have been better spent on building better flood barriers to protect places where people actually live.

      The company decided a complete disaster was worth risking because it was only a once in 1000 years probability. Considering the risk, that was an irresponsible choice. Providing a robust cooling/shutdown system wouldn't have cost much more than the system they built. The plant would still have been lost but the gross amount of radiation leakage wouldn't have happened.

    4. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Right on target!!! + 1000 Mod points

      Enough said!

    5. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Well, they only needed to deal with flooding, as in,

        1. put at least a few of the generators on that HILL behind the reactors

        2. run WATERPROOF and reinforced cables (so they don't break if something falls on them) from those hill installed generators to each of the buildings

        3. Make the most vital parts of the nuclear plant, the reactor building itself, water resistant (eg. doors open outside, not inside) with water pumps to catch leaks.

      A plant like that should be under 10m of water, get water logged, but still not melt down. Heck, passively safe systems would work too.

      So no, I don't agree that reinforcing Fukushima would have been a bad thing. It would have saved some money and a lot of grief in the long run.

      Regardless, total compensation for the disaster is expected to be about 200-250 billion USD equivalent (yen). Japan is now burning through about 35-45 billion USD hard currency per year to replace nuclear power with fossil fuels and they are running short. So one Fukushima level disaster every 5-6 years is what nuclear power is saving in costs to Japanese economy. And that is why Japan without nuclear power is a dead economy.

      As for the "environmentalists" saying doom and gloom, the entire effect of nuclear power disaster like that is quite local. Not good for Japan *people*, but completely unimportant from the world population. Heck, it could even be a positive thing for the natural world. Nature can reclaim 10s of sq. mi. of land simply because it is now undesirable by humans for a few generations. So I have now idea how so called environmentalists say nuclear power is bad.. If all goes right - it doesn't emit CO2 or toxins. If it goes tits-up, people leave the area and allow nature to thrive... I have yet to see an animal care if it has 1% or 10% increased chance of a tumor in its lifetime! It seems to care more if it gets run over by a car or shot or its habitat made into another Walmart.

    6. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by A+beautiful+mind · · Score: 1, Insightful

      You can always do better, especially with the advantage of hindsight. Worrying about Fukushima's failure in retrospect is however the equivalent of picking faults in the security of a garden gate when there is no fence around the property at all.

      If it was irresponsible to build a power plant without higher flood protection and keep the old design running for as long as they did, how much more irresponsible was neglecting tsunami protection for the half million people in the area that resulted in more than 15k deaths and 340k people getting displaced?. The parliamentary inquiry should have been focused on that, not driven by the people's irrational and overblown fear of the word "nuclear".

      --
      It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile
      Be yourself no matter what they say
    7. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The situation is nothing like generally worrying about dying from a shark attack in Nevada. This is more like owning a shark aquarium in Nevada that is open to the public, but not installing adequate protections to keep the public from swimming in the tank, and not having adequate first-aid facilities in the unlikely event that someone does manage to get in there. It's part of the *job* of running the business to keep the public safe. The task was the same for TEPCO: keep the public safe. That includes from one-in-1000-year rare events at the scale of historical events such as the 869AD earthquake and tsunami that flooded almost the same area as the 2011 tsunami.

      Your point about the scale of direct damage and deaths from the tsunami versus the nuclear disaster is a valid one, but TEPCO doesn't deserve any sympathy for the failure to do *their* part of the job. Their failure meant emergency efforts had to be divided between handling the direct tsunami effects and the nuclear risks. The worst part about the latter was not knowing how serious the accident might eventually be, which meant a lot of wasted resources at the time that could have been better spent elsewhere. They made a bad situation worse. That is TEPCO's fault. Reinforcing Fukushima to better survive this event would NOT have been a "waste", it would have freed up all those emergency resources, and let the government focus on many of the things you emphasize, although I'm not sure that more tsunami barriers is the best approach.

      Read the last few lines of this section:

      "A Japanese government study found that only 58% of people in coastal areas in Iwate, Miyagi, and Fukushima prefectures heeded tsunami warnings immediately after the quake and headed for higher ground. Of those who attempted to evacuate after hearing the warning, only five percent were caught in the tsunami. Of those who didn't heed the warning, 49% were hit by the water."

      That suggests if you want to save lives in a more effective way, the biggest investment should be in location-specific education (i.e. where to go and what to do in the event of a warning), more reliable tsunami prediction (i.e. avoid false alarms that make people complacent), and more effective evacuation plans, probably not in tsunami barriers that are very expensive and may or may not be up to the task anyway. The safest place to be is not in the path of the tsunami, whether or not a barrier works.

    8. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      how do you convince an electrical utility company to build seawalls for 355k people with the money they _weren't_ going to spend on seawalls for themselves?

    9. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      Japan is about 95% forest, and has been since shogunate times.

      but it's a pretty good point - natural selection doesn't care too much about increased cancer risk on timescales far longer than the length of an average generation in that species.

    10. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by chitokutai · · Score: 2

      You kind of missed the point of this whole review, didn't you?

      As someone who lives in Japan, and in fact in one of the more radioactively contaminated areas outside Fukushima (which isn't that bad), I sure as hell want them to figure out what went wrong and fix it. They called it a man-made error, which in and of itself is an important step in saying that the whole system from the ground up needs to be revised. They even use the word colluded to describe the relationship between the NISA and TEPCO. These are the kinds of issues that can and should be addressed.

      As for the power plants themselves, TEPCO all the other energy companies were given a free ride for years, avoiding having to make any upgrades or adjustments to safety regulations. Does that sound like the kind of nuclear industry you want running your power plants? The report even says that if the Japanese nuclear officials had improved the plants in line with the US standards adopted in the 9/11 report, they could have potentially survived these disasters without problem.

      Finally, the kinds of flood and tsunami protections you are talking about WERE in place. They were completely overwhelmed, and there is no amount of further prevention other than living away from the ocean that would have saved lives. The Guiness World Record holder for the largest wave breaker was in Kamaishi, and that massive wall was cut in two by the ocean.

      So maybe before going on a rant, you might actually read the report and see how important it is for fixing the corruption that has ruled the power industry monopolies for years.

    11. Re:Hysterical hyperbole. by jafiwam · · Score: 1

      They already gave up. In, a uncharacteristic (to Japanese) way, they threw up their hands and quit the nuclear power game over what amounts to a relatively minor aspect of a major natural disaster.

      What's left to talk about? Shut up, clean it up and start whining about not having enough power.

      Politicians bloviating about this is a COMPLETE waste of time. They'd be MUCH better off worrying about the fact the Korean car industry is about to wipe the floor with their kimonos in most major markets. Korean cars are both as good as, and cheaper than, Japanese cars are and Americans have noticed this.

      One could just as easily say, Fukushima would have not been a disaster had the nuclear power been driven to the point that it was replaced with better and safer models long ago.

  10. Well since they know better by Osgeld · · Score: 1

    Why didnt they warn the operators beforehand, that sounds like negligence.

    See how that works?

  11. I'm surprised by gman003 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm honestly surprised by this.

    Not the "it was human error, TEPCO fucked up and could easily have avoided the disaster" part. That was completely expected. I was suspecting as much before they even had it shut down.

    Nor am I surprised about the "collusion between industry and regulators". That was also a given.

    What I *am* surprised about is that they're admitting to it this quickly. I expected it to be a decade or two before TEPCO or the government would admit that anything but the earthquake/tsunami were to blame. And that they're even blaming their own culture of discipline... wow. That's some harsh self-criticism.

    1. Re:I'm surprised by MagikSlinger · · Score: 2

      What I *am* surprised about is that they're admitting to it this quickly. I expected it to be a decade or two before TEPCO or the government would admit that anything but the earthquake/tsunami were to blame. And that they're even blaming their own culture of discipline... wow. That's some harsh self-criticism.

      Exactly. Japanese Parliamentary reports are usually cover-ups or whitewashes of political and industry screw ups. This is probably a first in Japanese post-war history!

      --
      The bitter lessons of a veteran coder: http://bitterprogrammer.blogspot.com
    2. Re:I'm surprised by R3d+M3rcury · · Score: 2

      I'll throw my tinfoil hat into the ring.

      Sometimes it's better to blame people than to blame nature. People can be fixed. Nature, not so much.

      "Oh, the problem was this collusion between industry and regulators. So we'll pass some new laws and we'll hire watchers to watch the watchers and everything will be just fine. We can turn the other reactors back on."

      Compared to:

      "Oh, the problem was that this big tsunami--the biggest tsunami in 1,142 years--came along and there's no way we could plan for such an event and, by the way, all of these other reactors could possibly be affected by something unforeseen and make those areas unlivable and there really isn't anything that can realistically be done. But we'll turn those other reactors back on and just hope that something bad doesn't happen."

    3. Re:I'm surprised by siddesu · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Because there are elections coming, and Japan is sick of nuclear power, so everyone wants to appeal to them, all with their own perverse logic.

      The ruling party (Demoratic Party of Japan, Minshuto), which split recently, is about to lose badly, and many DPJ MPs will try to save themselves by appearing to have some record for toughness and competence.

      The major opposition party, the Jiminto (LDP, liberal democratic party) was in power during the time when the power plants were built, and it is LDP governments who made the rules and the regulators that created the conditions for this outrage. Naturally, the politicians from LDP will want as much distance from this Fukushima trouble as they can get.

      There is then the bunch of minor, one-day parties each of whom wants as much credit for toughness as they can, so that they can ride the popular anger.

      So, you get a drive for toughness out of the usual sleazy, self-serving motives.

    4. Re:I'm surprised by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

      ...That's some harsh self-criticism.

      Some individuals will take the fall in order to preserve the system, because that is what is most important.

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    5. Re:I'm surprised by gman003 · · Score: 1

      They're criticizing the damn system!

    6. Re:I'm surprised by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

      And the system will save itself by sacrificing those individuals, and then claiming all is well... and of course you'll hear exactly the same thing after the next disaster.

      Jedi business.. go back to your drinks...

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    7. Re:I'm surprised by khallow · · Score: 1

      What would be the point of a run-around, politically? Blame a few people, have a scapegoat ritual for public consumption, and get back to business.

    8. Re:I'm surprised by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What I *am* surprised about is that they're admitting to it this quickly. I expected it to be a decade or two before TEPCO or the government would admit that anything but the earthquake/tsunami were to blame. And that they're even blaming their own culture of discipline... wow. That's some harsh self-criticism.

      It's a "once in a milenia" event.

  12. How unexpectedly... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    predictable.

    "The inquiry report points a finger at collusion between industry executives and regulators"

    Anarchists, libertarians, objectivists, classical liberals, and free market economists have all made the explicit case that this is the inevitable outcome of statism applied to the peaceful and voluntary marketplace. The notion that democracy breeds economic fascism has been described in precise detail countless times. These concern has been raised over 100 years ago and have persisted through the years. How long must we suffer the inept domination of central planners before we even consider the arguments why it cannot work? Shall we continue to insist that we just need the right guys in control and then things will be fine? Shall we ignore the evidence and reasoning as to why there is no such person or group of people? Shall we let this corporatist economic environment destroy our civilizations before we decide to stop letting the momentum of history and precedent of popular opinion guide our convictions and begin to actually think critically about the arguments provided? Those who champion more of the same had only credibility with the ignorant. How much longer must even the ignorant be blind to the obvious deception before us?

    1. Re:How unexpectedly... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Wait, what?

      You do realise that the problem here was that the "free market" produced a corrupt business which then bribed the government to look the other way, yes?

      You do realise that removing regulation doesn't take away the ability to bribe the government to look the other way, yes?

      You do realise that all an individual needs is to balance risk/reward for himself, not the business he works for, yes? The goal is not "business profit", it's individual profit.

      Libertarians are stupid. I say that in the nicest possible sense: they're a regular combination of ignorance and low intelligence. They don't really think through what they say. I don't think that they would be able to, even if you helped them to train their minds to think in greater depth.

    2. Re:How unexpectedly... by mug+funky · · Score: 2

      - points out that $pet_ideology "predicted" this outcome.
      - points out some flaws in a system that is != $pet_ideology
      - propose $pet_ideology as solution
      - completely ignore any other flaws than $pet_ideology might entail

      seems good to me!

  13. WOW! The Parliament is SO SMART!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They are so smart they figured out there was a problem AFTER the fact. If this event could have been avoided then why didn't the Parliament inquire BEFORE the disaster. Oh that's right, it's always easier to point fingers and blame AFTER the fact.

    The idea is to be prepared before the accident so that systems fail safe... Having a system that relies on panicked, error prone humans is a dumb way to do business. They thought there systems would fail safe except the disaster was WAY bigger than anything they planned for. Then after the fact politicians who want to sound important point fingers and lay blame.

    Seriously, what level of planetary disaster is sufficient for planning purposes? Because, no matter what you plan for, one day something bigger will occur!!!

  14. Sorry+ by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It is unexcusable to forget to put an answer machine to tell any tsunami to come back after a while. I assume those out-of-the-box nuclear stations do not come prepared. Or maybe they did but they put the message in English thinking tsunamis are like tornadoes.

  15. Check out the USSR by Quila · · Score: 2

    That's an example of government doing it. Many areas of the former East Germany are toxic cesspools because the government didn't care about proper waste disposal.

    When a company does this it has to answer to the government. When a government does this it, in theory only, has to answer to the people. But you have probably noticed how little accountability the government has to the people lately.

    1. Re:Check out the USSR by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      From the perspective of the German-hating Soviet masters, making those cesspools was a feature, not a drawback.

      I don't think anybody supports the kind of non-representative government the USSR and Warsaw Pact had. If anything, in the US, we may have slipped too far in the other direction with Yucca Mountain.

  16. Story from three months ago by jc42 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Before commenting on this story, people might want to re-read the story about the Onigawa power station's survival that was posted here last March. There's pretty clear evidence that at least some managers of Japanese nuclear-power stations understood the tsunami danger and prepared for it. So the main questions should be: Why wasn't this understood by the entire management chain? And what are they doing to make sure they're preparing for the next such disaster?

    I'd think that people in Japan should be checking on which of their power system's managers are busy studying this and related stories, and putting those people in charge of the surviving plants. If they don't, then it's just going to happen again at some unknown future date.

    Similar comments would apply in most of the other volcanic zones on the planet. Here in the US, we might be checking to see which managers of critical infrastructure on the West Coast are aware of the story and studying it. We may not have the 1000-year history that the Japanese have, but we do have geological information about similar events along our coast.

    --
    Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    1. Re:Story from three months ago by khallow · · Score: 1

      There's pretty clear evidence that at least some managers of Japanese nuclear-power stations understood the tsunami danger and prepared for it.

      They all did. And only one location had any trouble with tsunami. Inadequate preparation is not the same as no preparation.

      So the main questions should be: Why wasn't this understood by the entire management chain?

      Understand what? Everyone understood that tsunami were dangerous and every ocean-side Japanese nuclear plant has sea walls or similar things for thwarting tsunami.

      And what are they doing to make sure they're preparing for the next such disaster?

      Everyone has always been preparing for the next disaster. Again, it's not a matter of if they're doing it, but whether such preparation is adequate or not. To give an example, we don't actually have that TEPCO's preparation for the Fukushima accident was inadequate given what was known prior to the accident.

      We also need to have some desired level of outcome in order to agree on whether preparation is adequate. There's never going to be a zero probability of death from accident (even in the case where nuclear power is scuttled, the alternatives have their own risks).

      While you probably are very aware of my points above, it remains that your language is inappropriate. The problem wasn't a lack of understanding of basic risks, but ignorance of the degree of the risk. Similarly, discussion of preparedness not only has to discuss what is being done to reduce risks, but also what level of risks are acceptable in the first place.

    2. Re:Story from three months ago by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      There's pretty clear evidence that at least some managers of Japanese nuclear-power stations understood the tsunami danger and prepared for it.

      They all did. And only one location had any trouble with tsunami. Inadequate preparation is not the same as no preparation.

      No, as jc42 pointed out, a second location had a problem with the Tsunami and was down to a single backup power supply. Had it not been for the efforts of a single man pushing TEPCO management to improve the seawall it would have been worse.

      However, in this case, inadequate preparation is the same as no preparation. The degree of consequence was the effect the tsunami had on the integrity of the reactor. Inadequate preparation still resulted in a disaster at Fukushima and Onagawa demonstrated that it was survivable with better preparation.

      So the main questions should be: Why wasn't this understood by the entire management chain?

      Understand what? Everyone understood that tsunami were dangerous and every ocean-side Japanese nuclear plant has sea walls or similar things for thwarting tsunami.

      What they were supposed to understand was the consequences of the basis design issues that they had not prepared adequately for. The consequences of not maintaining power to the spent fuel pool gate pair seals and the pressure the reactor could sustain (70psi) before it started to vent hydrogen.

      The same applies to the amount of water that should have been sustained above the spent fuel in the pools (450 tons) that would have maintained a safety margin of up to 40 days to perform repairs on the reactor. Unfortunately the backup generators were neatly packed together and on the ocean side of the reactor ensuring that they were the first thing hit by the tsunami.

      As I have often said to you khallow, this is a case of criminal negligence, this report is another step in preparing ground for that action to be taken.

      And what are they doing to make sure they're preparing for the next such disaster?

      Everyone has always been preparing for the next disaster. Again, it's not a matter of if they're doing it, but whether such preparation is adequate or not. To give an example, we don't actually have that TEPCO's preparation for the Fukushima accident was inadequate given what was known prior to the accident.

      What is clear here is that they were doing what every board has been shown that it would do, even with regulatory guidelines, maximise profit. They took the risk and these are the consequences that have manifest. There was plenty of geological science available as opposed to using historical records. By saying that you just look like an apologist for the nuclear industry.

      We also need to have some desired level of outcome in order to agree on whether preparation is adequate. There's never going to be a zero probability of death from accident (even in the case where nuclear power is scuttled, the alternatives have their own risks).

      Again, the basis design issues of this series of reactor was well documented by GE and the American Society of Mechanical Engineers. The desired outcome was obvious, to avoid a situation where the reactor could melt down and to avoid losing a billion dollar reactor installation.

      While you probably are very aware of my points above, it remains that your language is inappropriate. The problem wasn't a lack of understanding of basic risks, but ignorance of the degree of the risk. Similarly, discussion of preparedness not only has to discuss what is being done to reduce risks, but also what level of risks are acceptable in the first place.

      This discussion is not necessary because the requirements are spelled out for operating the reactor. The consequences of not adhering to the manufacturers requirem

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    3. Re:Story from three months ago by khallow · · Score: 1

      However, in this case, inadequate preparation is the same as no preparation. The degree of consequence was the effect the tsunami had on the integrity of the reactor. Inadequate preparation still resulted in a disaster at Fukushima and Onagawa demonstrated that it was survivable with better preparation.

      As we see from the outcome of the Fukushima accident, you are wrong here. "Disaster" is not a bit flag, but a matter of degree.

      Again, the basis design issues of this series of reactor was well documented by GE and the American Society of Mechanical Engineers. The desired outcome was obvious, to avoid a situation where the reactor could melt down and to avoid losing a billion dollar reactor installation.

      And when that can't be achieved, the reactor is designed to meltdown in a certain way so that it remains contained and can still be cooled by outside effort. That happened. Desired outcome too is not a bit flag that either is set or not.

      What is clear here is that they were doing what every board has been shown that it would do, even with regulatory guidelines, maximise profit. They took the risk and these are the consequences that have manifest. There was plenty of geological science available as opposed to using historical records. By saying that you just look like an apologist for the nuclear industry.

      You have to also consider when that geological and historical knowledge was found out and understood, and the time lag involved in the nuclear regulatory bureaucracy. I get the impression that people believe it's an afternoon's work to go from a raw scientific paper indicating tsunami danger to actually making the decision to enlarge a sea wall and other preparation for a higher tsunami danger than previously expected. These thing take years to happen. For example, see how long it took the neighboring Tokai plant to do so.

      Second, it's worth reminding everyone that Fukushima was to be decommissioned. We know that its lifespan was extended, but the decommissioning was planned first.

      Sure, if you know the date on which a magnitude 9 quake will occur, then it makes sense to build that sea wall higher or shut down the plant early. But if you don't have such accurate foresight, then it doesn't make economic sense to prepare for a disaster when your plant is scheduled to shut down in a few years.

      I don't think people appreciate the role that the decommissioning played in disaster preparedness. By planning first to decommission the plant and then changing their mind and extending its lifespan, any plans for mitigating larger tsunami were set years behind other plants. The eventual sea walls may still have been inadequate. but at least they'd be a bit better prepared.

      None of these risks are acceptable risks, this is plain, appropriate language that business understands. They are obvious and predictable risks, attempting to say otherwise is just confusing the issues.

      None of these are acceptable risks to you now. They were to Japan prior to the earthquake. Please don't confuse the two. Sure, Japan will probably never accept that degree of risk any more, but they did at one time.

      As to your accusation of criminal negligence, there has to be evidence of it. We still don't have that. We have yet more accusations from the political apparatus.

    4. Re:Story from three months ago by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      However, in this case, inadequate preparation is the same as no preparation. The degree of consequence was the effect the tsunami had on the integrity of the reactor. Inadequate preparation still resulted in a disaster at Fukushima and Onagawa demonstrated that it was survivable with better preparation.

      As we see from the outcome of the Fukushima accident, you are wrong here. "Disaster" is not a bit flag, but a matter of degree.

      The degree of consequence. That is what I said. Agreeing with me doesn't mean I am wrong.

      Again, the basis design issues of this series of reactor was well documented by GE and the American Society of Mechanical Engineers. The desired outcome was obvious, to avoid a situation where the reactor could melt down and to avoid losing a billion dollar reactor installation.

      And when that can't be achieved, the reactor is designed to meltdown in a certain way so that it remains contained and can still be cooled by outside effort. That happened. Desired outcome too is not a bit flag that either is set or not.

      So what, it failed in the way the design specified it would. It doesn't mean that the circumstances that allowed it to happen should have. But they arose through not following the specifications for operating the reactor. The only bit flag is; Fukushima reactors being operated in according to Design Criteria:False.

      Seawall, backup generators or any other mitigation means so that they would comply with redundancy required to operate the reactor. As a result the degree of consequence or the scale of the disaster or the seriousness of the situation or the mass of the fuckup or the just plain old how hard the shit hit the fan is best measured by the International Nuclear Event Scale and fuckupshima is categorised as an INES level 7 event.

      In other words, Pretty Fucken Bad or Thats a lot of shit, where did the fan go? or in the Giga Fuckup range or at least as bad as Chernobyl. I think the French Nuclear Authorities described the disaster as "apocolyptic", so don't try to convert a memory of failure into success.

      What is clear is we maybe able to design the technology but, as TMI, Chernobyl and Fukushima show, humans may not poses the organisational competence to operate it safely.

      What is clear here is that they were doing what every board has been shown that it would do, even with regulatory guidelines, maximise profit. They took the risk and these are the consequences that have manifest. There was plenty of geological science available as opposed to using historical records. By saying that you just look like an apologist for the nuclear industry.

      You have to also consider when that geological and historical knowledge was found out and understood, and the time lag involved in the nuclear regulatory bureaucracy. I get the impression that people believe it's an afternoon's work to go from a raw scientific paper indicating tsunami danger to actually making the decision to enlarge a sea wall and other preparation for a higher tsunami danger than previously expected. These thing take years to happen. For example, see how long it took the neighboring Tokai plant to do so.

      All this does is confirm my point that the Nuclear Industry is run with profit as the operating mode as opposed to safety. NISA say that fourteen reactors at four sites (including Tokai) were affected with varying degrees of consequence. This indicates systemic failures and inaction, industry wide with no acceptable time frame for action.

      I get the impression TEPCO found it cost effective to do nothing. Where is your evidence that TEPCO intended to perform any enhancements on the seawall? Everything I have seen or read shows TEPCO were ignoring this risk and where you doubted it was an issue before now you c

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
  17. Fukushima was an inside job by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Fukushima was an inside job.

    Clues: what happened in Fukushima, also happened in Niigata earlier:

    FULFORD VS. HAARP
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InV0cVH6KZc

    Benjamin Fulford reports from Tokyo on a mysterious plasma weapon seen prior to the Niigata earthquake in July, 2007 and red, white and blue lights seen prior to the recent earthquake in China. Both quakes targeted nuclear facilities...coincidence?

    Then, just before the Fukushima incident, we see an increase in the magnetic activity caused by haarp (=ionospheric microwave heater) at 2.5 Hz measured by the magnetometer at Gakona. This increase is centered at 2.5 Hz, a frequency that can resonate tectonic plates:

    http://www.humanresonance.org/quake_induction1.jpg

    As we know from the Niigata incident, HAARP leaves clues such as mysterious plasma clouds visible in the sky (because of the warming effect).

    And last, some months after the incident, NASA ( Never A Straight Answer ) creates some downplay BS story about ionospheric heating at Fukushima:

    http://www.naturalnews.com/032670_Fukushima_HAARP.html

    Recent data released by Dimitar Ouzounov and colleagues from the NASA Goddard Space Flight Center in Maryland highlights some strange atmospheric anomalies over Japan just days before the massive earthquake and tsunami struck on March 11. Seemingly inexplicable and rapid heating of the ionosphere directly above the epicenter reached a maximum only three days prior to the quake, according to satellite observations, suggesting that directed energy emitted from transmitters used in the High Frequency Active Auroral Research Program (HAARP) may have been responsible for inducing the quake.

    Nasa's downplay theory claims:

    Published in the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT) publication Technology Review, the findings are presented alongside a different theory called Lithosphere-Atmosphere-Ionosphere Coupling, which hypothesizes that the heating in the ionosphere may have been caused by the impending earthquake as the fault line released radioactive radon. This theory, of course, is not actually proven, but is instead presented as a possible explanation for the presence of the high-density electrons and emitted infrared radiation that was observed.

    Why would they need to explain some theory about why the ionosphere was heated rapidly, if we already know that HAARP is the main known cause for that?

    HAARP = ionospheric heater = an array of antennas which are used for heating the ionosphere

  18. the blame game by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is played at a different level in Japan. Even the most well thought out excuses are dicounted in favor of accountability. I wonder why this hasn't caught on in Europe or the US.
      Probably that falling on the sword thing.

  19. Re:3 words by mug+funky · · Score: 1

    nice! but how'd the Israelis cause the tsunami? that's pretty clever of them to blame the earthquake though.

  20. OK, so what is the severe consequence for cars? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Since nuclear power is the one technology with the least severe consequences"

    [proof damn well required]

  21. I call it politics by Pecisk · · Score: 1

    It's not a independent investigation, but parlamental - which is reason I don't buy it, because politicians always want to look better in public eye. And current public attitude is fear of nuclear. So let's make it to look like human error, nevermind that it hasn't killed anyone directly, and it was once in a lifetime event.

    Mistakes, errors - that's all there. But I would pick a independent scientists and management specialists to vet out them, not politicians.

    --
    user@ubuntubox:~$ stfu This server is going down for shutdown NOW!
  22. In the end, you need two parties by JSBiff · · Score: 1

    No, I'm not talking about political parties. What I mean is, you need some group who are separate and independent from the people responsible for building and operating the reactors, mines, oil wells, etc, who are your regulators. The trick is keeping the regulators from becoming corrupt and losing their independence.

    What I mean is, it doesn't matter whether private companies or government, whoever is building and running dangerous facilities NEEDS someone else who is independent looking over their shoulder or they will become complacent, and eventually an incident will occur.

  23. You can ask a group of any 10 year old schooler. by srk2040 · · Score: 0

    Ask them, if I were to build a nuclear plant in an earth quake prone area, would that be a good idea or bad idea? Most likely they will all agree it's not a good idea. No matter how well the place is built to with stand any, ultimately, you do not want to fudge with mother nature.