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Kinect 2 Sensor Output Image Leaks
New submitter rabok writes "If a Microsoft job posting can be believed, we are set to get a new Xbox on store shelves by March 2014 at the latest. Regardless of when it does eventually arrive, it seems an image claiming to be the output of a Kinect 2 has hit the web by a user on twitter. Kinect 2 is expected to be much more accurate — even able to see individual fingers, read lips, and gauge moods. This image seems to back up that improvement in both depth perception and the ability to distinguish individual fingers."
Microsoft has figured out that people read their job postings to forecast their efforts and it's part of their PR efforts now.
Help stamp out iliturcy.
The Kinect is a clever little device - I've been really impressed at some of the uses that people have found for it. I'm sure that the next-gen version will be cleverer still and, if MS continue to be as admirably "open"(ish) with the hardware as they were with the first one, then I'm sure we'll see some useful applications of it. I can also see something like this being the future of TV remote controls - until they ruined it a bit with the new dashboard, the ability to control my 360 using voice and gestures (including in stuff like Sky Player) was really convenient.
But the problem with the Kinect is that - for everything bar exercise software (where it's fair-to-middling) - it's an awful games controller. It's really, really bad at sensing rapid movements. I mean, it's generally ok at tracking movements that are relatively slow and considered, but at higher speeds, it struggles. And that's a major problem, given that it pretty much rules out any game that involves precision at speed (which many, many games do).
Now in fairness, the Wii-mote has similar problems, even in its "Plus" incarnation - and, indeed, plenty of Wii games have been ruined or at least harmed by that. But for the most part, developers overcome this by augmenting motion controls with button inputs. Indeed, some of the best games on the Wii, like Super Smash Brothers Brawl, make no use of the motion controls at all.
For the most part, to be honest, I think motion control has been a bit of a passing fad. However, there's one counter-point to this I've found, which is slightly surprising. The Playstation Move came late to the party, is technologically unimpressive (it's a Wii-mote that "cheats" via the addition of a basic camera that tracks a coloured ball on the end) and hasn't created much excitement. However, I've played both Killzone 3 and Resistance 3 using it (augmented by the navigation controller) and can confirm that for playing an fps on a console, it is way, way better than a twin-stick controller. It gives a degree of fine precision to your aim that rivals that of a keyboard and mouse. Large, rapid turns are still a problem compared to PC input, but the gap over traditional console controllers is huge. There's a similar effect on the Vita, actually, where Uncharted allows for something similar via tilt controls. This is one area where I think existing motion control technology can actually enhance games in the long-run, rather than being a short lived party novelty.
Microsoft Kinect Spy System
Microsoft Kinect Spy System
http://www.unmarkedvan.com/?p=192
"So you just got the Kinect/Xbox360 gaming system and you're having fun, hanging out in your underwear, plopped down in your favorite lounge chair, and playing games with your buddies. Yeah, it's great to have a microphone and camera in your game system so you can "Kinect" to your pals while you play, but did you read that Terms of Service Agreement that came with your Kinect thingy? No? Here, let me point out an important part of that service agreement.
If you accept the agreement, you "expressly authorize and consent to us accessing or disclosing information about you, including the content of your communications, in order to: (a) comply with the law or respond to lawful requests or legal process; (b) protect the rights or property of Microsoft, our partners, or our customers, including the enforcement of our agreements or policies governing your use of the Service; or (c) act on a good faith belief that such access or disclosure is necessary to protect the personal safety of Microsoft employees, customers, or the public."
Did you catch that? Here, let me print the important part in really big letters.
"If you accept the agreement, you expressly authorize and consent to us accessing or disclosing information about you, including the content of your communications⦠on a good faith belief that such access or disclosure is necessary to protect the personal safety of Microsoft employees, customers, or the public."
OK, is that clear enough for ya? When you use the Kinect system, you agree to allow Microsoft (and any branch of law enforcement or government they care to share information with) to use your Kinect system to spy on you. Maybe run that facial recognition software to check you out, listen to your conversations, and keep track of who you are communicating with.
I know this is probably old news to some, but I thought I would mention it because it pertains to almost all of these home game systems that are interactive. You have to remember, the camera and microphone contained in your game system have the ability to be hacked by anyone the game company gives that ability to, and that includes government snoops and law enforcement agents.
Hey, it's MICROSOFT. What did you expect?
And the same concerns apply to all interactive game systems. Just something to think about if you're having a "Naked Wii party" or doing something illegal while you're gaming with your buddies. Or maybe you say something suspicious and it triggers the DHS software to start tracking your every word. Hey, this is not paranoia. It's spelled out for you, right there in that Service Agreement. Read it! Here's one more part of the agreement you should be aware of.
"You should not expect any level of privacy concerning your use of the live communication features (for example, voice chat, video and communications in live-hosted gameplay sessions) offered through the Service."
Did you catch it that time? YOU SHOULD NOT EXPECT ANY LEVEL OF PRIVACY concerning your voice chat and video features on your Kinect box."
#
Continued..
http://www.unmarkedvan.com/?p=481
"Listen up, you ignorant sheep. Your government is spending more money than ever to spy on its own citizens. That's YOU, my friend. And if you're one of these people who say, "Well I ain't ever done nothing wrong so why should I worry about it?' - you are dead wrong. Our civil liberties are being taken away faster than you can spit. The NSA is working away on its new "First Intelligence Community Comprehensive National Cyber-security Initiative Data Center' to keep track of every last one of us. This thing will be the size of 17 football stadiums. One million square feet, all to be filled with more tec
I assume Kinect2 will be 720p, or at least 640x480 in the depth buffer. I didn't actually count the dots, but the image in the article looks like it's 320x240. Unless Kinect2's sole improvement is higher framerates (including or achieved with onboard processing, perhaps), this looks like the same old thing. At most, it looks like someone is rendering the output of a normal Kinect with their only special bit of test software or something. It's really just an incredibly unremarkable image.
Oh, I know - it's heresy to say such a thing here. But I really like the direction the man is taking the company right now. It's beautiful it its own way - the butterfly dissection way. He is the artist who is sculpting this crescendo of change. Change is good. I hope they keep him for a long time, maybe even until the end.
Your suggestions for process changes aren't going to happen. Microsoft employees aren't interested in those things. They're interested in working the politics of their environment and those issues take the fore for them. Software development is a minor side issue they have to barely tolerate.
Help stamp out iliturcy.
Yes.
This summer, there was a small "science fair" sponsored by MAKE Magazine at Seattle Center, here in Seattle. Microsoft had a large booth and several robots which used Kinect as their sensory input device. There were several different visual modes, of which this was one.
I suppose a screen grab image sent to some outside media could be considered a "leak", but the place was PACKED both weekend days, so I have to think quite a few people saw it and it wasn't being hidden...
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
.. this gets posted on various "news" websites. It's obviously just a random attentionwhore spamming his twitter account with an image any one of us could've created easily. I hate to say it but: FAAAAAAAAKE!
Oh, one mode I saw had "wire frame" figures, and the other was simple "stick men" with articulated joints, and the system seemed to be able to differentiate wrist movement and all five jointed fingers. I imagine that these were development platforms, no telling what will actually make it to the final product
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
I have to wonder if this will hold our interest until 2020 or beyond? It's one thing to try to predict the next year or two but the consoles have exceeded 5 years in having to remain current. I trade off my PC every two years so the console is always going to behind the technology for half it's life cycle at best. Even iPads release new versions every year or so. At this rate the tablets will exceed the abilities of the consoles before the following cycle. They can't survive with this snail's pace of innovation.
So if you are plotting with your friend to lobotomise your e-box don't just talk about it in your space pod. Close the windows first.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
Kinect 1 did 30FPS, although lots of movement made the visual component blurry. As to what the Kinect 2 can do... wait and see like the rest of us.
Help I am stuck in a signature factory!
Think about it for a minute:
Purely speculation on my side, but might be the logical next step for MS.
Games are only one use. I can imagine that this sort of tech could be used for many other things besides games.
I think that after some further body motion research (probably undertaken using motion capture tech) in conjuction with psychology we might see body motion cameras augment security cameras.
Rather than using dots for motion capture for movies and games, perhaps kinect like tech could be used instead. Not just for humans, but for all sorts of animals, or other things.
It may help robots with close range spacial vision.
...and so on. I think that with time, as people adjust to the idea, we will see it adopted in all sorts of uses that we wouldn't even consider today.
Wait and see it fail. Everything claimed for Kinect 2 was supposed to be possible with Kinect 1. The video analysis alone for Kinect 1 was only marginally better than the MS camera.
even able to see individual fingers, read lips, and gauge moods
Kinect / Natal had promised to do all that. Remember Milo? Instead MS delivered a system where most games mapped exaggerated spastic motions onto a few basic actions and had trouble doing even that. No reason to be cynical about the claims of Kinect 2 at all.
My guess is that with Win 8 Metro interface Microsoft might try to move not just into..." Microsoft: It was never 'Metro,' it was always 'Modern UI' A bit of search and replace should sort this out *** By Neil McAllister, 10th August 2012 19:19 GMT : After another long night at the whiteboard, the deep thinkers at Microsoft's marketing department have come up with a new replacement for the verboten word "Metro." From now on, it seems, the blocky, touch-centric user interface of Windows 8's new Start Menu will be known as the "Modern UI." Apps written to take advantage of the new UI features will be known as "Modern UI-style apps." http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/08/10/metro_is_modern_ui_now/
Now the Kinect is their first first-generation product in my memory that hasn't followed that pattern. By all accounts the Kinect is not only awesome, but before it there really was nothing like that on the market. But... what if it's actually not awesome? What if the Kinect 1, measured by the standards of future hardware, actually really sucked? Microsoft didn't have competitors to steal from, so they may have actually innovated new features for it, and cleaned up the hardware and software APIs! This is, I will repeat, the first time in my memory that their product cycle has worked like this! Who knows what this unknown behavior will deliver!
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
It's not about the video analysis, it's about the commodity-priced RGBD camera.
Help I am stuck in a signature factory!
Well then my approximations are off. I think even with a high enough FPS you're still looking at a difficult problem of gauging the angle and speed of punches and kicks. And then you have the problem of determining what to do when a punch goes through a block. Finally you have another problem which might not be solvable outside of LAN play on PC and this is latency. It just might not be that fun if the reaction time is more than X milliseconds. Now a good ping is about 33ms, but you're not always guaranteed that. LAN play on PC is a very limited market and would only be a solution if this game turned out to be perfect because people could host live tourneys. These are just some thoughts I have of the difficult parts of this type of game. To me, this is enough difficulties that I'd just personally make another genre of game if I was doing this solo, but someone with deep pockets who is ambitious could take a stab at it.
God spoke to me
is there a spoon?
I'm very happy to see that they've increased the resolution. This will make hand and finger tracking possible. Has anyone heard about speed improvements? I think reducing lag would go a long way in yielding an even better experience.
I think they should add libraries to the WinRT (metro) app API to allow developers to use a Kinect from WinRT (metro) apps. It should just be like any other sensor.
but someone with deep pockets who is ambitious could take a stab at it.
Version 2 can involves knives, which could include more violence, guts and gore. This will sell very well indeed.
120 characters ought to be enough for anyone
who gives a fuck? it's like a competition between you all to see who can be the most paranoid. really, people. if you're so fucking paranoid don't get a kinect. stop waving your paranoia-dicks around slashdot like anyone but your other paranoid buddies even care.
I love the technology behind the Kinect, but I honestly loved any games. They need to allow accessories with the next Kinect. How awesome would it be to have a gun and duck, cover, jump, hide behind your couch and shoot? And making a "finger gun" just isn't the same, no matter how accurate the system is.