Ask Slashdot: Best VPN Service For Australia?

New submitter frrrp asks, now that "Australia has proceeded on its merry way towards being an absolute nanny/surveillance state," what the best way is for Australians to avoid government snooping. "The Australian public, and media, have been largely asleep on this issue and, by Parliament standards, the speed with which this legislation has been rushed through must be a new record — with both major political parties colluding to force it through and quash any thoughts of amendment to its draconian scope. So the time has come — VPN is no longer a luxury but a necessity. The question is, which VPN service providers are best for us poor folks on the arse end of the planet? I have more or less settled on probably going with Private Internet Access. Can any of the BigBrains on Slashdot enlighten me further on the subject of personal VPN — the kind that provides the full spectrum of service as a naked direct link does?"

Comments

The real question is

[bsercombe72]

What illegal activities are you so desperate to hide? If you have nothing to hide then you have no problem. If you're surfing kiddy porn then you get what you deserve. If you go to places like Tor or Darknet then be prepared for additional scrutiny of your traffic. I've read some of the oddest, whackiest things about how subtly related information has resulted in law enforcement successfully prosecuting people who think VPN and other obfuscating services will hide their activities on the net.

Re:The real question is

[c0lo]

I've read some of the oddest, whackiest things about how subtly related information has resulted in law enforcement successfully prosecuting people who think VPN and other obfuscating services will hide their activities on the net.

Can you please share?

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

What illegal activities are you so desperate to hide?

If you have nothing to hide then you have no problem. If you're surfing kiddy porn then you get what you deserve.

If you go to places like Tor or Darknet then be prepared for additional scrutiny of your traffic. I've read some of the oddest, whackiest things about how subtly related information has resulted in law enforcement successfully prosecuting people who think VPN and other obfuscating services will hide their activities on the net.

Maybe he just wants to access Hulu and Netflix. Or did you not think of that before going off the rails?

Re:The real question is

[i-reek]

I've read some of the oddest, whackiest things about how subtly related information has resulted in law enforcement successfully prosecuting people who think VPN and other obfuscating services will hide their activities on the net.

Citation(s)?

Re:The real question is

[wild_quinine]

What illegal activities are you so desperate to hide?... I've read some of the oddest, whackiest things about how subtly related information has resulted in law enforcement successfully prosecuting people who think VPN and other obfuscating services will hide their activities on the net.

Quite so. Law enforcement, with sufficient motivation to investigate a person, will tend to get the information they need from other sources, using available facts, clues, and investigative logic. It's time consuming and expensive to actually work things out, of course, and they only do it when there's a strong reason to do it. And that is a desirable outcome.

On the other hand, having my internet history, my transactions and medical information, my relationships, any affairs I may be having, rough financial status, sexual preference and political views directly accessible to who knows who simply because it is politically convenient... That is not acceptable. That is open to abuse. Access to that kind of database will be available to, for example, tabloid reporters for a price, because access to databased information that is widely available to a law enforcement community is always available for a price. And that's NOT ok.

When you make just a little effort to hide what you are doing, I agree, that you are not anonymous. However, that information then requires effort to obtain. It requires co-ordination, intelligence, time and effort. It's only used when there is a strong reason. And a strong reason, even in this day and age, is usually a good reason.

In many ways, consistent use of obfuscating technology serves merely to put the warrant back in to the process. We should all be doing it.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't have to have "something to hide" if I ask you to respect my privacy - immediately jumping to the conclusion that if I wish my activities to be private they must be illegal is basically assuming I must be guilty of something and therefore need to prove myself innocent...

do you get all your bills and your postal correspondence sent to you in an envelope?

what do you have to hide - are you doing something illegal with your electricity - is that why you don't want anyone in the postal service to know what is on your electricity bill?

PRIVATE != ILLEGAL

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't use a VPN when updating your Facebook page talking about decapitating generals. Use Tor for that.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Method 1: Anything involving physical delivery or cash trails can be stung... "The site can only be accessed via TOR, which masks IP address details that could otherwise be stored by an ISP and associated with a user account. Silk Road trade relies on the virtual currency BitCoin for transactions. Alana Sullivan, acting national of Custom’s cargo and maritime targeting branch, said it monitors Silk Road along with other illicit-drug sites and was aware of the Australian presence on Silk Road as both sellers and buyers. “Persons who buy or sell through online market places, on so-called ‘anonymous’ networks should understand that they are not guaranteed anonymity,” said Sullivan. The statement follows a recent comment by Chris McDonald, an associate professor in computer science at the University of Western Australia and Dartmouth College in the US, that the federal government has “no chance of beating” TOR encryption, The Age reported in in April. Law enforcement may not be able to beat TOR’s encryption. However, this did not prevent US authorities in April arresting eight men accused of operating The Farmer’s Market -- another service that used the TOR anonymiser to facilitate trade. Undercover Drug Enforcement Administration agents had infiltrated the organisation after becoming trusted buyers over several years of investigation. " Method 2: Information seized from Tor nodes is anonymised but may not be encrypted. "Without going to deeply into what Tor is, Egerstad was operating some Tor nodes. Anyone, including you or me can do it and pretty soon, all sorts of traffic will start flowing through the systems under your command. Tor dusts up the trail you leave behind. When you browse a Web site through Tor (and many people do), no one has any idea where you or your computer are because of how Tor anonymizes your IP address. But that doesn't mean the payload is safe. For example, the user IDs and passwords being used to access inboxes on mail servers. Most such access is not done over secure protocols -- especially when it's browser-based access -- and Tor does nothing to secure those payloads. You're IP address might as well be coming from Mars. But if you're transmitting user IDs and passwords over unencrypted links, does your IP address really matter? " Method 3: (partly uses method 2) Big data mining can identify you by your use of language. With access to unencrypted TOR data from the exit nodes you can create a profile of suspects then search general web traffic for matches, kind of like matching fingerprints. The more info you have access to the higher chance of a successful match. This is used in antiterrorist operations. BTW, this I think is the legislation to which the original poster is referring... http://www.ashurst.com/publication-item.aspx?id_Content=7499

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Why would you need to do that anonymously?

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Now that I can agree with 1000%.

Re:The real question is

[i-reek]

Oh. You are confused.

Tor != VPN

"Methods" != Citations

Happy to clear that up for you

Re:The real question is

[c0lo]

Method 1:...
Method 2: Information seized from Tor nodes is anonymised but may not be encrypted.
Method 3: (partly uses method 2)

Thanks. Now, a personal answer your original question...

What illegal activities are you so desperate to hide?

Nothing illegal. But I was born and then grew up for 22 years in one of the Eastern European block under a communist regime. Unless you experience this on your own skin, I reckon you simply cannot understant how profound the everyday life is altered by knowing that a secret police has a file on every citizen and may be tracking what you do at any moment.
In the present, I can't get rid of the distrust in regards with any king of power, political power especially... So, as long as it is not illegal (is it already?) I will tend to "stick it to the Man" even if I'm not doing anything illegal. I do hope to be dead by natural causes if/when anywhere on this world it will be illegal to have a private life without being asked "what do you have to hide".

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Innocent until proven guilty is how everything should work. People have jumped on the bandwagon of saying "just because he wants to do stuff anonymously you have automatically assumed he is a criminal". No I didn't. I asked: WHAT is it you want to hide. IF it is a criminal activity THEN you deserve what you get. IF you want to hide (as wild_quinine posted) information about your messy break-up, power bills, medical data and who you're cheating on your wife with- fair enough, that should be your private business and not, available for a price because it was easily lifted from some poorly secured government or ISP stash. But I'll flip that around for you again and say that if data is on any networked computer it is at risk. Just because there is some new government legislation you're worried about doesn't mean that you shouldn't already have taken some precautions over what information you have lying around. Furthermore, what precautions have anyone you've transmitted that information to taken (ie: your mistress, your dentist, etc. etc. etc.) I don't begrudge an innocent person their right to privacy. But I say that your guarantee of privacy is vanishingly small. Once you come to accept that fact it might change how you interact with technology.

Re:The real question is

[outsider007]

You wouldn't, but you would need a US proxy. Not that this has anything to do with this thread.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

VPN still has endpoints. Google the text and find the citations yourself.

Re:The real question is

[awrowe]

"Nothing to hide, nothing to fear" is a bullshit argument at best, I really wish supposedly intelligent people would stop trotting this shit out. The law and the government is "supposed" to be there to serve the people, not spy on them. This "nothing to hide" bullshit is saying "What's that? You would prefer to have a little privacy? Aha! Now I know you are guilty of something, it's just a matter of catching you!"

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

The catch cry of the ignorant.

Everyone has a right to privacy, if the matter at hand is so important then law enforcement should have evidence to that effect - evidence sufficient to get a warrant, kinda like the law reads now.

Based on your self righteous attitude I would suggest you familiarise yourself with Martin Niemoller's famous quotation that starts "First they came for...", I hope it gives you perspective.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

if I am hiding something then asking me WHAT am I hiding is asking me to REVEAL IT

-and if you care to look back, you specifically said "what illegal activities" am I hiding so when you later deny that you were assuming I was a criminal...

your statements are not consistent and I think your contradictions betray your true thoughts on the matter

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Hell I live in Australia and I don't like what our inept government is doing and that they will keep their own files on systems maintained by very low paid IT workers and protected by security built by the cheapest bidder. But I don't think that anyone putting data on any computer should have the expectation of privacy simply because there are too many avenues of attack. Ask yourself if the Pentagon, NASA, ASIO, banks and credit card companies can't protect their data what chance do you REALLY think you have? Do you think that in North Korea there is any expectation of privacy. How about the other despotic regimes around the world where the local princeling can just come into your house and take what he wants without fear?

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Yes it does. By using VPN to access that service from an unauthorised jurisdiction aren't you then illegally accessing a computer system to which you have no right? Isn't there a pretty stiff penalty for doing that?

Re:The real question is

[cheekyjohnson]

But I don't think that anyone putting data on any computer should have the expectation of privacy simply because there are too many avenues of attack.

What? The fact that there aren't zero avenues of attack doesn't mean that people should expect the actual government to create laws that make it mandatory to keep information. That just makes the matter worse and expands the government's power.

Some protection is better than no protection.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Ok, I stand corrected. But if you can read my thoughts I'd better get out my tinfoil hat.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a juvenile mind that believes the only activities worth hiding must be illegal.

I create, I write, I draw, I photograph. I have a library of a tens of thousands of photographs - my trade library - stored on two machines here, and backed up offsite over the internet. I work as an editor and a graphic artist, and I use the internet to communicate with the vast majority of my clients. That work includes transmitting fully-finished unpublished works of my own and my clients. I've had a client lose control of an unpublished tech manual with devastating effects to their exclusivity contract. Keeping a tight lid on created works important to your livelihood is imperative.

I don't work in video or music, but the same issues apply there - even more so with lawyers and doctors who trade in private information.

Stating that "there's nothing to worry about if you have nothing to hide" brings with it the presumption that having something to hide is a bad thing. That's primary school bullshit. I protect what I do as much as I can online by hiding it.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

It is not that I have stuff to hide. It is the use and MISUSE of the information collected. How secure is it? Who can access it? When? Is it available to non-Australian Agencies. Is it available to non Government organizations, private enterprise? Who can have access to it? Asio? State police? The Feds? Is it available only under a warrant? State or Federal? Can Centerlink access it without a warrant? Will the Taxman have access to it?

You can bet your balls the data collected will not only be accessed illegally but will be misused just as it is now. An example...Centerlink regularly asks Ebay.com.au to supply details on Aust based sellers earning over $20000 a year and Ebay turns it over.

The big question is this...Why is it necessary to collect this data? Given the existence of TOR and VPN's, encryption that cannot be cracked by any organisation in Australia it seems a pointless exercise as any criminal worth the name will either not use the net or use TOR, VPN and encryption on top of 16 proxy's to conduct his criminal enterprises.

Accessing a virtual desktop on a server in Poland rented from an English Company using a CC stolen in USA processed in the Ukraine, banked in China, converted into bitcoin, transferred to Japan, banked to a Japanese account owned by a South African company and converted to Euros...and so on. All done with proxies, TOR, a VPN and encryption. And that is just the paper trial. The computer trial jumps from server to computer to server all located in other countries. All accessed through remote servers etc etc. Lot of work but the money is there so why not do it?

 

Re:The real question is

[outsider007]

Uh, no. Violating a ToS is not a criminal act. Especially if you never clicked on it.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

“First they came for the Communists, but I was not a Communist so I did not speak out. Then they came for the Socialists and the Trade Unionists, but I was neither, so I did not speak out. Then they came for the Jews, but I was not a Jew so I did not speak out. And when they came for me, there was no one left to speak out for me.” Based on your smug arrogance anonymous coward, I suggest you familiarise yourself with the original statement I made which doesn't say anywhere that people have no right to privacy. It says that people who do illegal things should get what they deserve.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

That's a straw man mate.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

These Terms of Use, which include our Privacy Policy and End User License Agreement ("EULA") govern your use of the Netflix service, including all features and functionalities, instant streaming, our website and user interfaces, and all content and software associated therewith (the "Netflix service" or "service"). By using, visiting, or browsing the Netflix service, you accept and agree to be bound by these Terms of Use. If you do not agree to these Terms of Use, you should not use the Netflix service, including our website and user interfaces. So no, in theory you don't have to click anything to agree with their TOS. Bet that hasn't been tested in court though. Furthermore, the legality of using this service in Australia where broadcasting the content using that medium is VERY grey. While everyone is being paid there seems to be no big fuss, but as soon as some enterprising media house realises they're missing out on the Australia tax IMHO the prosecutions will commence. As an aside, it's definitely a felony in some US states to share your netflix login with anyone else- and that's a TOS violation.

Re:The real question is

[jamesh]

Nothing illegal. But I was born and then grew up for 22 years in one of the Eastern European block under a communist regime. Unless you experience this on your own skin, I reckon you simply cannot understant how profound the everyday life is altered by knowing that a secret police has a file on every citizen and may be tracking what you do at any moment.
In the present, I can't get rid of the distrust in regards with any king of power, political power especially... So, as long as it is not illegal (is it already?) I will tend to "stick it to the Man" even if I'm not doing anything illegal. I do hope to be dead by natural causes if/when anywhere on this world it will be illegal to have a private life without being asked "what do you have to hide".

Go right ahead and use Tor and VPN's and anything else that will protect you. The secret police won't know what you are doing, but the fact that you are using Tor and VPN's to hide what you are doing will indicate that you are up to something and you'll be deleted.

Re:The real question is

[c0lo]

But I don't think that anyone putting data on any computer should have the expectation of privacy simply because there are too many avenues of attack.

This is exactly one reason NOT to save any traffic for any of the citizens unless you have very good reasons to and you are made responsible of what happens with the recorded data. Take for instance the old copper phone lines wiretapping: it was the police that acquired, stored, handled and were responsible for recordings (letting aside the need of a warrant). Because they needed to support the cost for doing all these operations, the police have a good incentive to do it only when necessary.

Now, with the Internet traffic: it is the ISP to take care of "Internet tapping" (at the police request). Since the data is of no use to ISP (actually a burden to store and secure) - is it likely that the collected data will be equally secure?
As the police "externalized" the cost of tapping and there is no legal need of a warrant for collection, is it likely that the process will be handled with the same care and not abused as for phone wire-tapping case?

But I don't think that anyone putting data on any computer should have the expectation of privacy simply because there are too many avenues of attack.

As long as there's nobody but me to take care about my privacy, I can sleep soundly on this account. Afterall, if my privacy is breached, it will be only myself to blame.
But... this changes the moment a law says my privacy can be breached without a judicial oversight! I'll continue to do whatever I consider necessary on my personal computers and other computers I communicate with, but now I may need to change my communication strategy... what if a police person asks without a warrant for my traffic to be recorded and the anonymous "legions" decides to break into the ISP and the data I exchanged (and which I did not mean to store on any computer I don't trust trust) is made public?

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Assuming that information collected will be misused is just as bad as assuming that all information someone attempts to obfuscate is illegal. Isn't it? How secure is your information now? You can bet your ass it will be less secure the more times it is copied and stored! Funny you mention Asio- who recently noted that there is no practical way they can protect their networks from penetration.

Re:The real question is

[outsider007]

In some US states... you wouldn't need it!! Did you hit your head recently?

Re:The real question is

[cheekyjohnson]

Assuming that information collected will be misused is just as bad as assuming that all information someone attempts to obfuscate is illegal. Isn't it?

No, I don't believe it is. Otherwise it would apparently be foolish to argue that the government shouldn't have the power to imprison people based on mere accusations because they'd probably abuse it. I'd say that it's a pretty good guess just by taking a look at various governments throughout history. People with a lot of power tend to abuse that power, so giving them power when it isn't absolutely necessary is probably a bad idea.

Citizens not wanting their government to have unchecked power is far different from assuming that a regular citizen is guilty of something for desiring privacy.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

No you did. Sharing your netflix logon details (a felony in some US states) and violating the TOS by accessing netflix from outside the US are two different things.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

The same delusional reply we see over and over again. >> "If you have nothing to hide then you have no problem." I have nothing to hide so there is no reason to search me.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

I think you're building a straw man argument there. I'm still sticking with the argument that both assumptions describe things that are not certainties. Perhaps if you can give me a different example I'll understand what you mean better. Believe me I agree with you 100% re: unchecked government power- particularly our bloody government. But from what I see they pretty much have it anyway. Otherwise how else would a minority government ram through some of the most unpopular legislation with the lease amount of scrutiny or documentation in history. Simply because our constitution and Australian federalism in particular is fundamentally broken. I'm also enjoying being the devil's advocate on this thread.

Re:The real question is

[c0lo]

Go right ahead and use Tor and VPN's and anything else that will protect you. The secret police won't know what you are doing, but the fact that you are using Tor and VPN's to hide what you are doing will indicate that you are up to something and you'll be deleted.

Do the Western countries already run "secret police"? If not, do you want to reach that point?

Because, let me share you from my experience... if you reach that point, the everyday languages that you'll be using will be derivatives of the Tamarian culture. Yes, that's right, languages at plural: with every person that you trust enough to exchange information, you'll use a different set of metaphors.

I won't tell you how painful is to reach a point in which you trust enough a person (one will never trust a person entirely without having a positive affection for that person but and having some knowledge to act as defensive blackmail... you know, for just in case) and what are the consequences of picking a single wrong person to trust.

Do you think it the above were related with subversive political activities? Heck... the necessities of the everyday life... at a certain point, the meat/butter/sugar and some other items were rationed (you see, our "comrades" the communist Russians, needed them in larger amounts. Started to happen in early/mid '80-ies). Of course there was a black market (harshly punishable by law)... of course you needed a to speak a sort of "steganographic Tamarian code" with your black market supplier and agree to the price, quantity, delivery place, etc diluted in "a friend-to-friend chat over a glass of beer" half an hour long - even if recorded, that conversation would seem innocuous to any uninformed eavesdropper.
And, for the sake of God... we were taking about 5 kg of beef, not overthrowing the government!!

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

Remember the coalition voted for this too.

Re:The real question is

[cheekyjohnson]

I think you're building a straw man argument there.

Sure, if you're only talking absolute certainties (I can't predict the future with absolute certainty). But I think what he meant was that they will almost certainly abuse whatever powers they have if people mindlessly give it to them.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

I'm sorry you had to live in that environment and I'm sorry that those kinds of environments still exist today. Unfortunately, I believe that "secret police" is EXACTLY the path we are on. I hope it never becomes like what you had to endure. There is already a western routine domestic surveillance culture. Look at London- biggest CCTV network in the world. Police cars which do automatic number plate recognition looking for vehicles that have been used in crimes or by known criminals. Police are even getting surveillance drones now because they're cheaper and quieter than helicopters. Police with in-car cameras to film us, and yet we are assaulted or arrested when we film THEM. I guess you could call the war on drugs a kind of black market, but at least it isn't the necessities of existence as you had to negotiate for. While we haven't reached the criminal low of widespread state corruption and torture (though some may legitimately argue that one as well), there is no denying that police corruption exists and is discovered routinely.

Re:The real question is

[jamesh]

Yeah it's a shitty life. What I was referring to is metaphorically walking in a crowd wearing a stocking over your head so people can't see your face and you can be anonymous. People won't recognise you, but you will sure stand out. That's what using Tor does - makes you stand out.

Re:The real question is

[outsider007]

And neither are a crime in Austraila, retard.

Re:The real question is

[c0lo]

Unfortunately, I believe that "secret police" is EXACTLY the path we are on. I hope it never becomes like what you had to endure.

Fortunately, Australia have quite a huge outback. If they needed the govt to build the copper phone network first and the NBN now, I guess it won't be too soon to have CCTV cameras in every pub with no beer. Besides, the women glow to much for the CCTV, the men will plunder them and Vegemite either will make your face unrecognisable (disgust grimace) or can be used in small enough quantities (less than for a sandwich) to smear the lenses of CCTV-es. Anyway, cover or not, she'll be apples for a while.

There is already a western routine domestic surveillance culture.

This is why I think using encryption as one way to maintain privacy is not paranoia, but the first line of defence against power grabs and nanny states. I wrote the above not to gain sympathy but to show that no matter what the govt would be doing, a population can - and will - get around any type of surveillance once it gets too intrusive.
Personally, I'm convinced it's not only moral to do it, but almost an obligation to do it. I mean: if you can't defend your very own privacy (a thing that involves/pertains to yourself only), how can you expect to be able to defend even a small group - like your family?

Re:The real question is

[c0lo]

Yeah it's a shitty life. What I was referring to is metaphorically walking in a crowd wearing a stocking over your head so people can't see your face and you can be anonymous. People won't recognise you, but you will sure stand out. That's what using Tor does - makes you stand out.

The defence against that is "to make from wearing a stocking a fashion statement", so that a majority of people will start using Tor/VPN/encryption. In my opinion: it is needed. If the liberties are slowly eroded and one reaches all the way down to the rock-bottom of civil rights loss, one will need to use all sorts of obfuscation just to survive.

This is why I say the OP's "Ask slashdot" is relevant, the matter should not be treated lightly (like "what do you have to hide") and sharing the information on how to technically do it is beneficial.

Re:The real question is

[SirTicksAlot]

I'll be watching you through your window tonight. I'm sure you have nothing to hide because you aren't doing anything illegal, right?

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't do anything that is illegal now, but some things I do today where illegal 20-40 years ago. Will there be things I do now that will be illegal in 20-40 years? Will the internet keep a record of that and may that be used against me in the future? I don't know, and I don't want to find out....

Example, there are movies you, or your parents may have in their house right now, that when bought 20 years ago were perfectly legal and right now would get you put on a sex-offender list or even charged without proper paperwork for those movies.... (assuming you live in the US).

Basically, I can almost guarantee you, if they go looking in your house for something to charge you with, they will find something. Of course, they can't without a warrant, but if you said something, like you owned one of those movies, on the internet then that could be all the evidence they need to get that warrant. This is scary as hell tin-foil hat stuff; but that legal process for this already exists, it just hasn't been "fully" abused yet but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be watched and where possible, a person shouldn't take a few extra steps to protect themselves.

Re:The real question is

[Dunge]

This is not the good way to think. Illegal activity or not, we shouldn't be watched by big brother.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

bsercombe72, I am so pleased to see that you are a firm believer in the Wikileaks; After all; only those governments with something to hide would be worried about the release of information.

However, I am somewhat surprised that you have a hidden email account. Surely someone who doesn't have anything to hide would be worried about something as little as an email address.

While you are at it; a password to download your email may prove interesting to some people.

Your driver's licence number and mother's maiden name are other curious bits of information that could be useful to someone.

And of course your full internet history tied to your user account could be of interest to someone.

But then; I am posting this as anonymous coward; because I have things to hide. My bank account details for one.

Re:The real question is

[PiSkyHi]

So when speaking out becomes illegal...

Re:The real question is

[nedlohs]

The fucking summary says: "to avoid government snooping" and "So the time has come — VPN is no longer a luxury but a necessity". Nothing changed with respect to Hulu and netflix, "the time has come" refers to legislation in Australia about government snooping..

So you'd have to be pretty damn stupid to think it's just about Hulu and Netflix and not about the exact thing the author said it was about.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

Likewise: read Helen Nissenbaum's Privacy as Contextual Integrity.
http://crypto.stanford.edu/portia/papers/RevnissenbaumDTP31.pdf

If you don't have privacy, you can't prove you are the person you say you are.

And "If I haven't done anything wrong, you have no reason to snoop on me.".

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

You asked what illegal activities people are hiding no?

Everyone else has made the point that people using, VPN's, even TOR, aren't necessarily committing illegal acts.. You keep trying to deny your initial question since you realised how the internet won't just agree with you like your Mom would.

What comes across to you as "smug arrogance" is actually a genuine pity for people like you. You may not have said people have no right to privacy in so many words but implying that if people take steps to maintain their privacy (say through a vpn like the topic that kicked this off) then they are committing illegal activities.

You can't have your cake and eat it too, either people are entitled to privacy or they aren't, the legislation and monitoring which promote surveillance of people aims to take that privacy away... from everyone, whether they carry out illegal activities or not and that would include you.

PS note the post under my first, what happens when speaking out becomes illegal ?

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

MULVAD!

You pay for mulvad using BITCOIN!!! Totally Anonymous.

I use it on Everything.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

Coalition, Labor - same coin, same minting - just different sides, they only disagree in public, as soon as we get the shits with one and vote the other the same stuff happens, and the nay's are provided to the same arguments - exactly the same as it was last government.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

You do know that the recommended serving size for Vegemite is around 5mg, that's a tiny tiny amount - would probably take 3x that to smear a CCD effectivly - and there are cheaper alternatives.

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

You do know that the recommended serving size for Vegemite is around 5mg,

By your dosage, the jar in my fridge would last me for 400 g / 5e-3 g= 80.000 servers. I assure you it won't last that much.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Until avoiding surveillance is also deemed illegal. Didn't they pass (or try to pass) legislation in the US which declared technology that obscures the source and destination of any electronic communication- ie: Tor, VPN, and wouldn't NAT even fall afoul of this political stupidity?

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Making a stocking a fashion statement is one of the things Pussy Riot kinda did. Didn't work out so well for them. But on the other hand it has made them very popular. I wonder what would happen if we had a band like pussy riot in Australia. I'd imagine probably not the big hoo-haa going on in Russia about it at the moment.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Proof or GTFO.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Threads like conversations have a habit of wandering. Say something constructive instead of being a whining little bitch. Either that or turn your thread filters up a bit.

Re:The real question is

[c0lo]

I wonder what would happen if we had a band like pussy riot in Australia. I'd imagine probably not the big hoo-haa going on in Russia about it at the moment.

This is serious, Mum... other times, though and no conflict with the power (looking on how the Assange saga evolves, I tend to agree with you).

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

I disagree with you. A valid answer to the "What illegal activities" question is: None. Posters including you have overlooked that. I then went on to make the point that IF you go on to use those kinds of services to try and protect your privacy you should expect that your activities will be the subject of additional scrutiny. That was my point. I also disagree with your statement that either people are entitled to privacy or they aren't. You simply can't be so black and white about it. People are sometimes entitled to privacy, meaning that nobody really gets to eat that cake. And at this point in time, speaking out MIGHT be illegal. In Australia we actually have no right to free speech enshrined in our constitution. So yet again, nothing as black and white as the statement you made. "Australia does not have explicit freedom of speech in any constitutional or statutory declaration of rights, with the exception of political speech which is protected from criminal prosecution at common law per Australian Capital Television Pty Ltd v Commonwealth. The Howard Government re-introduced sedition law, which criminalises some forms of expression." -wiki

Re:The real question is

[Anonymous Coward]

it's like when the cops said "do you mind if we search your house" and i said "yes, i don't particularly like you seeing as you rubbed my head into the road for no good reason" so the officer replied "if you say no then your guilty and have something to hide" so i said "do you mind if i search your house tonight or do you have something to hide". I still got my house searched and they performed every test they are legally allowed to, but the logic they use is terrible.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Haha, damn 25 posts a day limit- I've been waiting to respond to you all day! I agree that power is almost always abused by someone eventually. In this case, however, we didn't mindlessly give them this power. They gave it to themselves without asking.

Re:The real question is

[bsercombe72]

Thanks AC- I'm definitely a firm believer in Wikileaks. More government transparency - in the vast majority of cases- benefits us all. Unfortunately governments tend to argue that the disclosure of numbers of paperclips bought last financial year would undermine national security. I think the Assange witch hunt is shameful. When the current Australian Prime Minister was elected she said it was time to "let the sunshine in" meaning that she wanted to improve government transparency. What we have had during her term is the opposite. What we would get from the opposition is no different. As to the other part of your post, yes- all of that information would be useful to a criminal trying to steal my identity, but probably not very useful to anyone trying to see if I'd done anything illegal. So in this case wouldn't the government plan to record communications potentially help me because the evidence of that criminal activity may be recorded? Kinda invalidates your argument. I don't agree with the legislation the government has forced on us simply because the more places our data is kept the greater chance it will be accessible to unauthorised access. That doesn't really make me want start encrypting and proxying everything, it makes me want to get the stupid legislation repealed.

StrongVPN

[Anonymous Coward]

I use StrongVPN.

Re:StrongVPN

[Anonymous Coward]

you should be aware that PPTP is now useless as MS-CHAPv2 has been cracked with 100% reliability

https://www.cloudcracker.com/blog/2012/07/29/cracking-ms-chap-v2/

Re:StrongVPN

[bsercombe72]

That was an awesome article. Thanks for posting it.

I like the VPN service bundled with Giganews

[Anonymous Coward]

It's fast and you a have a good choice of endpoints around the planet...

You'll have to try

[ccguy]

As someone with experience providing VPNs to Australian customers I can assure that saying "I'm in Australia, what's best for me" is not enough *at all*. At the very least, you should provide your city and ISP.

Not that you really care about replies obviously since you just wanted to advertise one specific provider :-)

Re:You'll have to try

[i-reek]

Not that you really care about replies obviously since you just wanted to advertise one specific provider :-)

Yeah, it reeks of that to me as well. Helps to decide on what VPN company to avoid though ...

Maybe they like it that way?

[TarpaKungs]

Knowing about how Australia likes to regulate home electrical work and even plumbing (I'm talking water, not gas here) I would say the average Australian is either very much asleep or very much likes being cared for by Nanny.

Not quite what I would expect from the children of pioneering emigrants looking to force a new life...

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[TarpaKungs]

s/force/forge/

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Trracer]

So you think home electrical work or plumbing should not be regulated? Home electricity, if wired wrong is a serious health/death hazard. As for plumbing it can also be a serious health and environment hazard.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[i-reek]

Indeed. In fact, lack of regulation is why the US economy is the envy of the Western world while Australia is experiencing hard economic times and corporate collapse.

Combine this with our lack of universal healthcare and, well, the place is a mess. Dont even get me started on restricting our freedom to homestyle electrickery implementations ...

Wait a sec ...

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Anonymous Coward]

Electrical engineers that design the systems aren't even allowed to touch the wires. It seems there is no common sense in Australia, so rather than people knowing their own abilities and calling a contractor if their not %100 sure they can do it them selves, they just make it illegal for everyone. At least 25% of males in Australia would be more than capable of installing a rain water tank, but they aren't allowed, it's not like much could go wrong anyway.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[TarpaKungs]

I do not think DIY should be regulated beyond requiring that the person doing the work "is competent" (which is what the laws pertaining to UK gas plumbing state[1])

England and Wales went through this in 2005 with the introduction of "Part P" of the Building Regulations. Basically anyone doing electrical work that is notifiable (most major work) must either be registered or must report the work to the Building Control dept of the local council for a fee. The councils generally don;t know how to handle this so mostly just get an electrician in afterwards to perform a full system test for another fee making, say adding a new circuit cost around £200-300 in fees alone.

Prior to the introduction of Part P the government's own stats for England and Wales stated there were around 5 deaths per year from fixed electrical wiring. It notes a further 25 possible deaths due to fires where the fire was due to an electrical source of ignition but that does not break down into fixed wiring vs appliances and extension leads. Most informed sources estimate the number of deaths from fixed wiring directly or by resulting fire to be around 10 per year.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&ved=0CFsQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.stockport.gov.uk%2F2013%2F2994%2Fdevelopmentcontrol%2F14406%2F41351%2Fpartpelectricalsafety&ei=QvU1UJaYHe210QW8mIDoBQ&usg=AFQjCNGZgEjqrIWPIGTCIWqii5Metf20jw&sig2=2aV0bfyQw0v8RUIUotcsTg

The number of deaths on the road in the GB was 1901 in 2011. Scale that back a bit to remove Scotland.

Do I think limiting who can do electrical work is a waste of resources? Yes I do. The resources would be far better spend on road safety.

To require being a member of an accredited institution to do water plumbing (with the possible exception of sealed heating systems) is even more laughable.

There is a difference between regulation and limiting electrical and plumbing work to members of a closed shop artisan/union style which seems to be the case in Australia and becoming the case in the UK.

[1] I am legally allowed to do my own gas work in England, provided it is "not for hire or reward".

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Anonymous Coward]

The fact we are doing pretty good economically or our healthcare has little to do with how we are mostly scared little bitches, hell bent on enforcing laws on everything. Why can't i have any of the good paintball guns even if i get a gun licence and never show it to any one, why don't we have autobahns or electric cigarettes, why can't i drink a beer on the beach, none of it effects us financially, and i have to pay for my health insurance. Also i hope you don't think our political system is any more empowering than the US, all we get to vote on is who the smallest dickhead is.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[dwywit]

I visit lots of people in their own homes, to fix their computers - that's what I do for a living - house calls to fix your fake antivirus/faulty broadband/BSOD/whatever - so I accept that my sample might be skewed.
 
I have yet to meet someone (other than a qualified sparky, and even some of those need the cluebat) who I would trust to wire anything on a 240 volt circuit - even a table lamp. I have no problem with regulation of electrical work. Ditto plumbing - some of my customers can't cope with the fact that water flows downhill.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[TarpaKungs]

Do you mean you have no problem with there being "regulations" (eg IEE/IET wiring regs for the UK, NEC for the USA, VDE etc)?

Or are you saying you approve of running plumbing and wiring as a closed shop, artisan style?

The former is necessary - but I have not problems making my wiring IEE 17th compliant. OTOH I detest closed shop practices and I'm surprised and slightly disappointed the Australians put up with it.

In which case I can see how they might like Nanny watching "the Internet" to keep the bad men away...

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Anonymous Coward]

Interesting how you wouldn't trust them to do your wiring, but i bet you know some one (that isn't a mechanic) who you would let fiddle with your perpetual explosion propelling, 100 km/h+, 1000kg+, steel, transport device commonly called a car. A lot of wiring a house really is pretty simple (admittedly i'm an electrical engineer and work with a bunch of sparkeys, so i might be a bit biased).

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Anonymous Coward]

so rather than people knowing their own abilities and calling a contractor if their not %100 sure they can do it them selves, they...

i'm not % 100 sure their gonna trust you to install their water tank.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Anonymous Coward]

Not that i was offering, but why would putting the % sign at the wrong end of a number on an internet post, decide the abilities of attaching a gutter's drain to a tank?

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[bsercombe72]

Hahahah. I read someones sig on slashdot that said: The problem with voting is that the government still gets elected.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Anonymous Coward]

I think it's still illegal to change your own light bulb in Victoria. You got to be careful, otherwise the electricity will escape.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[TarpaKungs]

Knowing about how Australia likes to regulate home electrical work and even plumbing (I'm talking water, not gas here) I would say the average Australian is either very much asleep or very much likes being cared for by Nanny.

Not quite what I would expect from the children of pioneering emigrants looking to forge a new life...

I rest my case...

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[1s44c]

Knowing about how Australia likes to regulate home electrical work and even plumbing (I'm talking water, not gas here)..

That's not as nuts as it sounds. Large parts of Australia have a very limited amount of water to pump and losing any from leaks is a senseless waste of a vital resource. Sure the householder gets the bill for the excess water usage and maybe a fine too but that doesn't help the rest of the street who don't get anything to drink for the next few months.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[TarpaKungs]

Don't you think it's more likely that requiring plumbing be done by expensive card carrying professionals will actually cause more leaks not to be fixed as the householder will now have to pay, what, $50-$100 for a plumber to come and fix that dripping tap or overflowing toilet cistern vs a few dollars in parts to do it themselves?

Besides, how many DIY plumbers would actually leave a leaking joint in place?

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[dwywit]

I'm saying that the legal requirement to have a qualified electrician do your wiring is a good thing - my own street had a house fire from - can you guess? - dodgy wiring installed by a builder who was too cheap to hire a contractor. Yes, domestic household wiring isn't really that complex - mostly single-phase power and lighting circuits, with plug-in circuit breakers, ECD devices, etc, etc. But even that seems to defeat most people. Perhaps if our education standards were to improve, I could change my opinion, but I don't see that happening soon.
 
Ditto plumbers - gas work definately, maybe there's some wiggle room for water/sewerage work.
 
I accept that you draw the line at that point and dislike our system - what you call "closed shop", but we have more important things to worry about at the moment - my own state has run up a debt of AUD$65 Billion over the last 20 years of labor government, and now everyone's complaining about the cost-cutting that's necessary to pay that debt.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[dwywit]

Under no circumstances would I let anyone unqualified AND unrecommended touch my car or motorbike, except maybe in a breakdown or emergency. The Subaru needs someone with specialist training, and the bike is a 1976 Moto Guzzi - 98% of bike mechanics stare at it in slack-jawed ignorance, so there's no way I'm going to let them within spanner-wielding distance.

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Anonymous Coward]

Not even to change the oil?

Re:Maybe they like it that way?

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe your a bad example, but it's completely legal to fiddle with your car, but installing a new light at home is illegal. There are plenty of jobs i'm quite happy to do on my car, like an oil change, suspension, body work, ect; but i wouldn't be trying to rebuild an engine, or shave off parts of my cams. The Same should be with house wiring, my mother would be more than capable of installing a porch light, but wiring a house from scratch, deciding cable sizes and fuse rating would be well beyond her, she knows that so it isn't a problem. Also one other quick note, enforcing expensive electricians to do all electrical work means, a lot of dodgy old house wiring isn't repaired due to cost, and it's left in there with 50's wiring and materials using 00's power requirements.

What's the best VPN that can be use _anywhere_ ?

[Taco Cowboy]

I know TFA is asking what VPN service is best suited for ppl living in Australia

I happen to travel frequently, from the Americas to Europe to Asia (including Australia/NZ) to Africa, for business, and there are times I desperately need VPN that just works

I do not need a lot of GBs, but I do need security - which means, VPN which do NOT keep any log of my online activity

Can anyone recommend VPN services that can work in _any_ country in this world?

For what purpose?

[heypete]

If it's protection from local snooping (e.g. wifi snoopers at the coffee shop), any provider will be reasonable, though it may be better to get a reasonably local provider for better performance. As you say, Australia is on the arse end of the planet and there's very long links to get to North America or Europe.

If you want to be able to access geographically-limited sites (e.g. Netflix in the US), again, any provider with endpoints there should be adequate.

If you want anonymity for Serious Purposes (e.g. whistleblowing, or any other activity where you or your family could be at risk), you'd probably be better off using Tor or some other system that doesn't require user registration. Of course, considerable amounts of services have ended up blocking Tor due to extensive abuse being emitted from their network, but that may be something you're willing to put up with. Pretty much any commercial VPN provider logs basic stuff about users (e.g. which user is assigned what IP address at what time) so they can shut down accounts being used for abuse.

Why not running a Tor node/bridge in the cloud?

[c0lo]

Using a VPN has the disadvantage of being a single exit point, thus possibly subject to an international warrant to record the traffic (remember? - we are discussing this in relation to a law allowing Australia access to the "Council of Europe Convention on Cybercrime", thus the more countries do the same, the less chances to find a VPN service that you can trust to anonymize you).

So, instead of paying a VPN service, why not running a Tor node or bridge? If you are willing to pay a VPN service, then paying for a "cloud" hosted Tor node/bridge should not be a problem to you (the prices are pretty much comparable, I guess).
The more people would do this, the less capable would be anyone to track the data traffic of a certain person (unless they control a good majority of the exit nodes and are willing to spend time/effort/money to reconstitute a traffic that may exit randomly thought different nodes).

Re:What's the best VPN that can be use _anywhere_

[agm]

It's not a VPN but what about a good old SSH connection toa server you trust (i.e. a server you own)?

Paranoid much?

[Zouden]

Can we have a bit of sanity here? The laws are pretty clear that your online activity can only be recorded if the police specifically ask your ISP. Since most Australians are not under investigation by the police, a VPN is hardly a "a necessity".

Your language makes it sound like it's the end of the internet as we know it, when the reality is far more mundane.

Re:Paranoid much?

[c0lo]

Can we have a bit of sanity here? The laws are pretty clear that your online activity can only be recorded if the police specifically ask your ISP.

Yes, can we? Why should the police be able to ask the ISP to start recording without a warrant?

Since most Australians are not under investigation by the police, a VPN is hardly a "a necessity".

Without being required warrant, the police can ask the ISP to start recording persons that are not under any investigation. I don't know... say a policeman with a personal vendetta against a neighbour? A corrupt policeman on the payroll on NewsCorp or the like? Yes, I know...once the data is recorded, theoretically it requires a warrant to be legally accessed. But I think the anonymous stunt demonstrated that, once the data is recorded, it can be made accessible by illegal means.

Re:Paranoid much?

[Anonymous Coward]

Your language makes it sound like it's the end of the internet as we know it, when the reality is far more mundane.

Nothing like Nazis could happen in a civilised country like Germany, could it? Nor could a state like Queensland ever have a leader who commits graft and corruption and leads a repressive police state ever happen in Australia? You tin-foil hatter nutter you!

Re:Paranoid much?

[misexistentialist]

Since most Australians are not under investigation by the police, a VPN is hardly a "a necessity"

That doesn't mean none or even few are. If Australia was shooting 1 out 4 people as a conservation measure to protect koalas, it would be of no concern for the individual since most people will be spared?

Re:Paranoid much?

[goon]

"The laws are pretty clear that your online activity can only be recorded if the police specifically ask your ISP."

@Zouden since the legislation was signed yesterday have you personally looked at it?

I haven't but I've scanned through the discussion paper [0], "The Parliamentary Joint Committee on Intelligence and Security has commenced an inquiry into potential reforms of national security legislation." from the 'Joint Parliamentary Committee on Intelligence and Security'. [1] This legislation is simply a rubber stamp to update the Telecommunications act 79, 97, the ASIO act 97 and the Intelligence services act 2001. The outcome of the specific changes are not clear at the moment but the big picture is clear. Lets make it easier to collect and gather intelligence and share it between stakeholders - a nasty word that means intelligence, law enforcement and revenue collection at state & federal level.

    ''There is a big risk that we will in the future not be able to undertake even basic investigations...
      from our perspective data retention is a must. We seriously would not be able to do the majority
      of investigations without it' AFP, High Tech Crime Centre, Neil Gaughan. [2]

Future changes to the legislation make the ideas in the discussion paper and potentially the legislation (which I have yet to read) passed dangerous because an objective of the report is to identify & store information of online of all Australian individuals.

Reference
[0] http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Committees/House_of_Representatives_Committees?url=pjcis/nsl2012/additional/discussion%20paper.pdf
[1] http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Committees/House_of_Representatives_Committees?url=pjcis/nsl2012/index.htm
[2] http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/data-trail-easy-to-follow-for-big-brother-20120720-22ffm.html#ixzz24N57ILoN

Re:Paranoid much?

[Anonymous Coward]

And I quote: "The largest user of telecommunications data in 2010-11 was Victoria Police with 65,703 authorisations."

Re:What's the best VPN that can be use _anywhere_

[unixhero]

I know TFA is asking what VPN service is best suited for ppl living in Australia

I happen to travel frequently, from the Americas to Europe to Asia (including Australia/NZ) to Africa, for business, and there are times I desperately need VPN that just works

I do not need a lot of GBs, but I do need security - which means, VPN which do NOT keep any log of my online activity

Can anyone recommend VPN services that can work in _any_ country in this world?

I suggest you take a look here. And that goes to all of you: http://torrentfreak.com/which-vpn-providers-really-take-anonymity-seriously-111007/

It will be abused

[Quila]

It was here with the Patriot Act. National Security Letters, which were supposed to be used in an emergency to get info on terrorists from third parties. There was no judicial oversight, and those given the NSLs were forbidden from disclosing the fact. After a couple years of the Patriot Act, it was found that the FBI had abused NSLs in tens of thousands of instances. Instead they were used to obtain information on Americans where they couldn't obtain a court-issued search warrant due to flimsy evidence, or they were just too lazy to get a warrant. Seriously, we have a special court to give sealed warrants in national security cases, and for the most part it's a rubber stamp. This court rejected an FBI request for one warrant multiple times because there was no probable cause and because of a free speech issue, so the FBI just issued an NSL. Their justification? We disagreed with the court, so that made it okay.

Luckily, the NLSs were eventually thrown out in court.

You give law enforcement a powerful tool, they will abuse it. Even strong oversight won't help much. You would literally need to start putting police in jail for misuse in order for there to be a disincentive. Nobody was busted for the NSL fiasco above, not even fired.

Re:It will be abused

[TarpaKungs]

And in the UK, the RIPA Act 2000 was roundly abused:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06/23/councils_ripa_warning/

Big surpise...

Re:It will be abused

[Anonymous Coward]

Like how they gave police the right to search a house without a search warrant (so they could catch the evil terrorists) but now it's just used to bust stoners and to piss off those that upset a cop.

Re:What's the best VPN that can be use _anywhere_

[tqft]

why not just buy/rent a server and do it yourself?
also backups.

TorrentFreak

[unixhero]

http://torrentfreak.com/which-vpn-providers-really-take-anonymity-seriously-111007/

IPreadator

[Anonymous Coward]

IPreadator
https://www.ipredator.se/?lang=en
Fixed, inexpensive costs and unlimited bandwidth. About as anonymous as you'll get for something you have to pay real money for.

The endpoints are somewhere in northern Europe, though exactly where will vary from time to time.

Has a few problems that are just about fixed. Firstly, it supports only PPTP, which is known to be insecure ( http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/08/breaking_micros.html ). That also makes using anything other than Windows a pain. But it's supposed to be fixed this month ( https://www.ipredator.se/page/faq#gen_openvpn_l2tp ). Multiplexing tunnels is also made difficult due to PPTP, but again, L2TP should fix that.

Secondly, No IPv6 or static IPv4 addresses yet. IPv6 is (and has been for a long time) coming apparently. Static IPv4 addresses is not expected to happen, though; but for most uses, that'd be kind of defeating the point of an anonymous VPN, no?

On the whole, it's tricky to use and not without problems, but it's probably good enough for any realistic use, and it's cheap (I've seen email account that cost more!).

Disclaimer: satisfied (Australian) customer.

Re:IPreadator

[frrrp]

Thanks. You're the only one that actually answered the question. I was working off the list at Torrentfreak. I had Ipredator short listed, but dropped them as they had limited endpoints. I tentatively chose privateinternetaccess and said so, of course got accused for spamming/shilling, but my question was more are they trustworthy? The other two were BTGuard and Torguard. Really thought this was a straightforward question. Should know better than to expect straightforward answers.

Cloud Server / OpenVPN

[i-reek]

When I need to use a VPN, mostly either to get around geo-blocking or obfuscate my usage from my ISP, I use a cloud server on either Amazon or Rackspace with OpenVPN.

Since this isn't too often it means I only pay for the time the cloud server is up. When I'm not using it I delete the server. I've written a script to get the server set up in a couple minutes.

Of course, you can't trust the endpoint to be secure. The hosts and government (including the Australian government even if the cloud server is located in the US/UK) have easy access to the server, logs etc.

Re:Cloud Server / OpenVPN

[mathew42]

Would you mind sharing the script?

Re:Cloud Server / OpenVPN

[i-reek]

Sure. It's a bash script written for Debian but is easily adaptable.

Most of the time taken is transferring the keys.

I'll ferret out the script for you when I get home from work.

Re:What's the best VPN that can be use _anywhere_

[Anonymous Coward]

That's what a vpn is, derpy.

Re:What's the best VPN that can be use _anywhere_

[tqft]

kinda what I thought but I have no problem displaying my ignorance to be corrected.

Thanks.

Re:What's the best VPN that can be use _anywhere_

[Errtu76]

Yep. This is how I connect to things if I'm on a public network. Just 'ssh your-host -D 1080' , configure your firefox/whatever to use a SOCKS proxy on port 1080 and you're good to go.

proxnetwork.com

[fysdt]

Prox Network is pretty good.

VPN Experience from Aussie living in China

[beefsack]

I'm currently living and working as a software developer here in China, and my livelihood depends on using a VPN. A few things I've learned:

• On the whole, VPN providers are unreliable and heavily restrict services.
• It's trivial to set up a VPN using VPS providers.

I have about 7 different VPN servers that I manage for myself, my main one I use nowadays is on EC2, however I'm running a low cost low bandwidth VPN on DigitalOcean now and have been very happy. There are a huge number of VPS hosts around, pick one in a country with a good privacy record and work through that.

The process is simple: I just chuck an Ubuntu image on the server, install OpenVPN, and zip through a guide on configuring. The process becomes painfully simple to replicate to new servers if you're happy using a single private key for each of your servers, you can just copy the original server configs to a new server and have multiple servers available to you.

Re:VPN Experience from Aussie living in China

[jamesh]

I'm currently living and working as a software developer here in China, and my livelihood depends on using a VPN. A few things I've learned:

• On the whole, VPN providers are unreliable and heavily restrict services.
• It's trivial to set up a VPN using VPS providers.

I have about 7 different VPN servers that I manage for myself, my main one I use nowadays is on EC2, however I'm running a low cost low bandwidth VPN on DigitalOcean now and have been very happy. There are a huge number of VPS hosts around, pick one in a country with a good privacy record and work through that.

The process is simple: I just chuck an Ubuntu image on the server, install OpenVPN, and zip through a guide on configuring. The process becomes painfully simple to replicate to new servers if you're happy using a single private key for each of your servers, you can just copy the original server configs to a new server and have multiple servers available to you.

Just out of curiosity... as an Australian with only a vague interest in China I only know about what i hear in the media, which is mostly bad, but isn't running a VPN highly illegal over there?

Re:VPN Experience from Aussie living in China

[Anonymous Coward]

With experience working in China, I'd be very careful. You may get away with it, but if the authorities want to get you for some reason they will nail you with this. Vpn use is illegal in China.

Re:The real question is: why wear clothes?

[nick_urbanik]

If you have nothing to hide then you have no problem.

I wear clothes. I have a lot to hide.

Yes, I can

[xQx]

Buy a Virtual Server from a cheap provider in Europe, install linux on it if you're savvy, and windows if you're not.

Set it up to be an encrypted VPN endpoint and do all your browsing from there.

It's about as cheap as getting a VPN service provider, your IP address in destination logs will just look like a standard data center in Europe (rather than a suspicious VPN provider), you get massive data allowances for almost nothing.

Yes, the AFP can still pressure the foreign virtual server provider to give up logs etc, but if you're browsing is all encrypted and seeming to come from a European data center, they would only start looking if you were a person of interest for non-browsing reasons. If that is the case, you probably shouldn't be getting law avoidance advice from slashdot.

And don't forget to encrypt your PC

[xQx]

Oh, and remember to Truecrypt.

It's all circumstantial until they take your PC, and if you haven't encrypted, that's usually got all the _real_ evidence they need, regardless of your VPN provider.

Re:And don't forget to encrypt your PC

[BladeMelbourne]

TrueCrypt will not help you. Passwords and decryption keys must be provided if ordered by a magistrate, or you face six months in jail.

The Australian Cybercrime Act 2001 No. 161, Items 12 and 28 grant police with a magistrate's order the wide-ranging power to require "a specified person to provide any information or assistance that is reasonable and necessary to allow the officer to" access computer data that is "evidential material"; this is understood to include mandatory decryption. Failing to comply carries a penalty of 6 months imprisonment.

This has been in place since October 2001.

Re:And don't forget to encrypt your PC

[CoolBru]

You've missed one of TrueCrypt's major features: plausible deniability. You can provide keys that unlock encrypted data on your HD. It may not reveal all the data, but it's not possible for your accuser to prove that it's not.

OpenVPN

[Anonymous Coward]

Any third-party VPN service carries a risk they will be raided/subpoenaed and turn over information when requested. If you implement your own VPN service, same could happen with the data center you are hosting your VPN server from.

For a free implementation, go with OpenVPN. It creates a virtual network adapter with a default route through it. So rather than having to mess with everything on an application layer, I know all my internet traffic is going through the virtual network adapter. There are a few paid VPN services that are based off OpenVPN. I've been fairly happy with Hide My Ass! so far. They have a number of geographically spread servers (including Australia) and will warn you if the server you are connecting to is overloaded / offer to load balance you to another server. Unless you can find super-cheap hosting, I found this to be both cheaper and more hassle-free than rolling my own OpenVPN client+server.

Al-Tor-native?

[dodex1k]

I agree that internet users should try and stop data from being given out freely. Even though I don't really mind if people are snooping through my personal data, others do. I would like to make this sort of change for their sake. But from my experience with Tor, it can be kind of slow. Is it really the best alternative for anonymous internet surfing? Does VPN work any better? It seems if people want to make anonymous internet a viable concept, it will need to come close to matching the speed of browsing with a "naked" connection. I know, that sounds like a pretty tall order. Perhaps Tor/VPN/decoder rings aren't meant to be viable alternatives. Maybe they will forever remain unreliable and inefficient. That would be a bummer.

Re" best vpn privuder for australia?

[Anonymous Coward]

If u need a best vpn provider of the industry. i have a vpn review site, this website help and suggest you which vpn provider is best in the industry
visit this link: http://www.virtualprivate-network.com/

VPS

[Anonymous Coward]

Rent a cheap vps ($9 a month) and use SSH

Ok: Canberra, Internode. Go!

[Anonymous Coward]

I care about your reply.

Re:What's the best VPN that can be use _anywhere_

[heypete]

This can still leak a lot of information that doesn't go through the SOCKS proxy.

I prefer OpenVPN: it's easy to setup on both the client and server, and it can proxy *all* traffic, even for applications that don't otherwise support proxying.

Thanks to the requestor:

[AbRASiON]

As an Aussie, your submission is appreciated. I'm really not happy about the added latency this is going to have on my link but this outright disgusting move by the government once again shows their contempt for us.

I'm hoping to find a solution at a reasonable price that still lets me put through a significant amount of data, ideally something my DSL modem can auto-connect to as well so I don't need to maintain local clients on my workstation(s)

Hopefully some reasonable services are available out there.

Re:Thanks to the requestor:

[Anonymous Coward]

Not to break your heart bro, or to show up your partisan spin, but this was pushed by ASIO, DSD, AFP and a variety of other multiletter organisations, the ALP in this case got the short end of the stick as they just happened to be in the chair when it was being pushed. That they brought it to the publics attention, unlike what happened during the previous coallition government, showed a positive regard for the public in this matter.

Anyway the ultimate originator of this draconian piece of crap was more likely than not a variety of multiletter organisations in Amurica, NSA, CIA, RIAA, etc.

What are your latency and jurisdictional needs?

[billstewart]

The REAL real question is "What are your latency and jurisdictional needs?" Do you need a VPN service that's located outside Australia for legal reasons, or do you want one that's in/near Australia for performance reasons? Is it ok if it's in the US or Europe?

If you want outside Australia, but relatively nearby, e.g. Hong Kong or Singapore, you'll want to use traceroute to check that your connection to them stays on your side of the Pacific Ocean, as opposed to going from Aus to the US and back across. That's less common than it used to be, given some of the newer submarine cables, but it's still not infrequent depending on your carriers' peering arrangements.

If you're gaming, you may care a lot (or may even want to not use the VPN for your gaming connections.) Similarly for VOIP to other Australians. But for typical web browsing, it doesn't matter as much.

setup your own VPN?

[Anonymous Coward]

I really question how secure the VPNs are. Even if your VPN provider won't log you, your DNS, ISP providers can still track you. I would certainly not use Hidemyass. Sep 2001,FBI arrested Cody Kretsinger, a core member of LulzSec for hacking into the Sony Pictures website. London based VPN provider Hide My Ass (HMA) appears to have played a vital role in Kretsinger’s arrest. It doesn’t take too much imagination to see that VPNs can also be used for outright illegal activities, copyright violations and hacking for example. All VPN providers know this and, while their terms and conditions always state that their services are not to be used for illegal activities, they derive a portion of their revenue from users who signed up for just that purpose, something all VPN providers are aware of. If a provider does not log your IP address and does not log your activity while using their system, how would they be able to investigate anything? Even if they tell you that they won't keep logs, can you really trust them? I am thinking of setting up my own VPN using Amazon EC2.

www.cyberdodge.co.nz is NZ's VPN

[Anonymous Coward]

Aussies could use www.cyberdodge.co.nz, it is a New Zealand based company and sells in NZ dollars. I am in NZ and use it, its all good, I have had no problems.

I recommend Hushtunnel

[Anonymous Coward]

I recommend using Hushtunnel. They use SSH which is very secure (more than SSL and L2TP/IPSec), and are pretty cheap. They also give some good extras like being able to VNC to a remote computer.

Re:Paranoid WAY too much

[Anonymous Coward]

They may be able to ask to start recording without a warrant, but they need a warrant to get that recorded information from the ISP and there is a set time for them to have to get that warrant in. Why they should be allowed to ask an ISP to record this data is a difficult case to play devils advocate for, but even so there are many times when it takes an inordinate amount of time during the collection of evidence a building of a case in which a warrant would be unable to be given, if they can get the warrant most likely any information collected from the ISP will only be corroborating information already found anyway, which is important in court and possibly could lead to further allegations and evidence as well, that being said the actual concerning piece of information is not with Australian law enforcement per se but that it can be used to facilitate tin pot countries which don't respect the rule of law, or whose judicial systems have been bought out by corporate interests [*cough* Amurica *cough*] collecting information.

While i'm rather against these set of changes, no one seemed to care enough to stop them [certainly both sides of politics were for them], but really lets keep our feet and fears based on reality here. What Anonymous may or may not have done is neither here nor there in this matter as [low hanging fruit is low hanging and their attack on AAPT was against the lowest hanging fruit] anyone who has their data accessed in that way will most likely get a free pass [on any illegal activities found] and the companies storing the data will be the subject of multiple lawsuits [for loosing it] which would include damages for the individual whose data was stolen [not to mention it being unlikely to be admissable in court] as well as the individual who went against the law and asked them to start recording being put in gaol.

It is not a good law, nor a good thing to happen for Australians, but equally it is not the end of the world and moderatly balanced seeing that no one was seriously working against it as far as elected officials go OTHER than the Green party who are widly ridiculed on this site and others [and if you read the Australian that regularly that it was the best story on the AAPT attack you could find then you deserve everything the government dishes out to you as this is a policy the Liberal party would not even tell us they were looking at before it was worked over, like they did previously when they were in government].